[ANN][XCP] Counterparty - Pioneering Peer-to-Peer Finance - Official Thread

[qtgwith]

Agree!!!:

More people burn now means less chance to get more than 10x return like Mastercoin in short time.

Those kind of return (10x -> 1000x) requires that people highly suspect it in the beginning and then later found it real and useful. The extreme case is Nxt. Almost no one trusted it in the IPO stage (they got 21 BTC only), and then when the client came out and it worked, the price shot up because the demand suddenly increases but most chips are controlled in the hand of a few people and it's quite easy for they to hold and see the price up to the sky.

For XCP, 1) people are already quite familiar with the idea due to MSC; 2) the 'Prove by Burn' removes the trust issue; 3) the client is working and we can see the source code, so you can see that there're already 1200 BTC burnt in less than half a month. The situation, however, is almost the same after the IPO. Most of people want to buy will burn now anyway. For the demand from those new comers, the supply (from those want quick profit of 30-40%) will be enough to keep the low price.

Therefore, no reason to expect the price could rise significantly without any big news (e.g. a beautiful and user friendly client; a famous asset such as AM moves in; or a lot of bets like those in bitbet are available).

In other words, the new burner is giving money to the earlier burner!!! The new burner from now may become loss!!!

[superresistant]

Agree!!!:
More people burn now means less chance to get more than 10x return like Mastercoin in short time.
Those kind of return (10x -> 1000x) requires that people highly suspect it in the beginning and then later found it real and useful. The extreme case is Nxt. Almost no one trusted it in the IPO stage (they got 21 BTC only), and then when the client came out and it worked, the price shot up because the demand suddenly increases but most chips are controlled in the hand of a few people and it's quite easy for they to hold and see the price up to the sky.
For XCP, 1) people are already quite familiar with the idea due to MSC; 2) the 'Prove by Burn' removes the trust issue; 3) the client is working and we can see the source code, so you can see that there're already 1200 BTC burnt in less than half a month. The situation, however, is almost the same after the IPO. Most of people want to buy will burn now anyway. For the demand from those new comers, the supply (from those want quick profit of 30-40%) will be enough to keep the low price.
Therefore, no reason to expect the price could rise significantly without any big news (e.g. a beautiful and user friendly client; a famous asset such as AM moves in; or a lot of bets like those in bitbet are available).

There is already 60 times more Bitcoins invested in XCP than there was in Nxt. Considering that most people invest to make a quick profit : this is not gonna work !
The profit from the people that invested early in Nxt was about 50 times (like me). We may have 100 times more BTC invested in XCP.
People may loose money

[qtgwith]

Agree!!!:
More people burn now means less chance to get more than 10x return like Mastercoin in short time.
Those kind of return (10x -> 1000x) requires that people highly suspect it in the beginning and then later found it real and useful. The extreme case is Nxt. Almost no one trusted it in the IPO stage (they got 21 BTC only), and then when the client came out and it worked, the price shot up because the demand suddenly increases but most chips are controlled in the hand of a few people and it's quite easy for they to hold and see the price up to the sky.
For XCP, 1) people are already quite familiar with the idea due to MSC; 2) the 'Prove by Burn' removes the trust issue; 3) the client is working and we can see the source code, so you can see that there're already 1200 BTC burnt in less than half a month. The situation, however, is almost the same after the IPO. Most of people want to buy will burn now anyway. For the demand from those new comers, the supply (from those want quick profit of 30-40%) will be enough to keep the low price.
Therefore, no reason to expect the price could rise significantly without any big news (e.g. a beautiful and user friendly client; a famous asset such as AM moves in; or a lot of bets like those in bitbet are available).

There is already 60 times more Bitcoins invested in XCP than there was in Nxt. Considering that most people invest to make a quick profit : this is not gonna work !
The profit from the people that invested early in Nxt was about 50 times (like me). We may have 100 times more BTC invested in XCP.
People may loose money

Yes. The risk is becoming more as the burned coin increase. The new burner may have great risk now.

[wizzardTim]

Guys, chill out!!

I'm pretty sure there will be a very positive ROI in XCP.

People are already talking about 1BTC = 10XCP.

XCP is the first from all!! to have a decentralized biuld-in market.

[superresistant]

Guys, chill out!!

I'm pretty sure there will be a very positive ROI in XCP.

People are already talking about 1BTC = 10XCP.

XCP is the first from all!! to have a decentralized biuld-in market.

Hahaha great irony.

Seriously people, if you don't really believe in that coin and here to make a quick profit, think twice before burning your BTC.

This is not gonna be like Nxt. No millionaire here. You probably going to loose half of your investment if too many people want to cash out.

[qtgwith]

Guys, chill out!!

I'm pretty sure there will be a very positive ROI in XCP.

People are already talking about 1BTC = 10XCP.

XCP is the first from all!! to have a decentralized biuld-in market.

Joke!!!

[utopianfuture]

Agree!!!:
More people burn now means less chance to get more than 10x return like Mastercoin in short time.
Those kind of return (10x -> 1000x) requires that people highly suspect it in the beginning and then later found it real and useful. The extreme case is Nxt. Almost no one trusted it in the IPO stage (they got 21 BTC only), and then when the client came out and it worked, the price shot up because the demand suddenly increases but most chips are controlled in the hand of a few people and it's quite easy for they to hold and see the price up to the sky.
For XCP, 1) people are already quite familiar with the idea due to MSC; 2) the 'Prove by Burn' removes the trust issue; 3) the client is working and we can see the source code, so you can see that there're already 1200 BTC burnt in less than half a month. The situation, however, is almost the same after the IPO. Most of people want to buy will burn now anyway. For the demand from those new comers, the supply (from those want quick profit of 30-40%) will be enough to keep the low price.
Therefore, no reason to expect the price could rise significantly without any big news (e.g. a beautiful and user friendly client; a famous asset such as AM moves in; or a lot of bets like those in bitbet are available).

There is already 60 times more Bitcoins invested in XCP than there was in Nxt. Considering that most people invest to make a quick profit : this is not gonna work !
The profit from the people that invested early in Nxt was about 50 times (like me). We may have 100 times more BTC invested in XCP.
People may loose money

Yes. The risk is becoming more as the burned coin increase. The new burner may have great risk now.

Every burners have lower stakes when new burners coming in. The only solution to keep the your percentage stake is to burn more. Since XCP functionality is very similar to mastercoin and it even has the codes compared to the vaporware in mastercoin, I don't see why XCP should not be valued at least half of Mastercoin market price.

Fair XCP market cap valuation should be at 1/2 mastercoin market cap which is at 60 million$ right now.

BTW: can anyone estimate how many days more until the burning is over ?

 

[sumantso]

There will be a few millions XCP generated, so don't except an overnight jump like NXT or MSC.

IMO, its the fairest project, though, so I am burning (or at least I will after the bug is fixed).

[qtgwith]

Agree!!!:
More people burn now means less chance to get more than 10x return like Mastercoin in short time.
Those kind of return (10x -> 1000x) requires that people highly suspect it in the beginning and then later found it real and useful. The extreme case is Nxt. Almost no one trusted it in the IPO stage (they got 21 BTC only), and then when the client came out and it worked, the price shot up because the demand suddenly increases but most chips are controlled in the hand of a few people and it's quite easy for they to hold and see the price up to the sky.
For XCP, 1) people are already quite familiar with the idea due to MSC; 2) the 'Prove by Burn' removes the trust issue; 3) the client is working and we can see the source code, so you can see that there're already 1200 BTC burnt in less than half a month. The situation, however, is almost the same after the IPO. Most of people want to buy will burn now anyway. For the demand from those new comers, the supply (from those want quick profit of 30-40%) will be enough to keep the low price.
Therefore, no reason to expect the price could rise significantly without any big news (e.g. a beautiful and user friendly client; a famous asset such as AM moves in; or a lot of bets like those in bitbet are available).

There is already 60 times more Bitcoins invested in XCP than there was in Nxt. Considering that most people invest to make a quick profit : this is not gonna work !
The profit from the people that invested early in Nxt was about 50 times (like me). We may have 100 times more BTC invested in XCP.
People may loose money

Yes. The risk is becoming more as the burned coin increase. The new burner may have great risk now.

Every burners have lower stakes when new burners coming in. The only solution to keep the your percentage stake is to burn more. Since XCP functionality is very similar to mastercoin and it even has the codes compared to the vaporware in mastercoin, I don't see why XCP should not be valued at least half of Mastercoin market price.

Fair XCP market cap valuation should be at 1/2 mastercoin market cap which is at 60 million$ right now.

BTW: can anyone estimate how many days more until the burning is over ?

 

Even so, it also need much time (maybe 2-3years)to get the market cap since so many XCP coins have been created.  Also donn't forget the possibility of failure of the XCP project.

[superresistant]

There will be a few millions XCP generated, so don't except an overnight jump like NXT or MSC.
IMO, its the fairest project, though, so I am burning (or at least I will after the bug is fixed).

I agree XCP is fair but that also mean that you could loose money right after the IPO so don't burn too much.

[wizzardTim]

Guys, chill out!!

I'm pretty sure there will be a very positive ROI in XCP.

People are already talking about 1BTC = 10XCP.

XCP is the first from all!! to have a decentralized biuld-in market.

Hahaha great irony.

Seriously people, if you don't really believe in that coin and here to make a quick profit, think twice before burning your BTC.

This is not gonna be like Nxt. No millionaire here. You probably going to loose half of your investment if too many people want to cash out.

I believe in XCP, that's the reason I'm investing. I also didn't say anything about quick profit.
All I said is that I believe in its success + profit, without specifying a time period.

[superresistant]

LOL at people having destroyed a million coins and now realizing this is an ALPHA product that maybe won't make them millionaires. It might even (gasp!) lose you money! No refunds! Maybe if you pray hard enough God will give you the private key to 1CounterpartyXXX!

All Bitcoin sent to the Counterparty address are lost forever. No way to take them back. No refund. No after-sales service.

There is few people that actually believe in the potential of XCP, let me estimate... 21BTC. The rest are going to be disappointed.

[Asterios]

Is the win64 Installer up to date? I cant get past block 280518. Maybe somone can upload the database file?

Thanks. I really want to burn. Cant get past this error for 3 days now.

[maxmint]

Hi PhantomPhreak/xnova

I have noticed that duplicate ASSETs were allowed to be created. Please see http://blockscan.com/asset.aspx.

You will notice that the duplicate asset names for "SPACE" and "NEXT" both were created by the same issuer.  Wouldn't this lead to confusion?

Cheers

Those aren't duplicate issuances, but rather cumulative (with a max of 2^63 - 1).

EDIT: I just tweaked this.

Noted. Any updates on when the "ImportError: No module named 'apsw'" issue will be fixed?

I guess this is due to a missing dependency, "Another Python SQLite Wrapper": https://github.com/rogerbinns/apsw
I tried to install this but ran into more errors so I switched back to the old version which is working just fine.

I'll wait for further instructions from the devs before using the latest commit.

[peer2peer360]

Guys, chill out!!

I'm pretty sure there will be a very positive ROI in XCP.

People are already talking about 1BTC = 10XCP.

XCP is the first from all!! to have a decentralized biuld-in market.

from the looks of things, it seems XCP After the Proof of burn is over
& if XCP are in anyway shape, form or fashion similar to MSC or remotely
better than it's possible XCP could easily be worth potentially alot
more than what people are currently valuing them at.

whether 10 XCP = 1 Btc is correct I see the market going there
but how soon it may be a bit premature to tell.

decentralize, Peer2peer, trustless innovation may be some of the most
interesting projects of 2014

[NewLiberty]

Agree!!!:
More people burn now means less chance to get more than 10x return like Mastercoin in short time.
Those kind of return (10x -> 1000x) requires that people highly suspect it in the beginning and then later found it real and useful. The extreme case is Nxt. Almost no one trusted it in the IPO stage (they got 21 BTC only), and then when the client came out and it worked, the price shot up because the demand suddenly increases but most chips are controlled in the hand of a few people and it's quite easy for they to hold and see the price up to the sky.
For XCP, 1) people are already quite familiar with the idea due to MSC; 2) the 'Prove by Burn' removes the trust issue; 3) the client is working and we can see the source code, so you can see that there're already 1200 BTC burnt in less than half a month. The situation, however, is almost the same after the IPO. Most of people want to buy will burn now anyway. For the demand from those new comers, the supply (from those want quick profit of 30-40%) will be enough to keep the low price.
Therefore, no reason to expect the price could rise significantly without any big news (e.g. a beautiful and user friendly client; a famous asset such as AM moves in; or a lot of bets like those in bitbet are available).

There is already 60 times more Bitcoins invested in XCP than there was in Nxt. Considering that most people invest to make a quick profit : this is not gonna work !
The profit from the people that invested early in Nxt was about 50 times (like me). We may have 100 times more BTC invested in XCP.
People may loose money

Yes. The risk is becoming more as the burned coin increase. The new burner may have great risk now.

Every burners have lower stakes when new burners coming in. The only solution to keep the your percentage stake is to burn more. Since XCP functionality is very similar to mastercoin and it even has the codes compared to the vaporware in mastercoin, I don't see why XCP should not be valued at least half of Mastercoin market price.

Fair XCP market cap valuation should be at 1/2 mastercoin market cap which is at 60 million$ right now.

BTW: can anyone estimate how many days more until the burning is over ?

Mastercoin spends more on marketing.
Counterparty spends on code.
Why is XCP expected to be 1/2 of Mastercoin?

Really, the price of the coin isn't the point.  It is the features, the utility and the implementation.

Having a decentralized precious metal exchange is going to be worth it.  The London Fix is out, counterparty is in.

[panonym]

About the future value of XCP: could you just realize that nobody has a clue, please.
Anybody saying that he know is just trolling. Up or Down, same same.

Indeed an instant x100 is very unlikely.
We may even suffer a relative lost during the first week/month after-burn.
Yet MSC is valued at 60 million.
XCP despite it's alpha-stage and few bug has already more presently working functionality than it's concurrent.

Both may succeed, both may crash, one may succeed better than the other.
But if MSC is valued at 60 millions, theoretically there is nothing preventing XCP to reach 30/60/120 millions.

Just don't expect such valuation too fast.
It could happen in 4~6 month, it could happen in 1 month, or it could never happen.
Just as BTC itself could lose most of it's value if a really amazing innovation appear in 6 month.

I personally plan to hold my XCP a few month, and will not sell them at loses.
If I must way 6 month for that, then 6 month it will be.
Middle term I hope a very nice ROI, but it's gambling.

Are we done?
If a troller come trying to lower XCP credibility without quality argument, just ignore him.
Don't feed the troll.
Everyone can think for him/herself.
If you guys can't resist talking about that, open a dedicated topic for speculation.
Most here are not interested in the "tiny war" between metacoin.
Let's keep focusing on XCP testing and improvement in all field.

Obvious reminder:
Don't invest more than you can afford to lose.

[mtbitcoin]

I guess this is due to a missing dependency, "Another Python SQLite Wrapper": https://github.com/rogerbinns/apsw
I tried to install this but ran into more errors so I switched back to the old version which is working just fine.

I'll wait for further instructions from the devs before using the latest commit.

Yes, I saw that earlier but there was no build for the win64 platform. Did not try it anyway. I will wait this out...

Is there are specific git command to roll back to the previous release ?

[maxmint]

I guess this is due to a missing dependency, "Another Python SQLite Wrapper": https://github.com/rogerbinns/apsw
I tried to install this but ran into more errors so I switched back to the old version which is working just fine.

I'll wait for further instructions from the devs before using the latest commit.

Yes, I saw that earlier but there no build for win64 platform. Did not try it anyway. I will wait this out?

Is there are specific git command to roll back to the previous release ?

I'm not sure about that, I just always keep a backup copy before updating to the newest release.

[xnova]

apsw issue is fixed in the newest push for Ubuntu 13.10. (Ubuntu 12.04 LTS build is currently broken because Werkzeug doesn't support python3.2, which that version of Ubuntu uses). However as we will be most likely switching to from werkzeug cherrypy shortly (due to its much better WSGI performance) this isn't a super big deal.

Windows build will be fixed this afternoon. Probably what will need to happen is to use Python 3.2 (install that from the python site) and use the apsw library for that. If that is the 'fix', I'll just update the docs to say so.

Updated windows 64 installer will be issued once all of this is worked out.