ATTN: MtGox

[Maged]

So about these bots........ can you do something about them?

Have you lodged this with Gox, or just here on the forum? 

Either way, MagicalTux has now seen it. By his non-response, I suspect that nothing will be done.

[jed]

GeniuSxBoY: Why do you care if a bot adds and removes orders? How does it effect you at all?

[GeniuSxBoY]

How does it affect me???!!! What an absurd question.


Bots are simply an unfair advantage over humans.

Bots have a distinct advantage over humans in trading.  Mainly speed and the lack of human error and time.
Humans are simply not fast enough to type in an order before the market changes.


I'd have a lot more time on my hands if I had the time and resources and the knowledge to build and host a bot with a working trading algorithm.

I could walk away from the computer and make money. But then again, it wouldn't be fair to other people who are less fortunate.

[jed]

Heh ok. I think you give these bots way too much credit.
And what about all the human traders that are better than you should they have to pay extra fees?

[Tasty Champa]

GeniuSxBoY: Why do you care if a bot adds and removes orders? How does it effect you at all?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaslighting

[Tasty Champa]

mtgox's subreddit may be a good place for this.

[GeniuSxBoY]

I doubt that someone would keep their bot running for two weeks if they are losing money with it.

[Ridi]

Heh ok. I think you give these bots way too much credit.
And what about all the human traders that are better than you should they have to pay extra fees?

In case you haven't noticed, there are increasing amounts of complaints about Mt.Gox's website being inaccessible during the prime buying moments.  Bots are affecting MtGox's viability as a trading forum and also making their charts inaccurate representations of the market.

[repentance]

Heh ok. I think you give these bots way too much credit.
And what about all the human traders that are better than you should they have to pay extra fees?

In case you haven't noticed, there are increasing amounts of complaints about Mt.Gox's website being inaccessible during the prime buying moments.  Bots are affecting MtGox's viability as a trading forum and also making their charts inaccurate representations of the market.

It's not just bots placing fake orders which distorts the market depth.  The other day someone complained that a buy order they'd placed at 7.00 almost executed because they had trouble logging on quickly to remove it when the price was in freefall. 

[GeniuSxBoY]

Heh ok. I think you give these bots way too much credit.
And what about all the human traders that are better than you should they have to pay extra fees?

In case you haven't noticed, there are increasing amounts of complaints about Mt.Gox's website being inaccessible during the prime buying moments.  Bots are affecting MtGox's viability as a trading forum and also making their charts inaccurate representations of the market.

It's not just bots placing fake orders which distorts the market depth.  The other day someone complained that a buy order they'd placed at 7.00 almost executed because they had trouble logging on quickly to remove it when the price was in freefall. 

There's a huge difference. HUGE. Use your head!!! PLEASE use your head.

[Ridi]

Heh ok. I think you give these bots way too much credit.
And what about all the human traders that are better than you should they have to pay extra fees?

In case you haven't noticed, there are increasing amounts of complaints about Mt.Gox's website being inaccessible during the prime buying moments.  Bots are affecting MtGox's viability as a trading forum and also making their charts inaccurate representations of the market.

It's not just bots placing fake orders which distorts the market depth.  The other day someone complained that a buy order they'd placed at 7.00 almost executed because they had trouble logging on quickly to remove it when the price was in freefall. 

Rather than just call you an idiot, I'll just admit, I have no frickin clue how this equates to using bots to overwhelm the system.  Is placing an fake order capable of forcing people out of the market in a way I haven't heard of before? 

Even with fake orders on the market, legitimate buyers and sellers should be able to buy and sell their real offers.  Bots, on the other hand, maintain a monopoly on market manipulation by forcing all others off MtGox.  Furthermore, it prevents assholes, like the one you mentioned, from realizing that if they post a fake bid/ask to manipulate the market and it gets filled, then they have no one to blame but themselves.

[bitclown]

Bots have a distinct advantage over humans in trading.  Mainly speed and the lack of human error and time.
Humans are simply not fast enough to type in an order before the market changes.

Humans with their slow reactions and irrational feelings sounds like a much bigger problem for the market than fast and precise bots.

[GeniuSxBoY]

Bots have a distinct advantage over humans in trading.  Mainly speed and the lack of human error and time.
Humans are simply not fast enough to type in an order before the market changes.

Humans with their slow reactions and irrational feelings sounds like a much bigger problem for the market than fast and precise bots.

[Ridi]

Bots have a distinct advantage over humans in trading.  Mainly speed and the lack of human error and time.
Humans are simply not fast enough to type in an order before the market changes.

Humans with their slow reactions and irrational feelings sounds like a much bigger problem for the market than fast and precise bots.

I have no problem with bots as a means to do legitimate business.  Technology is not a bane to the bitcoin community. The clear issue is that either bot technology is being used intentionally maliciously (and in this case, where the bot user is most likely aware of the problems he's causing by now, it can't be ruled out,) or irresponsibly (this is clearly doing damage to the bitcoin market.)

The greater issue I have is that MtGox has several means to handle this issue at their disposal. Either impose the posting costs mentioned in other threads, or increase their capacity for traffic density.  Their is not a blameless party between MtGox and the botter.  In fact I have not ruled out Mt.Gox as the botter, as they may be trying to protect their profit margins.

Edit- Another possibility came to mind, from another thread I posted in

The other, on a lighter note, is that they are still working on security upgrades from the incident earlier this year, and have decided to include some way of staying the botters effect on the system.  In any case where they are intending to effect the botters they may not be willing to announce it till they can implement it, as it could cause the botters to escalate their activity drastically to maximize their abuse before the problem is handled.

[kjj]

Can you just shut the fuck up already?

They created the exchange, they own it, they operate it, they get to make the decisions for it, not you.  If you don't like that, you can go make your own exchange and set whatever policies you want for it.  If you are right that bots are bad, people will flock to your botless exchange.

[evolve]

[Ridi]

Can you just shut the fuck up already?

They created the exchange, they own it, they operate it, they get to make the decisions for it, not you.  If you don't like that, you can go make your own exchange and set whatever policies you want for it.  If you are right that bots are bad, people will flock to your botless exchange.

Somebody that advocates minding their own business to that point of absurdity should probably take their own advice.

Since Magical Tux usually appears to be very active in responding to feedback, I don't see why you are so hostile to everyone.  Aside from his mysterious silence, which is hardly telling of MtGox's position, there is no reason to believe that they have reached any decision regarding this matter. (Though I will continue to speculate on the possibilities.  I find the situation interesting.)

As for making my own exchange, and then expecting people to flock to it, hardly indicates that I should shut up.  In fact, such an action would require increased advocacy for my system's strengths compared to the competition.  I think you in particular would find me quite a bit more annoying in my increased presence on this forum. 

Luckily for you I already prescribe to another trading service. For the time being I have faith in them and you can rest assured that I entertain no such notion of creating an online trading service in the near future. 

[kjj]

...

I guess I should have made it clear that I was talking to the tool that started the thread and thinks that his opinion should be binding on everyone else, not whichever random person posted just before me.

[Ridi]

Criticisms about GxB's approach aside, I think my point still applies.  As I support the two views which you criticized. (Aggressive, involved feedback, and restricting bot abuse viability)

[Tasty Champa]

Bitcoin is terminal running along this direction.
No serious investor would get caught in this scheme.