Get a REFUND from Yifu for Avalon chips

[kevinm]

Many of the community have invested in these chips at a time when AVALON had elevated themselves into arguably the top slot for BTC mining equipment. So far they have delivered 1 batch of chips to their "western" customer base and they were some 4 weeks overdue.

Their "No Bullshit" terms of sale have not been followed; sample/developer chips provided 4 weeks after payment of order didnt happen. Shipping of chips 9-10 weeks after payment didnt happen. They are clearly in violation of their own terms of sale and therefore must offer a full refund to those purchasers requesting such.

Whatever you have been told, their statement "No refunds" does not effect our statutory rights as consumers (under UK law and probably most other countries). I am a large shareholder in a group buy who have already requested a refund and have not received any reply. This is simply not acceptable from a company who has taken $millions of our money. Our group has realised that this 6+ week in delay and counting has effectively made the chips worthless to us.

If the majority of shareholders in group buys decide that they will be wasting more money for fabrication costs and having no chance of seeing a ROI, then perhaps, its time to demand a full REFUND from BitSyncom,  after all there are other companies which can likely deliver sooner and represent a more favourable investment.

I would urge all batch leaders to poll your group buy members and find out what THEY want, if a large number of group buy leaders request a refund, there will have to start addressing the issue. BitSyncom need to understand that they need to open up channels of communication and address this serious issue which affects hundreds if not thousands of consumers.

If this situation continues for much longer, the chips will not be worth their initial cost + development cost.
If you have any information about BitSyncom, full personal details,addresses (for legal communication), telephone numbers and e-mail addresses, Links to their personal media pages, personal future appointments at events (dates and locations), any info which will help to make contact, please post it on this thread.

Please refrain from posting 1 line, throw away comments, they probably wont help our collective cause.
Thanks for reading,

kev

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[FlappySocks]

A refund on it's own, wont fix the problem.  Some of us have paid for fabrication, and others have given up their jobs to build these devices.

I'm all for compromises too.  Yifu could just walk away from it all, and let the company fold.  That's no good for the community either.

Chips now + partial refund + 2nd gen chips at cost.

[Bitcoinorama]

A refund on it's own, wont fix the problem.  Some of us have paid for fabrication, and others have given up their jobs to build these devices.

I'm all for compromises too.  Yifu could just walk away from it all, and let the company fold.  That's no good for the community either.

Chips now + partial refund + 2nd gen chips at cost.

They won't fold they don't need your money anymore.

[superduh]

A refund on it's own, wont fix the problem.  Some of us have paid for fabrication, and others have given up their jobs to build these devices.

I'm all for compromises too.  Yifu could just walk away from it all, and let the company fold.  That's no good for the community either.

Chips now + partial refund + 2nd gen chips at cost.

i feel your pain but...... right.. like they would actually do that

[kevinm]

Yifu Guo failed to honour his own terms of sale.
A refund must be granted to those who request one.

cheers,
kev

[FlappySocks]

I'm not expecting anything, other than some very late chips.

Just saying a refund on it's own does not let Yifu off the hook. How will he be able to show his face in public again, without making amends?

[peonminer]

I'm not expecting anything, other than some very late chips.

Just saying a refund on it's own does not let Yifu off the hook. How will he be able to show his face in public again, without making amends?

One acronym for you

BFL

[nemercry]

It's not even sure that people who bought chips get anywhere near to zero loss.
That all is a big bang of shit comming torwards us and any announcement of new gen chips makes it even more worse.
The Hashrate will gain so significantly that we wouldnt be able to get our money back in 2 Years without paying any elcetricity bills.
There is a little timewindow between right now and beginning of October. Right in that time are the chips able to produce enough coins so you could be able to gain even your invest. But you will not be able because the chips wont even arriv ein 3 fucking weeks. Will then first assembled and you will just die in a fucking fire then because when you get it its 15 days left till your machine becomes totally useless.

[SebastianJu]

This question in our groupbuy was answered differently. Some would like a refund, more seem to go through, but of course this might change with every day going by.

[lemonte]

A refund on it's own, wont fix the problem.  Some of us have paid for fabrication, and others have given up their jobs to build these devices.

I'm all for compromises too.  Yifu could just walk away from it all, and let the company fold.  That's no good for the community either.

Chips now + partial refund + 2nd gen chips at cost.

Best outcome for everyone!

Assemblers dont lose money on parts/equipment
Everyone gets a good deal
People's faith in Avalon is restored!

[Xian01]

 The thing that's stopping me from asking for a refund is the collateral damage it might cause to Steamboat. I've already paid for chips and assembly and know that Steamboat has already spent money to acquire components in good faith.

 How can I ask for a refund under those circumstances, knowing that Steamboat is completely blameless for Avalon not following through ?

 It's not an easily rectifiable situation.

[Coco888]

I think we might sue Yifu in U.S.A.
Yifu the Ass is an America, right?


The loss of chip buyers can be calculated by the PPS model. Someone please start a group lawsuit, and we can argue that Yifu should pay the loss based on PPS.

[PuertoLibre]

The thing that's stopping me from asking for a refund is the collateral damage it might cause to Steamboat. I've already paid for chips and assembly and know that Steamboat has already spent money to acquire components in good faith.

 How can I ask for a refund under those circumstances, knowing that Steamboat is completely blameless for Avalon not following through ?

 It's not an easily rectifiable situation.

Thats true, but at the same time you risk a default if steamboat actually does offer anyone a refund.

[Bicknellski]

In all deference to the builders out there the idea here is pretty simple. We need to hold these companies accountable for late delivery or in this case NON-DELIVERY. It makes the most sense at this point to get full refunds for those who ask for it as there is little or no direct communication and or tracking information available to the people who have purchased the chips.

If things are not delivered then they should be refunded full stop at this point there is nothing in what Avalon is posting that indicates where our orders are and when they even expect to be delivered. Sorry but at this juncture it is time to demand refunds. Failing a refund the community needs to hold Avalon accountable and I would suggest that we enforce a boycott on Avalon products and band together to spread that message across the whole community. There are certainly companies that deliver their products on time and as promised all we are asking is that Avalon lives up to the NO BULLSHIT policy. They didn't deliver on time, they didn't deliver the development chips on time and they have not provided any useful information to those operating the group buys, the ultimate customers, so we need to push back this is the right time. Their future sales hang in the balance here and if we have to shut them down by refusing to buy anything they produce then so be it.

Legal options are available but Avalon need to rectify the failure to deliver with a refund. They gave refunds to Batch 3 buyers the chips are no different. They are late they need to be refunded if we ask and I dare say many are asking. This is not the time to simply wait and give Avalon the benefit of the doubt. Lack of delivery means that they have a legal obligation to refund their customers. There is no escaping that given the promises they made regardless of them taking down the terms and conditions they posted. Refunds or Boycotts coupled with Lawsuits that is the pattern we need to pursue.

[eve]

The thing that's stopping me from asking for a refund is the collateral damage it might cause to Steamboat. I've already paid for chips and assembly and know that Steamboat has already spent money to acquire components in good faith.

 How can I ask for a refund under those circumstances, knowing that Steamboat is completely blameless for Avalon not following through ?

 It's not an easily rectifiable situation.

Thats true, but at the same time you risk a default if steamboat actually does offer anyone a refund.

In the first place you were being deceived by the sweat talk of the Avalon chips by these promoters, they talk you into this group buy.

[Bicknellski]

Demand Refunds and Boycott Avalon:

https://sites.google.com/site/boycotavalon/

[dddbtc]

I bought hundreds of gigahash worth of avalon chips.  If they conform to approximately to the most recent time-frame statements, I would not be too dissatisfied TBH.

We don't need to stir the pot.  Boycotts are one thing and perfectly okay, but if we sue Bitsyn our BTC will pay for his lawyers for a long drawn out trial. I'll bet all my bitcoins that lawsuit = terribly delayed chips

KEEP CALM
AND
CARRY ON

People will buy your preorder slots at more than what you paid at the moment. If you are dissatisfied, sell your chip orders.

[narayan]

Only buy from manufacturers that sell stock on hand. Like ASICMINER.

[Bicknellski]

Sorry.

We need to stir the pot VIGOROUSLY.

He has failed to deliver as promised. He has failed to notify us properly as to the state of the chips and where there are and when EXACTLY they will ship.

Refund and Boycott. Best option right now.

The time in Bitcoin to sit passively back and wait for 2 more weeks and alike is gone.

BOLDING things in red and making large print doesn't mean you are right. In fact it really goes to the weakness of that position. Unfortunately most of us do not have the luxury of waiting any longer without properly being consulted on our orders.

No, let us be clear it is time for REFUNDS and BOYCOTTS of Avalon and their products. Here is calling on the community to stop these sorts of business before they can grow and get establish on our dime. We need to set the tone, we will not be sitting back and taking this sort of treatment and we call on Avalon to fix it now not make promises. There is a lot of power in our hands to ruin their business just as the have ruined a lot of our communities businesses with Non-Delivery. Let us use that power and put companies like this on our collective SHIT LIST and make sure they compensate everyone.

If we are not sufficiently compensated then we can discuss legal actions. In fact it would be good if the group buy leaders polled their groups about this and then we all work together to get representation and move a collective legal proceeding forward as soon as they FAIL to compensate anyone who asks for a refund. They are in breach of the agreement and they need to be held accountable do not let them placate you with after the fact promises. It is far too late for that they need to resolve the issue today not next Friday or 2 weeks later. It is time to get a refund and to boycott them until we do.

[dddbtc]

Sorry.

We need to stir the pot VIGOROUSLY.

He has failed to deliver as promised. He has failed to notify us properly as to the state of the chips and where there are and when EXACTLY they will ship.

Refund and Boycott. Best option right now.

The time in Bitcoin to sit passively back and wait for 2 more weeks and alike is gone.

BOLDING things in red and making large print doesn't mean you are right. In fact it really goes to the weakness of that position. Unfortunately most of us do not have the luxury of waiting any longer without properly being consulted on our orders.

No, let us be clear it is time for REFUNDS and BOYCOTTS of Avalon and their products. Here is calling on the community to stop these sorts of business before and set the tone we will not be sitting back and taking this sort of treatment. There is a lot of power in our hands to ruin their business just as the have ruined a lot of our communities businesses with Non-Delivery.

While I'm not defending Avalon's business system or customer support tactics at all.  I'm saying all the "OMG AVALON IS A SCAM" threads are mostly just pissed off users venting and/or fear mongering.

Clearly if people will pay a 10-15 percent mark up on avalon chips from some of the later orders there is still faith behind BitSyn.

Yifu gave us a time frame hopefully after scrambling to keep up with preorders and maybe giving chips to CN buyers.  But give it some time.  I hope to God they're not lying about having multiple ways/places to produce chips.