Require a small amount of merit to become a Junior Member

[LoyceV]

That means the majority of this forum can't write meaningful posts, isn't it?

Correct. Out of more than 2 million accounts, less than 1% has received 1 or more Merit points.
The majority of users are either spambots or bounty hunters/account farmers with dozens of accounts.

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[arhipova]

That means the majority of this forum can't write meaningful posts, isn't it?

Correct. Out of more than 2 million accounts, less than 1% has received 1 or more Merit points.
The majority of users are either spambots or bounty hunters/account farmers with dozens of accounts.

Why are they not banned then ? Is it because the forum needs them for some reason or another ?

[hilariousetc]

I understand that the spammers and bot are a bigger issue than a regular person getting a merit to be a Jr. member. But what I'm saying is that I'm a regular person, having regular conversations, posts, and so on. Even though I understand that the spammers and bot are a major  issue, I'm just trying to bring light how this really messes up a regular person.

How does it mess people up? People should earn their ranks. If you can't contribute anything merit worthy then you should remain at a Newbie rank. Asking for one merit to become a Junior is not a ridiculous proposition. The other ranks are much higher.

The difficulty is such now that instead of developing through natural conversations, I have to go above and beyond and create really amazing posts. Most regular people are not going to have that ability. So you can see how it hurts the regular person the most.

Above and beyond?  . I'm really sorry that you now have to put a little effort into your posts and can't just rise through the ranks with generic one/two line posts. People are tired of having to read nonsense by lazy idiots who are only here to earn and do so by posting crap all over until they get the rank they want. If you can't get merit then you shouldn't move up ranks. People shouldn't be allowed to just come here and write "I like bitcoin because it helps me with my daily needs" 30 times and then become a Junior Member. Earn that title by posting something worthwhile, but if you don't then you should remain a Newbie.

Like I know I can go back and improved what I just said if I spend a lot more mental effort and time going over and looking at how I can better express my point. But now instead of being natural and a regular person, I'm forcing myself, using more mental energy, for the hope of getting a merit.

The cost, energy that one has to use for hopefully getting a merit puts us at a disadvantage.

Well maybe this is the problem here. Laziness or 'lack of energy' shouldn't be rewarded. If you lack energy to post on a message board then I wouldn't suggest finding something less tiring to do or just stick to collecting bounties until you've earned the right to move up ranks.

That means the majority of this forum can't write meaningful posts, isn't it?

Correct. Out of more than 2 million accounts, less than 1% has received 1 or more Merit points.
The majority of users are either spambots or bounty hunters/account farmers with dozens of accounts.

Why are they not banned then ? Is it because the forum needs them for some reason or another ?

Bots are banned once spotted or reported, but their accounts still remain in the database, they just can't do anything with them. Alts are allowed by the forum as long as it's not to evade a ban or something else malicious.

[QuadeBarrier]

I understand the logic and it makes sense. I was just trying to point out how much more difficult it all makes it for the regular people. Just wish there was a better solution to prevent people from spamming and selling such accounts.

So the one who gets merits is an irregular/divergent? That means the majority of this forum can't write meaningful posts, isn't it?

Come on Quade, don't be too pessimistic.

From what I see there are three types of possible posts.

1. Spam, forced. This is the majority on bitcointalk.
2. Normal. What you would see on your average website. Say on YouTube. Legit comment about the video they saw. MEANINGFUL to the subject/video.
3. All time great posts. John Carmack going in depth about computer programming. A subject he's an expert in.

What I'm saying that in the hopes of getting a merit one cannot be normal, but rather spend an expensive amount of mental energy for number three in hopes that maybe they'll get a merit. And something that the majority of people will not be able to do. Due to lack of knowledge on most of the topics, particularly if they're new. Or because they simply do not have the IQ. Or not being a native English speaker.

That was my point.

[upotami]

In case this is implemented, how much merits are we talking about ? Less than 5 seems quite less and then member rank will need an increase for merit as well.

[hilariousetc]

In case this is implemented, how much merits are we talking about ? Less than 5 seems quite less and then member rank will need an increase for merit as well.

It doesn't matter really, but it should be at least one. The amounts should be staggered and get progressively higher (and harder) to get as you move up ranks. Ten merit to become a Member isn't much at all, and Junior could be between 1-5, but one is better than nothing and is at least some encouragement in that all you need is one meritable post to move up a rank. Member is then ten times more difficult. My suggestion is more about just stopping the truly terrible posters and bots from being able to achieve this rank by doing nothing other than making 30 posts over two activity periods.

[Vpbank2018]

I do not think it's necessary to require for merit just to ask how many posts need to have at least a few words and write down which threads are counted.

[LoyceV]

That means the majority of this forum can't write meaningful posts, isn't it?

Correct. Out of more than 2 million accounts, less than 1% has received 1 or more Merit points.
The majority of users are either spambots or bounty hunters/account farmers with dozens of accounts.

Why are they not banned then ? Is it because the forum needs them for some reason or another ?

I think it has to do with their large numbers. Many get banned, but many more get created. And real users shouldn't be banned as collateral damage, which means Mods can't just ban 99% of the users.

What I'm saying that in the hopes of getting a merit one cannot be normal, but rather spend an expensive amount of mental energy for number three in hopes that maybe they'll get a merit. And something that the majority of people will not be able to do. Due to lack of knowledge on most of the topics, particularly if they're new. Or because they simply do not have the IQ. Or not being a native English speaker.

You make it sound as if it is a bad thing that people who don't have knowledge on the subject they're "discussing" can't rank up.

[QuadeBarrier]

That means the majority of this forum can't write meaningful posts, isn't it?

Correct. Out of more than 2 million accounts, less than 1% has received 1 or more Merit points.
The majority of users are either spambots or bounty hunters/account farmers with dozens of accounts.

Why are they not banned then ? Is it because the forum needs them for some reason or another ?

I think it has to do with their large numbers. Many get banned, but many more get created. And real users shouldn't be banned as collateral damage, which means Mods can't just ban 99% of the users.

What I'm saying that in the hopes of getting a merit one cannot be normal, but rather spend an expensive amount of mental energy for number three in hopes that maybe they'll get a merit. And something that the majority of people will not be able to do. Due to lack of knowledge on most of the topics, particularly if they're new. Or because they simply do not have the IQ. Or not being a native English speaker.

You make it sound as if it is a bad thing that people who don't have knowledge on the subject they're "discussing" can't rank up.

So people new to crypto should never rank up? Or wait for years until they become experts? Regular, average, normal people should rank up, not spammers. That's the point.

It's something that I see so much, how when people are on the top, they're basically like, "Who cares, I'm on top." Without even noticing that they're doing that. You're a Legendary member for no other reason that you've been here for many,many, many years. So your attitude is more of "Oh they can't rank up, oh well." Since you don't have to deal with it.

And I've also seen in so many other situations. "I have 15,000 Bitcoins because I mined it in 2009. How dare these people want to make money off of crypto instead of use it as a currency because the banking system is evil."

Very easy for a person with 15,000 Bitcoins to say when they don't have to worry about money. Not realizing that if they didn't have those 15,000 Bitcoins, they wouldn't be complaining that others are more concerned with making money than the a Utopian future without banks.

[pugman]

So people new to crypto should never rank up? Or wait for years until they become experts? Regular, average, normal people should rank up, not spammers. That's the point.

It's something that I see so much, how when people are on the top, they're basically like, "Who cares, I'm on top." Without even noticing that they're doing that. You're a Legendary member for no other reason that you've been here for many,many, many years. So your attitude is more of "Oh they can't rank up, oh well." Since you don't have to deal with it.

And I've also seen in so many other situations. "I have 15,000 Bitcoins because I mined it in 2009. How dare these people want to make money off of crypto instead of use it as a currency because the banking system is evil."

Very easy for a person with 15,000 Bitcoins to say when they don't have to worry about money. Not realizing that if they didn't have those 15,000 Bitcoins, they wouldn't be complaining that others are more concerned with making money than the a Utopian future without banks.

No. Its not like that. Anybody can rank up if they want to. I am no expert when it comes to bitcoin, I am far worse than a newb, but that is not the point to be focused on. Expert or no expert, you can still rank up, how? Use proper language, be a little unique and be relevant to the topic and make your post make sense. You have made good points on how legendary or other high ranked members don't care much on newbies ranking up. Its good that they don't, for, rank has nothing to do with you. I mean, I get that ranking up boosts your morale, but if you make good posts, you can rank up. At least normal understandable posts with some new information.

You can't expect to get merit for like agreeing with someone on some topic, or repeating what has been said before. I would have merited you for this post, but this has already been discussed in the past.

[bitmover]

So people new to crypto should never rank up? Or wait for years until they become experts? Regular, average, normal people should rank up, not spammers. That's the point.

Even a funny joke can award you a merit. Actually, it probably will award you a merit.

If you read all comments before posting you are half way to receive a merit.
If you read and research, you will get one very soon.

And why do you need to rank up? To join a signature/bounty campaign.
Well, if you have nothing to contribute to the forum why do you want to get paid to post?


I think 1 merit to Jr. Member would be nice.
Or maybe, what if 1 merit is needed to have a signature?

[olumyd]

So people new to crypto should never rank up? Or wait for years until they become experts? Regular, average, normal people should rank up, not spammers. That's the point.

Even a funny joke can award you a merit. Actually, it probably will award you a merit.

If you read all comments before posting you are half way to receive a merit.
If you read and research, you will get one very soon.

And why do you need to rank up? To join a signature/bounty campaign.
Well, if you have nothing to contribute to the forum why do you want to get paid to post?


I think 1 merit to Jr. Member would be nice.
Or maybe, what if 1 merit is needed to have a signature?

This would be too easy:

I think 1 merit to Jr. Member would be nice.
Or maybe, what if 1 merit is needed to have a signature

Newbies would begin to target merit sources and begin their holocaust campaign for merits. 1 merit to Jr. Member is not a bad idea at all. Only if there was a way to gather all the spambot accounts and nuke them, then dealing with the real accounts who have a poor understanding on how BTT works should be an entirely different yet simple problem.

[speem28]

- Newby thread starting restricted to an intro and an account recovery board. Newbies and juniors restricted to beginners and associated boards.

As you've discussed this before, I agreed to this too that Jr.members and newbies should stay first at the stated boards until they got reviewed and got merited. That will prevent them from spamming different boards with useless threads and replies and for members that are already ranked up to Jr before more restrictions will be implemented, bounty managers should be strict in accepting participants in their campaign.

[LoyceV]

You make it sound as if it is a bad thing that people who don't have knowledge on the subject they're "discussing" can't rank up.

So people new to crypto should never rank up?

No, I didn't say that. But you can't expect to rank up if you're not willing to learn and just keep posting generic useless posts.

Or wait for years until they become experts? Regular, average, normal people should rank up, not spammers. That's the point.

You've spammed your way into becoming Jr. Member in Spam Megathreads on the Off-topic and Politics & Society boards. Example:

I pay taxes because I don't want to have a negative credit. That will ruing your life.

It's something that I see so much, how when people are on the top, they're basically like, "Who cares, I'm on top." Without even noticing that they're doing that. You're a Legendary member for no other reason that you've been here for many,many, many years. So your attitude is more of "Oh they can't rank up, oh well." Since you don't have to deal with it.

You're right on one thing: this is something I see a lot, just not how you imagined it. Whenever a user with zero Merit complains about it, I check their post history. I checked yours yesterday, and saw nothing worth meriting.
You're not the first one to pull the "you're at the top so you don't care"-card, and all it does is prove you didn't check my post history.
I care a lot about new users who make decent posts, and I have given 566 merit 532 times, to 291 profiles.
But I've gotten thousands of posts deleted and accounts banned too. I don't merit you because I care about the forum, not the other way around.

And I've also seen in so many other situations. "I have 15,000 Bitcoins because I mined it in 2009. How dare these people want to make money off of crypto instead of use it as a currency because the banking system is evil."

There's your problem, you're here only to make money. That's why you spammed your way into being a Jr. Member.

[elegiyas]

Also, it would be nice to require some payment (very small) to start an account here. Currently, many create accounts and let is age to sell later.

[barsharkol12]

honestly. merits make me a hard time to rank up. i have a lot of good quality post and ended up no merit gain, but its ok because i think that the merit givers also think that my post is not that good enough to be rewarded by a merit and still i am doing all my hard works so that one day i will be rewarded by a lot of merits.

and for the jr member out there that experiencing the same kind of struggle. level up of knowledge and gain experiencing for those who are knowledgeable in this kind of work.

[DdmrDdmr]

honestly. merits make me a hard time to rank up. i have a lot of good quality post and ended up no merit gain, but its ok because i think that the merit givers also think that my post is not that good enough to be rewarded by a merit and still i am doing all my hard works so that one day i will be rewarded by a lot of merits.
<...>

I’ve checked through your posting history briefly and your posts tend to be one-liners that lack deeper content to be meritable.
I believe you mentioned you’re Philippine.  If so, I would suggest looking through the posts from theyoungmillionaire, who posts both in the English boards and in the local Philippine section. He is I believe one of the best examples I can provide from your local board.  Check through his posts to get a glimpse of the idea as to why he is an example.

[LTU_btc]

Also, it would be nice to require some payment (very small) to start an account here. Currently, many create accounts and let is age to sell later.

I think it's bad idea. I'm not sure that it would kill account sales market, but it would definitely stop legitimate newbies from cresting account here when they will see that payment is needed to join forum.
Maybe it would be better to make signatures as paid privillege - users would have to pay some BTC to enable signatures in their profiles.

[QuadeBarrier]

You make it sound as if it is a bad thing that people who don't have knowledge on the subject they're "discussing" can't rank up.

So people new to crypto should never rank up?

No, I didn't say that. But you can't expect to rank up if you're not willing to learn and just keep posting generic useless posts.

Or wait for years until they become experts? Regular, average, normal people should rank up, not spammers. That's the point.

You've spammed your way into becoming Jr. Member in Spam Megathreads on the Off-topic and Politics & Society boards. Example:

I pay taxes because I don't want to have a negative credit. That will ruing your life.

It's something that I see so much, how when people are on the top, they're basically like, "Who cares, I'm on top." Without even noticing that they're doing that. You're a Legendary member for no other reason that you've been here for many,many, many years. So your attitude is more of "Oh they can't rank up, oh well." Since you don't have to deal with it.

You're right on one thing: this is something I see a lot, just not how you imagined it. Whenever a user with zero Merit complains about it, I check their post history. I checked yours yesterday, and saw nothing worth meriting.
You're not the first one to pull the "you're at the top so you don't care"-card, and all it does is prove you didn't check my post history.
I care a lot about new users who make decent posts, and I have given 566 merit 532 times, to 291 profiles.
But I've gotten thousands of posts deleted and accounts banned too. I don't merit you because I care about the forum, not the other way around.

And I've also seen in so many other situations. "I have 15,000 Bitcoins because I mined it in 2009. How dare these people want to make money off of crypto instead of use it as a currency because the banking system is evil."

There's your problem, you're here only to make money. That's why you spammed your way into being a Jr. Member.

I have six total posts in the Off-Topic section, last one being from March 9th, and four posts from Politics and Society, the last one being on January 18. Back when I was new and I was getting my feet wet in here, and you want to make it seem as though I post there. Remember, I said that the majority of Bitcointalk posts are spam and forced. And as I read my history I saw a comment from myself complaining about the spam and forced comments.

The reason why I'm commenting about merits is because it's an interesting game theory kind of concept, and how it's a disadvantage for new, normal legit users, versus bots and spammers who don't even read the OP and post one liners. I couldn't care one iota about merits. You're never going to see me begging for merits.

But I'm done discussing this with you, because you really don't seem capable of understanding my very, very, very simple point. I decided to use Bitcoin as an example for this point, but instead of acknowledging the point that I tried to make, you deflect by saying that I'm only here to make money.

[RAMSHIVDEEPAK]

We have been discussing this topic from 21 days. Lots of suggestion have been come by the members.
 
Is there any final out come of this discussion    how much time it will take to implement ??