Coinplay CONFISCATING 291mbtc of fair NBA winnings

[GekkeBelg]

Hello,

A couple days ago Coinplay decided to close my account and confiscate all my sports bet winnings (291mbtc).
Let me tell you what happened:
After having monitored their ANN thread regularly since December last year to read about experiences from users about Coinplay, I finally decided after 3 months of hesitating to open an account at Coinplay.com on Monday 20th March. Oh boy, do I regret that decision now.
I deposited 70mbtc to start betting live on NBA. I only bet on NBA game winner market, never any totals or handicaps. First day I only placed 1 bet on Warriors to beat Houston at very low odds, which was a winner making my balance 84mbtc. Then the next day I placed my 84mbtc balance on the Clippers versus Oklahoma, which sadly lost. So the third day (Wednesday) I had to make another deposit, this time I did 200mbtc. I placed some more bets: Warriors to beat Dallas, Miami to beat Knicks, Lakers to beat Suns and 2 separate bets on Portland to beat Utah. All of them were favourites in range from 1,40 to 1,65 odds, apart from Lakers which were small underdogs at 2.20 odds. Lucky for me, all my bets won this day and my balance was 561mbtc after this Wednesday 22th of March. This meant 270mbtc deposit total plus 291mbtc of winnings. So I decided to quit for the day and withdraw 200mbtc, planning to play on with the remaining funds the next day.
But then a couple minutes after requesting my withdrawal I was suddenly auto-logged out from my account. I tried to log back in but the system said I had entered a wrong password even though I was 100% sure I had the correct one. So I went into livechat and was asked to email to security@coinplay.com so I did.
Then I got the response "hello, your request has been sent to the specialist, wait for the answer". And then 15 minutes later the following email:


foto online

So I was flabbergasted, that they simply decided to confiscate my winnings even though all I did was place a couple of NBA bets. It is just a very vague copy/paste of some terms which basically state that I have somehow "manipulated" or "cheated"....and the joke is also that it says "the decision was made after a careful investigation". How careful can an investigation have been when it took less than 30 minutes in total? Within an hour of my bets being settled or within even 30 mins from my withdrawal request this "investigation" had already been concluded.

Let me summarize the facts:
- I am not from a forbidden country, I live in Germany
- I have not bet using VPN, I simply used my normal German IP-address
- I have not bet on dodgy unknown leagues where I could maybe gain an unfair advantage
- All my bets were on one of the biggest leagues in the world: the NBA. And not even on handicaps or totals but the most reliable market of them all: the game winner market
- I have not used any software or robots placing my bets
- I did not claim any bonus
- I only have one account

So all in all my experience with Coinplay has been horrible. I have done nothing wrong and I am being accused of manipulating and cheating when I simply bet on a huge world famous league. How on earth can I manipulate or cheat with those bets? And how on earth can Coinplay determine this within 30 mins from my withdrawal request?
Why was nothing wrong yet with my betting when I lost my first deposit of 70mbtc? Why only after a winning run?
I sent an email to Coinplay stating I did nothing wrong and asked them to re-evaluate their decision, but waited now 4 days and received zero response.

My conclusion is that Coinplay is an abosolute scam and they are free-rolling their customers: if you lose they gladly take your money but if you win they only return the deposit. This is simply theft and I need to warn every Bitcointalk user against this practice. Coinplay are welcome to defend themselves and maybe they finally see that they made the wrong decision here to treat me as a cheater, and hopefully they re-instate my account. It can always be the case that they had an internal miscommunication about me and by accident flagged me as an abuser, in that case they are free to admit this here and the case will be closed. We all make mistakes, it's just how you handle them what determines how good or bad you actually are. But until that happens: AVOID Coinplay.com if you want to receive your fairly earned winnings. I will give them some time to respond and will create a flag against them if this does not lead to a solution. I will also file complaints with their Curacao license holder and with Askgamblers and if that does not help, will even take legal action on a no-cure, no-pay basis with a Curacao lawyer I know.

Here you can see all bets which have been voided after they were already settled, and now have odds of 1.00:


Here you can see my transactions on the account. First my 70mbtc deposit, then my 200mbtc deposit, then my rejected 200mbtc withdrawal and then my succesful withdrawal of only the 270mbtc deposited funds. After that my account got closed down and right now I cannot login anymore.


And here you can see my profile page with my account number and emailaddress:

[1715275666]

1715275666

[1715275666]

1715275666

[1715275666]

1715275666

[1715275666]

1715275666

[1715275666]

1715275666

[Getmon]

That was bad. From the opposite side, we would like to hear from the Bitcointalk representative of CoinPlay, @CoinPlay_official. Given that @CoinPlay_official is just beginning to establish a name for themselves in Bitcointalk, we anticipate that they will handle your case fairly.

By playing with their TOC, some of these bookmakers might be taking advantage of their customers. For the purposes of evidence, it would appear that we would require a screenshot each time we place bets in the event that the bookmakers will close our accounts without prior notice.

[coupable]

Waiting for an answer from the official representative of Coinplay, I think that the amount that you could not withdraw, that is, that remained in your account before it was closed, is not an important amount that one could risk losing his reputation for. Perhaps if there were other complaints about other users experiencing the same situation, the suspicions would be legitimate. But the platform has been working effectively since its launch and the signature campaign it runs proves that as well. I don't think they accuse you of trying to manipulate their system without obvious reasons.
By the way, why didn't you post your problem on their official announcement before accusing them directly in a this board?
Coinplay.com | Brand New Crypto Sportsbook & Casino

[GekkeBelg]

Waiting for an answer from the official representative of Coinplay, I think that the amount that you could not withdraw, that is, that remained in your account before it was closed, is not an important amount that one could risk losing his reputation for. Perhaps if there were other complaints about other users experiencing the same situation, the suspicions would be legitimate. But the platform has been working effectively since its launch and the signature campaign it runs proves that as well. I don't think they accuse you of trying to manipulate their system without obvious reasons.
By the way, why didn't you post your problem on their official announcement before accusing them directly in a this board?
Coinplay.com | Brand New Crypto Sportsbook & Casino

Because I have already contacted them per email. Wrote a long email and received zero reply.

[dbc23]

Let me summarize the facts:
- I am not from a forbidden country, I live in Germany
- I have not bet using VPN, I simply used my normal German IP-address
- I have not bet on dodgy unknown leagues where I could maybe gain an unfair advantage
- All my bets were on one of the biggest leagues in the world: the NBA. And not even on handicaps or totals but the most reliable market of them all: the game winner market
- I have not used any software or robots placing my bets
- I did not claim any bonus
- I only have one account

It will be difficult to ascertain  all this claims if there are no proofs. Victims sometimes are always in a hurry to present situations in a way that favours them. I am not saying that could be your case but to be on the fair side Coinplay will need to respond to the thread, with their own side of the story to avoid been bias. If none of this rules was violated it is impossible to get your account blocked. Lets hope your side of the story is clean and clear and wait for Coinplay to share theirs.

[TwitchySeal]

Reminds me of 1xbit.

Can't think of any reasonable explanation aside from OP leaving out very important details, which seems unlikely after skimming his history.

I left feedback for coinplay and would support a flag at this point.

[GekkeBelg]

Let me summarize the facts:
- I am not from a forbidden country, I live in Germany
- I have not bet using VPN, I simply used my normal German IP-address
- I have not bet on dodgy unknown leagues where I could maybe gain an unfair advantage
- All my bets were on one of the biggest leagues in the world: the NBA. And not even on handicaps or totals but the most reliable market of them all: the game winner market
- I have not used any software or robots placing my bets
- I did not claim any bonus
- I only have one account

It will be difficult to ascertain  all this claims if there are no proofs. Victims sometimes are always in a hurry to present situations in a way that favours them. I am not saying that could be your case but to be on the fair side Coinplay will need to respond to the thread, with their own side of the story to avoid been bias. If none of this rules was violated it is impossible to get your account blocked. Lets hope your side of the story is clean and clear and wait for Coinplay to share theirs.

I think we live in a world where the one confiscating is the one having to submit the proof for their actions. Or can people just confiscate stuff and then the victim has to prove he has NOT done something wrong? That would be a sick world to live in.

[Ryker1]

I quickly checked their announcement thread but it seems like unlawful behavior, they did not even reply or give their explanation here to depend on their side. But we hope they will settle this problem, all their effort on their campaign or reputation here in the forum will be ruined once this case will be left unsolved.
Look at the post of their representative on the previous case, which seems the same as your problem and I think this will perhaps be the reason they will give you.
^{[ https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5441574.msg61865721#msg61865721 ]}

[CoinEraser]

In the Coinplay thread, I also recommended that the official Coinplay account react to this accusation and solve the whole case. Will continue to keep an eye on the case and should a flag be created, also support it. Either way, I hope the case will be solved without a flag and the OP will get his account and/or his BTC back.  

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5420930.msg61993206#msg61993206

[Learn Bitcoin]

Oh wow.
That is very detailed information, and it seems Coinplay simply trying to scam this guy. Coinplay is here for a couple of months only, and there was another scam accusation against them. Coinplay scammed me out of 1300 USDT. The old scam accusation was partially solved as the Coinplay team returned his deposit. But he is not satisfied with that. Coinplay representative account was active a few minutes ago. They did not bother to write anything yet even though they already got a negative feedback. Interesting case to follow.

[rohang]

Reminds me of 1xbit.

Can't think of any reasonable explanation aside from OP leaving out very important details, which seems unlikely after skimming his history.

I left feedback for coinplay and would support a flag at this point.

This 10000%

Its definitely 1xbit/1xbet/22bet

The responses received are definitely from the same people/cust support. (they always say "wait for specialist")

Its just a 1xbet scam and i wouldnt expect the winnings @OP

[BitcoinGirl.Club]

But he is not satisfied with that. Coinplay representative account was active a few minutes ago.

Don't expect everyone to find everything that is happening on the forum. Have anyone informed them about the accusation? Looking at the account history I can assume they don't even notice the red tag LOL

Because I have already contacted them per email. Wrote a long email and received zero reply.

You better send them a PM. I have PMed a few people today so far. I don't want to PM anymore in case there are any limit set for PM and I hit it 🤣

[LoyceV]

But he is not satisfied with that. Coinplay representative account was active a few minutes ago.

Don't expect everyone to find everything that is happening on the forum. Have anyone informed them about the accusation?

OP posted in their topic:

Coinplay have scammed me out of my fairly won NBA winnings. Read more about it here:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5446504.msg61986669#msg61986669

You better send them a PM. I have PMed a few people today so far. I don't want to PM anymore in case there are any limit set for PM and I hit it 🤣

You're "limited" to 1200 PMs per day.

[CoinPlay_official]

Hi GekkeBelg,

We understand your frustration, but please be assured that our Risk & Fraud Team does not ban players without a valid reason. We are unable to share specific details about the investigation, as it might inadvertently help potential cheaters.

We also noticed that you have posted a few similar topics on this forum, playing with various bookmakers. This pattern might raise concerns about the possibility of cheating.

While you're free to have your opinion, we stand by our team's decision. We returned your initial deposit and won't be providing further support on this issue.

[Learn Bitcoin]

We are unable to share specific details about the investigation, as it might inadvertently help potential cheaters.

You don't have to share everything in public. Would you mind Cooperating with 3rd party mediators? May we know which mediators you guys support?

While you're free to have your opinion, we stand by our team's decision. We returned your initial deposit and won't be providing further support on this issue.

He already wrote the case in detail. I don't think he has to share more details about it. You should provide support on this case unless you want to ruin the reputation you are trying to build in this forum. I guess you already noticed the negative feedback on your profile.

[TwitchySeal]

Hi GekkeBelg,

We understand your frustration, but please be assured that our Risk & Fraud Team does not ban players without a valid reason. We are unable to share specific details about the investigation, as it might inadvertently help potential cheaters.

We also noticed that you have posted a few similar topics on this forum, playing with various bookmakers. This pattern might raise concerns about the possibility of cheating.

While you're free to have your opinion, we stand by our team's decision. We returned your initial deposit and won't be providing further support on this issue.

Had a feeling this would be the response.

If you think someone's a sharp bettor and don't want their action, that's fine.  But you can't make that decision retroactively since being a sharp bettor that gets limited often doesn't make you a cheater. 

OP create a flag.  

[bachezy]

Hello! Same thing happened to me few weeks ago.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5441574.0

They are scammers, complete copy of 1xbit, sorry for your loss

[GekkeBelg]

Hi GekkeBelg,

We understand your frustration, but please be assured that our Risk & Fraud Team does not ban players without a valid reason. We are unable to share specific details about the investigation, as it might inadvertently help potential cheaters.

We also noticed that you have posted a few similar topics on this forum, playing with various bookmakers. This pattern might raise concerns about the possibility of cheating.

While you're free to have your opinion, we stand by our team's decision. We returned your initial deposit and won't be providing further support on this issue.

You cannot just confiscate a balance and then not share any details about it. That is outright theft.

The fact that I had 2 scam accusations in this forum before has NOTHING to do with my case with Coinplay. First of all when you confiscated my winnings you did not know about those 2 earlier scam accusations because you didn't even know my username in here, and secondly in those 2 scam accusations the other party paid me out my funds so they agreed with me that I was right in the end.

Do you dare to direct my case to an independent party such as Askgamblers or Ecogra and let their decision be binding? If you are 100% sure you have proof that I cheated then this should be the golden opportunity for you to a) keep my winnings in your pockets and b) brush up your reputation on here.
If you refuse then I cannot conclude otherwise than that you have something to hide and know you are in the wrong here.

[AHOYBRAUSE]

100% scam confirmed.
How would anybody be able to "cheat" on NBA games I wonder. hahaha

This reply is a spit in the face of every customer.
Investigation, yeah right.

Freerolling their players, that's it. At least these people gave him the deposit back, unlike 1xbit.

You should definitely create a flag against them, just as TwitchySeal suggested. Hope it gets a lot of support so others will be warned of this site.

[John Abraham]

If you refuse then I cannot conclude otherwise than that you have something to hide and know you are in the wrong here.

OP, I don't think they will follow what community members suggest. Would you please create a flag, as TwitchySeal already suggested? If they want to prove that they are not guilty and maintain their reputation, They will have to go with 3rd party mediators. You have already Invited them, and other members also asked if they will cooperate with 3rd party mediators. Create a flag and add the link to the OP.

BTW, Coinplay already has an inactive flag created by bachezy for a similar case which can be found from here https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=trust;u=3502111;page=iflags. Until they solve the issues, Avoid Coinplay.

[GekkeBelg]

Coinplay, I give you until Saturday to reverse your decision and pay me out my fair NBA winnings. Or to agree to hand over the case to an independent investigator such as Askgamblers or Ecogra (you can choose which one). If you do neither of these 2 options then a flag will be created and a complaint will be filed at the Curacao Antillephone license, which I know has the best reputation out of all 4 license providers in Curacao, and they will take my complaint seriously.

You can end this right here and save your reputation. Be wise.

[Learn Bitcoin]

Coinplay, I give you until Saturday to reverse your decision and pay me out my fair NBA winnings. Or to agree to hand over the case to an independent investigator such as Askgamblers or Ecogra (you can choose which one). If you do neither of these 2 options then a flag will be created and a complaint will be filed at the Curacao Antillephone license, which I know has the best reputation out of all 4 license providers in Curacao, and they will take my complaint seriously.

You can end this right here and save your reputation. Be wise.

OP, I saw you posted the same post on two different threads (Here and Coinplay ANN), which is on two different boards. Kindly avoid doing such things as it violates the forum rules. If you want let them know, You can write different words and refer them to another post that you wrote on different boards.

12. No duplicate posting in multiple boards (except for re-posting topics in the local language boards if they're translated and re-posting marketplace topics in the altcoin boards if altcoins are accepted).

[Mahdirakib]

~snip~

You are just wasting your time by giving them the opportunity to pay your winnings. Coinplay representative has already said that they won't help you to get back your winnings.

While you're free to have your opinion, we stand by our team's decision. We returned your initial deposit and won't be providing further support on this issue.

I believe that they won't change their decision if you submit a complaint to a mediation center. Someone has filed a complaint on Askgamblers with similar issue, but Coinplay representative hasn't provided any evidence to the Askgamblers team.

We regret to inform you that despite the AskGamblers Complaint Team requests, Coinplay Casino management cannot provide reasonable justification and/or solid evidence which could prove the validity of the accusations against player.

Unfortunately, in this situation, the AskGamblers Complaint Team has no other choice but to close the case as unresolved and advise the player to seek further assistance from the relevant regulatory body or appointed ADR entity.

So, don't expect anything more from them. Moreover, they are somehow connected with 1xbit casino. We (some forum members) tried to highlight it in their ANN thread before. Both casinos have similar UI. At first, they were showing the old licences information of 1xbit (1xbet) in their casino terms page (see here). Their affiliate terms are also same. Now Coinplay is scamming the users in the same way as 1xbit does. You should create a flag against them ASAP.

[RapTarX]

My bad if I sound stupid!
I just had a visit at OP's profile after reading what coinplay told about your previous accusation about other casinos. You had almost the same problem with owl.games, wintomato, buff.bet; none of these are reputed casinos & coinplay as well. Don't you place bets in reputed casinos? Have you ever encountered such issues? If you haven't, what has influenced you to switch casinos all the time and try new & less reputed casinos? I don't want to conclude anything so fast. Your accusation seems solid with the proof you presented. Can you please share us why you are influenced to check out a new casino all the time despite facing such issues all the time?

[GekkeBelg]

My bad if I sound stupid!
I just had a visit at OP's profile after reading what coinplay told about your previous accusation about other casinos. You had almost the same problem with owl.games, wintomato, buff.bet; none of these are reputed casinos & coinplay as well. Don't you place bets in reputed casinos? Have you ever encountered such issues? If you haven't, what has influenced you to switch casinos all the time and try new & less reputed casinos? I don't want to conclude anything so fast. Your accusation seems solid with the proof you presented. Can you please share us why you are influenced to check out a new casino all the time despite facing such issues all the time?

Ofcourse I do place bets at reputaple sportsbook too. I have accounts at about 50 different sportsbooks. But if I don't encounter a problem, you will ofcourse not hear anything about it. Yes, sometimes I post a compliment to a sportsbook in their ANN thread, but ofcourse you only see a scam accusation topic opened about sportsbooks where I have a problem with. Btw, with Owl and Buff the issue was not sportsbook related, but they thought I was from a forbidden country when I wasn't. The only sportsbook issue I had was with Wintomato, but they agreed to pay me out after a long discussion.

[RapTarX]

Ofcourse I do place bets at reputaple sportsbook too. I have accounts at about 50 different sportsbooks. But if I don't encounter a problem, you will ofcourse not hear anything about it. Yes, sometimes I post a compliment to a sportsbook in their ANN thread, but ofcourse you only see a scam accusation topic opened about sportsbooks where I have a problem with. Btw, with Owl and Buff the issue was not sportsbook related, but they thought I was from a forbidden country when I wasn't. The only sportsbook issue I had was with Wintomato, but they agreed to pay me out after a long discussion.

I guess I don't have the right to know but once again I'm asking though you have skipped answering that part of my post/question. What is exactly influencing you to switch/try new casinos a lot of times when you know they can be outright scams? In fact, you have been the victim; this isn't the first time. All of your previous cases had the same approach which brings a concern but I'm still trusting your proofs attached above; you seem to be a trusted guy as well.

[2double0]

OP, it has now become a common practice for gambling websites that show up, advertise here and believe that they will get unbelievable amount of deposits to first pay their players, and then start stealing from them or others who play there. Unfortunately, there are not enough measures available for gamblers to understand what can they do in such cases, where some don't even show up and leave their money on the table. There ain't no enough supportive areas where a gambler can go if he is innocent and becomes a victim of such mischief from a casino. Casinos that do not gain enough from advertising here, just do it straight by stopping the winners winning huge because the casino does not have enough balance to pay the winner.

However, I would still wait to see if coinplay has something reasonable to play say here to prove their point.

[GekkeBelg]

Ofcourse I do place bets at reputaple sportsbook too. I have accounts at about 50 different sportsbooks. But if I don't encounter a problem, you will ofcourse not hear anything about it. Yes, sometimes I post a compliment to a sportsbook in their ANN thread, but ofcourse you only see a scam accusation topic opened about sportsbooks where I have a problem with. Btw, with Owl and Buff the issue was not sportsbook related, but they thought I was from a forbidden country when I wasn't. The only sportsbook issue I had was with Wintomato, but they agreed to pay me out after a long discussion.

I guess I don't have the right to know but once again I'm asking though you have skipped answering that part of my post/question. What is exactly influencing you to switch/try new casinos a lot of times when you know they can be outright scams? In fact, you have been the victim; this isn't the first time. All of your previous cases had the same approach which brings a concern but I'm still trusting your proofs attached above; you seem to be a trusted guy as well.

Because I want to have different odds and betting types to choose from.

[CoinPlay_official]

Hi GekkeBelg,

For an independent review, we will proceed with sharing the relevant details of your case with a third party - Askgamblers, as you've suggested. We appreciate your patience during this process.

[LoyceV]

For an independent review, we will proceed with sharing the relevant details of your case with a third party - Askgamblers, as you've suggested. We appreciate your patience during this process.

Will you honor the outcome of their review?

[John Abraham]

Hi GekkeBelg,

For an independent review, we will proceed with sharing the relevant details of your case with a third party - Askgamblers, as you've suggested. We appreciate your patience during this process.

An excellent decision ended. As LoyceV already asked, Will you accept the result will come from AskGamblers?
OP has dared you to cooperate with 3rd party company, and you agreed. The entire investigation and time will be wasted if one of the parties disagrees with the result.

Moreover, they are somehow connected with 1xbit casino. We (some forum members) tried to highlight it in their ANN thread before. Both casinos have similar UI. At first, they were showing the old licences information of 1xbit (1xbet) in their casino terms page (see here). Their affiliate terms are also same. Now Coinplay is scamming the users in the same way as 1xbit does. You should create a flag against them ASAP.

Oh wow. I didn't know that. A good piece of Information. I am sure other forum members don't know about this as well.
If they are somehow connected with 1xbit/1xbet. I won't expect a good result from the investigation as well. yeah, I noticed the way how it starts with (Incorrect password). Since Coinplay agreed to cooperate with askgamblers, let's see what they come up with.

[GekkeBelg]

Coinplay, thank you for letting Askgamblers have a look at the case. Can you email me a screenshot (or post it here for even more transparency) of what request you have sent to Askgamblers? You don't need to include your "evidence" with it, only just show us the email you sent to Askgamblers with the request for them to review the case.

[dimonstration]

Coinplay, thank you for letting Askgamblers have a look at the case. Can you email me a screenshot (or post it here for even more transparency) of what request you have sent to Askgamblers? You don't need to include your "evidence" with it, only just show us the email you sent to Askgamblers with the request for them to review the case.

Afaik, Askgambler will update you about the case, as per the evidence and conversation will always be discreet. Wait for Askgambler reply to you because they will ask you some information related on answering what Coinplay submitted and accuses you. You agree to use askgambler as 3rd party mediator to your case. Sharing what’s he submit here is useless because forum can’t interfere on your active case.

You can share the link of your complain thread here if you are the one who submits it. But all the conversations should stay on Askgambler platform because this already outside the forum.

[bittraffic]

Is askgamblers really that reliable in mediating such issue?
It's the first time I read something like this will happen in bitcointalk where both party will ask askgamblers to be in the middle. Won't they ask fees to resolve the issue too?

If it were to be solved quickly coinplay could just give the winning after all it seems the pieces of evidence are telling OP is doing it right. No violation.

[CoinPlay_official]

Coinplay, thank you for letting Askgamblers have a look at the case. Can you email me a screenshot (or post it here for even more transparency) of what request you have sent to Askgamblers? You don't need to include your "evidence" with it, only just show us the email you sent to Askgamblers with the request for them to review the case.

We meant to say that you should open a complaint on Askgamblers, where we both will provide the necessary details for them to review your case.

[TwitchySeal]

Coinplay, thank you for letting Askgamblers have a look at the case. Can you email me a screenshot (or post it here for even more transparency) of what request you have sent to Askgamblers? You don't need to include your "evidence" with it, only just show us the email you sent to Askgamblers with the request for them to review the case.

We meant to say that you should open a complaint on Askgamblers, where we both will provide the necessary details for them to review your case.

You should explicitly confirm that you will honor AskGamblers decision and pay GekkeBelg his winnings if they rule in his favor.

This is important if you hope to build any trust around here.

[RapTarX]

Is askgamblers really that reliable in mediating such issue?
It's the first time I read something like this will happen in bitcointalk where both party will ask askgamblers to be in the middle. Won't they ask fees to resolve the issue too?

If it were to be solved quickly coinplay could just give the winning after all it seems the pieces of evidence are telling OP is doing it right. No violation.

They are quite familiar faces in the casino industry. They used to value real players' opinions when rating a casino.

We meant to say that you should open a complaint on Askgamblers, where we both will provide the necessary details for them to review your case.

That's a great step from you. I really hope you solve the issue & prove that you aren't another 1xBit sister site. Well, you can consider sharing the proofs with an established member here so it gets easy for you to solve the issue here and save your reputation. Please confirm that you are going to honor Askgambler decision.

[BitcoinGirl.Club]

Coinplay, thank you for letting Askgamblers have a look at the case. Can you email me a screenshot (or post it here for even more transparency) of what request you have sent to Askgamblers? You don't need to include your "evidence" with it, only just show us the email you sent to Askgamblers with the request for them to review the case.

We meant to say that you should open a complaint on Askgamblers, where we both will provide the necessary details for them to review your case.

Interesting development. Looking forward to see who wins.

[...]

Ofcourse I do place bets at reputaple sportsbook too. I have accounts at about 50 different sportsbooks. But if I don't encounter a problem, you will ofcourse not hear anything about it. Yes, sometimes I post a compliment to a sportsbook in their ANN thread, but ofcourse you only see a scam accusation topic opened about sportsbooks where I have a problem with. Btw, with Owl and Buff the issue was not sportsbook related, but they thought I was from a forbidden country when I wasn't. The only sportsbook issue I had was with Wintomato, but they agreed to pay me out after a long discussion.

[....]

Because I want to have different odds and betting types to choose from.

I find it interesting. Do you always use all these 50 different sportsbooks all the time or you eventually find yourself in a difficult situation with one and they ban/disallow you gambling on their platform, you move to another one. I used to be a regular gambler and I only used few accounts at a time, as far as I remember, regularly I was able to use only maximum two of them despite having accounts with many sportsbooks. It's just not possible to check in with all the accounts you have and regularly gamble from all of the accounts. If I remember in my peak time, I was using only Paddy Power and Bet365. Both used to have variety of choices. While I had accounts with Williamhill, Coral, Betfair, Ladbrokes, bwin but all together not more than 8 bookies though.

You better send them a PM. I have PMed a few people today so far. I don't want to PM anymore in case there are any limit set for PM and I hit it 🤣

You're "limited" to 1200 PMs per day.

The algorithm behind this bot amaze me always 😉

[GekkeBelg]

Coinplay, thank you for letting Askgamblers have a look at the case. Can you email me a screenshot (or post it here for even more transparency) of what request you have sent to Askgamblers? You don't need to include your "evidence" with it, only just show us the email you sent to Askgamblers with the request for them to review the case.

We meant to say that you should open a complaint on Askgamblers, where we both will provide the necessary details for them to review your case.

I have now submitted the complaint. This is what they wrote to me, so it will take some time before the complaint goes live on their website:

We strive to review and proceed your complaint within 48 hours, however it may take up to 96 hours in case our team is experiencing high volume of new submitted cases.

Check your inbox regularly as we'll notify you of your complaint status. Explore our Help Centre for more info.

[TwitchySeal]

Coinplay, thank you for letting Askgamblers have a look at the case. Can you email me a screenshot (or post it here for even more transparency) of what request you have sent to Askgamblers? You don't need to include your "evidence" with it, only just show us the email you sent to Askgamblers with the request for them to review the case.

We meant to say that you should open a complaint on Askgamblers, where we both will provide the necessary details for them to review your case.

I have now submitted the complaint. This is what they wrote to me, so it will take some time before the complaint goes live on their website:

We strive to review and proceed your complaint within 48 hours, however it may take up to 96 hours in case our team is experiencing high volume of new submitted cases.

Check your inbox regularly as we'll notify you of your complaint status. Explore our Help Centre for more info.

Wouldn't get your hopes up.  I think the most likely outcome here is they rule in your favor and still don't get paid.  It's like they're freerolling arbitration.

[GekkeBelg]

Coinplay, thank you for letting Askgamblers have a look at the case. Can you email me a screenshot (or post it here for even more transparency) of what request you have sent to Askgamblers? You don't need to include your "evidence" with it, only just show us the email you sent to Askgamblers with the request for them to review the case.

We meant to say that you should open a complaint on Askgamblers, where we both will provide the necessary details for them to review your case.

I have now submitted the complaint. This is what they wrote to me, so it will take some time before the complaint goes live on their website:

We strive to review and proceed your complaint within 48 hours, however it may take up to 96 hours in case our team is experiencing high volume of new submitted cases.

Check your inbox regularly as we'll notify you of your complaint status. Explore our Help Centre for more info.

Wouldn't get your hopes up.  I think the most likely outcome here is they rule in your favor and still don't get paid.  It's like they're freerolling arbitration.

That would be double sad.....then they really get their reputation down the drain. Let's not assume that.

[BitcoinGirl.Club]

That would be double sad.....then they really get their reputation down the drain. Let's not assume that.

Any update on the case?

Also I would like to hear your thoughts about the following that I asked and you did not response on it yet.

[...]
I find it interesting. Do you always use all these 50 different sportsbooks all the time or you eventually find yourself in a difficult situation with one and they ban/disallow you gambling on their platform, you move to another one. I used to be a regular gambler and I only used few accounts at a time, as far as I remember, regularly I was able to use only maximum two of them despite having accounts with many sportsbooks. It's just not possible to check in with all the accounts you have and regularly gamble from all of the accounts. If I remember in my peak time, I was using only Paddy Power and Bet365. Both used to have variety of choices. While I had accounts with Williamhill, Coral, Betfair, Ladbrokes, bwin but all together not more than 8 bookies though.[...]

[GekkeBelg]

This morning the complaint was published by Askgamblers, and can be found here:
https://www.askgamblers.com/casino-complaints/coinplay-casino-closing-account-and-confiscating-winnings-with-no-further-justification

Coinplay, you still have 80 hours left to respond in there. And everyone can follow the case on the URL above.

[GekkeBelg]

That would be double sad.....then they really get their reputation down the drain. Let's not assume that.

Any update on the case?

Also I would like to hear your thoughts about the following that I asked and you did not response on it yet.

[...]
I find it interesting. Do you always use all these 50 different sportsbooks all the time or you eventually find yourself in a difficult situation with one and they ban/disallow you gambling on their platform, you move to another one. I used to be a regular gambler and I only used few accounts at a time, as far as I remember, regularly I was able to use only maximum two of them despite having accounts with many sportsbooks. It's just not possible to check in with all the accounts you have and regularly gamble from all of the accounts. If I remember in my peak time, I was using only Paddy Power and Bet365. Both used to have variety of choices. While I had accounts with Williamhill, Coral, Betfair, Ladbrokes, bwin but all together not more than 8 bookies though.[...]

I don't use all 50 at the same time. Some limited me, some I left myself because of odds I didn't like anymore. I play at about 5 at the same time. With saying I have 50 I meant I have used 50 different ones in the past.

[GekkeBelg]

https://www.askgamblers.com/casino-complaints/coinplay-casino-closing-account-and-confiscating-winnings-with-no-further-justification

Coinplay, you still have 22 hours left to answer on the Askgamblers thread, otherwise they will close it and rule in my favour and your rating will be lowered accordingly.

I once again state, if you have any proof of my "cheating" or "misleading" then be wise and do share it with Askgamblers. I give you permission to give all my sensitive and private information that you may have to them, I don't care. And if you care about your own "company secrets" then understand that you only need to give it to Askgamblers team, not to me or any other reader in here. You were the one who came up with the idea to move the case to Askgamblers yourself, so I assume you trust them. They will not do anything with the information you give them, no matter how "secret" it may be.
But, ofcourse, if the real reason why you don't want to share it is that you don't actually have anything tangible against me, then I truly wonder why you ever wanted to move the case to Askgamblers in the first place. So think about it and act accordingly within the next 22 hours, otherwise this case will be closed on Askgamblers.

[LoyceV]

Coinplay, you still have 22 hours left to answer on the Askgamblers thread, otherwise they will close it and rule in my favour and your rating will be lowered accordingly.

Allow me to quote AskGambler's response:

Kindly note that should the affected casino operator fail to respond to our email and your complaint within the allocated timeframe, the case will be closed as unresolved. As a direct consequence of such closure, the operator's ranking score on AskGamblers will be decreased accordingly.

I don't think that means they're ruling in your favour, it's just unresolved.

This is Coinplay's resonse (quote shortened):

The player violated the rules of our site which the player accepted upon registration. We provided all the evidence we could about this. We can't provide more information as it's too sensitive to share it.

In accordance with the rules of the service - we have the right to close the player's account if the player violates our rules, which was revealed by our Risk & Fraud department.

There's no evidence, which doesn't make the casino look good.

[TwitchySeal]

I don't think that means they're ruling in your favour, it's just unresolved.

Unsolved is the same as ruling in favor of the player.

I don't think there's any outcome other than solved or unsolved, other than rejected.  When they rule against the player, or they rule against the casino and the casino agrees to pay the player, the case is considered solved. Otherwise it's unsolved.


You can see basically identical case with Coinplay that ended up with the same outcome: https://www.askgamblers.com/casino-complaints/coinplay-casino-they-took-the-winnings-away




They're obviously following the 1xbit business model.

[LoyceV]

They're obviously following the 1xbit business model.

They also have an active signature campaign. @Royse777: please read this scam accusation.

[Wapfika]

They're obviously following the 1xbit business model.

It’s ironic how they agree to use 3rd party to arbitrage on the case and they failed to justify their own case against the user by not providing enough evidence.

I wonder how coinplay will react on this since there’s no more reason for them to deny the accusation since the evidence that they are hiding due to confidentiality is already invalidated by a trusted arbitrage service.

[Mahdirakib]

@GekkeBelg, I already told you that Coinplay won't change their decision even if you try to solve it through a mediator. I hope you wouldn't hesitate to create a flag against them now. You may use this post as a reference to show that Coinplay is a part of 1xbit casino.

I wonder how coinplay will react on this since there’s no more reason for them to deny the accusation ~~

Coinplay team will say the same thing everywhere which they have posted in Askgamblers complaint. 'LoyceV' has already quoted it above.

In accordance with the rules of the service - we have the right to close the player's account if the player violates our rules, which was revealed by our Risk & Fraud department.

Coinplay will scam other users in the same way. Then they will highlight some rules of their terms as a proof without providing any valid evidence.

[GekkeBelg]

Hi GekkeBelg,

For an independent review, we will proceed with sharing the relevant details of your case with a third party - Askgamblers, as you've suggested. We appreciate your patience during this process.

So, as you can see (https://www.askgamblers.com/casino-complaints/coinplay-casino-closing-account-and-confiscating-winnings-with-no-further-justification) the independent review by Askgamblers has been completed and they judge that you have not provided valid proof for the confiscation of my winnings. So Askgamblers ruled in my favour and your rating has been lowered from 7.3 to 5.8 on there.

Now it's time to pay me out my winnings. I am giving you up until Friday to re-instate my Coinplay account with the winnings on it. I will withdraw them and never come back. No further actions will be taken and you can keep your "information which was too sensitive to share with Askgamblers" to yourself. This topic will be closed and I will post a message that it has been resolved.

But, if you don't pay me then a flag will be created and your topic will have a scam warning all over it. All the efforts and money you put into your active signature campaign will be for nothing. Think wisely about your decision.

[T3PR00T]

So Askgamblers ruled in my favour

They did not ruled in your favour.

[acroman08]

So Askgamblers ruled in my favour

They did not ruled in your favour.

I am not siding with anyone but while it didn't specifically say that askgamblers's decision was in favour of OP, the fact askgamblers said that coinplay didn't provide enough evidence to justify the action they made against the gambler(OP) means that their action was questionable and should not have happened.

[Debra M]

Hi GekkeBelg,

For an independent review, we will proceed with sharing the relevant details of your case with a third party - Askgamblers, as you've suggested. We appreciate your patience during this process.

So, as you can see (https://www.askgamblers.com/casino-complaints/coinplay-casino-closing-account-and-confiscating-winnings-with-no-further-justification) the independent review by Askgamblers has been completed and they judge that you have not provided valid proof for the confiscation of my winnings. So Askgamblers ruled in my favour and your rating has been lowered from 7.3 to 5.8 on there.

Now it's time to pay me out my winnings. I am giving you up until Friday to re-instate my Coinplay account with the winnings on it. I will withdraw them and never come back. No further actions will be taken and you can keep your "information which was too sensitive to share with Askgamblers" to yourself. This topic will be closed and I will post a message that it has been resolved.

But, if you don't pay me then a flag will be created and your topic will have a scam warning all over it. All the efforts and money you put into your active signature campaign will be for nothing. Think wisely about your decision.

As an independent user, I must say that resorting to blackmail isn't the best approach to resolve this issue. It's important to remember that Coinplay has returned your deposit, even though they might have had the right to withhold it based on their Terms and Conditions. This gesture shows that they tried to address the situation fairly.

Additionally, playing on so many sportsbooks could raise suspicions about your intentions. While I understand that you're frustrated, I suggest considering a more constructive way to express your concerns. Remember, mutual understanding and compromise can go a long way in resolving conflicts. Good luck!

[TwitchySeal]

Hi GekkeBelg,

For an independent review, we will proceed with sharing the relevant details of your case with a third party - Askgamblers, as you've suggested. We appreciate your patience during this process.

So, as you can see (https://www.askgamblers.com/casino-complaints/coinplay-casino-closing-account-and-confiscating-winnings-with-no-further-justification) the independent review by Askgamblers has been completed and they judge that you have not provided valid proof for the confiscation of my winnings. So Askgamblers ruled in my favour and your rating has been lowered from 7.3 to 5.8 on there.

Now it's time to pay me out my winnings. I am giving you up until Friday to re-instate my Coinplay account with the winnings on it. I will withdraw them and never come back. No further actions will be taken and you can keep your "information which was too sensitive to share with Askgamblers" to yourself. This topic will be closed and I will post a message that it has been resolved.

But, if you don't pay me then a flag will be created and your topic will have a scam warning all over it. All the efforts and money you put into your active signature campaign will be for nothing. Think wisely about your decision.

As an independent user, I must say that resorting to blackmail isn't the best approach to resolve this issue. It's important to remember that Coinplay has returned your deposit, even though they might have had the right to withhold it based on their Terms and Conditions. This gesture shows that they tried to address the situation fairly.

Additionally, playing on so many sportsbooks could raise suspicions about your intentions. While I understand that you're frustrated, I suggest considering a more constructive way to express your concerns. Remember, mutual understanding and compromise can go a long way in resolving conflicts. Good luck!

As an independent user, I must say that I think you have a horrible take.

This isn't blackmail.  Personally I think he should just open the flag, but that's his decision and if he wants to give them some time to consider paying him first, there's nothing wrong with that.  It's not like he's making shit up and threatening them privately.  And the compromise already happened.  He agreed to let a third party review the situation and agreed to honor the decision.  

The decision was made in his favor.  Now the Coinplay is ghosting him.

Also, there's nothing wrong with signing up for however many sportsbooks/casinos you want.  I've likely signed up for closer to 100 gambling sites over the past 15 years, maybe more, always looking to find the best options out there.  This is a ridiculous reason to not trust someone.  

[PX-Z]

This is unfotunate. Well, most casino do the same BS. Accused their user for cheating but wont give evidence and proofs, if your account is accused then it is what it is. Because they have the right to not disclosed such thing on their terms. I dont know if casino license providers can do about this kind of terms because it is totally BS.

[AB de Royse777]

@GekkeBelg, the response for you that you requested on the campaign thread.

There is a complected scam accusation is going on against Coinplay. The team has enough evidence that the player was taking advantage of arbitrage betting but they don't want to explain their methods of investigation. I suggested them to pay the guy even if they are the victim but the management seems to be strict with their own decision.

I can not share more information but according to their terms they have right to confiscate the players account balance with the deposits he made. For those who are very keen to know why they refunded the deposit of the player is because they wanted him to understand his mistake. According to them if scam was in their mind then they would not even consider to give him a penny.

~snip~

About relating them with 1xbet, it was resolved long time ago. They already cleared their side of story and it was convincing without any question. According to my investigation they are not associated with 1xbet people. The only similarity was the script they used, later they updated the wording of the contents which were missed to update at the time of the launch. ~snip~

[AHOYBRAUSE]

@GekkeBelg, the response for you that you requested on the campaign thread.

There is a complected scam accusation is going on against Coinplay. The team has enough evidence that the player was taking advantage of arbitrage betting but they don't want to explain their methods of investigation. I suggested them to pay the guy even if they are the victim but the management seems to be strict with their own decision.

I can not share more information but according to their terms they have right to confiscate the players account balance with the deposits he made. For those who are very keen to know why they refunded the deposit of the player is because they wanted him to understand his mistake. According to them if scam was in their mind then they would not even consider to give him a penny.

~snip~

About relating them with 1xbet, it was resolved long time ago. They already cleared their side of story and it was convincing without any question. According to my investigation they are not associated with 1xbet people. The only similarity was the script they used, later they updated the wording of the contents which were missed to update at the time of the launch. ~snip~

Your stand in this even pausing the campaign really deserves respect. It was a good move on your part even though I feel sorry for the participants.

Coinplay now claiming it was "arbitrage betting" is in my eyes yet another excuse. He made a total of 7 bets if I counted correct, mostly on smaller odds. How would any site "detect" arbitrage betting with such a small sample size, that's just ridiculous.
If they have enough evidence then they could have shown these to askgamblers, they suggested that themselfes but then no more word.

We have seen this so often now with new casinos, this hit and run freeroll mentality is just sick. I bet within 1 year this site won't be around anymore and ran with some more regular winnings from customers.

[LoyceV]

Coinplay now claiming it was "arbitrage betting" is in my eyes yet another excuse.

I've seen that argument used quite a few times by different casinos. I searched a bit, and the general opinion "on Google" seems to be that arbitrage betting is legal, although bookmakers don't like it. In my opinion, it should just be allowed. If it's possible to gain an edge by certain bets, the odds should have been different. Don't blame the player for that.

[Fivestar4everMVP]

Its rather unfortunate that this has to happen to you @op, I am also an active gambler, I registered an account on coinplay when they first announced them self one this forum through their signature campaign, I intended playing on this casino, but I change my mind after some member of this community discovered that the coinplay casino had some proven links with 1xbit/1xbet, some even alleged that it is possible that this casino(coinplay) was being managed by officials of 1xbit/1xbet secretly, weeks after, the coinplay team came out to explain that they had no link with 1xbit, that the resemblance of their Casino to 1xbit was due to the fact that they used 1xbit script when building coinplay, I wasn't convinced by this, as I though within myself, "amongst all the script available online, some from reputable casino, why did they choose that of 1xbit?", because of this, I further decided to avoid coinplay..

And from all playing out already, it's like the decision I made to avoid coinplay was a good one after all, I am happy that askgamblers will be handling the case, but this does not guarantee anything, let's wait for askgamblers ruling, and hope they are honest in their ruling too.
In all, Goodluck.

EDIT: I failed to read the later part of the thread, didn't know there's a ruling already 

[T3PR00T]

let's wait for askgamblers ruling, and hope they are honest in their ruling too.
In all, Goodluck.

You did not read any update at all  
No wonder

[Woodie]

This is quite unfortunate especially that they have invested quite a bit in growing their reputation around the forum only to allow this to dent what they have built, sad to be honest...but there is still time to correct this

But looking at what OP has posted this doest really look lile arbitrage, especially that the player on the second time of playing had bet on several games on same league on same day  rules out arbitrage for me...Btw betting on singles is more profitable than making accumulators and this might have been the OPs strategy, nothing out of the extraordinary!

I wonder what is the definition of arbitrage betting according to coinplay 

[Erumo]

Is it possible that a good lawyer can help to solve that case? Or it is casinos privilege take money with impunity while hiding behind ToS ?

[GekkeBelg]

Its rather unfortunate that this has to happen to you @op, I am also an active gambler, I registered an account on coinplay when they first announced them self one this forum through their signature campaign, I intended playing on this casino, but I change my mind after some member of this community discovered that the coinplay casino had some proven links with 1xbit/1xbet, some even alleged that it is possible that this casino(coinplay) was being managed by officials of 1xbit/1xbet secretly, weeks after, the coinplay team came out to explain that they had no link with 1xbit, that the resemblance of their Casino to 1xbit was due to the fact that they used 1xbit script when building coinplay, I wasn't convinced by this, as I though within myself, "amongst all the script available online, some from reputable casino, why did they choose that of 1xbit?", because of this, I further decided to avoid coinplay..

And from all playing out already, it's like the decision I made to avoid coinplay was a good one after all, I am happy that askgamblers will be handling the case, but this does not guarantee anything, let's wait for askgamblers ruling, and hope they are honest in their ruling too.
In all, Goodluck.

EDIT: I failed to read the later part of the thread, didn't know there's a ruling already 

Yes, they ruled in my favour (although technically it's called "unresolved" when one of the 2 parties does not respond anymore) and lowered the rating of Coinplay severely, but now they don't pay up. They have stayed silent for a week already.

[Debra M]

As an independent user, I must say that I think you have a horrible take.

This isn't blackmail.  Personally I think he should just open the flag, but that's his decision and if he wants to give them some time to consider paying him first, there's nothing wrong with that.  It's not like he's making shit up and threatening them privately.  And the compromise already happened.  He agreed to let a third party review the situation and agreed to honor the decision.  

The decision was made in his favor.  Now the Coinplay is ghosting him.

Also, there's nothing wrong with signing up for however many sportsbooks/casinos you want.  I've likely signed up for closer to 100 gambling sites over the past 15 years, maybe more, always looking to find the best options out there.  This is a ridiculous reason to not trust someone.  

I appreciate your perspective on the matter. However, I still believe that using threats to resolve the issue can be counterproductive.

As for signing up for multiple sportsbooks, I agree that exploring different options is normal for most users. However, it's essential to respect each platform's terms and conditions to maintain a fair and trustworthy gambling environment for all.

Interestingly, you're promoting Sportsbet.io, which has had its share of similar scam accusations in reviews. It's crucial to consider all aspects of a situation before taking a firm stance, as each platform and user experience may differ.

[GekkeBelg]

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5422846.msg62084872#msg62084872

Hello all, see this topic (above) for more info. User Royse777 was nice enough to pause/stop the signature campaign until this case is solved. This is another sign that most people are on my side and that Coinplay cannot get away with this behaviour.
I have offered Coinplay (both via that post and via a PM) a solution to pay me out according to average market odds on my bets. This is not how it should have gone but I am willing to accept this as a solution. Let's see how they respond. If they don't respond then the only way to go is a complaint with the Antillephone Licensing and a flag being created on here.

[AB de Royse777]

This is another sign that most people are on my side

Sorry, I am not on your side, nor on Coinplay's side. I have no valid data to verify your claim and check internal things from Coinplay too. You need to stop thinking everyone is circling around you.

Whatever happened between you and them is unfortunate (either from your side or their side), as an outsider it's hard for me or infect anyone to conclude the case.

It should be clear from the post that I made on the campaign thread.

[noormcs5]

Yes, they ruled in my favour (although technically it's called "unresolved" when one of the 2 parties does not respond anymore) and lowered the rating of Coinplay severely, but now they don't pay up. They have stayed silent for a week already.

You may be lucky in a sense that they pay your deposit back and now only your winnings are left to be payed to you. However, when i see one or two other threads against them where they only pay the deposited money, make me think they are here for a big scam while thinking they won't be notice.
Its natural that when you pay the seed money to the gambler, half of his anger is gone as he is satisfied that at least he did not lose his own money and hence many people may not come here to open up scam accusation against them.

But now i think they are exposed and if they don't resolve this (and a few other cases), i am afraid they will lose many gamblers from this platform despite the fact that they run their campaigns for many weeks on this forum.

[SirJohnVonSlotty]

I reviewed this case and just wanted to add my two cents.

For all the watchers, keep in mind that the player can share their screenshots since it's their account, and can easily share only those screenshots that are going in to his/her favor, but an operator can't just post a players activity online - the regulator would go crazy about it. Even getting permission to send internal data to a random forum member would be tricky, especially if they know that they are right, and the Risk&Fraud team would never approve such an action without a court filling.

Additionally, it took me just a few minutes to find out that you're jumping from one sportsbook to another in search for better offers, if someone more serious digs through your history they might find more smoke, and where's smoke there might be fire. I'm not saying that you're at fault, but if you decide to lawyer up, check that you're 100% in the right before committing to anything.

For everyone else in the thread, you've already saw the steps which to take if an operator scams you, I would just add in a few others:

- AskGamblers isn't the only affiliate platform, you can also reach out to any other reputable affiliate that the operator is using and ask to pressure them. Most high level affiliates have direct contact to management.
- You can ping the regulator as well, you can see the operators license number in their footer.
- You can also pressure their payment providers, but you really need to know what you're doing here. E.g. if you've used PayPal (I know you didn't, I'm just giving an example), it means that they have a PayPal payment gateway, which means that they are risking of losing that payment provider if too many scam accusations pop up.

Also, I saw some 1xbit sentences and accusations that they are the same brand, and I haven't checked this personally, but I just wanted to add that the casino industry is smaller than you think, and most operators are using the same platform, game and payment providers.

[UmerIdrees]

This is another sign that most people are on my side

Sorry, I am not on your side, nor on Coinplay's side. I have no valid data to verify your claim and check internal things from Coinplay too. You need to stop thinking everyone is circling around you.

Whatever happened between you and them is unfortunate (either from your side or their side), as an outsider it's hard for me or infect anyone to conclude the case.

It should be clear from the post that I made on the campaign thread.

I really feel sorry for the campaign managers in this cases where they are doing their best in promoting a good project (to the best of their knowledge), preserving the interest of both the parties, the signature campaign participants, and the project team.

If the coinplay has any bad intentions or the OP is doing anything wrong, the campaign manager can't judge who is right and who is wrong because the Manager is NOT a part of the owners, he is only hired as a Campaign Manager.
There is a lot of responsibility on the campaign manager and the good ones can only stop the campaign unless these unresolved Scam Accusations are solved.

To cut it short, the reputed campaign manager running any campaign does not make a project trustworthy and similarly stopping any campaign by them does not make the project untrustworthy. They take steps in the best interest of the bitcointalk community based on the limited information presented to them.

[T3PR00T]

I reviewed this case and just wanted to add my two cents.

For all the watchers, keep in mind that the player can share their screenshots since it's their account, and can easily share only those screenshots that are going in to his/her favor, but an operator can't just post a players activity online - the regulator would go crazy about it. Even getting permission to send internal data to a random forum member would be tricky, especially if they know that they are right, and the Risk&Fraud team would never approve such an action without a court filling.

Additionally, it took me just a few minutes to find out that you're jumping from one sportsbook to another in search for better offers, if someone more serious digs through your history they might find more smoke, and where's smoke there might be fire. I'm not saying that you're at fault, but if you decide to lawyer up, check that you're 100% in the right before committing to anything.

For everyone else in the thread, you've already saw the steps which to take if an operator scams you, I would just add in a few others:

- AskGamblers isn't the only affiliate platform, you can also reach out to any other reputable affiliate that the operator is using and ask to pressure them. Most high level affiliates have direct contact to management.
- You can ping the regulator as well, you can see the operators license number in their footer.
- You can also pressure their payment providers, but you really need to know what you're doing here. E.g. if you've used PayPal (I know you didn't, I'm just giving an example), it means that they have a PayPal payment gateway, which means that they are risking of losing that payment provider if too many scam accusations pop up.

Also, I saw some 1xbit sentences and accusations that they are the same brand, and I haven't checked this personally, but I just wanted to add that the casino industry is smaller than you think, and most operators are using the same platform, game and payment providers.

Finally someone is making sense. The rest including TwitchySeal who seems leading the case, is playing everything in favor of the OP but not knowing what other factors can work behind these type of threads pop up all the time in the scam accusation section are just following whatever they feel comfortable for them.

If OP is so innocent then tell him to share his recent history with sportsbook like sportsbet.io, stake or even with highly dominating fiat sportsbook like bet365. I bet he does not play in these sportsbooks. He knows he can not make much high call against them because they have huge market value.

[TwitchySeal]

Shills seem to be coming out.

but an operator can't just post a players activity online - the regulator would go crazy about it.

That's not true at all.  (And it seems like they don't even have a valid license)

Other sites make detailed accusations against players all the time.  Example.

Since Coinplay, a relatively new casino that hasn't established any real level of trust from the community, isn't accusing the player of anything specific and refuses to explain themselves other than making vague references to their ambiguous terms I think the most reasonable thing to do is give the player the benefit of doubt.

If it were acceptable for sites to handle situations the way Coinplay is, think about how easy it would be to open a casino and just start scamming players left and right without risking any damage to their reputation.

Bottom line:  Coinplay agreed to use a third party to arbitrate, askgamblers.  They sent their evidence to the third party, and the third party made a decision in favor of the player and Coinplay still won't pay.  The case is closed. Coinplay scammed the player.

[T3PR00T]

Shills seem to be coming out.

Looks like you just wanted to quote me. Sorry it's not a paid comment. A shill does not work free.

[2double0]

SNIP
Bottom line:  Coinplay agreed to use a third party to arbitrate, askgamblers.  They sent their evidence to the third party, and the third party made a decision in favor of the player and Coinplay still won't pay.  The case is closed. Coinplay scammed the player.

TS is correct about the claim that Coinplay failed to provide any evidence against the player.

https://www.askgamblers.com/casino-complaints/coinplay-casino-closing-account-and-confiscating-winnings-with-no-further-justification

Above link sends you to this user's case and the below given link sends you to another complaint where another player named JOACHIM102 claimed that he got his account blocked with almost the same piece of shit that Coinplay presented here. And they didn't pay out just $261

https://www.askgamblers.com/casino-complaints/coinplay-casino-they-took-the-winnings-away

I don't think Coinplay will give any real evidence to prove their accusations and will keep doing this with various other gamblers. Thanks to AskGamblers community for decreasing Coinplay's ranking score on their website.

[GekkeBelg]

This is another sign that most people are on my side

Sorry, I am not on your side, nor on Coinplay's side. I have no valid data to verify your claim and check internal things from Coinplay too. You need to stop thinking everyone is circling around you.

Whatever happened between you and them is unfortunate (either from your side or their side), as an outsider it's hard for me or infect anyone to conclude the case.

It should be clear from the post that I made on the campaign thread.

Okay I apologize. You didn't say you were on my side and it indeed was an assumption from me. I should not say stuff that are assumptions so I apologize for that.

[TwitchySeal]

This is another sign that most people are on my side

Sorry, I am not on your side, nor on Coinplay's side. I have no valid data to verify your claim and check internal things from Coinplay too. You need to stop thinking everyone is circling around you.

Coinplay agreed to third party arbitration.

Both parties agreed to use ask gamblers.

Askgamblers ruled in favor of the player.

Coinplay has not paid the player.

This can all be easily verified in this thread and the AskGamblers complaint (and you can see this is not the first complaint like this at AG).

You don't need any other data.  The right side is obvious.

[mikeywith]

If OP is so innocent then tell him to share his recent history with sportsbook like sportsbet.io, stake or even with highly dominating fiat sportsbook like bet365. I bet he does not play in these sportsbooks.

I also bet he can't run faster than Usain Bolt but that doesn't help Coinplay in any shape or form, I don't understand anything about gambling but I read the whole thread, and both agreed to use a 3rd party "judge" and that 3rd party thought Coinplay is full of shit which automatically makes OP "innocent" in this exact incident, he could be a scammer, a serial killer or anything else, he could have abused or exploited something in Coinplay but that doesn't matter, they failed to provide the evidence to support their decision, they could not defend themselves not sure why are you doing that on their behalf.
 

[SirJohnVonSlotty]

That's not true at all.

But it kinda is. I have been within the industry for a while now and randomly posting players activity online can get you fired, you would need to open up a case with the risk & fraud team or check with management (depending on the size of the business) to go through with it. If you're constantly sharing player activity online you'll get in proper trouble with the regulator, standard laws/gdpr and so on.

The reason why I said that is not because I wanted to stand on either of the sides, but rather explain you that in most cases the player can post whatever goes in to their favor, while the operator then has to tippy toe around it and see if it's actually worth entering the battle - and keep in mind that there are thousands of these cases per week, people are scamming operators left and right.

I didn't say that it's not possible to share internal data publicly at all, you gave a good example with Stake, but their whole company is aware of bitcointalk.org and have a massive operation here, obviously getting an approval to post internal data within a scam accusation is easier to process. As an example, my risk & fraud team didn't even know that this forum exists, and trying to explain them that I need to publish internal data on a forum would be quite a task.

Do I think that Coinplay could have handled it better? Yeah, definitely.

[TwitchySeal]

That's not true at all.

But it kinda is. I have been within the industry for a while now and randomly posting players activity online can get you fired, you would need to open up a case with the risk & fraud team or check with management (depending on the size of the business) to go through with it. If you're constantly sharing player activity online you'll get in proper trouble with the regulator, standard laws/gdpr and so on.

What you said is not true:

but an operator can't just post a players activity online - the regulator would go crazy about it.

The only thing curacao regulators go crazy about is if a casino doesn't pay their annual dues on time.  And it appears coingaming doesn't actually have a license as I don't see any official seal that can be verified on their page.  

If we were talking about a casino holding a proper license from somewhere like Malta or Isle of Man you'd have a valid point.  But if that were the case then the player wouldn't have to create a thread here to try and solve this kind of issue.

[LoyceV]

But it kinda is. I have been within the industry for a while now and randomly posting players activity online can get you fired, you would need to open up a case with the risk & fraud team or check with management (depending on the size of the business) to go through with it. If you're constantly sharing player activity online you'll get in proper trouble with the regulator, standard laws/gdpr and so on.

OP already gave permission to share his data with AskGamblers:

share it with Askgamblers. I give you permission to give all my sensitive and private information that you may have to them, I don't care.

[SirJohnVonSlotty]

But it kinda is. I have been within the industry for a while now and randomly posting players activity online can get you fired, you would need to open up a case with the risk & fraud team or check with management (depending on the size of the business) to go through with it. If you're constantly sharing player activity online you'll get in proper trouble with the regulator, standard laws/gdpr and so on.

OP already gave permission to share his data with AskGamblers:

share it with Askgamblers. I give you permission to give all my sensitive and private information that you may have to them, I don't care.

No I understand that, I was just speaking in general how it's easier for the player to publish their own data, than for the operator to do the same. I'm not on either side, I even gave a couple more points on how to battle this in my post before.

The only thing curacao regulators go crazy about is if a casino doesn't pay their annual dues on time.  And it appears coingaming doesn't actually have a license as I don't see any official seal that can be verified on their page. 

If we were talking about a casino holding a proper license from somewhere like Malta or Isle of Man you'd have a valid point.  But if that were the case then the player wouldn't have to create a thread here to try and solve this kind of issue.

I worked with several of them, and I would say that UKGC is the most strict one, after that MGA, then Isle of Man and Curacao. I had no experience with Estonia though, but I'm looking in to it this quarter. Maybe your experience with the license is different though, and I don't want to spam the thread, so let's agree to disagree.

Regarding their license, they have it in their footer, but no verification seal, so another button for OP to push. You can always report operators directly to the regulator here: https://www.curacao-egaming.com/public-and-players/#section-authenticity

 

[GekkeBelg]

I have had enough of it. Coinplay were given multiple chances to solve my case and now they completely ignore me. They are a complete scam company and users must be warned for them. I have no more trust at all that Coinplay will work with me on a solution, so I will now go the official way and have just submitted a complaint to Antillephone. If that also doesn't work out then I will contact a Curacao lawyer on a no-cure no-pay basis.

A flag has been created here:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=trust;u=3502111;page=iflags

Users are welcome to vote for or against it.

[Mahdirakib]

Users are welcome to vote for or against it.

Your flag is still inactive as it hasn't received enough support from the forum members. But I'm surprised to see that 5 other forum members have opposed the flag except Coinplay representative. All of them are old registered and member ranked users. I'm wondering why those users are opposing the flag.

Whatever, Coinplay representative has received negative feedback from the forum members with the reference of this accusation. And there is an active flag against them for 'bachezy' accusation. They have to resolve both issues now if they want clear their reputation in the forum. Don't forget to give an update here if you receive response from Coinplay license operator.

[AHOYBRAUSE]

Users are welcome to vote for or against it.

Your flag is still inactive as it hasn't received enough support from the forum members. But I'm surprised to see that 5 other forum members have opposed the flag except Coinplay representative. All of them are old registered and member ranked users. I'm wondering why those users are opposing the flag.

Whatever, Coinplay representative has received negative feedback from the forum members with the reference of this accusation. And there is an active flag against them for 'bachezy' accusation. They have to resolve both issues now if they want clear their reputation in the forum. Don't forget to give an update here if you receive response from Coinplay license operator.

All the accounts opposing the flag are just some no name bounty campaign chasers with almost no merit over the years.
Wouldn't surprise me if it's all the same person to be honest.

Maybe the 1 user controlling the accounts made some kind of deal, everything is possible here.

At least the coinplay rep has a lot of red tags, that should be a good warning for anybody the might consider playing there.

[TwitchySeal]

Users are welcome to vote for or against it.

Your flag is still inactive as it hasn't received enough support from the forum members. But I'm surprised to see that 5 other forum members have opposed the flag except Coinplay representative. All of them are old registered and member ranked users. I'm wondering why those users are opposing the flag.

Whatever, Coinplay representative has received negative feedback from the forum members with the reference of this accusation. And there is an active flag against them for 'bachezy' accusation. They have to resolve both issues now if they want clear their reputation in the forum. Don't forget to give an update here if you receive response from Coinplay license operator.

All the accounts opposing the flag are just some no name bounty campaign chasers with almost no merit over the years.
Wouldn't surprise me if it's all the same person to be honest.

Maybe the 1 user controlling the accounts made some kind of deal, everything is possible here.

At least the coinplay rep has a lot of red tags, that should be a good warning for anybody the might consider playing there.

Funny coinplay opposed the flag...after agreeing to go to arbitration, losing, and then posting nothing at all ever since....

[BitcoinGirl.Club]

Funny coinplay opposed the flag...after agreeing to go to arbitration, losing, and then posting nothing at all ever since....

Supported the flag. They could handle the case better but they had chosen not to, which did not make sense for me. Haven't we seen much nasty cases than this? But a better co-operation from their forum representatives made it easier for everyone to understand the situations at least.

Well done OP. At least you got the deposit back.
My suggestion to you will be, to play in highly established sportsbook like Stake, Sportsbet.io
I don't think you will have such problem with them if you are playing fair.

[SirJohnVonSlotty]

I knew that purchasing accounts is a thing, but never thought that it would be used this obviously

[John Abraham]

But that's not all, go into their BPIP profiles and see more interesting matches:

Interesting Information and Nice catch, Ratimov. So now started playing a dirty game in the forum. I won't be surprised if I see those accounts start to shill their project since those are exclusively woken-up accounts trying to defend coin play. I am wondering how dumb their representative or marketing or whoever is trying to do this shit. None of those accounts are on the DT network, and their support or opposition cannot change the flag result.

I wonder what this group of clowns, under the control of one user, has to do with this casino and its representative?

At least, I think so. I don't think they will come here to say it's a coincidence.

At first, they had a few scam accusations and forum members didn't care about it because those things happen. Sometimes players cheat as well. They said they would cooperate with 3rd party mediation service but did not accept the result. Now we have to see this dirty job to protect their reputation. Good try, but it did not work.

[John Abraham]

Interesting Information and Nice catch, Ratimov. So now started playing a dirty game in the forum. I won't be surprised if I see those accounts start to shill their project since those are exclusively woken-up accounts trying to defend coin play. I am wondering how dumb their representative or marketing or whoever is trying to do this shit. None of those accounts are on the DT network, and their support or opposition cannot change the flag result.

Often the purpose of such accounts is to show, supposedly, the support of the casino. You see, not everything is so simple, we have supporters and those who do not agree with these accusations. And everything in this spirit. Although, judging by the behavior of this representative, he did not try to somehow save his signature campaign and his reputation on this forum. Just accepted it and left.

This is one of the reasons why account sales are frowned upon by forum members. A few days ago, yahoo created a thread to discuss this matter, and I saw you are the first person to respond there. If I am not wrong, all the accounts you mentioned in this thread are sold now. Regarding their reputation, yeah. They did not try to defend their back. They just accepted and left. But, Did you get that their casino representative is unfamiliar with the forum environment and doesn't know much about the forum system? Who would buy such accounts to oppose the flags? They don't know how it works. I see this as an attempt to save their reputation in a dirty way.

I won't be surprised that he will soon lose his casino, he will create another one and come here again under a new brand.

I won't say that. No scam casinos lose their platform. They lose their reputation. Some casinos still have bad reputations as they don't care about reputation in this forum, and their platform is up and running.

[Pmalek]

If I am not wrong, all the accounts you mentioned in this thread are sold now. Regarding their reputation, yeah. They did not try to defend their back. They just accepted and left. But, Did you get that their casino representative is unfamiliar with the forum environment and doesn't know much about the forum system? Who would buy such accounts to oppose the flags? They don't know how it works. I see this as an attempt to save their reputation in a dirty way.

Maybe the accounts were bought long time ago and never used. Just lying there idle waiting on a reason to wake up. Maybe they aren't owned by Coinplay at all but some farm that contacted them and offered to oppose the flags for money. Maybe Coinplay runs many other casinos or Bitcointalk accounts and has numerous alt accounts they can use for various reasons. There are many possibilities. The only thing that is certain is that their opposition to the flags means absolutely nothing to their visibility. Wasted effort that could have been better spent on not cheating their players.

[GekkeBelg]

I also have something peculiar to mention. Last week I filed an official complaint at their Curacao Anitellephone Licenseholder and at first I did not receive a reply. Then when I asked after a couple days of hearing nothing "can you please tell me if you received my complaint and tell me how long on average it takes to handle complaints?" out of the blue within minutes this reply suddenly came:



It strongly looks to me as if they play together with their Licenseholder Antillephone. Because I am 100% sure I do not have multiple accounts. Coinplay never told me the exact thing they accused me of but their signature campaign manager said it was because of "arbitrage betting". So now it's suddenly a completely different accusation. I wonder why did they not want to give the exact details of what I did wrong to Askgamblers because it was oh so secret and private info, and now they simply give it away just like that?
And if this truly is the correct accusation and they have proof to back it up, why didn't they just share that with Askgamblers so that I would have been shut up and most people would still have some kind of trust in Coinplay and their reputation would be saved?

I know why, because it's an incorrect accusation and they do not have any proof to back it up and Askgamblers would have seen through it. But sadly their Licenseholder is protecting them as long as they pay their license fees.
Btw, after that email from Antillephone they totally ignored me on my follow up emails. Antillephone is a horrible Licenseholder and does nothing to protect players from dishonest companies.

Avoid Coinplay and avoid sportsbooks licensed by Antillephone, unless they have a truly good reputation such as Pinnacle, Stake etc.

[John Abraham]

Maybe the accounts were bought long time ago and never used. Just lying there idle waiting on a reason to wake up. Maybe they aren't owned by Coinplay at all but some farm that contacted them and offered to oppose the flags for money.

You could be correct as well. But, I don't see any point why they will keep the password unchanged if they were bought long ago. They woke up and changed the password as well. It seems those accounts were bought a few days ago. However, It's possible that those accounts are not owned by Coinplay but by someone else.

Maybe Coinplay runs many other casinos or Bitcointalk accounts and has numerous alt accounts they can use for various reasons. There are many possibilities. The only thing that is certain is that their opposition to the flags means absolutely nothing to their visibility. Wasted effort that could have been better spent on not cheating their players.

Even if Coinplay or their representative did not own those accounts, Whoever dealt with the party to oppose that flag is not familiar with the forum system. They don't know how it works. Otherwise, they won't spend money on that purpose. I don't know if they own several casinos. But, If they own those same types of casinos, prepare yourself to see more scam accusations in the coming days.

[T3PR00T]

I also have something peculiar to mention. Last week I filed an official complaint at their Curacao Anitellephone Licenseholder and at first I did not receive a reply.

I think there are many sportsbook and casino who are  Curacao Anitellephone License holder. Your claim of you are innocent means all other casinos are performing shady business. It will be unrealistic to think.

but their signature campaign manager said it was because of "arbitrage betting". So now it's suddenly a completely different accusation.

I think it makes better sense now for arbitrage betting. If you have more than one account from the same household then for example, you placed a bet in home win and when the odd changed your placed another bet in away win and also in draw. All places in the same market to bring a small percentage of profit no matter what final result of the sport. That's what is arbitrage betting.

You can do it using same betting company or with different company.

But it is interesting why coinplay never wanted to share anything in details to the forum and with askgamblers.

I also have something peculiar to mention. Last week I filed an official complaint at their Curacao Anitellephone Licenseholder and at first I did not receive a reply. Then when I asked after a couple days of hearing nothing "can you please tell me if you received my complaint and tell me how long on average it takes to handle complaints?" out of the blue within minutes this reply suddenly came:



It strongly looks to me as if they play together with their Licenseholder Antillephone. Because I am 100% sure I do not have multiple accounts. Coinplay never told me the exact thing they accused me of but their signature campaign manager said it was because of "arbitrage betting". So now it's suddenly a completely different accusation. I wonder why did they not want to give the exact details of what I did wrong to Askgamblers because it was oh so secret and private info, and now they simply give it away just like that?
And if this truly is the correct accusation and they have proof to back it up, why didn't they just share that with Askgamblers so that I would have been shut up and most people would still have some kind of trust in Coinplay and their reputation would be saved?

I know why, because it's an incorrect accusation and they do not have any proof to back it up and Askgamblers would have seen through it. But sadly their Licenseholder is protecting them as long as they pay their license fees.
Btw, after that email from Antillephone they totally ignored me on my follow up emails. Antillephone is a horrible Licenseholder and does nothing to protect players from dishonest companies.

Avoid Coinplay and avoid sportsbooks licensed by Antillephone, unless they have a truly good reputation such as Pinnacle, Stake etc.

[Pmalek]

<Snip>

Where are you from btw? Your email is in German, but your PC's local language seems to be in Dutch. "Deels bewolkt" isn't German, it's Dutch and means partially cloudy. According to Coinplay TOS, players from the Netherlands and its territories are restricted from playing on Coinplay. I am not sure if that has anything to do with the problems you are experiencing. When they mentioned multiple accounts, you might have used VPNs (the same ones other players used) to bypass that geographical restriction.

Obviously, you aren't going to admin if that is the case, and I am not accusing you. It's just an observation I made based on the screenshot you posted and what the casino's TOS says. But none of that explains the horrible way Coinplay has decided to deal with this situation.   

[SirJohnVonSlotty]

Antillephone is a horrible Licenseholder and does nothing to protect players from dishonest companies.

I know you're angry about the whole situation, but you can't just throw around sentences like this. Every Curacao license holder will stop dealing with an operator that has constant issues with players, and Antillephone is not an exception. 

I also see that your default location is in Netherlands, were you KYC verified and are your documents german or dutch?

[TwitchySeal]

Just a reminder to everyone that's trying to defend Coinplay for some odd reason:

Coinplay agreed to use askgamblers to arbitrate.  

Askgamblers ruled against Coinplay.

Coinplay did not pay and ghosted.




There is absolutely no reason that Coinplay deserves any benefit of doubt in this situation.

Antillephone is a horrible Licenseholder and does nothing to protect players from dishonest companies.

I know you're angry about the whole situation, but you can't just throw around sentences like this. Every Curacao license holder will stop dealing with an operator that has constant issues with players, and Antillephone is not an exception.  

I also see that your default location is in Netherlands, were you KYC verified and are your documents german or dutch?

Curacao itself is a joke when it comes to gaming licenses and judging by the email he got, Antillephone is as well.  I know, big changes are supposedly in the works, but the only memorable action I've ever seen Curacao take is to defend 1xbit, the longest running scam casino, after they were forced into bankruptcy, and attack the one who investigated them.  I don't think it's a coincidence that Coinplay is very likely a 1xbit franchise. 

[GekkeBelg]

<Snip>

Where are you from btw? Your email is in German, but your PC's local language seems to be in Dutch. "Deels bewolkt" isn't German, it's Dutch and means partially cloudy. According to Coinplay TOS, players from the Netherlands and its territories are restricted from playing on Coinplay. I am not sure if that has anything to do with the problems you are experiencing. When they mentioned multiple accounts, you might have used VPNs (the same ones other players used) to bypass that geographical restriction.

Obviously, you aren't going to admin if that is the case, and I am not accusing you. It's just an observation I made based on the screenshot you posted and what the casino's TOS says. But none of that explains the horrible way Coinplay has decided to deal with this situation.  

It's very simple, I am Dutch living in Germany. This is already known, see my topic about Owl in my history. When I presented them (Owl) my Dutch passport they judged me as Dutch player and confiscated my winnings. Then when I provided them my German utility bill and driving license they paid me out.

And no, this played no role in my confiscation at Coinplay since I entered the website from a German IP and never used a VPN. And never even had to do KYC.

If I was living in Netherlands and Coinplay confiscated for that reason I would never have opened a scam accusation because I would not be in my right. And in that case Coinplay would have a very easy defence if I would still have filed a complaint.

[GekkeBelg]

Antillephone is a horrible Licenseholder and does nothing to protect players from dishonest companies.

I know you're angry about the whole situation, but you can't just throw around sentences like this. Every Curacao license holder will stop dealing with an operator that has constant issues with players, and Antillephone is not an exception.  

I also see that your default location is in Netherlands, were you KYC verified and are your documents german or dutch?

I am not allowed to say that Antillephone is a horrible licensor when they simply pass on lies from the casino they licensed? And when I ask about clarification about those lies they ignore me....coincidence huh?

No, I was not KYC verified. My passport is Dutch and my driving license is German but that is not the issue here.

[BitcoinGirl.Club]

Antillephone is a horrible Licenseholder and does nothing to protect players from dishonest companies.

I know you're angry about the whole situation, but you can't just throw around sentences like this. Every Curacao license holder will stop dealing with an operator that has constant issues with players, and Antillephone is not an exception.  

I also see that your default location is in Netherlands, were you KYC verified and are your documents german or dutch?

I am not allowed to say that Antillephone is a horrible licensor when they simply pass on lies from the casino they licensed? And when I ask about clarification about those lies they ignore me....coincidence huh?

No, I was not KYC verified. My passport is Dutch and my driving license is German but that is not the issue here.

You are creating doubt in mind, I am sorry I removed my support from the flag you created. It looks to me the whole story was not said completely. It does not surprise me though. There are many cases where many of us were bluffed by abusive gamblers like you. They see this place is a good chance for clearing their abuse.

Curacao itself is a joke when it comes to gaming licenses and judging by the email he got, Antillephone is as well.  I know, big changes are supposedly in the works, but the only memorable action I've ever seen Curacao take is to defend 1xbit, the longest running scam casino, after they were forced into bankruptcy, and attack the one who investigated them.  I don't think it's a coincidence that Coinplay is very likely a 1xbit franchise. 

In other words all sportsbook who have Curacao license are absolutely joke and the governing body who authorized Curacao license are jokes too? Let's not understand a thing the way it benefits us.

[SirJohnVonSlotty]

Just a reminder to everyone that's trying to defend Coinplay for some odd reason:

Coinplay agreed to use askgamblers to arbitrate.  

Askgamblers ruled against Coinplay.

Coinplay did not pay and ghosted.

There is absolutely no reason that Coinplay deserves any benefit of doubt in this situation.

I'm not defending Coinplay, in my eyes this ended up as a good lesson for both sides. Coinplay got slapped by the internet for not dealing with the issue, the player got their deposit back (regardless if they did or did not try to play the system)

What I'm trying to do though is figure out for my self what actually happened here, and it seems there's more to it.

#1. We have a Dutch player, who shouldn't be playing outside of his country, actively playing on several brands outside of his country.  
#2. That player won a larger amount through activity on several accounts, and triggered the abuser matrix.
#3. That same player got reported that he was playing with different accounts, arbitrage and so on.
#4. The operator didn't want to argue, refunded his deposit and closed his account.
#5. Even if the player could manage to somehow prove that he wasn't abusing the operator and remove all the smoke surrounding him, if KYC would be asked for, he would fail it and again only get the deposit back.

In my eyes this is not a scam situation, since the deposit was refunded, and the wins (operators money) was confiscated because of irregularities.

On the other side we have the operator, Coinplay, who just doesn't want to deal with this thing and assign resources to argue with the player publicly, so they kinda do deserve the flag as a lesson and I would definitely keep this thread alive.

At the same time, I want to note that operators sometimes get numb on this type of situations, just open up TrustPilot and type in any reputable casino, you'll see tons of 1 star reviews claiming "scam", and no one responds to them because it just costs too much resources to explain to TrustPilot how the scam went, especially when you're dealing with a user that aims to destroy you in any way possible. We had these situations on brands like Betsafe and Bet365 on a daily basis and it was hard to deal with it individually.

Curacao itself is a joke when it comes to gaming licenses and judging by the email he got, Antillephone is as well.  I know, big changes are supposedly in the works, but the only memorable action I've ever seen Curacao take is to defend 1xbit, the longest running scam casino, after they were forced into bankruptcy, and attack the one who investigated them.  I don't think it's a coincidence that Coinplay is very likely a 1xbit franchise.  

My experience is different, and if there wouldn't be for regulators, you would be playing rouge games with rouge payment providers, with scams going left and right. I am not familiar with what happened with 1xbit though, but I'll research it.

I am not allowed to say that Antillephone is a horrible licensor when they simply pass on lies from the casino they licensed? And when I ask about clarification about those lies they ignore me....coincidence huh?

No, I was not KYC verified. My passport is Dutch and my driving license is German but that is not the issue here.

You're allowed to say whatever you want, but the way you say it will either go in to your favor or against it. If you look at all my posts in your thread you'll see that I was just looking to discuss the situation, I'm not personally attacking you or claim that Coinplay did the right thing.

[GekkeBelg]

Just a reminder to everyone that's trying to defend Coinplay for some odd reason:

Coinplay agreed to use askgamblers to arbitrate.  

Askgamblers ruled against Coinplay.

Coinplay did not pay and ghosted.

There is absolutely no reason that Coinplay deserves any benefit of doubt in this situation.

I'm not defending Coinplay, in my eyes this ended up as a good lesson for both sides. Coinplay got slapped by the internet for not dealing with the issue, the player got their deposit back (regardless if they did or did not try to play the system)

What I'm trying to do though is figure out for my self what actually happened here, and it seems there's more to it.

#1. We have a Dutch player, who shouldn't be playing outside of his country, actively playing on several brands outside of his country.  
#2. That player won a larger amount through activity on several accounts, and triggered the abuser matrix.
#3. That same player got reported that he was playing with different accounts, arbitrage and so on.
#4. The operator didn't want to argue, refunded his deposit and closed his account.
#5. Even if the player could manage to somehow prove that he wasn't abusing the operator and remove all the smoke surrounding him, if KYC would be asked for, he would fail it and again only get the deposit back.

In my eyes this is not a scam situation, since the deposit was refunded, and the wins (operators money) was confiscated because of irregularities.

On the other side we have the operator, Coinplay, who just doesn't want to deal with this thing and assign resources to argue with the player publicly, so they kinda do deserve the flag as a lesson and I would definitely keep this thread alive.

At the same time, I want to note that operators sometimes get numb on this type of situations, just open up TrustPilot and type in any reputable casino, you'll see tons of 1 star reviews claiming "scam", and no one responds to them because it just costs too much resources to explain to TrustPilot how the scam went, especially when you're dealing with a user that aims to destroy you in any way possible. We had these situations on brands like Betsafe and Bet365 on a daily basis and it was hard to deal with it individually.

Curacao itself is a joke when it comes to gaming licenses and judging by the email he got, Antillephone is as well.  I know, big changes are supposedly in the works, but the only memorable action I've ever seen Curacao take is to defend 1xbit, the longest running scam casino, after they were forced into bankruptcy, and attack the one who investigated them.  I don't think it's a coincidence that Coinplay is very likely a 1xbit franchise.  

My experience is different, and if there wouldn't be for regulators, you would be playing rouge games with rouge payment providers, with scams going left and right. I am not familiar with what happened with 1xbit though, but I'll research it.

I am not allowed to say that Antillephone is a horrible licensor when they simply pass on lies from the casino they licensed? And when I ask about clarification about those lies they ignore me....coincidence huh?

No, I was not KYC verified. My passport is Dutch and my driving license is German but that is not the issue here.

You're allowed to say whatever you want, but the way you say it will either go in to your favor or against it. If you look at all my posts in your thread you'll see that I was just looking to discuss the situation, I'm not personally attacking you or claim that Coinplay did the right thing.

What the hell is going on here? Your post is so full of nonsense that I don't even know where to start.
A Dutch player who shouldn't be playing outside of his country? What does the country of birth have to do with this? I have been living in Germany for 17 years!
I won a large amount through activity on several accounts? Several? I only have one account.
I did not do any arbitrage. Coinplay never mentioned this either.
If KYC would be asked, I would fail?? Why? I am living in a perfectly legal country which is not forbidden in the Coinplay terms and have a driving license and utility bills from there.

[SirJohnVonSlotty]

What the hell is going on here? Your post is so full of nonsense that I don't even know where to start.
A Dutch player who shouldn't be playing outside of his country? What does the country of birth have to do with this? I have been living in Germany for 17 years!
I won a large amount through activity on several accounts? Several? I only have one account.
I did not do any arbitrage. Coinplay never mentioned this either.
If KYC would be asked, I would fail?? Why? I am living in a perfectly legal country which is not forbidden in the Coinplay terms and have a driving license and utility bills from there.

It's a peculiar situation, Coinplay isn't responsive, and I haven nothing smart to say anymore.

You've already did all the steps that you could, you could eventually lawyer up and go against them and their license holder if you like, as I already mentioned a few posts before, but be 100% sure that the claim is truthful before you enter that field.

[T3PR00T]

It's a peculiar situation, Coinplay isn't responsive, and I haven nothing smart to say anymore.

Whoever is behind the coinplay official account, he needs to learn to give more time when situations like this are up. Otherwise the brand will suffer even with a very weak case. This is a good example and should be a lession for all brands who are advertising on the forum.

[SirJohnVonSlotty]

It's a peculiar situation, Coinplay isn't responsive, and I haven nothing smart to say anymore.

Whoever is behind the coinplay official account, he needs to learn to give more time when situations like this are up. Otherwise the brand will suffer even with a very weak case. This is a good example and should be a lession for all brands who are advertising on the forum.

I agree with you, but from what I saw so far it's rarely the owner or CEO who is on this forum, it's mostly a lower acquisition specialist or manager that is testing the forum as a new channel to drive value, with some exceptions with the larger brands that are having a significant spend on the forum.

Even in my case the owners didn't know that bitcointalk even existed until I brought it up 5 months ago, but luckily I'm a bit higher up so I can move things quicker.

Nevertheless, the reason I'm active in this thread is because I'm curious, but at the same time it's sad to see how other operators are managing their brand, and then smaller guys like us get pulled down with them.

[John Abraham]

You are creating doubt in mind, I am sorry I removed my support from the flag you created. It looks to me the whole story was not said completely. It does not surprise me though. There are many cases where many of us were bluffed by abusive gamblers like you. They see this place is a good chance for clearing their abuse.

BitcoinGirl.Club, I am sorry, but I am asking why you think the whole story was not said. CoinPlay did not trigger KYC to GekkeBelg, and he did not have to do anything with the KYC and its related things like where he is from or similar info. Since he wasn't triggered for KYC, Sharing where he is from and where he is living is irrelevant. I feel like it was unnecessary to share those details. Everyone has their opinion, and I respect your opinion as well. But I am asking you because I Trust only three users' Judgments, and you are one of them. Do you see anything suspicious here? Help me figure out what makes you think the player is abusive and why the whole story was not said.

@GekkeBelg, Indeed, I am seeing some anger from you towards SirJohnVonSlotty. His post makes sense, and he did not guarantee that 100% of those happened. He clearly said

I'm not defending Coinplay, in my eyes this ended up as a good lesson for both sides.... ....What I'm trying to do though is figure out for my self what actually happened here, and it seems there's more to it....

@GekkeBelg, I don't see any point in talking like this, which makes you look guilty of doing something wrong.

[Pmalek]

BitcoinGirl.Club, I am sorry, but I am asking why you think the whole story was not said. CoinPlay did not trigger KYC to GekkeBelg, and he did not have to do anything with the KYC and its related things like where he is from or similar info. Since he wasn't triggered for KYC, Sharing where he is from and where he is living is irrelevant. I feel like it was unnecessary to share those details. Everyone has their opinion, and I respect your opinion as well. But I am asking you because I Trust only three users' Judgments, and you are one of them. Do you see anything suspicious here? Help me figure out what makes you think the player is abusive and why the whole story was not said.

To be fair, it wasn't BitcoinGirl.Club that mentioned OP being Dutch. It was me after seeing the latest screenshot they posted that had both German and Dutch text. I know that Netherlands, together with countries like France, the UK, USA, and some others are generally restricted territories on Curacao licenses. BitcoinGirl.Club might have just acted on that information.

I haven't followed the developments of this case from the beginning to confidently pass judgement.

[TwitchySeal]

You are creating doubt in mind, I am sorry I removed my support from the flag you created.  

You see coinplay agreed to use askgamblers to review the case, right?

And askgamblers ruled against them.

And then instead of paying  the player they ghosted, right.

The details of the case don't even matter anymore.

In other words all sportsbook who have Curacao license are absolutely joke and the governing body who authorized Curacao license are jokes too? Let's not understand a thing the way it benefits us.

What? I never criticized any site for having a license from Curacao. There are plenty of trustworthy sites that do. But the only benefits of the license are for the casino. The fact that a casino has a license from Curacao should mean nothing from the players perspective as to whether or not they should trust the casino with their money.

[LoyceV]

It strongly looks to me as if they play together with their Licenseholder Antillephone.

I'll type/quote the email here:

"It appears that you have been flagged and that there have been various accounts registered by you or those pertaining to your household. This is against Terms and Conditions, namely, clause 6.1. It is noteworthy that both accounts were accessed using the same IP address AND devices!"

I'm curious how Antillephone got this information: is this what the casino told them, or have they independently verified this? And if so: how?

To be fair, it wasn't BitcoinGirl.Club that mentioned OP being Dutch.

OP's username is literally in Dutch, and it means "CrazyBelgian". So I assumed he was from Belgium, but making fun of them is something we Dutchies do, so being Dutch makes sense too.

[tbct_mt2]

I am not familiar with what happened with 1xbit though, but I'll research it.

Start from this [WARNING] Beware of 1xBit casino, investors from Telegram, and Youtube scams!

I am very unsure what happened with 1xBit casino and their activities, advertisement here. They refused to resolve their scam accusations but are readily to spend budget for advertisements in signature campaigns, review campaigns many times. They do have budget for marketing but just used it not good enough.

With bad reputation and risk of red tagged for participants, they only can hire very low quality posters that is wasting their budget. They can use that budget to resolve their cases and move on with good reputation. Then they will be able to hire better quality posters.

[GekkeBelg]

It strongly looks to me as if they play together with their Licenseholder Antillephone.

I'll type/quote the email here:

"It appears that you have been flagged and that there have been various accounts registered by you or those pertaining to your household. This is against Terms and Conditions, namely, clause 6.1. It is noteworthy that both accounts were accessed using the same IP address AND devices!"

I'm curious how Antillephone got this information: is this what the casino told them, or have they independently verified this? And if so: how?

To be fair, it wasn't BitcoinGirl.Club that mentioned OP being Dutch.

OP's username is literally in Dutch, and it means "CrazyBelgian". So I assumed he was from Belgium, but making fun of them is something we Dutchies do, so being Dutch makes sense too.

Yes, I'm Dutch and living in Germany for 17 years. So let us all stop about that subject, it is totally irrelevant where I was born. I never denied that I have a Dutch nationality so please people don't make it look like I was hiding something. All that counts for terms and conditions is where you live.

About that comment from Antillephone, it really surprised me. I strongly believe they just passed on a lie which Coinplay told them, and didn't check it. I know I have only opened 1 account at Coinplay and I live alone in my household. It is absolutely impossible that a second account exists on my same device (=laptop). I really believe Coinplay just made up something that would warrant a confiscation (if it were true) so that their licensor would not be able to punish them or suspend the license.
If it truly was this way, then why did Coinplay not simply submit this proof to Askgamblers? It would have saved their reputation and shut me up immediately. But instead they vanished from the forum and allowed their signature campaign to stop over this, and they would just let that happen if they have a clear case against me?

And the bad thing also is, that Antillephone came up with this line literally 6 mins after I emailed them, but then in the 10 days after it they ignored all my follow up emails asking for further explanation and proofs.

[John Abraham]

To be fair, it wasn't BitcoinGirl.Club that mentioned OP being Dutch. It was me after seeing the latest screenshot they posted that had both German and Dutch text.

I know it was you. But I asked BitcoinGirl because she withdrew the support. After all, she thinks the whole story was not said. I wanted to hear more from her because I trusted her judgment. In my opinion, whether OP is German or Dutch, or he is Dutch but lives in Germany, is not matter here anymore. Because CoinPlay did not trigger, KYC and OP did not verify or submit KYC. So, this is irrelevant to share where he is from.

I'll type/quote the email here:

"It appears that you have been flagged and that there have been various accounts registered by you or those pertaining to your household. This is against Terms and Conditions, namely, clause 6.1. It is noteworthy that both accounts were accessed using the same IP address AND devices!"

I'm curious how Antillephone got this information: is this what the casino told them, or have they independently verified this? And if so: how?

There is no one from Antillephone. So, I guess the question will remain unanswered. You ask via email if you want to.

So I assumed he was from Belgium, but making fun of them is something we Dutchies do, so being Dutch makes sense too.

Huh? We? Does this Include you? Have you ever disclosed this before in this forum?

[LoyceV]

So I assumed he was from Belgium, but making fun of them is something we Dutchies do, so being Dutch makes sense too.

Huh? We? Does this Include you? Have you ever disclosed this before in this forum?

It's not a secret I'm from the Netherlands, but I think you missed my point: making fun of Belgians is an ancient thing here (we say they're dumb, they say we're cheap).
FWIW: I have no doubt about OP speaking Dutch. Not that it matters. In my opinion, this is enough:

For an independent review, we will proceed with sharing the relevant details of your case with a third party - Askgamblers, as you've suggested.

They didn't:

Kindly note that the AskGamblers Complaint Team requested additional evidence and details from the Coinplay Casino team due to the fact that we considered the information they presented not justified enough to confirm the accusations against the player.

Should the operator fail to provide such an update within the specified timeframes, the case shall be considered unresolved and will be closed accordingly.

The regulator's response also doesn't look like any evidence was provided.

[BitcoinGirl.Club]

BitcoinGirl.Club, I am sorry, but I am asking why you think the whole story was not said.

Some of the points I can remember so far [I don't have time to check what I said before and read before then quote them].

OP wanted to ignore when I asked him why he had 50 accounts with different sportsbook? He responded later though once I asked again and other few guys too.
OP had very similar problem with other none branded sportsbooks too but still he continues gambling with none branded sportsbooks with large amount of money. With a highly established sportsbook he would not have to face such issue if he was fair
OP use such a blackmailing words/sentences is like if you don't do this I will do that.
OP gets rude when someone is not speaking in his favour. His words against SirJohnVonSlotty was not nice while SirJohnVonSlotty didn't seems siding for either OP not Coinplay.
When licensor told something that was not in his favour he started to blame the licensor. If he was not going to accept the justification of the licensor then why did he wrote them. Now he makes it sound that licensor did not handle it well and their response is suspicious
If anyone says anything that is semi favouring him he makes it sound like 100% in his favour. The askgambler never said OP was right but the reason was lack of providing information from coinplay. The way he is denying the licensor's response he would do that same if askgambler was saying things against him.
Reason was said arbitrage betting, then multi accounting from the same household which also led very well to arbitrage betting so what licensor said are very well relevant to the case.
There are many other things that feel like the whole story was not told as it happened but whatever presented, presented nicely to make it a strong case.

Most importantly if coinplay was really wanted to scam the OP then why did they returned his deposit?

We all are speculating and supporting flags, leaving red feedback based on what OP wants us to do. Lacking of communication does not mean you are guilty. If coinplay was fucking co-operative and giving us information then it would be helpful but that does not mean I have to flag them, red tag them from only hearing one side of story.

There are few other scam accusations against some other casinos which are still active. If I really need to support this flag anymore then I will have to ask the same for others too. Looking at these people who are creating topics against businesses on the forum, these businesses who are spending tons of money for advertising, does it make sense for them to scam members for $1k, $2k, $5k or even $10k?

 

[John Abraham]

Snip

Thanks for the detailed explanation. However, you had a choice not to respond if you wanted to. All point makes sense to me. I also noticed that OP aggressively shows anger when someone doesn't support him. I also criticized OP for being rude to SirJohnVonSlotty.

@GekkeBelg, Indeed, I am seeing some anger from you towards SirJohnVonSlotty. His post makes sense, and he did not guarantee that 100% of those happened. He clearly said

I'm not defending Coinplay, in my eyes this ended up as a good lesson for both sides.... ....What I'm trying to do though is figure out for my self what actually happened here, and it seems there's more to it....

@GekkeBelg, I don't see any point in talking like this, which makes you look guilty of doing something wrong.

It's not a secret I'm from the Netherlands, but I think you missed my point: making fun of Belgians is an ancient thing here (we say they're dumb, they say we're cheap).

I didn't know you were Dutch. I thought you were from Switzerland, as once you responded to me and said you were allegedly Swiss! About making fun, I am not Dutch, and I am not here for long enough. So, I am unaware of this thing.

[TwitchySeal]

Most importantly if coinplay was really wanted to scam the OP then why did they returned his deposit?

You mean if they really wanted to steal players money why did they only steal some and not all of it?

Because that's what scam casinos do.  It's called a freeroll.  ANd 1xbit is the best example of a site that does this on a regular basis.

They keep all of their losing players deposits + some of their winning players winnings.  

Players are less likely to create a public issue if the deposit is returned, even though they never had a chance to win.  I'm sure if it were more profitable, they wouldn't return player deposits, but it seems to be an effective strategy.

Returning players deposits and confiscating their winnings should always be a red flag - there are very few cases where doing so is the appropriate decision for a casino.  A players balance belongs to the player.  It doesn't matter how much they deposited.

Please do not ever give a casino a pass because they returned a deposit and only kept player winnings.

Just a reminder to everyone that's trying to defend Coinplay for some odd reason:

Coinplay agreed to use askgamblers to arbitrate.  

Askgamblers ruled against Coinplay.

Coinplay did not pay and ghosted.

There is absolutely no reason that Coinplay deserves any benefit of doubt in this situation.

I'm not defending Coinplay, in my eyes this ended up as a good lesson for both sides. Coinplay got slapped by the internet for not dealing with the issue, the player got their deposit back (regardless if they did or did not try to play the system)

By even suggesting that a player having their balance taken minus their deposit is somehow acceptable or meaningful is, in fact, defending Coinplay.  

What I'm trying to do though is figure out for my self what actually happened here, and it seems there's more to it.

#1. We have a Dutch player, who shouldn't be playing outside of his country, actively playing on several brands outside of his country.  
#2. That player won a larger amount through activity on several accounts, and triggered the abuser matrix.
#3. That same player got reported that he was playing with different accounts, arbitrage and so on.
#4. The operator didn't want to argue, refunded his deposit and closed his account.
#5. Even if the player could manage to somehow prove that he wasn't abusing the operator and remove all the smoke surrounding him, if KYC would be asked for, he would fail it and again only get the deposit back.

Your list should read:

#1. Coinplay and player had a dispute of players balance.  
#2. Coinplay and player agree to use third party.
#3. Third party rules against Coinplay.
#4. Coinplay still doesn't pay player and ghosts the forum.

[a581aa]

I support OP. Coinplay is obviously a scam company, they cover up their seemingly fair trading plan by returning the principal and always ensuring profits. They first claimed that there were problems with betting on OP, and then said there were multiple accounts, which are ridiculous excuses. If there are odds in the bet, of course there will be risks relative to winning or losing. If OP loses the bet, nothing happens; if they win, various excuses will be used to refund your principal, which is common in some gambling fraud companies. What's the point of gambling if players can only get back their own capital every time they win? These gambling companies always look for players' problems without solving their own internal problems. Anyway, this platform is more disgusting than some unlicensed platforms. I am not specifically targeting anyone, but I have encountered similar situations before where they still give you trouble even when you place normal winning bets. Bet365, Stake and Pinnacle are where you should go - don't waste your time and money on these boring small platforms because even if you bet with them ,they won't provide live video viewing for you.

[LoyceV]

Please do not ever give a casino a pass because they returned a deposit and only kept player winnings.

I like how Stunna handled a confirmed fraude case:

I'd like to stop this right here and make clear that this is not a matter of money but rather a matter of principle. I'm happy to donate at minimum the funds involved in this claim to a charity of the community's choosing.

That makes it clear they don't profit off it, and stops any accusations that they do it for the money.

[SirJohnVonSlotty]

A players balance belongs to the player.

To a legit player that didn't trigger the abuser matrix, yes.

But, if they triggered the abuser matrix, the balance is dissected, and whatever was the casinos money before, is back to being casinos money.

You have to understand that there are millions of forums, scripts and subs dedicated to scamming operators, who are bombarded with them on a daily basis, and dealing with each and every individual case takes resources, and you're either large enough to have those resources, or you go through the route of ignoring them.

You mean if they really wanted to steal players money why did they only steal some and not all of it?

Because that's what scam casinos do.  It's called a freeroll.

Technically, the casino didn't earn any money on this if it was a full refund (house edge/vig included), the total revenue on that player account are now zero.

Your list should read:

#1. Coinplay and player had a dispute of players balance.  
#2. Coinplay and player agree to use third party.
#3. Third party rules against Coinplay.
#4. Coinplay still doesn't pay player and ghosts the forum.

This is true. However, I think that there's more to this case then we see here, but there's no way in finding out that info without a Coinplay representative that would be more active than the current one, so we're just wasting our time arguing.  

[BitcoinGirl.Club]

Returning players deposits and confiscating their winnings should always be a red flag - there are very few cases where doing so is the appropriate decision for a casino.  A players balance belongs to the player.  It doesn't matter how much they deposited.

A players balance does not belongs to the player always. When a player is earning the balance from manipulation, abusing terms, abusing bonus, fixing match, arbitraging that is not appreciated by any sportsbook then the balance is not his, even the deposit they made can be confiscated by the sportsbook according to their terms.

Please do not ever give a casino a pass because they returned a deposit and only kept player winnings.

I will suggest you not give a pass to a player too when you do not know if he was manipulating you, hiding information from you. You have no way to verify anything except trusting him. In fact you and me have no way to verify anything presented by the sportsbook too.

I like how Stunna handled a confirmed fraude case:

I'd like to stop this right here and make clear that this is not a matter of money but rather a matter of principle. I'm happy to donate at minimum the funds involved in this claim to a charity of the community's choosing.

That makes it clear they don't profit off it, and stops any accusations that they do it for the money.

I think we need to consider the level of experience a project representative have in the community. Stunna, Steve from sportsbet.iom Karl and some others know how the community works in terms of their marketing but these new casino / sportsbooks launching everyday all the time, do not have much idea about how to handle their PR on the forum. May be it's our failure but that does not mean they have intention to scam anyone especially when they are spending money on building a good reputation for their project.

[LEVSKI7]

Complete nonsense. This illiterate constantly promotes the fraudulent rules of the sites that have no legal value

[Mahdirakib]

A players balance does not belongs to the player always. When a player is earning the balance from manipulation, abusing terms, abusing bonus, fixing match, arbitraging that is not appreciated by any sportsbook then the balance is not his, even the deposit they made can be confiscated by the sportsbook according to their terms.

In that case, the betting site should have the valid proof against the users. But Coinplay has made their final decision by saying this to the mediator

In accordance with the rules of the service - we have the right to close the player's account if the player violates our rules, which was revealed by our Risk & Fraud department.

Coinplay representative hadn't provided the necessary evidence to the mediator team. While it was their last response in the forum for resolving the issue

We meant to say that you should open a complaint on Askgamblers, where we both will provide the necessary details for them to review your case.

Coinplay representative hasn't acted professionally. They haven't said anything about this issue after that. In the meantime, they used some Bitcointalk account to oppose flag. And there was suspicious activity on those accounts which has been pointed out by Ratimov.

[TwitchySeal]

Please do not ever give a casino a pass because they returned a deposit and only kept player winnings.

I will suggest you not give a pass to a player too when you do not know if he was manipulating you, hiding information from you. You have no way to verify anything except trusting him. In fact you and me have no way to verify anything presented by the sportsbook too.

A pass for what?  They agreed to use a third party to arbitrate.  Ruling was in favor of player.  

Consider the facts and then reconsider your stance.  

Player:
- Gives detailed explanation of situation.  Provides evidence.
- Gives site permission to share any evidence.
- Offers to go to arbitration, gives permission to site to share all info with third party.
- Result of arbitration in their favor.


Casino:
- Does not provide any details or even a specific accusation.
- Agrees to arbitration, loses.
- Still doesn't pay.
- Ghosts forum.
- Only been around for 6 months.
- Obvious ties to the longest running scam casino on the forum that is well known for freerolling players by making vague accusations against winners, seizing their profit, returning only their deposit and then going silent.


Why would you defend the casino?  And yes, that is what you're doing.

[SirJohnVonSlotty]

In this case it's obvious that Coinplay doesn't want to allocate resources to resolve this, so everything that you've said is on point, except this:

Why would you defend the casino?  And yes, that is what you're doing.

I would say that she's defending the general process on how we treat scam accusations, not the casino itself. It's good to talk these things trough and have different opinions, it will help with other scam accusations later on.

[BitcoinGirl.Club]

Consider the facts and then reconsider your stance.  

Player:
- Gives detailed explanation of situation.  Provides evidence.
- Gives site permission to share any evidence.
- Offers to go to arbitration, gives permission to site to share all info with third party.
- Result of arbitration in their favor.


Casino:
- Does not provide any details or even a specific accusation.
- Agrees to arbitration, loses.
- Still doesn't pay.
- Ghosts forum.
- Only been around for 6 months.
- Obvious ties to the longest running scam casino on the forum that is well known for freerolling players by making vague accusations against winners, seizing their profit, returning only their deposit and then going silent.

It's not that I am not aware. Of course I am aware but why don't you consider the response from the license providers too? That does not seems the OP is innocent. Or you are saying licensor are protecting their clients and risking their reputation for 100s of other casinos they provided license.

Why would you defend the casino?  And yes, that is what you're doing.

Do you really think I am defending a specific casino? Since you asked [not sure why] then let me ask the same. Don't you think you are defending the OP blindly? Defending him just because he posted something which looks like legit to you but truth is you and I can not prove if that is indeed legit. Haven't we seen such accusations all the time against other casinos? Common accusations:

Casino x banned my account
Casino x confiscated my deposit
Casino x not responding to my PMs
Casino x is a scam
Casino x is 1xbit
Casino x do not pay my winning.

The entire scan accusation filled with such type of threads but it seems all your focus is one defending OP and seeing a specific casino should go down to the hole.
Why?

[Slow death]

Consider the facts and then reconsider your stance.  

Player:
- Gives detailed explanation of situation.  Provides evidence.
- Gives site permission to share any evidence.
- Offers to go to arbitration, gives permission to site to share all info with third party.
- Result of arbitration in their favor.


Casino:
- Does not provide any details or even a specific accusation.
- Agrees to arbitration, loses.
- Still doesn't pay.
- Ghosts forum.
- Only been around for 6 months.
- Obvious ties to the longest running scam casino on the forum that is well known for freerolling players by making vague accusations against winners, seizing their profit, returning only their deposit and then going silent.

It's not that I am not aware. Of course I am aware but why don't you consider the response from the license providers too? That does not seems the OP is innocent. Or you are saying licensor are protecting their clients and risking their reputation for 100s of other casinos they provided license.

Why would you defend the casino?  And yes, that is what you're doing.

Do you really think I am defending a specific casino? Since you asked [not sure why] then let me ask the same. Don't you think you are defending the OP blindly? Defending him just because he posted something which looks like legit to you but truth is you and I can not prove if that is indeed legit. Haven't we seen such accusations all the time against other casinos? Common accusations:

Casino x banned my account
Casino x confiscated my deposit
Casino x not responding to my PMs
Casino x is a scam
Casino x is 1xbit
Casino x do not pay my winning.

The entire scan accusation filled with such type of threads but it seems all your focus is one defending OP and seeing a specific casino should go down to the hole.
Why?

well, in what thread have we seen this kind of stuff?

hi @CoinPlay_official
I deposited money into Coinplay today and after placing a few bets, I realized that my account was closed.
I can no longer access my account. I emailed the security team and they told me that my account has been closed.

can you help me ?

id number :620934467

Hi robertolsona,

You should now be able to withdraw your deposit. Our security team has provided the reasons for the termination of our collaboration and account closure. As Mahdirakib correctly pointed out above, we cannot share specific evidence leading to account closures. It's a matter of policy and privacy.

Thank you

The answer is quite simple:

in the 1xbit thread, they are the same way of operating, this strategy of returning the deposit when the player wins is a long-term scam strategy, when the customer loses all bets the casino is not telling the customer that they have detected cheating and that for this reason they will return the deposit, or am I wrong? Has anyone here ever seen a casino come here and say that their customer lost all their money in the casino but that the casino team detected cheating and for that reason they will return the entire deposit amount? that doesn't happen, it only happens when people win money at the casino. and this meaningless excuse that they can't show proof that the customer is cheating because it could expose the casino's investigative methods, honestly does anyone here still believe in this meaningless excuse?

when you have a case like that of OP? it's not the OP who should post proof, it's the casino (the accuser who should post proof to the public) and when the accuser doesn't want to post proof then he should pay everything the player won, that's quite simple, for that reason I support the flag and I advise people not to use this casino, it is unacceptable that a casino simply accuses a customer of cheating, and does not pay him his winnings and also does not want to post proof that led the casino to withhold the player's winnings. we cannot blindly trust the casino, today is OP's case, tomorrow will someone else have their account closed and why? the casino has detected cheating, but where is this proof? oh we just have to trust the word of the casino, so in 1 month we will have more similar cases

[TwitchySeal]

It's not that I am not aware. Of course I am aware but why don't you consider the response from the license providers too?

I did consider the response from the license provider.  I consider it bullshit.  In 5 + years I've never seen or even heard of curacao or a curacao master license helping a player or actually investigating. The only time I can think of anyone speaking up about any sort of dispute is when they defended 1xbit.  (1xbit was ultimately forced into bankruptcy after breifly having it overruled, which was when curacao made that statement.  

Do you really think I am defending a specific casino?

Yes.  You're defending coinplay.  You're doing it this very post.  By bringing up all the way OP could be guilty, or making it seem like the statement from their license holder somehow justifies anything despite the fact that coinplay agreed to use askgamblers.  Askgamblers ruled in favor of OP.  Coinplay didn't pay and just stopped posting.

Since you asked [not sure why] then let me ask the same. Don't you think you are defending the OP blindly? Defending him just because he posted something which looks like legit to you but truth is you and I can not prove if that is indeed legit. Haven't we seen such accusations all the time against other casinos? Common accusations:

Casino x banned my account
Casino x confiscated my deposit
Casino x not responding to my PMs
Casino x is a scam
Casino x is 1xbit
Casino x do not pay my winning.

The entire scan accusation filled with such type of threads but it seems all your focus is one defending OP and seeing a specific casino should go down to the hole.
Why?

I've participated in many scam accusation threads.  

I'm defending OP because of the way coinplay has handled the situation.

They agreed to use askgamblers.  Askgamblers ruled in favor of OP.  Coinplay didn't pay and just stopped posting.


Let me say that again:

They agreed to use askgamblers.

Askgamblers ruled in favor of OP.

Coinplay didn't pay and just stopped posting.

[BitcoinGirl.Club]

I've participated in many scam accusation threads.  

I don't understand why you need to state something to prove your worth, do you need an approval?  None of us are unknown and nothing to prove or approve to each others.

I'm defending OP because of the way coinplay has handled the situation.

They agreed to use askgamblers.  Askgamblers ruled in favor of OP.  Coinplay didn't pay and just stopped posting.


Let me say that again:

They agreed to use askgamblers.

Askgamblers ruled in favor of OP.

Coinplay didn't pay and just stopped posting.

It's obvious, you and me are not seeing a thing from the same angle. Whatever is your reason to give every benefit of doubt to the OP [it's like you were there when OP was creating the account and gambling on the site] but not co-operating with askgamblers from coinplay is true and the same way the response from the licenses provider is true too [not matter how you justify their response].

Askgamblers closed the case because they did not receive enough information from Coinplay, not that they were approving OP's case and certifying the case is a win in favour of the OP. The license provide in fact provided a good reason [although we don't know how was it verified] but it seems you are blinded in that part but very active in askgamblers part. Indicates again, you and me are not seeing the case from the same page.

Do you really think I am defending a specific casino?

Yes.  You're defending coinplay.  You're doing it this very post.

This very post is about Coinplay, not about sportsbet.io, Stake.com, Rollbit, Duelbits, FortuneJack. What do you expect, to talk about all on this thread?

[JollyGood]

I already left negative feedback for Coinplay some time back (because of their whole conduct throughout the scam allegation) even though I am late posting in this thread, I wanted to highlight what you wrote because that is ultimately what forum members opinions most probably should be based on.

In the end there should be no serious debate about what did or did not take place between the OP and Coinplay because after AskGamblers made their ruling that road is now closed. Anyway, since both parties agreed to take their claim and counter-claim to AskGamblers the common sense outcome would be to accept their judgement otherwise why agree to let AskGamblers evaluate the allegation.

Coinplay have destroyed their reputation in this forum over a 0.291 BTC payout and the chances are they will never be able to repair the damage even if they return and pay the OP what he is owed. Will the flags and feedback be revised/removed by all those tagged?

I've participated in many scam accusation threads.  

I'm defending OP because of the way coinplay has handled the situation.

They agreed to use askgamblers.  Askgamblers ruled in favor of OP.  Coinplay didn't pay and just stopped posting.

Let me say that again:

They agreed to use askgamblers.

Askgamblers ruled in favor of OP.

Coinplay didn't pay and just stopped posting.

[TwitchySeal]

I've participated in many scam accusation threads.

I don't understand why you need to state something to prove your worth, do you need an approval?  None of us are unknown and nothing to prove or approve to each others.

You know that's not the reason I made that statement.

You know that I was directly responding to what you said about me:

The entire scan accusation filled with such type of threads but it seems all your focus is one defending OP and seeing a specific casino should go down to the hole.

Trying to make it appear the way you are, when I was literally just responding to your bullshit claim is messed up.



As for the rest, just read Jollygoods post.  That's what I've been trying to explain to you this whole time.  This is not a complicated case so I'm not going to waste any more time going back and forth with your ridiculous and disingenuous arguments.