Publicly held Trump trials - ongoing

[paxmao]

From the recent ruling where a federal judge found that Trump did participate in insurrection, but should not be removed from the ballot:

TRUMP’S HISTORY WITH POLITICAL EXTREMISTS
61. As noted above, Petitioners called an expert in political extremism,
[-snip-]


Trump intended to incite violence.

https://www.courts.state.co.us/userfiles/file/Court_Probation/02nd_Judicial_District/Denver_District_Court/11_17_2023%20Final%20Order.pdf
(page 26 on)

Read about it tonight and I seems both those lawyers/prosecutors seeking to keep Trump out the ballot will try to appeal, so he will ended stay out the ballot in that State, during the election next year. On the other hand, I have also read Trump's legal team has tried to appeal to this ruling, in the base they do not want this judge to effectively setting a precedent of Trump being legally a participant in an insurrection within the United States,  if they do an exception to the presidency, then it would be a very dangerous precedent to keep for the amendment. After all, those who rise to power are the one who try to stay in power by getting rid of democracy, there has been several instances of it happening through history.

Ironically, I could foresee that excluding Trump from the ballot in states he did not have a chance of winning anyways, will only encourage his supporters to vote in flipping states and increase his popularity, in a similar way to what happened with indictments.

I read about the several challenges that have been put forward in several states. Judges are trying to avoid anything that looks like interfering with politics. Some of the arguments are really funny on why Trump can stay in the ballot, really creative like "The president is not an official of the Goverment" or other semantics.

However, what is possibly the most interesting and honest is the court that said: "He can be in the Primaries because that is internal to the party", however the court said that if he is the candidate chosen, then the case can be presented. All the cases have been appealed.

Most judges tend to look at all these matters as a political matter. In my view it is not from the moment that several felonies are proven right - then is a matter of justice.

[1715296445]

1715296445

[TwitchySeal]

From the recent ruling where a federal judge found that Trump did participate in insurrection, but should not be removed from the ballot:

TRUMP’S HISTORY WITH POLITICAL EXTREMISTS
61. As noted above, Petitioners called an expert in political extremism,
[-snip-]


Trump intended to incite violence.

https://www.courts.state.co.us/userfiles/file/Court_Probation/02nd_Judicial_District/Denver_District_Court/11_17_2023%20Final%20Order.pdf
(page 26 on)

Read about it tonight and I seems both those lawyers/prosecutors seeking to keep Trump out the ballot will try to appeal, so he will ended stay out the ballot in that State, during the election next year. On the other hand, I have also read Trump's legal team has tried to appeal to this ruling, in the base they do not want this judge to effectively setting a precedent of Trump being legally a participant in an insurrection within the United States,  if they do an exception to the presidency, then it would be a very dangerous precedent to keep for the amendment. After all, those who rise to power are the one who try to stay in power by getting rid of democracy, there has been several instances of it happening through history.

Ironically, I could foresee that excluding Trump from the ballot in states he did not have a chance of winning anyways, will only encourage his supporters to vote in flipping states and increase his popularity, in a similar way to what happened with indictments.

I read about the several challenges that have been put forward in several states. Judges are trying to avoid anything that looks like interfering with politics. Some of the arguments are really funny on why Trump can stay in the ballot, really creative like "The president is not an official of the Goverment" or other semantics.

However, what is possibly the most interesting and honest is the court that said: "He can be in the Primaries because that is internal to the party", however the court said that if he is the candidate chosen, then the case can be presented. All the cases have been appealed.

Most judges tend to look at all these matters as a political matter. In my view it is not from the moment that several felonies are proven right - then is a matter of justice.

I don't see how this case doesn't end up at the supreme court.

[Hispo]

From the recent ruling where a federal judge found that Trump did participate in insurrection, but should not be removed from the ballot:

TRUMP’S HISTORY WITH POLITICAL EXTREMISTS
61. As noted above, Petitioners called an expert in political extremism,
[-snip-]


Trump intended to incite violence.

https://www.courts.state.co.us/userfiles/file/Court_Probation/02nd_Judicial_District/Denver_District_Court/11_17_2023%20Final%20Order.pdf
(page 26 on)

Read about it tonight and I seems both those lawyers/prosecutors seeking to keep Trump out the ballot will try to appeal, so he will ended stay out the ballot in that State, during the election next year. On the other hand, I have also read Trump's legal team has tried to appeal to this ruling, in the base they do not want this judge to effectively setting a precedent of Trump being legally a participant in an insurrection within the United States,  if they do an exception to the presidency, then it would be a very dangerous precedent to keep for the amendment. After all, those who rise to power are the one who try to stay in power by getting rid of democracy, there has been several instances of it happening through history.

Ironically, I could foresee that excluding Trump from the ballot in states he did not have a chance of winning anyways, will only encourage his supporters to vote in flipping states and increase his popularity, in a similar way to what happened with indictments.

I read about the several challenges that have been put forward in several states. Judges are trying to avoid anything that looks like interfering with politics. Some of the arguments are really funny on why Trump can stay in the ballot, really creative like "The president is not an official of the Goverment" or other semantics.

However, what is possibly the most interesting and honest is the court that said: "He can be in the Primaries because that is internal to the party", however the court said that if he is the candidate chosen, then the case can be presented. All the cases have been appealed.

Most judges tend to look at all these matters as a political matter. In my view it is not from the moment that several felonies are proven right - then is a matter of justice.

I don't see how this case doesn't end up at the supreme court.

It will eventually, I guess.
And when it does it is probable those within the supreme court will rule in Favor of Trump, allowing him to stay in the ballot in those states where his participation is being disputed. Though, as I said, It may not matter whether he stays or not in the ballot in states where he won't have much chances of winning anyways.

The members of the supreme court could argue that excluding Trump would be a point of no return for American Democracy and the decision could lead to civil unrest amount the civilian population. January 6th has set a clear precendet for such argument.
On the other hand, it may be about avoiding to push the case to the supreme court, so if it stays in a local court, those procecuting Trump will have more chances to keep him out of the ballot.

[paxmao]

From the recent ruling where a federal judge found that Trump did participate in insurrection, but should not be removed from the ballot:

TRUMP’S HISTORY WITH POLITICAL EXTREMISTS
61. As noted above, Petitioners called an expert in political extremism,
[-snip-]


Trump intended to incite violence.

https://www.courts.state.co.us/userfiles/file/Court_Probation/02nd_Judicial_District/Denver_District_Court/11_17_2023%20Final%20Order.pdf
(page 26 on)

Read about it tonight and I seems both those lawyers/prosecutors seeking to keep Trump out the ballot will try to appeal, so he will ended stay out the ballot in that State, during the election next year. On the other hand, I have also read Trump's legal team has tried to appeal to this ruling, in the base they do not want this judge to effectively setting a precedent of Trump being legally a participant in an insurrection within the United States,  if they do an exception to the presidency, then it would be a very dangerous precedent to keep for the amendment. After all, those who rise to power are the one who try to stay in power by getting rid of democracy, there has been several instances of it happening through history.

Ironically, I could foresee that excluding Trump from the ballot in states he did not have a chance of winning anyways, will only encourage his supporters to vote in flipping states and increase his popularity, in a similar way to what happened with indictments.

I read about the several challenges that have been put forward in several states. Judges are trying to avoid anything that looks like interfering with politics. Some of the arguments are really funny on why Trump can stay in the ballot, really creative like "The president is not an official of the Goverment" or other semantics.

However, what is possibly the most interesting and honest is the court that said: "He can be in the Primaries because that is internal to the party", however the court said that if he is the candidate chosen, then the case can be presented. All the cases have been appealed.

Most judges tend to look at all these matters as a political matter. In my view it is not from the moment that several felonies are proven right - then is a matter of justice.

I don't see how this case doesn't end up at the supreme court.

It will eventually, I guess.
And when it does it is probable those within the supreme court will rule in Favor of Trump, allowing him to stay in the ballot in those states where his participation is being disputed. Though, as I said, It may not matter whether he stays or not in the ballot in states where he won't have much chances of winning anyways.

The members of the supreme court could argue that excluding Trump would be a point of no return for American Democracy and the decision could lead to civil unrest amount the civilian population. January 6th has set a clear precendet for such argument.
On the other hand, it may be about avoiding to push the case to the supreme court, so if it stays in a local court, those procecuting Trump will have more chances to keep him out of the ballot.

Well, what would be a point of no return is recognising a hostile takeover of the Capitol and death threats as an acceptable event in political life. The judges will have to be very creative in their arguments on why the President not only did absolutely nothing to defend a constitutional process, but practically encouraged an angry mob to stop it.

There are many arguments the judges may put forward, but what I think they will not do is to take a certain decision "because if not people would be angry". That is like accepting that an angry mob is above the law and the government can be decided by how violent they get.

It will end up in the Supreme Court, with many Trump appointees I assume.

[BADecker]

Trump... possibly the best President we had. Way, way better than the warmongering Biden team... or any of the other Dems, for that matter.

That's why they focus their trials on his personal life. He was saving the country as President. Hope we get him back for a second term.

[paxmao]

Trump... possibly the best President we had. Way, way better than the warmongering Biden team... or any of the other Dems, for that matter.

That's why they focus their trials on his personal life. He was saving the country as President. Hope we get him back for a second term.

The focus of the trial is not his personal life, the focus are more than 40 felonies which include a conspiracy to overtake the government of the US, trial under the RICO laws, which specifically target organised crime and collective conspiracies.

His personal life is a disaster, but that is not a problem being judged. Unless you consider his personal life the fact that he committed fraud by stating false values to the asset he owns in order to provide the banks with fake values to get credits.

[BADecker]

Trump... possibly the best President we had. Way, way better than the warmongering Biden team... or any of the other Dems, for that matter.

That's why they focus their trials on his personal life. He was saving the country as President. Hope we get him back for a second term.

The focus of the trial is not his personal life, the focus are more than 40 felonies which include a conspiracy to overtake the government of the US, trial under the RICO laws, which specifically target organised crime and collective conspiracies.

His personal life is a disaster, but that is not a problem being judged. Unless you consider his personal life the fact that he committed fraud by stating false values to the asset he owns in order to provide the banks with fake values to get credits.

If the focus is about taking control of the government, isn't that what the Presidency is all about? Take a look at Biden and his team, how they have pushed the American people into poverty through inflation, brought about by borrowing money from the banking system and giving it to Ukraine, Israel, and even China, covertly... by taking over the government. Trump never did this. Rather, he built up America in the many ways that I have been showing everybody - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5269905.msg55119252#msg55119252.

Here is how You build America up MAGA. You increase import taxes on all imports, especially the important ones, and you decrease or eliminate export taxes. This gives Americans back their jobs, and gets rid of a lot of foreign crap off the market. But the government still gets their money from the tax on imports that still come in.

A second way is to stop sending money to other countries. This cuts down on inflation. How? When you borrow money from the Federal Reserve Bank like Biden has been doing, it is really a creation of new money. If there is more money, the money you already have becomes less valuable. This is what inflation is. Trump didn't do this very much. And what he did is like a drop in a bucket compared to the amount that Biden has done it.

On top of it all, when the Biden team and the Dems steal a Presidential election - as they did 2020 - there is the fraudulent, criminal activity more than Trump could ever think of doing. How do we know that they stole the 2020 election? One simple way. They won't release the voting info in a transparent fashion. The second way we know it is that people who vigorously question the voting legality, are plagued with prosecution just for asking. Trump and his team are the best example of this. The third way is that the January 6 prosecutions and sentences are almost as good of an example, because most of the J6 people got sentences for doing nothing wrong. Some of them weren't even at the Capitol or in D.C. at the time.


As far as valuations of Trumps personal property, he did nothing wrong. How do we know? Because the banks and other businesses that accepted his valuations, didn't complain about the valuations. They simply accepted them.

Another way we know is simply this. Your property is your property. Because it is yours, you can value it in any amount you want. What if you have a keepsake that I wouldn't buy for even $1, and the courts would value it at ten cents. But because of emotional value for you, you wouldn't sell it for $1,000. If it's your property, you are the one who places the value on it.

When somebody else values Trump's property, that is something that they can do for themselves. But they can't force their valuation on the owner of it. The owner values it as he sees fit.


Now, I know that you might be upset with Trump, because he wouldn't give money and armament to your beloved Ukraine. So, you like it when you can steal money from the American people without looking like the criminal that you are!

[o48o]

In comparidon, SBF's trial is now over, and he was found guilty on seven counts of wire fraud, conspiracy, and money laundering and is facing up to 110 years in prison.

Trump charged with several felony counts, and if he is found guilty of them all (as he most likely is most of them), i am wondering what's is he facing, and why his fans think he is untouchable? Do they think that we are in uncharted waters just because he used to eat burgers in white house?

[TwitchySeal]

If the focus is about taking control of the government, isn't that what the Presidency is all about? Take a look at Biden and his team, how they have pushed the American people into poverty through inflation, brought about by borrowing money from the banking system and giving it to Ukraine, Israel, and even China, covertly... by taking over the government. Trump never did this. Rather, he built up America in the many ways that I have been showing everybody - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5269905.msg55119252#msg55119252.

But...your list is garbage...

You really think this should count as 10 accomplishments?

* Manufacturing jobs are growing at the fastest rate in more than 30 years.
* Stock Market has reached record highs.
* Median household income has hit the highest level ever recorded.
* African-American unemployment is at an all-time low.
* Hispanic-American unemployment is at an all-time low.
* Asian-American unemployment is at an all-time low.
* Women’s unemployment rate is at a 65-year low.
* Youth unemployment is at a 50-year low.
* We have the lowest unemployment rate ever recorded.
* The Pledge to America’s Workers has resulted in employers committing to train more than 4 million Americans.

If so, shouldn't this be in Bidens list, not Trumps?

You wrote that in Sept. 2020, when unemployment was at 7.9% overall. adult men (7.4
percent), adult women (7.7 percent), Whites (7.0 percent), Asians (8.9 percent),
teenagers (15.9 percent), Blacks (12.1 percent), and Hispanics (10.3 percent)

That's not even close to all time low.  It was never at all time low.

Biden is president now, and as of Q3 2023 unemployment was at 3.8%, Whites (3.1 percent) adult men (3.4 percent), adult women (3.1 percent), teenagers (11.0 percent), Blacks (6.0 percent), Asians (3.2 percent), and Hispanics (4.3 percent)

in other words, if you replaced Trumps name with Biden, you would be much closer to the truth
silly BADecker

But seeing as you really care about unemployment rates and consider them a reflection of the current president, surely you will rethink your outlook.

[paxmao]

Trump... possibly the best President we had. Way, way better than the warmongering Biden team... or any of the other Dems, for that matter.

That's why they focus their trials on his personal life. He was saving the country as President. Hope we get him back for a second term.

The focus of the trial is not his personal life, the focus are more than 40 felonies which include a conspiracy to overtake the government of the US, trial under the RICO laws, which specifically target organised crime and collective conspiracies.

His personal life is a disaster, but that is not a problem being judged. Unless you consider his personal life the fact that he committed fraud by stating false values to the asset he owns in order to provide the banks with fake values to get credits.

If the focus is about taking control of the government, isn't that what the Presidency is all about? Take a look at Biden and his team, how they have pushed the American people into poverty through inflation, brought about by borrowing money from the banking system and giving it to Ukraine, Israel, and even China, covertly... by taking over the government. Trump never did this. Rather, he built up America in the many ways that I have been showing everybody - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5269905.msg55119252#msg55119252.

Here is how You build America up MAGA. You increase import taxes on all imports, especially the important ones, and you decrease or eliminate export taxes. This gives Americans back their jobs, and gets rid of a lot of foreign crap off the market. But the government still gets their money from the tax on imports that still come in.

A second way is to stop sending money to other countries. This cuts down on inflation. How? When you borrow money from the Federal Reserve Bank like Biden has been doing, it is really a creation of new money. If there is more money, the money you already have becomes less valuable. This is what inflation is. Trump didn't do this very much. And what he did is like a drop in a bucket compared to the amount that Biden has done it.

On top of it all, when the Biden team and the Dems steal a Presidential election - as they did 2020 - there is the fraudulent, criminal activity more than Trump could ever think of doing. How do we know that they stole the 2020 election? One simple way. They won't release the voting info in a transparent fashion. The second way we know it is that people who vigorously question the voting legality, are plagued with prosecution just for asking. Trump and his team are the best example of this. The third way is that the January 6 prosecutions and sentences are almost as good of an example, because most of the J6 people got sentences for doing nothing wrong. Some of them weren't even at the Capitol or in D.C. at the time.


As far as valuations of Trumps personal property, he did nothing wrong. How do we know? Because the banks and other businesses that accepted his valuations, didn't complain about the valuations. They simply accepted them.

Another way we know is simply this. Your property is your property. Because it is yours, you can value it in any amount you want. What if you have a keepsake that I wouldn't buy for even $1, and the courts would value it at ten cents. But because of emotional value for you, you wouldn't sell it for $1,000. If it's your property, you are the one who places the value on it.

When somebody else values Trump's property, that is something that they can do for themselves. But they can't force their valuation on the owner of it. The owner values it as he sees fit.


Now, I know that you might be upset with Trump, because he wouldn't give money and armament to your beloved Ukraine. So, you like it when you can steal money from the American people without looking like the criminal that you are!

Incredible...

There is something you continuously fail to understand: Being elected President does not grant you unlimited powers, is exactly the contrary, you power is strongly restricted.

- No, as president you should not "take control of the government" beyond your constitutional functions. e.g. replacing general attorneys and the like. And you certainly do not get to self-extend your mandate just because you think you won.

- The democrats won the election. There is no proof of illegal wrongdoing. If there is, you present it to the press, the judges, etc ... but that did not happen, because there isn't.

- Sending money to other countries removes it from your economy, thus may reduce inflation, but I do not think that matters much.

- You can brag about the price of your properties in the golf club, but real state has an objective evaluation when you go to the bank to ask for a credit. If you say it is double it is fraud. This is not about "the price you'd sell it for, it is the market valuation (dude, capitalism 101).

- We do know because he is stupid enough to lie in written, in official accounting documents, right below where it says "All the information provided is true, I understand that if not I may be committing fraud".

If you have any sensible argument this is a good moment to express it. Otherwise, do a favour to this forum and stop blurting shit.

I am not upset at Trump, I fear that if what he does is Ok, the US is no longer the government of the people, but of the mobs.

Re your accusation of me being a criminal, I request you to present any evidence or remove the insults. You will get a reputation thread on that one.

[BADecker]

~

If the focus is about taking control of the government, isn't that what the Presidency is all about? Take a look at Biden and his team, how they have pushed the American people into poverty through inflation, brought about by borrowing money from the banking system and giving it to Ukraine, Israel, and even China, covertly... by taking over the government. Trump never did this. Rather, he built up America in the many ways that I have been showing everybody - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5269905.msg55119252#msg55119252.

Here is how You build America up MAGA. You increase import taxes on all imports, especially the important ones, and you decrease or eliminate export taxes. This gives Americans back their jobs, and gets rid of a lot of foreign crap off the market. But the government still gets their money from the tax on imports that still come in.

A second way is to stop sending money to other countries. This cuts down on inflation. How? When you borrow money from the Federal Reserve Bank like Biden has been doing, it is really a creation of new money. If there is more money, the money you already have becomes less valuable. This is what inflation is. Trump didn't do this very much. And what he did is like a drop in a bucket compared to the amount that Biden has done it.

On top of it all, when the Biden team and the Dems steal a Presidential election - as they did 2020 - there is the fraudulent, criminal activity more than Trump could ever think of doing. How do we know that they stole the 2020 election? One simple way. They won't release the voting info in a transparent fashion. The second way we know it is that people who vigorously question the voting legality, are plagued with prosecution just for asking. Trump and his team are the best example of this. The third way is that the January 6 prosecutions and sentences are almost as good of an example, because most of the J6 people got sentences for doing nothing wrong. Some of them weren't even at the Capitol or in D.C. at the time.


As far as valuations of Trumps personal property, he did nothing wrong. How do we know? Because the banks and other businesses that accepted his valuations, didn't complain about the valuations. They simply accepted them.

Another way we know is simply this. Your property is your property. Because it is yours, you can value it in any amount you want. What if you have a keepsake that I wouldn't buy for even $1, and the courts would value it at ten cents. But because of emotional value for you, you wouldn't sell it for $1,000. If it's your property, you are the one who places the value on it.

When somebody else values Trump's property, that is something that they can do for themselves. But they can't force their valuation on the owner of it. The owner values it as he sees fit.


Now, I know that you might be upset with Trump, because he wouldn't give money and armament to your beloved Ukraine. So, you like it when you can steal money from the American people without looking like the criminal that you are!

Incredible...

There is something you continuously fail to understand: Being elected President does not grant you unlimited powers, is exactly the contrary, you power is strongly restricted.

- No, as president you should not "take control of the government" beyond your constitutional functions. e.g. replacing general attorneys and the like. And you certainly do not get to self-extend your mandate just because you think you won.

- The democrats won the election. There is no proof of illegal wrongdoing. If there is, you present it to the press, the judges, etc ... but that did not happen, because there isn't.

- Sending money to other countries removes it from your economy, thus may reduce inflation, but I do not think that matters much.

- You can brag about the price of your properties in the golf club, but real state has an objective evaluation when you go to the bank to ask for a credit. If you say it is double it is fraud. This is not about "the price you'd sell it for, it is the market valuation (dude, capitalism 101).

- We do know because he is stupid enough to lie in written, in official accounting documents, right below where it says "All the information provided is true, I understand that if not I may be committing fraud".

If you have any sensible argument this is a good moment to express it. Otherwise, do a favour to this forum and stop blurting shit.

I am not upset at Trump, I fear that if what he does is Ok, the US is no longer the government of the people, but of the mobs.

Re your accusation of me being a criminal, I request you to present any evidence or remove the insults. You will get a reputation thread on that one.

Blah, blah, blah... You totally miss the point. Creating new money to give to other countries (Ukraine) doesn't do anything at all if the money is never spent by Ukraine. But when it is spent, it causes inflation in the country that is the main user of that money.

If you are a recipient of the benefit of the US money that is sent to Ukraine, you have stolen value from the American people... and should be ashamed of yourself. Of course, you may not have any choice in the matter. But if this is the case, perhaps you should consider immigrating to Russia so that you don't partake of stealing from Americans.

[Hispo]

~

If the focus is about taking control of the government, isn't that what the Presidency is all about? Take a look at Biden and his team, how they have pushed the American people into poverty through inflation, brought about by borrowing money from the banking system and giving it to Ukraine, Israel, and even China, covertly... by taking over the government. Trump never did this. Rather, he built up America in the many ways that I have been showing everybody - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5269905.msg55119252#msg55119252.

Here is how You build America up MAGA. You increase import taxes on all imports, especially the important ones, and you decrease or eliminate export taxes. This gives Americans back their jobs, and gets rid of a lot of foreign crap off the market. But the government still gets their money from the tax on imports that still come in.

A second way is to stop sending money to other countries. This cuts down on inflation. How? When you borrow money from the Federal Reserve Bank like Biden has been doing, it is really a creation of new money. If there is more money, the money you already have becomes less valuable. This is what inflation is. Trump didn't do this very much. And what he did is like a drop in a bucket compared to the amount that Biden has done it.

On top of it all, when the Biden team and the Dems steal a Presidential election - as they did 2020 - there is the fraudulent, criminal activity more than Trump could ever think of doing. How do we know that they stole the 2020 election? One simple way. They won't release the voting info in a transparent fashion. The second way we know it is that people who vigorously question the voting legality, are plagued with prosecution just for asking. Trump and his team are the best example of this. The third way is that the January 6 prosecutions and sentences are almost as good of an example, because most of the J6 people got sentences for doing nothing wrong. Some of them weren't even at the Capitol or in D.C. at the time.


As far as valuations of Trumps personal property, he did nothing wrong. How do we know? Because the banks and other businesses that accepted his valuations, didn't complain about the valuations. They simply accepted them.

Another way we know is simply this. Your property is your property. Because it is yours, you can value it in any amount you want. What if you have a keepsake that I wouldn't buy for even $1, and the courts would value it at ten cents. But because of emotional value for you, you wouldn't sell it for $1,000. If it's your property, you are the one who places the value on it.

When somebody else values Trump's property, that is something that they can do for themselves. But they can't force their valuation on the owner of it. The owner values it as he sees fit.


Now, I know that you might be upset with Trump, because he wouldn't give money and armament to your beloved Ukraine. So, you like it when you can steal money from the American people without looking like the criminal that you are!

Incredible...

There is something you continuously fail to understand: Being elected President does not grant you unlimited powers, is exactly the contrary, you power is strongly restricted.

- No, as president you should not "take control of the government" beyond your constitutional functions. e.g. replacing general attorneys and the like. And you certainly do not get to self-extend your mandate just because you think you won.

- The democrats won the election. There is no proof of illegal wrongdoing. If there is, you present it to the press, the judges, etc ... but that did not happen, because there isn't.

- Sending money to other countries removes it from your economy, thus may reduce inflation, but I do not think that matters much.

- You can brag about the price of your properties in the golf club, but real state has an objective evaluation when you go to the bank to ask for a credit. If you say it is double it is fraud. This is not about "the price you'd sell it for, it is the market valuation (dude, capitalism 101).

- We do know because he is stupid enough to lie in written, in official accounting documents, right below where it says "All the information provided is true, I understand that if not I may be committing fraud".

If you have any sensible argument this is a good moment to express it. Otherwise, do a favour to this forum and stop blurting shit.

I am not upset at Trump, I fear that if what he does is Ok, the US is no longer the government of the people, but of the mobs.

Re your accusation of me being a criminal, I request you to present any evidence or remove the insults. You will get a reputation thread on that one.

Blah, blah, blah... You totally miss the point. Creating new money to give to other countries (Ukraine) doesn't do anything at all if the money is never spent by Ukraine. But when it is spent, it causes inflation in the country that is the main user of that money.

If you are a recipient of the benefit of the US money that is sent to Ukraine, you have stolen value from the American people... and should be ashamed of yourself. Of course, you may not have any choice in the matter. But if this is the case, perhaps you should consider immigrating to Russia so that you don't partake of stealing from Americans.

But how does exactly moving to a different country from the United States prevent one to steal or participate in stealing the population of the United States? I don't understand it, to be honest. Because we could argue and even agree that those in power of what happens to money and economical aids are those in political positions, while the common citizen only is supposed to pay for taxes, regardless of their polítical ideas or their standing in the conflict of Ukraine.
How come the common people living in USA have anything to do with robbing themselves?

[BADecker]

~

Blah, blah, blah... You totally miss the point. Creating new money to give to other countries (Ukraine) doesn't do anything at all if the money is never spent by Ukraine. But when it is spent, it causes inflation in the country that is the main user of that money.

If you are a recipient of the benefit of the US money that is sent to Ukraine, you have stolen value from the American people... and should be ashamed of yourself. Of course, you may not have any choice in the matter. But if this is the case, perhaps you should consider immigrating to Russia so that you don't partake of stealing from Americans.

But how does exactly moving to a different country from the United States prevent one to steal or participate in stealing the population of the United States? I don't understand it, to be honest. Because we could argue and even agree that those in power of what happens to money and economical aids are those in political positions, while the common citizen only is supposed to pay for taxes, regardless of their polítical ideas or their standing in the conflict of Ukraine.
How come the common people living in USA have anything to do with robbing themselves?

Let me say one thing. The people of America are NOT supposed to pay IRS taxes. It's a Constitution and Amendment thing. The people are forced into it by their ignorance. In brief, here is how it works:

The people unwittingly, freely and ignorantly make an agreement to pay the IRS taxes. The only law requiring them to pay is their agreement under the Constitutional right to contract. Government, the IRS, and the banking system, attempt to hide this fact from the people, because they are making money off the people. If the people knew that their taxes exist by their free agreement, and if they knew what that agreement was, most of them wouldn't make that kind of agreement.


Until you understand simple things like this, most of the things in the US government and law will not be understood.

[paxmao]

~

If the focus is about taking control of the government, isn't that what the Presidency is all about? Take a look at Biden and his team, how they have pushed the American people into poverty through inflation, brought about by borrowing money from the banking system and giving it to Ukraine, Israel, and even China, covertly... by taking over the government. Trump never did this. Rather, he built up America in the many ways that I have been showing everybody - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5269905.msg55119252#msg55119252.

Here is how You build America up MAGA. You increase import taxes on all imports, especially the important ones, and you decrease or eliminate export taxes. This gives Americans back their jobs, and gets rid of a lot of foreign crap off the market. But the government still gets their money from the tax on imports that still come in.

A second way is to stop sending money to other countries. This cuts down on inflation. How? When you borrow money from the Federal Reserve Bank like Biden has been doing, it is really a creation of new money. If there is more money, the money you already have becomes less valuable. This is what inflation is. Trump didn't do this very much. And what he did is like a drop in a bucket compared to the amount that Biden has done it.

On top of it all, when the Biden team and the Dems steal a Presidential election - as they did 2020 - there is the fraudulent, criminal activity more than Trump could ever think of doing. How do we know that they stole the 2020 election? One simple way. They won't release the voting info in a transparent fashion. The second way we know it is that people who vigorously question the voting legality, are plagued with prosecution just for asking. Trump and his team are the best example of this. The third way is that the January 6 prosecutions and sentences are almost as good of an example, because most of the J6 people got sentences for doing nothing wrong. Some of them weren't even at the Capitol or in D.C. at the time.


As far as valuations of Trumps personal property, he did nothing wrong. How do we know? Because the banks and other businesses that accepted his valuations, didn't complain about the valuations. They simply accepted them.

Another way we know is simply this. Your property is your property. Because it is yours, you can value it in any amount you want. What if you have a keepsake that I wouldn't buy for even $1, and the courts would value it at ten cents. But because of emotional value for you, you wouldn't sell it for $1,000. If it's your property, you are the one who places the value on it.

When somebody else values Trump's property, that is something that they can do for themselves. But they can't force their valuation on the owner of it. The owner values it as he sees fit.


Now, I know that you might be upset with Trump, because he wouldn't give money and armament to your beloved Ukraine. So, you like it when you can steal money from the American people without looking like the criminal that you are!

Incredible...

There is something you continuously fail to understand: Being elected President does not grant you unlimited powers, is exactly the contrary, you power is strongly restricted.

- No, as president you should not "take control of the government" beyond your constitutional functions. e.g. replacing general attorneys and the like. And you certainly do not get to self-extend your mandate just because you think you won.

- The democrats won the election. There is no proof of illegal wrongdoing. If there is, you present it to the press, the judges, etc ... but that did not happen, because there isn't.

- Sending money to other countries removes it from your economy, thus may reduce inflation, but I do not think that matters much.

- You can brag about the price of your properties in the golf club, but real state has an objective evaluation when you go to the bank to ask for a credit. If you say it is double it is fraud. This is not about "the price you'd sell it for, it is the market valuation (dude, capitalism 101).

- We do know because he is stupid enough to lie in written, in official accounting documents, right below where it says "All the information provided is true, I understand that if not I may be committing fraud".

If you have any sensible argument this is a good moment to express it. Otherwise, do a favour to this forum and stop blurting shit.

I am not upset at Trump, I fear that if what he does is Ok, the US is no longer the government of the people, but of the mobs.

Re your accusation of me being a criminal, I request you to present any evidence or remove the insults. You will get a reputation thread on that one.

Blah, blah, blah... You totally miss the point. Creating new money to give to other countries (Ukraine) doesn't do anything at all if the money is never spent by Ukraine. But when it is spent, it causes inflation in the country that is the main user of that money.

If you are a recipient of the benefit of the US money that is sent to Ukraine, you have stolen value from the American people... and should be ashamed of yourself. Of course, you may not have any choice in the matter. But if this is the case, perhaps you should consider immigrating to Russia so that you don't partake of stealing from Americans.

I am not seeing here a withdrawal of your accusation. I understand that you believe that is ok to call someone a criminal without a proof - that is why you support Trump - but it is not. Prove or withdraw now.

What you call "bla bla" is called arguments in the rest of the world.

You have tried several times to provoke me into providing personal information on where I leave and who I am or who I deal with. Again, you will need to do much better and in any case is irrelevant to an argument based conversation - again, I understand why are you a Trump supporter (from China perhaps).

The fact is that the main recipients of the aid to Ukraine are US citizens. That is something you do not understand - as most of the things you speak about. When Ukraine gets funding for weapons these are produced in US factories. When they get military aid, the army units providing them get a newer, better replacement for it, guess where that is made? ... In the US most deprived regions, where most weapons factories operate.

BTW if you were a true bitcoin supporter, inflation would be irrelevant to you, even a good thing in fact.

[Hispo]

~

Blah, blah, blah... You totally miss the point. Creating new money to give to other countries (Ukraine) doesn't do anything at all if the money is never spent by Ukraine. But when it is spent, it causes inflation in the country that is the main user of that money.

If you are a recipient of the benefit of the US money that is sent to Ukraine, you have stolen value from the American people... and should be ashamed of yourself. Of course, you may not have any choice in the matter. But if this is the case, perhaps you should consider immigrating to Russia so that you don't partake of stealing from Americans.

But how does exactly moving to a different country from the United States prevent one to steal or participate in stealing the population of the United States? I don't understand it, to be honest. Because we could argue and even agree that those in power of what happens to money and economical aids are those in political positions, while the common citizen only is supposed to pay for taxes, regardless of their polítical ideas or their standing in the conflict of Ukraine.
How come the common people living in USA have anything to do with robbing themselves?

Let me say one thing. The people of America are NOT supposed to pay IRS taxes. It's a Constitution and Amendment thing. The people are forced into it by their ignorance. In brief, here is how it works:

The people unwittingly, freely and ignorantly make an agreement to pay the IRS taxes. The only law requiring them to pay is their agreement under the Constitutional right to contract. Government, the IRS, and the banking system, attempt to hide this fact from the people, because they are making money off the people. If the people knew that their taxes exist by their free agreement, and if they knew what that agreement was, most of them wouldn't make that kind of agreement.


Until you understand simple things like this, most of the things in the US government and law will not be understood.

Please elaborate.
Because as far as I understand how IRS and taxes work there in the United States, You cannot quit from taxation and I am not aware the federal government makes you sign on some paper about being forced to pay taxes as long as you keep your citizenship.
The citizenship is granted (in the most if the cases) when one is born from American parents or born in American soil and obviously a newborn cannot consent to paying taxes for the rest of their life.

If you stopped summitting your income declaration or your tax forms to the government, then you would be fined or arrested for tax evasion. Isn't that how is supposed to work there or I am missing something?
Since you say to be better informed about that "agreement" you talk about, am I supposed to assume you do not pay or even declare taxes?

[BADecker]

~

Blah, blah, blah... You totally miss the point. Creating new money to give to other countries (Ukraine) doesn't do anything at all if the money is never spent by Ukraine. But when it is spent, it causes inflation in the country that is the main user of that money.

If you are a recipient of the benefit of the US money that is sent to Ukraine, you have stolen value from the American people... and should be ashamed of yourself. Of course, you may not have any choice in the matter. But if this is the case, perhaps you should consider immigrating to Russia so that you don't partake of stealing from Americans.

But how does exactly moving to a different country from the United States prevent one to steal or participate in stealing the population of the United States? I don't understand it, to be honest. Because we could argue and even agree that those in power of what happens to money and economical aids are those in political positions, while the common citizen only is supposed to pay for taxes, regardless of their polítical ideas or their standing in the conflict of Ukraine.
How come the common people living in USA have anything to do with robbing themselves?

Let me say one thing. The people of America are NOT supposed to pay IRS taxes. It's a Constitution and Amendment thing. The people are forced into it by their ignorance. In brief, here is how it works:

The people unwittingly, freely and ignorantly make an agreement to pay the IRS taxes. The only law requiring them to pay is their agreement under the Constitutional right to contract. Government, the IRS, and the banking system, attempt to hide this fact from the people, because they are making money off the people. If the people knew that their taxes exist by their free agreement, and if they knew what that agreement was, most of them wouldn't make that kind of agreement.


Until you understand simple things like this, most of the things in the US government and law will not be understood.

Please elaborate.
Because as far as I understand how IRS and taxes work there in the United States, You cannot quit from taxation and I am not aware the federal government makes you sign on some paper about being forced to pay taxes as long as you keep your citizenship.
The citizenship is granted (in the most if the cases) when one is born from American parents or born in American soil and obviously a newborn cannot consent to paying taxes for the rest of their life.

If you stopped summitting your income declaration or your tax forms to the government, then you would be fined or arrested for tax evasion. Isn't that how is supposed to work there or I am missing something?
Since you say to be better informed about that "agreement" you talk about, am I supposed to assume you do not pay or even declare taxes?

The things you say aren't the only things that can be done. Even the IRS says in their pamphlets and paperwork that taxes are voluntary. If a person can volunteer in, he has the right to volunteer out. It's up to the person to find out how.

If you want to learn how, go here - https://www.youtube.com/@CraigLynch/videos - for starters, and listen to all the videos that have anything to do with the IRS and other taxes.

If you don't happen to like what you hear, I have used it and done it. It works, even though it is a battle to start with.

[TwitchySeal]

The things you say aren't the only things that can be done. Even the IRS says in their pamphlets and paperwork that taxes are voluntary. If a person can volunteer in, he has the right to volunteer out. It's up to the person to find out how.

The things you say aren't the only things that are relevant.

There might be a pamphlet from the IRS that says filing your taxes is voluntary (although I doubt that).

In reality, if you don't file them, the government will file them for you - and if you don't pay the bill they send you, they can collect them by seizing your property or garnishing your wages.

[BADecker]

The things you say aren't the only things that can be done. Even the IRS says in their pamphlets and paperwork that taxes are voluntary. If a person can volunteer in, he has the right to volunteer out. It's up to the person to find out how.

The things you say aren't the only things that are relevant.

There might be a pamphlet from the IRS that says filing your taxes is voluntary (although I doubt that).

In reality, if you don't file them, the government will file them for you - and if you don't pay the bill they send you, they can collect them by seizing your property or garnishing your wages.

But only if you voluntarily or ignorantly let them. This is why Trump is having as much difficulty as he is having. Ignorance of American law.

    

[BADecker]

Now the banks are starting to assert their testimony. Since they have accepted Trump in the past, they can't let their good names be tarnished by the New York AG destroying the Trump that they upheld. They don't want go down with Trump, so they are starting to act on his behalf.


Did Deutsche Bank Just Destroy New York AG's Case Against Trump?


https://www.zerohedge.com/political/did-deutsche-bank-just-destroy-new-york-ags-case-against-trump
A Deutsche Bank executive may have just tanked New York Attorney General Letitia James' lawsuit against former President Donal Drump - which revolved around portraying the German lender as Trump's biggest victim in an alleged scheme to inflate his assets in order to obtain favorable terms from banks and insurers.

David Williams, who directly worked on at least one of several loans obtained by Trump over several decades, testified on Tuesday in Manhattan that it's "atypical, but not entirely unusual" for a bank to internally slash a client's stated asset values by 50% and approve a loan anyway, as they did with Trump, Bloomberg reports.

"It just depends on the circumstances," said Williams, a managing director at the bank.

Deutsche Bank, which loaned hundreds of millions of dollars to Trump for properties in Miami, Chicago and Washington, cut his stated net worth in 2011 and 2012 from about $4.2 billion to $2.3 billion, according to internal bank credit memos. The same documents indicated the bank approved the loans anyway because it expected them to generate a profit based on Trump's history of successful developments and other criteria.

Trump, who denies wrongdoing and claims the case is politically motivated, is calling to the stand this week four current and former Deutsche Bank employees — including the family's former private banker Rosemary Vrablic — as part of his defense case, seeking to flip the script on the state's version of events. -Bloomberg

The testimony completely undermines AG James' premise, that Trump defrauded the German bank.
...

[paxmao]

Now the banks are starting to assert their testimony. Since they have accepted Trump in the past, they can't let their good names be tarnished by the New York AG destroying the Trump that they upheld. They don't want go down with Trump, so they are starting to act on his behalf.

...

Deutsche Bank, which loaned hundreds of millions of dollars to Trump for properties in Miami, Chicago and Washington, cut his stated net worth in 2011 and 2012 from about $4.2 billion to $2.3 billion, according to internal bank credit memos. The same documents indicated the bank approved the loans anyway because it expected them to generate a profit based on Trump's history of successful developments and other criteria.

Trump, who denies wrongdoing and claims the case is politically motivated, is calling to the stand this week four current and former Deutsche Bank employees — including the family's former private banker Rosemary Vrablic — as part of his defense case, seeking to flip the script on the state's version of events. -Bloomberg

The testimony completely undermines AG James' premise, that Trump defrauded the German bank.
...

First of all, this demolishes you previous theory (a joke really) that "you can put whatever value you want" - the bankers say now that they new the value was wrong, so there is a "right value" that does not depend on your imagination.

The banks are saying that they knew the valuation was wrong and accepted giving credits just on other considerations.  The bank executives will have to answer to their own shareholders on why they are ok with fraudsters.  The bank executives know perfectly well that they may be also open to a massive class action - effectively means that any shareholder of the bank can now sue them because they knowingly accepted a miss-valuation.

I know you are clueless about this, but the bank needs, for compliance, have assets against that type of credit or declare it as loss, possible loss, etc... If I am allowed an educated guess, these bankers are likely to have faked that in their accounts. There may even be jail time for some individuals for it.

Trump has to answer to the people of New York, that is irrespective of the banks dealings.

But let's look at proper news:
https://abcnews.go.com/US/live-updates/trump-fraud-trial/trump-never-risked-breaching-loan-covenants-banker-suggests-105213855?id=103642561

New York Attorney General Letitia James alleges that had Trump accurately reported the value of his assets, he could have risked defaulting on a loan covenant that required he maintain a net worth of $2.5 billion.

So the moment he signed the credit, he was already in breach of the covenants. The punishment for this is lower... but there's punishment.

I am also thinking that if the judge says this is all right, then it will be all right for any future use. Good luck to the banking system, but particularly to all shareholders of the banks.