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Author Topic: RentalStarter - A Midwest Real Estate Investment Company  (Read 118627 times)
NotoriousBIT
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April 01, 2014, 08:17:44 PM
 #421

How long will the IPO be open?  Until all shares are sold?
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April 01, 2014, 09:30:53 PM
 #422

How long will the IPO be open?  Until all shares are sold?

One month or until all the shares are sold, whichever comes first.

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April 02, 2014, 03:02:11 PM
 #423

Risk...

  Shareholders make up 30% of the company and after the first year get 30% of the net profits.  That's not a huge return being that the company is very small right now.  It's a long play, and the people who invest in Branny now may make out well in the future.  (Assuming Branny continues to do his best for the company and the shareholders and not turn into someone who abandons the project like so many others have.)  Though one has to worry about legal encroachment with these things.  (With everything Bitcoin related)

Also, I don't think Branny keeping funds in Bitcoin is a mistake.  Sure, the price is collapsing but if it rose the argument would go the other way.  Why weren't the funds kept in Bitcoin?  Realistically, we should be behind Bitcoin and be assured that its value will continue to rise.  Its value will rise again, it's just a matter of getting over this China Bank policy rumor fiasco.  Too many speculators laying in wait for the bubble to grow again, but not wanting to be in the crash.  I think we're near a bottom unless the PBOC announces stricter controls.  Then the market will react poorly, however it won't be able to get much lower and then start a gradual rise.  The rest of the world continues using it, demand will continue to grow.

I invest in RENT and continue to buy shares.  I intend to hold them as long as possible. 

The way I see it, speculation should be taken out of the equation as much as possible. This is an investment in the real world and Bitcoin is just a vehicle to enable the investment. I know it is not possible to segregate completely this risk but focus should be set on running a real estate business, not on when BTC price will rise or fall.

Note: I'm not criticizing Branny in any way, I just find it unfortunate that Havelock doesn't allow immediate releases to mitigate this risk

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April 02, 2014, 03:55:53 PM
 #424

I get what you're saying, but then why even sell shares for Bitcoins?  You either are in a Bitcoin related business or you aren't.  If you aren't, you shouldn't be dealing in the coins period.  As the entire thing is up and down even in the process of buying and selling shares.  Bitcoin is part of the equation of this business until Branny decides to take it out of Bitcoin and put it into Fiat only.  Personally, I like backing a company that is based in Bitcoin.  I believe that the value of Bitcoin will continue to rise.  We're dealing with some China nonsense and a lot of speculation that will subside after this new fall over the PBOC.  You just need one country to latch onto Bitcoin and we'll be up into the thousands per coin.  This things can happen fast.  Don't get hung up on the bad news.  If you don't want to invest in Bitcoin businesses, there's a whole world of things you can invest in with Fiat.

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April 02, 2014, 05:32:06 PM
 #425

Personally, I like backing a company that is based in Bitcoin.  I believe that the value of Bitcoin will continue to rise. 

It's not a company thats based in Bitcoins. It owns property, which is unrelated to Bitcoins. It should be fully invested and have no cash other than for contingencies, future investments etc.

If you want to bet on Bitcoin rising hold Bitcoins. This is Fiat investment (nothing wrong with that) that just happened to raise it's money through Bitcoins.
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April 02, 2014, 05:39:31 PM
 #426

And pays all its investors in Bitcoins as well.  So to convert out of Bitcoin means that when he collects the profits he has to convert back into Bitcoin.  That's stupid.  Better to keep a supply of coins to pay shareholders in Bitcoins and then save the Fiat from the property income. 

As Branny has stated as well, there are situations where he'd like to accept Bitcoin for rent.  Turning this into a Bitcoin business.  Currently it obviously is not.  But it's not just that he got a bunch of Bitcoins and turned them into cash.  He has to move the coins back and forth all the time to pay Dividends.  Ultimately if he gets people who want to do business in Bitcoin it could save him money on banking fees.

I agree that speculating with Bitcoins is not a way to run a business.  That said, cashing them out now when they are near or at the bottom is dumb unless you really think they are going to go lower.  We're in a crash situation today due to the PBOC, so it'd just be stupid to cash out now in my opinion.  It would be a panic move.  Better to wait for the dust to settle and try and cash out when it's worth more than it is now.  If he even wants to do that. 

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April 02, 2014, 11:12:33 PM
 #427

Personally, I like backing a company that is based in Bitcoin.  I believe that the value of Bitcoin will continue to rise. 

It's not a company thats based in Bitcoins. It owns property, which is unrelated to Bitcoins. It should be fully invested and have no cash other than for contingencies, future investments etc.

If you want to bet on Bitcoin rising hold Bitcoins. This is Fiat investment (nothing wrong with that) that just happened to raise it's money through Bitcoins.

Pretty much the optimal point of this company would be to liquidate Bitcoin assets at higher prices and then buy back Bitcoins from rental revenues at lower prices at least I think that is how it should work.

A big part of that is also finding good properties of course
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April 03, 2014, 02:49:34 AM
 #428

Thankfully we don't have a hugely difficult time finding quality properties.

Our 13% threshold is low enough that we hit quite a few candidate properties every time we search. Right now there are a few properties that are 13% or over in our desired neighborhoods. There are also a few flip candidates that would be great for returns.

The big thing is fundraising enough money to get enough properties to build enough monthly cashflow so we can try to lever via a local lender. This is the goal and if we can do it then we'll see exponential growth in the fund. If we don't, we'll trudge along at 13%-20% APY on the properties we have. Not ideal but not bad at all considering how terrible the bitcoin & bitcoin stock market has been the past 2-3 months.

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April 03, 2014, 03:13:19 AM
 #429

Thankfully we don't have a hugely difficult time finding quality properties.

Our 13% threshold is low enough that we hit quite a few candidate properties every time we search. Right now there are a few properties that are 13% or over in our desired neighborhoods. There are also a few flip candidates that would be great for returns.

The big thing is fundraising enough money to get enough properties to build enough monthly cashflow so we can try to lever via a local lender. This is the goal and if we can do it then we'll see exponential growth in the fund. If we don't, we'll trudge along at 13%-20% APY on the properties we have. Not ideal but not bad at all considering how terrible the bitcoin & bitcoin stock market has been the past 2-3 months.



Can you explain how you would get exponent growth if you have a local lender?  I don't follow.
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April 03, 2014, 03:52:21 AM
 #430

Thankfully we don't have a hugely difficult time finding quality properties.

Our 13% threshold is low enough that we hit quite a few candidate properties every time we search. Right now there are a few properties that are 13% or over in our desired neighborhoods. There are also a few flip candidates that would be great for returns.

The big thing is fundraising enough money to get enough properties to build enough monthly cashflow so we can try to lever via a local lender. This is the goal and if we can do it then we'll see exponential growth in the fund. If we don't, we'll trudge along at 13%-20% APY on the properties we have. Not ideal but not bad at all considering how terrible the bitcoin & bitcoin stock market has been the past 2-3 months.



Can you explain how you would get exponent growth if you have a local lender?  I don't follow.

I think he means leverage. You take a loan for which you pay a low interest and you obtain a higher return. Eventually you pay off that loan and then the return on your initial investment has grown exponentially.

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April 03, 2014, 04:47:35 PM
 #431

The big thing is fundraising enough money to get enough properties to build enough monthly cashflow so we can try to lever via a local lender. This is the goal and if we can do it then we'll see exponential growth in the fund. If we don't, we'll trudge along at 13%-20% APY on the properties we have. Not ideal but not bad at all considering how terrible the bitcoin & bitcoin stock market has been the past 2-3 months.



How much do the local lenders want you to have before they give you loans? Have they give you any feedback (to get this loan you would need X income), or do they just say "no, you don't make enough"?

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April 03, 2014, 05:06:47 PM
 #432

Most say not enough payment history, they also don't like the fact that I'm not making enough personally to pay back the loan (The first bank indicated that they didn't take the rental income into consideration at all).

Right now we own say around $450k worth of real estate once it's all rehabbed, we've put $300k into it all. We may be able to lend up to 70% of this number. We also will bring in roughly $6300/mo , with about $4500 being usable (Repair escrow, taxes, insurance deducted).

So for the loan - $450k * 70% = $315k

The resulting payment will be $2573/mo which will knock us down to $1,927/mo in free cashflow, BUT we'll have $315,000 more to spend on more properties. If we then went out and repeat the whole process, we would then purchase enough properties to then bring in an extra $4500/mo free and clear. This would put us over $6k/mo in free cashflow AND of that mortgage payment nearly a thousand dollars per month is going to loan reduction. So, in reality our interest payment is roughly $1200 per month which is unrecoverable interest.
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April 03, 2014, 08:27:18 PM
 #433

Found a older landlord wanting to liquidate quite a few properties. We don't have anywhere near the cash to buy them.

But, we do have enough cash to make (IMO) a pretty attractive seller-financed offer. Will go look at them tomorrow, maybe we can work something out.
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April 04, 2014, 03:07:49 PM
 #434

With all the crazyness of NeoBee and the market as a whole, I'm going to start the process of hiring/setting up liquidation agrements in the case of personal demise or disappearance of the issuer (me).

I'm talking to the atty right now about what needs to happen, but it would likely be the election of a POA (Most likely an attorney) who would be able to call a special shareholder meeting in case I lose contact with havelock and the shareholders in general.

This would cause all property to be automatically liquidated in the very best possible method which would recover most shareholder investment. There's also a very significant chance that the payout would be higher than the total investment due to the simple fact that we have so much equity in properties.

I'll keep everyone updated to the progress but actually plan to have everything set up by the end of the day. These kinds of agreements in the real estate world are stupidly easy to conduct.
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April 05, 2014, 11:14:32 AM
 #435

With all the crazyness of NeoBee and the market as a whole, I'm going to start the process of hiring/setting up liquidation agrements in the case of personal demise or disappearance of the issuer (me).

Very good idea and should add to the security of the investment.

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April 05, 2014, 12:25:22 PM
 #436

Found a older landlord wanting to liquidate quite a few properties. We don't have anywhere near the cash to buy them.

Whats the gross yield and the net after the costs of running them. Might have an idea......
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April 06, 2014, 01:58:18 AM
 #437

Found a older landlord wanting to liquidate quite a few properties. We don't have anywhere near the cash to buy them.

Whats the gross yield and the net after the costs of running them. Might have an idea......

Gross income is $4500/mo , cost might run at most $750/mo without setting aside money for repair escrow.

Kind of thought about asking to do seller financing w/ substantial down payment. Kind of shying away from that right now because to do it right we'd just about do all our liquid reserves.
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April 07, 2014, 08:49:26 AM
 #438

Any news on the CREI acquisition and future plans? Have you had a meeting with the guy in person?
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April 07, 2014, 01:46:39 PM
 #439

Any news on the CREI acquisition and future plans? Have you had a meeting with the guy in person?

Planning on flying down there tomorrow to meet him. If all goes well we'll fund his first property this week.

We also are closing on property #6 at 1:30ish today. Already got the HUD from the title company, last appraisal from what i can tell would have come in at $66k or so on the property we're buying as the seller owes $55k on it. The contract was for $39.9k + they are required to pro-rate April's rent along with sending us all deposits, this ends up being over $2k.
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April 08, 2014, 06:55:12 PM
 #440

Flight ended up being canceled due to aircraft issues. Will have to try and figure a way to get this taken care of in the next few days.
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