Slot Games' RTP, variable??

[Danydee]

 
 Hi

 Si it is true that RTP of slot games can be adapted to the casinos preferences ??
 
 do all providers do this ?


 And what about when slots are accessed directly on the casino website, here anything can happen, things like avoiding use of RNG too.



 Thanks to everybody

[seoincorporation]

Hello Danydee

I don't think the casinos can make public this information because a variable RTP would mean they are rigged because if you increase the RTP the user will lose more times.

Most of the slots are provided by gambling agencies that develop these games, and they rent them as a service. They don't have to prove the fairness of each roll because they have a verified license. And this means we shouldn't care about what happens in the backend and we should trust them because if they do something nasty then they will lose their license.

To be honest, I'm not sure if the RTP is variable, but what I know is that we can search slots by RTP and this way play with better odds. just google rtp-slots and you will find a huge list.

[Danydee]

Hello Danydee

I don't think the casinos can make public this information because a variable RTP would mean they are rigged because if you increase the RTP the user will lose more times.

 You surely mean decrease!

To be honest, I'm not sure if the RTP is variable, but what I know is that we can search slots by RTP and this way play with better odds. just google rtp-slots and you will find a huge list.

 Not all casinos do this,  and on top some do not even provide the RTP info !

Most of the slots are provided by gambling agencies that develop these games, and they rent them as a service. They don't have to prove the fairness of each roll because they have a verified license. And this means we shouldn't care about what happens in the backend and we should trust them because if they do something nasty then they will lose their license.

 Here's the point,
 I've read somewhere here ( https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5383777 ) that RTP may vary from casino to another and can be adapted to the casinos wants !  In addition in some casinos software is executed under (the website/casino URL), normally it should redirects to the game provider servers, so you know you are running the game from the original makers,  but running the game under another (Interface if we could say) there's no more, or any insurance there, and everything can happen.









Edit

...
Yeah, with PnG slots it can be seen in the code, while Pragmatic, NLC and others on info page. Play 'n GO can be brutal at some sites, as they have 5 different RTP models (96%, 94%, 91%, 87% and 84%). Not arguing that online casinos can't increase/decrease RTPs, it's just that it's not an easy click of a button from their side. They need to contact game provider and request change from provider's side.

[famososMuertos]

RTP is some like the payment tolerance, the slot should have the RTP assigned ever. This would vary according to each provider and casino, but in general it is the same.

In any case there is a fairly well known thread here, where you can find more details and actually funnel your question into an existing discussion thread.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5249415.msg59307710#msg59307710
well, of course if you like it.

 

[ultraBTC]

 Hi

 Si it is true that RTP of slot games can be adapted to the casinos preferences ??

Hi Danydee,

Yes, casino can choose, or better say request different RTP settings, if the game provider has multiple RTP settings available. And the bad news is that in the last year and so, it's a trend amongst the online casinos, including some big names in the industry.
 

do all providers do this ?

No - there are software providers with a  fix RTP for every slot/casino game. But many of them offer multiple RTP versions.
Some of the providers that actually have ONE fix RTP version of the game(s) are:

Big Time Gaming
Relax Gaming
YGGDRASIL
Elk Studios
Iron Dog Studios
Nextgen Gaming
Kalamba Games

And what about when slots are accessed directly on the casino website, here anything can happen, things like avoiding use of RNG too.

In the case that games are hosted on different servers (not official servers of the game provider), then those are "fake" slots, and yes, anything can happen. Here I am talking about industry software providers (Pragmatic, Microgaming, BTG, NLC....etc).

[ralle14]

I'm not sure but I remember reading a similar discussion back then as the player tried to point out there was one casino that had a slightly higher payout compared to another casino even though the game is the same.

I think one of the slot providers that lets you do this is Booming or Betsoft, not sure if it's both of them but i'm sure that the name of the provider is starting with the letter "B" since these are the providers that most casinos have back then.

[Eureka_07]

I'm not sure but I remember reading a similar discussion back then as the player tried to point out there was one casino that had a slightly higher payout compared to another casino even though the game is the same.

I think one of the slot providers that lets you do this is Booming or Betsoft, not sure if it's both of them but i'm sure that the name of the provider is starting with the letter "B" since these are the providers that most casinos have back then.

I remember someone created a topic just like this before. Further discussions also is about if casinos can change the slots' RTP. Which most of the providers offers.

To add, if I'm not mistaken, online casinos' RTP on both DEMO and ACTUAL slot can be different, in which they add more RTP on the DEMO mode. Not sure if it's absolutely true, my experience on both gambling with real money and playing demo modes, in demo, I'm winning a lot. So I guess it is somewhat true.

[Danydee]

I'm not sure but I remember reading a similar discussion back then as the player tried to point out there was one casino that had a slightly higher payout compared to another casino even though the game is the same.

I think one of the slot providers that lets you do this is Booming or Betsoft, not sure if it's both of them but i'm sure that the name of the provider is starting with the letter "B" since these are the providers that most casinos have back then.

 I think Betsoft do, drastical difference frome one casino to another !

[ultraBTC]

To add, if I'm not mistaken, online casinos' RTP on both DEMO and ACTUAL slot can be different, in which they add more RTP on the DEMO mode. Not sure if it's absolutely true, my experience on both gambling with real money and playing demo modes, in demo, I'm winning a lot. So I guess it is somewhat true.

RTP on DEMO & ACTUAL slot SHOULD be the same. For an obvious reason, player should experience the same play on free play and real-money mode. Otherwise, it's not a fair deal to player. But, yeah, I have seen sample of a different RTP for a free & real money mode.

[mu_enrico]

YES, it's called RTP variance, more explanation here: Slots 103: More In-Depth about Return To Player (RTP)

Casinos aren't required to set its game to the highest RTP since each has a different strategy. For example: more bonus, more rakeback, better wagering race prize, etc. They can surely use the "excess profits" from lower RTP. BUT, some bad one just straight profiting more and not giving back to the players.

[ultraBTC]

 I think Betsoft do, drastical difference frome one casino to another !

Problems with Betsoft are some serious issues in the past. Although, must admit that they do have some very nice slot products in the terms of 3D graphic, animations & story, trust issue still stands up.

Some years back, there was a jackpot scandal where progressive jackpots weren't paying out at all. (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1531232.0)
And although a decade ago, there was a scandal with completely rigged Keno play at Absolute Poker.

[iv4n]

I think Betsoft do, drastical difference frome one casino to another !

Problems with Betsoft are some serious issues in the past. Although, must admit that they do have some very nice slot products in the terms of 3D graphic, animations & story, trust issue still stands up.

Some years back, there was a jackpot scandal where progressive jackpots weren't paying out at all. (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1531232.0)
And although a decade ago, there was a scandal with completely rigged Keno play at Absolute Poker.

I remember Jackson and his incredible win with 5 yachts! If I remember correctly he made a deal with Betcoin.ag and Betsoft and he got some money in the end, but not his full win?! Am I right?!

I also remember one small casino in the hood with a few slot machines...you open it from the back and with a key you can set up RTP! As you said already, some providers have fixed RTP for all casinos, probably their policy, but some are different... for already mentioned reasons:

Casinos aren't required to set its game to the highest RTP since each has a different strategy. For example: more bonus, more rakeback, better wagering race prize, etc. They can surely use the "excess profits" from lower RTP. BUT, some bad one just straight profiting more and not giving back to the players.

Exactly this! Some casinos are "fair", and some bad ones just wish for more profit and they don't care about giving back...

[seoincorporation]

Here's the point,
I've read somewhere here ( https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5383777 ) that RTP may vary from casino to another and can be adapted to the casinos wants !  In addition in some casinos software is executed under (the website/casino URL), normally it should redirects to the game provider servers, so you know you are running the game from the original makers,  but running the game under another (Interface if we could say) there's no more, or any insurance there, and everything can happen.

I agree with you in that, and that's why we should be careful when we select a casino to gamble our coins, If you know that some casinos have a variable RTP just stay away from them and share the message with the community. We always appreciate any warning about new scams schemes.

As I mentioned in the first, for me if a site has an RTP variable, that only means it's rigged. I'm not saying users will never win, I say the house will always win and no luck will be involved in that.

[Saint-loup]

 Si it is true that RTP of slot games can be adapted to the casinos preferences ??
 
 do all providers do this ?

As far as I know that's not the case. I am not an expert on slot games, but I noticed that several big online casinos all use the same slot games. The games are developed by third parties and have a fixed return to player ratio. With the help of Google we can find RTP for the slot game before playing. The casino itself has no real impact on the game, they just provide the platform and customers for it. Also the casinos don't need to change the RTP, because all the slots are already profitable for the casino. The longer we play the closer we will get to the expected value, which is negative for us gamblers. Did you have a streak of bad luck?

Did you read the posts of the OP before replying and asking him if he rather had a streak of bad luck bro? Did you even read the merited posts of this one single page thread?   You should be more careful because DT members have started to red tag the shitposts of this section. Look at that please https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=trust;u=898552
In regards to RTP settings it's not the first time people are talking about this matter here, it's a pretty well known fact actually

[...]
and the team gave a similar answer on Trustpilot recently

We're sorry you haven't found the results you were looking for on Stake. Gambling can be volatile sometimes.

At Stake, all games have the highest RTP settings. This can actually be verified within the game. I suggest potentially contacting the providers themselves if you're feeling uneasy about the RTP offered. This is handled by them & they can safely assure you the same & that our settings are indeed lining up with what we offer.
[...]

https://www.trustpilot.com/reviews/60b5a3def9f4870a94b25e50

[BrutalFive]

 Hi

 Si it is true that RTP of slot games can be adapted to the casinos preferences ??
 
 do all providers do this ?


 And what about when slots are accessed directly on the casino website, here anything can happen, things like avoiding use of RNG too.



 Thanks to everybody

I think in theory it is impossible, moreover, the games are certified. All slots that you access on casinos websites are provided via API. This means that the casino is a kind of an intermediary between you and software producers.

[ultraBTC]

 Hi

 Si it is true that RTP of slot games can be adapted to the casinos preferences ??
 
 do all providers do this ?


 And what about when slots are accessed directly on the casino website, here anything can happen, things like avoiding use of RNG too.



 Thanks to everybody

I think in theory it is impossible, moreover, the games are certified. All slots that you access on casinos websites are provided via API. This means that the casino is a kind of an intermediary between you and software producers.

Hi BrutalFive,

The question was if RTP of slot games can  be adapted to casino preferences. Well, let's say not adapted but the FACT is that casinos CAN choose RTP settings if they are available on software provider's side.
Look for example, the latest release from the Nolimit City game provider:



There are two RTP settings options: 96.09% & 94.13%
Some providers have more RTP settings options, like Pragmatic Play (3 RTP settings). And some, don't have options of lower RTP settings, just default/top one.

Hope this helps.

[Saint-loup]

I think in theory it is impossible, moreover, the games are certified. All slots that you access on casinos websites are provided via API. This means that the casino is a kind of an intermediary between you and software producers.

Hi BrutalFive,

The question was if RTP of slot games can  be adapted to casino preferences. Well, let's say not adapted but the FACT is that casinos CAN choose RTP settings if they are available on software provider's side.
Look for example, the latest release from the Nolimit City game provider:



There are two RTP settings options: 96.09% & 94.13%
Some providers have more RTP settings options, like Pragmatic Play (3 RTP settings). And some, don't have options of lower RTP settings, just default/top one.

Hope this helps.

You seem to have very accurate and professional informations, usually not shared with the users. May I ask you how do you get all these informations? Did you find them on other forums or blogs (could you tell me which ones please I'm interested in the subject) or you are working for an online casino? Thank you very much for your informations.

[ultraBTC]

Hello Danydee

I don't think the casinos can make public this information because a variable RTP would mean they are rigged.

To clear this up. Different RTP setting doesn't mean that slot game/online casino is rigged. The online slot is/should be random operating on 97% RTP or 89% RTP. (Take online sportsbook as an example. Offering lower odds than the competition is not rigged as per default.)

Btw, some licenses DO require showing RTP info publicly and on every single slot/casino game (help/info file on particular slot).

Software providers are businesses offering their services to different online casinos & markets. Different markets/countries/licenses have different demands & operating costs. It is up to the management of online casinos to decide which business model to choose and calculate costs VS profits.

On the other hand, it's up to players to choose where are the best chances to play. But the fact is that a few percentages of lower RTP settings can affect players' play-time drastically in the long term.


I will make a separate in-depth thread on this subject when I catch some extra time.

[rijaljun]

-snip-

I really like this type of threads because it will make you think about the sites to choose to play and deal with. I am honestly not so educated about this topic, and through reading the replies here, made me realize of the misconceptions that I have been holding to for a long time now. I hope that you will update here about your separate thread @ultraBTC.

[ultraBTC]

-snip-

I really like this type of threads because it will make you think about the sites to choose to play and deal with. I am honestly not so educated about this topic, and through reading the replies here, made me realize of the misconceptions that I have been holding to for a long time now. I hope that you will update here about your separate thread @ultraBTC.

Of course rijaljun. Will make update here about the separate thread.