|
nearmiss
|
 |
July 15, 2013, 12:59:48 AM |
|
We all thank you for your pools contributions to low diff coins. Where would we be without it! The positive impact on all those involved with the coin outside the 20min coinchoose window of profitability thank you.
 damn, yah got me there. So what would happen if your multipool only switched to coins that had more hashpower than multipool itself? I'm surprised someone who has spent so much of their time on cryptocurrency, and presumably has or is making a bit of profit from it (either mining or building tech for it like you have) would be so arrogant and care so little for the negative impact they have on it (regardless of what you may think of individual coins, this one or others). |
Profit-Switching Pool w/ Vardiff -> http://hashco.ws Optionally keep the alts we mine or auto-trade for BTC. In addition can be paid out in any of: 365, AC, BC, BTC, C2, CINNI, COMM, FAC, HBN, MINT, PMC, QRK, RDD, WC, XBC |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Even in the event that an attacker gains more than 50% of the network's
computational power, only transactions sent by the attacker could be
reversed or double-spent. The network would not be destroyed.
|
|
|
Advertised sites are not endorsed by the Bitcoin Forum. They may be unsafe, untrustworthy, or illegal in your jurisdiction.
|
|
|
|
|
|
flound1129
|
|
July 15, 2013, 01:05:57 AM |
|
damn, yah got me there.
So what would happen if your multipool only switched to coins that had more hashpower than multipool itself? I'm surprised someone who has spent so much of their time on cryptocurrency, and presumably has or is making a bit of profit from it (either mining or building tech for it like you have) would be so arrogant and care so little for the negative impact they have on it (regardless of what you may think of individual coins, this one or others).
what's the impact exactly? Besides you not getting the profits you want? How about you don't list your coin on an exchange until it has a reasonable network hashrate? ooohhhhh, I think I see the problem. |
Multipool - Always mine the most profitable coin - Scrypt, X11 or SHA-256!
|
|
|
|
Eli0t
|
|
July 15, 2013, 01:07:40 AM |
|
damn, yah got me there.
So what would happen if your multipool only switched to coins that had more hashpower than multipool itself? I'm surprised someone who has spent so much of their time on cryptocurrency, and presumably has or is making a bit of profit from it (either mining or building tech for it like you have) would be so arrogant and care so little for the negative impact they have on it (regardless of what you may think of individual coins, this one or others).
what's the impact exactly? Besides you not getting the profits you want? How about you don't list your coin on an exchange until it has a reasonable network hashrate? ooohhhhh, I think I see the problem. it is you who are after profits and care not what you destory for a quick few cents |
LTC: LKpJf3uk7KsHU73kxq8iFJrP1AAKN7Yni7 DGC: DKXGvEbj3Rwgrm2QQbRyNPDDZDYoq4Y44d XPM: AWV5AKfLFyoBaMjg9C77rGUBhuFxz5DGGL
|
|
|
|
flound1129
|
|
July 15, 2013, 01:10:32 AM |
|
damn, yah got me there.
So what would happen if your multipool only switched to coins that had more hashpower than multipool itself? I'm surprised someone who has spent so much of their time on cryptocurrency, and presumably has or is making a bit of profit from it (either mining or building tech for it like you have) would be so arrogant and care so little for the negative impact they have on it (regardless of what you may think of individual coins, this one or others).
what's the impact exactly? Besides you not getting the profits you want? How about you don't list your coin on an exchange until it has a reasonable network hashrate? ooohhhhh, I think I see the problem. it is you who are after profits and care not what you destory for a quick few cents Please tell me what I'm destroying. |
Multipool - Always mine the most profitable coin - Scrypt, X11 or SHA-256!
|
|
|
|
BobMarley
|
|
July 15, 2013, 01:18:54 AM |
|
Premine yawn
|
|
|
|
|
nearmiss
|
|
July 15, 2013, 01:24:51 AM |
|
damn, yah got me there.
So what would happen if your multipool only switched to coins that had more hashpower than multipool itself? I'm surprised someone who has spent so much of their time on cryptocurrency, and presumably has or is making a bit of profit from it (either mining or building tech for it like you have) would be so arrogant and care so little for the negative impact they have on it (regardless of what you may think of individual coins, this one or others).
what's the impact exactly? Besides you not getting the profits you want? How about you don't list your coin on an exchange until it has a reasonable network hashrate? ooohhhhh, I think I see the problem. it is you who are after profits and care not what you destory for a quick few cents Please tell me what I'm destroying. 1) Not my coin 2) What impact? Seriously? Have you read any of the posts from other people here? 3) Do you see the problem? Please share. Me running pools only has the same impact as you have on miners of the coin. Imagine for a moment someone had done this in the early days of LTC. And those mining LTC on a constant basis had to consistently deal with 5000% network increases during every low diff period, then slog through the higher diff with a fraction of the hashrate. (assume LTC had a reasonable diff retarget like most new coins do now, including ARG, and wouldn't have gotten stuck at an impossible high diff, which it would have). Would it ever have gained the traction it has? Would it be at $2.50+ right now? (note: I'm in no way trying to compare ARG to LTC in terms of merit, value, whatever. Just examples) Your only real defense seems to be "well if the coin is any good it would easily be able to overcome this", but thats BS. Even now many argue if LTC actually has any real utility or whether it should be where it is. Would it really be where it is if someone was diff raping it at every chance possible during its early days? |
Profit-Switching Pool w/ Vardiff -> http://hashco.ws Optionally keep the alts we mine or auto-trade for BTC. In addition can be paid out in any of: 365, AC, BC, BTC, C2, CINNI, COMM, FAC, HBN, MINT, PMC, QRK, RDD, WC, XBC |
|
|
Mazakguy
Member
 Offline
Activity: 66
Merit: 10
|
|
July 15, 2013, 02:00:31 AM |
|
Just update the client and ban his pool with hard code.
Let them mine ALL day and get NO blocks.
See how easy it is. Can't belive I am the first to think of it.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Eli0t
|
|
July 15, 2013, 02:03:51 AM |
|
Just update the client and ban his pool with hard code.
Let them mine ALL day and get NO blocks.
See how easy it is. Can't belive I am the first to think of it.
thats just a cat and mouse game |
LTC: LKpJf3uk7KsHU73kxq8iFJrP1AAKN7Yni7 DGC: DKXGvEbj3Rwgrm2QQbRyNPDDZDYoq4Y44d XPM: AWV5AKfLFyoBaMjg9C77rGUBhuFxz5DGGL
|
|
|
coinstopper
Newbie
Offline
Activity: 20
Merit: 0
|
|
July 15, 2013, 02:33:23 AM |
|
Not much to weigh in here that hasn't already been said. I do agree ARG hasn't added anything technical to the crypto-currency realm, however, i do believe it has its place due to these points mainly.
1) Most, if not all of the premine has been accounted for.
2) Fair distribution from start, fast difficulty retargets mean flash mining is not or ever will be a problem (the coin will not be destroyed like CNC).
3) Very low Orphan rate, the block time DOES work given the mining circumstances it was designed for. Along with jbmiller10, I would argue no currency (including bitcoin) can take a 5000% increase in hashrate and produce 0 orphans.
The currency fits in between the faster block times of WDC and DGC and the slower of LTC, it has its place. Unfortunately it was launched at a time when the market was completely saturated, to find miners that aren't already committed elsewhere is difficult.
Flash mining of this currency was taking place before multipool, so multipool isn't to blame. I'm surprised multipool orphan rate is only 5%, epools looks to be around 30%. Not sure if there is a quick fix in this situation. The best outcome would be for multipool to only allocate a certain percentage of its hashing power over. This would reduce orphans and increase profitability for multipool, whilst not totally obliterating the currency for everyday miners. This would also reduce the time of the next retarget so multipool would have more opportunities to mine the coin as well.
|
|
|
|
|
|
erk
|
|
July 15, 2013, 03:00:52 AM
Last edit: July 15, 2013, 03:35:35 AM by erk |
|
Not much to weigh in here that hasn't already been said. I do agree ARG hasn't added anything technical to the crypto-currency realm, however, i do believe it has its place due to these points mainly.
I actually think ARG brings a lot to the table, go back and read the specs on the first page again. 32sec block rate - A nice balance.250 block diff re-target - Works out to about 2 hours when not deliberately high diff attacked! Could be a bit lower.64 million total ARG. Then increased by 1.1% annually, the rate of human population growth - brilliant idea!Block reward random from 1-5 - an interesting different approach, about 180coins per hour, BTC is 150.Mined blocks mature after 30 confirms - I like that, sick of waiting for 120+-Maximum block size increased to 10mb - future proofing-Maximum signature operations per block maximum increased to 100k - future proofing.Overall I think ARG has pretty much the best specs out there for a PoW coin, but of course you need more than just good specs to make a coin successful. |
|
|
|
|
|
flound1129
|
|
July 15, 2013, 03:19:39 AM
Last edit: July 15, 2013, 03:39:55 AM by flound1129 |
|
damn, yah got me there.
So what would happen if your multipool only switched to coins that had more hashpower than multipool itself? I'm surprised someone who has spent so much of their time on cryptocurrency, and presumably has or is making a bit of profit from it (either mining or building tech for it like you have) would be so arrogant and care so little for the negative impact they have on it (regardless of what you may think of individual coins, this one or others).
what's the impact exactly? Besides you not getting the profits you want? How about you don't list your coin on an exchange until it has a reasonable network hashrate? ooohhhhh, I think I see the problem. it is you who are after profits and care not what you destory for a quick few cents Please tell me what I'm destroying. 1) Not my coin But you are a competing pool owner who wishes his pool could mine thru those blocks in 2 hours like it could before when diff was low and keep all the coins. 2) What impact? Seriously? Have you read any of the posts from other people here?
3) Do you see the problem? Please share. Me running pools only has the same impact as you have on miners of the coin.
I see that people are pissed. That does not equal the coin is being destroyed. Imagine for a moment someone had done this in the early days of LTC. And those mining LTC on a constant basis had to consistently deal with 5000% network increases during every low diff period, then slog through the higher diff with a fraction of the hashrate. (assume LTC had a reasonable diff retarget like most new coins do now, including ARG, and wouldn't have gotten stuck at an impossible high diff, which it would have). Would it ever have gained the traction it has? Would it be at $2.50+ right now?
(note: I'm in no way trying to compare ARG to LTC in terms of merit, value, whatever. Just examples)
It's a different world now. As I said, someone with ~20-25 7970's can easily 51% your coin whenever they want to. Adapt or die. Your only real defense seems to be "well if the coin is any good it would easily be able to overcome this", but thats BS. Even now many argue if LTC actually has any real utility or whether it should be where it is. Would it really be where it is if someone was diff raping it at every chance possible during its early days?
My defense is that I am working within the parameters your coin devs have laid out in the code. If you don't like it, have them change the code. I agree that it's borderline exploitative, however, since there is no *real* commerce or any kind of important service relying on this coin (that I have been made aware of, please tell me if there is a hospital ER somewhere that is paying its heart monitor maintenance fees or something with this coin. lol.) The only real impact is that you and a handful of other suckers who have been snookered into thinking this coin is the best thing since sliced bread get less of it for your hash power. And maybe some people depositing and withdrawing it from a few shitty gambling sites have to wait an extra 15 minutes for their transactions to confirm. Meanwhile, I am raising awareness of your coin and putting it into the hands of hundreds more people who otherwise would never have heard of it, and might not dump it immediately if you give them a reason not to.To be clear: The coin is public now. You are not any more entitled to mining profits than anyone else. If you don't want my pool mining them, take the coin off exchanges, take the source private and only give it out to the people you like. |
Multipool - Always mine the most profitable coin - Scrypt, X11 or SHA-256!
|
|
|
|
flound1129
|
|
July 15, 2013, 03:29:43 AM |
|
Not much to weigh in here that hasn't already been said. I do agree ARG hasn't added anything technical to the crypto-currency realm, however, i do believe it has its place due to these points mainly.
I actually think ARG brings a lot to the table, go back and read the specs on the first page again. 32sec block rate - A nice balance.250 block diff re-target - Works out to about 2 hours when not deliberately high diff attacked! Could be a bit lower.64 million total ARG. Then increased by 1.1% annually, the rate of human population growth - brilliant idea!Block reward random from 1-5 - an interesting different approach.Mined blocks mature after 30 confirms - I like that, sick of waiting for 120+-Maximum block size increased to 10mb - future proofing-Maximum signature operations per block maximum increased to 100k - future proofing.Overall I think ARG has pretty much the best specs out there for a PoW coin, but of course you need more than just good specs to make a coin successful. Just put in a maximum difficulty adjustment like FTC did and your problems will be gone. |
Multipool - Always mine the most profitable coin - Scrypt, X11 or SHA-256!
|
|
|
coinstopper
Newbie
Offline
Activity: 20
Merit: 0
|
|
July 15, 2013, 03:44:22 AM |
|
Not much to weigh in here that hasn't already been said. I do agree ARG hasn't added anything technical to the crypto-currency realm, however, i do believe it has its place due to these points mainly.
I actually think ARG brings a lot to the table, go back and read the specs on the first page again. The best contribution so far has been the careful balance of block time and diff re-target. It is the selection of those parameters that make this coin so great. A technical change to me is one like changing mining algo or something a bit more extreme. The future proofing is nice, but can be added in later to any other coin. Some of those were suggestions taken from the bitcoin wishlist i believe. I think the random block reward was intended to solve some of the issues with flash mining going on right now, but doesn't really work. Increasing the randomness (somewhat like LKY) probably won't work either as it will all average over time through successive future flash mining periods. |
|
|
|
|
|
nearmiss
|
|
July 15, 2013, 03:59:38 AM |
|
My defense is that I am working within the parameters your coin devs have laid out in the code. If you don't like it, have them change the code. I agree that it's borderline exploitative, however, since there is no *real* commerce or any kind of important service relying on this coin (that I have been made aware of, please tell me if there is a hospital ER somewhere that is paying its heart monitor maintenance fees or something with this coin. lol.)
Perfect. At least we both agree on this aspect, which is mostly what I was trying to get at. Congrats on bringing the exploitation to a larger audience. Be proud! Good luck to you and your miners. It is what it is. |
Profit-Switching Pool w/ Vardiff -> http://hashco.ws Optionally keep the alts we mine or auto-trade for BTC. In addition can be paid out in any of: 365, AC, BC, BTC, C2, CINNI, COMM, FAC, HBN, MINT, PMC, QRK, RDD, WC, XBC |
|
|
coinstopper
Newbie
Offline
Activity: 20
Merit: 0
|
|
July 15, 2013, 04:12:30 AM |
|
Just put in a maximum difficulty adjustment like FTC did and your problems will be gone.
This might work, but with the base hash rate only at 12MH probably not. Diff will be slower to go up, but MUCH MUCH slower to go down. FTC got stuck with a very high diff and even after the fork, i remember it was still stuck for another 2-3weeks. FTC was also heavily instamined, with those stakeholders coming together to buy their way out of that hole with rewards. I don't think anyone will come to the rescue of ARG. It is a good suggestion though, which does even out some of the shock of a diff change. The final solution might need a combination of factors in the end. I think we all agree that ARG needs to exist. The real shame here is the timing of the launch to coincide with the 20 or so other coins which were released for instant profits. And yes i have sampled most. |
|
|
|
|
|
flound1129
|
|
July 15, 2013, 04:33:42 AM |
|
Just put in a maximum difficulty adjustment like FTC did and your problems will be gone.
This might work, but with the base hash rate only at 12MH probably not. Diff will be slower to go up, but MUCH MUCH slower to go down. FTC got stuck with a very high diff and even after the fork, i remember it was still stuck for another 2-3weeks. FTC was also heavily instamined, with those stakeholders coming together to buy their way out of that hole with rewards. I don't think anyone will come to the rescue of ARG. It is a good suggestion though, which does even out some of the shock of a diff change. The final solution might need a combination of factors in the end. I think we all agree that ARG needs to exist. The real shame here is the timing of the launch to coincide with the 20 or so other coins which were released for instant profits. And yes i have sampled most. If your devs want the coin to exist in the big leagues then they should use some of their premine to compensate the miners who are keeping it going. |
Multipool - Always mine the most profitable coin - Scrypt, X11 or SHA-256!
|
|
|
Mazakguy
Member
Offline
Activity: 66
Merit: 10
|
|
July 15, 2013, 04:49:31 AM |
|
flound1129 you are an ass. Maybe someone should DDoS your shitty pool into history instead  . If ya wanna be in the big leagues you should be able to stop it, right. If it was my coin I would just do a required update and make it so you never found a block no matter how much hash you had. But then I am an ass too, lol |
|
|
|
|
|
flound1129
|
|
July 15, 2013, 05:10:06 AM |
|
flound1129 you are an ass. Maybe someone should DDoS your shitty pool into history instead . If ya wanna be in the big leagues you should be able to stop it, right. I have no doubt someone will try one day. If it was my coin I would just do a required update and make it so you never found a block no matter how much hash you had.
That's not really possible, and even if it were, the time wasted doing that which would be easily circumvented would be better spent focusing on actually making the coin good. But then I am an ass too, lol
Takes one to know one. |
Multipool - Always mine the most profitable coin - Scrypt, X11 or SHA-256!
|
|
|
baritus
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 966
Merit: 1052
|
|
July 15, 2013, 12:52:25 PM |
|
The ARG part of the upcoming exchange is completed and working well. I'm continuing the development and I'll update as I get further along.
Also, if you missed other updates:
1. Bank of Argentum will be first
2. New investors have joined funding efforts
|
Digitalcoin - Sha256, Scrypt, x11 Mining - Multi-algorithm & One Click Masternodes - Founded in 2013
|
|
|
|
erk
|
|
July 16, 2013, 12:42:48 AM |
|
So it's been almost 38hours since multipool.in forced ARG into high diff. In that time just 230 blocks have been mined, where it should have been around 4,275 blocks. So that's over 4,000 blocks that everyone, including the users of multipool.in didn't get a share of. The greedy rush for a quick 250 blocks wastes 4,000 blocks. It's relatively simple arithmetic to work out how many minutes in an hour a pool with around 400MH/s could mine a coin ARG for maximum sustainable profitability, instead of rushing like a bull at a gate and ruining it for all.
The end result of course, is that multipool.in users are forced to mine high diff, energy expensive, coins with a high hash rate like LTC, FTC or even DGC for hours on end where the can't achieve the majority of the hash rate, instead of the far more profitable low diff alt coins. Quite sad really.
|
|
|
|
|
|
