[CLOSED-refunds process]Avalon - Chips group buy order time frame and deliveries

[paul3]

I don't know can we/you manage to link all the orders with payments since there was no obligation for group buyers to buy from wallet address they used to collect funds, and some also used escrow?
SebastianJu' batch #2 was paid, and order status was changed to "chips ordered" as per Sebastian's OP, but I will let him know about this so we can "hear" what he "says" about it.
I have to clarify that I have full confident in Sebastian and I appreciate all the effort he did to justify his role as group buy leader, so if anything wrong happened I would see it as mistake and nothing more.

Oh, I think you understand me wrong, there is the payment for batch #2 -> https://blockchain.info/de/address/1ECoeDfK79CNm1Mzx6NMMkZrHVocwNg6Sp - it just doesn't show up on the "big" avalon payment address. There is a big gap on this addresse between 2013-05-11 14:57:58 and 2013-05-22 02:17:07. Seems there are actually more orders than the 97 batches on 1FGAftzSTztFSB8LMwsrdCKTyqGY6zr3sU.

[1714191441]

1714191441

[tiros]

I don't know can we/you manage to link all the orders with payments since there was no obligation for group buyers to buy from wallet address they used to collect funds, and some also used escrow?
SebastianJu' batch #2 was paid, and order status was changed to "chips ordered" as per Sebastian's OP, but I will let him know about this so we can "hear" what he "says" about it.
I have to clarify that I have full confident in Sebastian and I appreciate all the effort he did to justify his role as group buy leader, so if anything wrong happened I would see it as mistake and nothing more.

Oh, I think you understand me wrong, there is the payment for batch #2 -> https://blockchain.info/de/address/1ECoeDfK79CNm1Mzx6NMMkZrHVocwNg6Sp - it just doesn't show up on the "big" avalon payment address. There is a big gap on this addresse between 2013-05-11 14:57:58 and 2013-05-22 02:17:07. Seems there are actually more orders than the 97 batches on 1FGAftzSTztFSB8LMwsrdCKTyqGY6zr3sU.

my bad then , anyways I sent PM to Sebastian so he will probably reply later.

[tiros]

I think the main group buy organizers should band together and contact the FBI regarding this $10M scam. At this point it is clear that Yifu sold chips to the highest bidder destroying any future ROI for customers on chips he may or may not deliver. This is a larger scam than pirate and the government developed a case and took him down.

Engaging the government on illegal actions such as this only helps strengthen and legitimize Bitcoin.

Most people I know are into Bitcoin because it is a currency that the bankers can not debase and reward just themselves. That is a legitimate goal. We don't want to see Bitcoin turn into a den of thieves that only transfers abuse from bankers to guys like Yifu and pirate.

Maybe we also send ....



...... ?

To clarify, being late can't be seen as a scam .... it's common knowledge.

[tiros]

Ok, now something completely off topic.

Eight Signs to Help You Detect Whether Someone is Lying to You!
http://socyberty.com/psychology/eight-signs-to-help-you-detect-whether-someone-is-lying-to-you/

[rocks]

To clarify, being late can't be seen as a scam .... it's common knowledge.

But this is not being late, that is the issue.

What is common knowledge is taking product that was paid for, manufactured for and allocated to a specific set of customers, and reselling that product to another 2nd customer for a higher price, is illegal and fraudulent.

In this situation the group buy payments (millions of dollars) were used to secure manufacture of product from TSMC, Yifu then turned around and resold that paid for product to a higher bidder. That is plainly illegal.

Even if Yifu then takes this higher bidder funds to purchase another round of TSMC chips and deliver those, it is still illegal. Doubly so since the time value of the product has been destroyed. Yifu promised a time schedule and purposefully broke that to profit himself with zero compensation to customers.

So the statement that it's common knowledge that being late is OK, is both wrong and absurd in this case.

[SebastianJu]

Where are those 135 boxes of chips we saw?

STOP saying this. There were 24 boxes of chips, NOT 135.  The tracking number was for the entire shipment which included other items. The boxes were clearly labeled as 1/24, etc.   It was still 24 boxes of chips, but not nearly as many as people think it was.

What were these other items?

[SebastianJu]

Thanks for the work tiros. I made a spreadsheet out of your data in combination with the avalon payment address (1FGAftzSTztFSB8LMwsrdCKTyqGY6zr3sU).

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AiLYkKIHJaIsdHpIaGdUOWRYVUdncTNpNlVKbVhCbEE&usp=sharing

Info about the data in the spreadsheet:

Order: There are some payments that don't have the hole payment amount in one transaction, these have the same Order "ID". For example order 4 -> Payment 1: 700.6, Payment 2: 55, Payment 1: 26.5.

In total there are 54 orders, containing 97 * 10.000 Chips.

Group Buy Date didn't match payment date
1. There is no payment for SebastianJu Batch #2 on:

Code:

2013-05-18: Batch 2 ordered - Expected date of arrival (10 weeks) - 2013-07-27 ---> - 23 days

I added it to an order made on 2013-05-22. Anyway the bitcoins are still here 1ECoeDfK79CNm1Mzx6NMMkZrHVocwNg6Sp not transfered to the bitcoin address with 75k Bitcoins.

2. There are some group buys you have listed that don't show up on this bitcoin address. I added this group buys on the end of the table.

What do you think is this spreadsheet usefull? Are there any infos on other delivered batches?

Its correct, 4 of our batch payments went to the collecting address but one payment is still lying at the address i had to pay to at bitinstant, so its a bitinstant controlled address. I wonder why Yifu lets lying around so much bitcoins at a website since everybody knows how often it happens that a website goes scammy or dies or whatever. I dont feel very good when i know my bitcoins out at another website.

[acidu]

thank you for your effort to bring up all that we need in one place

thx again

[tiros]

To clarify, being late can't be seen as a scam .... it's common knowledge.

But this is not being late, that is the issue.

What is common knowledge is taking product that was paid for, manufactured for and allocated to a specific set of customers, and reselling that product to another 2nd customer for a higher price, is illegal and fraudulent.

In this situation the group buy payments (millions of dollars) were used to secure manufacture of product from TSMC, Yifu then turned around and resold that paid for product to a higher bidder. That is plainly illegal.

Even if Yifu then takes this higher bidder funds to purchase another round of TSMC chips and deliver those, it is still illegal. Doubly so since the time value of the product has been destroyed. Yifu promised a time schedule and purposefully broke that to profit himself with zero compensation to customers.

So the statement that it's common knowledge that being late is OK, is both wrong and absurd in this case.

Can you prove your saying about selling to higher bidder? People and companies are being late all the time.

thank you for your effort to bring up all that we need in one place

thx again

no problem

[tiros]

Thanks for the work tiros. I made a spreadsheet out of your data in combination with the avalon payment address (1FGAftzSTztFSB8LMwsrdCKTyqGY6zr3sU).

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AiLYkKIHJaIsdHpIaGdUOWRYVUdncTNpNlVKbVhCbEE&usp=sharing

Info about the data in the spreadsheet:

Order: There are some payments that don't have the hole payment amount in one transaction, these have the same Order "ID". For example order 4 -> Payment 1: 700.6, Payment 2: 55, Payment 1: 26.5.

In total there are 54 orders, containing 97 * 10.000 Chips.

Group Buy Date didn't match payment date
1. There is no payment for SebastianJu Batch #2 on:

Code:

2013-05-18: Batch 2 ordered - Expected date of arrival (10 weeks) - 2013-07-27 ---> - 23 days

I added it to an order made on 2013-05-22. Anyway the bitcoins are still here 1ECoeDfK79CNm1Mzx6NMMkZrHVocwNg6Sp not transfered to the bitcoin address with 75k Bitcoins.

2. There are some group buys you have listed that don't show up on this bitcoin address. I added this group buys on the end of the table.

What do you think is this spreadsheet usefull? Are there any infos on other delivered batches?

Its correct, 4 of our batch payments went to the collecting address but one payment is still lying at the address i had to pay to at bitinstant, so its a bitinstant controlled address. I wonder why Yifu lets lying around so much bitcoins at a website since everybody knows how often it happens that a website goes scammy or dies or whatever. I dont feel very good when i know my bitcoins out at another website.

Only great master of Y(oda)ifu can answer that one, I guess.

[tiros]

AVALON & Yifu

[tiros]

List updated and some minor mistakes corrected.

[Vbs]

You can add these two from ActiveMining: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=158806.msg2370446#msg2370446

28th May
https://blockchain.info/tx/1ba8f144d6dcc4c07dc89b8a4a4112e2d83e619f26f9f7426c65c09c1d8a90c7

1st June
https://blockchain.info/tx/51c441dd02c7743800e17c8cdc53c3af26a543da9cf2e989754950b7251ef907

[tiros]

You can add these two from ActiveMining: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=158806.msg2370446#msg2370446

28th May
https://blockchain.info/tx/1ba8f144d6dcc4c07dc89b8a4a4112e2d83e619f26f9f7426c65c09c1d8a90c7

1st June
https://blockchain.info/tx/51c441dd02c7743800e17c8cdc53c3af26a543da9cf2e989754950b7251ef907

Thanks it is added.

[dexX7]

Really really nice work!

Where are those 135 boxes of chips we saw?
http://thegenesisblock.com/latest-shipment-of-avalon-asics-could-increase-network-hashrate-by-500/

Actually TGB was sloppy and confused about the difference between a "Master Air Way Bill" and a "House Air Way Bill". One is the identifier for the whole delivery of the shipping company, the other one for each individual recipient. Both are visible on the parcels and they are labeled with n/24. The conclusion is obvious, I guess.

My estimate was 187200 chips and guaranteed less than 374400 chips. Order #3 with 200000 chips maybe?

[tiros]

Really really nice work!

Where are those 135 boxes of chips we saw?
http://thegenesisblock.com/latest-shipment-of-avalon-asics-could-increase-network-hashrate-by-500/

Actually TGB was sloppy and confused about the difference between a "Master Air Way Bill" and a "House Air Way Bill". One is the identifier for the whole delivery of the shipping company, the other one for each individual recipient. Both are visible on the parcels and they are labeled with n/24. The conclusion is obvious, I guess.

My estimate was 187200 chips and guaranteed less than 374400 chips. Order #3 with 200000 chips maybe?

Thank you
To be honest I didn't go in details checking the number. Maybe good way to find out is to know weight of one package alone?
I go by this logic; If they made a mistake and wrote 135 boxes how possible is to make two mistakes and write 853 kg for weight of shipment?
So it is 6.31kg per package if there was 135 boxes or 35.54kg per package if there was 24 boxes.
I believe Zefir can confirm what is the truth by letting us know what was the weight of package or what is the weight of one chip.
I am aware not only chips adds to package weight of course, but we can conclude pretty accurate was there 135 or 24 boxes.

Edit:update from zefir by PM

I'd say the first is true - definitively below 8kg. I put one of the smaller packages on our kitchen scales: 3368 chips are 2.15 kg, so 6.5 for 10k chips is quite accurate.

So it looks like impossible to have two mistakes in one tracking form from shipping/forwarding company and based on weight we can conclude there was 135 boxes after all.

[Xialla]

FYI/A

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=177827.msg2994052#msg2994052

[tiros]

FYI/A

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=177827.msg2994052#msg2994052

Thanks! That was fast I'll admit.
Only few days passed since zefir received shipping confirmation.

[Bitcoinorama]

FYI/A

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=177827.msg2994052#msg2994052

Thanks! That was fast I'll admit.
Only few days passed since zefir received shipping confirmation.

Gridchip June;



Zephir Aug;

[tiros]

Thanks Bitcoinorama