REEEEE: PussyGate, a Collection of Trump Investigations

[dupeddonk]

HUR DUR I'mma pretend like I don't know what plea bargaining is

The federal conviction rate is 98%. If you are being charged you WILL be convicted, right or wrong. These charges are manufactured process crimes, and more evidence of this fact is exposed every day in spite of your willful ignorance of this fact. Of course you cling to this totally dismissed desperate effort to push this failed narrative because the democrat party can not win by any legitimate means. As expected, it never stops, accusation after accusation, each one getting more strained and senseless than the last, as they are all proven to be pathetic political ploys one by one. Your party's desperation to save its own ass from prosecution will be the fibers wound into the rope used hang them with.

Do you think Flynn violated the Foreign Agent Registration Act?

tecshare will now down play flynn influencing american policies without disclosing that he was being paid by a foreign country to do so.  just a process crime lol

he was also taking money from russia too

[Spendulus]

....
....

Do you believe that Flynn was being paid by Turkey in 2016 while he was lobbying American politicians to support Turkey in 2016?

Do you believe he did not register as a foreign agent until March 2017?

Do you think it's ethical to lobby for another country that's paying you without being transparent about the fact you're getting paid?  (On bitcointalk we call that shilling.)

Do you believe it would be wrong to make false statements when filing for FARA?  If so, I'll explain the false statements he made if you need.

So you have some things that you think are illegal, that make Flynn a BAD GUY, and these are different than what he was convicted of? He was convicted of "lying to the FBI." After plea bargaining guilty.

WTF? And I am curious. Why in the world would you present several times, one factoid, then ask "Do you believe..." I would never believe your presentation of facts as being impartial or anywhere near complete enough to make such a decision. In fact, I invited you to post all the transcripts, but you did not. Just more questions and presumptive guilty.

Regardless of that, I don't see where you are trying to go with this. This was and is an excellent example of FBI entrapment techniques. Numerous FBI personnel directly involved with that have been fired. Reams of evidence has came out about what actually happened.

Have you noticed that this is in the context of, and part of, a "Russia Collusion" investigation done under false pretenses?

So what's going on? Are you trying to assert something like, "If he had not plead guilty, he would have been charged with all these other things, which he was clearly guilty of, so he would be in a worse position today?"

[TwitchySeal]

....
....

Do you believe that Flynn was being paid by Turkey in 2016 while he was lobbying American politicians to support Turkey in 2016?

Do you believe he did not register as a foreign agent until March 2017?

Do you think it's ethical to lobby for another country that's paying you without being transparent about the fact you're getting paid?  (On bitcointalk we call that shilling.)

Do you believe it would be wrong to make false statements when filing for FARA?  If so, I'll explain the false statements he made if you need.

So you have some things that you think are illegal, that make Flynn a BAD GUY, and these are different than what he was convicted of? He was convicted of "lying to the FBI." After plea bargaining guilty.

WTF?

He accepted the plea deal so that he wouldn't be charged with all the crimes he committed.

[Spendulus]

....
....

Do you believe that Flynn was being paid by Turkey in 2016 while he was lobbying American politicians to support Turkey in 2016?

Do you believe he did not register as a foreign agent until March 2017?

Do you think it's ethical to lobby for another country that's paying you without being transparent about the fact you're getting paid?  (On bitcointalk we call that shilling.)

Do you believe it would be wrong to make false statements when filing for FARA?  If so, I'll explain the false statements he made if you need.

So you have some things that you think are illegal, that make Flynn a BAD GUY, and these are different than what he was convicted of? He was convicted of "lying to the FBI." After plea bargaining guilty.

WTF?

He accepted the plea deal so that he wouldn't be charged with all the crimes he committed.

But that's the very nature of plea bargaining, to agree to lesser or fewer charges and move the case rapidly through the court system.

We all already knew that. I think, or I hope we all did. So now we really need to focus on the entrapment and the charge of "lying to the FBI." Because that's what real. If you want to call him a "convicted felon", then that's what you got. No more, no less.

You need to focus strictly on the collection of evidence, lawful behavior of investigators in collecting evidence, and court proceedings for the charge of "lying to the FBI."

[TwitchySeal]

....
....

Do you believe that Flynn was being paid by Turkey in 2016 while he was lobbying American politicians to support Turkey in 2016?

Do you believe he did not register as a foreign agent until March 2017?

Do you think it's ethical to lobby for another country that's paying you without being transparent about the fact you're getting paid?  (On bitcointalk we call that shilling.)

Do you believe it would be wrong to make false statements when filing for FARA?  If so, I'll explain the false statements he made if you need.

So you have some things that you think are illegal, that make Flynn a BAD GUY, and these are different than what he was convicted of? He was convicted of "lying to the FBI." After plea bargaining guilty.

WTF?

He accepted the plea deal so that he wouldn't be charged with all the crimes he committed.

But that's the very nature of plea bargaining, to agree to lesser or fewer charges and move the case rapidly through the court system.

We all already knew that. I think, or I hope we all did. So now we really need to focus on the entrapment and the charge of "lying to the FBI." Because that's what real. If you want to call him a "convicted felon", then that's what you got. No more, no less.

If he finds away to reverse his guilty plea, do you think he should be off the hook for all the charges he avoided by taking the deal?  There seems to be enough evidence to go to trial.

[dupeddonk]

amazing watching the trump team squirm to avoid the fact that flynn actually did commit serious crimes and disgrace the army and his country. 

imagine if hillary started taking foreign money to lobby without disclosing.  and then got convicted and tried to get it reversed bc she didnt know she shouldnt lie to the fbi.

THE COURT: Do you wish to challenge the circumstances on
which you were interviewed by the FBI?
FLYNN: No, Your Honor.
THE COURT: Do you understand that by maintaining your
guilty plea and continuing with sentencing, you will give up your
right forever to challenge the circumstances under which you were
interviewed?
FLYNN: Yes, Your Honor.
THE COURT: Do you have any concerns that you entered your
guilty plea before you or your attorneys were able to review
information that could have been helpful to your defense?
FLYNN: No, Your Honor.
THE COURT: At the time of your January 24th, 2017
interview with the FBI, were you not aware that lying to FBI
investigators was a federal crime?
FLYNN: I was aware.
THE COURT: You were aware?
FLYNN: Yeah.

[Spendulus]

...

We all already knew that. I think, or I hope we all did. So now we really need to focus on the entrapment and the charge of "lying to the FBI." Because that's what real. If you want to call him a "convicted felon", then that's what you got. No more, no less.

If he finds away to reverse his guilty plea, do you think he should be off the hook for all the charges he avoided by taking the deal?  There seems to be enough evidence to go to trial.
[/quote]

I would imagine that in a reversed plea deal the dropped charges could be brought back up, if within the statute of limitations. Prosecutors would have to examine that and decide what to do.

It would be a new court case and a new trial.

[TwitchySeal]

...

We all already knew that. I think, or I hope we all did. So now we really need to focus on the entrapment and the charge of "lying to the FBI." Because that's what real. If you want to call him a "convicted felon", then that's what you got. No more, no less.

If he finds away to reverse his guilty plea, do you think he should be off the hook for all the charges he avoided by taking the deal?  There seems to be enough evidence to go to trial.

I would imagine that in a reversed plea deal the dropped charges could be brought back up, if within the statute of limitations. Prosecutors would have to examine that and decide what to do.

It would be a new court case and a new trial.
[/quote]

But he's already admitted he's guilty of several crimes he wasn't charged with.  

And even if he didn't, the 4 month late FARA filing was essentially admitting he didn't file within the 10 days required.  And it's easy to prove the FARA filing contained false statements.


The whole thing is just weird.  He wasn't charged with any of the serious crimes he admitted to, and he most likely wasn't going to get any time. He plead guilty bc he got a good deal.

It would be like if a cop pulled someone over for a DUI, the guy failed the breathalyzer, but decided to just give him a ticket for not wearing a seatbelt.  The guy says thank you, pays the fine and then goes to court to try and get the whole thing thrown out bc the cop was lying about his seatbelt.

[Spendulus]

...

We all already knew that. I think, or I hope we all did. So now we really need to focus on the entrapment and the charge of "lying to the FBI." Because that's what real. If you want to call him a "convicted felon", then that's what you got. No more, no less.

If he finds away to reverse his guilty plea, do you think he should be off the hook for all the charges he avoided by taking the deal?  There seems to be enough evidence to go to trial.

I would imagine that in a reversed plea deal the dropped charges could be brought back up, if within the statute of limitations. Prosecutors would have to examine that and decide what to do.

It would be a new court case and a new trial.

But he's already admitted he's guilty of several crimes he wasn't charged with.  

And even if he didn't, the 4 month late FARA filing was essentially admitting he didn't file within the 10 days required.  And it's easy to prove the FARA filing contained false statements.

The whole thing is just weird.  He wasn't charged with any of the serious crimes he admitted to, and he most likely wasn't going to get any time. He plead guilty bc he got a good deal.

It would be like if a cop pulled someone over for a DUI, the guy failed the breathalyzer, but decided to just give him a ticket for not wearing a seatbelt.  The guy says thank you, pays the fine and then goes to court to try and get the whole thing thrown out bc the cop was lying about his seatbelt.

This is the VERY DEFINITION of plea bargaining. If it's weird, it's weird hundreds of thousands of times per year. Virtually all prisons in the US are full then of people, usually of color, who have gone through this "weird" judicial process called plea bargaining.

Are you starting to "get it?"

Oh, and by the way, the cop that gave him a ticket for not wearing a seatbelt when he failed the breathalyzer? That cop should be fired, and the guy should have the case thrown out.

I would suggest read this summary of the recent events in the Flynn case, and then decide whether to continue to defend the prosecution of Flynn.

https://thefederalist.com/2020/04/27/robert-muellers-case-against-michael-flynn-is-about-to-implode/

[TwitchySeal]

...

We all already knew that. I think, or I hope we all did. So now we really need to focus on the entrapment and the charge of "lying to the FBI." Because that's what real. If you want to call him a "convicted felon", then that's what you got. No more, no less.

If he finds away to reverse his guilty plea, do you think he should be off the hook for all the charges he avoided by taking the deal?  There seems to be enough evidence to go to trial.

I would imagine that in a reversed plea deal the dropped charges could be brought back up, if within the statute of limitations. Prosecutors would have to examine that and decide what to do.

It would be a new court case and a new trial.

But he's already admitted he's guilty of several crimes he wasn't charged with.  

And even if he didn't, the 4 month late FARA filing was essentially admitting he didn't file within the 10 days required.  And it's easy to prove the FARA filing contained false statements.

The whole thing is just weird.  He wasn't charged with any of the serious crimes he admitted to, and he most likely wasn't going to get any time. He plead guilty bc he got a good deal.

It would be like if a cop pulled someone over for a DUI, the guy failed the breathalyzer, but decided to just give him a ticket for not wearing a seatbelt.  The guy says thank you, pays the fine and then goes to court to try and get the whole thing thrown out bc the cop was lying about his seatbelt.

This is the VERY DEFINITION of plea bargaining. If it's weird, it's weird hundreds of thousands of times per year. Virtually all prisons in the US are full then of people, usually of color, who have gone through this "weird" judicial process called plea bargaining.

Are you starting to "get it?"

Oh, and by the way, the cop that gave him a ticket for not wearing a seatbelt when he failed the breathalyzer? That cop should be fired, and the guy should have the case thrown out.

I feel like you're just looking for any possible way to rationalize to yourself that Flynn is a victim here.  He's not a poor minority with a shit public defender.  He's a retired 3 star general that's buddys with the president and he got a great deal considering he betrayed the country.  

I'm thinking he must be confident that they won't be able to charge him for any of the crimes we know he did.  I'm not sure how though.  It just wouldn't make sense for him to do what he's doing if he thought it were possible he'd be charged again.  The evidence is overwhelming even without the signed admission.  His only option would be to....plea to a lesser charge lol.

[Spendulus]

....I feel like you're just looking for any possible way to rationalize to yourself that Flynn is a victim here.  He's not a poor minority with a shit public defender.  He's a retired 3 star general that's buddys with the president and he got a great deal considering he betrayed the country.  

I'm thinking he must be confident that they won't be able to charge him for any of the crimes we know he did.  I'm not sure how though.  It just wouldn't make sense for him to do what he's doing if he thought it were possible he'd be charged again.  The evidence is overwhelming even without the signed admission.  His only option would be to....plea to a lesser charge lol.

Explaining to you the reality of plea bargaining is not rationalizing anything to myself.

You seem intent on getting people interested in what he WASN'T CHARGED WITH, which puzzles me.

There were some very, very wrong things going on on the Gov side in the items he was charged with, and if justice is to be served, those need to be corrected. Pretty much everyone acknowledges Flynn is a victim here, of improper actions by FBI administrators who have been fired for those exact actions. duh...

How much can you be blind to ?

[TwitchySeal]

....I feel like you're just looking for any possible way to rationalize to yourself that Flynn is a victim here.  He's not a poor minority with a shit public defender.  He's a retired 3 star general that's buddys with the president and he got a great deal considering he betrayed the country.  

I'm thinking he must be confident that they won't be able to charge him for any of the crimes we know he did.  I'm not sure how though.  It just wouldn't make sense for him to do what he's doing if he thought it were possible he'd be charged again.  The evidence is overwhelming even without the signed admission.  His only option would be to....plea to a lesser charge lol.

Explaining to you the reality of plea bargaining is not rationalizing anything to myself.

You seem intent on getting people interested in what he WASN'T CHARGED WITH, which puzzles me.

There were some very, very wrong things going on on the Gov side in the items he was charged with, and if justice is to be served, those need to be corrected. Pretty much everyone acknowledges Flynn is a victim here, of improper actions by FBI administrators who have been fired for those exact actions. duh...

How much can you be blind to ?

Incredible that you see it that way.

Imagine if Hunter Biden had been lobbying Democrats to push pro-ukraine policies and then it turned out he had secretly been getting paid by Ukraine and the rest played out similar to Flynn with the FBI.

Would you consider him a victim?  Of course not.  And your head would explode if he ended up walking away and declared 'fully exonerated' by the president.

The politics shouldn't matter when someone sells out their country.

[Spendulus]

...
Imagine if Hunter Biden ....

No, not interested in playing that game.

Are you through now bitching about things OTHER THAN what Flynn was charged and convicted of, with gross prosecutorial-side malfeasance?

If not, keep on posting about imaginary crimes.

How about we now talk about the hard copy evidence of the FBI planning and executing an entrapment of Flynn, with the stated purpose being to entrap him into a criminal charge of lying, not to find out the actual truth.

That's the operation you are defending. Let's see you defend it, instead of weaseling around, talking about Hunter, imaginary crimes, any and everything instead of the real shit you're in upto about waist level.

Go to it.

[TwitchySeal]

...
Imagine if Hunter Biden ....

No, not interested in playing that game.

Are you through now bitching about things OTHER THAN what Flynn was charged and convicted of, with gross prosecutorial side malfeasance?

Do you put any effort into being objective?

I mean, you can't really think it's not a big deal for someone powerful to act as a foreign agent without disclosing it...and lie about it when you get caught....can you?

Do you think this should be ok?

I think you know it's really fucked up but you just can't bring yourself to say something bad about the guy.

[Spendulus]

...
Imagine if Hunter Biden ....

No, not interested in playing that game.

Are you through now bitching about things OTHER THAN what Flynn was charged and convicted of, with gross prosecutorial side malfeasance?

Do you put any effort into being objective?

I mean, you can't really think it's not a big deal for someone powerful to act as a foreign agent without disclosing it...and lie about it when you get caught....can you?

Do you think this should be ok?

I think you know it's really fucked up but you just can't bring yourself to say something bad about the guy.

Let's look at one memo by those agents that framed Flynn. The hand scribbled memo says this,

“What’s our goal? Get him to lie so we can prosecute or get him fired?”

Have fun defending their actions. I know you would so much like to change the subject.

https://hannity.com/media-room/smoking-gun-see-the-disturbing-fbi-memo-on-flynn-whats-our-goal-get-him-to-lie-so-we-can-prosecute/

[TECSHARE]

Why would Flynn plead guilty to a crime he didn't commit?


"Attorney: Michael Flynn's plea was coerced by a threat to indict his son"

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/other/attorney-michael-flynns-plea-was-coerced-by-a-threat-to-indict-his-son/vp-BB13i3oO

(this is against official policy BTW)



A lawyer describes how he was railroaded in detail:

"General Flynn Versus the FBI! Lawyer Robert Barnes and Stefan Molyneux"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MoXCB1lx6aA

[Spendulus]

Why would Flynn plead guilty to a crime he didn't commit?


"Attorney: Michael Flynn's plea was coerced by a threat to indict his son"

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/other/attorney-michael-flynns-plea-was-coerced-by-a-threat-to-indict-his-son/vp-BB13i3oO

(this is against official policy BTW)



A lawyer describes how he was railroaded in detail:

"General Flynn Versus the FBI! Lawyer Robert Barnes and Stefan Molyneux"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MoXCB1lx6aA

Just my opinion, but for "plea bargaining" to have any shred of justice, it would be necessary for the crime that the defendant plead guilty to , to have been one he actually did and was guilty of.

Made up crimes and process technicalities occurring during the course of an investigation cannot possibly qualify.

So to answer Twitchy's earlier comments, had Flynn pled guilty to an actual crime that he'd actually committed, that would be different than if he pled guilty to lying in an interview for which those who interviewed him said he was being truthful, and for which their managers had schemed to entrap him, and which for those specific actions have been fired from the FBI.

Of course even in this case, for the "charge of lying to the FBI", for that to have been fair, we'd need to see that the victim (Yes, Flynn) was advised of his Miranda rights and told he had the right to an attorney present.

[TwitchySeal]

Why would Flynn plead guilty to a crime he didn't commit?

To avoid being charged for the more serious crimes he did commit.

[Spendulus]

Why would Flynn plead guilty to a crime he didn't commit?

To avoid being charged for the more serious crimes he did commit.

Or because that's the deal they offered him? I think that's much more likely. They would like to proceed with a "crime" that they had total control over from when they first dreamed it up and set up the trap, to when they recorded it, and then later prosecuted it.

There could have been serious deficiencies in the other things, that would have made the outcome uncertain if they were brought to trial. You have suggested ONE possibility.

Ultimately, you just have to deal with your own conscious in the matter of believing it's Good and Right that someone pleads guilty of something they were innocent of.

But after all, given that it was a rigged, setup scam of entrapment, why wouldn't you defend it?

[TECSHARE]

Why would Flynn plead guilty to a crime he didn't commit?

To avoid being charged for the more serious crimes he did commit.

Present the evidence to back this assertion.