Who exactly told theymos to change the threshold to 250 cycled merits?

[mikeywith]

Thanks for the list sm.

was i just called a "Loser"    ?

Let's see what cryptohunter thinks about the list and whether he thinks the "suggested" list could end the DT drama or not.

[1714816145]

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[1714816145]

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[suchmoon]

Thanks for the list sm.

was i just called a "Loser"    ?

You're in good company though

Let's see what cryptohunter thinks about the list and whether he thinks the "suggested" list could end the DT drama or not.

There isn't much DT drama anymore... mostly just CH drama. The buses-bicycles "coup" didn't work so here is a new diversion approaching "election" day.

[bones261]

so your proposal will exclude  45 members ( including me   ) ,  but do you really think that these 45 votes are the issue ?

suchmoon i don't want to be greedy with my "wants" but can you put a list of those who won't be able to "vote" if cryptohunter's proposal is applied ?

It's not ~45 users losing the right to vote. ~100 users would lose the right to vote and ~55 users would gain it. The lists below is not 100% accurate because my merit data is ~2 weeks old but it should give you a good enough approximation of the impact.

      The good news for me is that I would gain my vote again by the April vote, unless I stopped posting. The 2000 activity limit would take a while though... What I find a bit odd is that none of these criteria would exclude Lauda unless theymos put her on the blacklist. Isn't Lauda one of the main targets for cryptohunter?

[suchmoon]

The good news for me is that I would gain my vote again by the April vote, unless I stopped posting. The 2000 activity limit would take a while though... What I find a bit odd is that none of these criteria would exclude Lauda unless theymos put her on the blacklist. Isn't Lauda one of the main targets for cryptohunter?

You might be confusing CH with someone who can do math or logic

[bones261]

The good news for me is that I would gain my vote again by the April vote, unless I stopped posting. The 2000 activity limit would take a while though... What I find a bit odd is that none of these criteria would exclude Lauda unless theymos put her on the blacklist. Isn't Lauda one of the main targets for cryptohunter?

You might be confusing CH with someone who can do math or logic

TBH, I usually don't get past the 1st sentence on most of CH's posts. Therefore, it's a challenge to do a complete analysis of the logic.  

[LoyceV]

~100 users would lose the right to vote and ~55 users would gain it.

In other words: further centralizing the DT-system to a group of old users, excluding new contributors.

I'm working on a topic with different DT1-scenarios, for which I'll create a Rankup pipeline.
So far, I'll include:
250+ Merit and minimum Activity 1500
100+ Merit instead of 250+, and still minimum Activity 1500

I'd like to add some more scenarios, to show the consequences of certain choices.
Please add scenarios to the list!

[suchmoon]

Please add scenarios to the list!

Do it with 2000 activity too... because that's what CH is really aiming for. 1500 leaves too many merit recyclers in the list because they obviously registered back in 2013-2015 like a sleeper cell and patiently waited 4-5 years for theymos to implement merits so that they could take over the forum.

[cryptohunter]

There is no drama there is rather serious and sensible concern that
a/ DT key positions are held by those that are observably untrustworthy and abusing their power
b/ nothing is done to remove them nor undo the damage they are doing
c/ Red trust is being used to silence and discredit those bringing forth facts and observable events demonstrating clear wrong dong by DT key position holders.

So far I...

1. I see no rebuttal or even an attempt at once concerning my assertion that reducing the merit requirement and increasing the activity to 1500 or 2000 would be more useful. This is for the key positions only not for who can be on DT after all.

It is possible and is clearly observable that merit is cycled to those familiar with each other and often for political reasons and just general shitposts. Basically any excuse to empower those that will willingly collude and gang together pushing the same agenda. Merit is useful at stopping account farming ONLY it becomes very damaging to use it for anything else or by trying to attribute any other meaning to a MEANINGLESS (as suchmoon described it) score.  

Visit my thread of the year and try to understand just how dangerous the merit system is and MORE SO now that it has been turned into the TRUST system too. Nobody has refuted this in that thread because it is not possible to refute the dangers of such a system. It is wide open to and actually encourages people to abuse it for self interest.

If you wish to debate that then go to that thread and do so. Not here.

That thread serves as a prime example as to why merit in its current form is damaging misleading and political junk.
My posts especially the latter ones there are a clear and accurate description of how open the systems are to abuse and how they even set clear and selfish motives for that abuse. Yet there is no merit given and a post that makes a faux and empty rebuttal is given merit purely on political grounds because it suits those meriting for that to be seen as the most merit worthy post. There was nothing wrong with that post essentially on that it did not make the refutation that those meriting wanted to make out that it did. As I later pointed out clearly.

So merit score = unreliable at best and misleading and dangerous at worst. It means fuck all to do with trust and mostly noobs here observably asskissing and grovelling for merits and becoming self made ALREADY SPAMMING THEIR GAMBLING AND SIGS EVERYWHERE are only here to power up for high paid spamming slots.

Activity is NOT gameable in that it takes a minimum amount of time to replace a 2000 activity account. Once it is lost due to abuse or  black listed from a position of trust you will not be powering that up again for many years. Hence the incentive to act sensibly within the guidelines or framework that Theymos has set. Trust abusers can look forward to 5 years work to power up another alt to get back into the trust system.

Merit can be recycled very quickly I notice the lauda atrix 50 swap of merits (was that deleted by theymos like my 10 merits was for my post which was deserving of merit in its own right when theirs looks like a piece of advertising crap).

It is the prevention of collusion you want in a decentralised system. We can see the members that would hold the key positions in the trust system if we went with 100 earned merit and 1500 have less observable "pal connections" and there is no way to encourage new ass kissers and acoyltes and power them up to bolster your position in DT as there are now.

The only reason to have 250 earned (cycled) merits is to ensure the entrenchment of merit cyclers in the key positions of DT.

I would like to see one real debate over the advantages of 250 cycled merits over 100 merits +1500 activity. This is for key positions this does not mean the only people that can be on DT does it anyway.

However having the same political group who cycle merits to each other having the key positions in trust is a simply a FAKE decentralised system compared to what would be possible.

I would also say anyone that has EVER done anything clearly untrustworthy or that demonstrates extreme financial greed and no thought to effects on the forum for that should be auto black listed by a higher authority. If someone can tell me why that should not happen is welcome to explain.

Suchmoon of course as well as being an observable moron and the sort of imbecile that debunks her own arguments or ends up screaming out ludicrous statements to cling on to an observable pile of shit to substantiate her insane views  is also a willing and staunched supporter of those that have been PROVEN to be untrustworthy and greedy. I can not take anything she says seriously now.

I see some persons here that are not going to qualify for the 1500 activity threshold that are actually trying to help and also not spamming sigs everywhere for gambing and other crap those can still go on DT they will just not hold the key positions.

TLDR = KEY POSITIONS SHOULD BE 100 MERITS + 1500 ACTIVITY TO PREVENT OBVIOUS COLLUSION AND CREATE SOME REAL ATTEMPT AT A DECENTRALISED SYSTEM. I would even consider 50 merits and 1500 activity far superior to what we have now if you care about preventing collusion and ensuring free speech is not crushed here.

You can always take qwks view = the trush is not important and that wrongly placed red trust is helpful since it makes persons more wary of trading in general. If that is the case just make a bot that just goes around splattering people with red trust and make sure you hit those with the most green trust more often.

On the other hand theymos could say

I will black list any trust abusing scum bag that red trusts someone that is not a scammer or strongly likely to scam. Then it would not matter too much who was in DT. Even so 1500 activity could be useful so they simply don't return and do it again soon after.  Time to regain the power that was taken away is key.

Lauda is but a symptom of the problem as are the other trust abusers who have a dark history here. A trust system that works does not have these people in the key positions.

[suchmoon]

For anyone who values their sanity: don't click "Show/Hide".

CH is basically whining about not receiving merits in this thread while other users did, therefore merit system is bad and 250-merit requirement is bad, whereas 2000 activity is good. You've probably heard that before.

[cryptohunter]

For anyone who values their sanity: don't click "Show/Hide".

CH is basically whining about not receiving merits in this thread while other users did, therefore merit system is bad and 250-merit requirement is bad, whereas 2000 activity is good. You've probably heard that before.

Suchmoon is basically trying to stop you reading the FACTs contained within the post. Not that these are even the important facts just demonstrate what a double standards scum bag this person is. I have seen suchmoon red trust people for supporting a "POSSIBLE" scam. What a double standards scum bag. Then tells me good poster bad poster is a meaningless term without strict criteria and definition whilst arguing for the validity of merit score and indication of valuable poster. What an imbecile that snitchy bitch is.

1. suchmoon cycles merit to

a/ proven liars
b/ proven trust abusers
c/ proven greedy sneaky sock puppet racist troll sig spammers.

2. Suchmoon includes on her trust list

a/ proven liars
b/ proven trust abusers
c/ proven greedy sneaky sock puppet racist troll sig spammers.

3. Suchmoon excludes the same persons in her DT lists as

a/ proven liars
b/ proven trust abusers
c/ proven greedy sneaky sock puppet racist troll sig spammers.

4. Suchmoon has said that the merit system and it score is MEANINGLESS but wants to continue basing key positions of trust on that MEANINGLESS score.

In short ignore everything this observable imbecile suchmoron "claims" if you want any hope of finding the truth on any matter.

Anyone who wants to refute these facts then feel free to do so or you can bring a case for keeping it at 250 earned cycled merits over 100 merits +1500 activity.

Glad suchmoron read the entire post and selects out as it usually does misses the key points of the post.

Back on topic.

1. prevents obvious collusion and groups becoming entrenched
2. more incentive to act honestly because
a/ harder to replace blacklisted account will take years
b/ more likely already wealthy so lack of need for scam bucks
3/ more history to analyse and see if one they look trustworthy or have a reason to black list them from the start.


250 earned merits has zero advantage over 100 merits +1500 activity only to give a tight knit group control over trust and merit and free speech. Broken and damaging and dangerous.

[bones261]

For anyone who values their sanity: don't click "Show/Hide".

CH is basically whining about not receiving merits in this thread while other users did, therefore merit system is bad and 250-merit requirement is bad, whereas 2000 activity is good. You've probably heard that before.

CH should just go to the WO thread, request a hat avatar, and post rocket memes. He'll have 250+ merits in no time. It's really not that hard. 

[cryptohunter]

For anyone who values their sanity: don't click "Show/Hide".

CH is basically whining about not receiving merits in this thread while other users did, therefore merit system is bad and 250-merit requirement is bad, whereas 2000 activity is good. You've probably heard that before.

CH should just go to the WO thread, request a hat avatar, and post rocket memes. He'll have 250+ merits in no time. It's really not that hard.  

However, I have already said I will willingly be blacklisted from BOTH systems of control merit source and DT so i have no need of gaining 250 merits if we can swap it to a REAL decentralised approach.

[suchmoon]

CH, I can't stop anyone, I'm just advising people who already have you on ignore to not waste their time on your wall of text.

I still don't know what "key positions" are, sounds kinky but not quite sure how it relates to DT.

CH should just go to the WO thread, request a hat avatar, and post rocket memes. He'll have 250+ merits in no time. It's really not that hard.  

CH is more of a verbal person, memes are too much work.

[bones261]

CH should just go to the WO thread, request a hat avatar, and post rocket memes. He'll have 250+ merits in no time. It's really not that hard.  

CH is more of a verbal person, memes are too much work.

So is JayJuanGee... and he has 600+ merits. He can even troll people in that thread and have a good chance of racking up the merit.

However, I have already said I will willingly be blacklisted from BOTH systems of control merit source and DT so i have no need of gaining 250 merits if we can swap it to a REAL decentralised approach.

The WO thread is a decentralized approach.  Virtually anyone can rack up the merits there, although the supply has been drying up lately. Bulls and Bitcoin maximalists do have an easier time. But hey, this is bitcointalk after all.

[cryptohunter]

CH, I can't stop anyone, I'm just advising people who already have you on ignore to not waste their time on your wall of text.

I still don't know what "key positions" are, sounds kinky but not quite sure how it relates to DT.

CH should just go to the WO thread, request a hat avatar, and post rocket memes. He'll have 250+ merits in no time. It's really not that hard.  

CH is more of a verbal person, memes are too much work.

LOL first suchmoon begs moderators to DELETE my posts containing on topic relevant facts that demonstrate she supports proven liars, trust abusers and greedy sneaky racist trolling sock puppet sig spammers

Now she just tells people DONT READ the truth about her.

Now, please just get back to snitching on minor shit and playing whack a mole so you feel you have achieved something here in this community. Or lying trying to get people banned for doxing you then saying that was not even a dox and that name/address is nothing related to you at all.

Now stick on topic and stop derailing else I will request your derailing trash is deleted from my thread.

Present a case for the 250 earned merits vs 100 merits + 1500 activity or shut up.


@Bones

are you now claiming that I am a troll? If so present the incorrect and trolling posts in a thread claiming they are are trolling and I'll see you there.

Start with the thread of the year trolling thread because i can't get people to that thread even after they chime in then run off

Or perhaps the let's define net positive and valuable posts

Or well ANY thread I have started in meta. Just bring it here and list it under is cryptohunter a troll and we can break down the posts and see if it is trolling or if it is presentation of facts and observable events and an attempt to make this board a fairer and better place for all members.

Or ANY of the merit cycling threads I started that have demonstrated meta is just a place to slather each other up with merit lube before verbally masturbating all over each other how great we all are for giving all this merit to each other... often for just making graphs and stats about all the merit we have LOL

When I look at the snitchy bitchy crap suchmoon posts in reply to a lot of people and also the LACK of original content /suggestions that actually would make ANY difference to the board in a big way then I realise that she is just a big bag of wasted merit.

So nothing of note ever achieved here except whack a mole and snitching on minor shit and supporting proven untrustworthy scum and accused of actual scamming herself in the past. = yeah excellent member suchmoon.

I am pushing for a fairer board for everyone with NO SCAMMERS in DT whilst suchmoon admits merit is meaningless but want to use it as a method of control over the board because it suits her and the other proven untrustworthy scum to maintain positions of power for selfish gain and silence free speech.

[DIKUL]

Please add scenarios to the list!

One more scenario of toughening of selection:
- 5 users having on 250+ merits
- 10 users having on 100+ merits

[Jet Cash]

When I visit this thread, I can never tell if I am on page 1, 2 or 3. I vote that it is time for a hard fork, or for the adoption of NewWit.

[suchmoon]

When I visit this thread, I can never tell if I am on page 1, 2 or 3. I vote that it is time for a hard fork, or for the adoption of NewWit.

We already have a DimWit for an OP, does that count?

Ok, I'll humor you. What are "key positions"?

[bones261]

@Bones

are you now claiming that I am a troll? If so present the incorrect and trolling posts in a thread claiming they are are trolling and I'll see you there.

Start with the thread of the year trolling thread because i can't get people to that thread even after they chime in then run off

Or perhaps the let's define net positive and valuable posts

Or well ANY thread I have started in meta. Just bring it here and list it under is cryptohunter a troll and we can break down the posts and see if it is trolling or if it is presentation of facts and observable events and an attempt to make this board a fairer and better place for all members.

When I look at the snitchy bitchy crap suchmoon posts in reply to a lot of people and also the LACK of original content /suggestions that actually would make ANY difference to the board in a big way then I realise that she is just a big bag of wasted merit.

So nothing of note ever achieved here and supporting proven untrustworthy scum and accused of actual scamming herself in the past. = yeah excellent member suchmoon.

Oh please, you are prone to calling people names. That is a form of trolling. In fact most people on this forum are prone to being a troll from time to time. If you are looking for honeypots of merit where people are posting net positive and valuable posts, just head over to Development & Technical Discussion or Bitcoin Technical Support.
Also, if someone has some collectables to sell, the Collectibles board can help someone rack up the merit. There are probably other merit honeypots outside of meta and reputation that I am missing. The merit system is much more decentralized than you seem to think. There are 122 merit sources and they are not exclusively distributing their merit here. Theymos should consider enlisting some more notables in the altcoin community to become merit sources since the altcoin boards do seem to lack some love at the moment.

[virendarnagpal]

Change is the part of life.  We observe several changes whether these are favorable or unfavorable and we have to accept willingly or unwillingly.  
The small point I want to add is that using bad abusive words for any other member should be banned.
I see most of the people are very intelligent here in debate like this.  If we can add soft words to our intelligent debate it will look very nice.