Klondike 1 Avalon Asic chip Mini USB miner

[joeventura]

The K1 will be as compact clean as any BE.

As for the other commentary.

If want better prices than a BE then get into group buys. BKKCoins can't sell enough to make back his effort that is why others will take up the slack.

I was not aware that BKK was getting a percentage of every sale.

Probably something real generous like 5-10%?!?

he deserves it!!

The agreed upon royalty was approximately 0.02 BTC per each...

$80.00 Cost
less
$7.50 for the ASIC
less
$1.80 for BKK

Michael Douglas would be proud!

[kevinm]

The K1 will be as compact clean as any BE.

As for the other commentary.

If want better prices than a BE then get into group buys. BKKCoins can't sell enough to make back his effort that is why others will take up the slack.

I was not aware that BKK was getting a percentage of every sale.

Probably something real generous like 5-10%?!?

he deserves it!!

The agreed upon royalty was approximately 0.02 BTC per each...

$80.00 Cost
less
$7.50 for the ASIC
less
$1.80 for BKK

Michael Douglas would be proud!

and they just fabricate themselves, as if by magic!!!

cheers,
kev

[pixl8tr]

$80.00 Cost
less
$7.50 for the ASIC
less
$1.80 for BKK

Michael Douglas would be proud!

You are forgetting to include

Parts
PCB manufacture
PCB Layout & assembly
Production Labor
Transportation costs for above.
Project Management Labor
Advertising costs ( website )
Customer support , Etc...

[joeventura]

$80.00 Cost
less
$7.50 for the ASIC
less
$1.80 for BKK

Michael Douglas would be proud!

You are forgetting to include

Parts
PCB manufacture
PCB Layout assembly
Production Labor
Transportation costs for above.
Labor for organizers
Advertising costs ( website )
Customer support , Etc...

Gas for the transportation
Food for the labor
Help Desk system to handle calls

Yeah I get it, I understated it and you guys massively overstated it.

[pixl8tr]

Nothing "massively" overstated.  LOL obviously you have never run a business.    

[joeventura]

LOL obviously you have never run a business.   

I founded a multi-million dollar consulting firm which I sold to a Bell Operating company in the Southeast.

Does that count?

yeah I thought it might 

[Lohoris]

LOL obviously you have never run a business.   

I founded a multi-million dollar consulting firm which I sold to a Bell Operating company in the Southeast.

Does that count?

yeah I thought it might 

Then you must've been trolling.

[xyzzy099]

$80.00 Cost
less
$7.50 for the ASIC
less
$1.80 for BKK

Michael Douglas would be proud!

You are forgetting to include

Parts
PCB manufacture
PCB Layout & assembly
Production Labor
Transportation costs for above.
Project Management Labor
Advertising costs ( website )
Customer support , Etc...

Come on guys - Bicknellski already stated that the price was set to be 'competitive with' the Block Erupter.  If the price had been set to be (cost + reasonable profit + 0.02BTC for BKKCoins), it would almost certainly be a good bit lower.

I don't begrudge them making some BTC, but I was disappointed that the 1st OSS incarnation was priced to be competitive with the predatory prices we have been getting from ASICMiner.

[joeventura]

$80.00 Cost
less
$7.50 for the ASIC
less
$1.80 for BKK

Michael Douglas would be proud!

You are forgetting to include

Parts
PCB manufacture
PCB Layout & assembly
Production Labor
Transportation costs for above.
Project Management Labor
Advertising costs ( website )
Customer support , Etc...

Come on guys - Bicknellski already stated that the price was set to be 'competitive with' the Block Erupter.  If the price had been set to be (cost + reasonable profit + 0.02BTC for BKKCoins), it would almost certainly be a good bit lower.

I don't begrudge them making some BTC, but I was disappointed that the 1st OSS incarnation was priced to be competitive with the predatory prices we have been getting from ASICMiner.

I am not trolling I am annoyed.

I don't deny anyone the right to make a buck. This is a OPEN SOURCE project. So it shouldn't just be competitive it should be a considerable savings. That is really the end of my commentary on this.

If someone wants to send me details on where these boards are being made and who to contact I would be happy to have them manufactured and sell them at a more reasonable price.

I won't hold my breath for that data however. 

[Bicknellski]

Here is the simple solution.

DIY... best price.


If you don't want to do the work then you will probably have to pay a premium for chips that are fabricated into units and are available sooner than later.

Unless you are taking the risk of dealing with tens of thousands of chips and the volatility of the market place anyone who is selling these K1s will have to offer a competitive price. Then again why should anyone taking that sort of risk sell at 50% or 60% lower than what the market is for these units? Why?

Again there seems to be a real disconnect especially when some of us are actually offering much lower prices for larger volumes. Yet the same comment comes out that the PRICES are too high you are gouging people. If you want a great price then get a few people together and buy in volume. Silly to sit here and argue the value of something that has measurable ROI. If you think it is too high don't buy. If you think you can buy in larger numbers and get a reasonable ROI then do that. What bothers me is the idea that those willing to take a risk and produce a K1 that pays for BKKCoins development are some how evil for expecting it to be priced at the current market rate. Beyond me.

We are going to make more than 1 or 2 K1s... and each time we do we pay a royalty even if we sell it or mine it. I suggest you buy 10k worth of Avalon chips and sell what you think is a fair price... if not then please respect that we are helping not hurting the community by distributing them as widely as possible.

The idea we need to complain about those willing to take on this risk is somewhat of an issue for me given the lack of integrity and availability in the market. When competition takes places as it has already the prices will come down in fact it already has. Rather than complain and characterize people as Gordon Geckos you might want to look a little beyond the listed 1 unit price and look to get yet again in groups and buy in volume. There is a great price right now but you can't get it unless you are REALLY interested in buying.

[joeventura]

Here is the simple solution.

DIY... best price.


If you don't want to do the work then you will probably have to pay a premium for chips that are fabricated into units and are available sooner than later.

Unless you are taking the risk of dealing with tens of thousands of chips and the volatility of the market place anyone who is selling these K1s will have to offer a competitive price. Then again why should anyone taking that sort of risk sell at 50% or 60% lower than what the market is for these units? Why?

Again there seems to be a real disconnect especially when some of us are actually offering much lower prices for larger volumes. Yet the same comment comes out that the PRICES are too high you are gouging people. If you want a great price then get a few people together and buy in volume. Silly to sit here and argue the value of something that has measurable ROI. If you think it is too high don't buy. If you think you can buy in larger numbers and get a reasonable ROI then do that. What bothers me is the idea that those willing to take a risk and produce a K1 that pays for BKKCoins development are some how evil for expecting it to be priced at the current market rate. Beyond me.

I hear you, but you know as people are rattling off what your expenses are etc.
I'd like to see what your expenses would be had you paid for the engineering that BKK did,
and I expect that BKK was the one that set the royalty fee. I just want to say that if that is true then he is a true Open Source guy as he deserves so much more.

Never said you were evil, never said you were gouging. Just said the price for an open source project should command more savings.

[Bicknellski]

Your IMPLICATION is clear sir.

Go get your 10k Avalon chips, a fabrication site and then come compete. See you in 9 weeks. Unlike you I worked with a group to start production of K1s. We have built a network and as cooperative we are keen to support BKKCoins by SELLING AS MANY AS WE CAN... that way both the developer and the risk takers win.

Sorry but you fail to look at the offers we have put out there. Considerably LOWER than anything else. Just get some people together and buy... but I suspect like many people who are trying to characterize those selling K1s at TOO HIGH a PRICE you are not that interested in buying anything. If you were I would have seen my PM box light up or my email box filled.

[xyzzy099]

Here is the simple solution.

DIY... best price.


If you don't want to do the work then you will probably have to pay a premium for chips that are fabricated into units and are available sooner than later.

Unless you are taking the risk of dealing with tens of thousands of chips and the volatility of the market place anyone who is selling these K1s will have to offer a competitive price. Then again why should anyone taking that sort of risk sell at 50% or 60% lower than what the market is for these units? Why?

Again there seems to be a real disconnect especially when some of us are actually offering much lower prices for larger volumes. Yet the same comment comes out that the PRICES are too high you are gouging people. If you want a great price then get a few people together and buy in volume. Silly to sit here and argue the value of something that has measurable ROI. If you think it is too high don't buy. If you think you can buy in larger numbers and get a reasonable ROI then do that. What bothers me is the idea that those willing to take a risk and produce a K1 that pays for BKKCoins development are some how evil for expecting it to be priced at the current market rate. Beyond me.

For the sake of clarity, *I* don't think you are gouging anyone or being evil.  There is nothing wrong about charging what the market will bear.

As I said before, I was just disappointed that the first OSS player in this game chose to set the same price point as an entity that has had a monopoly on this market.  I foolishly thought that since this project was open source, it would be less expensive.  I was wrong, and therefore disappointed - but I'm sure time will bring competition, and competition will lower the price.

[Beastlymac]

Here is the simple solution.

DIY... best price.


If you don't want to do the work then you will probably have to pay a premium for chips that are fabricated into units and are available sooner than later.

Unless you are taking the risk of dealing with tens of thousands of chips and the volatility of the market place anyone who is selling these K1s will have to offer a competitive price. Then again why should anyone taking that sort of risk sell at 50% or 60% lower than what the market is for these units? Why?

Again there seems to be a real disconnect especially when some of us are actually offering much lower prices for larger volumes. Yet the same comment comes out that the PRICES are too high you are gouging people. If you want a great price then get a few people together and buy in volume. Silly to sit here and argue the value of something that has measurable ROI. If you think it is too high don't buy. If you think you can buy in larger numbers and get a reasonable ROI then do that. What bothers me is the idea that those willing to take a risk and produce a K1 that pays for BKKCoins development are some how evil for expecting it to be priced at the current market rate. Beyond me.

I hear you, but you know as people are rattling off what your expenses are etc.
I'd like to see what your expenses would be had you paid for the engineering that BKK did,
and I expect that BKK was the one that set the royalty fee. I just want to say that if that is true then he is a true Open Source guy as he deserves so much more.

Never said you were evil, never said you were gouging. Just said the price for an open source project should command more savings.

Actually we asked him what fee he would like he said is $2 per k1 fabricated ok and we said yes. We could have skimpily made them and kept the extra $2 but we wanted to give back to bkk for what he has done for the community I doubt that everybody who manufactures k1's is going to donate money to bkk for every unit they make.

[Bicknellski]

Here is the simple solution.

DIY... best price.


If you don't want to do the work then you will probably have to pay a premium for chips that are fabricated into units and are available sooner than later.

Unless you are taking the risk of dealing with tens of thousands of chips and the volatility of the market place anyone who is selling these K1s will have to offer a competitive price. Then again why should anyone taking that sort of risk sell at 50% or 60% lower than what the market is for these units? Why?

Again there seems to be a real disconnect especially when some of us are actually offering much lower prices for larger volumes. Yet the same comment comes out that the PRICES are too high you are gouging people. If you want a great price then get a few people together and buy in volume. Silly to sit here and argue the value of something that has measurable ROI. If you think it is too high don't buy. If you think you can buy in larger numbers and get a reasonable ROI then do that. What bothers me is the idea that those willing to take a risk and produce a K1 that pays for BKKCoins development are some how evil for expecting it to be priced at the current market rate. Beyond me.

I hear you, but you know as people are rattling off what your expenses are etc.
I'd like to see what your expenses would be had you paid for the engineering that BKK did,
and I expect that BKK was the one that set the royalty fee. I just want to say that if that is true then he is a true Open Source guy as he deserves so much more.

Never said you were evil, never said you were gouging. Just said the price for an open source project should command more savings.

Actually we asked him what fee he would like he said is $2 per k1 fabricated ok and we said yes. We could have skimpily made them and kept the extra $2 but we wanted to give back to bkk for what he has done for the community I doubt that everybody who manufactures k1's is going to donate money to bkk for every unit they make.

He is now quoting $1 per K1 but that is besides the point.

We are here to help grow the DIY community by selling as many as we can. Full stop. You can make your own, go with others who want you to send them chips or with people who bought chips and are fabricating units for direct sales. There are plenty of options. It is up to you to do the evaluations but when we actually posted prices people immediately dropped their prices for Block Erupters... wondering if that is not a good thing? Seriously, there is absolutely no need to characterize anyone selling K1s or K16s for market rates as bad for Open Source Hardware. We are taking a risk, we have provided fair pricing so it is up to the community to vote with their coins. I am hopeful that many will but if they don't BKKCoins still gets a buck for everyone we make and then have to mine in our cooperative pool.

Also we have offered great price breaks over 50 units and have clearly said make us an OFFER.

Waste of time if people want to misrepresent us but I hope you are clear now we are pricing at the market rate and offering deals for volume. Please respect that.

[Syke]

Nice try deleting my comment in your propoganda sales thread. Here it is again so everyone gets a chance to read it without your censorship.

Price: BTC0.99 1-9
10 or more BTC0.89
50 or more BTC0.79

Also no it is not the highest price we could have chosen. We are trying to price these to compete with asicminer

What a shame. BE's are available today. K1's aren't. You aren't competitive. Drop your prices by at least 30% because by the time you actual have a product to ship that's what they'll be worth.

[Swimmer63]

Nice try deleting my comment in your propoganda sales thread. Here it is again so everyone gets a chance to read it without your censorship.

Price: BTC0.99 1-9
10 or more BTC0.89
50 or more BTC0.79

Also no it is not the highest price we could have chosen. We are trying to price these to compete with asicminer

What a shame. BE's are available today. K1's aren't. You aren't competitive. Drop your prices by at least 30% because by the time you actual have a product to ship that's what they'll be worth.

WTF.  Really?

[joeventura]

Block Erupters are BTC0.89 now quantity 1

You can't get a K1 (quantity 1) for BTC0.89 can you?

[Beastlymac]

You can get them for 0.8374 BTC

[bitcoiner49er]

Come on guys - Bicknellski already stated that the price was set to be 'competitive with' the Block Erupter.  If the price had been set to be (cost + reasonable profit + 0.02BTC for BKKCoins), it would almost certainly be a good bit lower.

I don't begrudge them making some BTC, but I was disappointed that the 1st OSS incarnation was priced to be competitive with the predatory prices we have been getting from ASICMiner.

I am not trolling I am annoyed.

I don't deny anyone the right to make a buck. This is a OPEN SOURCE project. So it shouldn't just be competitive it should be a considerable savings. That is really the end of my commentary on this.

If someone wants to send me details on where these boards are being made and who to contact I would be happy to have them manufactured and sell them at a more reasonable price.

I won't hold my breath for that data however.  

How about ~.3BTC?