Does China plan to go communist?

[bits4books]

The whole Communist ideology of China is just a camouflage for a completely capitalist giant. It is profitable and convenient. In fact, from the "communism" that already existed there are some facts: really a one-party system, you can not say too much (including about Winnie the Pooh) and other censorship.
In fact, it will be technically difficult to build the "right" communism with so many people and having already tasted the beauty of capitalist relations. If China really wanted to build this, they wouldn't have turned off this path after the Cultural Revolution. But, as we can see, "something" went wrong and now it is quite a strong capitalistic state with a fairly free but still controlled market and some anachronisms (for historical and propaganda reasons).
Let's be honest, it is impossible to build a bright Communist society where it has already been tried.

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[amishmanish]

China has no "plans" to go communist. It does, of course, has plans to make more of the world fall in line with its own ideologies rather than Democracy. In much of the civilized world, debate over policies and protest over mishaps is considered the necessary thing to do. In China's worldview, these are low productivity practices that breed inefficiency. They are generally hell-bent on efficiency of the workforce and getting the maximum out of people.

While this has worked great for there own people because they had this whole world market to capture, these policies will feel suffocating to anybody used to the regular freedoms of other democracies. Imagine not being able to criticize leadership, central parties or any sort of government action. China is very clear on its aim to be in a position where it can guide world policies much the same way that USA and rest of the west has done. They have an underlying current of ultra nationalism rooted in the memory of a middle kingdom which was destroyed by the west. (Opium wars, cutting of the Chinese melon). So many posters in this thread seem to have a genuine appreciation and wonderment about their "system". Just wait till it comes for you with its reverse engineered weaponry and stolen/ bribed IP based cyber-warfare.

[abhiseshakana]

Has China ever been anything apart from a communist state? There are about four countries that I know that are communist countries, and China is one of them; the rest are Laos, Cuba, and Vietnam. Unless maybe I don’t really get how this communism of a thing works or something, but I have always known China to be one of the communist countries.

The first time I got to know about this was from an article that I read a long time ago that was talking about China and how it started and all that. According to the article China was founded in 1949, and by a communist leader (sorry I can’t remember his name), so that communism has always been there.

When Deng Xiaoping masterminded China's transition to a market economy through an economic reform program by opening the door as widely as possible to foreign investors and making Special Economic Zones, it was already at odds with or deviating from the ideas of communism coined by Karl Marx and Engels.

The economic system run by Deng Xiaoping, which allowed for capitalist-style incentives at home, was not concentrated on political ideology so that economic maneuvers were more effective, but the supremacy of the Chinese communist party remained in priority. Deng also struck a deal with Reagan on democracy in China within 40 years that was crushed by Xi which ultimately sparked a trade war between America and China.

[Spaffin]

One way or another, partly China is still communist. Today there is not a single country that has a purely communist and capitalist state system. But nevertheless, China uses the communist ideology to keep its citizens within certain limits, at the same time, capitalism allows the Chinese government to raise the state to a world leader not only economically, but also politically. Democracy should not even be mentioned here, since it does not and will not exist in China.

[DrG]

China has tiered government. The bottom strata are effectively communist - the country's wealth is spread to help the greatest number of people. Massive projects like 3 Gorges. If you happen to be an outlier too bad for you. The good of the many outweigh the needs of the few.

The middle strata are the ones who think they can do capitalism. I run into quite a few of these people's kids every day because they're driving Ferrari's and Lambos here in Southern California attending public school in the US because California bends over backwards for out of country money (specifically China).

The top layer are the CCP who are the billionaires and basically run the country in an oligarchy. They are allowed to keep their wealth as long as they don't step out of line. Stepping out of line results in an excommunication.

I was in Shanghai last year right before Covid was announced. The power substation my wife's grandfather built no longer bears his name and his plaque was taken down (he defected with Chiang Kai Shek). Individualism is not respected in that country.

[amishmanish]

China has tiered government. The bottom strata are effectively communist - the country's wealth is spread to help the greatest number of people. Massive projects like 3 Gorges. If you happen to be an outlier too bad for you. The good of the many outweigh the needs of the few.

The middle strata are the ones who think they can do capitalism. I run into quite a few of these people's kids every day because they're driving Ferrari's and Lambos here in Southern California attending public school in the US because California bends over backwards for out of country money (specifically China).

The top layer are the CCP who are the billionaires and basically run the country in an oligarchy. They are allowed to keep their wealth as long as they don't step out of line. Stepping out of line results in an excommunication.

I was in Shanghai last year right before Covid was announced. The power substation my wife's grandfather built no longer bears his name and his plaque was taken down (he defected with Chiang Kai Shek). Individualism is not respected in that country.

That is an amazing first person account @DrG. Especially about the power substation. Must be some 50-60 years back that someone from the west had to come in and build a substation. Since then, China has really come a long way to have become self sufficient in most heavy engineering capability. I actually feel pretty envious because one thing for sure is that the centralized governance allows way more control and much better focus in delivering infrastructure and improving capabilities as a nation. In a democracy like India, there are a hundred conflicting interests from labor reforms, land acquisition issues, native people's rights to land and its resources etc etc.

What I have seen from my experience with the Chinese workers is that they are unquestioningly devoted to their task. There is always a visible supervisor kind of person and nobody dares take their hands or eyes off the work. Compare them with Indian workers who are basically kings of their own whims. When they feel like they have to deliver, they will mountains. Yet, as a supervisor, if you over-stretch your authority and make them feel less than good, the work will suffer.

[Vishnu.Reang]

When Deng Xiaoping masterminded China's transition to a market economy through an economic reform program by opening the door as widely as possible to foreign investors and making Special Economic Zones, it was already at odds with or deviating from the ideas of communism coined by Karl Marx and Engels.

The economic system run by Deng Xiaoping, which allowed for capitalist-style incentives at home, was not concentrated on political ideology so that economic maneuvers were more effective, but the supremacy of the Chinese communist party remained in priority. Deng also struck a deal with Reagan on democracy in China within 40 years that was crushed by Xi which ultimately sparked a trade war between America and China.

I don't think that Xi Jinping's policies are drastically different from that of Deng Xiaoping. The only difference now is that the Americans no longer tolerate below-the-belt tactics from China, such as commodity dumping and currency manipulation. The difference not between Deng Xiaoping and Xi Jinping. The real difference is between Donald Trump, and the American presidents before him who used to tolerate China.

[DrG]

China has tiered government. The bottom strata are effectively communist - the country's wealth is spread to help the greatest number of people. Massive projects like 3 Gorges. If you happen to be an outlier too bad for you. The good of the many outweigh the needs of the few.

The middle strata are the ones who think they can do capitalism. I run into quite a few of these people's kids every day because they're driving Ferrari's and Lambos here in Southern California attending public school in the US because California bends over backwards for out of country money (specifically China).

The top layer are the CCP who are the billionaires and basically run the country in an oligarchy. They are allowed to keep their wealth as long as they don't step out of line. Stepping out of line results in an excommunication.

I was in Shanghai last year right before Covid was announced. The power substation my wife's grandfather built no longer bears his name and his plaque was taken down (he defected with Chiang Kai Shek). Individualism is not respected in that country.

That is an amazing first person account @DrG. Especially about the power substation. Must be some 50-60 years back that someone from the west had to come in and build a substation. Since then, China has really come a long way to have become self sufficient in most heavy engineering capability. I actually feel pretty envious because one thing for sure is that the centralized governance allows way more control and much better focus in delivering infrastructure and improving capabilities as a nation. In a democracy like India, there are a hundred conflicting interests from labor reforms, land acquisition issues, native people's rights to land and its resources etc etc.

What I have seen from my experience with the Chinese workers is that they are unquestioningly devoted to their task. There is always a visible supervisor kind of person and nobody dares take their hands or eyes off the work. Compare them with Indian workers who are basically kings of their own whims. When they feel like they have to deliver, they will mountains. Yet, as a supervisor, if you over-stretch your authority and make them feel less than good, the work will suffer.

China's purpose driven work ethic is both a blessing and a curse. They're able to get the job done at breakneck speeds and with incredible efficiency, but along the way they do not expand the knowledge base considerably. Compare that to the US and India where people tend to be much more creative. Elon Musk is a good example of people who fail repeatedly but learn along the way with his Falcon 9 rocket - each time learning how to improve and willing to take risks and not using conventional models (like the circus that is Tesla).

When China becomes #1 who can they continue stealing from? Eventually they will need to have ideas grow in-house or at least make friends with idea creators in US, India, Germany and so forth. Right now China is very welcoming to certain Western companies if they see they can glean some creativity to their own internal human resource. Anything they can already do in-house they have no desire for outside companies to come in.

[Nellayar]

China became a communist country back in 1921 introduced by Mao Zedong, the Father of People`s Republic of China. Therefore, China had already made communist even before the world war. When he was died, Deng Xiaoping formed the Market Socialism. Socialism is a combination of communism and capitalism wherein the economy is regulated but it advocates the means of production and etc.

As of now, China is in Modern Communism. That is why it is a question to me why OP said that it plans to go to a communist party?


Well, it does not matter anymore since China gradually adopts the idea of capitalism as many Chinese around the world becomes an entrepreneur. The sleeping giant awakes in modern era.

References:
https://cs.stanford.edu/people/eroberts/courses/cs181/projects/2007-08/communism-computing-china/china.html
https://www.google.com/search?q=socialism+means%3F&oq=socialism+means%3F&aqs=chrome..69i57.6311j0j9&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

[usekevin]

Most of us know,China is a communist country since 1950.The difference is,they trying to get more communist ideology into their country.If we compare the economy,it seems some variation in their ideology.But while comparing of their schemes and political activity. You can understand it's trying to get into lenin form of communism.

[Vishnu.Reang]

Most of us know,China is a communist country since 1950.The difference is,they trying to get more communist ideology into their country.If we compare the economy,it seems some variation in their ideology.But while comparing of their schemes and political activity. You can understand it's trying to get into lenin form of communism.

For the economy, Communism is not very harmful. The problem is when Socialism gets combined with Communism. The Chinese did the smart thing by removing the socialist policies and replacing them with capitalist ones. That's the reason why they achieved so much of economic growth, while the socialist countries such as Venezuela and Cuba remained poor.

[amishmanish]

China's purpose driven work ethic is both a blessing and a curse. They're able to get the job done at breakneck speeds and with incredible efficiency, but along the way they do not expand the knowledge base considerably. Compare that to the US and India where people tend to be much more creative. Elon Musk is a good example of people who fail repeatedly but learn along the way with his Falcon 9 rocket - each time learning how to improve and willing to take risks and not using conventional models (like the circus that is Tesla).

When China becomes #1 who can they continue stealing from? Eventually they will need to have ideas grow in-house or at least make friends with idea creators in US, India, Germany and so forth. Right now China is very welcoming to certain Western companies if they see they can glean some creativity to their own internal human resource. Anything they can already do in-house they have no desire for outside companies to come in.

The idea about how China might be accepting of ideas in the future is tantalizing. Yet, i feel that China is the very anti-thesis of a global, democratic, liberal world order. India has long bore the brunt of being neighbor to such an untrustworthy country. Its like being at the gates of Mordor. They have purposely let the boundary issue longer so they can settle it on their own terms when they are at such a position. This is the same approach they take with countries and corporations. While they feel benefited from you, they will be welcoming. The gates close once they have leeched off enough. The whole "Art of War" thought is inculcated in their diplomacy as well as business.

While USA dominated the world, there was never a single defining feature of US influence. This is because of the West's emphasis on individualism. For every polluting corporation, you also had a caring society where individuals went out of their way to help the poor. US influence in helping those less fortunate than them cannot be overstated. In case of China, there is no such "individual" influence. The whole state and its production machinery, including the population is aligned to one goal, becoming a sole superpower and reclaiming its place. There is very little one should expect from China in terms of mutual benefit.

[suzanne5223]

I saw they have a president and a one party system (apparently not a dictatorship?) but they have Marxist ideologies and look to be in a transition phase to communism?

The Chinese still operate in the phase of communism cause theres no way capitalism will be used in favor of the political leader.

I'm wary of socialist control of everything as I don't think it's historically ended well in the past (eg the Soviet Union) and it could either kill or heighten innovation.

A country where communism is practise usually lead to massacre of people literally split which history said it happened in Soviet then before Mao splits from Marx but I think the people of China never learn from that history.

Does anyone know of the plans to turn China communist and how it will look once all the phases are complete? Also would you expect their military to still be able to compete well with other countries?

Only the Communist Party authorities and the organization involve will know the plan to complete all communist phase in China and I still expect their military not to compete with other countries but the common people will be affected.

Lesson of the day : Mao created Communist Party of China to safe his people from Soviet issue and also chase out  imperialism but also use the same weapon to prison labour etc. Let's keep the decentralization of Cryptocurrecy alive thats the only way we can achieve equity.

[Ludmilla_rose1995]

China characterizes its economy as Socialism with Chinese characteristics. Since late 1978, the Chinese leadership has renewed the economy from a Soviet planned economy to an economy that was market-oriented but still within the strict political framework of the Communist Party. The Chinese government is also often said to be autocratic, communist, and socialist. The communist members who winged further to the left called it the capitalist country. Indeed, the Chinese state is increasingly moving towards a free economic system.

[Argoo]

China has been a communist dictatorship for the last 70+ years. They have embraced some capitalist concepts, like private business ownership, but the communist party retains ultimate control over everything.

China tried a more "pure" marxist/leninist version of communism back in 1950s and it didn't quite work out so I don't think they'll move back towards that. There is no plausible reason to abandon the massive economic advantage that the current system has created. More violent suppression of dissent is possible though.

China has long since departed from the principles of socialism and communism.  They seek and develop their own model for building a balanced society.  Of course, there are many mistakes along the way, and at the same time, the Chinese government has succeeded a lot.  Now China has one of the strongest economies and it continues to develop.  They are not afraid to experiment there.  The rapid adoption of blockchain technology and the thoughtful and thorough development of its digitized yuan are examples of this personalized approach.

[cabron]

China has been a communist dictatorship for the last 70+ years. They have embraced some capitalist concepts, like private business ownership, but the communist party retains ultimate control over everything.

China tried a more "pure" marxist/leninist version of communism back in 1950s and it didn't quite work out so I don't think they'll move back towards that. There is no plausible reason to abandon the massive economic advantage that the current system has created. More violent suppression of dissent is possible though.

China has long since departed from the principles of socialism and communism.  They seek and develop their own model for building a balanced society.  Of course, there are many mistakes along the way, and at the same time, the Chinese government has succeeded a lot.  Now China has one of the strongest economies and it continues to develop.  They are not afraid to experiment there.  The rapid adoption of blockchain technology and the thoughtful and thorough development of its digitized yuan are examples of this personalized approach.

Capitalism has completely turned out good for them, it's the only country that had completely risen from poor to being the wealthiest so far.  That Shenzhen city of them had made it the most progressive industrial city next to Hongkong.

I think having one leader almost like a dictator made them unite and aim to have one goal made China an example of what unity can do. Long term projects are built unlike having an election every 4-6 years which goals are also changed every time a new party take over.

[CarnagexD]

It's been governed by the CPC (Communist Party of China) for the past 70+ years and had since opened some capitalist concepts like private business ownerships and others which effectively boomed their economy. I do not think they will incorporate a much stricter approach than the ones they are operating under right now as it's not working. And besides, the current system works in their favor. Don't fix what is not broken.