Buy Buy Buy or Sell Sell Sell?

[Faazs]

that is why investors should practice trading no matter how they think they can be able to handle the two, trading might make investors to derail from the plan they had earlier, this may lead to serious regrets.

I agree with you, here.  Trading is a slippery slope that can be difficult to control if a person is not able to put limitations and boundaries upon it, and even have ways to segregate and/or limit their losses.  At the same time, some  guys are able to learn from practice, even though they are likely to be small in numbers - even though several traders likely end up devolve into thinking that they are in the small group of traders who are profitable and able to control/limit their trading, so there are likely a good number of traders who consider themselves to be way more talented than they are.

For trading to be a success it requires a lot of analysis and calculations, definitely not something everyone can do since doing all that will take alot of time out of people's hands plus they can't even be sure of their analysis, maybe a really good trader will be able to properly analyse the market and know when to enter and when to keep away from it which will be a great advantage to him but not everyone has access to this kind of information, most supposed trading barely understand how the trading market works, they got involved in trading because they saw or heard that someone else made quite a reasonable amount of profit from it and now they want a share of that profit, and sometimes most of them actually try to learn and understand trading principles and sometimes they are actually successful but this can only be said about a very small percentage probably less than 10% and the other over 90% don't quite grasp onto how trading works and end of going into it shortsighted which ultimately leads to them losing out alot.

Of course, traders want to be able to win on the way up and on the way down, and sometimes they will use leverage and margin in order to shore up various bets that they make.

Historically, part of the difficulty in bitcoin is that it tends to trend up, and so traders should attempt to account for such trend, which such upward trend also justifies not trading, since the price has ultimately gone up.. at least historically.

Sure there are trades in which traders are making money, and they might even make money more often than they don't, yet they can also end up with one trade that ends up wiping out all of their previous gains.. so then they spend a bunch of time building up a trading portfolio, then their trade gets knocked back to zero or even below their starting point.. which sometimes might contribute towards their taking more risks to try to make it up and/or failing to be "in bitcoin" when the BTC price does some kind of a stair-step upward movement that does not end up correcting back to previous price levels...

Sometimes I really wonder what would convince a person to trade bitcoin, it's not a very smart decision and it's not even profitable and looking for something profitable is what pushes people into trading so why trade when you would most likely not get any profit out of it.

The truth is some people make decisions blindly, or should I say they're just being too hasty to make profit. Because I also keep wondering why a guy will chose to go into trading that you can't take your eyes off the Market for some days, this makes we think that trading is even more stressful than most of this monthly pay jobs because it requires a lot of attention. Imagine something that requires alot of one's attention is what most people are still prioritizing over Investment that you can only showed up once is time to make your purchase then after making your purchase  you just go offline, though everyone have the right to decide what is best for them those who have decided to trade with bitcoin instead of focusing on the long term investment knows Best.

It's not that trading is not good, but the thing is that you have to know that trading need serious training and it's training will take you a couple of days before you understand it better, why some traders record a lot of losses, is due to they are not being trained well before they go into trading, some people is making turns of profit every day in trading, why they make make profit is because they acquired the skill of trading very well, why people that lose that much in trading are people who doesn't have basic knowledge of trading and join

If someone don't have the ideas of trading, the person shouldn't bother to trade, it's better for the person to buy Bitcoin and hold, that will be more safer than trading for something you know nothing about, buying Bitcoin and hold will is preferable than trading if you are novice in both.

It seems to me that trading likely takes a lot of learning and practice before figuring out various ways to potentially make it work so that you are not overly losing money, and some folks are likely to be more challenged in their abilities to trade in a way that is going to help them to be prepared for price moves in either direction... .. and so I doubt that anyone even comes close to developing good trading skills and practices in a matter of days or weeks - even if they might take approaches to trading that involves starting out with smaller amounts prior to perhaps increasing the amounts that they are staking (putting at risk) in their trades.

It takes way too many learning and practice and even with this there is still very little guarantee of success and the very number of traders who actually make profit from it barely trade with bitcoin, you will usually see them trading with altcoins that have higher volatility than bitcoin, of course higher volatility will increase the chances of a loss but it also increases the chances of turning a profit and some good traders are able to tell when the chances of making a profit are higher then the chances of losing so they take advantage of this opportunities though this probably doesn't always work out all the time, bitcoin trading has shown to be a relatively unsuccessful endeavour which is why smart traders tend to avoid it, but alot of people think that the higher the value of the asset the higher the chances of making profit out of it through trading and with this mentality they decide to trade bitcoin and most of the time the lose but still they keep doing it almost like there is a drive behind them, I'm not really sure.
Bitcoin investment on the other hand offers far less mental stress and it's relatively safer to go into and that's why bitcoin investors are more likely to make profit than bitcoin traders.

It hardly makes any sense since bitcoin has been and likely will continue to be amongst the best of investments, yet guys want to take chances to try to make more from it, when it already has high likelihood (not guaranteed) of success by just ongoingly building it up over time... so they take an asset with a high likelihood for success and they try to get even more profits out of it.. which ends up putting their investment at risk.. and yeah, sometimes the ups and downs seem to be so obvious, but then the BTC price does not end up moving in accordance with what had seemed to have had been so obvious.

There also may well be guys who made a lot of profits over the past couple of cycles since they buy bitcoin and then shave off their profits along the way, but then they may well would have had been better off to just put that money into bitcoin and just sit on that money since it can be difficult to beat 10x, 100x and even 1,000x returns that came through mere BTC price appreciation over the past 10-ish years (of course, depending on when a person got in and how much he might have been able to put in at various earlier bitcoin price points).  Even a guy who might have had started investing $100 per week in bitcoin in late 2015 (or even the beginning of 2016) at the end of that particular down period, he may well have had invested right around $50k over the past 10 years, yet at the same time ending up with more than 15 bitcoin right now, so it is very difficult to proclaim that trading in and out of bitcoin during that period of time could have had improved such results... sure it is possible to have had beat a buy and hold strategy, but not seeming to be very likely to have had been able to accomplish such better performance as compared with a buy and hold strategy.

Bitcoin is not likely to have as high of an upside in the next 10 years, even though it is likely to remain a decently good place to invest and difficult to justify trading it rather than just putting value into it.

Trading is more like gambling with bitcoin and any investors that really get to comprehend bitcoin for what it really stands for will never thing of gambling with bitcoin all in the name of making quick profit. Trading comes with a high level of risk which in anyway cant be compared with the risk associated with long term investment. There is no investors, no matter how technical incline they may seem to be in speculating market prices can speculate correctly the exact directions of the market.

Did i hear you say trading is more like gambling? Trading and gambling are thesame thing, trading is not entirely bad for those who study the market i think this thread doesn't promote trading so we shouldn't be talking about it bitcoin isn't what we should be buying and selling without regular accumulation and hodl with this way the profit of who is trading can't be compare with what a long term hodler will benefit, it pays to be a long term investor.

If you save in Bitcoin for the long term and invest in Bitcoin according to the DCA method, you can definitely make more powerful profits. Because Bitcoin is the only one that is most compatible with the DCA method, where not every investor has enough money. So that investor cannot invest at once, it is reasonable for him to buy Bitcoin every week with some of his income. Not everyone is rich in this world, so if you invest in Bitcoin according to the DCA method, both the rich and the poor can hold Bitcoin and hold it for a long time.

Bitcoin doors is open to both the rich and the poor to come in and invest. It doesn't discriminate instead it welcome everyone to invest  as long as they can figure out a Discretional income .  Exactly, Bitcoin can be used as a store to keep our wealth or funds in continuous value as long as we can continue to Hold and not sell. As bitcoin appreciates in value over time,our funds invested also increases along with it. Both the rich and the poor can equally invest in Bitcoin but the poor man might easily be tempted to tamper with his Bitcoin holding before even reaching his over accumulation stage..

I appreciate your thoughtful perspective. You're right that Bitcoin's accessibility is genuinely democratic in that sense there's no minimum investment requirement. Someone can start with whatever spare cash they have, even small amounts. Your point about discretionary income is important though. The idea that both rich and poor can invest equally is true in theory but there's a real friction point in practice. A poor person investing their limited discretionary income faces genuine pressure that a wealthy person doesn't. When unexpected expenses hit medical bills, car repairs, job loss that discretionary income gets needed elsewhere. It's not weakness; it's survival.

It's not that poor people lack discipline or understanding. It's that they have less margin for error. It's not about always the temptation. A rich person can hold through downturns because they have other resources. A struggling person might watch their Bitcoin drop 30% and might think he needed that money for rent next monthand they're not wrong. The real wealth building with Bitcoin does seem to come from that long-term holding and accumulation phase like you mentioned. But the people who most need wealth building are often the least able to weather the volatility. That's a genuine asymmetry.

Your comparison of the poor person to the rich person seems to outline why it remains important for poor people to build within their means so that they are not tempted to tap into their bitcoin investment at a time in which it would be better to keep the value in bitcoin.  Poor people may well ongoingly need the money, and if they are not able to figure out ways to stock the money away without touching it and without putting systems in place in order to not tap into their bitcoin, then they might not have enough money to be able to invest into bitcoin.. since they would end up trading and/or gambling if they cannot put systems and practices in place to create some level of confidence that they are not going to be tapping into their bitcoin stash in less than 4-10 years or longer.

As we also discussed poor people might have limitations in which they are able to increase their discretionary income by increasing their income and/or by cutting their expenses... there might ONLY be so much that they are ready, willing and able to do in the direction of increasing their discretionary income.. which is what is needed to be able to invest into bitcoin - and not and up trading and/or gambling with money that they actually need for either present expenses or some expenses into the future that might not have had yet been identified... sometimes even a small level of emergency funds (or back up funds) could save them in regards to preparing for various unidentified future expenses.

[edited out]

probably all those who later find it difficult in succeeding in the art of trading perhaps haven't gained the necessary skill required to trade adequately and as a result they may feel discouraged thinking trading isn't as not for them, but with the right information I think anyone can make the most out of trading as long as he or she is ready to spend time and learn what it takes to trade efficiently.

Are you full of shit, Skydrill?  

You really think that anyone can learn sufficient trading skills in order to turn it from being a loser (for 95% of those who try it) into being successful for a majority?

You seem to be living in a fantasy, and sure there are some profitable traders, and they might even have long streaks of success (luck)..

For an overwhelming majority of people it is likely better to figure out ways to earn money in other ways, and sure if they want to practice trading that might be o.k. to see if they can make money from it, even though many times, even folks who might have some outside income they are putting into trading, they still might end up losing more than they win and not really making any progress, even if they might be able to figure out some profitable tactics and strategies and hedges to bet on both the ups and the downs.

Another problem that traders tend to have that devolves into a kind of gambling is an ever increasing need for more and  more capital, so even if they might have had found some successful ways of utilizing their capital, they may well end up winning and having some successful trades that may well cause them to put more money into future trades, and so one or two losses of the future trades might end up costing them much more than their various gains in their earlier trades.. and even if we might be able to identify some traders who have been successful and/or lucky, they might not be able to pass those skills on to others  or make some of their experiences replicable.. and they might not even themselves be able to replicate their earlier success.

So, surely it is not obvious that anyone or everyone is able to learn such trading skills that will end up putting them into a better position than folks who are able to figure out investing skills and the various cashflow management skills and practices around building up a bitcoin investment.. that in and of itself might take years and years to build up both the bitcoin investment and to strengthen the cashflow management systems/practices.

Honestly, most people who think they can “learn” trading end up realizing it’s not as simple as watching charts or following indicators.
I’ve seen people make profits during bull runs, like, during the 2021 bull run, countless retail traders made good profits on paper, but by the next bear phase, most had wiped out their portfolios trying to “win it back.” Emotions, overconfidence, and leverage destroy more accounts than bad strategies ever do. Even some skilled traders can’t replicate their success because the market always changes. On the other hand, those who simply stacked sats, managed their cash flow, and stayed patient through the dips have consistently come out ahead over the years. For example, a person who bought Bitcoin in early 2019 at around $4,000 and just held through the ups and downs would have outperformed almost every short-term trader by 2025, even without perfect timing. That’s not luck, that’s the discipline of long-term conviction and managing cash flow well enough to keep stacking during dips instead of panic-selling.

Even professional traders with winning records, like those in hedge funds or crypto quant firms, rely on systems, automation, and teams not intuition alone. And when they’re honest, they’ll admit how rare and fragile consistent profitability really is.

Trading Bitcoin can be educational, sure but for the overwhelming majority, holding Bitcoin and learning proper cash management is a much more reliable way to build wealth than chasing quick trades.

[Justchukx]

Wether it is trading or investing,  one mist have the bravery of accepting risks when the centre cannot hold and things fall apart.
Its not a matter of life and death. One must understand there are ups and downs. This is the reason, it is not adviceable to go as far as borrowing huge sums to either trade or invest in digital currencies.

[Barikui1]

Wether it is trading or investing,  one mist have the bravery of accepting risks when the centre cannot hold and things fall apart.
Its not a matter of life and death. One must understand there are ups and downs. This is the reason, it is not adviceable to go as far as borrowing huge sums to either trade or invest in digital currencies.

I largely agree to most of what you said here, but I disagree on the highlighted statement in your write up.
Yes it's a risky move to borrow money to invest in Bitcoin because Bitcoin is not risk free and due to the fact that we live in a world full of uncertainty, so many things can go wrong in a very short period of time very fast, but once you have the ability to pay back the loan from another source, it's not a bad idea entirely, where the problem is, is by having it at the back of your mind of paying it back from your Bitcoin investment, that's where it's wrong, but if you have other means of repaying the loan without stress, it's actually not a bad idea, since the borrowed money can be used to front load your Bitcoin investment.

[Tonimez]

Wether it is trading or investing,  one mist have the bravery of accepting risks when the centre cannot hold and things fall apart.
Its not a matter of life and death. One must understand there are ups and downs.

Yeah sure, bitcoin is known for its Volatility and it is one of the characteristics of bitcoin which has made it so very difficult for investors or speculators to predict correctly how the chart goes. If is true that there's no bitcoin approach that is completely risk free but the emphasis on bitcoin risk greatly depends on the direction and individual chooses to follow in his bitcoin journey. Bitcoin traders face real risk everyday and infact they face extreme risks due to bitcoin volatility. Unlike bitcoin traders, Real bitcoin investors face lower risks compared to traders of which to a large extent, investors tend to be almost certain of not loosing their money to bitcoin volatility because they buy, buy and always buy but never in a hurry to sell. Bitcoin investors buy and HODL unlike the bitcoin traders who buy and sells immediately they think they have made profit.

This is why as a newbie, you must choose the right bitcoin practice by not attempting to play smart. Bitcoin trading can be very scary and keeps happening everyday whereby traders loose their money and sometimes they don't have the mind to bear the loss

This is the reason, it is not adviceable to go as far as borrowing huge sums to either trade or invest in digital currencies.

You are very correct. Borrowing money at all to invest in bitcoin is a huge mistake that many people make everyday especially bitcoin traders. Borrowing money to invest has a serious effect on an individual's attitude to his bitcoin. A bitcoin trader who borrows money to trade could loose all the money and may have to sell any of his assets to pay back or he keeps incurring loans until he is frustrated. This is why bitcoin trading is sometimes referred to as gambling. Secondly, borrowing money to invest in bitcoin with the intention to HODL is also risky and a bad idea because it can ruin your Holding ability.  Bitcoin investors are those bitcoin enthusiasts who buy bitcoin with the sole purpose of holding it for a very long time, say more than 4 to 10 years time. They are not in a rush to sell no matter the price of bitcoin because they believe that the future belongs to bitcoin HODLers. This is the right practice and a safer way of investing in bitcoin and can be ruined by introducing a borrowed money into it.

Bitcoin investment is best done with a discretionary income which is the money left after taking care of all your basic responsibilities. This means that you are only investing with your leftover money which would make it possible for you to forget the funds in bitcoin and HODL for a very long time as long as you also maintain your emergency funds and back up funds which would cushion your bitcoin against untimely sales. You can choose to invest by DCA or any other investment strategy like the lump-sum and buying the dip. But one must make sure that he is investing with discretionary income which if he does, then there's no way he can borrow to invest because a borrowed money is not a discretionary income and a borrowed money can ruin all your bitcoin when you can no longer service the loan for that number of years you initially intended to HODL your bitcoin.

PS: choose bitcoin investment over bitcoin trading, it will not mess your mental health.

[Xcode7]

Wether it is trading or investing,  one mist have the bravery of accepting risks when the centre cannot hold and things fall apart.
Its not a matter of life and death. One must understand there are ups and downs. This is the reason, it is not adviceable to go as far as borrowing huge sums to either trade or invest in digital currencies.

I largely agree to most of what you said here, but I disagree on the highlighted statement in your write up.
Yes it's a risky move to borrow money to invest in Bitcoin because Bitcoin is not risk free and due to the fact that we live in a world full of uncertainty, so many things can go wrong in a very short period of time very fast, but once you have the ability to pay back the loan from another source, it's not a bad idea entirely, where the problem is, is by having it at the back of your mind of paying it back from your Bitcoin investment, that's where it's wrong, but if you have other means of repaying the loan without stress, it's actually not a bad idea, since the borrowed money can be used to front load your Bitcoin investment.

If there are other sources to pay debts and not interfere with the investments we make with borrowed money, of course it is a very wise step, even for long-term investments it is needed when market prices are falling, so there is nothing wrong if we act aggressively to accumulate Bitcoin regardless of where we look for money, but what is certain is that our investments should not be disturbed, but if it is for trading, I really do not recommend that.

[Futurexxx]

. Borrowing money to invest has a serious effect on an individual's attitude to his bitcoin. A bitcoin trader who borrows money to trade could loose all the money and may have to sell any of his assets to pay back or he keeps incurring loans until he is frustrated. This is why bitcoin trading is sometimes referred to as gambling.

I agree with you that it's wrong to borrow money to trade because it might affect your emotions and since traders are advice to trade with an amount they can afford to lose,
It will make no sense because only the thought of losing that loan will make you start making terrible and emotional decisions.

Secondly, borrowing money to invest in bitcoin with the intention to HODL is also risky and a bad idea because it can ruin your Holding ability.  

Nothing will ruin your holding ability if you have other means of paying back the loan, and the outcome of your Bitcoin investment has no role to play in your ability to pay back. If that's the case, then you will be fine buddy

[Barrykbest]

Wether it is trading or investing,  one mist have the bravery of accepting risks when the centre cannot hold and things fall apart.
Its not a matter of life and death. One must understand there are ups and downs.

Yeah sure, bitcoin is known for its Volatility and it is one of the characteristics of bitcoin which has made it so very difficult for investors or speculators to predict correctly how the chart goes. If is true that there's no bitcoin approach that is completely risk free but the emphasis on bitcoin risk greatly depends on the direction and individual chooses to follow in his bitcoin journey. Bitcoin traders face real risk everyday and infact they face extreme risks due to bitcoin volatility. Unlike bitcoin traders, Real bitcoin investors face lower risks compared to traders of which to a large extent, investors tend to be almost certain of not loosing their money to bitcoin volatility because they buy, buy and always buy but never in a hurry to sell. Bitcoin investors buy and HODL unlike the bitcoin traders who buy and sells immediately they think they have made profit.

This is why as a newbie, you must choose the right bitcoin practice by not attempting to play smart. Bitcoin trading can be very scary and keeps happening everyday whereby traders loose their money and sometimes they don't have the mind to bear the loss

This is the reason, it is not adviceable to go as far as borrowing huge sums to either trade or invest in digital currencies.

You are very correct. Borrowing money at all to invest in bitcoin is a huge mistake that many people make everyday especially bitcoin traders. Borrowing money to invest has a serious effect on an individual's attitude to his bitcoin. A bitcoin trader who borrows money to trade could loose all the money and may have to sell any of his assets to pay back or he keeps incurring loans until he is frustrated. This is why bitcoin trading is sometimes referred to as gambling. Secondly, borrowing money to invest in bitcoin with the intention to HODL is also risky and a bad idea because it can ruin your Holding ability.  Bitcoin investors are those bitcoin enthusiasts who buy bitcoin with the sole purpose of holding it for a very long time, say more than 4 to 10 years time. They are not in a rush to sell no matter the price of bitcoin because they believe that the future belongs to bitcoin HODLers. This is the right practice and a safer way of investing in bitcoin and can be ruined by introducing a borrowed money into it.

Bitcoin investment is best done with a discretionary income which is the money left after taking care of all your basic responsibilities. This means that you are only investing with your leftover money which would make it possible for you to forget the funds in bitcoin and HODL for a very long time as long as you also maintain your emergency funds and back up funds which would cushion your bitcoin against untimely sales. You can choose to invest by DCA or any other investment strategy like the lump-sum and buying the dip. But one must make sure that he is investing with discretionary income which if he does, then there's no way he can borrow to invest because a borrowed money is not a discretionary income and a borrowed money can ruin all your bitcoin when you can no longer service the loan for that number of years you initially intended to HODL your bitcoin.

PS: choose bitcoin investment over bitcoin trading, it will not mess your mental health.

I feel many people overlook the psychological burden that comes with investing borrowed money. It’s not just about being able to repay from another source, it’s about the emotional pressure that can cloud your judgment and make you sell too early or panic during dips.
Bitcoin rewards patience, not leverage. Using only discretionary income gives you peace of mind and helps you hold through volatility without second guessing every market move. In the long run, financial calmness often matters more than financial speed.
Just a humble nugget.😇

[abaeze]

. Borrowing money to invest has a serious effect on an individual's attitude to his bitcoin. A bitcoin trader who borrows money to trade could loose all the money and may have to sell any of his assets to pay back or he keeps incurring loans until he is frustrated. This is why bitcoin trading is sometimes referred to as gambling.

I agree with you that it's wrong to borrow money to trade because it might affect your emotions and since traders are advice to trade with an amount they can afford to lose,
It will make no sense because only the thought of losing that loan will make you start making terrible and emotional decisions.

Secondly, borrowing money to invest in bitcoin with the intention to HODL is also risky and a bad idea because it can ruin your Holding ability.  

Nothing will ruin your holding ability if you have other means of paying back the loan, and the outcome of your Bitcoin investment has no role to play in your ability to pay back. If that's the case, then you will be fine buddy

If one thinks about it logically, it is seen that if one has a stable and secure source of income and money is kept aside to repay the loan and if one is not forced to sell even if the price of Bitcoin decreases, then holding Bitcoin with a loan is not financially dangerous. Because, his loan repayment is not dependent on the accumulation performance of Bitcoin.

Although these things are logically correct but in reality I don't like it and I will not advise anyone to do this. Because, most people are not in such a stable state. When the price of Bitcoin suddenly falls, most new/old investors naturally get stressed and later when they lack funds to pay their loan installments, many are forced to sell Bitcoin at a loss or in the middle of the investment and suffer losses. The effect of debt in practical terms seems to me to destroy the safe holding ability of Bitcoin.

[As-Soon-As]

Wether it is trading or investing,  one mist have the bravery of accepting risks when the centre cannot hold and things fall apart.
Its not a matter of life and death. One must understand there are ups and downs. This is the reason, it is not adviceable to go as far as borrowing huge sums to either trade or invest in digital currencies.

I largely agree to most of what you said here, but I disagree on the highlighted statement in your write up.
Yes it's a risky move to borrow money to invest in Bitcoin because Bitcoin is not risk free and due to the fact that we live in a world full of uncertainty, so many things can go wrong in a very short period of time very fast, but once you have the ability to pay back the loan from another source, it's not a bad idea entirely, where the problem is, is by having it at the back of your mind of paying it back from your Bitcoin investment, that's where it's wrong, but if you have other means of repaying the loan without stress, it's actually not a bad idea, since the borrowed money can be used to front load your Bitcoin investment.

If there are other sources to pay debts and not interfere with the investments we make with borrowed money, of course it is a very wise step, even for long-term investments it is needed when market prices are falling, so there is nothing wrong if we act aggressively to accumulate Bitcoin regardless of where we look for money, but what is certain is that our investments should not be disturbed, but if it is for trading, I really do not recommend that.

Bitcoin should not be bought aggressively, then again you said that it is a completely wrong move to invest in Bitcoin by borrowing. Whether it is for long-term investment, you should never invest in Bitcoin by borrowing, because if the price of Bitcoin is dumped for a short period of time, then you will face losses from both sides.
So you invest a small amount of money weekly following the DCA method but you can invest only with the money you have, there is no limit to this. Because if you ever buy aggressively in Bitcoin investment, then you will face losses.

[Cossyblack]

If there are other sources to pay debts and not interfere with the investments we make with borrowed money, of course it is a very wise step, even for long-term investments it is needed when market prices are falling, so there is nothing wrong if we act aggressively to accumulate Bitcoin regardless of where we look for money, but what is certain is that our investments should not be disturbed, but if it is for trading, I really do not recommend that.

It is a shitty idea to borrow fund to trade because it's highly risky. If you're trading with a borrowed money and the market starts moving against you, you will be forced to sell at loss and that alone is shitty. The lender do not care if the market isn't moving in your favor,the repayment agreement must be kept. This is a bigger mess because he already have sold his Bitcoin below his initial purchase price and he doesn't have an alternative source to service the loans. Considering how risky trading/Investment in Bitcoin can be, we should avoid borrowing loans without having an alternative source to repay them. Secondly, we should only borrow money we can afford to lose because trading/investments in Bitcoin is without guarantee.

[ZeroVinsonN]

Bitcoin should not be bought aggressively, then again you said that it is a completely wrong move to invest in Bitcoin by borrowing. Whether it is for long-term investment, you should never invest in Bitcoin by borrowing, because if the price of Bitcoin is dumped for a short period of time, then you will face losses from both sides.
So you invest a small amount of money weekly following the DCA method but you can invest only with the money you have, there is no limit to this. Because if you ever buy aggressively in Bitcoin investment, then you will face losses.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with buying bitcoin aggressively as long as you have the financial means to support your purchasing, aggressive buying means that you get to accumulate more bitcoin over shorter periods of time which rings as a win for me anytime of the day. I'm not sure why you think that buying bitcoin aggressively is wrong but I will probably not support that reason if I hear it.
And if you are borrowing money to invest in bitcoin with the hopes of paying back that loan with profits from your investment then you are probably not an investor but a trader instead, investors can borrow money to invest in bitcoin, it happens usually because they want to accumulate more aggressively or the want to buy a DIP, either way it works out just fine if you have a means by which you intend to buy back the loan outside of your bitcoin investment so even if you invested with a loan you still have no practical reason to sell at a loss just because there was a price dump, where you planning on selling too early in the first place?? Your answer is probably NO, so why should you sell early just because you borrowed to invest? Pay off your loan with s different income source and continue with your bitcoin accumulation.
If you don't have a different reliable source of income to pay of your loan with then don't invest with loan, just maintain your everyday or week or month of regular accumulation with whatever Discretionary income you have and your patience will still pay off. If you borrow and can't pay back the loan at the stipulated time because you don't have the financial means to pay back the loan then you might have to sell to early just to clear that loan and if you are not lucky enough then you might actually be selling at a loss compared to when you initially purchased the bitcoin and this is not a good thing to happen to anybody.
So while you can invest with loans and purchase bitcoin aggressively, be sure to have to financial support necessary to back up these strategies, if you don't then just continue with you DCAing.
You can also DCA the borrowed money and buy aggressively through DCAing.

[Father111]

Wether it is trading or investing,  one mist have the bravery of accepting risks when the centre cannot hold and things fall apart.
Its not a matter of life and death. One must understand there are ups and downs.

Yeah sure, bitcoin is known for its Volatility and it is one of the characteristics of bitcoin which has made it so very difficult for investors or speculators to predict correctly how the chart goes. If is true that there's no bitcoin approach that is completely risk free but the emphasis on bitcoin risk greatly depends on the direction and individual chooses to follow in his bitcoin journey. Bitcoin traders face real risk everyday and infact they face extreme risks due to bitcoin volatility. Unlike bitcoin traders, Real bitcoin investors face lower risks compared to traders of which to a large extent, investors tend to be almost certain of not loosing their money to bitcoin volatility because they buy, buy and always buy but never in a hurry to sell. Bitcoin investors buy and HODL unlike the bitcoin traders who buy and sells immediately they think they have made profit.

This is why as a newbie, you must choose the right bitcoin practice by not attempting to play smart. Bitcoin trading can be very scary and keeps happening everyday whereby traders loose their money and sometimes they don't have the mind to bear the loss

This is the reason, it is not adviceable to go as far as borrowing huge sums to either trade or invest in digital currencies.

You are very correct. Borrowing money at all to invest in bitcoin is a huge mistake that many people make everyday especially bitcoin traders. Borrowing money to invest has a serious effect on an individual's attitude to his bitcoin. A bitcoin trader who borrows money to trade could loose all the money and may have to sell any of his assets to pay back or he keeps incurring loans until he is frustrated. This is why bitcoin trading is sometimes referred to as gambling. Secondly, borrowing money to invest in bitcoin with the intention to HODL is also risky and a bad idea because it can ruin your Holding ability.  Bitcoin investors are those bitcoin enthusiasts who buy bitcoin with the sole purpose of holding it for a very long time, say more than 4 to 10 years time. They are not in a rush to sell no matter the price of bitcoin because they believe that the future belongs to bitcoin HODLers. This is the right practice and a safer way of investing in bitcoin and can be ruined by introducing a borrowed money into it.

Bitcoin investment is best done with a discretionary income which is the money left after taking care of all your basic responsibilities. This means that you are only investing with your leftover money which would make it possible for you to forget the funds in bitcoin and HODL for a very long time as long as you also maintain your emergency funds and back up funds which would cushion your bitcoin against untimely sales. You can choose to invest by DCA or any other investment strategy like the lump-sum and buying the dip. But one must make sure that he is investing with discretionary income which if he does, then there's no way he can borrow to invest because a borrowed money is not a discretionary income and a borrowed money can ruin all your bitcoin when you can no longer service the loan for that number of years you initially intended to HODL your bitcoin.

PS: choose bitcoin investment over bitcoin trading, it will not mess your mental health.

I feel many people overlook the psychological burden that comes with investing borrowed money. It’s not just about being able to repay from another source, it’s about the emotional pressure that can cloud your judgment and make you sell too early or panic during dips.
Bitcoin rewards patience, not leverage. Using only discretionary income gives you peace of mind and helps you hold through volatility without second guessing every market move. In the long run, financial calmness often matters more than financial speed.
Just a humble nugget.😇

Can i remember when i came across a thread were you can request for loan, as newbie that I'm, i asked the OP if i can request for such loan and he replied to me that i can only qualify for such loan if I'm under campaign and i asked what he meant by campaign and i was told if I'm to full member and getting myself working any of campaign in the forum and i said okay then, and now i have come across were my mate is advising never to borrow money all because we want to invest in Bitcoin that if we try to borrow money to invest we are going to be forced to sell and regret when dips finally comes and which i think i agree with him.

[gracreavix]

I largely agree to most of what you said here, but I disagree on the highlighted statement in your write up.
Yes it's a risky move to borrow money to invest in Bitcoin because Bitcoin is not risk free and due to the fact that we live in a world full of uncertainty, so many things can go wrong in a very short period of time very fast, but once you have the ability to pay back the loan from another source, it's not a bad idea entirely, where the problem is, is by having it at the back of your mind of paying it back from your Bitcoin investment, that's where it's wrong, but if you have other means of repaying the loan without stress, it's actually not a bad idea, since the borrowed money can be used to front load your Bitcoin investment.

If there are other sources to pay debts and not interfere with the investments we make with borrowed money, of course it is a very wise step, even for long-term investments it is needed when market prices are falling, so there is nothing wrong if we act aggressively to accumulate Bitcoin regardless of where we look for money, but what is certain is that our investments should not be disturbed, but if it is for trading, I really do not recommend that.

Xcode7 Even if I am to support some part of what you said, I still can not fully agree with the part where you called it a very wise step.  Yeah, I understand your point about having another source to pay back the loan without touching the investment,  that is fair, and in some cases, it might actually work out fine. 
But truth be told, it is still a risky move. Using borrowed money to invest, especially in Bitcoin, has done more harm than good to many people. The market does not always go as planned, and once things turn the other way round , that extra source of income might not even be enough to handle the pressure.. If it worked out for you, then that is great, I am happy for you, but personally, I still would not support taking loans for investment. I would rather build slowly with what I have than gamble with borrowed money hoping the market favors me..

[Gallar]

I also want to add that trading is for those who doesn't believe in hodling Bitcoin for long-term, those who wants quick profits and don't mind risking on shitcoins regardless of how risky it is compared to holding Bitcoin for a very long period and being patient with it as well. Bitcoin investment don't require one to analyse the price movement of the market or monitor it regularly like traders do, and investors don't have to be scared of volatility especially when it's the downtrend of it, all that's just require of an investor is to ensure their discretionary fund is available to constantly invest regularly over time for a longer period.

Yes, for people who want to make a quick profit, trading in shitcoins is indeed an option, but it is very risky. In addition, I am personally quite sure that the majority of traders know and believe that bitcoin is the best and that holding it in the long term will certainly yield good results. However, they choose not to invest, perhaps because they are tempted by the extreme volatility that shitcoins always exhibit. They may assume that doubling their assets in shitcoins is quick. In reality, it is not as easy as imagined, as the failure rate in shitcoin trading is extremely high. Even in Bitcoin, which has less extreme price fluctuations compared to shitcoins, the risk of failure is still quite high when traded. Therefore, I believe choosing the safer path is better investing in Bitcoin for the long term.

[Cgrexp]

Yes, for people who want to make a quick profit, trading in shitcoins is indeed an option, but it is very risky. In addition, I am personally quite sure that the majority of traders know and believe that bitcoin is the best and that holding it in the long term will certainly yield good results. However, they choose not to invest, perhaps because they are tempted by the extreme volatility that shitcoins always exhibit. They may assume that doubling their assets in shitcoins is quick. In reality, it is not as easy as imagined, as the failure rate in shitcoin trading is extremely high. Even in Bitcoin, which has less extreme price fluctuations compared to shitcoins, the risk of failure is still quite high when traded. Therefore, I believe choosing the safer path is better investing in Bitcoin for the long term.

Bitcoin has gained acceptance in various fields in the current world. It is natural to have doubts about alternatives or substitutes to Bitcoin. And to hedge our investments, other cryptocurrencies or conventional assets and money can be invested. Newbies should increase their savings in Bitcoin and cash to ensure life management. Bitcoin deposits are important for those who have not seen the full cycle of Bitcoin. Although some may hedge due to doubts. Everyone should take responsibility for their own decisions. It is not excessive optimism about success in Bitcoin but excessive doubt and distrust of people at the retail level that is preventing them from adopting Bitcoin. Negative and suspicious thoughts are frightening, due to which many people delay investing and express reluctance to invest. The biggest obstacle to people's success in Bitcoin is doubt and negative attitude. Which is preventing many from taking investment opportunities.

[Finebone]

Yes, for people who want to make a quick profit, trading in shitcoins is indeed an option, but it is very risky. In addition, I am personally quite sure that the majority of traders know and believe that bitcoin is the best and that holding it in the long term will certainly yield good results. However, they choose not to invest, perhaps because they are tempted by the extreme volatility that shitcoins always exhibit. They may assume that doubling their assets in shitcoins is quick. In reality, it is not as easy as imagined, as the failure rate in shitcoin trading is extremely high.

Trading or investing in shit is very risky because of it volatility, and if you make your own research about it, it shows that they are created for gambling purpose, so it's more of gambling since the chances of you losing your money is way higher than the chances of you making money from it.

Those that trade or invest in shit coin heavily even when they are aware of it danger, are the most stupid set of people because  they let greed blind their sense of reasoning to the point of self destruct without them knowing, that's why I will never feel sorry for such person because they must surely reap what they sowed.

[Hardyrobust]

Bitcoin should not be bought aggressively, then again you said that it is a completely wrong move to invest in Bitcoin by borrowing. Whether it is for long-term investment, you should never invest in Bitcoin by borrowing, because if the price of Bitcoin is dumped for a short period of time, then you will face losses from both sides.
So you invest a small amount of money weekly following the DCA method but you can invest only with the money you have, there is no limit to this. Because if you ever buy aggressively in Bitcoin investment, then you will face losses.

Taking loan to invest in bitcoin is not a bad idea as you think. It is only a bad idea when you are expecting a short term profit from your bitcoin investment to repay the loan.nevertheless , if an investor is expecting money from another source other than there bitcoin investment then it won't be wrong to take loan for this purpose. Also talking about losing money whenever there is a dump, is not true. It is only possible for an investor to lose money when they rushed to sell off there bitcoin whenever there is a dump.

[ASloveapg]

Bitcoin should not be bought aggressively, then again you said that it is a completely wrong move to invest in Bitcoin by borrowing. Whether it is for long-term investment, you should never invest in Bitcoin by borrowing, because if the price of Bitcoin is dumped for a short period of time, then you will face losses from both sides.
So you invest a small amount of money weekly following the DCA method but you can invest only with the money you have, there is no limit to this. Because if you ever buy aggressively in Bitcoin investment, then you will face losses.

Taking loan to invest in bitcoin is not a bad idea as you think. It is only a bad idea when you are expecting a short term profit from your bitcoin investment to repay the loan.nevertheless , if an investor is expecting money from another source other than there bitcoin investment then it won't be wrong to take loan for this purpose. Also talking about losing money whenever there is a dump, is not true. It is only possible for an investor to lose money when they rushed to sell off there bitcoin whenever there is a dump.

It is never completely wrong to invest using debt, but you should keep in mind that you have a separate arrangement for repaying the debt you are investing with, and even if you invest with debt, you must move forward only with a long-term mindset, not for short-term gains, but for the purpose of accumulating long-term wealth. When you can prepare yourself for these things, then you can definitely invest with debt. Risks are everywhere, but you have to be there responsibly. If someone expects to make immediate profits from Bitcoin, that is basically the wrong decision and this decision can expose him to more losses, especially if he has invested in Bitcoin with debt.

[ejikeme24]

so there is nothing wrong if we act aggressively to accumulate Bitcoin regardless of where we look for money, but what is certain is that our investments should not be disturbed, but if it is for trading, I really do not recommend that.

You seems to have forgotten that aggressive buying of bitcoin need to be done according to the level of our discretionary funds, whatever thing that requires investing aside your discretionary income is Said to be over-aggressive which is not good because it can ruin your investment journey so being aggressive need to be done moderately and not crossing boundaries because if you say that there's nothing wrong if we act aggressively regardless of where we look for money means that you're in support of those that take loan to invest.

Remember the reason why is advised for all Investors to invest from thier discretionary is to avoid messing our investment up, I can only agree with you on this that's if the person is sure of paying back which the guarantee may not be 100% because emergency issues can arise at any point in time. So for this reason I will say that buying aggressively need to be done according to the size of our discretionary funds.

[LOCKACO]

Since I started posting and following this thread, I've been able to understand alot of things differently, especially when it comes to Bitcoin, thanks JayJuanGee, Tonimez and others who has been very informative about bitcoin and now I have more insight when it comes to Bitcoin investing