[ANN][PRESALE] BITNATION

[Sammied]

Is there actually a soft cap or do you have enough funds already secured to definitely make Bitnation happen?

Hey DrearyUrbanite, there's actually no soft cap. However, we do have a hard cap of
US$27.3 Million, total hard cap was $30 Million, but $2.7 Million sold in pre-sale in Q4 2017.

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[Zye]

This article has some really good information about the direction of Bitnation

https://steemit.com/bitcoin/@romanpetrush/bitnation-promises-an-efficient-problem-solving-ecosystem

[BestKait]

It's great that you're going to work with cryptocurrency, cause it's money of future. But I can't find the information about what exactly currency you're going to work with?

Hello, Here is a little it about the PAT Token, the currency of reputation in the Bitnation platform.

The Pangea Arbitration Token (PAT) is an ERC20 compatible, in-app token for the Pangea
Jurisdiction. The PAT token rewards good reputation and is issued on Pangea when Citizens
accumulate non-tradable reputation tokens through creating a contract, successfully completing a
contract or resolving a dispute attached to a contract. PAT is an algorithmic reputation token, an
arbitration currency based on performance rather than purchasing power, popularity or attention.

I hope this answers your question .

[Kaznachej123]

                                   Bitnation  ICO Review (RUS) for Russian-speaking people! BTCBTCBTC   👉 https://youtu.be/UTVtiU7kOH4 
                                                          My Twit:  https://twitter.com/Kaznachej123/status/980098579464359936

    Pangea is a secure mesh network forming a distributed web, accessed through a smartphone-chat user friendly interface. Blockchain agnostic smart contract functionality powers the Pangea Jurisdiction, currently implemented with Ethereum. Pangea is a decentralized market for legal services. Create and execute peer-to-peer agreements seamlessly across the world, resolve disputes fairly and efficiently.

                             

[kieran_84]

blog review
https://icoshrimp.com/bitnation-worlds-first-decentralized-borderless-voluntary-nation/

Thanks for the review egetrorx, I will pass this on to the team!

[Zye]

Just read a review that really goes into detail about Bitnation,

These points really stood out to me!

• It provides a platform for a variety of governance services for users including chatbots and decentralized services.

• Holds a unique directory of citizen’s details.

• Ensures peer-to-peer contracts with ample amount of security.

• Allows the users to create their own nation.

• Provides a variety of citizenship benefits.

• The tokens of BitNation are referred to as Pangea Arbitration tokens. These tokens are used to give rewards.


https://medium.com/@sinofd/bitnation-ico-review-decentralized-borderless-voluntary-nation-70e70e098e00

[lps21]

Hi Everyone,

Here is a short video from the team of Bitnation regarding the token sale:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y1ZaKDGCGwA&feature=youtu.be

Take some time to click the link!

[Maslate]

Hi OP, I believe we are not in the pre-sale phase anymore, maybe we should change the title of this thread, every detail is very important
to attract investors. What I see now is that the contribution is very slow, it's still less than 1,000 ETH so far.

[vabchgent]

i've read all of your white paper and other of your project documents, and i still don't don't understand what about is this project....

Hi vensky,

Thank you for taking the time to read it.

Bitnation is creating a jurisdiction - a legal domain - in which p2p agreements can be made, disputes resolved and contracts enforced through reputation. So the answer is most people would use it - it’s 100 times cheaper than using legacy legal services, more secure, trustworthy and configurable for your life. More and more people live and work across borders and need a jurisdiction to account for that. Even more live and work in the informal economy (2bn according to World Bank estimates) and have no current legal protections. On our jurisdiction you can make enforceable binding agreements without recourse to 3rd parties. Communities and nations can also be built on the jurisdiction to offer services to their members - this means that a free market for governance services is possible - increasing choice and driving down costs.

What happens if I enter a contract with a counterparty and we agree upon certain terms and conditions. Now one party breaks the rules. Who is going to enforce my claims? Will it be acknowledged by any official jurisdiction?

Hey vabchgent,
Enforcement is done through financial and reputation incentives. Contracts are agreed to voluntarily and only apply peer-to-peer, there is no police necessary. Instead of deterrence enforcement is done through positive incentives

Can you think of any scenario where it might make sense for one party to deviate from the contract? Even if it is damaging both parties for example? What happens then? Would a court still be a place to go or how do envision such a situation (if existent) to play out? Very interesting project anyway here!

[Sammied]

Here's a brief but packed video about Bitnation shot at  Ashland, Oregon, to start your day!

Video introduces and  gives updates about Bitnation.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TpBKFnL2Q_0

Enjoy!!

[Sammied]

i've read all of your white paper and other of your project documents, and i still don't don't understand what about is this project....

Hi vensky,

Thank you for taking the time to read it.

Bitnation is creating a jurisdiction - a legal domain - in which p2p agreements can be made, disputes resolved and contracts enforced through reputation. So the answer is most people would use it - it’s 100 times cheaper than using legacy legal services, more secure, trustworthy and configurable for your life. More and more people live and work across borders and need a jurisdiction to account for that. Even more live and work in the informal economy (2bn according to World Bank estimates) and have no current legal protections. On our jurisdiction you can make enforceable binding agreements without recourse to 3rd parties. Communities and nations can also be built on the jurisdiction to offer services to their members - this means that a free market for governance services is possible - increasing choice and driving down costs.

What happens if I enter a contract with a counterparty and we agree upon certain terms and conditions. Now one party breaks the rules. Who is going to enforce my claims? Will it be acknowledged by any official jurisdiction?

Hey vabchgent,
Enforcement is done through financial and reputation incentives. Contracts are agreed to voluntarily and only apply peer-to-peer, there is no police necessary. Instead of deterrence enforcement is done through positive incentives

Can you think of any scenario where it might make sense for one party to deviate from the contract? Even if it is damaging both parties for example? What happens then? Would a court still be a place to go or how do envision such a situation (if existent) to play out? Very interesting project anyway here!

Hello Vabchgent,

PAT drives the reputation system on Pangea, which provides a native contract enforcement mechanism. Pangea awards three non-tradable sub-tokens for 1.) making and successfully completing contracts and arbitrating disputes (keeping your word), 2.) building and populating  nations and offering services citizens rate highly, 3.) developing and updating smart contracts that are highly rated by users. Users can only rate ‘machines ’ - smart contracts and nations - not other users (to prevent popularity contests), while a machine (AI) rates users against set criteria.

PAT is a tradable reward (like air miles) for building up a good reputation (accumulating non-tradable tokens). It can be used on the platform to buy services and exchanged for other digital assets - we have a deal with shapeshift already. You can also use any other crypto to buy services and trade on Pangea, but use of PAT will provide a small discount.

 So a jurisdiction is a domain of law. In which any agreements can made and upheld to a set of agreed rules (a legal code). Because ours is a peer-to-peer jurisdiction, those rules are agreed between the parties to each agreement, not by any third party or authority. The Pangea jurisdiction allows these agreements to be made, and provides a native human arbitration system to resolve disputes - and a reputation system for enforcement.

In addition to p2p agreements, users can also create their own voluntary communities- nations- for collective agreements, and to offer governance services. These can use the Pangea jurisdiction to their own set of collective rules.

Since they are voluntary (nobody is forced to join them, and any citizen can leave at any time) these communities must compete for citizens in a free market for governance - and it’s perfectly possible - even likely - that users will join several nations to access different services (e.g. a occupation based nation, say for employment and education - e.g. a wheat farmers nation, or a solidity developers nation, another for their local needs - say a neighborhood or city association for trash  collection, basic income and local services, and a cultural nation for religious or other social services - like a nation of Goths or Buddhists.) so governance becomes like other aspects of life, a matter of choosing what suits you best.

[kieran_84]

Hi all!

I recommend giving this steemit post a read:

https://steemit.com/ico/@maniecool/bitnation

It covers what Bitnation is, what Pangea's features and system architecture are and a roadmap for the project.

[vabchgent]

i've read all of your white paper and other of your project documents, and i still don't don't understand what about is this project....

Hi vensky,

Thank you for taking the time to read it.

Bitnation is creating a jurisdiction - a legal domain - in which p2p agreements can be made, disputes resolved and contracts enforced through reputation. So the answer is most people would use it - it’s 100 times cheaper than using legacy legal services, more secure, trustworthy and configurable for your life. More and more people live and work across borders and need a jurisdiction to account for that. Even more live and work in the informal economy (2bn according to World Bank estimates) and have no current legal protections. On our jurisdiction you can make enforceable binding agreements without recourse to 3rd parties. Communities and nations can also be built on the jurisdiction to offer services to their members - this means that a free market for governance services is possible - increasing choice and driving down costs.

What happens if I enter a contract with a counterparty and we agree upon certain terms and conditions. Now one party breaks the rules. Who is going to enforce my claims? Will it be acknowledged by any official jurisdiction?

Hey vabchgent,
Enforcement is done through financial and reputation incentives. Contracts are agreed to voluntarily and only apply peer-to-peer, there is no police necessary. Instead of deterrence enforcement is done through positive incentives

Can you think of any scenario where it might make sense for one party to deviate from the contract? Even if it is damaging both parties for example? What happens then? Would a court still be a place to go or how do envision such a situation (if existent) to play out? Very interesting project anyway here!

Hello Vabchgent,

PAT drives the reputation system on Pangea, which provides a native contract enforcement mechanism. Pangea awards three non-tradable sub-tokens for 1.) making and successfully completing contracts and arbitrating disputes (keeping your word), 2.) building and populating  nations and offering services citizens rate highly, 3.) developing and updating smart contracts that are highly rated by users. Users can only rate ‘machines ’ - smart contracts and nations - not other users (to prevent popularity contests), while a machine (AI) rates users against set criteria.

PAT is a tradable reward (like air miles) for building up a good reputation (accumulating non-tradable tokens). It can be used on the platform to buy services and exchanged for other digital assets - we have a deal with shapeshift already. You can also use any other crypto to buy services and trade on Pangea, but use of PAT will provide a small discount.

 So a jurisdiction is a domain of law. In which any agreements can made and upheld to a set of agreed rules (a legal code). Because ours is a peer-to-peer jurisdiction, those rules are agreed between the parties to each agreement, not by any third party or authority. The Pangea jurisdiction allows these agreements to be made, and provides a native human arbitration system to resolve disputes - and a reputation system for enforcement.

In addition to p2p agreements, users can also create their own voluntary communities- nations- for collective agreements, and to offer governance services. These can use the Pangea jurisdiction to their own set of collective rules.

Since they are voluntary (nobody is forced to join them, and any citizen can leave at any time) these communities must compete for citizens in a free market for governance - and it’s perfectly possible - even likely - that users will join several nations to access different services (e.g. a occupation based nation, say for employment and education - e.g. a wheat farmers nation, or a solidity developers nation, another for their local needs - say a neighborhood or city association for trash  collection, basic income and local services, and a cultural nation for religious or other social services - like a nation of Goths or Buddhists.) so governance becomes like other aspects of life, a matter of choosing what suits you best.

Thank you very much for all those details. It is a very interesting but also challenging concept in the way that it is hard to grasp its potential impact on our real lives. You mention, among others, this example of a wheat farmers nation: that is where I have a hard time to fully understand the consequences of such a nation. If we say that a wheat farmer enters a contract with a baker and both agree on a certain price to be paid for a certain amount of wheat on a specific date via Bitnation (is that a possible example, i.e. a futures contract?), and the baker doesn't pay, then the baker will lose reputation. Does that situation have any consequence outside the "virtual" bitnation world? Or am I totally off here with my example?

I do understand what you are essentially building, at least I believe so. I am just asking myself how Bitnation exists in relation to our current world? Can we just be there and make contracts outside or our jurisdictional world? Is that even legal?

[Sammied]

i've read all of your white paper and other of your project documents, and i still don't don't understand what about is this project....

Hi vensky,

Thank you for taking the time to read it.

Bitnation is creating a jurisdiction - a legal domain - in which p2p agreements can be made, disputes resolved and contracts enforced through reputation. So the answer is most people would use it - it’s 100 times cheaper than using legacy legal services, more secure, trustworthy and configurable for your life. More and more people live and work across borders and need a jurisdiction to account for that. Even more live and work in the informal economy (2bn according to World Bank estimates) and have no current legal protections. On our jurisdiction you can make enforceable binding agreements without recourse to 3rd parties. Communities and nations can also be built on the jurisdiction to offer services to their members - this means that a free market for governance services is possible - increasing choice and driving down costs.

What happens if I enter a contract with a counterparty and we agree upon certain terms and conditions. Now one party breaks the rules. Who is going to enforce my claims? Will it be acknowledged by any official jurisdiction?

Hey vabchgent,
Enforcement is done through financial and reputation incentives. Contracts are agreed to voluntarily and only apply peer-to-peer, there is no police necessary. Instead of deterrence enforcement is done through positive incentives

Can you think of any scenario where it might make sense for one party to deviate from the contract? Even if it is damaging both parties for example? What happens then? Would a court still be a place to go or how do envision such a situation (if existent) to play out? Very interesting project anyway here!

Hello Vabchgent,

PAT drives the reputation system on Pangea, which provides a native contract enforcement mechanism. Pangea awards three non-tradable sub-tokens for 1.) making and successfully completing contracts and arbitrating disputes (keeping your word), 2.) building and populating  nations and offering services citizens rate highly, 3.) developing and updating smart contracts that are highly rated by users. Users can only rate ‘machines ’ - smart contracts and nations - not other users (to prevent popularity contests), while a machine (AI) rates users against set criteria.

PAT is a tradable reward (like air miles) for building up a good reputation (accumulating non-tradable tokens). It can be used on the platform to buy services and exchanged for other digital assets - we have a deal with shapeshift already. You can also use any other crypto to buy services and trade on Pangea, but use of PAT will provide a small discount.

 So a jurisdiction is a domain of law. In which any agreements can made and upheld to a set of agreed rules (a legal code). Because ours is a peer-to-peer jurisdiction, those rules are agreed between the parties to each agreement, not by any third party or authority. The Pangea jurisdiction allows these agreements to be made, and provides a native human arbitration system to resolve disputes - and a reputation system for enforcement.

In addition to p2p agreements, users can also create their own voluntary communities- nations- for collective agreements, and to offer governance services. These can use the Pangea jurisdiction to their own set of collective rules.

Since they are voluntary (nobody is forced to join them, and any citizen can leave at any time) these communities must compete for citizens in a free market for governance - and it’s perfectly possible - even likely - that users will join several nations to access different services (e.g. a occupation based nation, say for employment and education - e.g. a wheat farmers nation, or a solidity developers nation, another for their local needs - say a neighborhood or city association for trash  collection, basic income and local services, and a cultural nation for religious or other social services - like a nation of Goths or Buddhists.) so governance becomes like other aspects of life, a matter of choosing what suits you best.

Thank you very much for all those details. It is a very interesting but also challenging concept in the way that it is hard to grasp its potential impact on our real lives. You mention, among others, this example of a wheat farmers nation: that is where I have a hard time to fully understand the consequences of such a nation. If we say that a wheat farmer enters a contract with a baker and both agree on a certain price to be paid for a certain amount of wheat on a specific date via Bitnation (is that a possible example, i.e. a futures contract?), and the baker doesn't pay, then the baker will lose reputation. Does that situation have any consequence outside the "virtual" bitnation world? Or am I totally off here with my example?

I do understand what you are essentially building, at least I believe so. I am just asking myself how Bitnation exists in relation to our current world? Can we just be there and make contracts outside or our jurisdictional world? Is that even legal?

Your reputation on Pangea determines how others view your ability to keep your word. This reduces or increase your chances of other to carry business transactions with you or not in the future. Aside reputation on Pangea which sounds more virtual, there's also an escrow - you will be able to put digital assets into escrow on a blockchain, (examples are land titles, ownership documents for assets like cars etc, deeds for buildings, wills, crypto-currency etc.), these will only be released on contract completion after arbitration. So in your case scenario if baker doesn't pay the farmer, what ever asset that was held in escrow will not be released until he carries out his part of the contract. There's also contract insurance - you can take out insurance against one party failing to fulfill their part of the bargain.

We all operate in both virtual and non-virtual worlds, and more so. You could have a bank account in New York and never visit a bank there or seen any of your cash dollars, but it will still work well for you when you need it because you can access it online. Goods are ordered daily from  Amazon, but nobody goes an Amazon store (in fact like the bank in New York, they don't exist as places you can walk into and do business), but like the dollars from the bank, the books from Amazon arrive on time. Why should jurisdiction be any different? The fact that it is, suggests its an archaic system ripe for disruption.

I hope this answers your question.

[kieran_84]

I am interested in this project as well after reading the available information on page first. Total maximum supply also is promising if all the tokens get sold.

The total tokens supply available is 42 Billion, however only 14.28 Billion are available during the token sale.

[Maslate]

I am interested in this project as well after reading the available information on page first. Total maximum supply also is promising if all the tokens get sold.

The total tokens supply available is 42 Billion, however only 14.28 Billion are available during the token sale.

What will happen to the tokens not intended for sale, and the unsold tokens will be burn?
Some ICOs do lock unsold tokens and some big tokens allocated in different purpose, I don't really like big supply project that the team has bigger supply to control.

[Sammied]

I am interested in this project as well after reading the available information on page first. Total maximum supply also is promising if all the tokens get sold.

The total tokens supply available is 42 Billion, however only 14.28 Billion are available during the token sale.

What will happen to the tokens not intended for sale, and the unsold tokens will be burn?
Some ICOs do lock unsold tokens and some big tokens allocated in different purpose, I don't really like big supply project that the team has bigger supply to control.

Hello there, the unsold tokens will not be burnt.
The supply of PAT is capped at 42 Billion, 18% are pre-allocated to founders, core team members and early investors, 34% will be released as rewards for good governance on Pangea and 14% is reserved for future contributors.

The remaining 34% will be sold across the three phases of the token sale.

The sale of 34% of the tokens is spread over 3 phases - presale 2.7% (complete), ICO 7.3% (25th March), slow release 24% (1% p/m for 2 yrs).

I hope this answers your question. 

[Margary]

I wonder if this idea will develop.
it is rather non-standard.
and it is not known whether these documents will be recognized by countries of the world.

[kieran_84]

I wonder if this idea will develop.
it is rather non-standard.
and it is not known whether these documents will be recognized by countries of the world.

Agreements made on Bitnation are legally binding, already at least one document notarised on Bitnation's Public Notary (a company registration) has stood up in UK courts when disputed.

[lps21]

Hi everybody,

Sharing a link here for an article that shares the goals of Bitnation, it's a pretty interesting read and something you all should be interested in. Thank you!

https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/choose-your-own-country-bitnation-vincent-lionheart/?published=t