JJG’s Outline of Bitcoin Investment Ideas

[Tonimez]

[Edited out]

Yes we can all agree that discretionary income is what’s needed to invest in bitcoin and both someone with a stable source and an unstable source of income can both invest if they have discretionary income.
Having a stable source of income makes it easier and more convenient to sort out your discretionary than an unstable source. And to be able to invest for the long term, one needs a steady supply of discretionary income and a good financial management plan.

With or without stable income source, a person who truly wants to invest in bitcoin will figure out his Discretionary income even when he doesn't not have a "stable" income. If a person continues waiting until he has a stable income source before he can make his first buy, he may also complain about his income amount when he finally gets a stable income. A person without a stable source of income and a low income earner needs to be good financial managers to own bitcoin and HODL for a long time. One benefit of starting your bitcoin accumulation when you do not have a stable income is that it helps you build a high level of financial discipline which will be very useful to him when he finally gets a source of income.

Being consistent comes when a person has a stable income, but owning bitcoin comes with self discipline and willingness to own bitcoin.

[edited out]

When discussing about bitcoin investment, age should not be the reason why someone can not invest into bitcoin. because someone who is 70 years of age may have financial stable than someone who is 25-30 years of age. So I don’t think age should be the reason for person not to invest. And one thing again is that not every old person that invest in bitcoin, invest for profit actually. Some may do it purposely to protect their money. My point is just that everyone who involved in bitcoin may have different reasons, goals must not be the same, so it’s just about everyone financial readiness than numbers of years they have.

Maybe if you think that age is not a factor, then you should give some example.

Age is a very big factor in bitcoin investment because it goes down to affect but the number of years of possible HODLing and security of your bitcoin. A 70 years old man may have had a series of recurrent issues that may also affect his mental health. At such age if such person must invest in bitcoin, it will be almost like he's going for a short term investment or he could involve a family member from the start or shortly after a start.

In my country, Life expectancy is around 55 years while the US stands at almost 75 years or more. So age here is a very important factor because to me the initial HODLing target by the investor will put his age into consideration. Let's say a person from my country at 70 years going into bitcoin, he will not plan for a 10 years initial HODLing period, but a guy of 40 years or less can choose to start with an initial HODLing target of up to 10 years or more.

Age affects everything in life so bitcoin is not an exception.

[James161]

I created this as a self-moderated thread in order for me to exercise some discretion in terms of removing possible shitcoin, trolling or shilling posts above and beyond what forum moderators might consider, and likely I am not going to be too inclined to delete posts even if they are critical of my ideas.. but we will see where the post substance goes or if there is any participation beyond just me.

I thought that the creation of this thread could be helpful for me to have some of the ideas in one place and potentially allow me to lessen some of my needs to repeat ideas… whether in the form of various PMs or in various threads that I am presented with seemingly repetitive ideas..

Maybe in the end, the creation and intended maintenance of this thread will not lessen repetition of my posts regarding ideas outlined herein..? time will tell.  

Of course, for at least an initial period, I will need to flesh out some of the first few posts in a kind of work-in-progress way.    

I am considering categories of:

1)   This post:  Introduction (Opening Post 1):  
2)   Opening Post 2: Getting started – assessing personal financial situation (in relation to ability to invest in bitcoin)
3)   Opening Post 3: Accumulation, maintenance, liquidation (or creation of legacy) of BTC  
                    3) a) -  Outside related thread Ideas of sustainable withdrawal
4)   Opening Post 4:  Attempts at BTC price predictions
5)   Opening Post 5:  Other considerations / resources, bitcoin podcasts, threads of other forum members or my other threads

I am also hoping that some of my ideas and outlining of intended investment bitcoin ideas will be helpful to other persons besides just me and maybe helpful for institutions and/or governments too.  

Anyone have any suggestions, questions or similar ideas that they would like to share in this thread?  Please do.  

I am also open to attempts to critique the various ideas or investment frameworks, but at my discretion I may well end up deleting posts that I determine to devolve too much into personal attacks (without seeming to provide adequate substance), shitcoin pumpening, bitcoin naysaying (that largely appears to me to be backhanded ways to shill some kind of a shitcoin) trolling or shilling.  

I would like to NOT delete many if any posts, but let’s see how it goes (especially since we are on the interwebs and cannot always know beforehand whether discussions will get too much derailed)?

Last Edited: November 24, 2023

I understand what you mean. Sometimes, sharing the same ideas repeatedly can feel exhausting, especially when you're trying to help others understand Bitcoin and manage their portfolios wisely. But remember, not everyone is at the same stage of learning. Your experience and perspective may be exactly what someone needs to hear. Keep sharing your insights, stay open to new ideas, and let your knowledge continue to grow. ₿🚀

[Cossyblack]

I disagree with you buddy because a person need money at any age and if you are saying 70 years old has to stop investing because of age factor

There are no age limits to invest in bitcoin. It doesn't matter whether you are in your 70s or above so long as you are healthy and has discretionary income available, you can invest in bitcoin.

Bitcoin investment is open to everyone irrespective of age, race or profession. There are people who are in their old age that are ongoing accumulating bitcoin. They may not have as much time to accumulate bitcoin as young people do but they can still accumulate a large stash of it before they grow weaker so there children can inherit it when they are gone. The fact that you are old shouldn't stop you from investing in bitcoin, so start investing while you still can using your discretionary income and hold for the long term, even if you might not be there to enjoy the harvest, your children will.

[Hardyrobust]

I disagree with you buddy because a person need money at any age and if you are saying 70 years old has to stop investing because of age factor

There are no age limits to invest in bitcoin[/b]. It doesn't matter whether you are in your 70s or above so long as you are healthy and has discretionary income available, you can invest in bitcoin.

Bitcoin investment is open to everyone irrespective of age, race or profession. There are people who are in their old age that are ongoing accumulating bitcoin. They may not have as much time to accumulate bitcoin as young people do but they can still accumulate a large stash of it before they grow weaker so there children can inherit it when they are gone. The fact that you are old shouldn't stop you from investing in bitcoin, so start investing while you still can using your discretionary income and hold for the long term, even if you might not be there to enjoy the harvest, your children will.

  Age is an important factors that needs to be considered while investing in bitcoin for a long term. You made mention of people that are old that are seriously accumulating bitcoin but neglect the time factor, how long they are to hold since they are already old. For people who are still at the age of 30 and above holding bitcoin may not be an issue compared to someone that is already in his 70s. There are ages that you may reach holding bitcoin for like 10years or more may not be that easy. Also at old age health issues may also become a problem because as people get old their health tend to depreciate. For someone that is already 70+,  age is an important while factor to be considered while buying bitcoin.

[abaeze]

  Age is an important factors that needs to be considered while investing in bitcoin for a long term. You made mention of people that are old that are seriously accumulating bitcoin but neglect the time factor, how long they are to hold since they are already old. For people who are still at the age of 30 and above holding bitcoin may not be an issue compared to someone that is already in his 70s. There are ages that you may reach holding bitcoin for like 10years or more may not be that easy. Also at old age health issues may also become a problem because as people get old their health tend to depreciate. For someone that is already 70+,  age is an important while factor to be considered while buying bitcoin.

Most of the billionaires in the world are older and all are investing. Their investment style and risk-taking ability are different from that of a 30-35 year old person. If a 30 year old person has debt, no emergency fund and needs money for his career, marriage, and buying a house, then long-term Bitcoin investment can be risky for him too. On the other hand, a 70-72 year old person has sufficient pension, savings, emergency fund, and other assets. He does not need to sell Bitcoin to meet his daily expenses. He can invest long-term for himself and his heirs too. There will be risks in building wealth or investing long-term, but one should not consider age as the main/big risk and hold back from investing. Because investing is not only for oneself but should be made in an investment that benefits oneself and the next generation as well. So it may be reasonable for a 72 year old person to hold Bitcoin for the long term, because the most important thing in investing is having money and the ability to bear risk.

[Crakryptvest]

I understand what you mean. Sometimes, sharing the same ideas repeatedly can feel exhausting, especially when you're trying to help others understand Bitcoin and manage their portfolios wisely. But remember, not everyone is at the same stage of learning. Your experience and perspective may be exactly what someone needs to hear. Keep sharing your insights, stay open to new ideas, and let your knowledge continue to grow. ₿🚀

Although it is tiring but what can we do, we learnt, other people should learn from us too, I don't feel this way because I think why we are here is to learn and pass the knowledge to other people, if it will take us to say the same thing countless as long as it will help someone to learn how to keep acumulating and follow up his or her Bitcoin investment right without deviating then it is the right thing to do if you ask me.
One thing about me is that I love discussing Bitcoin especially in this forum, the reason is that, from what you say, some person can counter you and you learn new things from their, but I have a question for you, hope you're practicing what you preach, let me be direct hope you've started investing in Bitcoin?

[Rockstarguy]

bitcoin can be interesting, but i’d rather see a clear plan for managing risk than just hype around price targets.

Spot on bro, we know that life is full of surprises but having a plan is key, like the saying goes, "not having a plan is like planning to fail", risk management is a very important aspect to look at while investing in Bitcoin, but I think the best way to go around that is using the DCA method

DCA strategy of Bitcoin investment is a strategy that enables investors to plan better, and it also has risk management. There is nothing to plan so much about investing in Bitcoin; one only needs to understand to invest the amount you can afford to lose with your discretionary income, and the DCA strategy enables one to accumulate Bitcoin, which helps investors to invest without being pressured.

DCA strategy is a very good strategy for investors because with this, you have to consider your financial strength and invest based on your ability. If you take away the DCA strategy, there may be no plan for investing, and it will make investing challenging for some people.

[Showlove01]

DCA strategy of Bitcoin investment is a strategy that enables investors to plan better, and it also has risk management. There is nothing to plan so much about investing in Bitcoin; one only needs to understand to invest the amount you can afford to lose with your discretionary income, and the DCA strategy enables one to accumulate Bitcoin, which helps investors to invest without being pressured.

DCA strategy is a very good strategy for investors because with this, you have to consider your financial strength and invest based on your ability. If you take away the DCA strategy, there may be no plan for investing, and it will make investing challenging for some people.

I disagree with the bold statement, DCA method does not actually enable investors to plan better rather it is the duty and a principle for every investor to plan better before starting any investment and DCA method does not have risk management but rather it is also investor who understand and know what he or she is doing do manage their risk while investing, if you say DCA help in risk management why do some people still invest with what they can not afford to lose, note; DCA is  just a method and then how smooth and great one's investing is going is person's identity, how they have perfected their system and process of accumulating.

[Merit.s]

DCA strategy of Bitcoin investment is a strategy that enables investors to plan better, and it also has risk management. There is nothing to plan so much about investing in Bitcoin; one only needs to understand to invest the amount you can afford to

DCA is a method of bitcoin accumulation that enables you to buy bitcoin every week based on the size of your discretionary income in order to gradually increase your bitcoin stash overtime irrespective of the price of bitcoin. DCA does not limit the risk in bitcion. Going on a long term investment and setting up an emergency funds and various backup funds along side with your bitcoin investment is the risk management in bitcion investment and you have to do that yourself by assigning the right amount of money for the right purpose.

If you only DCA without setting up an emergency funds, you will still sell at loss if bitcoin price is below your entry point when you're hit with real life emergency.

[Nwankwoala]

Great outline JJG, I really agree with this. Especially the first one - Don't get rekt. Many newbies start with trading or leverage and lose everything before they even understand Bitcoin. Thanks for sharing these principles. A well planned patient trading can be profitable if we follow such rules.

[MathPro]

I agree with the idea of only using discretionary funds for trading bitcoin because it has no fundamentals.  Btw a promising new technical indicator has just been made available, this thing is powerful, it litterally predicts bitcoin, the graphs on the chart are realtime:  www.btctechnical.com.  Anyone familiar with www.btctechnical.com? 

[Edited out]

Yes we can all agree that discretionary income is what’s needed to invest in bitcoin and both someone with a stable source and an unstable source of income can both invest if they have discretionary income.
Having a stable source of income makes it easier and more convenient to sort out your discretionary than an unstable source. And to be able to invest for the long term, one needs a steady supply of discretionary income and a good financial management plan.

With or without stable income source, a person who truly wants to invest in bitcoin will figure out his Discretionary income even when he doesn't not have a "stable" income. If a person continues waiting until he has a stable income source before he can make his first buy, he may also complain about his income amount when he finally gets a stable income. A person without a stable source of income and a low income earner needs to be good financial managers to own bitcoin and HODL for a long time. One benefit of starting your bitcoin accumulation when you do not have a stable income is that it helps you build a high level of financial discipline which will be very useful to him when he finally gets a source of income.

Being consistent comes when a person has a stable income, but owning bitcoin comes with self discipline and willingness to own bitcoin.

[edited out]

When discussing about bitcoin investment, age should not be the reason why someone can not invest into bitcoin. because someone who is 70 years of age may have financial stable than someone who is 25-30 years of age. So I don’t think age should be the reason for person not to invest. And one thing again is that not every old person that invest in bitcoin, invest for profit actually. Some may do it purposely to protect their money. My point is just that everyone who involved in bitcoin may have different reasons, goals must not be the same, so it’s just about everyone financial readiness than numbers of years they have.

Maybe if you think that age is not a factor, then you should give some example.

Age is a very big factor in bitcoin investment because it goes down to affect but the number of years of possible HODLing and security of your bitcoin. A 70 years old man may have had a series of recurrent issues that may also affect his mental health. At such age if such person must invest in bitcoin, it will be almost like he's going for a short term investment or he could involve a family member from the start or shortly after a start.

In my country, Life expectancy is around 55 years while the US stands at almost 75 years or more. So age here is a very important factor because to me the initial HODLing target by the investor will put his age into consideration. Let's say a person from my country at 70 years going into bitcoin, he will not plan for a 10 years initial HODLing period, but a guy of 40 years or less can choose to start with an initial HODLing target of up to 10 years or more.

Age affects everything in life so bitcoin is not an exception.

[Homemade-IQ]

. A well planned patient trading can be profitable if we follow such rules.

It is very important that you know that trading is very risky, because the chances of losing all your margin is very high irrespective of how skilled you may think you are in it, so I would advice you to invest in Bitcoin that is less stressful and more rewarding if you compare it to trading in a period of ten years and above.

I agree with the idea of only using discretionary funds for trading bitcoin because it has no fundamentals.  Btw a promising new technical indicator has just been made available, this thing is powerful, it litterally predicts bitcoin, the graphs on the chart are realtime:  www.btctechnical.com.  Anyone familiar with www.btctechnical.com? 

I don't know why newbie like you loves trading and be wasting your money in the name of trading, because you all think that you can get rich quickly through it, without even knowing that it's way difficult than investing in Bitcoin that is more rewarding and less stressful. Just buy consistently and hold, and you will never regret it mate.

[Emjay24]

DCA buying using discretionary income have multiple layers which consistency in purchasing rather set amount of bitcoin is one of such layers that is lost considered in DCA approach, other layers is your discretionary income management, this point is where you must adjust your set target monthly buying amount, let say your discretionary income I pegged at $300 out of your total monthly income of $1000, if along the line your income amount change fro. $1000 monthly salary  to $1500 income months you are expected to adjust your discretionary income for bitcoin purchase to somewhere around $350 buying capital property even $400 at most aggressive manner, you see where the changes can come in along the way, and you need to make plans for such changes, be it upwards or downward, depending on your financial conditions at each point.

Before you discuss aggressiveness you should know how much is the total discretionary income and what part of it is used by the investor to buy bitcoin, aggressiveness is measured by the quantity of your discretionary income that is used to purchase bitcoin.

From your example, the practice of using all discretionary income to purchase bitcoin might not be sustainable since the investor needs to build emergency fund alongside investing in bitcoin and might still want to leave out some part of it for discretionary consumption. Discretionary income is not set by the investor, it is the remainder after attending to expenses of which may not be fixed. The investor can decide to invest 50% of his discretionary income into bitcoin, 30% into emergency fund and 20% as discretionary consumption.

You should understand that if investor earned $1000 and has $300 discretionary income from which he invests $180 into bitcoin, then as his income increased to $1500 and he had $500 discretionary income and now invests $250. He was more aggressive when he had $300 discretionary income since he invested $180 which is 60% of his discretionary income as against when he invested $250 which is only 50% of $500, despite the fact that he now puts extra $70 into purchasing bitcoin periodically.

[Brizi5000]

Great outline JJG, I really agree with this. Especially the first one - Don't get rekt. Many newbies start with trading or leverage and lose everything before they even understand Bitcoin. Thanks for sharing these principles. A well planned patient trading can be profitable if we follow such rules.

This thread talks about investing in bitcoin for long term and not trading, what well planned patience trading are you talking about, traders are majorly impatient but investors are because they understand that bitcoin is a long term investment which requires patience while accumulating and holding bitcoin for long term purpose. Being patience in bitcoin investment is one of the characteristics of true investors, traders lack such patience because they want to make quick profits.

[ASloveapg]

Great outline JJG, I really agree with this. Especially the first one - Don't get rekt. Many newbies start with trading or leverage and lose everything before they even understand Bitcoin. Thanks for sharing these principles. A well planned patient trading can be profitable if we follow such rules.

This thread talks about investing in bitcoin for long term and not trading, what well planned patience trading are you talking about, traders are majorly impatient but investors are because they understand that bitcoin is a long term investment which requires patience while accumulating and holding bitcoin for long term purpose. Being patience in bitcoin investment is one of the characteristics of true investors, traders lack such patience because they want to make quick profits.

Patience is the most important thing in long-term Bitcoin investment. A real investor does not change his decision after seeing the daily ups and downs, those who are real long-term investors are very stable in their goals, they do not see the market volatility as a cause for panic in any way, rather they are stable in their long-term investment despite any volatility. In fact, not everyone has such patience, not everyone can have a long-term mindset, by expecting quick success, they waste all their money and hard work on various mistakes. They should actually understand that no success comes quickly, everything requires long-term, patience, the ability to manage everything correctly are equally needed, and after ignoring all obstacles, only if you are good at your goal, then the chances of profit from an investment will be good. But at the same time, I want to say that the way a trader wants to succeed quickly through trading, in reality it is never possible to succeed quickly. In trading, long-term patience is also necessary because learning trading is not easy and it takes a lot of effort and time to achieve this entire education.

[Muba20]

but at 70 it's better to start preparing, DCA at that point in time should be lower compare to their past years.

I disagree with you buddy because a person need money at any age and if you are saying 70 years old has to stop investing because of age factor but what if he live more then us? is you have a guarantee that you will live up to 70 years the answer is obviously no age is just a number if someone has a proper source of income and has no debt also has a discretionary income and he stop investing just because he is old does not make sense what i mean is age alone shouldn't be the deciding factor.

at that age it's better to just have fun and slowly walk away from investment

U can enjoy life and still invest at the same time if someone has enough income.

I understand your point about discouraging someone from investing. If a person with a regular income has discretionary income after meeting their essential expenses and if they are not burdened with any debt, then such a person may be interested in investing. But you should understand that these conditions do not lead to the conclusion that age is just a number or that age is irrelevant in investment decisions.

I would like to highlight two different issues. The first is whether the person can invest. His discretionary income can answer this.

The second is how much to invest and for how long is reasonable in his current situation. It depends on his health, future income, existing assets and when to use that money.

You also wanted to convey in your statement that death can happen even at a young age, which is true. But even if that is true, since the future is uncertain, differences in personal circumstances cannot be ruled out at the time of planning. No one is guaranteed to live a certain time, but that does not mean that everyone's potential investment period becomes the same.

[Charcol]

I disagree with you buddy because a person need money at any age and if you are saying 70 years old has to stop investing because of age factor

There are no age limits to invest in bitcoin. It doesn't matter whether you are in your 70s or above so long as you are healthy and has discretionary income available, you can invest in bitcoin.

Bitcoin investment is open to everyone irrespective of age, race or profession. There are people who are in their old age that are ongoing accumulating bitcoin. They may not have as much time to accumulate bitcoin as young people do but they can still accumulate a large stash of it before they grow weaker so there children can inherit it when they are gone. The fact that you are old shouldn't stop you from investing in bitcoin, so start investing while you still can using your discretionary income and hold for the long term, even if you might not be there to enjoy the harvest, your children will.

It is not right to exclude someone from direct investment because of age. However, the conclusion that age has no effect because there is discretionary income even at the age of 70-80 or more is not enough for the discussion. You have given the conditions of good health and discretionary income, but the investment period and the purpose of using that money must also be seen at the same time.

Someone's ability to buy and being able to hold on to it for as long as necessary are not the same thing. The future medical expenses, income continuity or need to use one's own money of someone you see healthy today cannot be decided by looking at age or current surplus alone. Again, it is not right to think that being old means one's opportunities are over.

[Grease5000]

I understand your point about discouraging someone from investing. If a person with a regular income has discretionary income after meeting their essential expenses and if they are not burdened with any debt, then such a person may be interested in investing. But you should understand that these conditions do not lead to the conclusion that age is just a number or that age is irrelevant in investment decisions.

I would like to highlight two different issues. The first is whether the person can invest. His discretionary income can answer this.

The second is how much to invest and for how long is reasonable in his current situation. It depends on his health, future income, existing assets and when to use that money.

You also wanted to convey in your statement that death can happen even at a young age, which is true. But even if that is true, since the future is uncertain, differences in personal circumstances cannot be ruled out at the time of planning. No one is guaranteed to live a certain time, but that does not mean that everyone's potential investment period becomes the same.

Age can play a role or determine how long some can invest, but I think we should be careful not to make age a bigger factor than it should be. Though you have rightly separated someone ability to invest from how much they can invest and for how long. However, I don't think the later point should be used to discourage older people from participating in accumulating bitcoin.

 Imagine a 67 year old man who has a regular income, enough money for his daily needs,some savings, no debt and  If he decides to use some  part of his surplus income to invest in bitcoin for his children or grandchildren, I don't  think his age  should be a major concern? Though he may not live long enough to enjoy the investment himself, but that does not mean the investment has no purpose.

And also being young  don't automatically  make someone a better investor. A 25 year old who invests money meant for rent or business expenses may be in a worse position than a 67 year old who invests consistently  using his surplus money and with a clear plan.

For me the adjustment  I would make is this, age should help determine the investment strategy, and not automatically determine whether someone should invest. What matters most is the person's financial position, purpose,  and the time available for that particular goal.

[Alonso_]

Great outline JJG, I really agree with this. Especially the first one - Don't get rekt. Many newbies start with trading or leverage and lose everything before they even understand Bitcoin. Thanks for sharing these principles. A well planned patient trading can be profitable if we follow such rules.

Have you heard about investing in Bitcoin for the long term ? Well for your your information, I know you’re a beginner, and it seems you don’t really know what is talked about here, but I just have to inform you that this thread mostly speaks about investing in Bitcoin for a long term, and we don’t discuss about trading here, where people are looking for quick gains and profits, because when you’re looking for that quick profit it would definitely result in missing out on opportunities, and I’ wouldn’t be very happy seeing a beginner missing out on tremendous opportunity of stacking bitcoin, I will advice you to approach the market with buying and stacking bitcoin for the long term.