[OFFICIAL]Bitfinex.com first Bitcoin P2P lending platform for leverage trading

[noobtrader]

TH1 is probably going to return 4.3 more dividends.  But it could be anything from 1-10.

 


then im losing 0.6 btc...
 

[Sukrim]

Just a heads-up:
2FA seems to treat "000001" and "1" the same - while ignoring leading zeroes is not THAT much of a problem (still a large search space), it is still something that could/should be fixed in your backend.

[DoubleSwapper]

Just a heads-up:
2FA seems to treat "000001" and "1" the same - while ignoring leading zeroes is not THAT much of a problem (still a large search space), it is still something that could/should be fixed in your backend.

Interesting. It also ignores additional non numer signs like if you type 48458# instead of 48458 it will be accepted.
 

One thing I'm not certain of, as there are so few opportunities to really test it, is whether the same applies for unused swaps.

I have before now had a 30 day reservation taken out on a block of funds, which the trader then proceeded to trade very very slowly into a position - like, $3 at a time, and each time they broke off another $3 piece to convert into a 'used' swap, the time remaining counter on the unused remainder seemed to reset back to "about 1 month" or, shortly later, "30 days", even while the remaining time on the active swaps (the funds for which had originally been the same block) ticked down to 29 or 28 days.

They returned the whole lot long before it became relevant, but it left me with the impression of a loophole around unused swaps.

this is what I have noticed too, mine is closer to "expiring"  14th Dec (30 days from 14th Nov) but still 12 days to go

same with my unused swaps......this bug must be fixed...gives me the impression of a loophole ...I stopped offering.until it is fixed.or paid on time...awaiting some comments from you and/or from the support.

Hooray!!!!!!....finally the swap was paid on time......the support DIDNOT respond to my messages..... and I was a bit nervous reminding me  the Gox days....

Are you guys talking about normal USD swaps? I've never encountered something similar and the swap payment seems consistent with the rate at the moment.

[noggin-scratcher]

Are you guys talking about normal USD swaps? I've never encountered something similar and the swap payment seems consistent with the rate at the moment.

Those last two guys seem to be talking about a different thing than I was - all I noticed was some potential weirdness around the expiry date where it seemed to reset the unused remainder to the full initially offered duration (or possibly just rounded up to a whole number of days; would have had the same effect) whenever funds were moved from unused to used. Never noticed any discrepancy with the payment.

I wonder if it's connected with that other oddness in the other direction, where the 'time remaining' on reserved funds repeatedly ticked downwards as they were used... could be the implementation only has a concept of integer numbers of days.

[Hunyadi]

Is the BTC hotwallet empty? I have not received my withdrawal, yet...

It is currently "Processing" (it is just 15 mins, so no big deal)

e. withdrawal completed  

[nrd525]

Now that the whole TH1 contract fiasco is over.

Ways in which BFX profited from the manipulation of the TH1 contract at the expense of their customers

1. The price premium that was caused by manipulation and the increased volatility due to market manipulation increased the TH1BTC swap rate to two or more times what it should have been.  This doubled the amount of swap fees.

2. The price premium increased the fees collected on trades.

3. (optional)  The price premium may have allowed Bitfinex to sell contracts to the market maker at a higher price than they cost.  The identity of the market maker is unknown and given the manipulation in the market and the way in which contracts were randomly issued this is disturbing.

[grappa_barricata]

Now that the whole TH1 contract fiasco is over.

Ways in which BFX profited from the manipulation of the TH1 contract at the expense of their customers

1. The price premium that was caused by manipulation and the increased volatility due to market manipulation increased the TH1BTC swap rate to two or more times what it should have been.  This doubled the amount of swap fees.

2. The price premium increased the fees collected on trades.

3. (optional)  The price premium may have allowed Bitfinex to sell contracts to the market maker at a higher price than they cost.  The identity of the market maker is unknown and given the manipulation in the market and the way in which contracts were randomly issued this is disturbing.

Bitfinex has lost points on this situation in the eyes of many clients... (the market started with a long squeeze and ended with a short squeeze, new TH1 were issued with little to no warning in a self-contained market, mysterious market maker raping everybody...).
I suggest they at least consider refunding some of the losses people are reporting (even as low as 10% refund will be seen positively).
Unfortunately, if they do so they have to pay from their own pockets (they can't expect who profited from this to still have the money in their account, and will not be positive for their image anyway to 'seize' users funds).

So, maybe a limited 'rollback' can be an acceptable solution. And I really hope no more mining contracts will be traded at bitfinex (at least without some serious redesign of the system).

[dankster]

anyone else having an issue logging in to BFX using the 2FA? keeps telling me my code is invalid. 

[noggin-scratcher]

anyone else having an issue logging in to BFX using the 2FA? keeps telling me my code is invalid.  

Fine for me. Have you checked that your system clock (on your phone) is accurate?

The codes are time-dependent so if you disagree with the server about the time you may generate a different code than it's expecting to receive.

[dankster]

yeah looks like my phone is out of sync. i installed authy on my PC and the code worked.  very strange!

[noobtrader]

Now that the TH1BTC contract is done, here are my suggestions:

1. Show values in BTC rather than $ in the TH1BTC (and LTCBTC) margin trading display. Dollars amounts aren't useful since everything is done in BTC and nothing is done in dollars.

2. Make the trading price range limits smarter. In the last few days of the TH1BTC contract, the value dropped quickly enough to make it impossible to trade sometimes because the software limits the difference between the trade price and the last price to 10%. In some cases, I could not sell to bids that were 40% above the contract's expected value.

3. I don't know if it is me or what, but I got a few margin calls and it was not obvious why. It would be nice if a number were displayed that tells you how close you are to reaching the margin requirement, or at least provide two values that can be compared.

oh derp...

i lost 0.2 btc on TH1BTC,

[nrd525]

TH1
I lost about 8.8 BTC and then made back 0.8 BTC for a net loss of 8 BTC. Without manipulation, I would have made a net profit of 0 BTC.  If I had held on 5-7 days longer and been bailed out by Bitfinex when they intervened in the market and bailed out the shorters then I would have made a profit of 13 BTC.  But instead I cut my losses because there was no indication that they would act.

The market should never be offered unless swap is available for the same length of lifetime (in days) as the contract.

[noobtrader]

TH1
I lost about 8.8 BTC and then made back 0.8 BTC for a net loss of 8 BTC. Without manipulation, I would have made a net profit of 0 BTC.  If I had held on 5-7 days longer and been bailed out by Bitfinex when they intervened in the market and bailed out the shorters then I would have made a profit of 13 BTC.  But instead I cut my losses because there was no indication that they would act.

The market should never be offered unless swap is available for the same length of lifetime (in days) as the contract.

wow 8 btc is like 2700 usd

how much 1TH did you play ?


btw is it true that 1TH is gone for good now or will they offer new contract ?

[nrd525]

I had a short for 28 TH1 contracts.  They were priced at 30-45% over mining value (and 20-40% over mining value plus expected swap cost), so I thought it was a good risk.  Turns out that the contract's value didn't depend on mining value...
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=853084

I'm not rich.  This is the most money I've ever lost on an investment in my 23 years of investing. I've made a couple thousand on lending USD swaps at Bitfinex, so I'm sticking with the show.  But while I was a formerly very happy customer, I'm now disgruntled.

[johndee]

tried to withdraw money yesterday from bitfinex. a day passed but money is not being transferred. wrote to support twice, but they are not answering. what is going on there? anyone encountered the same problem during the last day or two? is it goxing?

[SebastianJu]

I want to margin trade on bitfinex and i know the fundamental principles of how it works. And i traded such papers on real world stocks. But i cant find out how it works on bitfinex even with their explaination on margin trading because they only describe fundamentals and those sound different from what i would await. Daily payout? I thought payments happen only when the paper ends?

As far as i understand one can short and long BTC there. Or you can be a lender for bitcoins. If you want you cant create a option paper? yourself or buy such papers that others created.

So how exactly, step by step, can i bid on a lowering bitcoin price? Thanks!

[noggin-scratcher]

I want to margin trade on bitfinex and i know the fundamental principles of how it works. And i traded such papers on real world stocks. But i cant find out how it works on bitfinex even with their explaination on margin trading because they only describe fundamentals and those sound different from what i would await. Daily payout? I thought payments happen only when the paper ends?

As far as i understand one can short and long BTC there. Or you can be a lender for bitcoins. If you want you cant create a option paper? yourself or buy such papers that others created.

So how exactly, step by step, can i bid on a lowering bitcoin price? Thanks!

I have no "real world" trading background so I may use screwy terminology, but the basic principle is (as with any leveraged trade) to borrow the side of the pair that you think is going to be less valuable, use those borrowed funds to trade into the other currency, then wait for the price to move in your favour before paying back what you owe and keeping the difference as your profit.

On 'finex your choice is to provide 'swaps' that pay you a small fixed percentage rate per day in exchange for giving someone else control over those funds (either BTC or USD) to trade with. Or to take swaps, pay that rate, and use them to fund your trading. The daily payout is to settle the percentage due to the swap provider (payable either out of your capital or by borrowing more). When it comes to the profits from your position it's as you described; only at the end when you close it out.

So to enter a short position you would put your funds into the 'trading' wallet, then go to the margin trade tab and enter a "Sell" order. If you sell more coins than you personally own, it'll automatically take out a BTC swap to fund your position, or if you prefer you can go to the swaps tab to manually reserve some funds to try and secure a better rate.

[noobtrader]

tried to withdraw money yesterday from bitfinex. a day passed but money is not being transferred. wrote to support twice, but they are not answering. what is going on there? anyone encountered the same problem during the last day or two? is it goxing?

keep us informed, maybe just time difference.  try pm and email unclescrooge

[GreekGeek]

Those last two guys seem to be talking about a different thing than I was - all I noticed was some potential weirdness around the expiry date where it seemed to reset the unused remainder to the full initially offered duration (or possibly just rounded up to a whole number of days; would have had the same effect) whenever funds were moved from unused to used. Never noticed any discrepancy with the payment.

I wonder if it's connected with that other oddness in the other direction, where the 'time remaining' on reserved funds repeatedly ticked downwards as they were used... could be the implementation only has a concept of integer numbers of days.

I was talking about the same thing you are, it seems to appear only on unused swaps
was thinking  the same about the integer number of days , but it seems that is only a "visual" glitch because the swaps  were returned on time

can't be sure though if this happens every time , maybe someone from bitfinex can make it clear to us 

[Tzupy]

I would like to trade with leverage on Bitfinex, but I don't want to send (or withdraw) fiat to / from Bitfinex,
I only want to send and withdraw bitcoins. Do I have to complete the full verification? I can send scans of ID card, passport,
utility bill and of a recent bank document involving fiat transfer to another exchange (not Bitfinex). Would that be good enough?
Sorry if this looks silly, but I browsed the last 10 pages of this thread and couldn't find relevant information on my problem.