Investigation Complete of Instamines and Fastmines for almost every top alt coin

[reRaise]

No, it does not mean that "few" could take part.  It only means blocks passed by faster than normal.

The market already takes the flood of coins into account as well, and the coins are priced accordingly to that metric on the exchanges upon release.  This means in the majority of cases, it would have been more profitable to mine LTC, then sell it to purchase the other coin.  I know this holds true for Vertcoin & Dogecoin.  Where is the early miner advantage then?  There is none.  The early miner is not rewarded at all.  The smart exchange trader is the person rewarded.

You have to take into account average mining profit per megahash per day.  I mined Vertcoin at release.  Each day I was making less than mining Litecoin.  I, and the other thousands of miners didn't know if the coin would even live or die, of if we would make a cent from it.  Nobody knew if they should hold, or try and sell for less than Litecoin profit before it went down lower.  Miners in this regard are gamblers.  They're gambling with their time and money.  

Out of the available pools, every single one was being DOS'd for days as well.  You literally had to sit at your computer 24 hours a day configuring pools and miners, all the while being rewarded for less than Litecoin profit.

For this reason, coins like Dogecoin and Vertcoin don't belong in that list.  There are coins that exist where early miners were rewarded far higher than normal mining profits for the day though.  The ones I talked about just aren't one of them.  To make anything on Doge or VTC, you really had to make somewhat of a long term investment that was available to anyone.

Anyone could have bought VTC on exchange for .00005, held for a few weeks, then have it turn into .005

Look at my quote below and time stamp, that's about 10 days after the coin had already been released and the coin is worth absolutely nothing.

That's in the first few days. What about the first few hours when most of the instamine took place?

The first 4 hours mining in VTC produced about 304,000 coins, instead of the 4800 coins that should have been minted in that time, i.e. about 300,000 extra coins. If we make an assumption that the dev got 150,000 of those (just an example), then those were worth 7.5 BTC at your 0.00005 rate. Had the instamine not happened, and the dev (believing in his own coin) had bought 150,000 coins, then he would have had to pay maybe 30 BTC instead (without the huge extra supply in the early days, and with a 150,000 coin buy pressure, the price would have gone up). As it happened the coin took off and 150,000 VTC became worth more like 300 BTC.

+1 also 600,000 VTC were created in roughly 30 hours

[1714540558]

1714540558

[Whoisthelorax]

ultracoin had a 2% pre-mine, there are a total of 100,000,000 coins to be created, 2% of 100,000,000 is 2mil.
Premine: 2% (1.6% IPO / 0.3% DEV / 0.1% REWARDS)
the IPO was shared so that not one person could buy all the coins.... seems pretty fair to me or am I missing something?

Could you show me where that information is displayed on the www.ultracoin.net website? I couldn't find that.

Also, its "fair" when you allow the person benefitting the most to describe was it happening.


To the investor wanting to buy a coin RIGHT NOW, that 2 million premine represents nearly 15% of the current totals.

A big difference that they don't want the regular person to realize...

[minip]

the information is found here https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=413978.0

[Whoisthelorax]

the information is found here https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=413978.0

...which is precisely my point, hidden in the bitcointalk.org forums.

[illodin]

Is this the thread where I can cry if I missed a lunch?

[Spoetnik]

No, it does not mean that "few" could take part.  It only means blocks passed by faster than normal.

The market already takes the flood of coins into account as well, and the coins are priced accordingly to that metric on the exchanges upon release.  This means in the majority of cases, it would have been more profitable to mine LTC, then sell it to purchase the other coin.  I know this holds true for Vertcoin & Dogecoin.  Where is the early miner advantage then?  There is none.  The early miner is not rewarded at all.  The smart exchange trader is the person rewarded.

You have to take into account average mining profit per megahash per day.  I mined Vertcoin at release.  Each day I was making less than mining Litecoin.  I, and the other thousands of miners didn't know if the coin would even live or die, of if we would make a cent from it.  Nobody knew if they should hold, or try and sell for less than Litecoin profit before it went down lower.  Miners in this regard are gamblers.  They're gambling with their time and money.  

Out of the available pools, every single one was being DOS'd for days as well.  You literally had to sit at your computer 24 hours a day configuring pools and miners, all the while being rewarded for less than Litecoin profit.

For this reason, coins like Dogecoin and Vertcoin don't belong in that list.  There are coins that exist where early miners were rewarded far higher than normal mining profits for the day though.  The ones I talked about just aren't one of them.  To make anything on Doge or VTC, you really had to make somewhat of a long term investment that was available to anyone.

Anyone could have bought VTC on exchange for .00005, held for a few weeks, then have it turn into .005

Look at my quote below and time stamp, that's about 10 days after the coin had already been released and the coin is worth absolutely nothing.

That's in the first few days. What about the first few hours when most of the instamine took place?

The first 4 hours mining in VTC produced about 304,000 coins, instead of the 4800 coins that should have been minted in that time, i.e. about 300,000 extra coins. If we make an assumption that the dev got 150,000 of those (just an example), then those were worth 7.5 BTC at your 0.00005 rate. Had the instamine not happened, and the dev (believing in his own coin) had bought 150,000 coins, then he would have had to pay maybe 30 BTC instead (without the huge extra supply in the early days, and with a 150,000 coin buy pressure, the price would have gone up). As it happened the coin took off and 150,000 VTC became worth more like 300 BTC.

+1 also 600,000 VTC were created in roughly 30 hours

and Dark coin was way worse and they even admitted it and proposed ideas to fix it like giving coins away.
vs
Vertcoin where they admitted fuck all !

nice try spreading FUD on VTC lol

one is guilty and one is not.. fact.

[Spoetnik]

let me save the trouble..

Popular coins are instamined.

Yup.

that is all there is to it lol

so any coin that is popular is a huge instamine scam then lol

i've also had to say this dozens of times lately.. tiring bs.

have guess what... read ?

@illodin bingo

[Whoisthelorax]

Is this the thread where I can cry if I missed a lunch?

no, but since you advertise darkcoin and blackcoin in your signature, would care to address the problems brought up in the article about these coins?

What makes you confident about Blackcoin's 50 million mined coins in 3 days?

What makes you confident about Darkcoin's 1.6 million instamine in its first 8 hours? there are about 4.2 million coins today.

[Whoisthelorax]

Added...


Particle
Limecoin
XXL coin
Hobonickels
Myriadcoin
fluttercoin

[DemetriusAstroBlack]

Great article and data.  Keep up the work and thank you.

[wasamata]

Are you like, deliberately excluding the worst distributed coin of all, NXT?
Theres no excuse pal, it is up there on the high market cap list.
Here you go: NXT coin-100 % insta pre mine shared by 70 early adopters.

[notsoshifty]

Are you like, deliberately excluding the worst distributed coin of all, NXT?
Theres no excuse pal, it is up there on the high market cap list.
Here you go: NXT coin-100 % insta pre mine shared by 70 early adopters.

Well, first line say "Second generation coins like Ripple, Mastercoin, Counterparty, etc are not incuded in this discussion.", so yes it seems it was deliberately excluded.

Like it or lump it (I'm in the latter camp btw), NXT's distribution model was as it was, and only time will tell how much that is holding it back. But everything about the initial distribution is out in the open; nothing is hidden. The coins discussed in this article have large premines / fastmines / instamines that are hidden from sight and denied by the coin's core team; and any talk of them in the coin's thread marks you as a whining ranter (so they go off and make a moderated thread instead).

Put aside the "NXT, fair or not?" debate (which everyone knows about), and let the scope of the study be what it is.

[Daedelus]

Are you like, deliberately excluding the worst distributed coin of all, NXT?
Theres no excuse pal, it is up there on the high market cap list.
Here you go: NXT coin-100 % insta pre mine shared by 70 early adopters.

There were 6 weeks to join the IPO for Nxt and coins* were distributed on a proportion of how much BTC you gave. This was also capped at a maximum of 1 BTC. i.e. if you gave 0.1% of funds collected you got 0.1% of the coins, 5% of what was collected you get 5% of the coins.

Only 100 or so people came forward in 6 weeks and then only 73 of those claimed the coins that they were entitled to. They understood, as the first POS, that nobody would join them if they hoarded their coins so there was an orgy of bounties, selling and giveaways. When comparing POS coins, perhaps this period should be judged as the distribution phase? Which pure POS have the fastest dilution of the initial founders stakes? As the nature of pure POS requires all coins to be created at once. If there were only 73 holders now then Nxt wouldn't be valued at 10s of millions of dollars.

The tech was then released and this is what gave the coin its value when people understood what was being built. It also has provided the funds to build, arguably, the most advanced cryptographic platform devised so far (I won't go into details to avoid looking like advertising but start another thread and we can discuss it there).

Finally, the initial distribution is moot as the distribution between accounts now is better than bitcoin's and improving slowly all the time, all achieved in a few months. I can dig out the links if the auther would like to see them.


I for one would welcome the author's inclusion of Nxt for all to see, as I think wasamata would be surprised that it would come out the other side with a good overall report. Though comparison should be to Ripple, Counterparty and Mastercoin as you would comparing apples with oranges. These are also striving to beyond being solely a currency.


*(these are not generally referred to as coins as this limits what Nxt actually is peoples minds, they are more generally considered tokens for the Nxt Crypto Platform's features)

P.S. I wasn't one of the 73!  

[illodin]

Is this the thread where I can cry if I missed a lunch?

no, but since you advertise darkcoin and blackcoin in your signature, would care to address the problems brought up in the article about these coins?

What makes you confident about Blackcoin's 50 million mined coins in 3 days?

What makes you confident about Darkcoin's 1.6 million instamine in its first 8 hours? there are about 4.2 million coins today.

Dunno what's there to address. I saw the pre-announcements and specs for both those coins and immediately noticed the value in them. I was ready at the launch and started mining them. There were no problems for me.

What I have a problem with though, is people who are too lazy to do any research on what coins are being launched and what their potential is. So they just mine whatever they mine (doge or ltc probably) and when some other coin starts gaining value they become pissed they didn't mine at start. So basically they want to let everyone else take the risk on new coins and when on some rare occasion that risk pays off they become jealous.

[Lauda]

Is this the thread where I can cry if I missed a lunch?

Yeah, and because you've missed the launch, it is instamined. 

[Viscis]

What a shallow analysis.

[Daedelus]

What a shallow analysis.

I look forward to reading your improvements. Please post the link here when you have uploaded it.

This and your coming analysis is good for the crypto world as it is "cross-crypto" so bias will be minimised.

[r0ach]

Honestly, when you don't even mention the fact that things like KGW came late to the crypto scene and most coins didn't launch with them, and then don't even mention NXT distribution once, this analysis could not be more bogus.

I'm too lazy to look at original poster's post history, but I think it will turn out he's trying to promote some ridiculous coin nobody has ever heard of that has a seemingly fair mine because 0 people mined it like the Cryptoshekel: 

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=394123.0

[Lauda]

Honestly, when you don't even mention the fact that things like KGW came late to the crypto scene and most coins didn't launch with them, and then don't even mention NXT distribution once, this analysis could not be more bogus.

I'm too lazy to look at original poster's post history, but I think it will turn out he's trying to promote some ridiculous coin nobody has ever heard of that has a seemingly fair mine because 0 people mined it like the Cryptoshekel: 

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=394123.0

That coin is just weird. From the name to the logo.

[bl0ckchain]

This article is pretty much useless as it provides a single one-dimensional view of each currency.

For example in the case of instamines, you provide no blockchain data, no distribution data (bounties, giveaways), etc., and fail to consider the entire history of the coin. I would love to know the motivation behind the spin.