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Author Topic: Duckdice.io [SCAM and SHADY behavior]  (Read 5014 times)
Avirunes
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July 17, 2017, 01:37:16 AM
 #21

We do not push our bonuses to everyone, bonus information is on the completely separate page and usually only advanced dice gamblers are interested in them and newcomers are very much welcome to ask additional questions in the chat to mods or support.

Then I think it requires much more fair implementation.

We may consider removing "cancel" button completely and will notify users in advance that once bonus is claimed it cannot be cancelled however, this does NOT solve an issue where user just don't read the messages, in this scenario next complaint would be "I accidentally claimed a bonus and now I can't cancel it even though I don't wanna wager". So we are still looking for a more elegant solution and all suggestions are very much welcome.

Not many users like wagering. Many gamblers realize how hard it is to meet wagering requirements and unlock the bonus in middle of game . So what do you think about them. Will it be good to remove "Cancel" button?

*actmyname presented how much difficult it is to claim bonus.*. And many user may feel to cancel it in middle of the game. I don't think removing "cancel" button is entirely a good call.

Maybe removing bonus system is the best call.


So far we disagree that canceling not only winnings but a deposit as well is "shady" or "unethical",

In that case I simply want to point out where it is unethical.

(1) So what gives you the right on the users balance which he hasn't lost actually by betting?---- Is it ethical ?

Not all players do as what 1982dre said. Don't make it in this way just because some gamblers are doing bonus in a loop. In short "find an ethical way and not an unethical way (which you are doing by showing right over users balance)". I have pointed out why in my opinion it is unfair and if you still find that your dice bonus system presently is fair then despite being a player or a HR in intial stage of DuckDice , "Shady and unfair" are the only words that will pop out from my mouth regarding your dice site.


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mammabitcoin2u
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July 17, 2017, 03:32:15 AM
 #22

We do not push our bonuses to everyone, bonus information is on the completely separate page and usually only advanced dice gamblers are interested in them and newcomers are very much welcome to ask additional questions in the chat to mods or support.

We may consider removing "cancel" button completely and will notify users in advance that once bonus is claimed it cannot be cancelled however, this does NOT solve an issue where user just don't read the messages, in this scenario next complaint would be "I accidentally claimed a bonus and now I can't cancel it even though I don't wanna wager". So we are still looking for a more elegant solution and all suggestions are very much welcome.

Bonus algorithm has not been invented by DuckDice but adopted from dice practices, our mathematician department will run simulations and based on the results we may consider new or improved algorithm.

So far we disagree that canceling not only winnings but a deposit as well is "shady" or "unethical", as Dre mentioned above this is to avoid the following scenario:
– make a deposit
– claim bonus
– betting unsuccessful
– cancel bonus
– withdraw deposit
– deposit is again

..and here we have a loop.

As said earlier, this is a gambling, we give users a chance to win more and we NEVER ask questions on withdrawal.



This is how it works:

– make a deposit
– claim bonus or not
– betting unsuccessful
– cancel bonus (shouldn't allow a bonus to be cancelled, once applied the 30X 50X even 1000X applies)
– withdraw deposit REMAINING FUNDS
– MAYBE deposit is again

I deposit 100 and your bonus is 100% that means I have 200 to play with if I accept your bonus or it's forced upon me

I lose 25 I say forget this I want to withdraw and go

I should get my $75

But according to you............I lose everything

Please someone tell me I am wrong??  Otherwise, this is just an insane SCAM

~Be Wise & Scrutinize Everything~~Scammers are like roaches squash 1 there's millions more hiding~I will NEVER ask for a loan~I got plenty of my own ~ BIGGEST lie to date said about me: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2046485.msg20429473#new
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July 17, 2017, 04:35:16 AM
 #23

Scammers Profile Link: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=917361

Reference Link:
Amount Scammed: 9 bitcoin

What happened::
Hello,

Nickname : Ozafejyw782

I am their biggest winner : https://duckdice.io/stats

I am a casino highroller, I like casinos, poker etc.  Today, I played for my first time on duckdice.io I saw on their bitcointalk's thread that they have a bonus 120%. Let's try it !

I deposited 2 BTC for my first deposit, claimed a bonus, set up 2FA. I was a bit surprised, I got 2 btc extra. I thought that will be like a poker bonus to clear. I can see that I have to clear it. Then I thought it will delete only the 2 BTC extra if I delete it.

Let's gamble ! I played and won from 4 bitcoin to 9.xx and 23% bonus cleared. A lot of beggars spammed me in PM. I got more than 20 private messages in 1 hour.

I had to go, I still didn't trust the website, small, young, not a good reputation(not a bad too) I decided to withdraw but I have my bonus. That's normal, I cannot withdraw.

I decided to cancel my bonus. Even if I lose my extra 2 BTC. It is safer with a young website like that. I click cancel and are you sure yes in 1 second, without reading anything ( My fault) but I never thought there was a shady feature like that.(The proof it is shady, the admin stan talked to me and told me they will change it on monday)

BOOM : 0 balance. I refresh : 0 balance.

I contacted the moderator : barcode. He was very helpful instead of the other moderators (except mharckie
 helpful as well). He told me to talk to the admin who was here : DuckHunt. He didn't answer me.

Then, I started to lose my temper and made a scandal in the chat and magic : an admin "Stan" answered me. He explained me that I decided to cancel my bonus and I had to read. The balance is cancelled. I explained him that's was a shady feature and I just want my account like before : 9.xx BTC balance and 23% bonus cleared. I will clear it and if they are lucky I will lose it.

I asked them if they had enough balance to keep a 10 btc max bet as well (at least 800 BTC) but no links, nothing.

Here their rules :

To claim bonus your balance must be greater or equal to deposit amount.
Your Balance will be locked while bonus is active. You can cancel bonus at any time.
Bonus must be wagered 55x to became a part of your balance.
Wagering contribution is 50% from bet amount.
Reload Bonus can be claimed only twice per day.

It is NOT written:  the balance will be cancelled as well but ONLY the bonus.

At the same time, the admin "stan" sent me a funky proposition : Deposit 5 bitcoin and I will see what I can do for you. IS IT A JOKE ? They stole me 7 BITCOIN and now they want 5 MORE ?

I wanted to get my money back 9 BITCOIN with the same 23% bonus cleared but now they tried to scam me against their own rules, I want the whole balance on my bitcoin address. I want them to give back the money of all the players who have been f***ed by this shady behavior.

STAY AWAY FROM duckdice.io

 


Oh god, I feel so bad for you. I thought this was just an old post when Bitcoin was only like 500 USD. Dude rip that 5000 USD, I guess when DuckDice.io canceled your winning that is debatable but they have no right to just take your deposits now. This isn't your fault, the site's terms were clear and when you cancel a bonus you shouldn't have to lose all the money you deposit in the first place, this is a pretty big sum and I would maybe recommend taking legal actions because what DuckDice is doing here is totally illegal and I dont want other people getting scammed.

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Avirunes
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July 17, 2017, 04:54:09 AM
 #24

-snip-
 This isn't your fault, the site's terms were clear and when you cancel a bonus you shouldn't have to lose all the money you deposit in the first place, .... -snip-

Site's term and conditions are nothing. Site owner should be able to put a valid reason behind all the terms and conditions which are ethical and reasonable for both site owners and its players. Let me say for example if i put a term that withdraw oa player will not be process until bitcoin drops back to 1000$ or so. Is it ethical? Sure i made it in terms and conditions but in the same way I am holding withdraw which ethically i should not hold.

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July 17, 2017, 08:26:46 AM
 #25



So far we disagree that canceling not only winnings but a deposit as well is "shady" or "unethical", as Dre mentioned above this is to avoid the following scenario:
– make a deposit
– claim bonus
– betting unsuccessful
– cancel bonus
– withdraw deposit
– deposit is again

..and here we have a loop.

 
There is simple fix for this just change the rules and make the (original balance unlocked and have to be used first ) that way there will never be a loop and your site will lose nothing if someone canceled the bonus  Wink .



sounds interesting.

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panjul07
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July 17, 2017, 09:48:58 AM
 #26

We do not push our bonuses to everyone, bonus information is on the completely separate page and usually only advanced dice gamblers are interested in them and newcomers are very much welcome to ask additional questions in the chat to mods or support.

We may consider removing "cancel" button completely and will notify users in advance that once bonus is claimed it cannot be cancelled however, this does NOT solve an issue where user just don't read the messages, in this scenario next complaint would be "I accidentally claimed a bonus and now I can't cancel it even though I don't wanna wager". So we are still looking for a more elegant solution and all suggestions are very much welcome.

Bonus algorithm has not been invented by DuckDice but adopted from dice practices, our mathematician department will run simulations and based on the results we may consider new or improved algorithm.

So far we disagree that canceling not only winnings but a deposit as well is "shady" or "unethical", as Dre mentioned above this is to avoid the following scenario:
– make a deposit
– claim bonus
– betting unsuccessful
– cancel bonus
– withdraw deposit
– deposit is again

..and here we have a loop.

As said earlier, this is a gambling, we give users a chance to win more and we NEVER ask questions on withdrawal.



This is how it works:

– make a deposit
– claim bonus or not
– betting unsuccessful
– cancel bonus (shouldn't allow a bonus to be cancelled, once applied the 30X 50X even 1000X applies)
– withdraw deposit REMAINING FUNDS
– MAYBE deposit is again

I deposit 100 and your bonus is 100% that means I have 200 to play with if I accept your bonus or it's forced upon me

I lose 25 I say forget this I want to withdraw and go

I should get my $75

But according to you............I lose everything

Please someone tell me I am wrong??  Otherwise, this is just an insane SCAM

Looks like you have the same opinion with me, as long as I know most deposit bonuses will use the initial deposit first to wager and if we cancel the bonus then we will still have some balance like your example. In other case, if we win while using the initial deposit then we cancel the bonus so will will lose all the winning but still have the initial deposit.
Lose everything should be only happen when players has lost all the initial deposit and use the bonus balance then decided to cancel the bonus, no matter the players win or lose while playing with the bonus. Just my 2 cents

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July 17, 2017, 07:30:58 PM
 #27

Here is our final decision:

1. Bonus algorithm:

You may not like our Bonus algorithm and if you don't like it no one is forcing you to claim it. Users are notified about exact amount that will be subtracted from the balance and there is a specially designed confirmation screen where user confirm and agree with this. DuckDice shall not be liable for users who don't read confirmation screens.

Many members in this thread gave us their insight on how Bonus algorithm should work based on their opinion and we are very grateful to all of them. We may use this expertise in the future but this does not mean that current algorithm is flawed.

2. Refund:

DuckDice will not "negotiate with terrorists". We see this case as a pure blackmail and therefore DuckDice will not make any refund. There is nothing shady or scammy, it is user's responsibility to read confirmation messages. Better make a thread and ask how many members won big with our bonuses.

3. Solution:

The initial deposit of user Ozafejyw782 was 2 BTC and we will give this 2 BTC for charity. Transaction id will be added shortly

We have a negative trust because of this case now, but this doesn't frighten us, we believe that our position is correct and we will just regain user trust.

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July 17, 2017, 08:46:13 PM
 #28

To be honest I do not know what do you guys are thinking or how you came to this decision . Do you really think that warning someone that you gonna kill him  even 10 times will make you not guilty !! Because that what happened here ! you have no right to take his initial bonus ( even your own rules not support you ) and he had on his account 9 BTC to cover the bonus and his initial deposit no rules in the world can allow you to take his initial deposit . no matter how many warnings you put it will not make it right Smiley .

As much as I like the fact that you guys did not ignore this thread and you was active trying to solve it ( respect for that ) . But taking money that clearly you have no right to take = scam weather you gonna give to to charity or not . Because simply it is not yours to give .





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actmyname
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July 17, 2017, 09:50:58 PM
 #29

1. Bonus algorithm:

You may not like our Bonus algorithm and if you don't like it no one is forcing you to claim it. Users are notified about exact amount that will be subtracted from the balance and there is a specially designed confirmation screen where user confirm and agree with this. DuckDice shall not be liable for users who don't read confirmation screens.

First of all, it wasn't outlined in your terms about how the entire balance was canceled. When a user claims the bonus, it's too late to go back and they are forced to wager 110x or just simply lose their entire balance. That is misleading. In that case, why put a cancel button there in the first place if it's just going to make them lose all their funds?



2. Refund:

There is nothing shady or scammy, it is user's responsibility to read confirmation messages. Better make a thread and ask how many members won big with our bonuses.

Suppose you deposit at my site with 1 BTC but when you withdraw I tell you that you are forced to tip 50% of all your winnings to a random chat member otherwise the balance is taken. You can not make rules appear after the fact when they are not outlined in your terms. That is simply unethical.

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July 18, 2017, 04:45:14 AM
 #30

1. Bonus algorithm:

You may not like our Bonus algorithm and if you don't like it no one is forcing you to claim it. Users are notified about exact amount that will be subtracted from the balance and there is a specially designed confirmation screen where user confirm and agree with this. DuckDice shall not be liable for users who don't read confirmation screens.

First of all, it wasn't outlined in your terms about how the entire balance was canceled. When a user claims the bonus, it's too late to go back and they are forced to wager 110x or just simply lose their entire balance. That is misleading. In that case, why put a cancel button there in the first place if it's just going to make them lose all their funds?



2. Refund:

There is nothing shady or scammy, it is user's responsibility to read confirmation messages. Better make a thread and ask how many members won big with our bonuses.

Suppose you deposit at my site with 1 BTC but when you withdraw I tell you that you are forced to tip 50% of all your winnings to a random chat member otherwise the balance is taken. You can not make rules appear after the fact when they are not outlined in your terms. That is simply unethical.

If you claim the bonus and cancel it directly you still got your initial deposit. The locked balance grows while wagering.

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July 18, 2017, 04:52:29 AM
 #31

If you claim the bonus and cancel it directly you still got your initial deposit. The locked balance grows while wagering.

Then what's this?

So far we disagree that canceling not only winnings but a deposit as well is "shady" or "unethical"

https://archive.is/8f6Bz

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July 18, 2017, 07:07:20 AM
 #32

If u were the owner of the site would you let someone use ur money to play against you and without risking their own money they can get profit from you.Its like suicidal.You wont do that,of course you will make agreement.And in Duckdice.Io it is to have a wagering requirement.After all if you finish those requirement all balances will be yours.
Well If you havent try or fully understand how does the bonus on Duckdice.Io does,It goes like this.
1.You made Deposit,(You can play with your own money or Claim bonus to have additional ammo but you need to complete those wagering requirement).Not pushing you to claim it.(Optional)
2.You already claim the bonus but before you start rolling you realize that you dont have the skills to finish the wagering requirement.(Here You can Cancel the Bonus and at the same time Your deposit amount will be refunded.Why and How?Simply because you never touch it.
3.You decided to roll and wager.The locked balance goes bigger while your unlocking the bonus.(Note:Locked balance is different the Locked Volume.).And as time Goes by Your locked balance can be greater than the current Balance.(Thats what happen to oza thats why all his balance had been cancelled)
4.You are in the middle of the wagering and youd realized you cant finish it.You click on the cancel button.(Here,a message will show up saying that the locked balance will be subtracted from your current balance.)two cases here:
       your current balance is greater than the locked balance=will give
       x amount during cancelation,
       your current balance is less than the locked balance = you will
       get nothing.(this is what happen to him)
5.You finish the wagering requirements.Congratulations.All balance
    is yours.Site will take nothing from you.You can withdraw All.


I personally had claim the said bonus and succesfully unlocked it.
With the help of old players and Mods especially I understand how does the bonus goes.And so far this is the first time i heard an issue about Duckdice.Io bonuses.A user's mistake that lead to cancellation of his balance.Not reading a message upon cancellation isnt a site mistake so where and when the scam happen?

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July 18, 2017, 10:45:56 PM
 #33

OP when you are playing with high amounts of money, it's not time of experiments and in this situation it's better to play on highly trusted dice website.

DuckDice.io
You have to show us what happens before deposit and not after that because on that time it's late (I mean your post with pics).

Nothing personal but to my mind you deserve red trust. You offer bonus which is just legit way of scamming. The rules you offered for claiming that bonus isn't correct way and you know it also because it sounds almost impossible to players to claim bonus and you know 99% you will profit and players will lose their deposit. If I deposit and don't want to fight for claiming bonus anymore, it's players choise to deny or continue playing for your "bonus".
Let's explain, I deposited 1 btc and got bonus. I have to wager 1btc x55 = loss (yes it is even on 98% winning chanse and you know it), 0.5btc x 110 = loss again, 0.1 x 550 = loss and etc and etc, you are winning, sounds well.

I have one suggest for you, what about to make dice and offer 100x bonus if you will be able to wager 10000000000000x. Good idea, not?

But still to my mind that happens because people won't realize when casino offers you 55x deposit wager, they strongly believe that they win and you lose because casino exist for profit, not for charity.

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July 19, 2017, 03:56:23 PM
 #34

OP when you are playing with high amounts of money, it's not time of experiments and in this situation it's better to play on highly trusted dice website.

DuckDice.io
You have to show us what happens before deposit and not after that because on that time it's late (I mean your post with pics).

Nothing personal but to my mind you deserve red trust. You offer bonus which is just legit way of scamming.

Indeed, duckdice deserves his red-trust (and more red-trust). They are shady, arrogant and they scammed me at least for 2 bitcoins.

And don't make me laugh with your charity, it is my money you have no rights to use it. I don't want to give it to your bulgarian scammer charity.

It is easy to make good impression when you only have small money  issues to resolve. However when you have an issue with  a higher amount of money, like mine, it is now that all people here can see that your admins are greedy and absolutely unfair.
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July 20, 2017, 12:46:17 PM
 #35


3. Solution:

The initial deposit of user Ozafejyw782 was 2 BTC and we will give this 2 BTC for charity. Transaction id will be added shortly

Is it done already? Have you sent the 2btc "for charity"? You said that you will add fhe txid shortly but it has been 3days but I see no txid. Did I miss something here?
I'm curious, will this charity clear your account from the negative trust and will you add more terms on the deposit bonus information to make it clear and this kind of thing happen again in the future?

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Lutpin
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July 21, 2017, 03:18:03 AM
 #36

Indeed, duckdice deserves his red-trust (and more red-trust). They are shady, arrogant and they scammed me at least for 2 bitcoins.
Voiding the whole balance was indeed the wrong way to go.

2. Refund:
DuckDice will not "negotiate with terrorists". We see this case as a pure blackmail and therefore DuckDice will not make any refund. There is nothing shady or scammy, it is user's responsibility to read confirmation messages.
Seriously? Terrorists?

3. Solution:
The initial deposit of user Ozafejyw782 was 2 BTC and we will give this 2 BTC for charity. Transaction id will be added shortly
Doesnt sound like a solution to me. Neither for the user, nor for anyone else playing with your bonus terms in the future.

We have a negative trust because of this case now, but this doesn't frighten us, we believe that our position is correct and we will just regain user trust.[/size]
Good luck with that.


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July 21, 2017, 03:49:40 AM
 #37

Terrorists? Now how the owner found the user is terrorist?
Never seen a admin of any site talking like this....ofc shady behaviour

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July 21, 2017, 04:55:37 AM
 #38

You offer to cancel the bonus, but then in reality you cancel the whole balance inclusive deposit and winnings and this is the criminal offense of false representation!

2 Fraud by false representation

(1) A person is in breach of this section if he—

(a) dishonestly makes a false representation, and

(b) intends, by making the representation—

(i) to make a gain for himself or another, or

(ii) to cause loss to another or to expose another to a risk of loss.

(2) A representation is false if—

(a) it is untrue or misleading, and

(b) the person making it knows that it is, or might be, untrue or misleading.

(3) “Representation” means any representation as to fact or law, including a representation as to the state of mind of—

(a) the person making the representation, or

(b) any other person.

(4) A representation may be express or implied.

(5) For the purposes of this section a representation may be regarded as made if it (or anything implying it) is submitted in any form to any system or device designed to receive, convey or respond to communications (with or without human intervention).


1982dre
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July 21, 2017, 05:06:53 AM
 #39

You offer to cancel the bonus, but then in reality you cancel the hole balance inclusive deposit and winnings and this is the criminal offense of false representation!

2 Fraud by false representation

(1) A person is in breach of this section if he—

(a) dishonestly makes a false representation, and

(b) intends, by making the representation—

(i) to make a gain for himself or another, or

(ii) to cause loss to another or to expose another to a risk of loss.

(2) A representation is false if—

(a) it is untrue or misleading, and

(b) the person making it knows that it is, or might be, untrue or misleading.

(3) “Representation” means any representation as to fact or law, including a representation as to the state of mind of—

(a) the person making the representation, or

(b) any other person.

(4) A representation may be express or implied.

(5) For the purposes of this section a representation may be regarded as made if it (or anything implying it) is submitted in any form to any system or device designed to receive, convey or respond to communications (with or without human intervention).



You only lose your whole balance if you are unlocking for a while. If you unlock after a few bets, you just lose a little amount.

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July 21, 2017, 05:17:22 AM
 #40

You only lose your whole balance if you are unlocking for a while. If you unlock after a few bets, you just lose a little amount.
If I unlock for a while, is it stated "cancel your bonus" or is it stated "cancel your whole balance"?

Why would anyone agree to cancel his whole balance? If you continue to play nothing worse than exactly this can happen!

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