Betpanda confiscated ~13,000 USDT after settled sports bets – UK user, no bonus

[pytycrys]

Can you please make the bets public as I have no more access to my account or betting history after you have banned me. I am happy to go through last 50 bets let's say and we can easily cross check the lines I have bet against standard lines available at other bookmakers using industry websites such as proboxingodds / bestfightodds.

So just to confirm your position:

You are stating that “value betting” — i.e. placing bets at odds that later move in the player’s favour — is considered a breach of your Anti-Fraud Policy.

There has been no fraud, no automation, no arbitrage, no multi-accounting. Therefore, the only issue identified is that the bets were profitable or that some lines moved in my favour albeit some could swing the other way as well, right?

If that is the case, then your position is effectively that identifying value in standard pre-match markets is grounds for confiscating player funds, including deposited funds.

I will continue documenting this case publicly so that others can draw their own conclusions.

[Rating Place]

1 – You say that banning someone is not as simple as “someone is just winning”. However, in your email to me (which I have published here via screenshots), you state the following:

“In this instance, what raised the suspicions of our Sportsbook provider were bets which targeted advantageous early pre-match odds and line falls.”

I hope you realise that this effectively means the “suspicious behaviour” you refer to is simply placing bets at odds that later moved in my favour — in other words, identifying value.

We must correct a misquoting here; we mentioned that an investigation would not be initiated by someone "just winning". While it has to be said that what you also stated is true, an account closure would not be something that would be actioned solely based on someone winning.

We are not in a position to comment on what our sportsbook provider considers to be "suspicious behaviour" as we do know the parameters which they use to make this decision.

You can also confirm yourself that I am not an arbitrage bettor, and I did not take advantage of any erroneous lines or target obscure markets. I also did not place automated bets or engage in any form of bonus abuse, I had no bonuses on my account. The bets were placed manually and in a normal manner.

Additionally, I do not even place particularly “early” pre-match bets. The market I primarily bet on (boxing) typically releases lines only 2–3 days before the fights, and approximately 90% of my bets on your website were placed either the day before or the day of the fight itself.

We have never mentioned any other type of suspicious activity but targeting line falls as we do not speculate on behaviour beyond the one which is reported to us by our sportsbook provider.

Like above, we are not in a position to comment on what our sportsbook provider considers to be "early", but presumably this changes depending on the market/event in question. But we cannot confirm this as his information is not available to us.

More broadly, the term “suspicious activity” is extremely vague. Using such an undefined concept to justify confiscating funds does not inspire confidence in your platform, particularly when customers are not provided with any concrete explanation of what rule was actually breached.

We have provided you the exact clause which you broke when we replied to your email on 19th of February, but you can also find it below:

5. ANTI-FRAUD POLICY

In the interests of fair play, it is not permitted to utilise or deploy any novel or recognised betting techniques while using our services which are designed to circumvent the standard house edge in our casino games nor the sportsbook. Should we detect that You have engaged in any activity of this nature, we may immediately suspend, terminate or restrict access to Your Account and/or retain any funds on the account.

As you mentioned in your message above, you were betting on lines which you knew you were going to change in your favour, also known as value betting, a practice which is explicitly designed to circumvent the standard house edge and therefore breaching the above clause of our Terms and Conditions.

For the sake of transparency, I formally give you permission to publish my complete betting history here in this thread so that the forum can review it and judge for themselves whether the activity was genuinely “suspicious.” These are my bets, and I am happy for them to be made public.

If you wish to do so, you are of course welcome to share this information, but simply looking at your betting history would not provide much context to these particular circumstances. For example, line changes would not be evident from betting history alone and in this instance, this something that is central to this case.

Even if we ignore the overall profits that were made on the account (approximately $7,000 USDT), my total deposits amount to roughly $8,000 USDT.

Although you claim that the bets were “suspicious” and therefore voided or confiscated, you have refunded only $1,800 USDT, which was my latest deposit.

This means that $6,200 USDT of my deposited funds remains with BetPanda. That money does not belong to Betby, and it is not sitting with them — it was deposited directly with your platform.

Therefore, regardless of any alleged issues with specific bets, the question remains very simple:

On what basis are you retaining $6,200 USDT of my own deposits?

The deposits which you have made have been wagered multiple times (ie. not sitting on the account unused) and any funds on the account the outcomes of winning bets, some of which evidently were based under circumstances which led to the investigation and the outcome we are already aware of.

As the clause which we shared above mentions, it is possible that should it be breached, any funds on the account could be retained as a result.

As also made evident by this clause, we are not obliged to refund any funds that have potentially been obtained through suspicious methods but a decision was made regardless to refund your most recent deposit as a gesture of goodwill.

Otherwise, I will continue documenting the case publicly and will escalate the matter further through platforms such as AskGamblers and CasinoGuru, where cases like this can be independently reviewed.

It is of course within your rights to do so if you wish, we are happy to cooperate with any independent adjudicators and provide them with the necessary documentation regarding the matter.

Post his bets so we can see what happened. Also, are you saying that some type of human investigation occurred? Betby is AI. They have it's own division AI Labs. If the OP beats closers, he will be flagged. Players making early bets have no idea if their bets will beat closers.

[pytycrys]

Also just to make it completely clear that is a very interpretable reason to ban someone. Even at big bookmakers such as Bookmaker, even a few hundred dollars will swing even a ML line in a boxing fight, so surely that could be interpreted as 'value betting' because...after you bet a line it slightly moves? Never meant that people get banned at reputable bookmakers, lol.

[T1HGO]

1 – You say that banning someone is not as simple as “someone is just winning”. However, in your email to me (which I have published here via screenshots), you state the following:

“In this instance, what raised the suspicions of our Sportsbook provider were bets which targeted advantageous early pre-match odds and line falls.”

I hope you realise that this effectively means the “suspicious behaviour” you refer to is simply placing bets at odds that later moved in my favour — in other words, identifying value.

We must correct a misquoting here; we mentioned that an investigation would not be initiated by someone "just winning". While it has to be said that what you also stated is true, an account closure would not be something that would be actioned solely based on someone winning.

We are not in a position to comment on what our sportsbook provider considers to be "suspicious behaviour" as we do know the parameters which they use to make this decision.

You can also confirm yourself that I am not an arbitrage bettor, and I did not take advantage of any erroneous lines or target obscure markets. I also did not place automated bets or engage in any form of bonus abuse, I had no bonuses on my account. The bets were placed manually and in a normal manner.

Additionally, I do not even place particularly “early” pre-match bets. The market I primarily bet on (boxing) typically releases lines only 2–3 days before the fights, and approximately 90% of my bets on your website were placed either the day before or the day of the fight itself.

We have never mentioned any other type of suspicious activity but targeting line falls as we do not speculate on behaviour beyond the one which is reported to us by our sportsbook provider.

Like above, we are not in a position to comment on what our sportsbook provider considers to be "early", but presumably this changes depending on the market/event in question. But we cannot confirm this as his information is not available to us.

More broadly, the term “suspicious activity” is extremely vague. Using such an undefined concept to justify confiscating funds does not inspire confidence in your platform, particularly when customers are not provided with any concrete explanation of what rule was actually breached.

We have provided you the exact clause which you broke when we replied to your email on 19th of February, but you can also find it below:

5. ANTI-FRAUD POLICY

In the interests of fair play, it is not permitted to utilise or deploy any novel or recognised betting techniques while using our services which are designed to circumvent the standard house edge in our casino games nor the sportsbook. Should we detect that You have engaged in any activity of this nature, we may immediately suspend, terminate or restrict access to Your Account and/or retain any funds on the account.

As you mentioned in your message above, you were betting on lines which you knew you were going to change in your favour, also known as value betting, a practice which is explicitly designed to circumvent the standard house edge and therefore breaching the above clause of our Terms and Conditions.

For the sake of transparency, I formally give you permission to publish my complete betting history here in this thread so that the forum can review it and judge for themselves whether the activity was genuinely “suspicious.” These are my bets, and I am happy for them to be made public.

If you wish to do so, you are of course welcome to share this information, but simply looking at your betting history would not provide much context to these particular circumstances. For example, line changes would not be evident from betting history alone and in this instance, this something that is central to this case.

Even if we ignore the overall profits that were made on the account (approximately $7,000 USDT), my total deposits amount to roughly $8,000 USDT.

Although you claim that the bets were “suspicious” and therefore voided or confiscated, you have refunded only $1,800 USDT, which was my latest deposit.

This means that $6,200 USDT of my deposited funds remains with BetPanda. That money does not belong to Betby, and it is not sitting with them — it was deposited directly with your platform.

Therefore, regardless of any alleged issues with specific bets, the question remains very simple:

On what basis are you retaining $6,200 USDT of my own deposits?

The deposits which you have made have been wagered multiple times (ie. not sitting on the account unused) and any funds on the account the outcomes of winning bets, some of which evidently were based under circumstances which led to the investigation and the outcome we are already aware of.

As the clause which we shared above mentions, it is possible that should it be breached, any funds on the account could be retained as a result.

As also made evident by this clause, we are not obliged to refund any funds that have potentially been obtained through suspicious methods but a decision was made regardless to refund your most recent deposit as a gesture of goodwill.

Otherwise, I will continue documenting the case publicly and will escalate the matter further through platforms such as AskGamblers and CasinoGuru, where cases like this can be independently reviewed.

It is of course within your rights to do so if you wish, we are happy to cooperate with any independent adjudicators and provide them with the necessary documentation regarding the matter.

So, you are confiscating and banning people over "suspicious behavior"? Does this mean you don't even have solid proof of wrong-doing? Amazing.

You say, an account closure isn't solely based on someone winning. Then why does every single ban, on every sportsbook related case against you in this entire forum, happen right after a cashout attempt? Why wouldn't you ban the players after your "suspicious behavior" flag? Because if the player doesn't win, he's free to keep losing.

Definition of value betting: Value betting is a smart betting strategy where you only wager when the odds give you a positive expected value (EV) meaning the payout is higher than the true risk of the outcome, based on your analysis.

So, it's against your ToS to win bets basically. So, to use sportsbook at betpanda, you need to shut off your brain, and bet like an ape, and hope you lose. Doesn't this contradict what you said about account closure solely based on someone winning? Your Anti-fraut policy clause is predatory.
But let's go along with this crap for a moment. Why does the player have to be the one punished, because the provider provided you odds, you consider "unfair" for lack of a better word?

You claim "All the information regarding the bets which are suspicious come from our sportsbook provider". Why does every other casino with the same sportsbook provider as you, limits and pays, when dealing with the exact same type of situation, while you ban and confiscate?

EDIT: I don't want to make another post, as this case isn't about me, but i've noticed you replied to my complaint at trustpilot 4 hours ago. "We can confirm that such action would not be taken unless we were informed by our sportsbook provider that suspicious betting activity would have taken place." At this point i wonder if this excuse is something you have on a .txt on your desktop ready to be copy-pasted quickly. Again with the "suspicious betting activity". So, no solid evidence again? Feel free to take a look at any of the 10 screenshots worth of an entire month of betting history i provided in my accusation thread against you, and pin-point exactly, where is the "suspicious betting activity" is. I know you won't do it. Because you can't. You have literally nothing on me. 0. But i already made you this question. And you whistled to the side. It's easy for you when you know you can do this and get away with it because there is no consequences when you have half of this forum under your payroll. They will vouch for you no matter what kind of bullshit you say or do.

[pytycrys]

Thanks, T1HGO

One thing to add in addition to what you said, and maybe a good question for BetPanda.

I have had this account for two years and placed hundreds of bets over this period.  I have deposited at least three times money in the account. Why does this suspicious behaviour flag and ban of the account came only when I requested to withdraw my balance? Clearly it wasn't an issue during the last two years when I was consistently betting, nor was it an issue when I deposited.

Maybe you clarify this to the people of this forum and, again, can you please make my betting history available to the public here, or at least a selection of the bets that were 'flagged' and we can review and discuss these more precisely?

[Rating Place]

I don't think the BetPanda rep is truthful. Otherwise he would post the bets. The OP had his money taken for winning. No one can win at BetPanda if they confiscate +EV.

 It's a simple fix. Turn on auto-limit. BetPanda can do this or Betby can do this for them as they do for other books. Auto-limit goes into affect early and prevents free rolls by BetPanda.

[T1HGO]

I don't think the BetPanda rep is truthful. Otherwise he would post the bets. The OP had his money taken for winning. No one can win at BetPanda if they confiscate +EV.

 It's a simple fix. Turn on auto-limit. BetPanda can do this or Betby can do this for them as they do for other books. Auto-limit goes into affect early and prevents free rolls by BetPanda.

I'm not sure i understand what you're saying, but if you're saying they don't limit, they do. They limit, ban, and confiscate.

[Rating Place]

I don't think the BetPanda rep is truthful. Otherwise he would post the bets. The OP had his money taken for winning. No one can win at BetPanda if they confiscate +EV.

 It's a simple fix. Turn on auto-limit. BetPanda can do this or Betby can do this for them as they do for other books. Auto-limit goes into affect early and prevents free rolls by BetPanda.

I'm not sure i understand what you're saying, but if you're saying they don't limit, they do. They limit, ban, and confiscate.

I didn't realize that since I thought they were doing the same as XYes. Why do they refuse to show the bets?

[T1HGO]

I don't think the BetPanda rep is truthful. Otherwise he would post the bets. The OP had his money taken for winning. No one can win at BetPanda if they confiscate +EV.

 It's a simple fix. Turn on auto-limit. BetPanda can do this or Betby can do this for them as they do for other books. Auto-limit goes into affect early and prevents free rolls by BetPanda.

I'm not sure i understand what you're saying, but if you're saying they don't limit, they do. They limit, ban, and confiscate.

I didn't realize that since I thought they were doing the same as XYes. Why do they refuse to show the bets?

That is something i don't have an answer for. In my case, i was using 2 other betby casinos at the time, with the exact same bets. Exact mirrors. That was how i was able to show my betting history publicly. Which makes their point of the "provider made the call" even more pathetic, because 2 betby's with the exact same bets paid up without any issue and quickly. Otherwise i would be in the same position as OP. Well, to be honest, i am in the same position as OP, because betting history or not, it's all the same. Even if they "release the files" nothing will change, sadly.

While legit casinos using this provider flag winning players, and limits them, which is totally fair, betpanda limits, bans and confiscate winnings from flagged winning players. This doesn't happen by chance. This their decision. This can't be fixed by toggle on or off a setting. This is fixed with integrity.

[Rating Place]

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https://betby.com/en/ai-labs/

We can figure this out on our own if we see the bets.

[T1HGO]

@OP any updates? Have you taken this somewhere else? Hope you're doing well.

[pytycrys]

Nope - still waiting for the BetPanda reply!

[Rating Place]

What's happening here is that Betpanda is cancelling bets claiming bad line. Each Betby book sets it's own risk management. Some will cancel bets off 8%, others may do 10% and others do it manually. Sportsbooks are not middlemen. Everything is customizable. The ToS may be different in that one cancels late starts after 12 hours and others 36 hours.

Betpanda is refusing to show wagers so that we can come to our own independent conclusions. If BetPanda refuses to show the wagers, it should be marked a scam.

[T1HGO]

What's happening here is that Betpanda is cancelling bets claiming bad line. Each Betby book sets it's own risk management. Some will cancel bets off 8%, others may do 10% and others do it manually. Sportsbooks are not middlemen. Everything is customizable. The ToS may be different in that one cancels late starts after 12 hours and others 36 hours.

Betpanda is refusing to show wagers so that we can come to our own independent conclusions. If BetPanda refuses to show the wagers, it should be marked a scam.

From what i read from OP, he didn't have any bet canceled or void. This case is an exact match of all the others here against them. Correct me if i'm wrong.

Realistically speaking, even if they show the wagers, nothing will change. Because OP will still not get his money back, and their reputation will not be damaged. Because when you say "it should be marked as a scam", who's gonna do that?

[Rating Place]

What's happening here is that Betpanda is cancelling bets claiming bad line. Each Betby book sets it's own risk management. Some will cancel bets off 8%, others may do 10% and others do it manually. Sportsbooks are not middlemen. Everything is customizable. The ToS may be different in that one cancels late starts after 12 hours and others 36 hours.

Betpanda is refusing to show wagers so that we can come to our own independent conclusions. If BetPanda refuses to show the wagers, it should be marked a scam.

From what i read from OP, he didn't have any bet canceled or void. This case is an exact match of all the others here against them. Correct me if i'm wrong.

Realistically speaking, even if they show the wagers, nothing will change. Because OP will still not get his money back, and their reputation will not be damaged. Because when you say "it should be marked as a scam", who's gonna do that?

I may be mixing up cases. Holy said that your case was considered resolved even though it wasn't. I'm hoping the same doesn't happen here. He has a thread somewhere in "reputation" that marks solved or unsolved.

[T1HGO]

What's happening here is that Betpanda is cancelling bets claiming bad line. Each Betby book sets it's own risk management. Some will cancel bets off 8%, others may do 10% and others do it manually. Sportsbooks are not middlemen. Everything is customizable. The ToS may be different in that one cancels late starts after 12 hours and others 36 hours.

Betpanda is refusing to show wagers so that we can come to our own independent conclusions. If BetPanda refuses to show the wagers, it should be marked a scam.

From what i read from OP, he didn't have any bet canceled or void. This case is an exact match of all the others here against them. Correct me if i'm wrong.

Realistically speaking, even if they show the wagers, nothing will change. Because OP will still not get his money back, and their reputation will not be damaged. Because when you say "it should be marked as a scam", who's gonna do that?

I may be mixing up cases. Holy said that your case was considered resolved even though it wasn't. I'm hoping the same doesn't happen here. He has a thread somewhere in "reputation" that marks solved or unsolved.

If my case was considered resolved, then this will be too, because this case is a mirror to mine. The only thing different is that he bets on boxing, and i on Dota. Which is irrelevant. Unless he changes his mind, and i don't really see it happening tbh. And looking back, there are more cases exactly like this, not just this one and mine.

[pytycrys]

@Betpanda

We are still waiting for a response and an update to my previous message.

@holydarkness

I can't help but notice that you had no more thoughts since the Betpanda reply? Would you mind sharing your thoughts? Is this a 'resolved' case as well, where Betpanda is in the right and the player is in the wrong?

[Rating Place]

@Betpanda

We are still waiting for a response and an update to my previous message.

@holydarkness

I can't help but notice that you had no more thoughts since the Betpanda reply? Would you mind sharing your thoughts? Is this a 'resolved' case as well, where Betpanda is in the right and the player is in the wrong?

BetPanda's an awful book. It doesn't seem as though they are going to listen to any of us. This case shouldn't be listed resolved.

[T1HGO]

@Betpanda

We are still waiting for a response and an update to my previous message.

@holydarkness

I can't help but notice that you had no more thoughts since the Betpanda reply? Would you mind sharing your thoughts? Is this a 'resolved' case as well, where Betpanda is in the right and the player is in the wrong?

Kinda off-topicish, but have you seen the case going on right now about Jackpotter? link if you didn't:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5577803.0

This further proves what i've been saying for 11 months. And discredits even more betpanda's reasons in every case against them in this forum.

[pytycrys]

Thanks for raising that, T1HGO

Thanks for all the help @Rating Place as well.

That further proves that the power lies within the casino itself as well, not only in Betby.

This should set an example to Betpanda and prove that they can solve this situation as well if they are committed to having a reputable casino.

@cryptofrka
@AHOYBRAUSE
@yahoo62278
@Fortify
@bitbollo

Can I get a bit of support / help here? No idea how to tag people but hopefully that does it.