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Author Topic: BITSTAMP eXchange wall Observer. second biggest and best exchange  (Read 88661 times)
dserrano5
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October 14, 2013, 07:34:21 PM
 #501

That wasn't the specific distinction he was trying to make. He was trying to illustrate that two parties with a vested interest in pumping the volume on the exchange, could trade back and forth for minimal fees, to create the appearance of a robust market.

FWIW that's how I interpreted it too.

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manfred
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October 14, 2013, 07:42:10 PM
 #502

That wasn't the specific distinction he was trying to make. He was trying to illustrate that two parties with a vested interest in pumping the volume on the exchange, could trade back and forth for minimal fees, to create the appearance of a robust market.

FWIW that's how I interpreted it too.
Thats why chinas volume is so high because most exchanges have no fee's and the same coins are moved back and forth.
oda.krell
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October 14, 2013, 07:46:44 PM
 #503

The "consciously creating the appearance of volume" is a possibility, but not even what I really consider the main factor. Take the following example:

Scenario 1: "indecisive" market (say in a consolidation phase), but low trading cost (which, for example, seems to be the case on the Chinese exchanges). Quite high volume despite the indecision, because trading is cheap, and there's always someone trying to make a small profit by selling high/buying back low(er).

Scenario 2: A rally, with many new buyers entering the market. Overall volume could in fact be the same as in scenario 1 (since a number of established btc holders are probably tempted to sell if price is rising too fast, in anticipation of a sudden drop), but the total amount USD entering exchanges is different (assuming of course that the sellers don't leave the market entirely).

I guess I see where the idea that it doesn't really matter comes from: if, in the long run, the traders that trade "back and forth" stay out of btc entirely, then it really doesn't matter. But the crucial difference is that at least a portion of the "new" money stays in the market, and at least a portion of the money of those that sold to the new entrants will (probably) stay on the exchanges, waiting for an opportunity to rebuy.

Here's another view on the matter: think of it in terms of price discovery. In scenario 1, the participants already paid a price per btc close to the price of the trade now. For them, their contribution to the overall price discovery is rather minimal (say a trader bought at 100, and now sells at 101). A new market participant will however mark a much more substantial adjustment of what the market thinks is a fair price: he previously "valued" btc at 0, and now values them at 100 (as per the example before). Volume doesn't distinguish between those two cases, but for the long-term market dynamics it does matter, in my opinion.

Not sure which Bitcoin wallet to use? I suggest to take a look at Electrum.
Electrum is an open-source lightweight client: user friendly, fast, and one of the safest ways to store, send or receive bitcoins.
For executables (Windows, OSX, Linux, Android), source code and documentation, see the Electrum homepage.
derpinheimer
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October 14, 2013, 08:36:01 PM
 #504

In order for the price move to be substantiated, there needs to be volume and this requires asks filling in.  19k (now 17k) is actually still low for stamp. It was 24k for a while.

Yes, but that doesnt mean asks filling in is bullish...  [its still bearish]

Back to 19k.

And back to 17k.. lol

I think these "small" movements have to be ignored.
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October 15, 2013, 06:49:03 AM
 #505

In order for the price move to be substantiated, there needs to be volume and this requires asks filling in.  19k (now 17k) is actually still low for stamp. It was 24k for a while.

Yes, but that doesnt mean asks filling in is bullish...  [its still bearish]

Back to 19k.

And back to 17k.. lol

I think these "small" movements have to be ignored.
Without asks filling in, you'd have a full-on bubble with lots of volatility detracting investors and followed inevitably by an equally brutal crash that might break the trend. Slow and steady with a decent volume and liquidity is the way to go. Let's hold off bubbling till we break 260.
molecular
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October 15, 2013, 09:36:22 AM
 #506

In order for the price move to be substantiated, there needs to be volume and this requires asks filling in.  19k (now 17k) is actually still low for stamp. It was 24k for a while.

Yes, but that doesnt mean asks filling in is bullish...  [its still bearish]

Back to 19k.

And back to 17k.. lol

I think these "small" movements have to be ignored.
Without asks filling in, you'd have a full-on bubble with lots of volatility detracting investors and followed inevitably by an equally brutal crash that might break the trend. Slow and steady with a decent volume and liquidity is the way to go. Let's hold off bubbling till we break 260.

ok, boss

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notme
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October 15, 2013, 01:49:41 PM
 #507

In order for the price move to be substantiated, there needs to be volume and this requires asks filling in.  19k (now 17k) is actually still low for stamp. It was 24k for a while.

Yes, but that doesnt mean asks filling in is bullish...  [its still bearish]

Back to 19k.

And back to 17k.. lol

I think these "small" movements have to be ignored.
Without asks filling in, you'd have a full-on bubble with lots of volatility detracting investors and followed inevitably by an equally brutal crash that might break the trend. Slow and steady with a decent volume and liquidity is the way to go. Let's hold off bubbling till we break 260.

And how do you get volume?  Oh yeah, traders, who are attracted to volatility.

https://www.bitcoin.org/bitcoin.pdf
While no idea is perfect, some ideas are useful.
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Shermo
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October 15, 2013, 02:02:06 PM
 #508

Looks like some big bites into that $136 wall at the mo Smiley
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October 15, 2013, 02:11:46 PM
 #509

And the wall is now at $140 with price slowly rising through the $136 range...
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October 15, 2013, 02:35:38 PM
 #510

138 now, the rally is ignited again. Curious if Mt.Gox will follow.
Shermo
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October 15, 2013, 02:46:28 PM
 #511

Wonder if we can break in to the 140's today? Smiley
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October 15, 2013, 02:52:53 PM
 #512

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zby
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October 15, 2013, 05:14:53 PM
 #513

Head and shoulder:



target is above 200 Smiley

Only volume is a bit low.
uhoh
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October 15, 2013, 06:32:32 PM
 #514

Wonder if we can break in to the 140's today? Smiley

oda.krell
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October 15, 2013, 06:32:45 PM
 #515

nom nom (dat 140 wall)

Not sure which Bitcoin wallet to use? I suggest to take a look at Electrum.
Electrum is an open-source lightweight client: user friendly, fast, and one of the safest ways to store, send or receive bitcoins.
For executables (Windows, OSX, Linux, Android), source code and documentation, see the Electrum homepage.
Ivanhoe
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October 15, 2013, 06:33:57 PM
 #516

Wonder if we can break in to the 150's today? Smiley
oda.krell
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October 15, 2013, 06:37:39 PM
 #517

... as always, btc market gets ahead of itself. We'll scratch 150, drop back to 120-something but quickly go back to 132. From there, we'll continue the rally :D

Not sure which Bitcoin wallet to use? I suggest to take a look at Electrum.
Electrum is an open-source lightweight client: user friendly, fast, and one of the safest ways to store, send or receive bitcoins.
For executables (Windows, OSX, Linux, Android), source code and documentation, see the Electrum homepage.
gunzeon
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October 15, 2013, 06:51:02 PM
 #518

Does anybody know of another exchange, apart from MtGox, where a trader can freely bounce between currencies ?

To me this is why tha banks sabotage their activities; they are a defacto money changer, usurping the busines from the banking cartel.

You got $US, $C, $A, Yen, Roubles, you name it, and no bank forex spread, just a minimal bitcoin trade commission.

Difficult for banks to play along with MtGox given that, me thinks.

People shifting money around freely and sharing none of it with them. Plain jealousy.

BTC: 1gunzeo8X7iYznsnmgveUQDuRj6vhzyK6 ~~~
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October 15, 2013, 06:54:20 PM
 #519

Money changing is the original activity of the banks, and even Jesus condemned it.
zby
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October 15, 2013, 06:56:49 PM
 #520

Does anybody know of another exchange, apart from MtGox, where a trader can freely bounce between currencies ?

To me this is why tha banks sabotage their activities; they are a defacto money changer, usurping the busines from the banking cartel.

You got $US, $C, $A, Yen, Roubles, you name it, and no bank forex spread, just a minimal bitcoin trade commission.

Difficult for banks to play along with MtGox given that, me thinks.

People shifting money around freely and sharing none of it with them. Plain jealousy.

There used to be 2% commission by MtGox for this.
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