Health Professionals and COVID-19 - PROOF

[tvbcof]

Medical people are coming out of the woodwork, so to speak, all over the world where there is freedom to speak, and showing us that the pandemic is false panic propagated by people who want us to believe a lie.

No they are not. I know people this pandemic has killed. I have a relative who works with the patients who are sick from it.

Pics, or it didn't happen!

The funny thing is that I would believe your story about all the dead people you used to know and all the patients your relatives have seen from exactly one person on this forum.  That would be you.

Considering the deaths are about 60k and the world population is about 7.5B, the odds of a random individual being killed are roughly 10 times higher than getting hit by lightning.  60,000/7,500,000,000 is 0.000008.  You have a very unusual set of friends and family so it would seem.  A special tribe perhaps?

---

By the way, the 60k reported deaths worldwide from 'covid-19' include people who had stage 4 cancer and multiple organ failure but since they had the coronavirus in their system they were reported as 'covid-19' death.  About 82% (87%?) of the reported deaths in Italy were similar, and the U.S. reports the same way.  Small wonder that the U.S. is 'mirroring' the Italian numbers where a country like Germany which, presumably, reports things in a less politically convenient way is running something like a 0.1% mortality rate just like one would expect for any medium flu or seasonal coronavirus.

[BADecker]

Medical people are coming out of the woodwork, so to speak, all over the world where there is freedom to speak, and showing us that the pandemic is false panic propagated by people who want us to believe a lie.

No they are not. I know people this pandemic has killed. I have a relative who works with the patients who are sick from it.

Sorry about your relative. But have you actual proof that it was CV? Or might it have been something else and only attributed to CV? Or was it only that CV was present and nobody really knows what the cause was? How do you know?

[franky1]

oh tvbcof
people are self isolating.
over 99% of people have not even got it.
yes of the small amount of people that do get it ~80% of people are asymptomatic
of the remaining 20% 14% are mild and 6% are severe and of the severe amount. some are dying from it.

i know you think that 60k after weeks of isolation seems like isolation is pointless..
but imagine the extra deaths if people didnt self isolate

just imagine if everyone went into extreme herd immunity of licking making out with infected people to guarantee they will get it
the number of people needing hospitals (6%) would overwhelm hospitals. to such a point that hospitals wold not cope in february/march. and it would become near all 6% that would die

imagine it 300m where 18mill cant get access to breathing support so die.
now imagine 99% isolation.. so 3mill atrisk pop.. so the number is more of 180km at risk. if all in one week would be 90k deaths as there are only 90k ICU beds
now stagger the numbers over a few months and the deaths are less because hospitals can cope more


again.
now go back to a position if there was no self isolation and realise the difference

JUST WAKE UP and stop acting like badecker

[Spendulus]

Medical people are coming out of the woodwork, so to speak, all over the world where there is freedom to speak, and showing us that the pandemic is false panic propagated by people who want us to believe a lie.

No they are not. I know people this pandemic has killed. I have a relative who works with the patients who are sick from it.

Pics, or it didn't happen!....

Actually, there's an aspect of this matter that I would like to mention to you. It's the take on your various conspiratorial perspectives. (A) Oh, but they could have died of something else... (B) Oh, but the powers that be are inflaming the crisis beyond any reason (C)Oh, but the low number of people in hospitals...
(D) whatever else you've mentioned that I may have not paid attention to...

Namely, that these things for most half way intelligent people are not "False" but are "also true." None of them are contradictory to the basic reality of a major pandemic. None of them I disagree with. All of them I disagree with if alleged to be "all that there is."

At least you are not pushing quack cures.

[tvbcof]

Medical people are coming out of the woodwork, so to speak, all over the world where there is freedom to speak, and showing us that the pandemic is false panic propagated by people who want us to believe a lie.

No they are not. I know people this pandemic has killed. I have a relative who works with the patients who are sick from it.

Pics, or it didn't happen!....

Actually, there's an aspect of this matter that I would like to mention to you. It's the take on your various conspiratorial perspectives. (A) Oh, but they could have died of something else... (B) Oh, but the powers that be are inflaming the crisis beyond any reason (C)Oh, but the low number of people in hospitals...
(D) whatever else you've mentioned that I may have not paid attention to...

Namely, that these things for most half way intelligent people are not "False" but are "also true." None of them are contradictory to the basic reality of a major pandemic. None of them I disagree with. All of them I disagree with if alleged to be "all that there is."

Of course this is a complex and multi-faceted issue with a bunch of people and entities trying to do a bunch of things.  Many people probably make the mistake of assuming that everything has a central point of planning.  The mistake probably comes from fiction where in order to tell a story it needs to be simplified in order to be coherent.  In reality most things tend to be, or rapidly become, fairly chaotic.  None-the-less one can see the shadows of a finite number of major interests through the mist, and if looking for them based on past encounters they can be quite recognizable.

At least you are not pushing quack cures.

I don't write most of them off either.  It's just that unless I have studied something and put some thought into it, I don't have a lot to say about it.  At least that is what I try to do.

Since it is hard to find an intelligent argument against certain ideas, let me do that here.  One hypothesis which is gaining strength in my mind is that SARS-cov-2 is nothing more than a run-of-the-mill seasonal coronavirus which just happened to come along when various powers decided that the time was right pull a hoax.

The trouble with this is that there seem to be all kinds of 'old drugs' and other 'cures' which seem to be proving effective against it.  The 'common cold' has been around forever and there is much money, fame, etc from finding ways to deal with it.  Much research into it as well I'm sure.  Given that, it seems unlikely to me that SARS-cov-2 is totally 'natural'.  I don't think that the so called 'crushed glass lung' observations on CT scans would be a new thing in pulmonary science if there were not some new things going on.

[franky1]

and there he goes again.. admitting something is gaining strength in his mind. without oing the research upfront.
he also admits he feels if there is a entity that can gain financially out of a situation they must have created it...

well i gained alot of profit from bitcoin.. but i aint satoshi. and i hope you realise you need to retweak your mindset to realise that im not.. and not just stick with your weird way of thinking about stuff.
i hope you can see the flaw in your methodology.

and i hope real soon you realise this self isolation period does actually help reduce deaths by delaying everyone getting it at the same time. but first i think you need to truly accept that people do die from it to numbers significant enough to worry hospitals

yea its low percentages.. but in human number form 7billion people even 1% is a large amount of people to go in one period for one reason.

[Spendulus]

and there he goes again.. admitting something is gaining strength in his mind. without oing the research upfront.
he also admits he feels if there is a entity that can gain financially out of a situation they must have created it...

well i gained alot of profit from bitcoin.. but i aint satoshi. and i hope you realise you need to retweak your mindset to realise that im not.. and not just stick with your weird way of thinking about stuff.
i hope you can see the flaw in your methodology.

and i hope real soon you realise this self isolation period does actually help reduce deaths by delaying everyone getting it at the same time. but first i think you need to truly accept that people do die from it to numbers significant enough to worry hospitals

yea its low percentages.. but in human number form 7billion people even 1% is a large amount of people to go in one period for one reason.

I read a book on the 1918 flu a couple years ago, so I know pretty much exactly what all these docs and everyone else are worried about.

In a practical sense it really doesn't matter one bit if the bug came from a lab or a market or whatever.

[tvbcof]

I read a book on the 1918 flu a couple years ago, so I know pretty much exactly what all these docs and everyone else are worried about.

What did your book say about the vaccine research by the Rockefeller Foundation on military bases and re-using the same cattle and/or horses for the development of different microbes?

What did your book say about the declining number of test subjects logged while performing this aformentioned research?

What did your book say about digging up bodies out of the permafrost in the 1950's and not being able to find a virus at all, but finding one hell of a bacterial pneumonia?

My family of NPR-ish liberals 'knows' a lot about the 1918 flu, and they seem to 'know' pretty much the same things you do.  It's a resonable conjecture that you all were reading from the same stable of books.  Seems that there were more than several 'different' books on the subject and they were all marketed fairly effectively no to long ago.

In a practical sense it really doesn't matter one bit if the bug came from a lab or a market or whatever.

It matters a lot to me because in the lab case we can expect it to happen again and again whenever it is "politically useful" (to quote the neocons from their PNAC document.)  And such things have a ton of uses politically.

[Spendulus]

In a practical sense it really doesn't matter one bit if the bug came from a lab or a market or whatever.

It matters a lot to me because in the lab case we can expect it to happen again and again whenever it is "politically useful" (to quote the neocons from their PNAC document.)  And such things have a ton of uses politically.

It's probably reasonable to expect something this to happen every ten or twenty years. Of course, in some areas of Asia wearing face masks is not new.

[tvbcof]

In a practical sense it really doesn't matter one bit if the bug came from a lab or a market or whatever.

It matters a lot to me because in the lab case we can expect it to happen again and again whenever it is "politically useful" (to quote the neocons from their PNAC document.)  And such things have a ton of uses politically.

It's probably reasonable to expect something this to happen every ten or twenty years. Of course, in some areas of Asia wearing face masks is not new.

Depends.  An especially nasty naturally occurring seasonal virus would just as they always have.  Of course if there are additional mutagens in the environment (GMO technology, 5G on bandwidths, etc) the rate of mutation would likely increase, but that would not necessarily imply that the most dangerous ones would be the ones which 'take' and go around the globe.

In the case of a lab created bug being released it is more likely that there would be a snowball effect.  These things have been being developed for decades so it is fair to guess that there are thousands cataloged by feature set and stored up by a bunch of different nations and NGO's.  Once one is finally used 'in anger', it seems very likely to me that there would be a conflagration.

[franky1]

whether nature or corporate origin..
truth is you dont know if it will happen every year or once a decade..

after all nuclear bombs are not a yearly thing.. it was done once.. and that was it.

what actually is important is finding the best way to cope with something that can put a strain on healthcare. and know how to get people immunised enough to not expect to get sick every month.. and at best not sick every year/ever again from the same thing

[Spendulus]

...
In the case of a lab created bug being released it is more likely that there would be a snowball effect.  These things have been being developed for decades so it is fair to guess that there are thousands cataloged by feature set and stored up by a bunch of different nations and NGO's.  Once one is finally used 'in anger', it seems very likely to me that there would be a conflagration.

Anyone with half a brain knows the full range of possible sources. Of course you want to discuss the small subgroup of possibilities that is in line with your conspirators inclinations.

whether nature or corporate origin..
truth is you dont know if it will happen every year or once a decade..

It's reasonable to look back, we had swine flu, bird flu. If one of those happened again, how would it be handled?

RE "every year or once a decade" I would guess that the future response would be everyone has a couple of n95 and thing go on as usual, but the future tends to hold surprises.

[tvbcof]

...
In the case of a lab created bug being released it is more likely that there would be a snowball effect.  These things have been being developed for decades so it is fair to guess that there are thousands cataloged by feature set and stored up by a bunch of different nations and NGO's.  Once one is finally used 'in anger', it seems very likely to me that there would be a conflagration.

Anyone with half a brain knows the full range of possible sources. Of course you want to discuss the small subgroup of possibilities that is in line with your conspirators inclinations.

I see two possible sources:

 - natural

 - man-made

Got more?

'natural' is fairly well understood, excepting the corner-case environmental considerations with the 5G and what-not.

'man-made' is classified so much less is known about what might be in the various freezers scattered around the world.

[Spendulus]

...
In the case of a lab created bug being released it is more likely that there would be a snowball effect.  These things have been being developed for decades so it is fair to guess that there are thousands cataloged by feature set and stored up by a bunch of different nations and NGO's.  Once one is finally used 'in anger', it seems very likely to me that there would be a conflagration.

Anyone with half a brain knows the full range of possible sources. Of course you want to discuss the small subgroup of possibilities that is in line with your conspirators inclinations.

I see two possible sources:

 - natural

 - man-made

Got more?

'natural' is fairly well understood, excepting the corner-case environmental considerations with the 5G and what-not.

'man-made' is classified so much less is known about what might be in the various freezers scattered around the world.

Yes, but as frank1 has noted, there are simply no action items to result from any level of rooting around or guessing as to the cause of this outbreak. EG it doesn't help us cope with tomorrow or today. It does not help the hospitals.

[franky1]

the problem with looking back and comparing it to bird flu swine flu and sars and mers. and say well its a once every 5-10 year thing..
hospitals will then think cool. holiday next year, all fine and dandy because the past must repeat itself so we must get a break next year because history tells us so
i call that mind set not trend analysis.. but being a trend anal..

looking and studying events as they happen and really getting into it. to find out if immunity from this strain lasta a year. means if everyone got it in spring. dont expect it again in autumn but may expect it next spring
also if immunity is just for this particular strain alone. then if a new strain pops up in autumn. that would be a cycle and then in spring another cycle of the first strain.
however if its global immunity for all sars based and it lasts for 5 years. .. then be more relaxed about booking a holiday next year

the past and origins dont help much.. thats just finger pointing and finding someone bigger than a microbe to be able to punish

[BADecker]

...
In the case of a lab created bug being released it is more likely that there would be a snowball effect.  These things have been being developed for decades so it is fair to guess that there are thousands cataloged by feature set and stored up by a bunch of different nations and NGO's.  Once one is finally used 'in anger', it seems very likely to me that there would be a conflagration.

Anyone with half a brain knows the full range of possible sources. Of course you want to discuss the small subgroup of possibilities that is in line with your conspirators inclinations.

I see two possible sources:

 - natural

 - man-made

Got more?

'natural' is fairly well understood, excepting the corner-case environmental considerations with the 5G and what-not.

'man-made' is classified so much less is known about what might be in the various freezers scattered around the world.

Yes, but as frank1 has noted, there are simply no action items to result from any level of rooting around or guessing as to the cause of this outbreak. EG it doesn't help us cope with tomorrow or today. It does not help the hospitals.

That's because the whole pandemic is a fake scare. Treat people like you would treat pneumonia. Get back to business like normal.

[franky1]

That's because the whole pandemic is a fake scare. Treat people like you would treat pneumonia. Get back to business like normal.

its obvious that you are oblivious to reality. but one last time
imagine this. because your too afraid to actually realise it.. so just imagine
UK has 4000 ICU beds for people pneumonia

now imagine 65million people
now imagine 1%.... 650k
now imagine from that 650k 80% might be fine.. 14% mild and 6% severe
that 6% severe is 39k

thats 39k needing beds all in one go
thats like having 10 people turn up at hospital and saying to 9 f them to F**k off
..
again this number you might think is only 0.06%.. but thats 35000 people your telling to just get lost and die
i think if you found out a relative of yours was sick and told by a hospital to just get lost because government implemented the dipstick act of refusing to help .. you would be going mega nuts trying to find some massive conspiracy about the healthcare system

.. well welcome to the situation
have we got your attention yet

[BADecker]

That's because the whole pandemic is a fake scare. Treat people like you would treat pneumonia. Get back to business like normal.

its obvious that you are oblivious to reality. but one last time
imagine this. because your too afraid to actually realise it.. so just imagine
UK has 4000 ICU beds for people pneumonia

now imagine 65million people
now imagine 1%.... 650k
now imagine from that 650k 80% might be fine.. 14% mild and 6% severe
that 6% severe is 39k

thats 39k needing beds all in one go
thats like having 10 people turn up at hospital and saying to 9 f them to F**k off
..
again this number you might think is only 0.06%.. but thats 35000 people your telling to just get lost and die
i think if you found out a relative of yours was sick and told by a hospital to just get lost because government implemented the dipstick act of refusing to help .. you would be going mega nuts trying to find some massive conspiracy about the healthcare system

.. well welcome to the situation
have we got your attention yet

It's becoming more and more obvious that you and Spendy are trolls. But why? All you have to do is watch https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KCnpPjUvdLM. I know it's a bit long (nearly 2 hours). But cut it into 10-minute chunks, and take notes. This way even you (maybe?) will be able to see that the pandemic panic is entirely unjustified.

[franky1]

ok so just watched the first 10 minutes
lots of rants mainly about them complaining that this is an event not seen before

then saying how one guy predicted 500k UK deaths.. then reduced to 20k
due to self isolation models

again this is deaths.. meaning others with severe symptoms survive because they got hospital treatment
again corona is not fine one day dead 2 minutes later. its actually where for the severe it causes respiratory distress for days. needing hospital care for days

again even if it was like 40k severity.. under isolation models UK only has 4k ICU beds
and if all 40k got it at short time. 36k dead
but staggering it abit.. where they hop people in and out of ICU every 7 days for 2 months (8 stages)
they could possibly handle 32k patients over 2 months..
but guess what 40k severe vs 32k handle =8k not able to handle
its not been 2 months yet and numbers are climbing by ~700 a day .. because... there aint enough beds and staff and equipment

hospitals just cannot cope if everyone was freely mingling because the numbers would be much high
well over 90% have not even got it yet
do you get why the drop from 500k to 40k was done..

UK is not using stats of those asymptomatic at home. but hospital stats of people that need extra care.
do you get it yet.

if you think its bad now. wait until the other majority of the population get it
there actually is a point to self isolation

...
its really you that should watch the video in 10 minute segments. and then actually investigate and research stuff
actually understand it.. not just from the prospective of the guy on youtube. but by actually doing some math. checking some numbers. looking at source data. comparing it. and actually using some common sense

[BADecker]

ok so just watched the first 10 minutes
lots of rants mainly about them complaining that this is an event not seen before

then saying how one guy predicted 500k UK deaths.. then reduced to 20k
due to self isolation models

again this is deaths.. meaning others with severe symptoms survive because they got hospital treatment
again corona is not fine one day dead 2 minutes later. its actually where for the severe it causes respiratory distress for days. needing hospital care for days

again even if it was like 40k severity.. under isolation models UK only has 4k ICU beds
and if all 40k got it at short time. 36k dead
but staggering it abit.. where they hop people in and out of ICU every 7 days for 2 months (8 stages)
they could possibly handle 32k patients over 2 months..
but guess what 40k severe vs 32k handle =8k not able to handle
its not been 2 months yet and numbers are climbing by ~700 a day .. because... there aint enough beds and staff and equipment

hospitals just cannot cope if everyone was freely mingling because the numbers would be much high
well over 90% have not even got it yet
do you get why the drop from 500k to 40k was done..

UK is not using stats of those asymptomatic at home. but hospital stats of people that need extra care.
do you get it yet.

if you think its bad now. wait until the other majority of the population get it
there actually is a point to self isolation

...
its really you that should watch the video in 10 minute segments. and then actually investigate and research stuff
actually understand it.. not just from the prospective of the guy on youtube. but by actually doing some math. checking some numbers. looking at source data. comparing it. and actually using some common sense

Except that most of the explanations you give are simply stories. Watch the rest of the video.