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Author Topic: [PRE-ANN] Blacknet (IBO for BlackCoin) | Original research | PoS | No ICO  (Read 2452889 times)
Kalizar
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April 30, 2014, 11:51:19 PM
 #26601



I don't understand this at all. Is it supposed to be funny? Is an attempt at trolling?

Information

It fails at its purpose if that's the case, cause it is genuinely confusing. But from looking at your past history it seems you think it would be relatively easy to pull of a 51% attack on a PoS coin. If that's the case why not try an intelligent discussion?

A PoS coin is susceptible to an attack, just like PoW. However, the means of performing the attack would be much simpler. The main weakness comes from most coin holders do not (and will probably never) stake their coins in the long run.

If there are 100 coins in circulation(for example) and only 4 coins staked, that would only require 5 staked coins to perform an attack. That is how a PoS attack would be performed, having over 51% of the staked coins.

Meanwhile, PoW requires 51% of the network hash. This makes it much more impractical to destroy a coin. Neither attacks have been successfully performed to destroy a coin, but PoS attacks would be much easier.

Any coin is vulnerable to an attack.. Just like any Bank can be heisted. Just takes the right person or group to perform the attack. Never say Never. So I agree with you 100% on this.

Yes, but I am trying to emphasize how much easier it is for PoS coins. There is not enough incentive, at the moment, for coin holders to stake their coins.

but "much easier" is relative. That could still be incredibly difficult in a wider frame and is almost impossible to measure.

I think what is starting to change is *that* is the incentive in itself...you stake to protect your investment. It's why I do. I mean say, for example, why would someone put money in a savings account instead of in a drawer in an apartment? Interest is fractions of a percent. I just want to keep my money 'safe' from say a fire or a robber or other 'attacks'.

You are comparing your incentive to stake coins towards everyone else's and, even worse, the issues with FIAT money. I have no fear of a robber or fire resulting in loss of my coins.

Most holders are constantly switching their coins around while trying to catch the next train.

That's kind of my point though too. You can't compare incentives for everyone invested in a given coin (when you said it's easier for a pos). In what frame? By how much? I know a handful of folks in the top 100 who don't day trade and switch their coins around in terms of blackcoin. We all stake. Without you knowing who I know, and without me knowing who you know (or were using in an example when you said "most holders"), you are just taking a stab at the assumption on incentives to different people and what matters to each one personally. I'm not saying it's not a potential problem, an attack can happen on any coin, absolutely, but I am just talking about the idea that staking IS an incentive to some to protect their coins has been growing. I do think it should continue to be pushed and explain to new investors too in order to continue emphasizing the importance of not just say getting a 1% roi, but also protecting from an attack.

And to me it is comparable to fiat. They both are something you want to protect because they are worth something. You might not be worried about a robber, but people are. Including me. I have no cash stored anywhere, it's all in a bank to protect my investments. If I need cash I make the extra effort to go to an ATM and take what I need. I'm protecting my cash in a bank and I'm protecting my blackcoins by staking in my wallet.

All it takes is one to a few hyped coins to come out. A majority of coin holders could likely sell their coins for whatever hyped coin they want. In the meantime, the security would be weak.
Miners are less likely to switch & reconfigure often for whatever hyped coin comes out.
Coin holders could just transfer it over in just a few moments.
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April 30, 2014, 11:56:26 PM
 #26602


but "much easier" is relative. That could still be incredibly difficult in a wider frame and is almost impossible to measure.

I think what is starting to change is *that* is the incentive in itself...you stake to protect your investment. It's why I do. I mean say, for example, why would someone put money in a savings account instead of in a drawer in an apartment? Interest is fractions of a percent. I just want to keep my money 'safe' from say a fire or a robber or other 'attacks'.

You are comparing your incentive to stake coins towards everyone else's and, even worse, the issues with FIAT money. I have no fear of a robber or fire resulting in loss of my coins.

Most holders are constantly switching their coins around while trying to catch the next train.

Right now, I don't even bother downloading a wallet for my other altcoins. Just leave them on MintPal. But BC stakes at 8 hours so I keep my money printing machine on!

Give me an idea what a "printing money machine" will be. take, for instance, 5,000 BC as an example, what  kind of printing money will it produce in my wallet and how should I go about it. Thanks!

Keep your wallet open and watch the money come in! Ka-ching! Ka-ching! $$$ Those little decimal BCs might be worth 10x one day!

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May 01, 2014, 12:06:42 AM
 #26603


but "much easier" is relative. That could still be incredibly difficult in a wider frame and is almost impossible to measure.

I think what is starting to change is *that* is the incentive in itself...you stake to protect your investment. It's why I do. I mean say, for example, why would someone put money in a savings account instead of in a drawer in an apartment? Interest is fractions of a percent. I just want to keep my money 'safe' from say a fire or a robber or other 'attacks'.

You are comparing your incentive to stake coins towards everyone else's and, even worse, the issues with FIAT money. I have no fear of a robber or fire resulting in loss of my coins.

Most holders are constantly switching their coins around while trying to catch the next train.

Right now, I don't even bother downloading a wallet for my other altcoins. Just leave them on MintPal. But BC stakes at 8 hours so I keep my money printing machine on!

Give me an idea what a "printing money machine" will be. take, for instance, 5,000 BC as an example, what  kind of printing money will it produce in my wallet and how should I go about it. Thanks!

Keep your wallet open and watch the money come in! Ka-ching! Ka-ching! $$$ Those little decimal BCs might be worth 10x one day!

So we are talking "cents", then? on 5,000 BC?
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May 01, 2014, 12:10:59 AM
 #26604

Number of miners on the pool seems to be increasing again.  This is good.  Maybe some sort of promotion to get us to the 15gh/s for the titan is in order?  A no fee weekend?  Or more of the random giveaways or something?  I think these are good for the pool and good for the coin.

  Thoughts?

   Phad.
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May 01, 2014, 12:12:34 AM
 #26605

So we are talking "cents", then? on 5,000 BC?
Its easy, Barabbas. On 5K BC, stacking will generate around 50 BCs per year, which is around 1 BC per week.

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May 01, 2014, 12:15:07 AM
 #26606

Number of miners on the pool seems to be increasing again.  This is good.  Maybe some sort of promotion to get us to the 15gh/s for the titan is in order?  A no fee weekend?  Or more of the random giveaways or something?  I think these are good for the pool and good for the coin.

  Thoughts?

   Phad.

+1. Im always yelling it at the multipool's chat: Miners are the core of BC. We need to cater them, care for them and cheer them. Watch out Version 2 of the multi pool. Will be the most advanced and cool looking ever hottie in the altcoin planet  Grin

I think that when things go back to normal (a slow growth past 40,000 sat etc) the weekly promotions on the pool will be a standard.

Free Faucet for BTC,LTC and DOGE, daily, no need even to log! : http://tinyurl.com/qbtzjg3
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May 01, 2014, 12:18:06 AM
 #26607

Warning regarding Iconic's misguided "Wall Street" plan:
The investment industry sees this type of thing he's planning (ie- hiring pretty, but likely clueless, women who really don't know what the hell they're peddling) as very gimmicky and very juvenile.
The investment industry in reality these days is not "Wolf of Wall Street" and is boring and cares only about two things: returns and playing by the SEC's rules. Investment professionals do due diligence using these simple 1-pagers (http://www.harborfunds.com/docs/international_fund_fact_sheet.pdf and this thing called a prospectus http://hosted.rightprospectus.com/HarborFunds/Fund.aspx?dt=SP&ts=HIINX.
SecondMarket realizes this and will have their public Bitcoin ETF up and running later this year after convincing investors and the SEC that Bitcoin not some gigantic, scammy, ponzi-scheme.
Secondmarket knows that the best way to legitimize Bitcoin for the general investment world is to get the regulators to okay it first and then market it as a returns-achieving security that is safe to hold in a high-risk portfolio.
With Iconic's plan you'll likely get another pump, followed by another dump, and overall nothing will have been achieved.
 
A better plan would be to send those donated BC's to the Blackcoin development team, with the intention of them starting Blackcoin on the path of ETF-creation or a BlackCoinPool Mining Investment Fund. This would be a huge endeavor and would require many expensive securities lawyers and potentially years of work and patience, however it would help the coin in the long-term versus Iconic's plan.
Hell, I would bet every Blackcoin I own that if the Blackcoin Developers made a simple news release that they were going to hire a securities law-firm to help them start on this long process of legitimizing Blackcoin for the investment industry, the price of Blackcoin would spike up higher than this plan of Iconic's, and, unlike Iconic's plan, the price would stay up because it is so unique and ballsy and would add ridiculous value to Blackcoin in the long-term.
Just my 2-cents.
Source: I work in the investment industry and read thousands of prospectuses, fact sheets, 10Q's, 10K's and annual reports, and I need to file a 13h and 13f.

JL


Thank you for comments. Please read the previous responses and comments before commenting, it makes things a lot easier when responding.

The dev team has been focusing on partnerships...etc..etc, and as a community we also have to focus on publicity. The problem is we focus way too much on pools and partnerships. We can have all the pools and partnerships in the world, but if we do not let the rest of the world know BlackCoin exists it doesn't matter. Maybe 100,000 people or less in the world know about BlackCoin, so in the eyes of the world BlackCoin doesn't exist. There are more people that work on Wall Street than people who know about BlackCoin. The purpose of the promotion is to create buzz and bring outside attention to BlackCoin. With all do respect please stick to facts and do not make assumptions. Unless you are psychic or a fortune teller you have no clue what effect this promotion will have on the price, nor do you know if the dev team announced they are hiring a securities law firm it would have a positive effect on the price. Also, your idea is counter intuitive to the spirit of crypto. The point of crypto is to avoid large financial institutions and your plan is to get in bed with them. You do realize before a securities firm were to even consider taking on BlackCoin as a client BlackCoin would have to be a registered Corporation first? If BlackCoin ever became a corporation it will die because it is a community project that existence depends on a community. Please do your homework....

Iconic, of course no one knows the future but you of all people should know that with experience (business-wise, in this case) comes wisdom.
And, no, BlackCoin would not need to be a corporation first; in fact the BlackCoin team wouldn't even need to be connected to it besides granting license of the BlackCoin name to a sponsor of the BlackCoin ETF.
You, sir, need to do your homework.


JL

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May 01, 2014, 12:31:30 AM
 #26608

Does anybody know the HTML notation for the gold on the outside of the blackcoin logo??? I cant get it right  Embarrassed
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May 01, 2014, 12:32:10 AM
 #26609


but "much easier" is relative. That could still be incredibly difficult in a wider frame and is almost impossible to measure.

I think what is starting to change is *that* is the incentive in itself...you stake to protect your investment. It's why I do. I mean say, for example, why would someone put money in a savings account instead of in a drawer in an apartment? Interest is fractions of a percent. I just want to keep my money 'safe' from say a fire or a robber or other 'attacks'.

You are comparing your incentive to stake coins towards everyone else's and, even worse, the issues with FIAT money. I have no fear of a robber or fire resulting in loss of my coins.

Most holders are constantly switching their coins around while trying to catch the next train.

Right now, I don't even bother downloading a wallet for my other altcoins. Just leave them on MintPal. But BC stakes at 8 hours so I keep my money printing machine on!

Give me an idea what a "printing money machine" will be. take, for instance, 5,000 BC as an example, what  kind of printing money will it produce in my wallet and how should I go about it. Thanks!

Keep your wallet open and watch the money come in! Ka-ching! Ka-ching! $$$ Those little decimal BCs might be worth 10x one day!

So we are talking "cents", then? on 5,000 BC?

Yes and no. Those "cents" you will get regardless if you stake 24/7 or once a year. But it's that compound interest which is like 0.5 BC that's the real reason you should keep staking!  Grin

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May 01, 2014, 12:34:55 AM
 #26610

So looking at exchanges for awhile, you can see a lot of the same money (whales) moving from coins to coin. Is no surprise to us in cryptos that are not new, but even most the hype is just whales going from coin to coin. Sure we find some sort of value trading, but overall being unregulated and watching the walls going up it's no surprise that coins only move when whales want them to. We can see on mintpal for sure, the $$$ has left BC volume, into other lower priced POS coins that are junk, but hot right now cause of they all the talk.

This is where we need new blood in this, and iconic's idea is a great one. All cryptos seem to be having this issue. Our focus should be like someone pointed out here talking about JOBS movie, how steve jobs showed people how they needed to get an apple PC, and how it can be in everyones home, well same with cryptos. People don't see a need for it that know about it, or if they do, not easy to use for most. The user friendly aspect like DOS operating system is still in play, we need a Windows platform for people, or reach them with ease.

There are billions of people out there, and this small small community of cryptos fights for a small piece of pie here, when in reality the sky is the limit. There are billions upon billions out there, we just need to show people why cryptos are better and marketing to ease of use.

I'm not sure exactly what would work, but creating buzz really seems to be first. Iconic blackcoin card is also something with ease of use. These are things are I see no other community doing.

Iconic is right, price can and should be able to hit what he says, cause he's thinking outside the box and community. If we are trying to take the money invested away from BTC to be #1 that will be a hard battle, but if we move outside our comfort zone, get marketing to people that could be interested in cryptos but have hard time figuring out how to purchase, or get some. We need to make it easy, easy as going to amazon and ordering a book or movie, and payment as easy as credit card/debit card transactions.

Well, I think we are making a lot of smart moves, and things are moving ahead.

One very important thing as a community we need not do, is look at the prices on exchanges in which the whales decide is fair value, and start looking outside community for expansion. Checking prices based on what % of the $$$ moves out of BTC for the week into what coin for trading is just disappointing. It's important, having volume, less posts about prices and more about building is what will make us win the #1 spot. I believe this, and agree with Iconic, we can make this a very wealthy coin to hold.
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May 01, 2014, 12:44:47 AM
 #26611


Iconic is right, price can and should be able to hit what he says, cause he's thinking outside the box and community. If we are trying to take the money invested away from BTC to be #1 that will be a hard battle, but if we move outside our comfort zone, get marketing to people that could be interested in cryptos but have hard time figuring out how to purchase, or get some. We need to make it easy, easy as going to amazon and ordering a book or movie, and payment as easy as credit card/debit card transactions.


Purchasing altcoins will never be easy as going online with a credit card. It's the nature of cryptocurrency. Easy methods put the seller at major risk of fraud. AML and KYC laws also make it difficult to deposit and withdraw.

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May 01, 2014, 12:45:41 AM
 #26612

Does anybody know the HTML notation for the gold on the outside of the blackcoin logo??? I cant get it right  Embarrassed

I believe the Hex code "ffd46b"

                                    █████████
                                    ██    ███
                    ███████████    ▐█ █  █ ██
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██▀ ▀██▀▀▀▀▀████▄       ██ ▀▄ █  ████  ██ ▐█
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                                   ▀███▀
.VANIG 
▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀
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May 01, 2014, 12:46:56 AM
 #26613

i think its funny that people are trying to supress the price of BC... the volume drop will not last once the competition starts on friday for the knc miner... ac and wc clones will get dumped like a cheap whore and people will realize they made a mistake
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May 01, 2014, 12:49:07 AM
 #26614


Iconic is right, price can and should be able to hit what he says, cause he's thinking outside the box and community. If we are trying to take the money invested away from BTC to be #1 that will be a hard battle, but if we move outside our comfort zone, get marketing to people that could be interested in cryptos but have hard time figuring out how to purchase, or get some. We need to make it easy, easy as going to amazon and ordering a book or movie, and payment as easy as credit card/debit card transactions.


Purchasing altcoins will never be easy as going online with a credit card. It's the nature of cryptocurrency. Easy methods put the seller at major risk of fraud. AML and KYC laws also make it difficult to deposit and withdraw.

I had to respond to this. I am developing a program that will eliminate fraud between two untrusted parties. It was supposed to be out this week but i was writing whitepaper. So yeah... buying online will become a thing of the past. Soon bc will be bought with cash using untrusted parties.

Its a very exciting project so happy about it i could seriously jump
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May 01, 2014, 12:50:40 AM
 #26615


Iconic is right, price can and should be able to hit what he says, cause he's thinking outside the box and community. If we are trying to take the money invested away from BTC to be #1 that will be a hard battle, but if we move outside our comfort zone, get marketing to people that could be interested in cryptos but have hard time figuring out how to purchase, or get some. We need to make it easy, easy as going to amazon and ordering a book or movie, and payment as easy as credit card/debit card transactions.


Purchasing altcoins will never be easy as going online with a credit card. It's the nature of cryptocurrency. Easy methods put the seller at major risk of fraud. AML and KYC laws also make it difficult to deposit and withdraw.

I had to respond to this. I am developing a program that will eliminate fraud between two untrusted parties. It was supposed to be out this week but i was writing whitepaper. So yeah... buying online will become a thing of the past. Soon bc will be bought with cash using untrusted parties.

Its a very exciting project so happy about it i could seriously jump

Elaborate! What solution do you have that millions of people have failed to come up with?

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May 01, 2014, 12:52:20 AM
 #26616

Blackcoins checkpoint system was removed and nobody noticed? LMAO

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May 01, 2014, 01:03:32 AM
 #26617

BLzgAhJDqMs9VpmswisE2th4JwmTWVapz6

We need android wallet. 2000 bc and I will make.
Daedelus
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May 01, 2014, 01:04:23 AM
 #26618

Blackcoins checkpoint system was removed and nobody noticed? LMAO



Try again troll, not enough prople here will know what the implications are Cheesy
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May 01, 2014, 01:05:20 AM
 #26619


Iconic is right, price can and should be able to hit what he says, cause he's thinking outside the box and community. If we are trying to take the money invested away from BTC to be #1 that will be a hard battle, but if we move outside our comfort zone, get marketing to people that could be interested in cryptos but have hard time figuring out how to purchase, or get some. We need to make it easy, easy as going to amazon and ordering a book or movie, and payment as easy as credit card/debit card transactions.


Purchasing altcoins will never be easy as going online with a credit card. It's the nature of cryptocurrency. Easy methods put the seller at major risk of fraud. AML and KYC laws also make it difficult to deposit and withdraw.

I had to respond to this. I am developing a program that will eliminate fraud between two untrusted parties. It was supposed to be out this week but i was writing whitepaper. So yeah... buying online will become a thing of the past. Soon bc will be bought with cash using untrusted parties.

Its a very exciting project so happy about it i could seriously jump

Elaborate! What solution do you have that millions of people have failed to come up with?

well its actually very simple. Its a protocol of exchanging raw tx data. Malleability is not a problem in my protocol I could explain it if you want to see the whitepaper i can send it. The announcement is a suprise. I have mentioned it multiple times in this thread. Just making everything nice with all the bells and whistles. Cheesy
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May 01, 2014, 01:07:44 AM
 #26620

in reply to the person trolling the stake photo, centralized checkpointing is not really needed at this time anyway. How would somebody be able to stake 51% if you look at the distributing nobody even has .5% of the coins. Its completely impossible.
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