Do we realy need NXT / Ripple ?

[Alphi]

Really, I believe that much of the hate for ripple will blow up when people will see its usefulness; the federate payment system is very powerfull. Right now you can open a gateway and if you are good at market making you consumers can buy with their currency in everyshop accepting bitcoins and ripple.

Actually you can buy everything with PPC XPM NMC LTC NXT and even with DOGECOIN; thx to ripple

if ripple is centralized and many bad actors get involved and start money laundering.. what is to stop the US govt from shutting it down like they did with liberty reserve?

same goes for NXT... if the US govt decides to shut it down by locking up the 71 original investors then what happens?

with bitcoin yes ofcourse any government could hunt down the people with the most coins.. but even if you took 90% of the coins out of circulation there are still enough coins in place to support the infrastructure that has been built around BTC.. so the system keeps working.

from what I can see NXT on the other hand does not have the infrastructure in place.. it relies mostly on being exchanged into LTC and BTC.

(this is the problem with most other altcoins too btw)

this is why the widest possible initial distribution is so very very important,

any kind of concentration is bad for ANY crypto coin.. even BTC.

[1714774155]

1714774155

[1714774155]

1714774155

[crocko]

LOL 

NXT :: descendat of Bitcoin   [ https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=345619.0 ]

NEM :: Descendant of Nxt    [ https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=440185.0 ]

[Eadeqa]

same goes for NXT... if the US govt decides to shut it down by locking up the 71 original investors then what happens?

How would  the US govt find those 71 "investors"? It's not as if they are sitting in one office in New york. It was open invitation here on bitcointalk.org and everyone was free to join.  They might be in different countries.  

Besides, those 71 accounts have been selling/distributing their shares. The number of accounts are now over 20,000. That number will keep growing at very fast rate.

Nxt is decentralized

[ilccoin]

we might need altcoins but not those two

[Come-from-Beyond]

we might need altcoins but not those two

Looks like u registered just to post ur competent opinion. 

[Alphi]

How would  the US govt find those 71 "investors"? It's not as if they are sitting in one office in New york. It was open invitation here on bitcointalk.org and everyone was free to join.  They might be in different countries.  

Besides, those 71 accounts have been selling/distributing their shares. The number of accounts are now over 20,000. That number will keep growing at very fast rate.

Nxt is decentralized

thank you you just made my point for me.

bitcointalk has been hacked so many times.. you think the NSA dont know who is who on here?

just as an example for you... many many users of the silk road.. YES people using TOR encryption and Mixers to hide their tracks.. have been arrested and many more to come.

this is only hypothetical but IF the major players in an Alt coin such as NXT were found to be money laundering OR facilitating a Ponzi scheme then you can bet that US govt agencies would go after them.. and find most of them.


people assume too easily that Pseudonyms protect them.. they don't.

as I already stated I'm not alleging that NXT IS doing anything wrong.. just saying that it could easily be torn apart if bad actors were found to be involved in its creation. same goes for any coin that has any kind of concentration of power (in any form) and does not have the broader infrastructure in place..

[Come-from-Beyond]

bitcointalk has been hacked so many times.. you think the NSA dont know who is who on here?

USA can't get even Snowden...

[Alphi]

bitcointalk has been hacked so many times.. you think the NSA dont know who is who on here?

USA can't get even Snowden...

knowledge is power... you think snowden escaped on his own? he is being protected by very very powerful players.... are you? am I? I doubt it.

[Come-from-Beyond]

bitcointalk has been hacked so many times.. you think the NSA dont know who is who on here?

USA can't get even Snowden...

knowledge is power... you think snowden escaped on his own? he is being protected by very very powerful players.... are you? am I? I doubt it.

I'm protected by the power of a country that will use every opportunity to show that it f*cks the USA.  

[Eadeqa]

How would  the US govt find those 71 "investors"? It's not as if they are sitting in one office in New york. It was open invitation here on bitcointalk.org and everyone was free to join.  They might be in different countries.  

Besides, those 71 accounts have been selling/distributing their shares. The number of accounts are now over 20,000. That number will keep growing at very fast rate.

Nxt is decentralized

thank you you just made my point for me.

bitcointalk has been hacked so many times.. you think the NSA dont know who is who on here?

just as an example for you... many many users of the silk road.. YES people using TOR encryption and Mixers to hide their tracks.. have been arrested and many more to come.

Silkroad was one guy (or a group of guys) running a website on Tor network. He got caught by his own stupidity by leaking his personal info.  When/if Nxt is distributed widely, let's say 100,000 accounts in various countries. How on earth would the US be hunting random 100,000 people in the world? You are talking nonsense. SIlk road wasn't decentralized. It was one site run by one person.  

[crocko]

we might need altcoins but not those two

+1

Bitcoin as a currency will survive because they're actually rewarding miners to keep the thing up.  Even if Bitcoin lost 50% of it's value overnight somehow, a year from now it will still be around, and probably more valuable than it is currently.  If a coin like NXT lost 50% of it's value in a flash crash (which probably will happen due to horrendous distribution), you would probably never see the coin again after a week.

[Come-from-Beyond]

we might need altcoins but not those two

+1

Bitcoin as a currency will survive because they're actually rewarding miners to keep the thing up.  Even if Bitcoin lost 50% of it's value overnight somehow, a year from now it will still be around, and probably more valuable than it is currently.  If a coin like NXT lost 50% of it's value in a flash crash (which probably will happen due to horrendous distribution), you would probably never see the coin again after a week.

Sorry for cross-post but still...

I heard a Bitcoin mining virus is on round, that once installed in your machine, doing no harm, except taking your CPU power to mine for others. - True ?

Not 100% true. It attacks brain of people and makes them to mine proof-of-work currencies. It's easily detectable though, just ask opinion of these people about any proof-of-stake coin. Asking about Nxt, which is 100% PoS, gives the best level of detection.

[startselect]

Bitcoin is not good enough because it's so slow. How frustrating is it to need to buy lets say NXT when the price is low, when time is crucial and then having to wait and wait.

Also, OPs comment is so closed minded. I can't imagine him coming up with an innovative concept. 

[extee]

we might need altcoins but not those two

+1

Bitcoin as a currency will survive because they're actually rewarding miners to keep the thing up.  Even if Bitcoin lost 50% of it's value overnight somehow, a year from now it will still be around, and probably more valuable than it is currently.  If a coin like NXT lost 50% of it's value in a flash crash (which probably will happen due to horrendous distribution), you would probably never see the coin again after a week.

NXt has crashed and lost more than half of its value overnight at least two times...and it survives and infact gets stronger as the coin gets wider distributed .
by the way your OP is like saying "myspsace is good enough we don't need innovation".....and myspace was used by 60 million ppl at some point. and look where it is now.
in technology it is all about innovation. nxt is one of the only few coins around which actually innovates  and you discredit it .
and the fact that you refer as mining as bitcoin's biggest strength just shows how clueless you are.......if you spent any time in the development/technical forums you'll see that mining is the n.1 problem and n.1 threat to the bitcoin ecosystem. mining at the present moment is not  decentralized....and there doesn't seem a solution for this. bounties for true p2p mining are just ending in dead holes.
the expensive and wasteful infrastructure that currently holds bitcoin up cannot afford to see the value plummet...if that happens it would be a disaster of epic proportions and people would jump ship.
not sure if that ship would be Nxt....but sure as hell would not be another miners coin to end up down the same dead end road.

[DeadlyEskimo]

All alts benifit BTC by brining money to the crypto world. So do we need them? Yes, to think that BTC is the final product in a new industry your blind. PERIOD.

[Alphi]

When/if Nxt is distributed widely, let's say 100,000 accounts in various countries. How on earth would the US be hunting random 100,000 people in the world? You are talking nonsense. SIlk road wasn't decentralized. It was one site run by one person.  

that's the point, as I understand it the addresses with the most NXT are the ones who get the most newly created NXT coins so there is no incentive for Nxt to be distributed widely.

Nxt addresses work like gravity.. the bigger they are the more coins they attract from the mining process.
this process alone tends towards centralization of the currency into a few large addresses over time.

authorities OR criminals from any persuasion do not need to go after 100,000 people they just need to target the top addresses. once they control the largest addresses the majority of newly mined coins naturally flow to them.. they don't even have to work to get more coins..

if I understand how NXT works correctly this IS a fundamental flaw.
it is much more dangerous than a %51 attack which can only allow attackers to spend 1 or 2 blocks worth of coins before the miners start rejecting the transactions.

if you look a the bitcoin richlist for example... address with the most BTC was actually seized from the Silk Road.

(if this site is correct)
http://bitcoinrichlist.com/top100

now in BTC world that doesn't matter because those coins are taken out of circulation and the owner of that address, the biggest miners and the most powerful devs are NOT the same people. so the miners keep mining and the devs keep on working new coins get created and spread around.

if that situation were to occur in NXT land.... then that seized address would simply keep growing because by virtue of it being locked nobody can spend the coins.
ask yourself this.. who is going to mine or buy NXT if most of the new coins will go to the FBI for example...

please correct me if my understanding of the underlying NXT model is incorrect but to me that seems to be how it works.

[ewhenn]

We need alts, but NXT isn't it.

Things I know about NXT:
1) It's 100% PoS.  Basically the rewards from the mining process only go to those that hold it.   IE. the rich get richer and the poor get squat.  
2) Since the reward is based on holding it you are deterred form spending it as not only do you exchange it out now, you also lose future earnings.  
3) Combine that with the fact it's 100% pre-mine.. and just LOL!  Shit, I think I'm going to open up my monopoly game, stick my face on the bills, then say "I'll only give more to the people that buy now" and sell them for $1000 USD each. lol. Any "investors" out there?

NXT = trash.

[relm9]

When/if Nxt is distributed widely, let's say 100,000 accounts in various countries. How on earth would the US be hunting random 100,000 people in the world? You are talking nonsense. SIlk road wasn't decentralized. It was one site run by one person.  

that's the point, as I understand it the addresses with the most NXT are the ones who get the most newly created NXT coins so there is no incentive for Nxt to be distributed widely.

Nxt addresses work like gravity.. the bigger they are the more coins they attract from the mining process.
this process alone tends towards centralization of the currency into a few large addresses over time.

authorities OR criminals from any persuasion do not need to go after 100,000 people they just need to target the top addresses. once they control the largest addresses the majority of newly mined coins naturally flow to them.. they don't even have to work to get more coins..

if I understand how NXT works correctly this IS a fundamental flaw.
it is much more dangerous than a %51 attack which can only allow attackers to spend 1 or 2 blocks worth of coins before the miners start rejecting the transactions.

if you look a the bitcoin richlist for example... address with the most BTC was actually seized from the Silk Road.

(if this site is correct)
http://bitcoinrichlist.com/top100

now in BTC world that doesn't matter because those coins are taken out of circulation and the owner of that address, the biggest miners and the most powerful devs are NOT the same people. so the miners keep mining and the devs keep on working new coins get created and spread around.

if that situation were to occur in NXT land.... then that seized address would simply keep growing because by virtue of it being locked nobody can spend the coins.
ask yourself this.. who is going to mine or buy NXT if most of the new coins will go to the FBI for example...

please correct me if my understanding of the underlying NXT model is incorrect but to me that seems to be how it works.

First, I don't know what you mean by "newly created coins" as NXT isn't inflationary. The coins aren't generated from thin air - they come from fees.

Second, the seized funds from Silk Road haven't been taken out of circulation, the FBI is planning to sell them.

Third, a 51% attack isn't possible with NXT, an attacker would have to get like 90% of the coins, which seems impossible. It's more likely the government will build its own ASIC network to try and take over Bitcoin if you want to engage in those kind of theories.

[NWO]

The average person is saying the exact same thing with regards to BTC. Go around the streets and ask people. There are a lot of people that just feel its a fad that will die. They don't see the value in Bitcoin because of it being a digital currency. Some of my friends all feel why should they use it when Credit cards work just as well other than it being centralized. If one doesn't care about that then yeah...

Considering that even Bitcoin has struggled for years, how the hell do you expect that yet another obscure altcoin (in hundreds now), like Nxt to get some traction, huh?

Nxt did pretty well in 1 month since "official" launch.  It will get some traction by offering new features (faster transactions, messages, aliases, decentralized asset exchanges/market place, etc).

It was manipulated... Pretty easy to do when a small group owns a large majority of coins.

[Alphi]

First, I don't know what you mean by "newly created coins" as NXT isn't inflationary. The coins aren't generated from thin air - they come from fees.

Second, the seized funds from Silk Road haven't been taken out of circulation, the FBI is planning to sell them.

Third, a 51% attack isn't possible with NXT, an attacker would have to get like 90% of the coins, which seems impossible. It's more likely the government will build its own ASIC network to try and take over Bitcoin if you want to engage in those kind of theories.

Firstly... "newly created" and "generated" mean the same thing... you are just arguing semantics

Secondly.. seized funds.. yes they are taken out of circulation for a time. the FBI has control of them and has NOT sold them yet that is the point. If those coins were NXT the FBI holdings would be increasing in number without them having to do anything.

Thirdly.. 51% was talking about BITCOIN.... i said the concentration of coins is fundamentally is WORSE than a 51% attack in the context of NXT because the concentration acts like gravity attracting more coins. essentially those people who control the largest amount of coins control the entire market of not just existing coins but the creation of new coins.. this is very dangerous indeed. this is the fundamental flaw of any entirely PoS system.


you missed the point of my post completely due to lack of understanding both BTC and NXT.