Using ToS against users normal?

[vv181]

This 'checkbox compliance' is, in essence, a Band-Aid solution. Rather than merely ensuring a user 'agrees' to the ToS, businesses should strive to make them easily understandable and engaging. Utilise summaries, bullet points, visuals - bring them to life! Once users feel that ToS are more accessible and less of a chore, perhaps then we'll see an uptick in their widespread consideration.

Businesses' main concern in terms of services is compliance and protection/defending their own legal rights. They did not have the motive to make it easily digestible, instead, the regulation force them to make that happen. If I'm not mistaken, there is a regulation that enforces businesses should make the ToS/TnC contains less legal language, and the thing as you've said, summaries and bullet points.

If we look at a similar approach to business and customer relations, we are aware of how irritatingly we have to click the cookie consent. That is also part of regulation, the problem is does it effective to make the customer become more aware of their rights? I don't think it significantly affects them, instead, it just annoys people.

[Doan9269]

Sure, sending notifications of any changes is a good practice, but did Stake.com actually obliged themselves (in the ToS) to send notifications of any changes? If not, you'd still have to read them everytime you log in, if you want to practice what you preach.

This is the cheatsheet of every casino that lawmakers should check and I knew every service is required by law to do that^{(notifying when there's a change in TOS at least 2 weeks before)}. But stake mentioned on its TOS that they can change their TOS with or without notifying its users so you need to read it regularly like its just 3-5 lines sentences amp.

I don't see anything that calls for worrying oneself on the issue of discussion concerning recent experience with the stake.com gambling platforms, all they requested is for you to complete a KYC procedures required to have a good catch on every elements of money laundering attempts, i hope by now the conditions given is not what ordinary person cannot afford to give knowing that they are KYC casino.

[michellee]

This 'checkbox compliance' is, in essence, a Band-Aid solution. Rather than merely ensuring a user 'agrees' to the ToS, businesses should strive to make them easily understandable and engaging. Utilise summaries, bullet points, visuals - bring them to life! Once users feel that ToS are more accessible and less of a chore, perhaps then we'll see an uptick in their widespread consideration.

Businesses' main concern in terms of services is compliance and protection/defending their own legal rights. They did not have the motive to make it easily digestible, instead, the regulation force them to make that happen. If I'm not mistaken, there is a regulation that enforces businesses should make the ToS/TnC contains less legal language, and the thing as you've said, summaries and bullet points.

If we look at a similar approach to business and customer relations, we are aware of how irritatingly we have to click the cookie consent. That is also part of regulation, the problem is does it effective to make the customer become more aware of their rights? I don't think it significantly affects them, instead, it just annoys people.

Most people would not think to want to read such long terms that it takes more time to digest what is written there. They will only immediately agree because they want to play gambling at the casino immediately.

But when they are later faced with a problem, they will immediately contact the support service to ask for clarity on the problem. And they're just starting to take the time to read the rules when they're breaking them. And the casino itself may want to explain all the rules in detail so the casino does not intend to summarize and outline the rules. And often, users really need help understanding the meaning of the rules so they will immediately press the agree button.

If these consumers are wise, they may read slowly and try to digest it so they understand and will not try to break any rules in the casino. But usually, if there is a change in the rules, the casino will notify the user so that they will check it immediately before playing gambling.

[klidex]

Yes, not all casinos will give notifications when there are changes to the TOS, but as I recall, the popular casinos that I currently use, such as Stake.com, will notify you when you open the site after the TOS changes have been made.
Like last time when Stake changed the TOS and I opened the site and there was a notification that there was a change in the TOS that had been determined.
It is at that time that we are obliged to read the changes that have occurred so that we avoid the problem of violating the TOS.
Maybe not all casinos will have the same notices but I hope we all at least read a little bit about the more important TOS we have to comply with.

Stake.com has done that a while back. And they ask us to read it because it's important that we don't break it. So reading the TOS is recommended even though many gamblers don't like to read the TOS because it's too long.

I agree with you that sometimes gamblers will become lazy to read if they remember very long texts and they only read what they need as we discuss here.
In another problem, namely sometimes gamblers who ignore these rules, they are novice gamblers who do not know beforehand that each casino has different rules.

[LUCKMCFLY]

~snip~

I think that this is how most people gamble.  Just like you. 

And those players just want to have some fun and don't want to spend time reading TOS at all, and time is spent not only reading, but also understanding some of the more difficult points of TOS.  And these points in the rules may be important in your future game in this casino. 
Moreover, persuading players to carefully read and understand TOS in advance, in my opinion, does not make sense at all.  All the same, almost no one will listen to you (with rare exceptions - attentive, responsible and cautious players) and will continue to play without taking into account the possibility of unforeseen situations at all. 
Those situations that directly follow from the TOS of this casino.  And then you will have endless correspondence with support, which could have been avoided and not wasted on them your precious time.

Sure, many gamers find TOS a roadblock and overlook it, but it's this neglect that can cause problems. The TOS isn't just wordy gibberish; it's a pact detailing rights and duties of both parties. Believing that reading TOS is time-wasting doesn't lessen its key role in warding off disputes. Gamers could dodge troubles by knowing what they're agreeing to. Promoting TOS awareness isn't useless, even if largely ignored. Skipping the TOS can lead to unexpected issues like account freezing, lost income, or quarrels with support. Thus, urging players to read TOS can spare time and future headaches.

Yes, always what we sometimes do not Look at when we enter a casino and especially because of the bonuses, contests, only the adrenaline makes us enter, is what we always Observe, I am a person that I have seen in some other threads out there some casinos change their coughs, and that is something that should not be, Because generally they do it to Benefit the casino in general and that is something that they should not do and if they do it they should participate so that they can all be aware , but doing it at all times and without the consent of a Community can sometimes look very bad.

Yes, not all casinos will give notifications when there are changes to the TOS, but as I recall, the popular casinos that I currently use, such as Stake.com, will notify you when you open the site after the TOS changes have been made.
Like last time when Stake changed the TOS and I opened the site and there was a notification that there was a change in the TOS that had been determined.
It is at that time that we are obliged to read the changes that have occurred so that we avoid the problem of violating the TOS.
Maybe not all casinos will have the same notices but I hope we all at least read a little bit about the more important TOS we have to comply with.

Stake.com has done that a while back. And they ask us to read it because it's important that we don't break it. So reading the TOS is recommended even though many gamblers don't like to read the TOS because it's too long.

I agree with you that sometimes gamblers will become lazy to read if they remember very long texts and they only read what they need as we discuss here.
In another problem, namely sometimes gamblers who ignore these rules, they are novice gamblers who do not know beforehand that each casino has different rules.

Well, but we all know that stake.com is a very different casino that has a unique legitimacy and authenticity over the years, the reputation in the casino and all its games is a good image of what it represents to have or be a great casino , I don't know if you've seen it, but when it comes to having the best casks in the stake.com forum , it always rises, if it's not first, then not third place, of course when it's someone who has a point of view Regarding the reviews very good and what is impartial.

There are other casinos that are very good and that have a lot of future , that do things very Well, and that can be the best in any Sense , in this case I am talking about stake.com because it has always Stood out as One of the Best in The World.

[Wiwo]

Yes, not all casinos will give notifications when there are changes to the TOS, but as I recall, the popular casinos that I currently use, such as Stake.com, will notify you when you open the site after the TOS changes have been made.
Like last time when Stake changed the TOS and I opened the site and there was a notification that there was a change in the TOS that had been determined.
It is at that time that we are obliged to read the changes that have occurred so that we avoid the problem of violating the TOS.
Maybe not all casinos will have the same notices but I hope we all at least read a little bit about the more important TOS we have to comply with.

Stake.com has done that a while back. And they ask us to read it because it's important that we don't break it. So reading the TOS is recommended even though many gamblers don't like to read the TOS because it's too long.

I agree with you that sometimes gamblers will become lazy to read if they remember very long texts and they only read what they need as we discuss here.
In another problem, namely, sometimes gamblers who ignore these rules, they are novice gamblers who do not know beforehand that each casino has different rules.

But sometimes,  we can't blame the player for being too lazy not to read the terms and conditions of casinos before making deposits and playing on them,  even though the seizure of the document is a major point of disagreement for the gambler which has become the ground at which casino always win cases that arise from such mistakes.

Also, another point to note also is that some scam casinos always edit the TOS frequently as a way to favour their case and this have been discovered several time.

[erep]

But sometimes,  we can't blame the player for being too lazy not to read the terms and conditions of casinos before making deposits and playing on them,  even though the seizure of the document is a major point of disagreement for the gambler which has become the ground at which casino always win cases that arise from such mistakes.

Also, another point to note also is that some scam casinos always edit the TOS frequently as a way to favour their case and this have been discovered several time.

If the player has never read the TOS then scammed gambling has the opportunity to blame the player for not understanding the basic provisions before betting on a particular gambling platform, but if the TOS changes without notification then the player has never read the TOS repeatedly because he does not suspect any points have changed, my advice to archive the TOS gambling article link or take a screenshot of the TOS to save on your device.

If we have evidence of TOS changes from archive links and screenshots then we must immediately report gambling on the alleged fraud board to prevent losses from other gamblers. They will immediately check your report, if it is proven it will be marked as scam gambling and no forum members are gambling using their gambling platform.

[Wiwo]

But sometimes,  we can't blame the player for being too lazy not to read the terms and conditions of casinos before making deposits and playing on them,  even though the seizure of the document is a major point of disagreement for the gambler which has become the ground at which casino always win cases that arise from such mistakes.

Also, another point to note also is that some scam casinos always edit the TOS frequently as a way to favour their case and this have been discovered several time.

If the player has never read the TOS then scammed gambling has the opportunity to blame the player for not understanding the basic provisions before betting on a particular gambling platform, but if the TOS changes without notification then the player has never read the TOS repeatedly because he does not suspect any points have changed, my advice to archive the TOS gambling article link or take a screenshot of the TOS to save on your device.

If we have evidence of TOS changes from archive links and screenshots then we must immediately report gambling on the alleged fraud board to prevent losses from other gamblers. They will immediately check your report, if it is proven it will be marked as scam gambling and no forum members are gambling using their gambling platform.

That is the fact and the blame should be on the gambler most because of the failure to read the document and properly interpret its terms and services and how best to avoid breaking the rules because all casino has their own special and peculiar rules guiding their activities.

The mistakes I have also noticed that players make is the fact that they tend to contradict the TOS or misunderstood it because they already read a TOs document from casino A there will not read that of casino B thinking that the documents and rules will be the same for Casino A and B we're as it differs both in writing and applications.

[maydna]

~snip~

I agree with you that sometimes gamblers will become lazy to read if they remember very long texts and they only read what they need as we discuss here.
In another problem, namely sometimes gamblers who ignore these rules, they are novice gamblers who do not know beforehand that each casino has different rules.

We must try to be active to read the rules, which may be very long and difficult to understand if we only read them once. We do that so that we don't break the rules and can immediately withdraw the money without any problems. It's better not to ignore these rules so that we can enjoy gambling well and withdraw the money. But many gamblers need to read the rules because they think it will be the same for every casino when it's not. It is a form of responsibility that we can take to protect ourselves while playing gambling so that we can be calm and comfortable playing gambling at a trusted casino.

[Coin_trader]

~snip~

I agree with you that sometimes gamblers will become lazy to read if they remember very long texts and they only read what they need as we discuss here.
In another problem, namely sometimes gamblers who ignore these rules, they are novice gamblers who do not know beforehand that each casino has different rules.

We must try to be active to read the rules, which may be very long and difficult to understand if we only read them once. We do that so that we don't break the rules and can immediately withdraw the money without any problems. It's better not to ignore these rules so that we can enjoy gambling well and withdraw the money. But many gamblers need to read the rules because they think it will be the same for every casino when it's not. It is a form of responsibility that we can take to protect ourselves while playing gambling so that we can be calm and comfortable playing gambling at a trusted casino.

With your suggestion. Player should read the very long content of the ToS everytime he will play on the website so that he can assure that the he can remember the rules always? This is the most tiresome way of gambling since casino ToS is TLDR which a normal gambler will find very stressful while we are just having fun as purpose of gambling. ToS is not that complicated if you are just a regular gamblers that doing a regular bets without any abused on the casino promotion.

No one is willing to memorize the casino ToS before they play because impossible and mood killer. Just play on the casino that has a good reputation so that you can assure that their ToS is always fair for their customers. Only shady casino like 1xbit will deliberately use ToS against user while reputable casino like Livecasino will always be fair on regular gamblers that knows the basic rule of the casino which is not that complicated and self explanatory.

[South Park]

We must try to be active to read the rules, which may be very long and difficult to understand if we only read them once. We do that so that we don't break the rules and can immediately withdraw the money without any problems. It's better not to ignore these rules so that we can enjoy gambling well and withdraw the money. But many gamblers need to read the rules because they think it will be the same for every casino when it's not. It is a form of responsibility that we can take to protect ourselves while playing gambling so that we can be calm and comfortable playing gambling at a trusted casino.

While this is the correct thing to do, at the same time it is very rare, most of the time when a gambler wants to try a new casino they are so excited about it that they want to begin to gamble immediately, so they do not bother to read the terms of service of the casino, now most of the time this will not be a problem, however if you happen to encounter some circumstances that are out of the ordinary then you could regret not reading those terms, as in that case the casino will most likely be on the right and they will be able to take the measures that suit their interests the best.

[TimeTeller]

We must try to be active to read the rules, which may be very long and difficult to understand if we only read them once. We do that so that we don't break the rules and can immediately withdraw the money without any problems. It's better not to ignore these rules so that we can enjoy gambling well and withdraw the money. But many gamblers need to read the rules because they think it will be the same for every casino when it's not. It is a form of responsibility that we can take to protect ourselves while playing gambling so that we can be calm and comfortable playing gambling at a trusted casino.

While this is the correct thing to do, at the same time it is very rare, most of the time when a gambler wants to try a new casino they are so excited about it that they want to begin to gamble immediately, so they do not bother to read the terms of service of the casino, now most of the time this will not be a problem, however if you happen to encounter some circumstances that are out of the ordinary then you could regret not reading those terms, as in that case the casino will most likely be on the right and they will be able to take the measures that suit their interests the best.

If you start sending big amount to the casino, it is your very own responsibility to check the terms of the site.
Because whatever happens is your fault because as a player, you have the responsibility to know their ToS.
They put it in place as a common ground for both players and the owner, absence of this will give them a messy management of their casino.
So for me, some of these accusations also root from the ignorance of the players, and not entirely the casinos fault.

[lienfaye]

We must try to be active to read the rules, which may be very long and difficult to understand if we only read them once. We do that so that we don't break the rules and can immediately withdraw the money without any problems. It's better not to ignore these rules so that we can enjoy gambling well and withdraw the money. But many gamblers need to read the rules because they think it will be the same for every casino when it's not. It is a form of responsibility that we can take to protect ourselves while playing gambling so that we can be calm and comfortable playing gambling at a trusted casino.

While this is the correct thing to do, at the same time it is very rare, most of the time when a gambler wants to try a new casino they are so excited about it that they want to begin to gamble immediately, so they do not bother to read the terms of service of the casino, now most of the time this will not be a problem, however if you happen to encounter some circumstances that are out of the ordinary then you could regret not reading those terms, as in that case the casino will most likely be on the right and they will be able to take the measures that suit their interests the best.

If you start sending big amount to the casino, it is your very own responsibility to check the terms of the site.
Because whatever happens is your fault because as a player, you have the responsibility to know their ToS.
They put it in place as a common ground for both players and the owner, absence of this will give them a messy management of their casino.
So for me, some of these accusations also root from the ignorance of the players, and not entirely the casinos fault.

That's right. Before playing in the casino of your choice, always take a little time to read their rules so you won't be clueless but careful not to violate any of it. It's a basic thing to do but some of us are too complacent. Even you're just using a small amount for your gambling activity, it's not a reason to disregard the ToS.

Therefore, if you violate the rules because of being unaware then it's your fault. Unless they changed what's written on their ToS without notifying their players, well that's a different matter.

[Blitzboy]

`

Most people would not think to want to read such long terms that it takes more time to digest what is written there. They will only immediately agree because they want to play gambling at the casino immediately.

But when they are later faced with a problem, they will immediately contact the support service to ask for clarity on the problem. And they're just starting to take the time to read the rules when they're breaking them. And the casino itself may want to explain all the rules in detail so the casino does not intend to summarize and outline the rules. And often, users really need help understanding the meaning of the rules so they will immediately press the agree button.

If these consumers are wise, they may read slowly and try to digest it so they understand and will not try to break any rules in the casino. But usually, if there is a change in the rules, the casino will notify the user so that they will check it immediately before playing gambling.

You're right about people ignoring terms and conditions to start playing. You nicely described this "click-and-go" mindset, which is more frequent than one would expect.

These words exist for a purpose. Players and casinos are protected by them. It's tempting to get immediately into the game, but learning the rules might avoid future miscommunications.

Knowing your rights and duties as a participant is as important as avoiding breaching the rules. Casinos notifying users of regulation changes is a good step toward openness.

Rules should be approached pragmatically, in my opinion. Though boring, it's essential to internet gaming. Be a clever player and make an educated selection.

[maydna]

~snip~

With your suggestion. Player should read the very long content of the ToS everytime he will play on the website so that he can assure that the he can remember the rules always? This is the most tiresome way of gambling since casino ToS is TLDR which a normal gambler will find very stressful while we are just having fun as purpose of gambling. ToS is not that complicated if you are just a regular gamblers that doing a regular bets without any abused on the casino promotion.

No one is willing to memorize the casino ToS before they play because impossible and mood killer. Just play on the casino that has a good reputation so that you can assure that their ToS is always fair for their customers. Only shady casino like 1xbit will deliberately use ToS against user while reputable casino like Livecasino will always be fair on regular gamblers that knows the basic rule of the casino which is not that complicated and self explanatory.

He doesn't need to read it every time he gambles but takes the time, maybe once a week or a month, to read the TOS' lengthy content. But if your goal is just to have fun, that means you don't have to bother yourself reading those long TOS and skipping them. If you don't read the TOS carefully, it means you agree to all the rules, and even if later you have problems with the rules, you can't complain because it's your own fault for not wanting to read the TOS.

Yes, playing at a reputable casino is very good advice, and that's what we should do and stay away from shady casinos so that we don't get into trouble. If you have an account at Stake.com, you can skim through the TOS before entering your betting account page so that it's easier for you to see whether there have been changes in the TOS. And if not, it means there is no notification about changes to the TOS.

~snip~

While this is the correct thing to do, at the same time it is very rare, most of the time when a gambler wants to try a new casino they are so excited about it that they want to begin to gamble immediately, so they do not bother to read the terms of service of the casino, now most of the time this will not be a problem, however if you happen to encounter some circumstances that are out of the ordinary then you could regret not reading those terms, as in that case the casino will most likely be on the right and they will be able to take the measures that suit their interests the best.

Yes, that's what happens to most gamblers. They don't want to read the requirements on other pages and instead go straight to gambling. We should prevent unwanted things rather than regret them later, and reading the TOS regularly can prevent problems. And we can also play gambling calmly because we don't break anything while playing gambling.

[Fatunad]

`

Most people would not think to want to read such long terms that it takes more time to digest what is written there. They will only immediately agree because they want to play gambling at the casino immediately.

But when they are later faced with a problem, they will immediately contact the support service to ask for clarity on the problem. And they're just starting to take the time to read the rules when they're breaking them. And the casino itself may want to explain all the rules in detail so the casino does not intend to summarize and outline the rules. And often, users really need help understanding the meaning of the rules so they will immediately press the agree button.

If these consumers are wise, they may read slowly and try to digest it so they understand and will not try to break any rules in the casino. But usually, if there is a change in the rules, the casino will notify the user so that they will check it immediately before playing gambling.

You're right about people ignoring terms and conditions to start playing. You nicely described this "click-and-go" mindset, which is more frequent than one would expect.

These words exist for a purpose. Players and casinos are protected by them. It's tempting to get immediately into the game, but learning the rules might avoid future miscommunications.

Knowing your rights and duties as a participant is as important as avoiding breaching the rules. Casinos notifying users of regulation changes is a good step toward openness.

Rules should be approached pragmatically, in my opinion. Though boring, it's essential to internet gaming. Be a clever player and make an educated selection.

99% of players or gamblers would really be like this on which i do even myself consider on skipping out on reading up terms and conditions and just simply click out that checkbox and done registering and would make
out some deposit next. So far i havent been able to experience those fund locked ups because usually where these casinos is been focusing is on that KYC or having those wager requirements or something which
it isnt really that too far into each other.This is why we do really assume out that it wont really be that much in different when it comes to those terms which would really be similar most of the time.
On the time that the house is using their TOS against their players or havent been able to pay it up then as a user then there's nothing we can do or not to make out any argument since we havent been able
to read up that TOS on the time we do register. We cant really be able to point out if there are some changes or not with those TOS and this is why we do end up on accepting our fate and move on.

[Ziskinberg]

We cant really be able to point out if there are some changes or not with those TOS and this is why we do end up on accepting our fate and move on.

Did we know about any issues from gamblers who were victims of changes to the Terms of Service? Personally, I believe that a fair gambling site would inform its gamblers if there are significant changes to the TOS that would affect their gambling experience. So, I suppose it wouldn't happen unless there is evidence stating otherwise.

[LUCKMCFLY]

The rules at the casino can change at any time, without or with notification and this requires our attention so that we can be aware of these changes and we need to adapt to the new regulations. It's better for us to take a moment to know the rules than to regret them later because when we want to withdraw the winning money but find ourselves in trouble, it will disappoint us. There may be a reason the casino changed the rules so that people who don't see the TOS can get in trouble. But a trusted and good casino will always notify you if there is a change in the rules.

Yes, not all casinos will give notifications when there are changes to the TOS, but as I recall, the popular casinos that I currently use, such as Stake.com, will notify you when you open the site after the TOS changes have been made.
Like last time when Stake changed the TOS and I opened the site and there was a notification that there was a change in the TOS that had been determined.
It is at that time that we are obliged to read the changes that have occurred so that we avoid the problem of violating the TOS.
Maybe not all casinos will have the same notices but I hope we all at least read a little bit about the more important TOS we have to comply with.

But if the casinos do not notify, I think that this is bad practice, because it is not what they should be, things get very ugly, firstly they are playing with the will of many players who believe that things are under the terms and conditions they signed from the registry is kept intact, I am not saying anything that they put or change the terms and conditions of the bonuses, because the bonuses are things that the casinos offer and they change them daily, but in general in their rules if they should notify and if they change them to every moment is a red alert without a doubt.

[Fivestar4everMVP]

We cant really be able to point out if there are some changes or not with those TOS and this is why we do end up on accepting our fate and move on.

Did we know about any issues from gamblers who were victims of changes to the Terms of Service? Personally, I believe that a fair gambling site would inform its gamblers if there are significant changes to the TOS that would affect their gambling experience. So, I suppose it wouldn't happen unless there is evidence stating otherwise.

From all my years  as a gambler, all the casinos I've gambled on have always been reputable casinos, (atleast, at the time I used them), all of them have always been fair to their users like you pointed out, that is, the always remind users through email(most of the time), that their terms and conditions have been updated, and that on so and so date, the updated terms and conditions will take effect, they also provide users a link to read and accept the new terms and conditions, stating that if the user continues to use the platform after the date the new terms and conditions is taking effect, it means the user have accepted the new terms and conditions.

But then, like I've said before In one of my previous comments, casinos being managed by some bag eggs still use terms and conditions as a way to scam unsuspecting users.

[SirLancelot]

We cant really be able to point out if there are some changes or not with those TOS and this is why we do end up on accepting our fate and move on.

Did we know about any issues from gamblers who were victims of changes to the Terms of Service? Personally, I believe that a fair gambling site would inform its gamblers if there are significant changes to the TOS that would affect their gambling experience. So, I suppose it wouldn't happen unless there is evidence stating otherwise.

Personally, I've never heard anyone stating that they've been a victim of this, but I do know that a lot of gambling platforms don't inform their customers when they make changes in their terms and conditions, and I've read this myself in a lot of terms and conditions that the platform has the right to modify, add, or remove anything into the terms and conditions page without the consent of the users, and users have already agreed with that when they signed up.

So the point is that if a casino doesn't inform their customers about the changes, they simply don't want them to know about the changes and if they get in trouble, they wouldn't be able to say anything since it's written in their terms and conditions. Most gamblers don't read the terms and conditions, so they think that maybe it has always been there.