Garr255/Werner - Auction shilling

[Phinnaeus Gage]

WTF, Garr! This thread has doubled in size since I posted. I was only kidding about starting a bonfire. Now I'm forced to read to catch up to see if any fuel is needed, of which none will be barn wood. Maybe all the posters are thanking you for coming forward with your apology, but I somehow doubt. Hope this episode doesn't interrupt your spring vacation.

Peace.

Now to a reading.

EDIT:

I'm pretty sure the bonfire got started with post 170 at 04:27:19 AM. Back to a reading to see how this now epic thread ends.

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[usagi]

Rampion: I'm saddened that you don't think I'm worthy of participating in the community because of one blatantly stupid mistake. I've never done anything else wrong and do not plan to ever again.

Well, as long as you've learned something from this, that's all that really matters, right? If you apply it in your life and your relationships with others you'll come out a better person.

Your running 7/0 on COGNITIVE, I don't think you have anything to worry about.

[SLok]

Are you being serious right now? You're suggesting victimizing the victim again.

Seems like the only logical thing to do. He thinks he was a victim so fine, void the sale. If he on the other hand was not a victim and is happy, well don't void it. But really can he be happy with the deal and be a victim? No, not at all.

Are you serious? Its basic logic.

Game's been over already for some time man, you can get your arm out of Garr's ass now..

[crumbs]

Then you'd be fine if MtGox refunded your fiat after you bought BTC & the price doubled, right?

With Mt. Gox I would be happy if I got anything back evar!  

But to your point, yes if I was going around saying I was a victim I would be happy to get my money back. If I was not a victim and bitching I would not want my money back.

/forgetting 'bout how gox goes/
So you would not feel scammed if you have purchased bitcoin at $50, the price went up to $100, and instead of getting your coin, you got fifty bucks?

[ThatDGuy]

Are you being serious right now? You're suggesting victimizing the victim again.

Seems like the only logical thing to do. He thinks he was a victim so fine, void the sale. If he on the other hand was not a victim and is happy, well don't void it. But really can he be happy with the deal and be a victim? No, not at all.

Are you serious? Its basic logic.

A single right now is valued by the market at far more than Starsoccer9 paid for it when he won it.

You're suggesting he be given that value back now because either Cognitive would benefit from a straight refund directly and you would benefit indirectly.

I'm in disbelief that after all of this even more shady suggestions are being made.  The suggestion to fully refund Starsoccer9 and make it look like Garr255/Cognitive/You are the "good guy" is disgusting.

[crumbs]

/forgetting 'bout how gox goes/
So you would not feel scammed if you have purchased bitcoin at $50, the price went up to $100, and instead of getting your coin, you got fifty bucks?

If I was going around the forum saying oh knowz Mt Gox "scammed" me and I am a victim then yes, it would be fair for them to give me the money back.

If I was not bitching like a baby then I would feel cheated if it was voided.

In that case, you're wellcome to invest in BTC with me.  I don't charge fees.  Bitcoin goes up?  You get your fiat back.  Down?  You get your coinz

[ThatDGuy]

Are you being serious right now? You're suggesting victimizing the victim again.

Seems like the only logical thing to do. He thinks he was a victim so fine, void the sale. If he on the other hand was not a victim and is happy, well don't void it. But really can he be happy with the deal and be a victim? No, not at all.

Are you serious? Its basic logic.

A single right now is valued by the market at far more than Starsoccer9 paid for it when he won it.

You're suggesting he be given that value back now because either Cognitive would benefit from a straight refund directly and you would benefit indirectly.

I'm in disbelief that after all of this even more shady suggestions are being made.  The suggestion to fully refund Starsoccer9 and make it look like Garr255/Cognitive/You are the "good guy" is disgusting.

Still, it is the most fair and logical thing to do eh?      We need to make the victim whole!   He is a victim and he got scammed, gota fix it!

No.  In no way is it fair.  

Starsoccer9 was victimized out of ~BTC3 due to Werner bumping up the auction falsely after Starsoccer9 already had a winning bid.

Now you are suggesting victimizing him again, to get more money for you/Cognitive/Garr255/Werner/svbeon

Starsoccer9 was already aware of it, was further made aware of it, and now the rest of us are aware of your obvious agenda.

edit: misspelled Werner's name.  Sorry fake guy!

[crumbs]

Still, it is the most fair and logical thing to do eh?      We need to make the victim whole!   He is a victim and he got "scammed", gota fix it!

I'm sure you know that money back != made whole, you used the expression first, i ain't playing backyard lawer.

[furuknap]

Rampion: I'm saddened that you don't think I'm worthy of participating in the community because of one blatantly stupid mistake. I've never done anything else wrong and do not plan to ever again.

The issue is that this statement must be taken in the context of your now revealed action. You have provably and admittedly lied and deceived and only once you got caught did you come forward. I believe what some in the community will see is that you've pleaded guilty only to the cases where you've already been caught and has massive evidence against you.

That said, I commend you for coming forward and I do believe you had the best intentions of Cognitive in mind. The result is bad, for Cognitive, for you, and for the community at large. Heck, you've shown that there may be some truth in BFLs statements and once that happens, who knows what else can blow up?

You're a young person and you'll have a lot to learn and a lot of bruises to endure. If, in fact, you grow from this, you'll be a stronger person, but realize that it will take years for you to rebuild your reputation and that is a great price to pay for being stupid. Assume that another 30% of your life so far will pass before you can start to laugh at this and see that people also do forget with time.

On a final note; I hear what you're saying about this being your only transgression. However, because this is in fact several transgressions, some may think that there may very well be other events where you've acted in what you thought would be the best interest of Cognitive but ultimately acted dishonestly. If there are such events that you wish to disclose, I believe now would be the best time to do so.

.b

[Deprived]

Are you being serious right now? You're suggesting victimizing the victim again.

Seems like the only logical thing to do. He thinks he was a victim so fine, void the sale. If he on the other hand was not a victim and is happy, well don't void it. But really can he be happy with the deal and be a victim? No, not at all.

Are you serious? Its basic logic.

A single right now is valued by the market at far more than Starsoccer9 paid for it when he won it.

You're suggesting he be given that value back now because either Cognitive would benefit from a straight refund directly and you would benefit indirectly.

I'm in disbelief that after all of this even more shady suggestions are being made.  The suggestion to fully refund Starsoccer9 and make it look like Garr255/Cognitive/You are the "good guy" is disgusting.

Still, it is the most fair and logical thing to do eh?      We need to make the victim whole!   He is a victim and he got scammed, gota fix it!

No.  In no way is it fair.  

Starsoccer9 was victimized out of ~BTC3 due to Werner bumping up the auction falsely after Starsoccer9 already had a winning bid.

Now you are suggesting victimizing him again, to get more money for you/Cognitive/Garr255/Werner/svbeon

Starsoccer9 was already aware of it, was further made aware of it, and now the rest of us are aware of your obvious agenda.

edit: misspelled Werner's name.  Sorry fake guy!

I wouldn't bother arguing the point - you're playing his game when you do so.  He's trying to take the discussion off-topic to give a reason why the thread can be locked.

He doesn't actually believe that if someone breaks one part of a contract (in this case price discovery) then rectifying that entitles them to nullify the remainder of the contract.  He's just trying to help a friend out by derailing the thread with nonsensical arguments.  Just ignore him - everyone knows he's wrong and most know that HE knows he's wrong.  If his pretend argument were true then anyone could intentionally break a contract (or reveal that they'd previously broken it) in order to cancel the whole deal.

[boonies4u]

But to your point, yes if I was going around saying I was a victim I would be happy to get my money back. If I was not a victim and bitching I would not want my money back.

So forced refunds are okay? Be sure to tell Josh and Garr that!

[nimda]

But to your point, yes if I was going around saying I was a victim I would be happy to get my money back. If I was not a victim and bitching I would not want my money back.

So forced refunds are okay? Be sure to tell Josh and Garr that!

Hahaha_oh_wow.jpg

[ThatDGuy]

I wouldn't bother arguing the point - you're playing his game when you do so.  He's trying to take the discussion off-topic to give a reason why the thread can be locked.

He doesn't actually believe that if someone breaks one part of a contract (in this case price discovery) then rectifying that entitles them to nullify the remainder of the contract.  He's just trying to help a friend out by derailing the thread with nonsensical arguments.  Just ignore him - everyone knows he's wrong and most know that HE knows he's wrong.  If his pretend argument were true then anyone could intentionally break a contract (or reveal that they'd previously broken it) in order to cancel the whole deal.

Makes sense.  Thanks.  Was not aware that Cognitive was littered with shady before all of this.

[starsoccer9]

Are you being serious right now? You're suggesting victimizing the victim again.

Seems like the only logical thing to do. He thinks he was a victim so fine, void the sale. If he on the other hand was not a victim and is happy, well don't void it. But really can he be happy with the deal and be a victim? No, not at all.

Are you serious? Its basic logic.

A single right now is valued by the market at far more than Starsoccer9 paid for it when he won it.

You're suggesting he be given that value back now because either Cognitive would benefit from a straight refund directly and you would benefit indirectly.

I'm in disbelief that after all of this even more shady suggestions are being made.  The suggestion to fully refund Starsoccer9 and make it look like Garr255/Cognitive/You are the "good guy" is disgusting.

Still, it is the most fair and logical thing to do eh?      We need to make the victim whole!   He is a victim and he got "scammed", gota fix it!

Most fair lol, first off i am a victim. Last time i check bidding up your own auction is something that should not be done, therefore I am a victim.

If you would like to refund me then fine, I would like my refund at the current market rate one is going at. I saw one for 20k on ebay and it didnt sell yet so fine send me 25k and its all yours.

[TomUnderSea]

This thread is definitely providing lots of input for my trust filter.

[crumbs]

Hahaha_oh_wow.jpg

At least some people get the joke  

No, no we got it pages ago

Garr did not say this, but it seems like a good policy     They guy clearly got "scammed" he should get his money back in full. Void the deal

You're loving this just a touch too much, goat. BFL Josh found a good apprentice in you

[twitami1]

As an outsider, and being bored at work today, I read all of this, and all of the stuff on Matthew's "bet". Now, perhaps I am missing something, but here are the points I see as relevant:

1. Did matthew actually take money form anyone? (from what I could see, he did not)

2. Reading the huge thread on his "bet", I actually found myself laughing quite a bit. How could ANYONE have actually thought that it was serious? It's like watching Reality TV and thinking it isn't all scripted.

3. Where did he "actually" scam anyone? Scamming, to me anyway, would be defined as stealing money in some way. I can't see anywhere this happened.

4. It seems like all the upset people were upset because they didn't get any free money, which they did nothing to get anyway. None "lost" any that they already had. Too me its like giving my friend saying he will put $10 on a horse for me. He ends up not going to the track, so he never bets on a horse. Did I get 10 bucks scammed?

5. Garr OUTRIGHT robbed people. In an ACTUAL auction (in my state anyway) shill bidding is FLAT-OUT illegal. Period. It's like going thru the drive thru, then the cashier adding $5.00 onto your bill and keeping it. Did she hold a gun to your head to make you buy your Doritos Tacos? No. Did she scam you? HELL YES!

6. It is VERY obvious that the apology was a last resort, no way out. "Oh look, I sent a picture of my penis to someone and I am a politician. I can just deny it was me." "Oh look, they tied the picture to my account, shit, no way out of this now." "I am deeply troubled by the penis picture. I am seeking help, and am extremely dissapointed in my own actions." Muhahahah, next time I will buy a disposable cellphone!!

7. Refusing to ban/scammer tag/etc Garr can ONLY be because of some sort of friendship/financial/dating/WOW buddies or some other relationship. I mean what grey area is there here? He scammed, plain and simple, and got caught doing it. And he didn't do it just once either. That Werner account was NOT new.

I am writing this all down though, gonna sell it as the next Netflix Original Series! "The BTC Conspiracy--A 10 part limited series, only on Netflix"

[ibminer]

Again, I sincerely regret what I have done and I apologize for doing it. The small sum of bitcoins I gained from this (until I pay the auction bidders back) was certainly not worth the tarnished reputation. Never again will I allow myself to do something so crooked.

Sincerely,
Garrett

Am I just being an ass thinking that he needs to say the exact words "I will never falsely bid on another auction using another bitcointalk.org forum account"… Seems like a very regretful apology for this situation, but the only mention of never doing it again in the future seems to happen in one line on the last paragraph… and only mentions the 'something' that he did and will never do again.

I assume, later on, since things seem to be so technical with wording around here - he could just say… "I was saying I would never allow myself to do something so crooked as getting caught bidding on my own auctions and tarnishing my reputation… what an idiot I was."… and Theymos would just have to accept it?

Maybe just one of the "smart" greedy people that do not typically get caught?

I like to think of myself as having morals and ethics... yes, I have made mistakes, as we all have. Unfortunately, real life mistakes and internet-based mistakes are different. Especially in the anonymous world of bitcoins. One persons mistakes, IRL, typically stick with that one person. One forum account's mistakes can easily be wiped with a new account and some time to build up reputation. I completely understand that EVEN if the forum 'banned' for sockpuppet accounts, people could still create multiple accounts.  But to openly say 'its ok'... that just seems to send a bad message,
EDIT: and makes it much easier and worry-free for people to start creating sockpuppet accounts.

There is a need for trust here, IMO. This type of activity causes distrust, which in my mind is enough to try and stop the activity. I personally would hope the mods are trying to create a trustworthy environment... why add the 'trust' feature and all of this other nonsense when you just turn your eye to activity like this?  The trust feature, if combined with the permitted use of sockpuppets, seems like it doesn't really do anything?  ... seems like sockpuppets can just come in and start trusting their 'master' account.

People can't trust their governments/banks/corporations/etc... which seems to be why a good chunk of people end up in bitcoins... only to find out that the bitcoin world appears to be filled with even more untrustworthy people... but not only is it filled with them, the forum mods on the largest forum that exists for bitcoins ignore shady/untrustworthy activity. Personally, this doesn't provide me with much hope.


EDIT: IMO - Having any sockpuppet account is 'crooked'

[SLok]

Are you being serious right now? You're suggesting victimizing the victim again.

Seems like the only logical thing to do. He thinks he was a victim so fine, void the sale. If he on the other hand was not a victim and is happy, well don't void it. But really can he be happy with the deal and be a victim? No, not at all.

Are you serious? Its basic logic.

Game's been over already for some time man, you can get your arm out of Garr's ass now..

Your going to basic insulting and not trying to argue with my logic shows to me that you know I am right.

Basic insulting, says the goat that calls others idiots, crying bitches, beggars??
You are way past logic, remember when you right jumped on Maged's conclusion that the screenshot was faked? Called me clueless when there was tons of evidence already that Maged was the clueless one, which I said to you?

"I think most of the people here bitching are upset at Theymos for unrelated/offtopic things." "And then some "victims" begging for coins." Speaking of basic insulting, right....

How your defending Garr now turned to attacking the auction winner, trying to get his auction win turned back?
Yeah, you are to up your elbow in Garr's "business", and a miserable person on top of that. Just like your cry buddy Garr "I'm so sorry", sorry because he got caught, he tried to damage others and lied for 2 days to get the better of it, and has no other option now to come "clean". Bleh, too late

[starsoccer9]

As an outsider, and being bored at work today, I read all of this, and all of the stuff on Matthew's "bet". Now, perhaps I am missing something, but here are the points I see as relevant:

1. Did matthew actually take money form anyone? (from what I could see, he did not)

2. Reading the huge thread on his "bet", I actually found myself laughing quite a bit. How could ANYONE have actually thought that it was serious? It's like watching Reality TV and thinking it isn't all scripted.

3. Where did he "actually" scam anyone? Scamming, to me anyway, would be defined as stealing money in some way. I can't see anywhere this happened.

4. It seems like all the upset people were upset because they didn't get any free money, which they did nothing to get anyway. None "lost" any that they already had. Too me its like giving my friend saying he will put $10 on a horse for me. He ends up not going to the track, so he never bets on a horse. Did I get 10 bucks scammed?

5. Garr OUTRIGHT robbed people. In an ACTUAL auction (in my state anyway) shill bidding is FLAT-OUT illegal. Period. It's like going thru the drive thru, then the cashier adding $5.00 onto your bill and keeping it. Did she hold a gun to your head to make you buy your Doritos Tacos? No. Did she scam you? HELL YES!

6. It is VERY obvious that the apology was a last resort, no way out. "Oh look, I sent a picture of my penis to someone and I am a politician. I can just deny it was me." "Oh look, they tied the picture to my account, shit, no way out of this now." "I am deeply troubled by the penis picture. I am seeking help, and am extremely dissapointed in my own actions." Muhahahah, next time I will buy a disposable cellphone!!

7. Refusing to ban/scammer tag/etc Garr can ONLY be because of some sort of friendship/financial/dating/WOW buddies or some other relationship. I mean what grey area is there here? He scammed, plain and simple, and got caught doing it. And he didn't do it just once either. That Werner account was NOT new.

I am writing this all down though, gonna sell it as the next Netflix Original Series! "The BTC Conspiracy--A 10 part limited series, only on Netflix"

+1 agree totally