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Question: Should "bits" become the standard for merchant pricing, wallets and general usage.
Bitcoin best as the common unit. 0.001234 is ok - 108 (14.1%)
milliBitcoins (thousandths) are best - 90 (11.7%)
Bits (millionths) are best - 570 (74.2%)
Total Voters: 768

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Author Topic: 1,000,000 bits = 1 bitcoin. Future-proofing Bitcoin for common usage? VOTE  (Read 56180 times)
BlueBitAUT
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May 04, 2014, 03:02:26 PM
 #181

Crosspost from Coindesk:

I totally disagree to change it to "bits"!
Most people I know, that aren't so involved with "that Internet and computerstuff" AKA the masses and majority of older businessowners that don't deal with IT.
They are glad, they can finally use a Smartphone, send an E-Mail, they know their SDcard or HDD "has a lot of Gigabyte" if you ask them for the Processor...
There are too many "bits & bytes" already in the daily life and the only thing happening with this change is: even more confusion!
If we don't avoid this, we are making Bitcoins even more complicated to understand for everyone else.

Most of them just recently learned, that a digital photo consumes 3 Megabyte of Diskspace
and are still highly confused about the difference to their ISP's provider (Megabits) Bandwidth and all that stuff.
If you link Bitcoin to "bits", the first thing to happen is like "oh, so i could store millions /160gigabits on my Flashmemory?"
or "Oh, but i have slow 1mbit Internetconnection ; only low datavolume to spend per month...can i transfer so much of them with it? doesn't sound fast/safe/cheap."

There has to be a simpler way: Euro/Dollar + Cents / Bitcoin + MSat (Megasatoshis) !?
I don't know...there are already enough suggestions and options to do so.
But for the sake of sooner mass adoption, please - do not use "bits" as a Bitcoin unit. Name it more unique.

my 2 satoshis
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Gaman
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May 04, 2014, 03:07:43 PM
 #182

too many terms.... bits satoshi .... sooo confusing.
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May 04, 2014, 03:36:49 PM
 #183

If we're going to do bits we might as well go all the way down to satoshis.  I've found it easiest to just think in them.

Fun poll, thanks!
fryarminer
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May 04, 2014, 03:45:56 PM
 #184

Crosspost from Coindesk:

I totally disagree to change it to "bits"!
Most people I know, that aren't so involved with "that Internet and computerstuff" AKA the masses and majority of older businessowners that don't deal with IT.
They are glad, they can finally use a Smartphone, send an E-Mail, they know their SDcard or HDD "has a lot of Gigabyte" if you ask them for the Processor...
There are too many "bits & bytes" already in the daily life and the only thing happening with this change is: even more confusion!
If we don't avoid this, we are making Bitcoins even more complicated to understand for everyone else.

Most of them just recently learned, that a digital photo consumes 3 Megabyte of Diskspace
and are still highly confused about the difference to their ISP's provider (Megabits) Bandwidth and all that stuff.
If you link Bitcoin to "bits", the first thing to happen is like "oh, so i could store millions /160gigabits on my Flashmemory?"
or "Oh, but i have slow 1mbit Internetconnection ; only low datavolume to spend per month...can i transfer so much of them with it? doesn't sound fast/safe/cheap."

There has to be a simpler way: Euro/Dollar + Cents / Bitcoin + MSat (Megasatoshis) !?
I don't know...there are already enough suggestions and options to do so.
But for the sake of sooner mass adoption, please - do not use "bits" as a Bitcoin unit. Name it more unique.

my 2 satoshis


I completely disagree. There's nothing more simple than to explain to someone tech-illiterate that a "bit" is a small part of a "bitcoin".


Gyrsur
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May 04, 2014, 03:50:43 PM
 #185

If we're going to do bits we might as well go all the way down to satoshis.  I've found it easiest to just think in them.

Fun poll, thanks!

true, but you cannot divide a satoshi. common is to have a unit and 2 decimal digits. base unit will be 100 sats where a name should found for it.

1 'base unit' = 100 sats

a cup of coffee: 10,000 'base units' (10,000 x $.00045)

at the moment the 2 decimal digits are irrelevant.

"Hi, I want to buy a cup of coffee, please." - "Sure, this will cost you 10,000 bits." - "Fine, I'll take it."
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May 04, 2014, 03:51:22 PM
 #186

Millibits (mBTC) and microbits (uBTC) are already used. If you want to use whole numbers, just use Satoshis and stop trying to force this US ignorance of the metric system on the rest of the world.

Renaming "microbit" to "bit" is pure insanity.

This poll is incredibly flawed.
fryarminer
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May 04, 2014, 03:58:18 PM
 #187

Millibits (mBTC) and microbits (uBTC) are already used. If you want to use whole numbers, just use Satoshis and stop trying to force this US ignorance of the metric system on the rest of the world.

Renaming "microbit" to "bit" is pure insanity.

Let's look at the other side of this argument. Suppose everyone was talking kilometers. "Wow, I'm home from work, tired, and I have to walk 0.000032 Kilometers to the fridge to get a beer!"
That's what's happening now with bitcoin.
Instead we have the concept of "meters", and go up and down from there.

The term "bit" is an excellent equivalent for "meters". A bitcoin would be the full measurement of bits. A satoshi would be 100 bits. But in day-to-day talk, we would talk about bits. "This cold beer cost me 25 bits!"

So no. It's not US ignorance.
Mabsark
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May 04, 2014, 04:08:06 PM
 #188

Millibits (mBTC) and microbits (uBTC) are already used. If you want to use whole numbers, just use Satoshis and stop trying to force this US ignorance of the metric system on the rest of the world.

Renaming "microbit" to "bit" is pure insanity.

Let's look at the other side of this argument. Suppose everyone was talking kilometers. "Wow, I'm home from work, tired, and I have to walk 0.000032 Kilometers to the fridge to get a beer!"
That's what's happening now with bitcoin.
Instead we have the concept of "meters", and go up and down from there.

The term "bit" is an excellent equivalent for "meters". A bitcoin would be the full measurement of bits. A satoshi would be 100 bits. But in day-to-day talk, we would talk about bits. "This cold beer cost me 25 bits!"

So no. It's not US ignorance.


Nonsense. The term "bitcoin" is already directly equivalent to the term "metre". Your example just shows that this is US ignorance. Nobody in their right mind would say 0.000032 km, they would say 32 millimetres. How the hell do you walk 32 mm to get to your fridge?
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May 04, 2014, 04:11:32 PM
 #189

If we're going to do bits we might as well go all the way down to satoshis.  I've found it easiest to just think in them.

Fun poll, thanks!

true, but you cannot divide a satoshi. common is to have a unit and 2 decimal digits. base unit will be 100 sats where a name should found for it.

1 'base unit' = 100 sats

a cup of coffee: 10,000 'base units' (10,000 x $.00045)

at the moment the 2 decimal digits are irrelevant.

"Hi, I want to buy a cup of coffee, please." - "Sure, this will cost you 10,000 bits." - "Fine, I'll take it."

and bits are very cheap at the moment! but this decision will have an impact on serveral things in the whole Bitcoin community. (exchanges, micro transactions, etc.)

but it is necesarry now, IMHO! we are not far away from release 1.0 of Bitcoin (maybe 2015?)
fryarminer
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May 04, 2014, 04:15:03 PM
 #190

Millibits (mBTC) and microbits (uBTC) are already used. If you want to use whole numbers, just use Satoshis and stop trying to force this US ignorance of the metric system on the rest of the world.

Renaming "microbit" to "bit" is pure insanity.

Let's look at the other side of this argument. Suppose everyone was talking kilometers. "Wow, I'm home from work, tired, and I have to walk 0.000032 Kilometers to the fridge to get a beer!"
That's what's happening now with bitcoin.
Instead we have the concept of "meters", and go up and down from there.

The term "bit" is an excellent equivalent for "meters". A bitcoin would be the full measurement of bits. A satoshi would be 100 bits. But in day-to-day talk, we would talk about bits. "This cold beer cost me 25 bits!"

So no. It's not US ignorance.


Nonsense. The term "bitcoin" is already directly equivalent to the term "metre". Your example just shows that this is US ignorance. Nobody in their right mind would say 0.000032 km, they would say 32 millimetres. How the hell do you walk 32 mm to get to your fridge?


I agree. I am ignorant. So what is the equivalent of kilometers, (or kilometers if you wish)? Kilabitcoins?
BlueBitAUT
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May 04, 2014, 04:15:20 PM
 #191

Crosspost from Coindesk:

I totally disagree to change it to "bits"!
*text removed*
There has to be a simpler way: Euro/Dollar + Cents / Bitcoin + MSat (Megasatoshis) !?
I don't know...there are already enough suggestions and options to do so.
But for the sake of sooner mass adoption, please - do not use "bits" as a Bitcoin unit. Name it more unique.

my 2 satoshis


I completely disagree. There's nothing more simple than to explain to someone tech-illiterate that a "bit" is a small part of a "bitcoin".


Try it.
A "bit" has already too many meanings.
In the language itself but also in technical-everyday-stuff that Average Joe is already confronted to deal with.
It is another "obstacle" that leads to more questions in an "first time Bitcoin conversation"
and i hope you agree, that the last thing we need in promoting/education on Bitcoin, are more "obstacles".

fryarminer
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May 04, 2014, 04:24:52 PM
 #192

Crosspost from Coindesk:

I totally disagree to change it to "bits"!
*text removed*
There has to be a simpler way: Euro/Dollar + Cents / Bitcoin + MSat (Megasatoshis) !?
I don't know...there are already enough suggestions and options to do so.
But for the sake of sooner mass adoption, please - do not use "bits" as a Bitcoin unit. Name it more unique.

my 2 satoshis


I completely disagree. There's nothing more simple than to explain to someone tech-illiterate that a "bit" is a small part of a "bitcoin".


Try it.
A "bit" has already too many meanings.
In the language itself but also in technical-everyday-stuff that Average Joe is already confronted to deal with.
It is another "obstacle" that leads to more questions in an "first time Bitcoin conversation"
and i hope you agree, that the last thing we need in promoting/education on Bitcoin, are more "obstacles".



Trust me, I talk about bitcoin all the time. I don't see it as a problem. It's something that people would smile at and accept.
"This is a satoshi. It is the smallest denomination.
This is a bit. It's a little bit of a bitcoin.
This is a bitcoin. It is the full measurement."
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May 04, 2014, 04:26:13 PM
 #193

I think until microtransactions and dust spending is brought back, the bit argument is moot.

Explaining to people that sending them 1,000 bits will cost them 11,000 bits makes it more confusing than it is now.

I'm not saying I'm against it, but I'm not for it right now.

The Bitcoin Museum is back under my control, but I still need to go through all the code. DO NOT PURCHASE ANYTHING FROM IT

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Mabsark
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May 04, 2014, 04:26:35 PM
 #194

I agree. I am ignorant. So what is the equivalent of kilometers, (or kilometers if you wish)? Kilabitcoins?

That would be kilobitcoin which people would then likely shorten to kilobit, which could be rather confusing. For some reason though, people tend not to use prefixes for large amounts of currency so most people would simply say 1,000 bitcoins rather than kilobitcoin and 1,000,000 bitcoins rather than Megabitcoin.
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May 04, 2014, 04:46:08 PM
 #195

I agree. I am ignorant. So what is the equivalent of kilometers, (or kilometers if you wish)? Kilabitcoins?

That would be kilobitcoin which people would then likely shorten to kilobit, which could be rather confusing. For some reason though, people tend not to use prefixes for large amounts of currency so most people would simply say 1,000 bitcoins rather than kilobitcoin and 1,000,000 bitcoins rather than Megabitcoin.

So many opinions, practice will decide what terms are used among the terms available or the fondation will impose some terms

Millibits (mBTC) and microbits (uBTC) are already used. If you want to use whole numbers, just use Satoshis and stop trying to force this US ignorance of the metric system on the rest of the world.

Renaming "microbit" to "bit" is pure insanity.

Let's look at the other side of this argument. Suppose everyone was talking kilometers. "Wow, I'm home from work, tired, and I have to walk 0.000032 Kilometers to the fridge to get a beer!"
That's what's happening now with bitcoin.
Instead we have the concept of "meters", and go up and down from there.

The term "bit" is an excellent equivalent for "meters". A bitcoin would be the full measurement of bits. A satoshi would be 100 bits. But in day-to-day talk, we would talk about bits. "This cold beer cost me 25 bits!"

So no. It's not US ignorance.


a bit will be 100satoshis

fryarminer
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May 04, 2014, 04:54:08 PM
 #196

Quote


The term "bit" is an excellent equivalent for "meters". A bitcoin would be the full measurement of bits. A satoshi would be 100 bits. But in day-to-day talk, we would talk about bits. "This cold beer cost me 25 bits!"

So no. It's not US ignorance.


a bit will be 100satoshis

hahaha! yeah. Like the guy insulting Americans was saying, I'm ignorant! I guess I could call it an "error de dedo" though!
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May 04, 2014, 05:07:38 PM
 #197

I think until microtransactions and dust spending is brought back, the bit argument is moot.

Explaining to people that sending them 1,000 bits will cost them 11,000 bits makes it more confusing than it is now.

I'm not saying I'm against it, but I'm not for it right now.
let 1 btc = 1,000,000 bits = $500

10,000 bits = $5

default fee = 0.5 cent = 100 bits

miner's fee will become variable soon, so this may all be moot
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May 04, 2014, 05:10:50 PM
 #198

Bits gets my vote, simple catchy, leaves 2 decimal points in the existing system and enough scope for growth. Even if a rise in the value of Bitcoin is slow, its still fine, plenty of currencies around the world deal in higher figures. Just think back to Italy before they had the euro with 10,000, 20,000 and 50,000 Lira notes.

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May 04, 2014, 05:50:13 PM
 #199

Bits should be designated as the FOURTH decimal place since it's the midpoint between Bitcoins and Satoshis.

The sixth place lacks symmetry vis-a-vis the already accepted and undisputed designations of Bitcoin and Satoshi. Why would you go so far into the decimal places to split the range like this when you have a midpoint staring you in the face?

When you have a major denomination at the midpoint, then you maximize the efficiency of the numbers. You'll never have to deal with a number greater than 10,000 when you are to the right of the decimal. A Bit would be 10,000 Satoshis, and a Bitcoin would be 10,000 Bits.

Isn't this more intuitive and natural?


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May 04, 2014, 06:08:17 PM
 #200

Bits should be designated as the FOURTH decimal place since it's the midpoint between Bitcoins and Satoshis.

The sixth place lacks symmetry vis-a-vis the already accepted and undisputed designations of Bitcoin and Satoshi. Why would you go so far into the decimal places to split the range like this when you have a midpoint staring you in the face?

When you have a major denomination at the midpoint, then you maximize the efficiency of the numbers. You'll never have to deal with a number greater than 10,000 when you are to the right of the decimal. A Bit would be 10,000 Satoshis, and a Bitcoin would be 10,000 Bits.

Isn't this more intuitive and natural?

The whole point is not about symmetry or aesthetics. The reason for this specific decimal place is so that 100 Satoshis are 1.00 bit. So that a bit has 2 decimal places which is imperative if you want to be compatible with established financial processing software, because basically any currency has 2 decimal places.
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