There are ONLY 6 REAL projects here on this entire board outside of the top 10??

[cryptohunter]

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2479595.0

I created this thread and yet there are no projects at ALL that meet the criteria in the OP ??

There are really only 6 real projects on this entire board that are not scams that are not in the top 10 that have real use cases?

That is totally crazy.

If true why isn't everyone investing in them then??

Surely there must be others??

Nobody can present even 1 other?

I think we should collate a list of REAL projects with REAL use cases.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2479595.0

if you want one added go there and structure your case for it to be added as others have done so other members can see why it deserves to be called a REAL project.

[1714973124]

1714973124

[1714973124]

1714973124

[1714973124]

1714973124

[1714973124]

1714973124

[949miner]

I agree with his real vision over PivX, it is one of the best projects that the market has so far.

But it is very expensive at the moment, maybe it is not even worth it to buy a few PivX right now because the price has already made more than 100% of the ICO price, and that makes it a little bit more risky.

Maybe not risky at all, but you can be in a huge loss again if bitcoin goes up again and lets this coin behind (like it happened with a lot of altcoins during this last pump)

Komodo, i have read a lot about this coin too, but i can not figure it what is the real purpose of this coin, has it been created only to give revenue to their investors or what?

[cryptohunter]

I agree with his real vision over PivX, it is one of the best projects that the market has so far.

But it is very expensive at the moment, maybe it is not even worth it to buy a few PivX right now because the price has already made more than 100% of the ICO price, and that makes it a little bit more risky.

Maybe not risky at all, but you can be in a huge loss again if bitcoin goes up again and lets this coin behind (like it happened with a lot of altcoins during this last pump)

Komodo, i have read a lot about this coin too, but i can not figure it what is the real purpose of this coin, has it been created only to give revenue to their investors or what?

Komodo and blocknet both provide atomic exchanges.

This means you can keep all your coins on your own machine and never trust an exchange again.
This is a huge piece of the missing decentralised trustless end to end arena we are trying to create.

PIvx was a POW coin not ico if i am correct. I think so anyway I bought some sold most and made lot of money but sold too soon. Does not stop it being real and useful. Although not up to the level of some of those listed.

I think there will be more than 6 so lets see what others people suggest.

[noa06]

Yoooo Hunter,

There is much more promising project who meet the criteria of your post, in my opinion :

Gamecredit : In my eyes, the most promising mobile gaming plateform outta there, huge advantages for dev/players alike to move on to it !!

Sweet team, hyperledger member, plateform out and workin, upcoming of the Esport plateform, Unitity Partners amd much more !

The Mobile gamin industry is headed to hit 64,9B in MCap in 2020 and Game is now sittin at 121+M today... If it delivers and keep growin as it did this year, im sure it could get that 1B+ market share as it is truly a great idea : )

[Crypington]

Storj has a working product, customers, data farmers, a payout system ...  it’s still being improved, but it is working. 

Wings also has a working prediction market up and running in pre-beta ... but still needs a lot more streamlining.

[cryptohunter]

Yoooo Hunter,

There is much more promising project who meet the criteria of your post, in my opinion :

Gamecredit : In my eyes, the most promising mobile gaming plateform outta there, huge advantages for dev/players alike to move on to it !!

Sweet team, hyperledger member, plateform out and workin, upcoming of the Esport plateform, Unitity Partners amd much more !

The Mobile gamin industry is headed to hit 64,9B in MCap in 2020 and Game is now sittin at 121+M today... If it delivers and keep growin as it did this year, im sure it could get that 1B+ market share as it is truly a great idea : )

Great suggestions please can you go to the poll thread listed in the OP here and structure your answers like the last guy did there so others can see why your projects are being added as REAL projects here.

thanks i am building a collection of REAL projects.

[cryptohunter]

Storj has a working product, customers, data farmers, a payout system ...  it’s still being improved, but it is working. 

Wings also has a working prediction market up and running in pre-beta ... but still needs a lot more streamlining.

Great suggestions please can you go to the poll thread listed in the OP here and structure your answers like the last guy did there so others can see why your projects are being added as REAL projects here.

thanks i am building a collection of REAL projects.

distribution is key to the answer since this is often the benchmark to test if it is a scam.

[illiki23]

Storj has a working product, customers, data farmers, a payout system ...  it’s still being improved, but it is working. 

Wings also has a working prediction market up and running in pre-beta ... but still needs a lot more streamlining.

Great suggestions please can you go to the poll thread listed in the OP here and structure your answers like the last guy did there so others can see why your projects are being added as REAL projects here.

thanks i am building a collection of REAL projects.

distribution is key to the answer since this is often the benchmark to test if it is a scam.

With the ease at which tokens can be issued I am not sure distribution by itself is a good litmus test.

I would add more requirements but afraid very few coins would be chosen.  I am thinking about only looking at open source coins. 

Still going to make a suggestion or two, just been busy and it does take quite a bit of time.  I like this sort of data collection and analysis stuff. I would love to see more spreadsheets of all new coins that people could fill in that describes different wanted features. It would also make my life easier doing a data mining project to find features which are predictive of ICO success of failure.

[cryptohunter]

Storj has a working product, customers, data farmers, a payout system ...  it’s still being improved, but it is working. 

Wings also has a working prediction market up and running in pre-beta ... but still needs a lot more streamlining.

Great suggestions please can you go to the poll thread listed in the OP here and structure your answers like the last guy did there so others can see why your projects are being added as REAL projects here.

thanks i am building a collection of REAL projects.

distribution is key to the answer since this is often the benchmark to test if it is a scam.

With the ease at which tokens can be issued I am not sure distribution by itself is a good litmus test.

I would add more requirements but afraid very few coins would be chosen.  I am thinking about only looking at open source coins. 

Still going to make a suggestion or two, just been busy and it does take quite a bit of time.  I like this sort of data collection and analysis stuff. I would love to see more spreadsheets of all new coins that people could fill in that describes different wanted features. It would also make my life easier doing a data mining project to find features which are predictive of ICO success of failure.

I agree distribution alone can not ascertain scam or no scam.
I am looking forward to your suggestions.

[asepsetiawan1990]

I agree with you. in fact there must be a solid cooperation so that all can be realized. actually people who participate in the world The project of cryptocurrency is in almost all corners of the world. It's just a matter of whether they can be invited to work together.

[AleksandrKosov]

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2479595.0

I created this thread and yet there are no projects at ALL that meet the criteria in the OP ??

There are really only 6 real projects on this entire board that are not scams that are not in the top 10 that have real use cases?

That is totally crazy.

If true why isn't everyone investing in them then??

Surely there must be others??

Nobody can present even 1 other?

I think we should collate a list of REAL projects with REAL use cases.

Tierion is a working protocol for binding data to a block chain
Wings is the current DAO platform, which has already passed several ICO
BitShares is a real decentralized exchange Bitshares DEX

[withche.07]

I can agree with other person mentioning Storj. Their product is okay. But I don't think its coins are worth investing. They mostly worth for real usage. If your question is just use, Storj is good.

[cryptohunter]

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2479595.0

I created this thread and yet there are no projects at ALL that meet the criteria in the OP ??

There are really only 6 real projects on this entire board that are not scams that are not in the top 10 that have real use cases?

That is totally crazy.

If true why isn't everyone investing in them then??

Surely there must be others??

Nobody can present even 1 other?

I think we should collate a list of REAL projects with REAL use cases.

Tierion is a working protocol for binding data to a block chain
Wings is the current DAO platform, which has already passed several ICO
BitShares is a real decentralized exchange Bitshares DEX

these sound rather interesting projects I am familiar with bitshares... could you come to this thread and lay out your case for the other 2 coins wings and tierion in the format others are doing so we can analyse and also it adds explanation for other members as to why they were added.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2479595.0

thanks if you can.

Even if you could put a bitshares one there too that would be great for other members

[Alex_nutis]

I can add to the above three more coins:
1. Steem vand Golos - working social networks with a large audience
2. KIN - a token of a real-working messenger with a multi-million audience
3. Kick - a platform for raising funds for start-ups using the popular finance method

[cryptohunter]

I can add to the above three more coins:
1. Steem vand Golos - working social networks with a large audience
2. KIN - a token of a real-working messenger with a multi-million audience
3. Kick - a platform for raising funds for start-ups using the popular finance method

Sure anyone can add any project on this thread..

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2479595.0

If you go there and detail your answers as others have to ensure they meet the criteria they can be analysed for review.

I can tell you though already steem would not pass. They captive instamined their entire minting and I have never seen a ledger for those coins and also he just hopped to another project straight after. To me it is a borderline scam already although golos uses their steems code it could have been distributed more fairly.

[VarDiff]

I can add to the above three more coins:
1. Steem vand Golos - working social networks with a large audience
2. KIN - a token of a real-working messenger with a multi-million audience
3. Kick - a platform for raising funds for start-ups using the popular finance method

Golos is a clone of Steem as I know, clone with ugly typography and full of spam.

[katlogic]

As far I can tell, current "real" projects are (roughly by date of conception).

* Bitcoin
* NXT
* Cryptonote (now Monero)
* BitShares (now Steemit)
* Ethereum
* Sia
* Iota
* Waves (reimplementation of NXT to be more ETH-like)
* Cardano
* Tezos

(i'm sure i've missed something, please tell if you know about others)

By real I consider complete and often highly innovative codebase from scratch, not just copying and bending previous stuff, nor piggybacking on existing networks (tokens).

Vast majority of alts out there is just bitcoin slightly tweaked.

Honorable mentions, as those are not satoshian BFT blockchains, but interesting nevertheless in their own right:
* Ripple
* Storj (modern seti@home for spare disk space)
* Byteball (TX DAG)
* Hyperledger ("Consensus" of non-deterministic contracts)
* Many chains like zcash or dash, though highly divergent, are still ultimately rooted in the bitcoin codebase

As for how to deal with the clones, those are not necessarily a scam, often it makes sense to just copy the base and slightly tweak it. Bitcoin had many influental forks (such as Litecoin, Peercoin or Blackcoin) and to a lesser degree NXT.

edit: added more OC implementations

[cryptohunter]

As far I can tell, current "real" projects are (roughly by date of conception).

* Bitcoin
* NXT
* Cryptonote (now Monero)
* BitShares (now Steemit)
* Ethereum
* Sia
* Iota
* Waves (reimplementation of NXT to be more ETH-like)
* Cardano
* Tezos

(i'm sure i've missed something, please tell if you know about others)

By real I consider complete and often highly innovative codebase from scratch, not just copying and bending previous stuff, nor piggybacking on existing networks (tokens).

Vast majority of alts out there is just bitcoin slightly tweaked.

Honorable mentions, as those are not satoshian BFT blockchains, but interesting nevertheless in their own right:
* Ripple
* Storj (modern seti@home for spare disk space)
* Byteball (TX DAG)
* Hyperledger ("Consensus" of non-deterministic contracts)
* Many chains like zcash or dash, though highly divergent, are still ultimately rooted in the bitcoin codebase

As for how to deal with the clones, those are not necessarily a scam, often it makes sense to just copy the base and slightly tweak it. Bitcoin had many influental forks (such as Litecoin, Peercoin or Blackcoin) and to a lesser degree NXT.

edit: added more OC implementations

quite a bunch of Excellent suggestions here. Please can you come to

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2479595.0

and structure your case for each one as the format there is required.

I ask only members do this when suggesting projects added because

1. other members can reference why each was added
2. I simply will never have the time to write a structured review for each project since many I am not familiar with in depth and the reasearch would end up being huge. where as if you are already familiar it will only take a short time for each.

thanks if you have the time.

[katlogic]

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2479595.0

I've checked that thread, and half of the poll are just clones of bitcoin (often of zcash and dash variety). Which is why I'd like to keep discussion in here to point out the merits of what is "real".

It seems that most of the board occupants are using different optics for that word, there seems to be strong preference for marketing rather than what is actually under the hood. This is fine thing to do for short term speculation (ie to ride pump and dump trends). The idea is that in the long term, altcoins ultimately compete both in terms of time-to-market and rigorous robustness (Bitcoin has both), and finally features (which the altcoins i've listed are offering).

Just like with anything else, marketing has little to say about fundamental qualities. If the product is significantly better than incubents, it will sell itself. I'd not consider the quality of marketing to make decisions to "HODL". Best thing you can do about marketing is write a bot to track amount of shilling for any given particular ticker to catch their pump campaigns early, but it's not really useful beyond that.

[cryptohunter]

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2479595.0

I've checked that thread, and half of the poll are just clones of bitcoin (often of zcash and dash variety). Which is why I'd like to keep discussion in here to point out the merits of what is "real".

It seems that most of the board occupants are using different optics for that word, there seems to be strong preference for marketing rather than what is actually under the hood. This is fine thing to do for short term speculation (ie to ride pump and dump trends). The idea is that in the long term, altcoins ultimately compete both in terms of time-to-market and rigorous robustness (Bitcoin has both), and finally features (which the altcoins i've listed are offering).

Just like with anything else, marketing has little to say about fundamental qualities. If the product is significantly better than incubents, it will sell itself. I'd not consider the quality of marketing to make decisions to "HODL". Best thing you can do about marketing is write a bot to track amount of shilling for any given particular ticker to catch their pump campaigns early, but it's not really useful beyond that.

This is an interesting response and one that is well worth exploring futher.. can you tell me why you consider

bitbay and blocknet and byteball to be clones of bitcoin? do you not consider them to offer something new or are you talking about some of the others listed there. I agree pivX is really just a combination of dash/zcoin/not sure what version of pos they use but I do not think it is taken from ppc.. but it is a real project in that it meet the criteria of the thread and does have a use case of an anon crypto even if that is already filled with a few others already. Of course I expect zcoin and zcash should be there too. That thread does not really rule out clones or at least active clones that are taking things futher as being real projects.

Are you mainly trying to find NEW technology altogether that is real NEW from scratch development?

I agree this way does bring forth some real creativity ... monero was a clone of bytecoin though wasn't it?

Are you bothered by initial distribution.

Should a trustless decentralised project start in a trustless decentralised way? or primarily do you just consider the technology behind it?

[cau]

Your thread was a good wake up call to reassess the way I am building my portfolio. I tried to put my list, that's the time I realized majority (40-50%) of my chosen coins are still in paper as a concept. (I share few coins, which you already quoted).

Time for me to have this in my checklist while short listing the coins.

[katlogic]

bitbay and blocknet and byteball to be clones of bitcoin?

Blocknet and Bitbay are, in the stringent sense, "just bitcoin base hacked a bit". The reason im averse to that is that these overwhelmingly can't transcend what bitcoin already does in any meaningful manner and you get grotesque supernode perversions like dash.

Don't throw ByteBall in that mix though. Byteball is perfectly fine and im quite fond of it (that's why its in honorable mentions), but it's not technically trustless cryptocurrency in satoshian sense. It's a web of trust DAG, semantically more related to Ripple. It's a notable difference from Iota, where each transaction carries PoW proof (you can reframe iota as bitcoin where each transaction has its own block, but you can't do that for BB).

Are you mainly trying to find NEW technology altogether that is real NEW from scratch development?

Indeed. It may seem asinine at first, but hear me out: People don't write new implementations just because they like the additional work, but because its often imperative to innovate. The only exception to the rule I've encountered is Sia, which for some odd reason is written from scratch, yet is technically very uninspiring and could work just as well as a bitcoin or some other codebase fork. The opposite is things like Ethereum - it'd be far more effort trying to bend bitcoin into that, hence why it is separate codebase from scratch.

Of course there's silver lining to the black and white thinking, and certain forks have proven innovative for one reason or another, but usually tend to be just mere extension of the original. A canonical example of this is Namecoin. It had its utility back then, and it was well engineered and everything, and it made sense to just fork bitcoin to do this. But it wasn't certainly that revolutionary, in fact, you could run the same service on bitcoin's chain, too.

Not everything is sunshine in the "from scratch" space. Tendermint and Maid come to mind as a massive clusterfuck of naivete and poor understanding, but it could be just growing pains.

edit: clarify why iota is trustless and byteball isnt

[cryptohunter]

bitbay and blocknet and byteball to be clones of bitcoin?

Blocknet and Bitbay are, in the stringent sense, "just bitcoin base hacked a bit". The reason im averse to that is that these overwhelmingly can't transcend what bitcoin already does in any meaningful manner and you get grotesque supernode perversions like dash.

Don't throw ByteBall in that mix though. Byteball is perfectly fine and im quite fond of it (that's why its in honorable mentions), but it's not technically trustless cryptocurrency in satoshian sense. It's a web of trust DAG, semantically more related to Ripple. It's a notable difference from Iota, where each transaction carries PoW proof (you can reframe iota as bitcoin where each transaction has its own block, but you can't do that for BB).

Are you mainly trying to find NEW technology altogether that is real NEW from scratch development?

Indeed. It may seem asinine at first, but hear me out: People don't write new implementations just because they like the additional work, but because its often imperative to innovate. The only exception to the rule I've encountered is Sia, which for some odd reason is written from scratch, yet is technically very uninspiring and could work just as well as a bitcoin or some other codebase fork. The opposite is things like Ethereum - it'd be far more effort trying to bend bitcoin into that, hence why it is separate codebase from scratch.

Of course there's silver lining to the black and white thinking, and certain forks have proven innovative for one reason or another, but usually tend to be just mere extension of the original. A canonical example of this is Namecoin. It had its utility back then, and it was well engineered and everything, and it made sense to just fork bitcoin to do this. But it wasn't certainly that revolutionary, in fact, you could run the same service on bitcoin's chain, too.

Not everything is sunshine in the "from scratch" space. Tendermint and Maid come to mind as a massive clusterfuck of naivete and poor understanding, but it could be just growing pains.

edit: clarify why iota is trustless and byteball isnt

Thank you for your explanation. I understand what you are getting at and yes you are correct it is different to my other thread trying to identify projects that have real development and use cases but are not essentially innovative ( creating new from scratch designs) at their core. Some (or most) are variations of already proven tech but given new overlays that add utility or make it easier to apply to certain use cases. I totally get what you say when you comment these things are not transcending what is possible with bitcoin. Although both of these projects you mention i accept like 99% of wave one alts are bitcoin hacks i do think both if completed will provide a nice trustless decentralised service for what they are aiming at and are part of a group of select REAL projects that exist with proven dev teams. I see that only the most innovative and creative new designs from the ground up are what interests you.

Have you read any of anonymints posts? regarding sia ( he posed the proof of storage idea years before anyone else i believe) i think he said sia can never work (well proof of storage not just sia) so he abandoned the idea*** if i am misrepresenting what he said then that is my fault for not understanding it... Not only him but a few top devs have said iota will eventually fail when the training wheels are taken off at some point. So these designs although they seem very interesting could be fatal.  Now of course I do not have the technical chops to know a good design from a flawed one but In time with wide usage I guess we will see if they work or not. I am not betting against either of them but it is perhaps to early to tell if they are good new designs (have enough advatages over btc to merit any down sides they may have) or just different designs to bitcoin. I mean if bitcoin did turn out to be the best design we still have after a few years then those running hacks on top of it to provide great use cases that are not immediately there with just bitcoin then they are hopefully still going to have great value.

Regarding bitbay however... although currently it runs on pos3 that code base is open to being altered. I believe DZ (bitbay dev) is in future looking at a few different possibilities. It hasn't as yet so i'm just talking dreams and talk until it has happened. I do think though he is capable of pretty much anything so when he tells me he is looking at doing it i do believe him.

There is radix coming out I think that could be of interest to you since i have heard this is a real project but as yet is only in test net. I think this will be a new design. He apparently tried dag years back but discounted it due to reasons beyond my understanding and seems a very good developer.

I hold to my belief so far though that there are very very very few Real developers here that have the chops to make something other than like you say a standard clone of what we have with straight forward bitcoin.

One point you did make which i think is valid too is that sometimes the key devs that develop something new don't always end up with the best project based on their design. I mean take monero... I am not sure exactly but are the devs that made bytecoin (was this the original) even involved with monero? I did hear that the main designer of crytponote was CZ the dev of boolberry. However a few years back he kind of abandoned it or rather just left it to start another project. He still posts here and there but not too much. Either way right now monero seems king of that code base and the others...not so much.

Anyway nice to hear what you had to say.

can i please know your opinion on xby and xrb ? these seem interesting but for a layman as myself impossible to tell if they have merit fully.

[katlogic]

Have you read any of anonymints posts? regarding sia ( he posed the proof of storage idea years before anyone else i believe) i think he said sia can never work (well proof of storage not just sia) so he abandoned the idea*** if i am misrepresenting what he said then that is my fault for not understanding it...

No, you got it right. Sia and Storj are not proof of storage, closest existing thing atm is BURST, and even that is seriously flawed, and that's just mere proof of erasure.

Not only him but a few top devs have said iota will eventually fail when the training wheels are taken off at some point.

Although a bit better theory-wise, IOTA is currently in very bad shape (mostly thanks to shoddy implementation). It relies on node trust, otherwise you could take it down with a moderate GPU mining rig. My opinion on it is basically "another maidsafe, perhaps marginally safer this time".

So these designs although they seem very interesting could be fatal.

Definitely, especially if the implementation is new, it's to be expected to be buggy for few years. Out of the bunch it was probably NXT with most famous glaring holes which were (luckily) silently patched. By extension, incidents like TheDAO bring all this to another meta level.

I am not betting against either of them but it is perhaps to early to tell if they are good new designs (have enough advatages over btc to merit any down sides they may have) or just different designs to bitcoin.

Claims to "replace" bitcoin is to be viewed with extreme suspicion. Personaly I'm looking for things branching out into spheres Bitcoin definitely cant do in its current shape.

I mean if bitcoin did turn out to be the best design we still have after a few years then those running hacks on top of it to provide great use cases that are not immediately there with just bitcoin then they are hopefully still going to have great value.

Bitcoin is arguably not the *best*, the strength of bitcoin is it's *conservative* design. Bitcoin is, for all intents and purposes, the first, most minimal (in terms of theory) and most tested implementation of trustless CC. Which bank would you prefer, one with 100 year tradition with history of prudence as well as various conservative warts from 100 year ago, or a new flashy hip startup?

Regarding bitbay however... although currently it runs on pos3 that code base is open to being altered. I believe DZ (bitbay dev) is in future looking at a few different possibilities. It hasn't as yet so i'm just talking dreams and talk until it has happened. I do think though he is capable of pretty much anything so when he tells me he is looking at doing it i do believe him.

Even the major ones like NXT, MasterCoin, BitShares all lost against counterparty and later eth. It's a risky bet to think blackhalo could fare better this time.

In terms of pure sales pitch, CLTV implementations like blocknet (or something similiar with fancy UX) are better in the near term. In the longterm, every bitcoin fork and their mom pulled CLTV from upstream, making no room for any intermediary currency for x-swaps, it would just add to the spread.

There is radix coming out I think that could be of interest to you since i have heard this is a real project but as yet is only in test net. I think this will be a new design. He apparently tried dag years back but discounted it due to reasons beyond my understanding and seems a very good developer.

eMunie sure knows how to keep hype for 3 years. Whenever this is done, there's usually good reason for there being no single line of code in years, and when something finally shows up, the results tend to be underwhelming. Though I'd love to be proven wrong.

I hold to my belief so far though that there are very very very few Real developers here that have the chops to make something other than like you say a standard clone of what we have with straight forward bitcoin.

One point you did make which i think is valid too is that sometimes the key devs that develop something new don't always end up with the best project based on their design. I mean take monero... I am not sure exactly but are the devs that made bytecoin (was this the original) even involved with monero? I did hear that the main designer of crytponote was CZ the dev of boolberry. However a few years back he kind of abandoned it or rather just left it to start another project. He still posts here and there but not too much. Either way right now monero seems king of that code base and the others...not so much.

Monero is quite unique because of its bullshit inception story, luckily it's not that common. Indeed in terms of "original", it should be probably clarified "the most accepted by the community". Given that monero was the first non-scammy fork of cryptonote at the time (though even there rumors exist that monero devs knew about the AES exploit). Whatever, it's the "original" now.

Anyway nice to hear what you had to say.

can i please know your opinion on xby and xrb ? these seem interesting but for a layman as myself impossible to tell if they have merit fully.

XBY is generic rubbish. Didn't know about raiblocks until now, looks somewhat original, albeit not really sure yet as I had only cursory look at its cowboyish consensus code.

[cryptohunter]

@katlogic

thanks for those replies. Very helpful and informative.

Damn I thought xby had something novel going for it. This is the problem with trying to invest in things you really don't understand.

Would be excellent if new popular projects (ones with some hype and reasonable following) were all given a thorough deep analysis by persons with a proven skillset in this arena. I'm surprised that a group of savvy investors have not grouped together to engage the real minds here to give deep analysis to new seemingly exciting projects. Then again perhaps they actually have already done this. Or perhaps the savvy investors are the real minds who understand all of these designs and their real chances long term.

For now the best we can try to do is at the very least compile a list of real projects that even if long term do not at a deep level break free of being "hacks of btc" but do offer some specific use cases and demonstrate the developers do have some skill set that is relevant to working on trustless decentralised projects. Whilst keep looking for that new design that brings a real leap in solving some of the things that btc struggles with whilst not throwing up a lot of new issues or risks.

[cau]

XBY is generic rubbish.

Hello Katlogic - the above statement is too generic, if you really don't mind can you please help me to understand more on the negative side of it, is your conclusion based on code review? I mean on technical side or fundamental of the project?

Positives in my view -
PoSign new consensus and every transactions need to be signed by their "static nodes".
Project is trying to build an ecosystem where anyone can build -
DApps,
X-Vault (decentralized storage)
X-change (decentralized exchange, with some incentive scheme)
SHA 512 algorithm
Few other concepts like Vitals, Pulse, DICOM and many more in their forum
10K transactions per second, nearly cannot have scalability issue
With PoSign concept said to be having attack proof (51% or Quantum)
XFuel is a proof of working PoSign and static node testing in progress

Negatives in my view -
Even to few of genuine questions, no direct answer
In other communities, usually community manager or project person speaks about project rather than coin price. In fact ceiling limit of 650K is also designed keeping in mind that there wont be inflation, so price will sky rocket.

It would be really nice, if you can help me with your findings....

[JW9494]

Rentberry... ICO starts next week, I think....
Already a successful business. They want to expand

[mullenrodney]

As far I can tell, current "real" projects are (roughly by date of conception).

* Bitcoin
* NXT
* Cryptonote (now Monero)
* BitShares (now Steemit)
* Ethereum
* Sia
* Iota
* Waves (reimplementation of NXT to be more ETH-like)
* Cardano
* Tezos

(i'm sure i've missed something, please tell if you know about others)

By real I consider complete and often highly innovative codebase from scratch, not just copying and bending previous stuff, nor piggybacking on existing networks (tokens).

Vast majority of alts out there is just bitcoin slightly tweaked.

Honorable mentions, as those are not satoshian BFT blockchains, but interesting nevertheless in their own right:
* Ripple
* Storj (modern seti@home for spare disk space)
* Byteball (TX DAG)
* Hyperledger ("Consensus" of non-deterministic contracts)
* Many chains like zcash or dash, though highly divergent, are still ultimately rooted in the bitcoin codebase

As for how to deal with the clones, those are not necessarily a scam, often it makes sense to just copy the base and slightly tweak it. Bitcoin had many influental forks (such as Litecoin, Peercoin or Blackcoin) and to a lesser degree NXT.

edit: added more OC implementations

These are great projects to mention.

Also, I would like to add some:
* Raiden (ETH scalability)
* PundiX (have a working product, terminals to pay and buy crypto, going to enter Chinese and Russian market)
* Blackmoon Crypto (connection between crypto and traditional investments)
* Wishfinance (already working credit service)
* Gladius (cybersecurity)

I believe these projects will shine in 2018

[JW9494]

Now this is the type of post that is productive and resourceful. Ill

[katlogic]

Hello Katlogic - the above statement is too generic, if you really don't mind can you please help me to understand more on the negative side of it.  is your conclusion based on code review? I mean on technical side or fundamental of the project?

It's just renamed bitmox, fork of early dash with pos added or somesuch.

Positives in my view -

All marketing rubbish none of which exists at best, and probably for the better because most of it is just pretty hilarious wordsalad.

Even to few of genuine questions, no direct answer

This might be of some help:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1742783.0
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1793468.0

Chances are high the guy is the same one and just trying to flip the coins from ico scam by pumping the pony he's got, another common trick in the book. That CCRevolution guy seems to be responsible for one of the most insane technobabble buzzwords I've seen tho, I really want to smoke the shit he's doing.

[cau]

Thanks Katlogic for your time! I have some portion of holdings and I was contemplating myself to add few more to host a node, if I understand correct you have question on their funda itself

I see, X-Fuel is out there with working PoSign and "Static Node" in testing phase, these are the two main reasons why my confidence went sky high before I come across you.... its matter of time now to see where it is heading. For now, let me put a hold neither buy nor sell

Incidentally I have high hopes on Maid as well   (These two guys, sounds great in paper and I do wish they deliver what was promised)

[FiiNALiZE]

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2479595.0

I created this thread and yet there are no projects at ALL that meet the criteria in the OP ??

There are really only 6 real projects on this entire board that are not scams that are not in the top 10 that have real use cases?

That is totally crazy.

If true why isn't everyone investing in them then??

Surely there must be others??

Nobody can present even 1 other?

I think we should collate a list of REAL projects with REAL use cases.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2479595.0

if you want one added go there and structure your case for it to be added as others have done so other members can see why it deserves to be called a REAL project.

Waves and Sys are the only coins that I can agree upon. The other coins are just well...there.

[cryptohunter]

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2479595.0

I created this thread and yet there are no projects at ALL that meet the criteria in the OP ??

There are really only 6 real projects on this entire board that are not scams that are not in the top 10 that have real use cases?

That is totally crazy.

If true why isn't everyone investing in them then??

Surely there must be others??

Nobody can present even 1 other?

I think we should collate a list of REAL projects with REAL use cases.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2479595.0

if you want one added go there and structure your case for it to be added as others have done so other members can see why it deserves to be called a REAL project.

Waves and Sys are the only coins that I can agree upon. The other coins are just well...there.

Always good to hear other peoples POV.

Can you tell me why you don't think komodo, bitbay, blocknet and pivx are not REAL projects or that you dont agree.

There are no right or wrong answers. Everyones opinion is valid.

Have you examined any of the others and if so what made you decide they were not real projects or failed to meet one or more of the criteria in the OP.

I agree sys and waves are real projects so no argument there.