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Author Topic: I'm MtGox, here's my side.  (Read 33851 times)
tymothy
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June 20, 2011, 11:44:28 PM
 #61

Whether or not Kevin was at all involved with the hacker is irrelevant. He has taken possession of stolen goods. At the time he probably didn't know they were stolen.  Now he does. Now it's a crime if he keeps them.
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cypherdoc
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June 20, 2011, 11:46:04 PM
 #62

Let me show you the login logs for our hacker guy on his account full of bitcoins, and Kevin:

Code:
[2011/06/19 05:00:02] Hacker login
[2011/06/19 05:12:10] Kevin login
[2011/06/19 05:15:10] Hacker login
[2011/06/19 05:22:35] Hacker login
[2011/06/19 05:45:39] Hacker login
[2011/06/19 06:08:18] Hacker login
I don't understand. Which account? Kevin and the hacker used the same account?

Yeah Please Explain this Jargon, And what is it that you're implying by it?

He is saying that Kevin logged in 12 minutes after the attacker logged in to start the attack.  Not damning by itself, and almost certainly a coincidence, but still a connection that needs to be followed up, particularly in light of how it all played out.

And placed a buy order at 0.01 USD per btc.

its quite odd that Kevin could login when the rest of us couldn't.  i watched the whole thing unfold and i certainly couldn't get in.
the other thing MT might be implying is that Kevin logged into the hacked acct?  now that would be damning.  please clarify?
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June 20, 2011, 11:46:12 PM
 #63

Whether or not Kevin was at all involved with the hacker is irrelevant. He has taken possession of stolen goods. At the time he probably didn't know they were stolen.  Now he does. Now it's a crime if he keeps them.
There is no proof other than Mt Gox saying there was a theft.  I suspect there was never any hacker.  I suspect there was a bug in their code or someone at their company screwed up big time.  WHO with 500k bitcoins makes it easy for their account to be compromised?  Until PROOF of a hacking is provided, he has NOT accepted stolen goods.  
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June 20, 2011, 11:46:33 PM
 #64


Agree 100%

Synaptic has to be the worst troll on this site.  He poisons nearly every thread.

Trust me, Synaptic is definately not the worst troll on this site.
I'll definitely take your word for it, but he's got my vote since I joined a few weeks ago  Grin
Synaptic
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June 20, 2011, 11:47:11 PM
 #65

This is my take as well. The fact is that you were compromised. We've all seen absolute proof. When you decided you were going to move into real commodities of significant value, along with seeing dollar signs, you should have made SURE you were secure. This is on you. Most people will cut you a break, but you were lax on your security. YOu saw $ signs, got greedy, and didnt take necessary precautions.

Perhaps time to get a grip on reality. US military/RSA/FBI/CIA (trillion dollar spending) and IMF/Lockheed Martin/Citigroup/Google/SONY/SEGA (billion dollar companies) got compromised and you are asking a young start-up company to be uncompromizable.


Well y'know, not handing over your whole database to a third party is a decent start.

And that's just what they  SAY happened.

That's likely just the "cover our asses" story...
SeW900
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June 20, 2011, 11:47:17 PM
 #66

As other users said, Mt.Gox was not an officially regulated exchange, and they have the full right to revert any transactions that they deem as not complaint (in fact HP did this recently when an error in their online store made certain computers or printers to cost $1). I don't understand what's the confusion with that? It's a risk you have to understand when dealing with such new and risky stuff as a "digital p2p currency".

Also, as the bitcoins that were stolen are not a legit currency, I doubt the intruder can be sued on that account. Still, they could get him for breaching and entering their network.

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June 20, 2011, 11:47:25 PM
 #67

Here's the real time vid of the crash. Time's in the bottom-right system tray. 1:47PM, don't know time zone.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T1X6qQt9ONg

EDIT: I assume this would mean the time of the flash crash was around 05:47, 35 mins after kevin logged in at 05:12? Not sure.
bitrebel
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June 20, 2011, 11:47:25 PM
 #68

What I don't understand is what Kevin logging in around the same time the hacker did, what about everyone else? EVERYONE was logging in around that time, so it seems to me like he is trying to make Kevin look like hes working with the hacker, but yet doesn't post logs of all the others who logged in, and if you can recall everyone was..



I agree with you. Mt Gox from the first post ACCUSED Kevin by proxy of knowing the hacker.
Then Mt Gox posts a simple display of login times and names them "Hacker" and "Kevin" without showing any other logins or buys or sells.

That's just fishy.

Mt Gox, tell us a few things:
1.) How many bitcoins were stolen from the network? Mark claimed 100-200 last night on the Bitcoinshow, and Kevin claims he has 600 or so. That's a lot you guys obviously didn't know about. How do you account for that?
2.) Who is the person or account from which the 500,000 bitcoins were hacked and then sold? Where is the victim of all this theft and hacking? Have they contacted you, or notified you yet?
3.) How many accounts were hacked and bitcoins stolen from?

We can start with those for now.

Why does Bitrebel have 65+ Ignores?
Because Bitrebel says things that some people do not want YOU to hear.
MyFarm
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June 20, 2011, 11:47:56 PM
 #69

its quite odd that Kevin could login when the rest of us couldn't.  i watched the whole thing unfold and i certainly couldn't get in.
the other thing MT might be implying is that Kevin logged into the hacked acct?  now that would be damning.  please clarify?
Plenty of us could login, I did.  Some people even got in buy and sell orders.  Just because you didn't doesn't mean plenty of others did.  And those of us who did are now SUSPECTS under the logic Mt Gox is using.
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June 20, 2011, 11:48:12 PM
 #70

Whether or not Kevin was at all involved with the hacker is irrelevant. He has taken possession of stolen goods. At the time he probably didn't know they were stolen.  Now he does. Now it's a crime if he keeps them.
There is no proof other than Mt Gox saying there was a theft.  I suspect there was never any hacker.  I suspect there was a bug in their code or someone at their company screwed up big time.  WHO with 500k bitcoins makes it easy for their account to be compromised?  Until PROOF of a hacking is provided, he has NOT accepted stolen goods.  

Bingo.
datafish
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June 20, 2011, 11:48:44 PM
 #71


Agree 100%

Synaptic has to be the worst troll on this site.  He poisons nearly every thread.

He hasn't made any useful contributions that I can see.  If he has something productive to say, he should just say it, once, without profanity, if his infantile mind will allow him to do so.  Better yet, he should actually DO something, like start an exchange or a better fork of the Bitcoin software.
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June 20, 2011, 11:49:18 PM
 #72

Do not get the government involved ! They want to destroy BTC!

GOOOOOOOOOOO BITCOINS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Edit: Oops. Just fixed a typo. It should be GO (like GO TEAM!) and not GOOB
Edit2: Just checked the dictionary and goob is not a word
Synaptic
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June 20, 2011, 11:49:31 PM
 #73


Agree 100%

Synaptic has to be the worst troll on this site.  He poisons nearly every thread.

He hasn't made any useful contributions that I can see.  If he has something productive to say, he should just say it, once, without profanity, if his infantile mind will allow him to do so.  Better yet, he should actually DO something, like start an exchange or a better fork of the Bitcoin software.

FUCK.
Enochian
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June 20, 2011, 11:50:56 PM
 #74

I'm pretty sure MT has been one of the more proactive exchange operators when it comes to covering their bases legally ahead of time.  He pays taxes, and just a few days ago he was offering to cooperate with any authorities investigating Silk Road.  The evidence I've seen is that MT has tried to make Mt. Gox as not-under-the-table as possible.

So basically, the operator of the biggest exchange of unregulated p2p government-proof libertarian currency of the future is going to give all our private financial information to Big Brother because his insecure Website didn't scale gracefully to 60,000 users and Hax0rs tore him a new one.

That makes sense.

We need a distributed P2P exchange to go with the distributed P2P currency.

Mt. Gox isn't Bitcoin.  It is just a business that accepts Bitcoin.  Bitcoin will continue merrily onwards in spite of this wart.



MoonShadow
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June 20, 2011, 11:51:43 PM
 #75

Whether or not Kevin was at all involved with the hacker is irrelevant. He has taken possession of stolen goods. At the time he probably didn't know they were stolen.  Now he does. Now it's a crime if he keeps them.
There is no proof other than Mt Gox saying there was a theft.  I suspect there was never any hacker.  I suspect there was a bug in their code or someone at their company screwed up big time.  WHO with 500k bitcoins makes it easy for their account to be compromised?  Until PROOF of a hacking is provided, he has NOT accepted stolen goods.  

By his own version of the story, he withdrew the funds that he did because he suspected that someone's account had be compromised already, and he was not certain that it couldn't happen to him as well.  There has been no evidence to suggest that this event is anything other than what MagicalTux says it was.  Kevin understood, at least on some level, that he might be accepting stolen property.  This doesn't mean that Kevin did anything wrong at the time, but now that there is credible verification that was so, it's wrong for Kevin to keep that property.

"The powers of financial capitalism had another far-reaching aim, nothing less than to create a world system of financial control in private hands able to dominate the political system of each country and the economy of the world as a whole. This system was to be controlled in a feudalist fashion by the central banks of the world acting in concert, by secret agreements arrived at in frequent meetings and conferences. The apex of the systems was to be the Bank for International Settlements in Basel, Switzerland, a private bank owned and controlled by the world's central banks which were themselves private corporations. Each central bank...sought to dominate its government by its ability to control Treasury loans, to manipulate foreign exchanges, to influence the level of economic activity in the country, and to influence cooperative politicians by subsequent economic rewards in the business world."

- Carroll Quigley, CFR member, mentor to Bill Clinton, from 'Tragedy And Hope'
epii
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June 20, 2011, 11:52:16 PM
 #76


Agree 100%

Synaptic has to be the worst troll on this site.  He poisons nearly every thread.

He hasn't made any useful contributions that I can see.  If he has something productive to say, he should just say it, once, without profanity, if his infantile mind will allow him to do so.  Better yet, he should actually DO something, like start an exchange or a better fork of the Bitcoin software.

FUCK.
As Synaptic likes to say, QED.

Vires In Numeris.
MagicalTux
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June 20, 2011, 11:52:47 PM
 #77

Let me show you the login logs for our hacker guy on his account full of bitcoins, and Kevin:

Code:
[2011/06/19 05:00:02] Hacker login
[2011/06/19 05:12:10] Kevin login
[2011/06/19 05:15:10] Hacker login
[2011/06/19 05:22:35] Hacker login
[2011/06/19 05:45:39] Hacker login
[2011/06/19 06:08:18] Hacker login
I don't understand. Which account? Kevin and the hacker used the same account?

Yeah Please Explain this Jargon, And what is it that you're implying by it?

He is saying that Kevin logged in 12 minutes after the attacker logged in to start the attack.  Not damning by itself, and almost certainly a coincidence, but still a connection that needs to be followed up, particularly in light of how it all played out.

And placed a buy order at 0.01 USD per btc.

its quite odd that Kevin could login when the rest of us couldn't.  i watched the whole thing unfold and i certainly couldn't get in.
the other thing MT might be implying is that Kevin logged into the hacked acct?  now that would be damning.  please clarify?

He logged in 3 minutes before the whole thing unfold.

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June 20, 2011, 11:53:11 PM
 #78

Better yet, he should actually DO something, like start an exchange or a better fork of the Bitcoin software.

Yea or maybe he could go get a life and move out from under that bridge he's living under..  Grin

If you like my post please feel free to give me some positive rep https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=trust;u=18639
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Synaptic
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June 20, 2011, 11:53:43 PM
 #79


Agree 100%

Synaptic has to be the worst troll on this site.  He poisons nearly every thread.

He hasn't made any useful contributions that I can see.  If he has something productive to say, he should just say it, once, without profanity, if his infantile mind will allow him to do so.  Better yet, he should actually DO something, like start an exchange or a better fork of the Bitcoin software.

FUCK.
As Synaptic likes to say, QED.

QED.
nelisky
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June 20, 2011, 11:53:50 PM
 #80

So, after putting out the fact that I'm confident Mark will do 'the right thing (tm)' and that I don't have any suspicion of foul play from mtgox's part, I must say that this whole episode will force me to say goodbye to a good friend that has accompanied me for many years now... my email address. It is on the wild, it is related to bitcoins, it is getting spammed with get rich quick emails and is probably forever tainted.

Ah well, it breaks my heart but its a small price to pay for a lesson learned: use unique / disposable emails on anything that is not under your control (which is pretty much everything on the net, I guess).
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