xf2_org
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Activity: 98
Merit: 13
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April 23, 2011, 04:26:05 PM |
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Real mature responses around here. We're sure to be taken seriously now!
+1 agreed This forum is not 4chan, people. |
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Alex Beckenham
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April 23, 2011, 05:58:46 PM |
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That's exactly what I was thinking when I first saw the carrot... it'll end up being a repeat joke.
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jtimon
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Activity: 1372
Merit: 1002
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April 23, 2011, 07:03:44 PM |
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I think he believes that money must have "intrinsic value".
Why the dolar has been valued since 1972 then?
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tomcollins
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April 23, 2011, 07:08:29 PM |
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I think he believes that money must have "intrinsic value".
Why the dolar has been valued since 1972 then?
Because you are "forced" to use it. That's certainly a good argument on why money gains value. That doesn't mean it's the only way. |
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goatpig
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Activity: 3752
Merit: 1364
Armory Developer
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April 23, 2011, 07:16:45 PM |
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I think he believes that money must have "intrinsic value".
Why the dolar has been valued since 1972 then?
Actually it's been devalued oO People might have put an increasing amount of trust in the currency but it doesn't change the fact that the value a dollar represents nowadays is less than what it was in 1972. Oppose to that, Bitcoins are gainly value on the long term. |
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no to the gold cult
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April 23, 2011, 08:22:41 PM |
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I followed that link but had to close it immediately, I am annoyed when websites presume to intrude upon my ears uninvited. |
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Raoul Duke
aka psy
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Activity: 1358
Merit: 1002
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April 23, 2011, 08:51:01 PM |
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I followed that link but had to close it immediately, I am annoyed when websites presume to intrude upon my ears uninvited. Yeah, it's not good when your boss listens to your computer playing music when you should be working  j/k  |
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dvide
Newbie
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Activity: 59
Merit: 0
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April 23, 2011, 10:41:25 PM |
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This mockery is discouraging. Nielsio is a brother in arms. Maybe he's wrong about bitcoin, and mistaken about how currency can be valuable in and of itself, but let's not straw man him. Come on guys, he doesn't support government fiat--actually listen to what he said. And he doesn't think that vegetables make a good currency obviously; vegetables was just an example of a consumption good. The pictures made me sad because it's such a straw man. Come on guys, you can try to convince him why he's wrong. He has a good following of anarcho-capitalists and voluntaryists that could get on board. Mocking him is actually a travesty  Sometimes the best way to learn is just to put your conclusions out there, but be open to being shown to be wrong. Nielsio will change his mind if you can show why he's wrong. For the record, I saw his video and it made me think about the concepts involved and about why my intuition was telling me that he was wrong. I spent all day looking into bitcoin and I think it's wonderful. Some people here have provided some good answers, explaining how the properties that make gold good as currency make people value the gold as currency by itself. His psychic powers may be scarce, but they have none of the other properties that would make it good currency (unlike gold and bitcoins too). The fact that nobody would buy his psychic power certificates is not just because it has no genuine consumption value, but mostly because it lacks the properties vladimir described. And he would be the central issuer of this currency, w here with bitcoin and gold that is not the case. And yes, the properties that make gold good as jewellery or as an electrical conductor also means people value gold for those use cases, but that's different and unrelated. The fact that gold has value for some consumption too is just a sort of 'coincidence'. Of course, nearly every material has some use for consumption but very few materials have properties that make it a good currency (silver is another good currency but unlike gold it corrodes easily). Maybe these consumption use cases helped it become established at first, but I refuse to accept that it's a necessary step. Currency in and of itself is valuable. Without it we'd be bartering, so with currency our lives are better. So if gold had no foreseeable use as a consumption good, lives would still be improved by using it as a currency because we wouldn't be bartering. So logically the properties of currency itself provide a kind of value too, solely from its use as a good medium of exchange. |
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tomcollins
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April 23, 2011, 10:48:56 PM |
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This mockery is discouraging. Nielsio is a brother in arms. Maybe he's wrong about bitcoin, and mistaken about how currency can be valuable in and of itself, but let's not straw man him. Come on guys, he doesn't support government fiat--actually listen to what he said. And he doesn't think that vegetables make a good currency obviously; vegetables was just an example of a consumption good. The pictures made me sad because it's such a straw man. Come on guys, you can try to convince him why he's wrong. He has a good following of anarcho-capitalists and voluntaryists that could get on board. Mocking him is actually a travesty Sometimes the best way to learn is just to put your conclusions out there, but be open to being shown to be wrong. Nielsio will change his mind if you can show why he's wrong. For the record, I saw his video and it made me think about the concepts involved and about why my intuition was telling me that he was wrong. I spent all day looking into bitcoin and I think it's wonderful. Some people here have provided some good answers, explaining how the properties that make gold good as currency make people value the gold as currency by itself. His psychic powers may be scarce, but they have none of the other properties that would make it good currency (unlike gold and bitcoins too). The fact that nobody would buy his psychic power certificates is not just because it has no genuine consumption value, but mostly because it lacks the properties vladimir described. And he would be the central issuer of this currency, w here with bitcoin and gold that is not the case. And yes, the properties that make gold good as jewellery or as an electrical conductor also means people value gold for those use cases, but that's different and unrelated. The fact that gold has value for some consumption too is just a sort of 'coincidence'. Of course, nearly every material has some use for consumption but very few materials have properties that make it a good currency (silver is another good currency but unlike gold it corrodes easily). Maybe these consumption use cases helped it become established at first, but I refuse to accept that it's a necessary step. Currency in and of itself is valuable. Without it we'd be bartering, so with currency our lives are better. So if gold had no foreseeable use as a consumption good, lives would still be improved by using it as a currency because we wouldn't be bartering. So logically the properties of currency itself provide a kind of value too, solely from its use as a good medium of exchange. I've dealt with Neilsio for many years, and him admitting he is wrong on ANYTHING is pretty much impossible. Even when it comes from someone he admires and respects. You will not convince him he is wrong about anything once he is convinced he knows the answer. |
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dvide
Newbie
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Activity: 59
Merit: 0
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April 23, 2011, 10:53:28 PM |
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This mockery is discouraging. Nielsio is a brother in arms. Maybe he's wrong about bitcoin, and mistaken about how currency can be valuable in and of itself, but let's not straw man him. Come on guys, he doesn't support government fiat--actually listen to what he said. And he doesn't think that vegetables make a good currency obviously; vegetables was just an example of a consumption good. The pictures made me sad because it's such a straw man. Come on guys, you can try to convince him why he's wrong. He has a good following of anarcho-capitalists and voluntaryists that could get on board. Mocking him is actually a travesty Sometimes the best way to learn is just to put your conclusions out there, but be open to being shown to be wrong. Nielsio will change his mind if you can show why he's wrong. For the record, I saw his video and it made me think about the concepts involved and about why my intuition was telling me that he was wrong. I spent all day looking into bitcoin and I think it's wonderful. Some people here have provided some good answers, explaining how the properties that make gold good as currency make people value the gold as currency by itself. His psychic powers may be scarce, but they have none of the other properties that would make it good currency (unlike gold and bitcoins too). The fact that nobody would buy his psychic power certificates is not just because it has no genuine consumption value, but mostly because it lacks the properties vladimir described. And he would be the central issuer of this currency, w here with bitcoin and gold that is not the case. And yes, the properties that make gold good as jewellery or as an electrical conductor also means people value gold for those use cases, but that's different and unrelated. The fact that gold has value for some consumption too is just a sort of 'coincidence'. Of course, nearly every material has some use for consumption but very few materials have properties that make it a good currency (silver is another good currency but unlike gold it corrodes easily). Maybe these consumption use cases helped it become established at first, but I refuse to accept that it's a necessary step. Currency in and of itself is valuable. Without it we'd be bartering, so with currency our lives are better. So if gold had no foreseeable use as a consumption good, lives would still be improved by using it as a currency because we wouldn't be bartering. So logically the properties of currency itself provide a kind of value too, solely from its use as a good medium of exchange. I've dealt with Neilsio for many years, and him admitting he is wrong on ANYTHING is pretty much impossible. Even when it comes from someone he admires and respects. You will not convince him he is wrong about anything once he is convinced he knows the answer. Ok. I must admit I said that without knowing for sure, but he doesn't strike me as an ideologue. I'll concede though because you know him. I still don't think he's worth this mockery though. |
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tomcollins
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April 23, 2011, 11:02:37 PM |
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This mockery is discouraging. Nielsio is a brother in arms. Maybe he's wrong about bitcoin, and mistaken about how currency can be valuable in and of itself, but let's not straw man him. Come on guys, he doesn't support government fiat--actually listen to what he said. And he doesn't think that vegetables make a good currency obviously; vegetables was just an example of a consumption good. The pictures made me sad because it's such a straw man. Come on guys, you can try to convince him why he's wrong. He has a good following of anarcho-capitalists and voluntaryists that could get on board. Mocking him is actually a travesty Sometimes the best way to learn is just to put your conclusions out there, but be open to being shown to be wrong. Nielsio will change his mind if you can show why he's wrong. For the record, I saw his video and it made me think about the concepts involved and about why my intuition was telling me that he was wrong. I spent all day looking into bitcoin and I think it's wonderful. Some people here have provided some good answers, explaining how the properties that make gold good as currency make people value the gold as currency by itself. His psychic powers may be scarce, but they have none of the other properties that would make it good currency (unlike gold and bitcoins too). The fact that nobody would buy his psychic power certificates is not just because it has no genuine consumption value, but mostly because it lacks the properties vladimir described. And he would be the central issuer of this currency, w here with bitcoin and gold that is not the case. And yes, the properties that make gold good as jewellery or as an electrical conductor also means people value gold for those use cases, but that's different and unrelated. The fact that gold has value for some consumption too is just a sort of 'coincidence'. Of course, nearly every material has some use for consumption but very few materials have properties that make it a good currency (silver is another good currency but unlike gold it corrodes easily). Maybe these consumption use cases helped it become established at first, but I refuse to accept that it's a necessary step. Currency in and of itself is valuable. Without it we'd be bartering, so with currency our lives are better. So if gold had no foreseeable use as a consumption good, lives would still be improved by using it as a currency because we wouldn't be bartering. So logically the properties of currency itself provide a kind of value too, solely from its use as a good medium of exchange. I've dealt with Neilsio for many years, and him admitting he is wrong on ANYTHING is pretty much impossible. Even when it comes from someone he admires and respects. You will not convince him he is wrong about anything once he is convinced he knows the answer. Ok. I must admit I said that without knowing for sure, but he doesn't strike me as an ideologue. I'll concede though because you know him. I still don't think he's worth this mockery though. Possibly, but only because he could get to a lot of people, and a few people could drive up the price. He's a brother in arms only accidentally. I sense some kind of trauma in his past from government/schools/society that have made him the way he is more than actually understanding the concepts. |
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Prze_koles
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April 23, 2011, 11:03:41 PM |
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This is boring. I mean, we already know those facts. It is obvious for Bitcoin community that there's no government which forces you to use Bitcoins. I think nobody here is 100% sure that Bitcoin will succeed. Although we participate in this project, we have fun with this, we speculate etc.
OK, this is his opinion, but who cares what is he saying?
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1FzTJh1C58m1gqnNzxLTt2ryNYkuk1YdfN
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tomcollins
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April 23, 2011, 11:10:24 PM |
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This is boring. I mean, we already know those facts. It is obvious for Bitcoin community that there's no government which forces you to use Bitcoins. I think nobody here is 100% sure that Bitcoin will succeed. Although we participate in this project, we have fun with this, we speculate etc.
OK, this is his opinion, but who cares what is he saying?
Sure, everyone here knows. But there are other people who won't immediately know the weaknesses in his arguments. |
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BCEmporium
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Activity: 1218
Merit: 1000
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April 23, 2011, 11:15:33 PM |
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I'm being slow with my projects waiting for when BTC stops to be "the business" and business can be done with BTC instead.
The only way to stop BTC is to shutdown the internet. But if someone does that, then we go back to caves where no money at all, printed or whatsoever has any value. We will trade with bison bones instead.
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grondilu (OP)
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Activity: 1288
Merit: 1080
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April 23, 2011, 11:20:36 PM |
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I think being mocked a bit is a good punishment for being a smart ass.
If you think you are clever enough to lecture people about stuffs, you have to assume it.
A lot of people are doing and writing very smart things, and yet they don't feel the narcissic urge of showing their face on Youtube.
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goatpig
Legendary
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Activity: 3752
Merit: 1364
Armory Developer
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April 23, 2011, 11:36:48 PM |
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I think being mocked a bit is a good punishment for being a smart ass.
If you think you are clever enough to lecture people about stuffs, you have to assume it.
A lot of people are doing and writing very smart things, and yet they don't feel the narcissic urge of showing their face on Youtube.
+1 Apparently some people did quite the opposite of what this guy is saying. I think the problem isn't whether he is a "brother in arms" but rather that he is close minded. As someone stated, his behavior indicates that he is "like minded" with anarchist or libertarian ideals not because he embraces them but rather because he nurtures anti government feelings, for whatever reason. I'm a gold bug myself yet I adopted Bitcoin at first sight, and I'm pretty sure I'm not alone here, which certainly prove the 2 aren't incompatible. Also, I'll take a wolf skull with those bison bones. |
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grondilu (OP)
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Activity: 1288
Merit: 1080
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April 23, 2011, 11:40:52 PM
Last edit: April 24, 2011, 12:09:34 AM by grondilu |
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I'm a gold bug myself yet I adopted Bitcoin at first sight, and I'm pretty sure I'm not alone here, which certainly prove the 2 aren't incompatible.
This gives me an idea for a poll. Edit. Here it is: http://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=6392.0 |
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