Known Alts of any-one - A User Generated List Mk III (2022 Q2)

[Despairo]

2 Accounts Connected: (Note: Banned shown in red / Inactive in Blue)

1. GeorgeJohn
2. Ebede

Proof:

Re: Vacsino All media Bounty campaign || Budget $100,000 in stablecoin || 1 Month
posted by GeorgeJohn on 2021-04-01 04:56:27 UTC

#Proof Of Authentication
Forum Username: Georgejohn
Forum Profile Link: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=2817036;
Telegram Username: georgejohn
Participated Campaigns:  telegram and facebook
Facebook profile link: https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100034572642603
BSC-DAI Wallet Address: 0xEdEDbF82436ab4E5D763E628b91b6e3Ac5FB37b5

https://ninjastic.space/post/56688146

Re: Vacsino All media Bounty campaign || Budget $100,000 in stablecoin || 1 Month
posted by Ebede on 2021-04-01 04:35:32 UTC

#Proof Of Authentication
Forum Username: Georgejohn
Forum Profile Link: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=2817036;
Telegram Username: georgejohn
Participated Campaigns:  telegram and facebook
Facebook profile link: https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100034572642603
BSC-DAI Wallet Address: 0xEdEDbF82436ab4E5D763E628b91b6e3Ac5FB37b5

https://ninjastic.space/post/56688056

Miscellaneous:
If you look on their applications Ebede was send earlier before Georgejohn so the person controlled both of this accounts are hurry up when he want to drop the application of the bounties. Both of the accounts already deleted their applications, Ebede was known promoting scam casino 1xbit. Even both of the accounts doesn't cheat a bounty or signature campaign, it's worth to note he's greedy promoting scam sites with alt accounts to make a lot money.

[1714106978]

1714106978

[1714106978]

1714106978

[1714106978]

1714106978

[YOSHIE]

Accounts Connected: (Note: Banned shown in red / Inactive in Blue/Active)

1. Skhellal00
2. Sakibvai66
3. Saidur100

Proof:

#PROOF OF REGISTRATION
Forum Username: Skhellal00
BEP-20 Wallet address :
0xaAb82c5aFE52fA0E756Fd897df2B3969b589B609

https://archive.vn/wip/Lw3x0

#PROOF OF REGISTRATION
Forum Username: sakibvai66
BEP-20 wallat address : 0xaAb82c5aFE52fA0E756Fd897df2B3969b589B609

https://archive.vn/wip/jvF2U

#PROOF OF REGISTRATION
Forum Username: Skhellal00
BSC-20 Wallet address :
0xaAb82c5aFE52fA0E756Fd897df2B3969b589B609

https://archive.vn/wip/AuZim

Related Addresses:

Code:

BSC-20 Wallet address :
0xaAb82c5aFE52fA0E756Fd897df2B3969b589B609

Miscellaneous:

Three Alt accounts detected with ETH addresses, used almost all the campaigns they participate in, of the three associated alts, two of them, signed up and cheated in the campaigns below.

Campaign manager:@Hhampuz.
Bounty campaign rules are clearly written as below.


Other evidence.
@Skhellal00: Bounty report page. (157).
Topic: [ERC20] Ethernity.CLOUD Bounty | Twitter/FB/Sig/Reddit + GH Bonus | $70k 6 Weeks

@Sakibvai66: Bounty report page. (202).
Topic: [ERC20] Ethernity.CLOUD Bounty | Twitter/FB/Sig/Reddit + GH Bonus | $70k 6 Weeks

Both Alts are listed in: SPREADSHEETS

@Skhellal00: in position number:(1070). And
@Sakibvai66: in position number:(1122).


Another Alt account and engage in cheating in the same campaign as the one above.

Accounts Connected:

1. ABCD1122
2. Salman8205

Proof:

Telegram Username:@ABCD8205
ERC-20 Wallet Address: 0xBa7461e2f9328EEB88D546f3e6bEfFAD67e005AE

https://archive.vn/wip/nsckU

Telegram Username:@Riya7711
BEP-20 Wallet Address:0xBa7461e2f9328EEB88D546f3e6bEfFAD67e005AE

https://archive.vn/wip/d4feF

Related Addresses:

Code:

BEP-20 Wallet Address: 0xBa7461e2f9328EEB88D546f3e6bEfFAD67e005AE

Miscellaneous:

Evidence of their involvement in cheating in the same campaign.

@ABCD1122: Bounty report page. (.
Topic: [ERC20] Ethernity.CLOUD Bounty | Twitter/FB/Sig/Reddit + GH Bonus |

@Salman8205: Bounty report page. (9).
Topic: [ERC20] Ethernity.CLOUD Bounty | Twitter/FB/Sig/Reddit + GH Bonus |

SPREADSHEETS


Other evidence, just in case.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5335270.msg57992220#msg57992220
@ABCD1122: https://archive.vn/wip/qaoqf
@Salman8205: https://archive.vn/wip/b0k8w

[lovesmayfamilis]

2 Accounts Connected: (Note: Banned shown in red / Inactive in Blue)

1. GeorgeJohn
2. Ebede

Considering that it was an April Fool's joke, then probably Ebede also joked with GeorgeJohn's account. Although yes, it is not clear why this should be done. It looks strange.
GeorgeJohn has had a lot of enemies lately. Maybe he himself will answer why it happened?

[rozak]

Accounts Connected: (Note: Banned shown in red / Inactive in Blue/Active)

1. niloy111 (Archived)
2. Mamun74

Proof:

Facebook post link: https://www.facebook.com/shopnochoraa/posts/4195043347206149

Archived

Facebook Link: https://www.facebook.com/shopnochoraa      

Archived

Related Addresses:

Code:

https://www.facebook.com/shopnochoraa

Miscellaneous:
niloy111 account has autoban user. and both accounts join in the same bounties.

Albetrage Platform (SPREADSHEET) (twitter 187 and 292)

WEYU (SPREADSHEET) (twitter 687 and 160)

SOKU SWAP (SPREADSHEET) (twitter 198 and 396)

Apeswap.Finance (SPREADSHEET) (twitter 371 and 240)

[GeorgeJohn]

2 Accounts Connected: (Note: Banned shown in red / Inactive in Blue)

1. GeorgeJohn
2. Ebede

Considering that it was an April Fool's joke, then probably Ebede also joked with GeorgeJohn's account. Although yes, it is not clear why this should be done. It looks strange.
GeorgeJohn has had a lot of enemies lately. Maybe he himself will answer why it happened?

Thank you for understanding that some persons  developed enemies with me just like that, and they want my account to be ban, which i don't know their reason, yes of course i know the know vividly the owner of ebede account, and it's my course mate in University, the same course and the same department, and i introduced him to bitcointalk community then before we separated, the ebede normally use my system to do almost his academic work both graphics design and other works, so on that day of April fool he used my laptop to login bitcointalk community, before i could notice he has dropped a Post that contains all my information..so when i noticed i deleted it. I'm not denying the fact that i don't know the user ebede i know him in person and is a course mate. I want to know if i will be penalize because of a newbie mistake using my laptop do work. I know many some people want to kick me out from bestchange signature campaign i join.

[decodx]

I have a new report of a serial ban evader.

4 Accounts Connected: (Note: Banned shown in red / Inactive in Blue / Active profile (in ordinary link colour))

1. kulsuma
2. floraggoins
3. brejozetta
4. ariaemily

Proof:

Proof of authentication
- BSC: 0xDEeb51d9b5E195556d5db66C68E4983E79233b1B
- Email: ariaemily92@gmail.com
- Campaigns applied for: Twitter, Telegram, Facebook

Proof of authentication
- ETH wallet address: 0x6684532b5C3a46AA776497035786cA26E81425c4
- Email: ariaemily92@gmail.com
- Campaigns applied for: Twitter, Telegram, Instagram, Facebook

#Proof of Authentication
Email: ariaemily92@gmail.com
Telegram username: @cameronjohn
Which Campaign Joined : Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, Telegram

Bitcointalk username : ariaemily
Forum Rank : Copper Member
Email address : ariaemily92@gmail.com
Which campaign : Twitter, facebook  and Telegram

Reporting:

These alts have been reported by me in the "[Report] Ban Evasion [Requesting Admin/mod to check those and ban]" thread for ban evasion - Yes


Related Addresses:

Code:

Email: ariaemily92@gmail.com

Miscellaneous:

Ban evasion (using or creating accounts while one of your accounts is banned) is not allowed.

[Despairo]

Thank you for understanding that some persons  developed enemies with me just like that, and they want my account to be ban, which i don't know their reason, yes of course i know the know vividly the owner of ebede account, and it's my course mate in University, the same course and the same department, and i introduced him to bitcointalk community then before we separated, the ebede normally use my system to do almost his academic work both graphics design and other works, so on that day of April fool he used my laptop to login bitcointalk community, before i could notice he has dropped a Post that contains all my information..so when i noticed i deleted it. I'm not denying the fact that i don't know the user ebede i know him in person and is a course mate. I want to know if i will be penalize because of a newbie mistake using my laptop do work. I know many some people want to kick me out from bestchange signature campaign i join.

I don't buy your story, that just how ordinary excuse when alts got caught by someone. I thought you will said it's your brother , sister, mother, father etc.
@Ebede is not a newbie, he's 1 year old account he already should know the forum rules. You and @Ebede only had 2 months different old account, should I say you're newbie too?

@Ebede didn't got banned, why you say you will get banned? Negative trust and banned are different case. Don't ignore the fact @Ebede is your alt.

[GeorgeJohn]

Thank you for understanding that some persons  developed enemies with me just like that, and they want my account to be ban, which i don't know their reason, yes of course i know the know vividly the owner of ebede account, and it's my course mate in University, the same course and the same department, and i introduced him to bitcointalk community then before we separated, the ebede normally use my system to do almost his academic work both graphics design and other works, so on that day of April fool he used my laptop to login bitcointalk community, before i could notice he has dropped a Post that contains all my information..so when i noticed i deleted it. I'm not denying the fact that i don't know the user ebede i know him in person and is a course mate. I want to know if i will be penalize because of a newbie mistake using my laptop do work. I know many some people want to kick me out from bestchange signature campaign i join.

I don't buy your story, that just how ordinary excuse when alts got caught by someone. I thought you will said it's your brother , sister, mother, father etc.
@Ebede is not a newbie, he's 1 year old account he already should know the forum rules. You and @Ebede only had 2 months different old account, should I say you're newbie too?

@Ebede didn't got banned, why you say you will get banned? Negative trust and banned are different case. Don't ignore the fact @Ebede is your alt.

Brother, take your time and look towards the account ebede and also check my account georgejohn, you will know that ebede is a different body, i told you categorically that the user ebede is a course mate and we stays in the same hostel block C, and they always use my laptop to do almost their work my hostel mates, i have explained this before, i have many academic load and i can't control two accounts. I don't know while all these is happening this period of my exam.

[Despairo]

Challenge accepted.

1 Using Delta symbol to list an item, how can you prefer to choose Delta symbol while this forum had insert list BBcode or you could use number / alphabet list.

∆ understanding
∆ observation
∆ passion to overcome issues

∆ Through Twitter publication
∆ Through Telegram publication
∆ Through Instagram publication
∆ Through Facebook publication
∆ Through newspaper publication
∆ Through Television such as BBC's and satellite

2 Very like to create multiple unnecessary thread about forum rules, rank, quality post, motivation, guideline seeking for merit. You're a newbie why you guiding to newbie too?

The quality of our work attracts good response and also make us not to be fearful, because the first time I login my account I was unable to understand the forum because I don't know the direction to follow untill i observed these group, despite that am not too good to understand everything in the group now but believing that with time i will follow up, but the little research i made  i understand that good quality contributes for the growth of user, and also reading of work like twice before posting also create good impact of quality post.

I understand that many starters in forum their primary concerns is to ranked up without knowing the criteria of the group or forum, I think many people are once a newbie before getting to certain position, I think what should help all new members is to study the environment first before looking for uplift, understanding the rules and regulations of these honourable forum perfectly and it will enable us beginner's to create a positive solution's in future through the community.

making a quality post
 Making a quality post does not required long paragraph, it's based on how meaningful the work is, so write a post especially newbie like me, I think we have to pass through processes, which is adequate research, observation and something that are different from the work of others.
From my observation I foun that most of the topic in Bitcointalk community we discuss today has already been treated, discussed for long time. People framed or interchange the words in a modern form.

A quality post :are one of the major criteria to earn merit and well recognize to the forum, a beginners  most know  how to make a quality  post both from local  board and public  board, because  good quality  of post attracts a campaign to hire a member and to be merited.

Beginners are conscious to ranked up in the forum without proper research and observation and hardworking.

Hardworking is the activation energy of begginers to make quality post without obstruction.
A begginer most follow the full steps of the seniors like the following @suchmoon,@ loycev,@welsh, @loyce777, @ upgrade. And other members who are highly intellectual in order to propagate.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5262255.msg54797349#msg54797349

A quality post is a post that is answerable to a question, and also a post that brings a solution to a question even though it's a two lines stanza of an article that's well arranged, coordinated, constructed, understandable and also meaningful, but from my perspective some user's misunderstood what we meant by a quality post or a quality article, i have come across of some varieties of post's in the community and it trigger's me to put it in writing, i seen some user's making an ambiguous articles And taught that a large numbers of articles is granted or guarantee making of a tangible or nice post, [No]

This is what you called you and @Ebede are different body?

[lovesmayfamilis]

Challenge accepted.

You should probably move your discussion to a separate topic since this topic is no longer what it should be.
Please move the citation to another thread. Perhaps other users will join your discussion and also express their opinion.


I did not really delve into the details of the publications of these two accounts, but the fact that there is a similarity is noticeable.
Both write posts with little to no capitalization or punctuation marks. Their entire post can be merged into one sentence. I remember that I once suggested to GeorgeJohn to check his punctuation more closely. But unfortunately, he did not quite understand what I meant.
For example. The sentence is not delimited by a dot.

From my understanding I noticed that democracy is only system of government that will help for proper treatment of less privileged with manner, any Country that doesn't practice democracy system kind of government will suffer, because democracy is the only place an average individual in the country can exercise her feelings to the government and government will pay attention, so any Country that does not practice democracy system will definitely live life of difficulties. That's personal opinion.

At first I think the caution of the headlines the topic suppose to be, why you can't be rich when having crypto, instead of why you can't be rich by owning crypto, so relating to topic, Bitcoin is something that's not in control of any one but in control of of itself for regulations depending the standard of cryptocurrency marketcap, and its increments depends on the demands which no one can testify accurately when such will occur, because people buy Bitcoin when the price is low would have make a potential profit assuming them know exactly when will zoom up, so to be Rich in crypto its based on long time holding of cryptocurrency.

[Timelord2067]

You should probably move your discussion to a separate topic since this topic is no longer what it should be.
Please move the citation to another thread. Perhaps other users will join your discussion and also express their opinion.

Actually as this is my thread I'm happy for it to continue (it's not going to last much longer given the compelling evidence being put forward by everyone).  People are being civil enough, and with each denial comes fresh investigations that uncover new leads that others can follow up.

@GeorgeJohn needs to weigh up how much longer they want to be in denial Vs how many more investigators will come in and pick through their prior post history.

[hutamut]

Account connected.
Bitstar_coin and Anonylz are connected with this address: 0xa1d2d5eaa6ad3a42e21381b010572e8d91c181e8


Bitstar_coin poa post: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5347365.msg57377210#msg57377210


Anonylz poa post: deleted by him. But dont worry here is archived link: http://www.freezepage.com/1626677561VOTPQIJINF

archived link source


And I want to reopen small rabbit's this case here. He are going to be free by his excuse. I am requesting to DT members for checking: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5351159.0

[Stalker22]

Accounts Connected

Accounts Connected: (Note: Banned shown in red / Inactive in Blue/Active)

1. Jannat2020
2. Dua001
3. kiransundhu77 (Archived)
4. khanni89
5. arainsara7888 (Archived)
6. Wow001
7. gazi990 (Archived)
8. Touheedkhan78 (Archived)
9. sehar2021 (Archived)

10. bravekhanni78
11. khanm2020
12. help712 (Archived)
13. supersehar (Archived)
14. jatt733 (Archived)
15. Mrsfarroque73333 (Inactive)
16. Its Time (Inactive)
17. Mrsfarroque (Archived)


Related Addresses:

Code:

Email: urducolours@gmail.com

Proof:

~
- Email: urducolours@gmail.com

~
- Email: urducolours@gmail.com

~
- Email: urducolours@gmail.com

~
- Email:  urducolours@gmail.com

~
- Email: urducolours@gmail.com

~
submit your email address which you used to registered on www.arciris.org urducolours@gmail.com

~
submit your email address which you used to registered on www.goldario.com : urducolours@gmail.com

~
Email id; urducolours@gmail.com

~
Email Address : urducolours@gmail.com

Email id urducolours@gmail.com
~

Miscellaneous:

• Ban evasion (using or creating accounts while one of your accounts is banned) is not allowed.

[YOSHIE]

I'm no stranger to both of them, because someone already mentioned it here.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5347365.msg57495309#msg57495309

Stop changing your address, you've been caught, you are a cheater for joining the campaign and also with your alt account which is Anonylz

What the person said is true.

@lovesmayfamilis and @kro55, caught them all.

Accounts Connected: (Note: Banned shown in red / Inactive in Blue/Active)

1. Anonylz
2. Bitstar_coin
3. KaliLinux
4. Henrobakkara
5.Mulann2
6.nicecrypto

Indeed, the behavior of members who have many (Alt) accounts is like that, sometimes they often enter their own addresses into other Alt accounts, sometimes there are also those who enter the Alt profile themselves, it's because there are too many Alt managed, so it is not controlled in making the Bounty application.
Example:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5348924.msg57687233#msg57687233

#Proof of Registration
Forum Username: Bitstar_coin
Forum Account link: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=31569
Telegram Username: @Nearzer0
Participating Campaigns: Signature
Your BEP-20 Wallet Address: 0x12a5353b2040b4F5C591246dBfB319F77Fed068E

Sometimes they, after being caught they give a reason, I copy someone else's application, honestly for me personally don't want to hear that excuse, it's a lie.

That's why, if i find the same thing, the reason doesn't make sense to me, i'll ignore it.

[lovesmayfamilis]

2 Accounts Connected
Accounts Connected: (Note: Banned shown in red / Inactive in Blue)

1.Karish2return
2.Pasa32

Proof:

ERC20 Wallet Address: 0x066a9226B7b110dB56E497A960ac4b313BcA797E

[ archive ]

ERC20 wallet address : 0x066a9226B7b110dB56E497A960ac4b313BcA797E

[ archive ]

Related Addresses:

Code:

ERC20 wallet address : 0x066a9226B7b110dB56E497A960ac4b313BcA797E

Miscellaneous:

cheating bounty programs.

[Bounty] Foobee 🚀 Swipe to earn 🚀 $100k worth of tokens | 1 month Campaign
manager  @irfan_pak10
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1tws817xtWTQSKYqnfKBilLjyifHyiCeSC5rofGSmX80/edit#gid=1524026476

Active cheater from the farm discovered by @nutildah
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5335270.msg57782276#msg57782276

[decodx]

Here are my latest reports concerning ban evaders.

Accounts Connected: (Note: Banned shown in red / Inactive in Blue / Active profile (in ordinary link colour))

1. airdropfactory
2. niloy111

Proof:

Proof of authentication
- Klaytyn wallet address https://wallet.klaytn.com/create: 0x42994acbf12e8e15179df29f78d431ba4233fd3b
- Email: ami_niloy1987@yahoo.com         
- Campaigns applied for: Twitter, Facebook, Instagram, Telegram

Proof of authentication
- ETH: 0x939f4B8fBF7A3cA337AB11d4AA64CA7c4DbB9754
- Email: ami_niloy1987@yahoo.com         
- Campaigns applied for:  Twitter, Telegram, Reddit, Facebook

Related Addresses:

Code:

Email: ami_niloy1987@yahoo.com

Miscellaneous:

Ban evasion (using or creating accounts while one of your accounts is banned) is not allowed.

Accounts Connected: (Note: Banned shown in red / Inactive in Blue / Active profile (in ordinary link colour))

1. soniaxsani
2. xxpyaraxx
3. xxlafangaxx

Proof:

Proof of authentication
- ETH  compatible with NFTs(Metamask, Trust Wallet, and Coinbase): 0xB113195e5B14260074C193B78dbfB2197207f0E2
- Email: adilvrpk2011@gmail.com
- Campaigns applied for: Twitter,Facebook

Week#12: Oct 07 - Oct 13
Email address: adilvrpk2011@gmail.com
Twitter profile link: https://twitter.com/mustaqeemch6
Number of followers:  10500

twitter profile :                       https://twitter.com/mustaqeeeem
Telegram       :                      @mustaqeemch
Youtube Channel URL:             https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCrELQMGgDd_Xvj0XTSSmtFg?view_as=subscriber
Youtube Video Url     :             https://youtu.be/WD68d0y0oMI
My Steemit Blog URL :             https://steemit.com/@amirjaved
My Post URL            :            https://steemit.com/money/@amirjaved/get-free-eth-everymonth-via-boldman-capital
My Etherwallet         :           0xb403e7f88cc662E79b9b9d7474f80a26D1dDBdA7
My email                 :          adilvrpk2011@gmail.com

Related Addresses:

Code:

Email: adilvrpk2011@gmail.com

Miscellaneous:

Ban evasion (using or creating accounts while one of your accounts is banned) is not allowed.

[Stalker22]

Accounts Connected

1. Jamalmgg
2. Jamalkm74 (Inactive)
3. Jamalmg (Inactive)


Related Addresses:

Code:

Email: jamalkm73@gmail.com

Proof:

~
- Email: jamalkm73@gmail.com

~
My email: Jamalkm73@gmail.com

archive: https://ninjastic.space/post/54887782

~
submit my email address which i used to registered on www.goldario.com : Jamalkm73@gmail.com

archive: https://ninjastic.space/post/54432585

Miscellaneous:

• Jamalmg account already linked by @lovesmayfamilis here and tagged as bounty cheater.
• Merit abuse: https://bpip.org/smerit.aspx?to=Jamalmgg&from=Jamalmg

[Igebotz]

5 Accounts Connected:
Accounts Connected: (Note: Banned shown in red / Inactive in Blue)

1. wiraningsun
2. Donialex
3. Nanangsi
4. Ramosakin
5. anwarsa

Proof

Proof of Authentication:
Telegram username:@donialex453

#Proof of authentication
telegram : @donialex453

Proof of participation details as below
✏️Twitter handle: @naonakue

Twitter campaign.              
Twitter Profile URL: https:/twitter.com/naonakue        

           

Proof of participation details as below
Twitter handle: @best_crypto1

Twitter Campaign
Twitter Account: https:/twitter.com/best_crypto1

#Proof of authentication post
twiter: http://twitter.com/best_crypto1

Related Addresses

Code:

Telegram username:@donialex453
https:/twitter.com/naonakue
http://twitter.com/best_crypto1

Miscellaneous:
Ban evasion (using or creating accounts while one of your accounts is banned) is not allowed.

[Timelord2067]

Here are my latest reports concerning ban evaders.

Accounts Connected: (Note: Banned shown in red / Inactive in Blue / Active profile (in ordinary link colour))

1. airdropfactory
2. niloy111

Both UID's are now showing as banned, so that's two less accounts that have an opportunity to reap in rewards by the one scammer.

What I am wondering however is what did you do that caused the admin/mods to ban the second account so quickly?  There are many other UID's that other investigators have linked, yet they are still roaming the forum as they please.

[lovesmayfamilis]

What I am wondering however is what did you do that caused the admin/mods to ban the second account so quickly?  There are many other UID's that other investigators have linked, yet they are still roaming the forum as they please.

I can share with you my list, where all applications submitted by me are blocked the next day. Of course, this will happen if the report is executed correctly.
With all the workload, it is difficult for moderators to disassemble dozens of accounts that have connections.
Make it easier to see everything clearly.
The account that has been blocked should go first.
Further, the account or accounts with a later period of activity after the blocked account.
You don't need too much proof. One link between accounts is enough. And for every small report, apply for a ban.
I see that in this thread, moderators are not blocking. But I translated some reports into an understandable form, and they were blocked the next day.
Simplicity is always more convenient.
For anyone interested, there are examples in the Russian locale.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2613277.msg58042144#msg58042144