Why not to trade with guaranteed profit?

[RCreator]

I can see lot of guys trading with risks of losing money while trading.
Why not to trade just with shares which price cannot go down? (like super shares on x-value)
I think it's more clever and practical action.

Please write only real answers and thoughts without stupid comments like "It is all a scam".
I want to discuss it with users who tried some trade platforms like cryptsy, x-value or even forex. Admins of sites like DICEs please do not post here without describing your mind constructively.

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[Bogleg]

There is always 2 sides on every transaction. If one side is making sure profit, who is going to take the other side of a trade?

[jonald_fyookball]

Super shares appears to be what is called a "Ponzi scheme".  What this means is that investors are paid profits from the money of investors who come later.  How else do you think they run such an operation?

There is no magic way to trade with a guaranteed profit.

The closest thing to risk-free investing is to put your money in the bank where you can earn a nominal interest rate.  With a slight risk, you can earn higher returns.  The more risk you take on, the more you can make...but there is always a trade off.  You generally cannot get high return and low risk at the same time. 

There are legitimate way to make your money work for you...they require due diligence and
reasonable expectations.  Again, there is always a balance of risk and reward.

Be real, do not be greedy.

The sooner you can accept and understand this, the better off you will be.

[RCreator]

Super shares appears to be what is called a "Ponzi scheme".  What this means is that investors are paid profits from the money of investors who come later.  How else do you think they run such an operation?

There is no magic way to trade with a guaranteed profit.

The closest thing to risk-free investing is to put your money in the bank where you can earn a nominal interest rate.  With a slight risk, you can earn higher returns.  The more risk you take on, the more you can make...but there is always a trade off.  You generally cannot get high return and low risk at the same time. 

There are legitimate way to make your money work for you...they require due diligence and
reasonable expectations.  Again, there is always a balance of risk and reward.

Be real, do not be greedy.

The sooner you can accept and understand this, the better off you will be.

Thank you for an explanation, but I want to understand.
In case of Ponzi scheme the owner of website pays to old members with the money of new members.
And if there will be no new members, the money of last members will be paid to first members, and last members will lose their money. It is a risk of loosing money. Maybe normal stock trading is same or better than Ponzi.
Why you prefer trading instead of investing in Ponzi?

And ok.

But in case of x-value.com there is not a Ponzi scheme, because you can buy Super Shares in more higher price, than sell. So, that is the type of stock market too.

Do you have any more minds why normal trading is better than trading with guaranteed profit?
Or it is not?

Of course, I am trading always with taking the risks, and never will invest my last money, but I have some free funds to invest and trying to make a decision.

[jonald_fyookball]

Super shares appears to be what is called a "Ponzi scheme".  What this means is that investors are paid profits from the money of investors who come later.  How else do you think they run such an operation?

There is no magic way to trade with a guaranteed profit.

The closest thing to risk-free investing is to put your money in the bank where you can earn a nominal interest rate.  With a slight risk, you can earn higher returns.  The more risk you take on, the more you can make...but there is always a trade off.  You generally cannot get high return and low risk at the same time. 

There are legitimate way to make your money work for you...they require due diligence and
reasonable expectations.  Again, there is always a balance of risk and reward.

Be real, do not be greedy.

The sooner you can accept and understand this, the better off you will be.

Thank you for an explanation, but I want to understand.
In case of Ponzi scheme the owner of website pays to old members with the money of new members.
And if there will be no new members, the money of last members will be paid to first members, and last members will lose their money. It is a risk of loosing money. Maybe normal stock trading is same or better than Ponzi.
Why you prefer trading instead of investing in Ponzi?

And ok.

But in case of x-value.com there is not a Ponzi scheme, because you can buy Super Shares in more higher price, than sell. So, that is the type of stock market too.

Do you have any more minds why normal trading is better than trading with guaranteed profit?
Or it is not?

Of course, I am trading always with taking the risks, and never will invest my last money, but I have some free funds to invest and trying to make a decision.

Well, you are correct -- the last people to join will lose all their money.

The actual risk is unknown -- you do not know the probability
that you will get an increase in your money, or lose it.
Do you even have proof that some people are getting money
back?

Maybe there is 70% chance to make 10% profits and 30% chance
to lose 100%.  That is not good odds.

But the thing is you just don't know.

The bottom line is: why would you risk your money when you don't know the
probabilities?  Then it just becomes a total gamble. 

[burnettm]

The bottom line is: why would you risk your money when you don't know theprobabilities?  Then it just becomes a total gamble.  

Because he is a obvious shill and thinks there are greater fools here. And why is it that the most blatant of scams I see pitched here are always from people speaking broken English?

Just looking at their records make this even more laughable. The contact address listed on their website is in Switzerland for a company called "SM Investment Tools, LLC", but their domain is registered to a German company "OS Comp LTD" with a email address from a free Russian webmail provider "yandex.ru", and the domain registrar is from a Russian company "webnames.ru". The address for the Swiss company actually belongs to "peppi’s deli-cious food" according to Yelp. And the address for the German company actually belongs to "Alliance Virtual Office" which offers "Live Receptionists & Virtual Office Services".

So basically this is some dumb Russian who can't even put up a believable front trying to scam Americans, because he thinks they're dumber than him.

Ivan plz go.

Company Address
https://x-value.com/about

WHOIS DNS Records
http://who.is/whois/x-value.com

Swiss Company Address
http://www.yelp.com/biz/peppis-deli-cious-food-bern

German Company Address
http://www.alliancevirtualoffices.com/DE/wittestrasse-30-k-virtual-office-3127

[RCreator]

Because he is a obvious shill and thinks there are greater fools here.
Ivan plz go.

Do you mean me?
Am I shill?
Well, I typed in my first post, please keep of comments that all is scam. It's nothing when you say that x-value is a scam. I think, you are only skeptical one. But it is not good when you are saying that I am a scammer or shill.
Please look again at this thread and find my ref link? Can you see it? Why should I promote another site without ref link? Or do you think is it my site? I would like it to be. But than I would buy advertisements on other sites and did not spend my time on forum with 150 views of the theme.

English is not my first language, but it is stupid to say that I think that you are foolish, because I make a mistakes in my words.

Before your comment, yesterday I put 10 BTC to the x-value.com site. And you are saying I am fool, because Ivan cheated me.

I think, that x-value owners just used different offshore companies for their business and to own a domain. You also forget to note, that it is hosted in NETHERLANDS.

Please, just know that you are totally wrong because of your loser mind.
Yes, you have loser mind.
Because you think that the site is scam, people will lose money, I am bad man who want to make you foolish, and all is going against you.

But, because you are thinking like looser, you can think, that I lie to you. But please, do not post here.
I wanted to discuss the possibility to making money and why one trading system is better or not than another.
And you are just offended me personally, saying THAT I AM OBVIOUS SHILL. Buhaha ))) Yes i am, without my ref link.

[burnettm]

Do you mean me? Am I shill?

No, the other guy speaking broken English in this thread is the shill, you're completely legit.

Well, I typed in my first post, please keep of comments that all is scam.

Oh right, if you ask people not to call you a scammer, they totally won't. My bad, I totally screwed up here, I wont let it happen again.

Please look again at this thread and find my ref link? Can you see it? Why should I promote another site without ref link? Or do you think is it my site? I would like it to be.

Please see the English definition of the word "shill":
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/shill

shill [shil]
noun
1.
a person who poses as a customer in order to decoy others into participating, as at a gambling house, auction, confidence game, etc.
2.
a person who publicizes or praises something or someone for reasons of self-interest, personal profit, or friendship or loyalty.

English is not my first language

Really? I never would have guessed.

Before your comment, yesterday I put 10 BTC to the x-value.com site. And you are saying I am fool, because Ivan cheated me.

I'm sure you did, no one would ever lie on the internet.

I think, that x-value owners just used different offshore companies for their business and to own a domain.

Did you read my post? The address they listed as theirs belongs to a deli. Looking at StreetView on Google Maps verifies it is a deli.

Please, just know that you are totally wrong because of your loser mind. Yes, you have loser mind.

Right... because I don't buy in to your Ponzi scheme, I'm a loser. The guy trying to scam people with a poorly put together Ponzi scheme and sock puppet shill account however is the epitome of success.

But please, do not post here.

Ok, sure thing, I'll just go delete my account now.

[wachtwoord]

Wost scam ever.

[anti-dot]

Wost scam ever.

Please read https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=577679.msg6944217#msg6944217
Also, are you the owner of DICE site? Site, where people can lose all their money?
Are you not a scammer? Why am I? Come on, explain it.

[wachtwoord]

Wost scam ever.

Please read https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=577679.msg6944217#msg6944217
Also, are you the owner of DICE site? Site, where people can lose all their money?
Are you not a scammer? Why am I? Come on, explain it.

I do not own a DICE site, not have I ever in the past. You are a scammer because you're advocating a ponzi with is a scam.

[burnettm]

And one of Sergi's sock puppet accounts sent me this threat last night at 4AM. I dunno who the hell bitcoin-trader.biz is, or why he thinks I would care about them. From my private messages:

Man, if you will not stop black PR in my affiliate section, I will buy some forum posters and they all will post that https://bitcoin-trader.biz is a scam. I will pay you the same way, if you will not stop. You will lose much more, if you will make a bad reputation for me. Make a good reputation for your site instead. Buy the way, your site is clean Ponzi, but is it ok for you, is not it?

So go ahead Dimitri, go fuck up bitcoin-trader.biz, I really dont care.

[anti-dot]

Wost scam ever.

Please read https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=577679.msg6944217#msg6944217
Also, are you the owner of DICE site? Site, where people can lose all their money?
Are you not a scammer? Why am I? Come on, explain it.

I do not own a DICE site, not have I ever in the past. You are a scammer because you're advocating a ponzi with is a scam.

If you do not own a dice site, why do you have it in your signature?

I am just promoting one site for ref awards, it's not a ponzi, but you even did not checked it. Even if it would be a ponzi, and what? I can post about ponzi or about any gambling site in the gambling section, why not?

[wachtwoord]

If you do not own a dice site, why do you have it in your signature?

Because the owner is paying me (and many others) for the privilege.

I am just promoting one site for ref awards, it's not a ponzi, but you even did not checked it. Even if it would be a ponzi, and what? I can post about ponzi or about any gambling site in the gambling section, why not?

Because with gambling sites everything is clear: e.g. what are the odds? You're claiming to be an investment. You most definitely are not. That is what we call scamming.

[burnettm]

I am just promoting one site for ref awards, it's not a ponzi

Your site is the very definition of a Ponzi scheme.

Even if it would be a ponzi, and what? I can post about ponzi or about any gambling site in the gambling section, why not?

You're getting your shill threads and sock puppet accounts mixed up. This thread is in the trading section, not the gambling section.


And in case anyone cares about the latest lulzy threats:

Just do not slander in my threads, otherwise I said what I will do, I do not care too. I noticed you, now it's up to you what to do. From this point I will ignore your messages to me. It looks you are evil russians hater. P. S. I am from Kazakhstan. I am not russian, I am kazakh.

[anti-dot]

You're getting your shill threads and sock puppet accounts mixed up. This thread is in the trading section, not the gambling section.

You mix me with topic starter. I created thread in the Gambling section, where you placed link to this thread.

[anti-dot]

Because with gambling sites everything is clear: e.g. what are the odds? You're claiming to be an investment. You most definitely are not. That is what we call scamming.

Ok. An investment it is when you deposit money in some places for a long time to have a profit and also you have take risks of losing money. Why stock market is investing and not just a scam? According to your logic, all investments are scam. Even banks can be closed, and you will lose money, except of cases,when your deposit is insured. Well, thank you. Maybe you just mean, that ponzi scheme are always closes in the end, that's why it is a scam? Ok, but x-value.com is not a ponzi. But I will not discuss it anymore, I am sure, you are not able to understand this. I will go sleep with my girl. Good luck

[jonald_fyookball]

Because with gambling sites everything is clear: e.g. what are the odds? You're claiming to be an investment. You most definitely are not. That is what we call scamming.

Ok. An investment it is when you deposit money in some places for a long time to have a profit and also you have take risks of losing money. Why stock market is investing and not just a scam? According to your logic, all investments are scam. Even banks can be closed, and you will lose money, except of cases,when your deposit is insured. Well, thank you. Maybe you just mean, that ponzi scheme are always closes in the end, that's why it is a scam? Ok, but x-value.com is not a ponzi. But I will not discuss it anymore, I am sure, you are not able to understand this. I will go sleep with my girl. Good luck

This comparison is idiotic.

There are legal procedures required to start a bank or list your company on a major stock exchange.  Both cost millions of dollars.  But, any clown can create a fly-by-night website for 10 bucks.

[Relnarien]

Because with gambling sites everything is clear: e.g. what are the odds? You're claiming to be an investment. You most definitely are not. That is what we call scamming.

Ok. An investment it is when you deposit money in some places for a long time to have a profit and also you have take risks of losing money. Why stock market is investing and not just a scam? According to your logic, all investments are scam. Even banks can be closed, and you will lose money, except of cases,when your deposit is insured. Well, thank you. Maybe you just mean, that ponzi scheme are always closes in the end, that's why it is a scam? Ok, but x-value.com is not a ponzi. But I will not discuss it anymore, I am sure, you are not able to understand this. I will go sleep with my girl. Good luck

To simplify things, a scam is a lie. That's basically what it is. If something is presented as something else with the intention to deceive, then that is an act of scamming. A gambling site is a gambling site -- there's nothing deceitful about it. People who join it and gamble know that there is a very high chance that they could lose their money. No one is telling them differently. Ponzi schemes are scams because their founders claim to accept money as investments but are actually only redistributing the money received from other "investors" until the system can no longer support itself and implodes.

[SOEHARTO]

i think to guarentee money is trading bitcoin .
for alt coin high profit but high risk to .
i feel that because i have case like that now ..