Seeking a team to develop Bitcointalk 2.0 forums (apply within)

[Xch4ng3]

You won't be able to ban sock puppets completely. You can discourage them but rest assured if someone wants to make an anonymous account on your forum and use it as a sock puppet, it will happen. The only thing you can do as a website administrator is make sure you do everything possible by your abilities.

[Operatr]

I think the real problem here is:

People are trying to turn Bitcointalk into something it is not.

This is obvious just looking at the Altcoin board. Many calls to break it up into sub forums were denied by the admins, and rightfully so because this isn't an altcoin forum, it is a forum about Bitcoin specifically and should remain as such. Altcoins need to move out of mom and dads basement.

When Bitcoin was the only digital currency at the start, the forum made sense. There was only one coin to mine, one to trade, one to talk about. But this is not the cas e anymore, there is way too much subject matter packed in where it doesn't really belong. Each section of this is simply overgrown, and needs new places to congregate and focus on distinct subjects, or at least diversify into more general coin forums to create smaller communities. Bitcointalk is "too big to fail" and needs to break up I in no way disrespect Bitcointalk or its operators with these thoughts, but the reality seems to be everyone in the crypto scene is trying to use Bitcointalk as a waystation for everything, and is now hindered by its own weight. Time to branch out and let Bitcointalk just be about Bitcoin itself again.

Bitcointalk.org either needs to evolve itself into something more broad, or face an exodus in the form of new communities branching out.

Though ad revenue and what is done with it can be a thorny subject, the simple matter is hosting isn't free and managing a large board can take a lot of time and effort to the point of being a part time job, I don't see harm in sharing a portion of the revenue as long as bills are paid and forum needs are taken care of first from those funds. But I think a proper donation bin should be enough for the community to support the board and keep it operating without pesky ads all over the place. In the case of BFL it became a big joke for them to still be advertised here a year late with their products with no admin interdiction. The nature of ads is bad to me anyway, if a maker of a product wants attention they should get involved with the community opposed to just paying for a little space and calling it a day.

Rule wise its pretty simple to me: act like an adult and things will be fine. Fail to do that, meet Mr. Banhammer. Another way to do this is not ban, but set up a forum jail as a punishment group for misbehaving, with certain jail time for each offense. 3 strikes and gone kind of thing? Just a thought. But it does seem like here people are allowed to get away with scamming, spamming, trolling, etc entirely too much, some areas of this place are a digital cesspool.


To that, I would be willing to donate the following resources to the project:

VPS hosting package

Graphical design for logos, theme modification, etc.

I could have an SMF installation up and running in about 20 minutes and would happily do this for the community. I would digress direction of this board and setup to the OP as head admin, myself functioning as a back-end admin and forum mod mostly (I have other projects on my plate to which I wouldn't want to be the lead on this). Whatever allocation of donation funds deemed appropriate for hosting costs would be going to me

I'm here to help any way I can, let me know. And if I get banned for this, well, obviously I can go make my own  

[skilo]

Changing the domain name would be a pretty dumb move, People already know bitcointalk is the place to go to talk about bitcoins, As far as the forum software goes i think phpBB would be a nice choice, Really SMF is fine it just needs a new default skin/theme, The default blue theme looks unprofessional and tacky.

[Operatr]

Changing the domain name would be a pretty dumb move, People already know bitcointalk is the place to go to talk about bitcoins, As far as the forum software goes i think phpBB would be a nice choice, Really SMF is fine it just needs a new default skin/theme, The default blue theme looks unprofessional and tacky.

I just mentioned the above just because I already have them on tap and did some graphics already, and will just be let go when they expire otherwise, but whatever the domain choice I can provide a hosting solution for it. Though I don't think just making  a "bitcointalk2.org" would be appropriate or respectful either, another board should have a voice and feel of its own.

SMF is what the this board and the Litecoin forum are, it would make sense to make it a familiar platform. The stock templates are terrible but there are many more that are better. This is my SMF for BlockBurner as an example. Or I am sure a competent SMF themer could create something new for a few coin 

[skilo]

Changing the domain name would be a pretty dumb move, People already know bitcointalk is the place to go to talk about bitcoins, As far as the forum software goes i think phpBB would be a nice choice, Really SMF is fine it just needs a new default skin/theme, The default blue theme looks unprofessional and tacky.

I just mentioned the above just because I already have them on tap and did some graphics already, and will just be let go when they expire otherwise, but whatever the domain choice I can provide a hosting solution for it. Though I don't think just making  a "bitcointalk2.org" would be appropriate or respectful either, another board should have a voice and feel of its own.

SMF is what the this board and the Litecoin forum are, it would make sense to make it a familiar platform. The stock templates are terrible but there are many more that are better. This is my SMF for BlockBurner as an example. Or I am sure a competent SMF themer could create something new for a few coin 

Looks clean but the background should be a darker color like gray or something, The bright white hurts my eyes.

[Viceroy]

I have created a new thread specifically to discuss the forum software choice.  


Possible Platforms:  (vote here - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=246936.0)
     -Discourse
     -Xenforo
     -MyBB
     -SMF

[Operatr]

Changing the domain name would be a pretty dumb move, People already know bitcointalk is the place to go to talk about bitcoins, As far as the forum software goes i think phpBB would be a nice choice, Really SMF is fine it just needs a new default skin/theme, The default blue theme looks unprofessional and tacky.

I just mentioned the above just because I already have them on tap and did some graphics already, and will just be let go when they expire otherwise, but whatever the domain choice I can provide a hosting solution for it. Though I don't think just making  a "bitcointalk2.org" would be appropriate or respectful either, another board should have a voice and feel of its own.

SMF is what the this board and the Litecoin forum are, it would make sense to make it a familiar platform. The stock templates are terrible but there are many more that are better. This is my SMF for BlockBurner as an example. Or I am sure a competent SMF themer could create something new for a few coin 

Looks clean but the background should be a darker color like gray or something, The bright white hurts my eyes.

Seems less piercing to me compared to here even (it is actually not a full white, but very light grey), but that can be changed easily. This was based on a theme called "Minimal". I will have another example to show after tonight that was further modified.

[Viceroy]

Don't jump the gun now.  We are not ready to talk about a logo, we don't even know that we need a new website yet.  Let's just keep gathering information at this time.  The first post has been updated with all known ideas to date has it not?  What else should be added/discussed?

[Viceroy]

what if thread creation was governed?  Should just anybody be able to start a thread?

how about google integrated searches.  I contend the reason people make threads is they cannot find what they seek.

what about a follow feature where you could follow people who you agree with or people you disagree with

or a popularity feature where you could sort responses by 'most agreed with first'
what about being able to sort the responses

are these interesting?

[Inedible]

what if thread creation was governed?  Should just anybody be able to start a thread?

how about google integrated searches.  I contend the reason people make threads is they cannot find what they seek.

what about a follow feature where you could follow people who you agree with or people you disagree with

or a popularity feature where you could sort responses by 'most agreed with first'
what about being able to sort the responses

are these interesting?

That might limit discussion too much.

The most agreed with sounds like it would need a lot more thinking about like how to age a thread.

[Gordon Bleu]

Is there a forum software (like simple machines) which has a module that help to identify and remove sock puppets?

I know from my Ban evading Times, that some Sites using a Service like http://dev.maxmind.com/proxy-detection/
but they pay for 1000 Queries, to block known Tor Nodes you don^t have to be an Expert, you just have to dig deeper for Proxy's.

Maybe there are really Search Algo's for this kind of Issues, but they will cost you some Coins.

[Vod]

you can see a full list of users ip addresses

TERRIBLE idea.  You want to give hackers free reign against those users who don't bother to proxy in?

If you want to give people a tool to identify sock puppets, then hash the IP address.  The same IP address will have the same hash.

[jackjack]

you can see a full list of users ip addresses

TERRIBLE idea.  You want to give hackers free reign against those users who don't bother to proxy in?

If you want to give people a tool to identify sock puppets, then hash the IP address.  The same IP address will have the same hash.

With a complicated, non public hash algorithm, like sha256(ripemd160(endianreverse(sha512(md5(IP)))))

[Viceroy]

Satoshi's first post in these forums:

Welcome to the new Bitcoin forum!

The old forum can still be reached here:
http://bitcoin.sourceforge.net/boards/index.php

I'll repost some selected threads here and add updated answers to questions where I can.

FAQ
http://bitcoin.sourceforge.net/wiki/index.php?page=FAQ

Download
http://sourceforge.net/projects/bitcoin/files/

[Inedible]

you can see a full list of users ip addresses

TERRIBLE idea.  You want to give hackers free reign against those users who don't bother to proxy in?

If you want to give people a tool to identify sock puppets, then hash the IP address.  The same IP address will have the same hash.

With a complicated, non public hash algorithm, like sha256(ripemd160(endianreverse(sha512(md5(IP)))))

A random salt would be better - then you don't need to depend on 'secret sauce'

[zackclark70]

I ancerd the post but it was removed 

[Luckybit]

We've been losing good members for months now.  The post about a dismal level of discourse is telling.  If things do not change in these forums we will continue to lose smart contributors like Jason.  For those of you who do not know what Jason did for the community let me tell you.  He, along with Gusti and a small group of other engineers, tried to develop a public mining asic chip.  While they didn't complete their task the effort was nothing short of amazing.

When I arrived on the scene almost exactly two years ago it was a small and fun community of computer geeks.  Like half of you we came to mine bitcoin.  We were mining on deepbit and slush's pool and using the brand new cgminer, it was awesome.  People were helpful and kind and it was a community.  But things have changed.

Part of the problem comes from the traffic.  The admins claim they just do not have the time to manage all the noise.  With more than 100,000 registered members and sockpuppets their task must be daunting.  But that's why people gave them money, right?  It recently came to light that Theymos is now paying the moderators and that he is distributing the $600,000 worth of bitcoin the forums have collected from donations in addition to the $130,000 per year the forums generate by running BFL ads.

Now I'm not here to tell Theymos what to do with HIS money but I'm tired of the lack of support from he and the team and the fact that they hold more than 1/2 million dollars and are doing little to improve the forums is embarassing so I'm calling them out and starting a new forum.  


So I am calling for a group of volunteers to help design the next version of this forum, bitcointalk 2.0.

If you want to volunteer or you have an idea to improve the forums in the next iteration please post it here.  Any and all are welcome to post.  If you do not want to reveal your main avatar feel free to create a new account just to post in this thread.  With no rules here, no privacy policy, no terms of service, sock puppets are encouraged and that is, imho, half the problem.  

What would you do different if you were in charge of this forum?


(Edit: June 30) Here's the list we've come up with so far:

Brand:
 -Cryptocoin or Bitcoin only???
 -Catchy - easy to remember name

Possible Platforms:  (vote here - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=246936.0)
     -Discourse
     -Xenforo
     -MyBB
     -SMF


Mandatory Requirements:

Good Design
  - Anonymous or Transparent?
    > what form of company is the forum?
    > what country should the forum be hosted in?
  - The site should be modern
  - Better mobile platform support
     > Tapatalk?
  - Better social media support
     > Integrate with
        o - Bitmessage
        o - Facebook
        o - other?
  - Offers two factor authentication
        o - Google authenticator

Rules:
  - Defined Up Front
     > Terms of Service
     > Privacy Policy
     > Moderation Policy
        o - deleting spam posts
        o - only one account per user (sock puppet ban)
        o - bans on users that are obvious scammers
        o - qualifications for perma-ban (what constitutes a ban?)
     > Moderators
        o - volunteed vs paid
        o - how selected
        o - how removed




What should be added or removed to/from this list?

Invitation only?  

Support micropayments throughout the site for a permanent funding mechanism to replace ads with fees.

[jackjack]

you can see a full list of users ip addresses

TERRIBLE idea.  You want to give hackers free reign against those users who don't bother to proxy in?

If you want to give people a tool to identify sock puppets, then hash the IP address.  The same IP address will have the same hash.

With a complicated, non public hash algorithm, like sha256(ripemd160(endianreverse(sha512(md5(IP)))))

A random salt would be better - then you don't need to depend on 'secret sauce'

Why a secret salt would be better than a secret algo?

[davout]

Why a secret salt would be better than a secret algo?

There's this common misunderstanding that salts should be secret. (and also the common misunderstanding that salts should be used at all).
Salts protect against rainbow tables, nothing else, and they do not need to be secret to achieve this purpose, only different for each value that gets hashed.

[jackjack]

Why a secret salt would be better than a secret algo?

There's this common misunderstanding that salts should be secret. (and also the common misunderstanding that salts should be used at all).
Salts protect against rainbow tables, nothing else, and they do not need to be secret to achieve this purpose, only different for each value that gets hashed.

We're not talking about passwords but IPs here. If the salt and the algo are not secret, using a hash to make the IP unguessable is useless.