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Nefario
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April 06, 2012, 04:38:37 AM
 #221


So for the bonding, a listed asset on GLBSE basically borrows money from investors and saves a portion of that to pay them back in case the asset creator fails?

I think nefario should request some personal verification from all people listing assets on GLBSE or use some third-party verifier.

Bonding?


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stochastic
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April 06, 2012, 04:41:52 AM
 #222

So for the bonding, a listed asset on GLBSE basically borrows money from investors and saves a portion of that to pay them back in case the asset creator fails?

The thought is that it wouldn't be invested funds used for the bond, but profits from operations.  I will "give it a rest" as Nefario has requested and stop responding to questions on this thread.

For a bond the only time I put up a bond was with my own cash as I never borrow money, but I am sure other people and companies cannot afford that.  I assume that the owners of companies that borrow money that is needed not only for the loan to open the company but also on the bond have to put up some kind of collateral.

I don't know how it would work with GLBSE but anything that gives some protection to shareholders, but I prefer a prediction market for asset failures more.

Introducing constraints to the economy only serves to limit what can be economical.
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April 06, 2012, 04:45:13 AM
 #223

We'll be adding a prediction market, that  in and of itself is an excellent idea that has much merrit.

We are slowing adding measures to help reduce risk of fraud. We'll only find out in time which ones are most effective(without killing the market).

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The00Dustin
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April 06, 2012, 01:10:54 PM
 #224

Should TyGrr Tech hold 50% of income to invest in future hardware?   

Yea votes: 399

Nay votes: 73


Should TyGrr Tech create and sell 150 new shares at 3BTC each to raise capital for either FPGAs or 7990s. Second vote to be had later if this one is successful.


Yea votes: 430

Nay votes: 55


Looks like both have passed. I will start holding 50% of the dividends and I will start selling the 150 new shares ate 3BTC each.

If you would like to help fund the expansion please buy these directly from me. You will send me the BTC and then I will transfer them into your account.

Thank you.
Did these new shares end up selling?  I thought they were listed on GLBSE prior to the freeze, and they don't appear to be listed there anymore.  Thought I'd mention it in case the order was cancelled (intentionally or otherwise) during (or after) the freeze.
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April 06, 2012, 05:45:49 PM
 #225

well, thanks. the share price is totally fucked up.

i spend 60+ btc in this venture, if i would liquidate now, i would have lost at least 60% of it.
.. and please don't tell me its shit-money and not worth it. its a big part of all my savings Sad im studying, no time to work, im living from about 220 bitcoin/month, so this is pretty serious to me.

dividends have been nice so far, but it frightens me very much, to see A) such discussion B) that shareprice C) evermore strange projects from goat (tygrrbank, tygrr bot) whcih don't really add confidence to me..

about kluge.. i don't know what it is about him and goat, but if there is something like inside-trading that would be an serious act of defraud on every shareholder, and therefore must be persecuted.

whatever, i don't know. as long as there are dividends, i don't really worry, but if there arent any anymore.. well..

you frightened me Sad

vampire
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April 06, 2012, 08:34:05 PM
 #226

To the above poster:

This isnt a regulated industry, glbse isn't licensed by any gov to my knowledge. So insider trading would be expected.
Kluge
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April 06, 2012, 09:31:37 PM
 #227

To the above poster:

This isnt a regulated industry, glbse isn't licensed by any gov to my knowledge. So insider trading would be expected.
As far as insider trading, I did have knowledge of how the ID situation was progressing as I was directly involved. I did give public notice the situation was going to be resolved very soon - that was about an hour or two before I actually bought the bonds. I'm fairly sure I haven't acted on any privileged information outside of that, and don't believe I've ever knowingly acted to decrease the value of TyGrr* stocks (though I did note to Goat I wasn't very worried about the value of TyGrr-Bank declining because I was interested in cheap aftermarket bonds - though it's probably worth noting that was after the ID fiasco was resolved).

Don't mix your coins someone said isn't legal
stochastic
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April 06, 2012, 09:51:15 PM
 #228

To the above poster:

This isnt a regulated industry, glbse isn't licensed by any gov to my knowledge. So insider trading would be expected.
As far as insider trading, I did have knowledge of how the ID situation was progressing as I was directly involved. I did give public notice the situation was going to be resolved very soon - that was about an hour or two before I actually bought the bonds.

I think the problem is that you could have been 99% sure that the ID situation was going to be resolved but everyone else could not be that sure as your projection of the resolution was not backed by anything.  You were able to trade on that knowledge as you were directly involved in the mediation but other people did not have that knowledge and thus perceived more risk.  It would probably have been better if you stated that you would not trade for a week after the mediation was completed.  I do appreciate you taking the time to resolve the issue though.  I think you did well in stating you had an interest in getting the dispute between nefario and goat resolved, but I think you could have done a little better in the post-mediation time in purchasing shares or bonds right after the dispute was resolved.

Except for market making opportunities, I have decided to stay out of any contracts on GLBSE in the long term that don't confirm the ID of any of the asset issuers on GLBSE, like Garr has completed.

Introducing constraints to the economy only serves to limit what can be economical.
HorseRider
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April 07, 2012, 03:25:28 AM
 #229


Except for market making opportunities, I have decided to stay out of any contracts on GLBSE in the long term that don't confirm the ID of any of the asset issuers on GLBSE.


+1

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brendio
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April 07, 2012, 06:08:49 AM
 #230

well, thanks. the share price is totally fucked up.

i spend 60+ btc in this venture, if i would liquidate now, i would have lost at least 60% of it.
.. and please don't tell me its shit-money and not worth it. its a big part of all my savings Sad im studying, no time to work, im living from about 220 bitcoin/month, so this is pretty serious to me.

The problem with valuation is that there is an inverse relationship to the exchange rate. At start up, TyGrr had ca. $15,000 worth of equipment and issued 1500 shares, meaning each share was backed by $10 worth of hardware. When the exchange rate was around $3, each share was backed by about 3 BTC worth of assets. Now that the exchange rate has increased, each share is back by only about 1.5 BTC worth of tangible assets. So, the exchange rate going up means I'm not willing to pay as much in BTC for TyGrr shares. So, yes this translates to a loss when denominated in BTC, but about break even or a bit ahead in US$ terms (i.e. I spent $10 worth of BTC for a share. I can now sell that share for about $12 worth of BTC).

Red Emerald
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April 07, 2012, 07:15:06 AM
 #231

So if 593 shares were paid, shouldn't there be a bunch of shares available at 3.0 BTC? I must be missing something.

Red Emerald
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April 07, 2012, 07:48:55 AM
 #232

So if 593 shares were paid, shouldn't there be a bunch of shares available at 3.0 BTC? I must be missing something.

I hold 903 shares. This time I did not pay myself.  Cool

Contract says I can not sell more than 750 shares so at the most only 153 could be for sale. However I am not looking to sell my shares right now.

Thanks.
Oh.  So where are the last 4 shares?  903+593=1496

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April 07, 2012, 03:37:16 PM
 #233

0.3878582    TYGRR    2012-04-07 00:52:59



O_o made a failure while paying out dividends?!
TheBitMan
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April 08, 2012, 12:43:19 AM
 #234

If I where to buy one share how much is one dividend?
And how often do you pay them out?
Red Emerald
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April 09, 2012, 11:44:53 PM
 #235

If I where to buy one share how much is one dividend?
And how often do you pay them out?

I pay out every Tuesday evening (Thai time) and you would get 1/1500th times 49.75% of what we mined that week.

I get 5% for managing things and 50% goes into savings.

Uh... 49.75% + 5% + 50% is not 100%

Matthew N. Wright
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April 10, 2012, 12:24:22 AM
 #236

Sorry for the late comments (have been ignoring this thread on purpose).

I can't comment on any of the other allegations yet (although I have heard many unsavory claims regarding a user on IRC by the name of TyGrr in relation to CP) but I can say two things:

1) Unless Kluge actually works for law enforcement, his opinion doesn't mean squat for if "documents look official" or not. He needs to be able to run them against a live database, not just check and see if they are high quality scans of potentially fake documents. Kluge, are you in any capacity to be able to do that?

His avatar looks like a poorly photoshopped job (see black shirt on black background)


2) Doesn't look photoshopped to me and I know because I've shooped a few shoops in my day.


Kluge
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April 10, 2012, 12:31:02 AM
 #237

1) Unless Kluge actually works for law enforcement, his opinion doesn't mean squat for if "documents look official" or not. He needs to be able to run them against a live database, not just check and see if they are high quality scans of potentially fake documents. Kluge, are you in any capacity to be able to do that?
Nope. Checked with what university has published. They certainly could be fake (or perhaps more likely, stolen). I don't believe them to be fake given there is third-party evidence supporting his claims (rather, supporting claims that the person he is alleging to be exists and went to the same university Goat has a student ID for with "his" picture), there are no red flags I can notice (though, being foreign, all I can do is look at samples online and compare them against what he sent), and the amount of time which would likely go into securing all the fake/stolen documents. All of the documents have images of Goat at various ages.


I would be surprised if Nefario had the ability to do more than I am able to -- pleasantly surprised, of course. Wouldn't he need a live db for every law enforcement agency in the world?

Don't mix your coins someone said isn't legal
Matthew N. Wright
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April 10, 2012, 01:59:59 AM
 #238

Matthew I do not know why you spread these rumors about me.
What rumor are you talking about? I wasn't even talking to you, I was talking to Kluge. Did you have something informative to add to the conversation about how Kluge wasn't qualified to say if legal documents are legitimate or not? Or did you just want to show off your lack of reading comprehension for a little while longer?

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April 10, 2012, 02:05:47 AM
 #239

I wonder why I am not the only one refusing to hand them over. :/

you're not the only one. I wrote in an email I'd provide postal address, phone nr and show id on skype but no way I'd send a scanned hires pic of my ID. on the other hand my glbse asset management worth is zero and what I planned to issue had anyway a cap of < 100 btc to begin with

your ad here:
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April 10, 2012, 04:03:18 AM
 #240

well, thanks. the share price is totally fucked up.

i spend 60+ btc in this venture, if i would liquidate now, i would have lost at least 60% of it.
.. and please don't tell me its shit-money and not worth it. its a big part of all my savings Sad im studying, no time to work, im living from about 220 bitcoin/month, so this is pretty serious to me.

The problem with valuation is that there is an inverse relationship to the exchange rate. At start up, TyGrr had ca. $15,000 worth of equipment and issued 1500 shares, meaning each share was backed by $10 worth of hardware. When the exchange rate was around $3, each share was backed by about 3 BTC worth of assets. Now that the exchange rate has increased, each share is back by only about 1.5 BTC worth of tangible assets. So, the exchange rate going up means I'm not willing to pay as much in BTC for TyGrr shares. So, yes this translates to a loss when denominated in BTC, but about break even or a bit ahead in US$ terms (i.e. I spent $10 worth of BTC for a share. I can now sell that share for about $12 worth of BTC).

Can not forget about the 5 months of solid dividends:)

So what is your current valuation of the assets and how much would one currently get if they accept your buy-back offer at 90% of USD asset value (see quote below from contract)?

Quote
What makes TyGrr tech different from other mining companies? The CEO (Chaang Noi) will offer to pay $US dollar cash for any share at anytime from anyone. The price Chaang Noi will pay will be 90% of the value of the assets of the Company. Therefor if bitcoin price falls in terms of US dollars the stock price of TyGrr will go up.

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