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Author Topic: [ANN] LuckyCoin LKY | Lucky Blocks | Fast | Fun | Fair  (Read 107669 times)
rapta
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July 16, 2013, 02:50:04 AM
 #1241

Sadly it's only getting worse.  We are beyond a 24 hour retarget at this point.  Even 24 hours is bad, because in reality all that means is that only 480 blocks are mined for each retarget period (~2 days right now).  That's quite a bit shy of the target 1440 blocks that are supposed to be created each day.
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Titan
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July 16, 2013, 10:38:53 AM
 #1242

Sadly it's only getting worse.  We are beyond a 24 hour retarget at this point.  Even 24 hours is bad, because in reality all that means is that only 480 blocks are mined for each retarget period (~2 days right now).  That's quite a bit shy of the target 1440 blocks that are supposed to be created each day.

Yes, some action is required here. I am researching the best retarget times now. So not to introduce other undesired side effects.
I am thinking now of 5 - 10 min retarget intervals. So we will do a hard fork in the near future to break this feedback cycle.

Titan


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July 16, 2013, 11:44:39 PM
 #1243

The Luckycoin QT windows client is now available on GitHub.
https://github.com/LuckyCoinFoundation/LuckycoinQT

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=236714.0

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July 17, 2013, 12:07:28 AM
 #1244

Sadly it's only getting worse.  We are beyond a 24 hour retarget at this point.  Even 24 hours is bad, because in reality all that means is that only 480 blocks are mined for each retarget period (~2 days right now).  That's quite a bit shy of the target 1440 blocks that are supposed to be created each day.

Yes, some action is required here. I am researching the best retarget times now. So not to introduce other undesired side effects.
I am thinking now of 5 - 10 min retarget intervals. So we will do a hard fork in the near future to break this feedback cycle.

Titan



See if you can re-target based on time rather than block count, it should be pretty easy to do as each block has a timestamp so an "if greater than timestamp = x then adjust". Most devs take the easy way out and just change the block count parameter because it's easier to calculate when the last change occured, but just look at all the coins that have been high diff locked by the flash mining crowd to see that's pretty hopeless.

I think an elapsed time diff adjustment, like 10min, 30min, 1hr or more should be good, just depends on  how long you are prepared to leave the block rate out of range. If you adjust frequently, say every 10min, then you could set a limit like no more than +/- 10% change every 10min. So the ups and downs are a  bit more graceful.

If you went time based adjustments ask people to nominate the interval and the percentage to see whats prefered. You could even run a poll with some choices to see what miners want.

eg.

Interval  Max diff adjustment
 10min   10%
 30min   50%
 60min   unlimited
 ...







Titan
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July 17, 2013, 01:42:55 AM
 #1245

Sadly it's only getting worse.  We are beyond a 24 hour retarget at this point.  Even 24 hours is bad, because in reality all that means is that only 480 blocks are mined for each retarget period (~2 days right now).  That's quite a bit shy of the target 1440 blocks that are supposed to be created each day.

Yes, some action is required here. I am researching the best retarget times now. So not to introduce other undesired side effects.
I am thinking now of 5 - 10 min retarget intervals. So we will do a hard fork in the near future to break this feedback cycle.

Titan



See if you can re-target based on time rather than block count, it should be pretty easy to do as each block has a timestamp so an "if greater than timestamp = x then adjust". Most devs take the easy way out and just change the block count parameter because it's easier to calculate when the last change occured, but just look at all the coins that have been high diff locked by the flash mining crowd to see that's pretty hopeless.

I think an elapsed time diff adjustment, like 10min, 30min, 1hr or more should be good, just depends on  how long you are prepared to leave the block rate out of range. If you adjust frequently, say every 10min, then you could set a limit like no more than +/- 10% change every 10min. So the ups and downs are a  bit more graceful.

If you went time based adjustments ask people to nominate the interval and the percentage to see whats prefered. You could even run a poll with some choices to see what miners want.

eg.

Interval  Max diff adjustment
 10min   10%
 30min   50%
 60min   unlimited
 ...


I see your point now. This is an interesting idea.
There might be a problem if consecutive block numbers do not have consecutive time stamps.
I have to think a bit about it.

Certainly I am open to new ideas from the community to make the network more robust and secure and give a fair share to all miners.

Titan

  

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July 17, 2013, 02:52:06 AM
 #1246

Sadly it's only getting worse.  We are beyond a 24 hour retarget at this point.  Even 24 hours is bad, because in reality all that means is that only 480 blocks are mined for each retarget period (~2 days right now).  That's quite a bit shy of the target 1440 blocks that are supposed to be created each day.

Yes, some action is required here. I am researching the best retarget times now. So not to introduce other undesired side effects.
I am thinking now of 5 - 10 min retarget intervals. So we will do a hard fork in the near future to break this feedback cycle.

Titan



See if you can re-target based on time rather than block count, it should be pretty easy to do as each block has a timestamp so an "if greater than timestamp = x then adjust". Most devs take the easy way out and just change the block count parameter because it's easier to calculate when the last change occured, but just look at all the coins that have been high diff locked by the flash mining crowd to see that's pretty hopeless.

I think an elapsed time diff adjustment, like 10min, 30min, 1hr or more should be good, just depends on  how long you are prepared to leave the block rate out of range. If you adjust frequently, say every 10min, then you could set a limit like no more than +/- 10% change every 10min. So the ups and downs are a  bit more graceful.

If you went time based adjustments ask people to nominate the interval and the percentage to see whats prefered. You could even run a poll with some choices to see what miners want.

eg.

Interval  Max diff adjustment
 10min   10%
 30min   50%
 60min   unlimited
 ...


I see your point now. This is an interesting idea.
There might be a problem if consecutive block numbers do not have consecutive time stamps.
I have to think a bit about it.

Certainly I am open to new ideas from the community to make the network more robust and secure and give a fair share to all miners.

Titan

  

You may want to look at Mincoin's diff adjustment.  It handles the hashrate bursts rather well.

Multipool - Always mine the most profitable coin - Scrypt, X11 or SHA-256!
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July 18, 2013, 03:47:56 AM
 #1247

Sadly it's only getting worse.  We are beyond a 24 hour retarget at this point.  Even 24 hours is bad, because in reality all that means is that only 480 blocks are mined for each retarget period (~2 days right now).  That's quite a bit shy of the target 1440 blocks that are supposed to be created each day.

Yes, some action is required here. I am researching the best retarget times now. So not to introduce other undesired side effects.
I am thinking now of 5 - 10 min retarget intervals. So we will do a hard fork in the near future to break this feedback cycle.

Titan



See if you can re-target based on time rather than block count, it should be pretty easy to do as each block has a timestamp so an "if greater than timestamp = x then adjust". Most devs take the easy way out and just change the block count parameter because it's easier to calculate when the last change occured, but just look at all the coins that have been high diff locked by the flash mining crowd to see that's pretty hopeless.

I think an elapsed time diff adjustment, like 10min, 30min, 1hr or more should be good, just depends on  how long you are prepared to leave the block rate out of range. If you adjust frequently, say every 10min, then you could set a limit like no more than +/- 10% change every 10min. So the ups and downs are a  bit more graceful.

If you went time based adjustments ask people to nominate the interval and the percentage to see whats prefered. You could even run a poll with some choices to see what miners want.

eg.

Interval  Max diff adjustment
 10min   10%
 30min   50%
 60min   unlimited
 ...


I see your point now. This is an interesting idea.
There might be a problem if consecutive block numbers do not have consecutive time stamps.
I have to think a bit about it.

Certainly I am open to new ideas from the community to make the network more robust and secure and give a fair share to all miners.

Titan

 

You may want to look at Mincoin's diff adjustment.  It handles the hashrate bursts rather well.

Or.. you could.. as a courtesy, to each coin's core movement, decide that coin hopping is BAD BUSINESS.

HT xD

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July 18, 2013, 09:44:50 AM
 #1248

Come and try my Luckycoin pool: http://lky.nordicminers.eu, Stratum/PPLNS/1% Fee/No delays in payouts.
stratum+tcp://lky.nordicminers.eu:9441

Pools shutting down march 31st. Don't have time to support them, sorry for the inconvenience.
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July 19, 2013, 12:58:48 AM
 #1249

Come and try my Luckycoin pool: http://lky.nordicminers.eu, Stratum/PPLNS/1% Fee/No delays in payouts.
stratum+tcp://lky.nordicminers.eu:9441

Great! Thank you!

Titan

rapta
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July 21, 2013, 05:29:40 AM
 #1250

Titan, how is the difficulty fix coming?
Titan
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July 22, 2013, 05:36:02 AM
 #1251

Titan, how is the difficulty fix coming?

I have analyzed the Mincoin algorithm. It went form a 4x/4x to a 2x/8x configuration.
So the difficulty cannot rise as fast as before (2x) and it drops more quickly (8x).
This makes sense in some situations and we can also go into that direction.

I am still researching the other parameters. We certainly want to avoid a situation like Craftcoin.

Titan

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July 22, 2013, 10:12:41 AM
 #1252

Titan, how is the difficulty fix coming?

I have analyzed the Mincoin algorithm. It went form a 4x/4x to a 2x/8x configuration.
So the difficulty cannot rise as fast as before (2x) and it drops more quickly (8x).
This makes sense in some situations and we can also go into that direction.

I am still researching the other parameters. We certainly want to avoid a situation like Craftcoin.

Titan

You could add some clause like testnet, such as "if no block at all is found in X minutes, difficulty immediately drops to Y".
Has this already been tested in a living coin?

1LohorisJie8bGGG7X4dCS9MAVsTEbzrhu
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Titan
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July 22, 2013, 11:05:24 AM
 #1253

Titan, how is the difficulty fix coming?

I have analyzed the Mincoin algorithm. It went form a 4x/4x to a 2x/8x configuration.
So the difficulty cannot rise as fast as before (2x) and it drops more quickly (8x).
This makes sense in some situations and we can also go into that direction.

I am still researching the other parameters. We certainly want to avoid a situation like Craftcoin.

Titan

You could add some clause like testnet, such as "if no block at all is found in X minutes, difficulty immediately drops to Y".
Has this already been tested in a living coin?


This causes a synchronization issue. Think about a block that is found exactly at the cutoff time. The chain would fork and the question is who has the right chain now.

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July 22, 2013, 11:42:34 AM
 #1254

Community Poll

Dear Luckycoin Community,

One way to cure the current difficulty fluctuations on the Luckycoin network is to go to the root cause and ask for a suspension or removal of LKY from multipool.in.
My investigations have shown that essentially all the 400MH/s we see after a retarget come from the multipool site.
This measure would give back the real supporters of the Luckycoin network the opportunity to mine their fair share of coins.

Please post your opinion regarding this measure.

Titan

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July 22, 2013, 06:27:36 PM
 #1255

Community Poll

Dear Luckycoin Community,

One way to cure the current difficulty fluctuations on the Luckycoin network is to go to the root cause and ask for a suspension or removal of LKY from multipool.in.
My investigations have shown that essentially all the 400MH/s we see after a retarget come from the multipool site.
This measure would give back the real supporters of the Luckycoin network the opportunity to mine their fair share of coins.

Please post your opinion regarding this measure.

Titan


i disagree, this measure doesnt actually supports the open digital currency idea. Maybe something like stbgefltc/barwizi did to Noirbits will be more helpfull.

my 1 LKY  Smiley

yawn
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July 22, 2013, 07:11:57 PM
 #1256

Community Poll

Dear Luckycoin Community,

One way to cure the current difficulty fluctuations on the Luckycoin network is to go to the root cause and ask for a suspension or removal of LKY from multipool.in.
My investigations have shown that essentially all the 400MH/s we see after a retarget come from the multipool site.
This measure would give back the real supporters of the Luckycoin network the opportunity to mine their fair share of coins.

Please post your opinion regarding this measure.

Titan


Best of luck, but they've more or less rejected this concept (see the old Argentum thread for some details).  In short, they don't care about 'real supporters' (we are suckers), and they'll do whatever they can if it makes a quick buck.

Profit-Switching Pool w/ Vardiff -> http://hashco.ws  Optionally keep the alts we mine or auto-trade for BTC. In addition can be paid out in any of: 365, AC, BC,  BTC, C2, CINNI, COMM, FAC, HBN, MINT, PMC, QRK, RDD, WC, XBC
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July 23, 2013, 02:41:31 AM
 #1257

Community Poll

Dear Luckycoin Community,

One way to cure the current difficulty fluctuations on the Luckycoin network is to go to the root cause and ask for a suspension or removal of LKY from multipool.in.
My investigations have shown that essentially all the 400MH/s we see after a retarget come from the multipool site.
This measure would give back the real supporters of the Luckycoin network the opportunity to mine their fair share of coins.

Please post your opinion regarding this measure.

Titan


I would make the difficulty 100 times what it would be, if/when the network's hashrate jumps by a factor of x. If we can't have them, then no one will ! Grin

A less drastic measure would be to make the diff retarget, time based and/or sensitive to the total network hashpower in real time.

Both ideas will immediately cut off the parasite's supply of easy blocks.

HT xD


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July 23, 2013, 04:18:08 AM
 #1258

Spawning a new coin when the community is already unable to secure the coins it already has seems closer to the "root cause" of the "problem"...

-MarkM-

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July 23, 2013, 04:58:26 AM
 #1259

I'm not keen to get in another public argument in this thread, however, I will state for the record that the manner in which the question was brought to me in my pool thread and then in the ARG thread had as much to do with the answer ARG got as my own personal rationale for keeping ARG on Multipool.

Titan, if you want to PM me we can have a discussion about LKY's future on Multipool, however please understand that my position is that once a coin is public, and on exchanges, anyone should be free to mine it, including those who only want to mine when it is profitable to do so.

I will not reply in this thread again regarding this topic.

Multipool - Always mine the most profitable coin - Scrypt, X11 or SHA-256!
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July 23, 2013, 11:03:32 AM
 #1260

Titan, if you want to PM me we can have a discussion about LKY's future on Multipool, however please understand that my position is that once a coin is public, and on exchanges, anyone should be free to mine it, including those who only want to mine when it is profitable to do so.

Even though I don't like the concept of multipools, I have to admit that is correct. If you go public, you go public. Only reasonnable thing to do is to adjust difficulty algorithms and code so that this practice is no longer profitable.

One thing we did to help Noirbits (which I develop) is to place a max. time before next retarget. Basically, if difficulty gets too high for the actual hashrate, and next retarget takes too long to kick in, it is automatically dropped (for Noirbits, 4 hours max., while retargets are supposed to occur every hour).

The next step we are taking is too force a difficulty increase when blocks go too fast, so that we have symmetrical difficulty adjustements.

Just my two coins, but it might give you some ideas to improve your difficulty retarget rules...

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