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Author Topic: [BCN] Bytecoin. Secure, private, untraceable since 2012  (Read 1070029 times)
tersagun
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May 22, 2014, 01:31:28 PM
 #1521

Minergate is not crediting users for shares atm. If they don't respond within 24 hours, we can safely call them a scam.

They are having some problems with the coins recently but I've never lost a share on my humble BCN mining except late confirmations. My withdraw happened instantly.
That doesn't mean work flawless for everyone though.
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May 22, 2014, 01:42:33 PM
 #1522

Minergate is not crediting users for shares atm. If they don't respond within 24 hours, we can safely call them a scam.

Your funny bro
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May 22, 2014, 01:58:46 PM
 #1523

Yes, I am aware this is the claimed goal. This was also the claimed goal for litecoin— and unlike the cryptonote paper litecoin used a publicly known, peer reviewed algorithm. Litecoin failed in this goal because it is simply not really possible to achieve. You should go read the nice writeup I linked to.   The cryptonight stuff is _less_ well reviewed and justified than the approach taken in litecoin.  It's also insanely slow to verify, which is debilitating to many applications (including just syncing up a node).

Certainly, as you say, you can increase the upfront costs... and that might delay things a bit while the cryptocurrency is worthless. But higher upfront costs will almost guarantee a monopoly to someone who does go and create something (and, in fact, cpu only right now basically means an intel and amd duopoly— you realize that the marginal cost of a chip to someone with the right contracts with Intel is a tiny fraction of the retail price, right?), less competition in the hardware space is a risk, not an advantage. And, of course, litecoin asics have higher NRE and so there is less competition in that space. Making that worse seems unlikely to be an advantage.

Here are some quotes from the document that you've cited: https://download.wpsoftware.net/bitcoin/asic-faq.pdf

Quote
3. Is ASIC resistance possible?
ASIC resistance, in the sense of making life difficult for ASIC manufacturers (and therefore reducing the number of distinct manufacturers) is possible. But it is impossible to create an algorithm which runs at the same speed on general-purpose and dedicated hardware (since general-purpose hardware contains many extraneous features, e.g. communication buses for peripherals), and so ultimately ASIC resistance is futile.

This is true, however we're talking about the costs required to create an AISC, which would be as multi-purpose as CPU.

By the way, Ethereum's authors are working in the same direction, as their function will perform random scripts from the block chain. Since those algorithms are likely to be arbitrary (Turing complete language), the interpreter should also be multi-purpose.

Quote
4. Is memory hardness desirable?

As an aside, since memory is far away and expensive to access on general purpose computers, memory hardness actually increases the benefit provided by ASIC’s!

Our initial idea is that the main advantage of the ASICs is piplining. Since SHA-256 doesn't require more memory that the data processed in the gate (256 bits), it is possible to run different parts of the algorithm on the same circuit. On the other hand, our algo requires 2 MB to process the data. Moreover, it processes not everything at once, but random 64-bit parts, so it takes time for them to be transferred. This makes piplines impossible as it would require 2 MB on-chip memory per each line. 2 MBs is indeed much for the ASIC, since on-chip memory is more expensive than dram (the link you've provided also suggests this). In case someone decides to go with dram, the additional costs will grow because of the memory controllers. In a nutshell, CryptoNight makes CPU a suitable and convenient tool.

I wouldn't like to argue whether it is possible to create an ideal PoW function. Our main idea was to push the economic barrier for the ASICs to a significant distance.
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May 22, 2014, 02:00:21 PM
 #1524

Anyone else having trouble with bytecoind on Mac? It worked 2 days ago when I last synced. Now it fails and logs out. Tried downloading the new binaries, no luck.

Edit:

Here's what terminal says when i launch the daemon:

2014-May-21 17:27:02.835776 Attempting to add IGD port mapping.
2014-May-21 17:27:03.985759 ERROR /Users/user/jenkins/workspace/Bytecoin - MacOS/src/p2p/net_node.inl:255 UPNP_AddPortMapping failed.
2014-May-21 17:27:03.985898 P2p server initialized OK
2014-May-21 17:27:03.985954 Initializing cryptonote protocol...
2014-May-21 17:27:03.986024 Cryptonote protocol initialized OK
2014-May-21 17:27:03.986084 Initializing core rpc server...
2014-May-21 17:27:03.986161 Binding on 127.0.0.1:8081
2014-May-21 17:27:03.986322 Core rpc server initialized OK on port: 8081
2014-May-21 17:27:03.986396 Initializing core...
2014-May-21 17:27:03.986751 ERROR /Users/user/jenkins/workspace/Bytecoin - MacOS/src/common/boost_serialization_helper.h:82 Exception at [unserialize_obj_from_file], what=invalid signature
2014-May-21 17:27:03.986854 Failed to load memory pool from file /Users/stereosympathy/.bytecoin/poolstate.bin
2014-May-21 17:27:03.986909 ERROR /Users/user/jenkins/workspace/Bytecoin - MacOS/src/cryptonote_core/cryptonote_core.cpp:116 Failed to initialize memory pool
2014-May-21 17:27:03.986974 ERROR /Users/user/jenkins/workspace/Bytecoin - MacOS/src/daemon/daemon.cpp:164 Failed to initialize core

2014-May-21 17:27:03.987846 Mining has been stopped, 0 finished
logout

[Process completed]


You need to delete poolstate.bin file

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May 22, 2014, 03:03:03 PM
 #1525

For those who don't want to wait for a long time till "synchronized ok"

Windows bundle https://mega.co.nz/#!cBwDEQYB!SaJIPKtQFo4MiUBnYBOQhQF1t7VCp10Knd_tM3s306E
Windows blockchain https://mega.co.nz/#!hY53QYgD!h2YRgIUWoexadm9eJpbFPxSbU96nQeQEmotw4XZx--k
Mac blockchain https://mega.co.nz/#!YApFWKwL!_ChctvcJOmqWfIeOhvkQkxLGmr5pdwL6j5IF6IkkJHs
Linux blockchain https://mega.co.nz/#!BRQCzSRB!bEkNC_EhH5bg0KEtFhXKdalDPGyHrOi0Bv7N2orz30Y

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May 22, 2014, 03:03:45 PM
Last edit: May 22, 2014, 03:14:09 PM by Wanesst
 #1526

New translations!


Thanks!

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May 22, 2014, 03:20:28 PM
 #1527

Moreover, it processes not everything at once, but random 64-bit parts, so it takes time for them to be transferred. This makes piplines impossible as it would require 2 MB on-chip memory per each line. 2 MBs is indeed much for the ASIC, since on-chip memory is more expensive than dram (the link you've provided also suggests this). In case someone decides to go with dram, the additional costs will grow because of the memory controllers.
For silicon fabricated on modern process (e.g. 45nm or better) the power costs typically exceed the marginal manufacturing costs within a few weeks of operation. In long running computations the hardware costs are amortized. Making changes which _decrease_ the power density of the algorithm may have the opposite of the intended effect.  The end result may be a greater operating cost advantage when hardware does exist applied on top of a monopoly created by the increased NRE for the more complex part.

Quote
By the way, Ethereum's authors are working in the same direction, as their function will perform random scripts from the block chain.
Yes, and quite likely thoroughly ruin approximation freeness along the way, without at all precluding substantial speedups from specialized hardware even ignoring the approximations. Keep in mind that mining is perfect competition, a mere factor of 2 advantage can easily drive everyone else out of business... and simply eliminating unnecessary IO and support electronics can result in gains larger than that.

Quote
I wouldn't like to argue whether it is possible to create an ideal PoW function. Our main idea was to push the economic barrier for the ASICs to a significant distance.
The authors of litecoin (and tenebrix) made an identical claim and they had more peer review to back their claims and it turned out to be substantially untrue.  They've also found their POW's verification slowness to be problematic, and yet it verifies orders of magnitude faster than the cryptonight function.

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May 22, 2014, 03:44:48 PM
 #1528

One more update is already here : even more optimized binaries are at official Bytecoin site https://bytecoin.org/ now

Windows https://bytecoin.org/download-windows-bin.php
Linux https://bytecoin.org/download-linux-bin.php
Mac OS https://bytecoin.org/download-mac-bin.php


Up-to-date hash optimization (from the community) and improvements in JSON RPC are included.

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May 22, 2014, 03:45:12 PM
 #1529

How is Bytecoin different from Monero?

 
                                . ██████████.
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DStrange (OP)
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May 22, 2014, 03:45:47 PM
 #1530

How is Bytecoin different from Monero?

Monero is BCN fork  Wink

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May 22, 2014, 04:42:47 PM
 #1531

How is Bytecoin different from Monero?

Monero is BCN fork  Wink

Without 80% premine Wink Wink
DStrange (OP)
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May 22, 2014, 04:55:11 PM
 #1532

How is Bytecoin different from Monero?

Monero is BCN fork  Wink

Without 80% premine Wink Wink

With name uncertainty (BMR or MRO?), instamine incident and strange developing team that kicked off main developer for no reason.
Let's stop here, ok? I think nobody is interested in such things anymore.

Monero has flatter emission curve and 60 sec block time (120 for BCN). That's all differences.

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May 22, 2014, 04:55:54 PM
 #1533

How is Bytecoin different from Monero?

Monero is BCN fork  Wink

Without 80% premine Wink Wink

Congratulations! We have new annoying guy here.
You are invited into "International Smooth's Annoying Team". All members of this perfect team can post helpful info about premine several times a day. Great achievement in my view =)
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May 22, 2014, 05:06:53 PM
 #1534

How is Bytecoin different from Monero?

Monero is BCN fork  Wink

Without 80% premine Wink Wink

Congratulations! We have new annoying guy here.
You are invited into "International Smooth's Annoying Team". All members of this perfect team can post helpful info about premine several times a day. Great achievement in my view =)

How many coins have been mined ?

 
                                . ██████████.
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       .██████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████.
       ..████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████..
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matej krkic
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May 22, 2014, 05:12:29 PM
 #1535

How is Bytecoin different from Monero?

Monero is BCN fork  Wink

Without 80% premine Wink Wink

Congratulations! We have new annoying guy here.
You are invited into "International Smooth's Annoying Team". All members of this perfect team can post helpful info about premine several times a day. Great achievement in my view =)

How many coins have been mined ?


You can use blockexplorer: https://minergate.com/blockchain/bcn/blocks
154 billions
FrictionlessCoin
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May 22, 2014, 05:16:44 PM
 #1536

How is Bytecoin different from Monero?

Monero is BCN fork  Wink

Without 80% premine Wink Wink

Congratulations! We have new annoying guy here.
You are invited into "International Smooth's Annoying Team". All members of this perfect team can post helpful info about premine several times a day. Great achievement in my view =)

How many coins have been mined ?


You can use blockexplorer: https://minergate.com/blockchain/bcn/blocks
154 billions

Does Monero have same mint rates at Bytecoin?

 
                                . ██████████.
                              .████████████████.
                           .██████████████████████.
                        -█████████████████████████████
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       .██████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████.
       ..████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████..
       .   .██████████████████████████████████████████████████████.
       .      .████████████████████████████████████████████████.

       .       .██████████████████████████████████████████████
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tersagun
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May 22, 2014, 06:30:57 PM
 #1537

BTW, do you guys prefer minerd or simpleminer?
I've got several minerd versions but apparently, at least on my Phenom, minerd underperforms simpleminer. (I had better results with minerd compared to simpleminer with my i5).
smooth
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May 22, 2014, 06:35:57 PM
 #1538

How is Bytecoin different from Monero?

Monero is BCN fork  Wink

Without 80% premine Wink Wink

Congratulations! We have new annoying guy here.
You are invited into "International Smooth's Annoying Team". All members of this perfect team can post helpful info about premine several times a day. Great achievement in my view =)

How many coins have been mined ?


You can use blockexplorer: https://minergate.com/blockchain/bcn/blocks
154 billions

Does Monero have same mint rates at Bytecoin?

No they are completely different. Currently MRO mints a little under 17 coins every minute and BCN mints a little under 120000 coins every two minutes.

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May 22, 2014, 07:36:50 PM
 #1539

One more update is already here : even more optimized binaries are at official Bytecoin site https://bytecoin.org/ now

Windows https://bytecoin.org/download-windows-bin.php
Linux https://bytecoin.org/download-linux-bin.php
Mac OS https://bytecoin.org/download-mac-bin.php


Up-to-date hash optimization (from the community) and improvements in JSON RPC are included.

Is there any difference compare the yesterday's version? The version is the same like yesterday v. 0.8.9.65<>.   

I like Bytecoin (BCN). BYTECOIN.ORG the best to mine with MinerGate
DStrange (OP)
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May 22, 2014, 07:50:08 PM
 #1540

One more update is already here : even more optimized binaries are at official Bytecoin site https://bytecoin.org/ now

Windows https://bytecoin.org/download-windows-bin.php
Linux https://bytecoin.org/download-linux-bin.php
Mac OS https://bytecoin.org/download-mac-bin.php


Up-to-date hash optimization (from the community) and improvements in JSON RPC are included.

Is there any difference compare the yesterday's version? The version is the same like yesterday v. 0.8.9.65<>.   

I received the letter from BCN devs. It said new binaries have faster hash function than yesterday's ones.

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