Bitponzi.io - fair ponzi with automated hourly payments, 150% in 150 hours.

[bitponzi.io]

We are a Ponzi gambling system offering automated hourly payments. We do not invest, gamble, or otherwise use your money other than to pay it to the previous depositors. 1% of the deposited funds goes for system maintenance.

 

Deposit address:

1PoNzi7PGzRyvc9KWYBcaauS3oeJqa5vFg

Minimum deposit: 0.005 BTC. Use Blockchain.info wallet or desktop Bitcoin clients. If you don't get payments contact support

Payments are processed hourly, you get 1% for 150 payouts.  That is your total profit is 50%, like in original scheme by Charles Ponzi.

This is pure gambling so don't risk coins you can't afford to lose. Analyze the cashflows and current system balance using blockchain.info to make intelligent deposit decisions. Promote the program to get it going forever. We pay hourly which reduces the chances of the system getting stuck.

Bitcoin transparency turns ponzi schemes into pure gambling. Have fun and make money!

Bitponzi.io

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[DaveQB]

To everyone looking at this, I have dipped my toe in the water.

I sent .008 btc yesterday. Since then I have been getting .00008 btc back in my wallet every hour. I don't know how long this will last, that's the gamble.

In my calculations I will break even in 4.16 says (.008/.00008 = 100 hours)

We'll see what happens from there.

Happy gambling everyone!

[bitponzi.io]

Thank you for checking us out, as in any ponzi scheme earlier investors have higher chances to make money
But actually our cycles are short so the risk is quite low at the moment.

To everyone looking at this, I have dipped my toe in the water.

I sent .008 btc yesterday. Since then I have been getting .00008 btc back in my wallet every hour. I don't know how long this will last, that's the gamble.

In my calculations I will break even in 4.16 says (.008/.00008 = 100 hours)

We'll see what happens from there.

Happy gambling everyone!

[MikeMazzone]

Do the payments get made every hour on the hour? Like in 2 minutes it will be 1 am where I'm at, will I get my first payment then even though my deposit was made at 12:30 am, or do I have to wait over an hour to get my first payment?

Edit: In checking the blockchain, it looks like you always have to wait one hour minimum before you get your first hourly payment.

[bitponzi.io]

Yes, effectively you have to wait at least one hour, taking also into account the confirmation time for your deposit.

Do the payments get made every hour on the hour? Like in 2 minutes it will be 1 am where I'm at, will I get my first payment then even though my deposit was made at 12:30 am, or do I have to wait over an hour to get my first payment?

Edit: In checking the blockchain, it looks like you always have to wait one hour minimum before you get your first hourly payment.

[Cluster2k]

We pay hourly which reduces the chances of the system getting stuck.

What do you mean?  A ponzi scheme is guaranteed to become 'stuck' when the number of suckers drawn into the system isn't enough to pay out the early adopters.

I look forward to the numerous 'umm, the payments have slowed and then stopped, you guys sure it's still working, I haven't got my investment back yet' posts.

[MikeMazzone]

We pay hourly which reduces the chances of the system getting stuck.

What do you mean?  A ponzi scheme is guaranteed to become 'stuck' when the number of suckers drawn into the system isn't enough to pay out the early adopters.

I look forward to the numerous 'umm, the payments have slowed and then stopped, you guys sure it's still working, I haven't got my investment back yet' posts.

Check the blockchain, you always know how much is left in the bitponzi fund.

https://blockchain.info/address/1PoNzi7PGzRyvc9KWYBcaauS3oeJqa5vFg

Right now, there's 1.34231128 BTC left to make payments with.  If they do it right and wait until it gets wiped out to 0 to stop making payments, a new cycle can begin with fresh deposits.  You might be surprised how long a cycle can last.

It's not an investment anyway, it's a gamble.  I deposited a little over the 0.005 BTC minimum, if I get in early on the next cycle I might risk a whole half a bitcoin like a couple of depositors have done this cycle.

[DaveQB]

Check the blockchain, you always know how much is left in the bitponzi fund.

https://blockchain.info/address/1PoNzi7PGzRyvc9KWYBcaauS3oeJqa5vFg

Right now, there's 1.34231128 BTC left to make payments with.  If they do it right and wait until it gets wiped out to 0 to stop making payments, a new cycle can begin with fresh deposits.  You might be surprised how long a cycle can last.

It's not an investment anyway, it's a gamble.  I deposited a little over the 0.005 BTC minimum, if I get in early on the next cycle I might risk a whole half a bitcoin like a couple of depositors have done this cycle.

Yeah exactly. What he said!

[bitponzi.io]

Well, sure there will be such posts sooner or later, we hope later, much later. talking about several months later. But if it gets stuck it can also get unstuck if there's new funds going into the system
What I mean by reducing the chances of getting stuck by making frequent payout is you make cash flows much smoother this way. If we tried to pay the whole 150% in one payment the payments would become highly irregular, which would effect the stability of the system of course.

Botomline: We want to turn Ponzi's into pure gambling. With dice games you need to make them "provably fair" to bring transparency, with Ponzi's all you need is blockchain.

We pay hourly which reduces the chances of the system getting stuck.

What do you mean?  A ponzi scheme is guaranteed to become 'stuck' when the number of suckers drawn into the system isn't enough to pay out the early adopters.

I look forward to the numerous 'umm, the payments have slowed and then stopped, you guys sure it's still working, I haven't got my investment back yet' posts.

[bitcoin4eva]

I actually like the system. If they do not decide to run away with the money (which I wouldn't do because of the 1% unlimited cashflow) the system should keep going till theres no new investors joining the program.

[thExit]

"Fair Ponzi", this sounds really thrilling. I know cryptocurrencies provide numerous opportunities to businesses, but I would never suspect that they would allow to create a "fair Ponzi scheme". Money coming out of thin air? You are asking for trouble.

50% return (after what? +/- 6 days) sounds even more thrilling than "Fair Ponzi", I can only make a 5-10% a month trading (Forex or altcoins), the difference is that I can REALLY make money, not just juggle sbd's coins. It's taking me weeks and now even months to think how my ability to make those 5% monthly can benefit the cryptocurrency community, how to make it reliable, safe, with use of distributed exchanges, colored coins, smart contracts, protocols such as NXT, MSC, XRP,  and you simply came up with a "Fair Ponzi". Why didn't I think of that? But instead of running a Pozni, I would secretly trade to make money instead of ponziing them. Sorry for the tone, but I can't help myself. Despite this, I wish you all the good luck, there are hordes of people dreaming of running a Ponzi scheme, you actually managed to achieve it.

Please take the following words of advice. Instead of running this Fair Ponzi by yourself, employ the blockchain technology to create a “Provably Fair Ponzi Scheme”, where we can see the balance (you already have this feature implemented;), where payouts are made automatically to all the people that cashed in, where you do not have the ability to run off with the money (in your current Ponzi there is the element of trust, why not eliminate the need for trust?), and where you automatically get the 1% maintenance fee. That would be a “Fair Ponzi”. Go for it.



Here's a quote from a topic taken from the same forum section /Gambling/. I didn't read it, I just liked the title of the thread.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=510323.0

People please avoid ponzi's like the plague.

Here is the very simple description of a ponzi:

a) Idiot hands over money to con artist. 
b) con artist pays (for example) 1% interest weekly on your investment. 
c) idiot decides he wants to compound his investment so interest is never collected.
d) Ponzi operator runs off with funds when investors ask for withdrawals.

Or the Other Method:

c) not quite an idiot collects 1% interest a week and tells everyone how great it is.
d) The ponzi operator can do 100 weeks of payouts before running into trouble, they usually will stop when they stop getting new investors.

Now I know there are many people that make the following claim: The trick is to get in and out early. and they are one of the 3 types:

1) shills - they never invested anything but claim they did and that the payments WERE FABULOUS. 
2) idiots who think they will be  the first in and out.
3) idiots who were lucky enough to actually be 1 of the first in and out. Its the same as leaving your wallet/phone/camera with a random stranger on the corner of the street - yes sometimes they are honest but guess what, its terrible advice to give anyone and to claim success at doing so is just encouraging other idiots to invest.

Finally:

Ponzi's and pyramids are not gambling its a way to syphon money from idiots. 
These long running pyramids...... you will find out all the success stories are sockpuppets of 1-2 people right at the top.

PS: Friends dont let friends order from BFL.

The List of Ponzi Operators.
If you take advice from these people your gonna have a bad time mmmkay.

yonce - a HYIP promoter making more than a passing effort in his scam (nice to see a committed con artist).

Min-btc - scammer.

120cycle - scammer.

naRky - scammer

multiponzi - scammer.
bmL - scammer.
btcmania - A very clever and persuasive shill. Defends ponzi's and their operators despite knowing full well that ponzi's operate as a scam.

BitDoubler - scammer.

ponzimatic - scammer.

CoinPayoff - ConPayoff.
Weekly_Ponzi - lol.
jontstaz - ponzi operator
ponjava - ponzi operator
greenservice - piece of shit ponzi operator/ con artist.

apsvinet - Scammer, liar, opponent of free speech, all in all a nasty piece of work.

[bitponzi.io]

Well, but we actually have all the features you mention.
Balance can be checked via blockchain;
Payouts are automated;
The maintenance fee will be taken once a week. I don't see why we should take it real time, that does not make sense;
As for running  away with the money - let's not discuss our honesty and integrity, but here it just doesn't make sense - the balance is being paid back really fast, so it doesn't really grow. Thus it makes much more sense to profit from the fees, which are derived from total transaction volume.

"Fair Ponzi", this sounds really thrilling. I know cryptocurrencies provide numerous opportunities to businesses, but I would never suspect that they would allow to create a "fair Ponzi scheme". Money coming out of thin air? You are asking for trouble.

50% return (after what? +/- 6 days) sounds even more thrilling than "Fair Ponzi", I can only make a 5-10% a month trading (Forex or altcoins), the difference is that I can REALLY make money, not just juggle sbd's coins. It's taking me weeks and now even months to think how my ability to make those 5% monthly can benefit the cryptocurrency community, how to make it reliable, safe, with use of distributed exchanges, colored coins, smart contracts, protocols such as NXT, MSC, XRP,  and you simply came up with a "Fair Ponzi". Why didn't I think of that? But instead of running a Pozni, I would secretly trade to make money instead of ponziing them. Sorry for the tone, but I can't help myself. Despite this, I wish you all the good luck, there are hordes of people dreaming of running a Ponzi scheme, you actually managed to achieve it.

Please take the following words of advice. Instead of running this Fair Ponzi by yourself, employ the blockchain technology to create a “Provably Fair Ponzi Scheme”, where we can see the balance (you already have this feature implemented;), where payouts are made automatically to all the people that cashed in, where you do not have the ability to run off with the money (in your current Ponzi there is the element of trust, why not eliminate the need for trust?), and where you automatically get the 1% maintenance fee. That would be a “Fair Ponzi”. Go for it.



Here's a quote from a topic taken from the same forum section /Gambling/. I didn't read it, I just liked the title of the thread.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=510323.0

People please avoid ponzi's like the plague.

Here is the very simple description of a ponzi:

a) Idiot hands over money to con artist. 
b) con artist pays (for example) 1% interest weekly on your investment. 
c) idiot decides he wants to compound his investment so interest is never collected.
d) Ponzi operator runs off with funds when investors ask for withdrawals.

Or the Other Method:

c) not quite an idiot collects 1% interest a week and tells everyone how great it is.
d) The ponzi operator can do 100 weeks of payouts before running into trouble, they usually will stop when they stop getting new investors.

Now I know there are many people that make the following claim: The trick is to get in and out early. and they are one of the 3 types:

1) shills - they never invested anything but claim they did and that the payments WERE FABULOUS. 
2) idiots who think they will be  the first in and out.
3) idiots who were lucky enough to actually be 1 of the first in and out. Its the same as leaving your wallet/phone/camera with a random stranger on the corner of the street - yes sometimes they are honest but guess what, its terrible advice to give anyone and to claim success at doing so is just encouraging other idiots to invest.

Finally:

Ponzi's and pyramids are not gambling its a way to syphon money from idiots. 
These long running pyramids...... you will find out all the success stories are sockpuppets of 1-2 people right at the top.

PS: Friends dont let friends order from BFL.

The List of Ponzi Operators.
If you take advice from these people your gonna have a bad time mmmkay.

yonce - a HYIP promoter making more than a passing effort in his scam (nice to see a committed con artist).

Min-btc - scammer.

120cycle - scammer.

naRky - scammer

multiponzi - scammer.
bmL - scammer.
btcmania - A very clever and persuasive shill. Defends ponzi's and their operators despite knowing full well that ponzi's operate as a scam.

BitDoubler - scammer.

ponzimatic - scammer.

CoinPayoff - ConPayoff.
Weekly_Ponzi - lol.
jontstaz - ponzi operator
ponjava - ponzi operator
greenservice - piece of shit ponzi operator/ con artist.

apsvinet - Scammer, liar, opponent of free speech, all in all a nasty piece of work.

[thExit]

Well, but we actually have all the features you mention.
Balance can be checked via blockchain;
Payouts are automated;
The maintenance fee will be taken once a week. I don't see why we should take it real time, that does not make sense;
As for running  away with the money - let's not discuss our honesty and integrity, but here it just doesn't make sense - the balance is being paid back really fast, so it doesn't really grow. Thus it makes much more sense to profit from the fees, which are derived from total transaction volume.

"Fair Ponzi", this sounds really thrilling. I know cryptocurrencies provide numerous opportunities to businesses, but I would never suspect that they would allow to create a "fair Ponzi scheme". Money coming out of thin air? You are asking for trouble.

50% return (after what? +/- 6 days) sounds even more thrilling than "Fair Ponzi", I can only make a 5-10% a month trading (Forex or altcoins), the difference is that I can REALLY make money, not just juggle sbd's coins. It's taking me weeks and now even months to think how my ability to make those 5% monthly can benefit the cryptocurrency community, how to make it reliable, safe, with use of distributed exchanges, colored coins, smart contracts, protocols such as NXT, MSC, XRP,  and you simply came up with a "Fair Ponzi". Why didn't I think of that? But instead of running a Pozni, I would secretly trade to make money instead of ponziing them. Sorry for the tone, but I can't help myself. Despite this, I wish you all the good luck, there are hordes of people dreaming of running a Ponzi scheme, you actually managed to achieve it.

Please take the following words of advice. Instead of running this Fair Ponzi by yourself, employ the blockchain technology to create a “Provably Fair Ponzi Scheme”, where we can see the balance (you already have this feature implemented;), where payouts are made automatically to all the people that cashed in, where you do not have the ability to run off with the money (in your current Ponzi there is the element of trust, why not eliminate the need for trust?), and where you automatically get the 1% maintenance fee. That would be a “Fair Ponzi”. Go for it.



Here's a quote from a topic taken from the same forum section /Gambling/. I didn't read it, I just liked the title of the thread.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=510323.0

People please avoid ponzi's like the plague.

Here is the very simple description of a ponzi:

a) Idiot hands over money to con artist. 
b) con artist pays (for example) 1% interest weekly on your investment. 
c) idiot decides he wants to compound his investment so interest is never collected.
d) Ponzi operator runs off with funds when investors ask for withdrawals.

Or the Other Method:

c) not quite an idiot collects 1% interest a week and tells everyone how great it is.
d) The ponzi operator can do 100 weeks of payouts before running into trouble, they usually will stop when they stop getting new investors.

Now I know there are many people that make the following claim: The trick is to get in and out early. and they are one of the 3 types:

1) shills - they never invested anything but claim they did and that the payments WERE FABULOUS. 
2) idiots who think they will be  the first in and out.
3) idiots who were lucky enough to actually be 1 of the first in and out. Its the same as leaving your wallet/phone/camera with a random stranger on the corner of the street - yes sometimes they are honest but guess what, its terrible advice to give anyone and to claim success at doing so is just encouraging other idiots to invest.

Finally:

Ponzi's and pyramids are not gambling its a way to syphon money from idiots. 
These long running pyramids...... you will find out all the success stories are sockpuppets of 1-2 people right at the top.

PS: Friends dont let friends order from BFL.

The List of Ponzi Operators.
If you take advice from these people your gonna have a bad time mmmkay.

yonce - a HYIP promoter making more than a passing effort in his scam (nice to see a committed con artist).

Min-btc - scammer.

120cycle - scammer.

naRky - scammer

multiponzi - scammer.
bmL - scammer.
btcmania - A very clever and persuasive shill. Defends ponzi's and their operators despite knowing full well that ponzi's operate as a scam.

BitDoubler - scammer.

ponzimatic - scammer.

CoinPayoff - ConPayoff.
Weekly_Ponzi - lol.
jontstaz - ponzi operator
ponjava - ponzi operator
greenservice - piece of shit ponzi operator/ con artist.

apsvinet - Scammer, liar, opponent of free speech, all in all a nasty piece of work.

Of course "it makes much more sense to profit from the fees" as it would show your honesty and allow to grab more BTCs, without a lot of interest from potential "investors" your Ponzi wouldn't be worth the hustle.

I mean, I don't see much sense in investing in anything that is just a financial pyramid even if it openly claims to be one- the openness does not add anything of value. If a pyramid of this type had a chance to survive, don't you think all the other hustlers would have succeeded in their efforts to sustain the pyramid?

My money is hard-earned. Please try to convince me to invest 50,000 USD into your scheme. If I do it tomorrow, will you be able to pay me 75,000 USD in 6 to 7 days? I tell you what, if you invest 50,000 USD with me tomorrow, I will be able to pay you 51,000 in 5 days. Or if you invest 500,000 USD I will be able to pay you 510,000 USD in 5 days. Or, yes, you should know by now, if you invest 5,000,000 USD with me, I will still be able to give you 5,100,000 USD in 5 days. To continue, if you would like to invest 50,000,000 USD, I would pay you 51,000,000 USD in 5 days, or at this stake I would consider saying that a hacker attacked my account;) Just a joke, I would probably say that at 5m USD I'm not advocating myself to be the holy grail of investing, but I am sure you can see the difference clearly. If I invest with you 50k USD, your Ponzi wouldn't make me a dime. If you invest with me no matter what amount, I can still make you a nice yearly return. Think about it.

Usually I am good at judging people after a short personal contact, but it is harder to do it over the Internet. For now, I don't view you as an abuser of trust, you can still prove yourself. You are either honest ( quoting @bitcoin4eva "If they do not decide to run away with the money") or clever. Clever by using "an inception within inception". You say that you run a Ponzi, so you are honest and trustworthy, so we will deposit our funds with you, cause you are honest, despite being a Ponzi. Hey, he's an honest Ponzi, don't be scared:D He's giving away free candy.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-tBFw8yUhC3Y/T9E2g8FwF5I/AAAAAAAAATU/n1RmI7JPMaM/s1600/FreeCandy.jpg

Once again, I couldn't help myself, it's a classic. How about we join forces, you run the Ponzi, I'll make real money from what you collect. It's a win-win situation. We'll split what we REALLY earn.

And now being serious, one thing I appreciate, if you turn out to be honest (which I believe might be true), is that you took the effort to think and come up with something new within the borders that limit you. Don't take this as an offense.

[Cluster2k]

Right now, there's 1.34231128 BTC left to make payments with.  If they do it right and wait until it gets wiped out to 0 to stop making payments, a new cycle can begin with fresh deposits.  You might be surprised how long a cycle can last.

'if they do it right',  'a new cycle can begin with fresh deposits'.

All wonderful justifications for a ponzi scheme by the people supporting it.  All ponzi schemes fail because 'they didn't do it right' and 'the idiots stopped pumping money into it, therefore it's the investors' fault!'

[bitponzi.io]

Yes you are right All ponzi's are just gambling. If you think otherwise you are delusional.

Right now, there's 1.34231128 BTC left to make payments with.  If they do it right and wait until it gets wiped out to 0 to stop making payments, a new cycle can begin with fresh deposits.  You might be surprised how long a cycle can last.

'if they do it right',  'a new cycle can begin with fresh deposits'.

All wonderful justifications for a ponzi scheme by the people supporting it.  All ponzi schemes fail because 'they didn't do it right' and 'the idiots stopped pumping money into it, therefore it's the investors' fault!'

[bitponzi.io]

I think you're missing the whole point.
Please check the program description more carefully. We accept no "investments", just like you don't "invest" when you gamble. It's is gambling, pure and simple. But with a twist, since you can do it intelligently, by checking the program balance and cashflows. So it's probably more like chess

Well, but we actually have all the features you mention.
Balance can be checked via blockchain;
Payouts are automated;
The maintenance fee will be taken once a week. I don't see why we should take it real time, that does not make sense;
As for running  away with the money - let's not discuss our honesty and integrity, but here it just doesn't make sense - the balance is being paid back really fast, so it doesn't really grow. Thus it makes much more sense to profit from the fees, which are derived from total transaction volume.

"Fair Ponzi", this sounds really thrilling. I know cryptocurrencies provide numerous opportunities to businesses, but I would never suspect that they would allow to create a "fair Ponzi scheme". Money coming out of thin air? You are asking for trouble.

50% return (after what? +/- 6 days) sounds even more thrilling than "Fair Ponzi", I can only make a 5-10% a month trading (Forex or altcoins), the difference is that I can REALLY make money, not just juggle sbd's coins. It's taking me weeks and now even months to think how my ability to make those 5% monthly can benefit the cryptocurrency community, how to make it reliable, safe, with use of distributed exchanges, colored coins, smart contracts, protocols such as NXT, MSC, XRP,  and you simply came up with a "Fair Ponzi". Why didn't I think of that? But instead of running a Pozni, I would secretly trade to make money instead of ponziing them. Sorry for the tone, but I can't help myself. Despite this, I wish you all the good luck, there are hordes of people dreaming of running a Ponzi scheme, you actually managed to achieve it.

Please take the following words of advice. Instead of running this Fair Ponzi by yourself, employ the blockchain technology to create a “Provably Fair Ponzi Scheme”, where we can see the balance (you already have this feature implemented;), where payouts are made automatically to all the people that cashed in, where you do not have the ability to run off with the money (in your current Ponzi there is the element of trust, why not eliminate the need for trust?), and where you automatically get the 1% maintenance fee. That would be a “Fair Ponzi”. Go for it.



Here's a quote from a topic taken from the same forum section /Gambling/. I didn't read it, I just liked the title of the thread.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=510323.0

People please avoid ponzi's like the plague.

Here is the very simple description of a ponzi:

a) Idiot hands over money to con artist. 
b) con artist pays (for example) 1% interest weekly on your investment. 
c) idiot decides he wants to compound his investment so interest is never collected.
d) Ponzi operator runs off with funds when investors ask for withdrawals.

Or the Other Method:

c) not quite an idiot collects 1% interest a week and tells everyone how great it is.
d) The ponzi operator can do 100 weeks of payouts before running into trouble, they usually will stop when they stop getting new investors.

Now I know there are many people that make the following claim: The trick is to get in and out early. and they are one of the 3 types:

1) shills - they never invested anything but claim they did and that the payments WERE FABULOUS. 
2) idiots who think they will be  the first in and out.
3) idiots who were lucky enough to actually be 1 of the first in and out. Its the same as leaving your wallet/phone/camera with a random stranger on the corner of the street - yes sometimes they are honest but guess what, its terrible advice to give anyone and to claim success at doing so is just encouraging other idiots to invest.

Finally:

Ponzi's and pyramids are not gambling its a way to syphon money from idiots. 
These long running pyramids...... you will find out all the success stories are sockpuppets of 1-2 people right at the top.

PS: Friends dont let friends order from BFL.

The List of Ponzi Operators.
If you take advice from these people your gonna have a bad time mmmkay.

yonce - a HYIP promoter making more than a passing effort in his scam (nice to see a committed con artist).

Min-btc - scammer.

120cycle - scammer.

naRky - scammer

multiponzi - scammer.
bmL - scammer.
btcmania - A very clever and persuasive shill. Defends ponzi's and their operators despite knowing full well that ponzi's operate as a scam.

BitDoubler - scammer.

ponzimatic - scammer.

CoinPayoff - ConPayoff.
Weekly_Ponzi - lol.
jontstaz - ponzi operator
ponjava - ponzi operator
greenservice - piece of shit ponzi operator/ con artist.

apsvinet - Scammer, liar, opponent of free speech, all in all a nasty piece of work.

Of course "it makes much more sense to profit from the fees" as it would show your honesty and allow to grab more BTCs, without a lot of interest from potential "investors" your Ponzi wouldn't be worth the hustle.

I mean, I don't see much sense in investing in anything that is just a financial pyramid even if it openly claims to be one- the openness does not add anything of value. If a pyramid of this type had a chance to survive, don't you think all the other hustlers would have succeeded in their efforts to sustain the pyramid?

My money is hard-earned. Please try to convince me to invest 50,000 USD into your scheme. If I do it tomorrow, will you be able to pay me 75,000 USD in 6 to 7 days? I tell you what, if you invest 50,000 USD with me tomorrow, I will be able to pay you 51,000 in 5 days. Or if you invest 500,000 USD I will be able to pay you 510,000 USD in 5 days. Or, yes, you should know by now, if you invest 5,000,000 USD with me, I will still be able to give you 5,100,000 USD in 5 days. To continue, if you would like to invest 50,000,000 USD, I would pay you 51,000,000 USD in 5 days, or at this stake I would consider saying that a hacker attacked my account;) Just a joke, I would probably say that at 5m USD I'm not advocating myself to be the holy grail of investing, but I am sure you can see the difference clearly. If I invest with you 50k USD, your Ponzi wouldn't make me a dime. If you invest with me no matter what amount, I can still make you a nice yearly return. Think about it.

Usually I am good at judging people after a short personal contact, but it is harder to do it over the Internet. For now, I don't view you as an abuser of trust, you can still prove yourself. You are either honest ( quoting @bitcoin4eva "If they do not decide to run away with the money") or clever. Clever by using "an inception within inception". You say that you run a Ponzi, so you are honest and trustworthy, so we will deposit our funds with you, cause you are honest, despite being a Ponzi. Hey, he's an honest Ponzi, don't be scared:D He's giving away free candy.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-tBFw8yUhC3Y/T9E2g8FwF5I/AAAAAAAAATU/n1RmI7JPMaM/s1600/FreeCandy.jpg

Once again, I couldn't help myself, it's a classic. How about we join forces, you run the Ponzi, I'll make real money from what you collect. It's a win-win situation. We'll split what we REALLY earn.

And now being serious, one thing I appreciate, if you turn out to be honest (which I believe might be true), is that you took the effort to think and come up with something new within the borders that limit you. Don't take this as an offense.

[Galio]

So if its a gamble, then wouldnt it be better to just to lose at an actual bitcoin casino.

Where I can make possible returns, then just hoping I would get one? lol.

[thExit]

I think you're missing the whole point.
Please check the program description more carefully. We accept no "investments", just like you don't "invest" when you gamble. It's is gambling, pure and simple. But with a twist, since you can do it intelligently, by checking the program balance and cashflows. So it's probably more like chess

Is it then gambling or a game of chess? Or maybe an investment after all? Those are just name tags, doesn't really matter how you call it. The important element is the underlying structure. It's not the "how we call it", it's "how it works".

Why do you think "prospectors" do their best to hide the fact that they run a Ponzi? Why do they create a shiny layer on top of their "operation". Why don't they simpy say that they run a financial pyramid?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Madoff_investment_scandal

Why did Madoff's pyramid fall? Because of the SEC stepping in? Do you think that his faith would be different if he would say at some point that he runs a Ponzi scheme? Even if it was legal?

Please notice one point that makes you different from Madoff, his yearly return from what I remember was at around 10%, your return is 50% in 7 days. It's a huge difference, and he still wasn't able to sustain the pyramid.

I like this project as I would brand it an experiment. I am really curious how it plays out, you really should consider promoting yourself somehow. The reason for calling it a pyramid is that you need a proportional increase of money flow from newcomers to pay to the oldcomers, and then evenly more inflow from newercomers to pay the previous newcomers:) but you already know that. Mathematically, odds for sustaining this pyramid are not on your side, but if you persuade gamblers that this is a gamble and that they can win as long as they decide to play, who knows, maybe this scheme would finally work and it could be named after you As always, best wishes to everyone.

[bitponzi.io]

There's something you don't take into consideration -
if Madoff's investors could see his books they wouldn't give him money, right?
And Bitcoin allows you to do exactly that, monitor the whole accounting, and make intellgient bets.
Bitcoin transparency is a game-changer here.

As for program promotion - it is being promoted, and also participants are very welcome to help, since their success depends on this too.

I think you're missing the whole point.
Please check the program description more carefully. We accept no "investments", just like you don't "invest" when you gamble. It's is gambling, pure and simple. But with a twist, since you can do it intelligently, by checking the program balance and cashflows. So it's probably more like chess

Is it then gambling or a game of chess? Or maybe an investment after all? Those are just name tags, doesn't really matter how you call it. The important element is the underlying structure. It's not the "how we call it", it's "how it works".

Why do you think "prospectors" do their best to hide the fact that they run a Ponzi? Why do they create a shiny layer on top of their "operation". Why don't they simpy say that they run a financial pyramid?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Madoff_investment_scandal

Why did Madoff's pyramid fall? Because of the SEC stepping in? Do you think that his faith would be different if he would say at some point that he runs a Ponzi scheme? Even if it was legal?

Please notice one point that makes you different from Madoff, his yearly return from what I remember was at around 10%, your return is 50% in 7 days. It's a huge difference, and he still wasn't able to sustain the pyramid.

I like this project as I would brand it an experiment. I am really curious how it plays out, you really should consider promoting yourself somehow. The reason for calling it a pyramid is that you need a proportional increase of money flow from newcomers to pay to the oldcomers, and then evenly more inflow from newercomers to pay the previous newcomers:) but you already know that. Mathematically, odds for sustaining this pyramid are not on your side, but if you persuade gamblers that this is a gamble and that they can win as long as they decide to play, who knows, maybe this scheme would finally work and it could be named after you As always, best wishes to everyone.

[bitponzi.io]

You check the balance and hourly payments, and if you can see that they are sufficient to pay you your 150% you deposit and make profit.

So if its a gamble, then wouldnt it be better to just to lose at an actual bitcoin casino.

Where I can make possible returns, then just hoping I would get one? lol.

[thExit]

There's something you don't take into consideration -
if Madoff's investors could see his books they wouldn't give him money, right?
And Bitcoin allows you to do exactly that, monitor the whole accounting, and make intellgient bets.
Bitcoin transparency is a game-changer here.

As for program promotion - it is being promoted, and also participants are very welcome to help, since their success depends on this too.

Of course I take it into consideration:) One thing you could do to improve the chances of your Fair Ponzi to succeed is to give a clear clue for investors/gamblers (choose a name:) how to behave, what to do in order to make money and make the system work. When you monitor the whole accounting, please let us, the noob Pozni gamers, know what to be looking for. Let us, the noob Ponzi gamers, know how to make "intelligent bets". Tell us to come in early, as early as possible, so we have a greater chance to get our money back before the scheme runs out of money.

I am certain that there is a strict line of behaviour, which, if followed by all the participants, would guarantee a success of this scheme. If you are proposing a Fair Ponzi, why won't you go one step further by telling people EXACTLY what to do for all of us to succeed? This would be a true novelty, and a way to make your Ponzi even more fair.

[Joca97]

i still dont understand why dosent this forum

block ponzis this is just obvious scam 5% of people dont get scamed and 95 % does

[bitponzi.io]

I didn't think that it was so complicated actually, it's sufficient to monitor the ponzi balance, hourly payments, and new funds flow. also plots like that can be of value: https://blockchain.info/charts/received-per-day?timespan=30days&showDataPoints=false&daysAverageString=1&show_header=true&scale=0&address=1PoNzi7PGzRyvc9KWYBcaauS3oeJqa5vFg

 All this info is available through blockchain. We will also make some stats at the website soon.

There's something you don't take into consideration -
if Madoff's investors could see his books they wouldn't give him money, right?
And Bitcoin allows you to do exactly that, monitor the whole accounting, and make intellgient bets.
Bitcoin transparency is a game-changer here.

As for program promotion - it is being promoted, and also participants are very welcome to help, since their success depends on this too.

Of course I take it into consideration:) One thing you could do to improve the chances of your Fair Ponzi to succeed is to give a clear clue for investors/gamblers (choose a name:) how to behave, what to do in order to make money and make the system work. When you monitor the whole accounting, please let us, the noob Pozni gamers, know what to be looking for. Let us, the noob Ponzi gamers, know how to make "intelligent bets". Tell us to come in early, as early as possible, so we have a greater chance to get our money back before the scheme runs out of money.

I am certain that there is a strict line of behaviour, which, if followed by all the participants, would guarantee a success of this scheme. If you are proposing a Fair Ponzi, why won't you go one step further by telling people EXACTLY what to do for all of us to succeed? This would be a true novelty, and a way to make your Ponzi even more fair.

[bitponzi.io]

We are not a scam. Please read the program description.

i still dont understand why dosent this forum

block ponzis this is just obvious scam 5% of people dont get scamed and 95 % does

[ChiliPowder]

We are not a scam. Please read the program description.

i still dont understand why dosent this forum

block ponzis this is just obvious scam 5% of people dont get scamed and 95 % does

Yea thats what you all say, then you run with the money.


Just cause you tell us its a Ponzi doesnt mean your not gonna fuck eveyone.

[bitponzi.io]

We answered that question already.
It doesn't make sense, we're making profits from the fees. Balance doesn't really grow.

We are not a scam. Please read the program description.

i still dont understand why dosent this forum

block ponzis this is just obvious scam 5% of people dont get scamed and 95 % does

Yea thats what you all say, then you run with the money.


Just cause you tell us its a Ponzi doesnt mean your not gonna fuck eveyone.

[thExit]

i still dont understand why dosent this forum

block ponzis this is just obvious scam 5% of people dont get scamed and 95 % does

Why should they block it? If they did, people would never learn to recognize scammers themselves. If a person gets burned once, maybe it will spare their fortune in the future. The moderators cannot act as brains for someone. What is awkward is that financial pyramids resurface in societies over time. In my country, Poland, recently we had a case of Amber Gold, a para-bank organization that was supposed to turn people’s money deposits into gold and hold it for long-term gains, promising a return few times higher than regular banks gave. It turned out that the company bought a fraction of the gold they should and “invested” the money elsewhere. Those details are not that important. What is important is that in every few years a new pyramid/heist resurfaces, even if this is in a national scale, where media continue to the topic for few months, waning people over and over. Three or four years is enough for people/the most of the society to forget that they need to be cautious with their money. Same case here. If people don’t learn once and for all to avoid Ponzis, blocking them won’t make any sense, as they may be well hidden.

I didn't think that it was so complicated actually, it's sufficient to monitor the ponzi balance, hourly payments, and new funds flow. also plots like that can be of value: https://blockchain.info/charts/received-per-day?timespan=30days&showDataPoints=false&daysAverageString=1&show_header=true&scale=0&address=1PoNzi7PGzRyvc9KWYBcaauS3oeJqa5vFg

 All this info is available through blockchain. We will also make some stats at the website soon.

There's something you don't take into consideration -
if Madoff's investors could see his books they wouldn't give him money, right?
And Bitcoin allows you to do exactly that, monitor the whole accounting, and make intellgient bets.
Bitcoin transparency is a game-changer here.

As for program promotion - it is being promoted, and also participants are very welcome to help, since their success depends on this too.

Of course I take it into consideration:) One thing you could do to improve the chances of your Fair Ponzi to succeed is to give a clear clue for investors/gamblers (choose a name:) how to behave, what to do in order to make money and make the system work. When you monitor the whole accounting, please let us, the noob Pozni gamers, know what to be looking for. Let us, the noob Ponzi gamers, know how to make "intelligent bets". Tell us to come in early, as early as possible, so we have a greater chance to get our money back before the scheme runs out of money.

I am certain that there is a strict line of behaviour, which, if followed by all the participants, would guarantee a success of this scheme. If you are proposing a Fair Ponzi, why won't you go one step further by telling people EXACTLY what to do for all of us to succeed? This would be a true novelty, and a way to make your Ponzi even more fair.

Your statement does not answer my "noob" question in any way. What values should the balance be within in a given time, what is the requirement for new funds flow, with sufficient, precise data you may convince me. "it's sufficient to monitor the ponzi balance, hourly payments, and new funds flow" those are general statements just like "invest in companies with solid foundations". If I want to invest in those companies, I will do my own research and judge myself what are those solid foundations, but here I am asking you to do the research for me in case of your Ponzi.

Let's suppose I want to be successful at your Ponzi, I am asking politely for precise clues, and you don't want to provide them. My conclusions are that you either cannot give me such clues, or you would like to use your "expert" knowledge yourself My questions come from my heart, I really want to help you run your scheme successfully, you have a chance to give all the gamblers clear guidance so both them and you can benefit, yet you neglect the chance. I'm starting to get confused. I hope that the upcoming stats on your website will answer my questions with precision.

[Joca97]

We are not a scam. Please read the program description.

i still dont understand why dosent this forum

block ponzis this is just obvious scam 5% of people dont get scamed and 95 % does

Yea thats what you all say, then you run with the money.


Just cause you tell us its a Ponzi doesnt mean your not gonna fuck eveyone.

okey if you want to get scam go for it

dont you say later that you werent warned!

[thExit]

I think it goes along those lines:

"They" have a bit of knowledge on how Bitcoin works. Maybe they are students or some youngsters. They were looking for a way to cash in on Bitcoin, they can't run a sophisticated service like an exchange, can't open a shop, can't invest the money, so they thought, well, we can come up with an honest Ponzi. We'll earn 1% provision, honestly. So they set up the website and started advocating themselves. They came up with the Ponzi as they are not capable of doing something more elaborate (not yet). It's the reversed approach to business- they thought they can do it, not wondering if people need it or want to take part in it. They created a service and are now looking for customers. Next time "they" should look at customers, what people want and need, and if "they" spot the need, then "they" should create a service. One day "they" may learn how to run a business properly, everyone needs to start at some point. I would grant them with a bit of trust- as long as they can earn at least some pennies from their 1% commission. But as they grow, the temptation to run off gets bigger:) Perhaps "they" would need an escrow.

[dooglus]

We are a Ponzi gambling system offering automated hourly payments. We do not invest, gamble, or otherwise use your money other than to pay it to the previous depositors. 1% of the deposited funds goes for system maintenance.

Wow! You don't see an honest Ponzi very often.

Well done.

[thExit]

We are a Ponzi gambling system offering automated hourly payments. We do not invest, gamble, or otherwise use your money other than to pay it to the previous depositors. 1% of the deposited funds goes for system maintenance.

Wow! You don't see an honest Ponzi very often.

Well done.

Yes, we've all been given a chance to get extra rich extra fast, and are stupid not to give it a shot.

BTW Dooglus, best wishes to you, I'm not a player nor an investor (yet), I was researching how Bitcoin is used for gambling and I run into Just-Dice thread, just a day after you decided to halt the operation. I am impressed with your work, happy to see you back in the game. Good luck

[a1choi]

i like the way you advertise this.  no guarantees of any kind and open wallet.  ponzi's still a ponzi but at least you're not putting lipstick on it.

[LanMachine]

+1

1 period complete!!

Thank you!!

[bitponzi.io]

Thanks. The idea here is to turn Ponzi's into a form of gambling. It was not possible before, but with Bitcoin it becomes possible.

i like the way you advertise this.  no guarantees of any kind and open wallet.  ponzi's still a ponzi but at least you're not putting lipstick on it.

[bitponzi.io]

You are welcome
Actually first cycle is over for many deposits already. Let's do 1000 cycles

+1

1 period complete!!

Thank you!!

[dooglus]

Wow! You don't see an honest Ponzi very often.

Well done.

Yes, we've all been given a chance to get extra rich extra fast, and are stupid not to give it a shot.

BTW Dooglus, best wishes to you, I'm not a player nor an investor (yet), I was researching how Bitcoin is used for gambling and I run into Just-Dice thread, just a day after you decided to halt the operation. I am impressed with your work, happy to see you back in the game. Good luck

There's a difference between running a Ponzi scheme honestly and running a Ponzi scheme that is worth playing.

Most people running Ponzi schemes tell their victims that they are investing the money somewhere that makes amazing returns; they're mining, or daytrading, or in some other way putting your coins to work to make the returns they promise. They're almost always lying. They just use new deposits to fund the returns of older depositors.

OP here isn't lying. He openly says that he's not investing the deposits at all, and is simply running a classic Ponzi.

That's better than what most Ponzi operators do.

I still wouldn't play, or recommend playing. But it's good that OP is being honest about his scheme.

One criticism I would make is that he's not clear about the end game. What happens when it comes to be payout time and he only has 75% of the amount he needs to make a payout?

Does he:

1) shut down, and keep the remaining funds for himself?
2) shut down, and make a final 75% payout?
3) skip this payout, wait for new deposits, then continue business as usual whenever there's enough to make a full hourly payout?
4) something else?

It would be good to have that clearly specified.

In fact it would be good to have the whole thing written up as an Ethereum contract! It could take no fee at all and be clear to everyone that it was as fair as possible. It's the next evolutionary step. We have transparency through the blockchain, we have automatic payments, and next Etherium will give us absolute certainty that OP isn't going to run with the coins, since OP is an Ethereum contract that blindly follows his own rules.

[thExit]

Wow! You don't see an honest Ponzi very often.

Well done.

Yes, we've all been given a chance to get extra rich extra fast, and are stupid not to give it a shot.

BTW Dooglus, best wishes to you, I'm not a player nor an investor (yet), I was researching how Bitcoin is used for gambling and I run into Just-Dice thread, just a day after you decided to halt the operation. I am impressed with your work, happy to see you back in the game. Good luck

There's a difference between running a Ponzi scheme honestly and running a Ponzi scheme that is worth playing.

Most people running Ponzi schemes tell their victims that they are investing the money somewhere that makes amazing returns; they're mining, or daytrading, or in some other way putting your coins to work to make the returns they promise. They're almost always lying. They just use new deposits to fund the returns of older depositors.

OP here isn't lying. He openly says that he's not investing the deposits at all, and is simply running a classic Ponzi.

That's better than what most Ponzi operators do.

I still wouldn't play, or recommend playing. But it's good that OP is being honest about his scheme.

One criticism I would make is that he's not clear about the end game. What happens when it comes to be payout time and he only has 75% of the amount he needs to make a payout?

Does he:

1) shut down, and keep the remaining funds for himself?
2) shut down, and make a final 75% payout?
3) skip this payout, wait for new deposits, then continue business as usual whenever there's enough to make a full hourly payout?
4) something else?

It would be good to have that clearly specified.

In fact it would be good to have the whole thing written up as an Ethereum contract! It could take no fee at all and be clear to everyone that it was as fair as possible. It's the next evolutionary step. We have transparency through the blockchain, we have automatic payments, and next Etherium will give us absolute certainty that OP isn't going to run with the coins, since OP is an Ethereum contract that blindly follows his own rules.

This is an idea very well put. As I am a proponent of new solutions and opportunities given by the block chain, in my recent posts I have vocalised my concerns with regards to a Ponzi, but as well given some credit of trust towards the OP. I've encouraged him to educate us how to make this Fair Ponzi run smoothly (with a dose of scepticism and mockery:) but still believing his intentions are good). This is the time to change the world as we know it, to change finances, voting, bets, contracts.

@Dooglus, it is good to have a more knowledgable member writing in this thread, I am relatively new to the cryptocurrency society, I didn't even consider looking at Ethereum (despite having heard about them), but now I will take a peak at them, what you are writing is just what I was looking for for my own projects. Thank you.

[dooglus]

I didn't even consider looking at Ethereum (despite having heard about them), but now I will take a peak at them, what you are writing is just what I was looking for for my own projects. Thank you.

As I understand it, it's like Bitcoin except that you can add arbitrarily complex (turing complete) rules to addresses. So you could write things like "each time there's a deposit to this address, split it between all the previous depositors to this address in proportion to the site of their deposit, until they have received 150% of the amount of their deposit back" into the blockchain. Then everyone can see the rule and be sure that the Ponzi was "fair".

Obviously it's still a Ponzi, and some people are going to end up out of pocket, but at least there's no OP taking his 1%, and there's no risk that OP will run off, because he never gets access to the coins.

[thExit]

Please take the following words of advice. Instead of running this Fair Ponzi by yourself, employ the blockchain technology to create a “Provably Fair Ponzi Scheme”, where we can see the balance (you already have this feature implemented;), where payouts are made automatically to all the people that cashed in, where you do not have the ability to run off with the money (in your current Ponzi there is the element of trust, why not eliminate the need for trust?), and where you automatically get the 1% maintenance fee. That would be a “Fair Ponzi”. Go for it.

Wow, it's the first time I can quote myself:D Forgive me my fuzzy description, I am quoting myself just to highlight that in fact there might be a way to achieve a Provably Fair Ponzi, as Dooglus puts it more technically:

I didn't even consider looking at Ethereum (despite having heard about them), but now I will take a peak at them, what you are writing is just what I was looking for for my own projects. Thank you.

As I understand it, it's like Bitcoin except that you can add arbitrarily complex (turing complete) rules to addresses. So you could write things like "each time there's a deposit to this address, split it between all the previous depositors to this address in proportion to the site of their deposit, until they have received 150% of the amount of their deposit back" into the blockchain. Then everyone can see the rule and be sure that the Ponzi was "fair".

Obviously it's still a Ponzi, and some people are going to end up out of pocket, but at least there's no OP taking his 1%, and there's no risk that OP will run off, because he never gets access to the coins.

BTW, you're a hazard to this thread:) saying there's no need for an OP taking 1%. But I guess this is how evolution manifests itself through the block chain.

[dooglus]

BTW, you're a hazard to this thread:) saying there's no need for an OP taking 1%. But I guess this is how evolution manifests itself through the block chain.

and hopefully to Ponzis in general. If you were to make an Etherium Ponzi with a 1% fee, someone would just clone it but change the fee to 0.5%, and so on. Since it's trustless the only thing you can compete on is fee, and so it's a race to the bottom. The fee would have to end up at zero.

See also: dice sites, exchanges, and anything else currently taking a fee for a service that can be decentralised and made trust-less.

[bitponzi.io]

Thank you for your comments. We have a way to handle such situations. Payments are made fully automatically every hour, if there's not enough funds to pay the script just waits, when new funds arrive it continues paying. Situation is also mitigated by the fact that we pay out 1% of the user deposit every hour, that is hourly payments are rather small, which makes cashflows more smooth and prevents the system from getting stuck.

Wow! You don't see an honest Ponzi very often.

Well done.

Yes, we've all been given a chance to get extra rich extra fast, and are stupid not to give it a shot.

BTW Dooglus, best wishes to you, I'm not a player nor an investor (yet), I was researching how Bitcoin is used for gambling and I run into Just-Dice thread, just a day after you decided to halt the operation. I am impressed with your work, happy to see you back in the game. Good luck

There's a difference between running a Ponzi scheme honestly and running a Ponzi scheme that is worth playing.

Most people running Ponzi schemes tell their victims that they are investing the money somewhere that makes amazing returns; they're mining, or daytrading, or in some other way putting your coins to work to make the returns they promise. They're almost always lying. They just use new deposits to fund the returns of older depositors.

OP here isn't lying. He openly says that he's not investing the deposits at all, and is simply running a classic Ponzi.

That's better than what most Ponzi operators do.

I still wouldn't play, or recommend playing. But it's good that OP is being honest about his scheme.

One criticism I would make is that he's not clear about the end game. What happens when it comes to be payout time and he only has 75% of the amount he needs to make a payout?

Does he:

1) shut down, and keep the remaining funds for himself?
2) shut down, and make a final 75% payout?
3) skip this payout, wait for new deposits, then continue business as usual whenever there's enough to make a full hourly payout?
4) something else?

It would be good to have that clearly specified.

In fact it would be good to have the whole thing written up as an Ethereum contract! It could take no fee at all and be clear to everyone that it was as fair as possible. It's the next evolutionary step. We have transparency through the blockchain, we have automatic payments, and next Etherium will give us absolute certainty that OP isn't going to run with the coins, since OP is an Ethereum contract that blindly follows his own rules.

[bitponzi.io]

As for Etherium and other crypto 2.0 - sure there will be a way to make it fully automated there, without human participation at all. This is the future of Ponzi schemes

[C.Steven]

As for Etherium and other crypto 2.0 - sure there will be a way to make it fully automated there, without human participation at all. This is the future of Ponzi schemes

Sounds like a win-win situation to me.
Those who like ponzi an play with fully automated ones.
Those who don't like ponzi won't see any ponzi thread in this section (as they will be in the altcoin section).

[mem]

We pay hourly which reduces the chances of the system getting stuck.

What do you mean?  A ponzi scheme is guaranteed to become 'stuck' when the number of suckers drawn into the system isn't enough to pay out the early adopters.

I look forward to the numerous 'umm, the payments have slowed and then stopped, you guys sure it's still working, I haven't got my investment back yet' posts.

well said sir

This is a gamble in the same way leaving your wallet on the bus and hoping to come back, find it and also have another $100 stuffed in it.

This is not a gamble in the form of a casino game, a wager or a bet.

This is a scam, a grift and most of all a tax on the gullible.

[bitponzi.io]

Please remove your negative trust you gave us. We won't let it stand. All your comments were responded to several times in this thread already. Once again, we definitely will give you negative trust back, for not taking the time to read and think.

We pay hourly which reduces the chances of the system getting stuck.

What do you mean?  A ponzi scheme is guaranteed to become 'stuck' when the number of suckers drawn into the system isn't enough to pay out the early adopters.

I look forward to the numerous 'umm, the payments have slowed and then stopped, you guys sure it's still working, I haven't got my investment back yet' posts.

well said sir

This is a gamble in the same way leaving your wallet on the bus and hoping to come back, find it and also have another $100 stuffed in it.

This is not a gamble in the form of a casino game, a wager or a bet.

This is a scam, a grift and most of all a tax on the gullible.

[thExit]

BTW, you're a hazard to this thread:) saying there's no need for an OP taking 1%. But I guess this is how evolution manifests itself through the block chain.

and hopefully to Ponzis in general. If you were to make an Etherium Ponzi with a 1% fee, someone would just clone it but change the fee to 0.5%, and so on. Since it's trustless the only thing you can compete on is fee, and so it's a race to the bottom. The fee would have to end up at zero.

See also: dice sites, exchanges, and anything else currently taking a fee for a service that can be decentralised and made trust-less.

Hopefully. Yes, I've noticed that at some point various services started competing through lowering fees. Seems a natural consequence when all of them run on similar principles in terms of functionality. The big question is how to get cryptocurrency-backed gambling services mainstream, how to compete with already established casinos. Will those casinos adopt such services by themselves, giving up their huge edge? No. Their edge allows them to make astonishing profits, if you are a kebab booth owner and you put two slot machines in your booth for people to play while waiting for their food, the "company" that owns the machines shares the profit with you, the profit can be equal to what the owner of the kebab booth makes monthly:)

Is it possible to battle them? No, they are run by mafia, supported by governments. If you try to battle them, you'll end up either in jail or at the bottom of a river. I don't know how things look in different countries, but this is how it looks in my country.

EDIT:

Please remove your negative trust you gave us. We won't let it stand. All your comments were responded to several times in this thread already. Once again, we definitely will give you negative trust back, for not taking the time to read and think.

We pay hourly which reduces the chances of the system getting stuck.

What do you mean?  A ponzi scheme is guaranteed to become 'stuck' when the number of suckers drawn into the system isn't enough to pay out the early adopters.

I look forward to the numerous 'umm, the payments have slowed and then stopped, you guys sure it's still working, I haven't got my investment back yet' posts.

well said sir

This is a gamble in the same way leaving your wallet on the bus and hoping to come back, find it and also have another $100 stuffed in it.

This is not a gamble in the form of a casino game, a wager or a bet.

This is a scam, a grift and most of all a tax on the gullible.

Mem won't get scared of getting a negative trust from you, here's the reason

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=75883.0

[bitponzi.io]

He maintains a list of scam sites? Great effort. We just don't belong there.

Mem won't get scared of getting a negative trust from you, here's the reason

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=75883.0

[thExit]

He maintains a list of scam sites? Great effort. We just don't belong there.

Mem won't get scared of getting a negative trust from you, here's the reason

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=75883.0

I hope so. I'm not here to judge whether you belong there or not, time and your deeds will tell, I'm only saying that Mem's got "some" reputation compared to you. I’m sure you will agree that each new enterprise that surfaces on this forum needs to take great effort to prove their trustworthiness, your enterprise automatically gets -1 for standing so close to Charles Ponzi. No wonder people will dislike the idea and try to warn others. Don't get upset, don't get angry at them and don't run with the money. That's all you need to do to sustain your operation:)

[bitponzi.io]

Oh well, you just don't get it.
What we should run away with, 1.7 BTC (current balance)?
The balance does not grow much, I think it's easy to understand, you pay back 24% of the user deposit back to him daily.

He maintains a list of scam sites? Great effort. We just don't belong there.

Mem won't get scared of getting a negative trust from you, here's the reason

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=75883.0

I hope so. I'm not here to judge whether you belong there or not, time and your deeds will tell, I'm only saying that Mem's got "some" reputation compared to you. I’m sure you will agree that each new enterprise that surfaces on this forum needs to take great effort to prove their trustworthiness, your enterprise automatically gets -1 for standing so close to Charles Ponzi. No wonder people will dislike the idea and try to warn others. Don't get upset, don't get angry at them and don't run with the money. That's all you need to do to sustain your operation:)

[dooglus]

This is a gamble in the same way leaving your wallet on the bus and hoping to come back, find it and also have another $100 stuffed in it.

This is not a gamble in the form of a casino game, a wager or a bet.

This is a scam, a grift and most of all a tax on the gullible.

I don't think that's fair.

If someone runs a Ponzi and claims they are making profits by mining, day-trading, robbing old ladies of their pension, or whatever else then that's a scam. Investors think they're making money in one way and it turns out they're being paid only from new deposits. One day it all stops and investors are surprised to find that they are out of pocket.

One the other hand, if a Ponzi is advertised as a Ponzi where the operator is up front about how it runs, and warns that payments will pause if new deposits dry up then everyone knows what they are getting into.

"scam" is defined as "a dishonest scheme; a fraud". This doesn't fit that definition. There's nothing dishonest about it.

"grift" is defined as "a petty swindle"; "swindle" as "a fraudulent scheme or action", and "fraudulent" as "obtained, done by, or involving deception, especially criminal deception". Again, there's no deception here. Everything is out in the open.  Deception; deceit, deceitfulness, duplicity, double-dealing, fraud, cheating, trickery, chicanery, deviousness, slyness, wiliness, guile, bluff, lying, pretense, treachery. There's none of that stuff.

Leaving negative trust feedback for someone running such a scheme doesn't seem appropriate to me.

Edit: Your trust feedback says:

Gambling that a ponzi operator will not run off with your funds IS NOT a gambling game.

That isn't the game. Every gambling site you play has a risk that the operator will run off with the funds, the same with every other service you entrust with your coins such as exchanges.

The game is whether you think the Ponzi will survive long enough for you to get paid back in full.

Edit2: also, you wrote that you risked "21,000.00000000" BTC with this guy. That's clearly not true, and is an abuse of the trust system. You are on the DefaultTrust list and so have a duty to use that power responsibly.

[thExit]

Oh well, you just don't get it.
What we should run away with, 1.7 BTC (current balance)?
The balance does not grow much, I think it's easy to understand, you pay back 24% of the user deposit back to him daily.

He maintains a list of scam sites? Great effort. We just don't belong there.

Mem won't get scared of getting a negative trust from you, here's the reason

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=75883.0

I hope so. I'm not here to judge whether you belong there or not, time and your deeds will tell, I'm only saying that Mem's got "some" reputation compared to you. I’m sure you will agree that each new enterprise that surfaces on this forum needs to take great effort to prove their trustworthiness, your enterprise automatically gets -1 for standing so close to Charles Ponzi. No wonder people will dislike the idea and try to warn others. Don't get upset, don't get angry at them and don't run with the money. That's all you need to do to sustain your operation:)

You're seriously asking for me to stop being mr. nice guy by saying s*** like that, but I'm not provoked that easily. I've tried to warn people, I've also tried to give you some credit, but you don't seem to appreciate that. Let's wait till (if ever) your balance grows to a more serious amount, now it's just candy, and if you are a true Fair Ponzi, please give us your company details, so we know who is behind this operation. Would be great to learn who we are dealing with. I bet this would help to boost your balance.

Edit:

Without much enthusiasm, as I'm about to stop being mr. nice guy, I need to agree with Dooglus, at a first glance giving a negative trust seemed to me as a warning for other members, but I guess this feature is not designed to work this way. As in a court of law, a person is not guilty unless proven otherwise. Although Bitponzi.io has some problems with understanding what they're really trying to do and how others view it, they haven't done anything wrong to deserve a negative trust. I vote that an open discussion in this thread is enough to make people aware of the dangers. I'm used to swimming against the current, so I would love a scheme like this to succeed, perhaps the use of Ethereum, as suggested earlier, would be a good choice for all the enthusiasts of Ponzi.

Edit:

http://s30.postimg.org/esac10qch/dawm.jpg


This makes me laugh

[bitponzi.io]

Many thanks for your support, especially to Dooglus, we couldn't have explained it better than you did.
We hope that Mem changes his attitude towards us. Please reconsider. We understand that you protect people from getting scammed but we are normal gambling operation, nothing more and nothing less.

[ml73]

I received 144 payments and now it has stopped??
I should have 150...am I right ??

[dooglus]

Dooglus, how do you know there's no deception here? Usually these things end with the site operator running away with the bank when it gets large enough.

I don't know that the operator isn't going to run away with the funds, but I don't know that about any site that accepts coins. CoinBase, BitStamp, whatever dice sites are still running - they all have that risk.

The problem I have with most Ponzi schemes is that the operator lies about where the "profits" are coming from. They tell you you're investing in mining equipment, or funding their day trading on exchanges, investing in oil rigs, or whatever else they can think of, when in fact it is just a Ponzi.

This guy says "I'm not investing in anything. I'm going to use new deposits to pay out old investors, I'm going to take 1% of each new deposit for myself, and if new desposits dry up, you're out of luck".

That's not a good thing to get involved in, but I don't see how it's any worse than rolling dice against a 1% house edge.

There are 3 risks:

1) the game's odds are stacked against you. You're likely to lose
2) the site operator may abscond with the bankroll before the game is over
3) the site operator may be lying about how the game works

1 and 2 are risks with any game
3 is the risk that isn't present here, and it's the absence of that risk that I commend him for.

[Bizmark13]

One criticism I would make is that he's not clear about the end game. What happens when it comes to be payout time and he only has 75% of the amount he needs to make a payout?

Does he:

1) shut down, and keep the remaining funds for himself?
2) shut down, and make a final 75% payout?
3) skip this payout, wait for new deposits, then continue business as usual whenever there's enough to make a full hourly payout?
4) something else?

It would be good to have that clearly specified.

If my understanding of ponzis is correct, I would think that if new deposits slowed down, payouts would simply take longer and longer to fulfill.

[dooglus]

One criticism I would make is that he's not clear about the end game. What happens when it comes to be payout time and he only has 75% of the amount he needs to make a payout?

Does he:

1) shut down, and keep the remaining funds for himself?
2) shut down, and make a final 75% payout?
3) skip this payout, wait for new deposits, then continue business as usual whenever there's enough to make a full hourly payout?
4) something else?

It would be good to have that clearly specified.

If my understanding of ponzis is correct, I would think that if new deposits slowed down, payouts would simply take longer and longer to fulfill.

It really depends on the operator.

"Bent" operators may decide to close the scheme as soon as the rate of new deposits slows to below the rate of outgoing payments. If their aim is to run off with the coins then it makes sense to stop when the available "haul" is as big as possible.

Even a legit operator may decide to close the scheme as soon as there are not enough coins available to make a regular payout. So long as that is announced up front I think that's OK. We just need to know what the rules are.

In this case I think he has said that he will run the scheme indefinitely, just skipping hourly payouts if he doesn't have enough to make a full payout.

[bitponzi.io]

Yes, this is correct. If there's not enough funds, well, that's it. Let's wait for some new funds.
Actually it can be seen that this shouldn't be the case for quite a while

One criticism I would make is that he's not clear about the end game. What happens when it comes to be payout time and he only has 75% of the amount he needs to make a payout?

Does he:

1) shut down, and keep the remaining funds for himself?
2) shut down, and make a final 75% payout?
3) skip this payout, wait for new deposits, then continue business as usual whenever there's enough to make a full hourly payout?
4) something else?

It would be good to have that clearly specified.

If my understanding of ponzis is correct, I would think that if new deposits slowed down, payouts would simply take longer and longer to fulfill.

It really depends on the operator.

"Bent" operators may decide to close the scheme as soon as the rate of new deposits slows to below the rate of outgoing payments. If their aim is to run off with the coins then it makes sense to stop when the available "haul" is as big as possible.

Even a legit operator may decide to close the scheme as soon as there are not enough coins available to make a regular payout. So long as that is announced up front I think that's OK. We just need to know what the rules are.

In this case I think he has said that he will run the scheme indefinitely, just skipping hourly payouts if he doesn't have enough to make a full payout.

[dooglus]

Yes, this is correct. If there's not enough funds, well, that's it. Let's wait for some new funds.
Actually it can be seen that this shouldn't be the case for quite a while

The chart of the balance at the fund's address is interesting.

It looks like you're about 24 hours from ruin all the time if no new funds are deposited.

Look at the steepness of the drops, and how soon they would hit the zero line if nobody deposited:

[bitponzi.io]

Sure, this is really interesting indeed, all ponzi mechanics is open for everyone to see.
When considering the sustainability one should also take into account cash flows, not only the balance chart. If you look at this plot (number of transactions per day) https://blockchain.info/charts/n-transactions?timespan=30days&showDataPoints=false&daysAverageString=1&show_header=true&scale=0&address=1PoNzi7PGzRyvc9KWYBcaauS3oeJqa5vFg you can see that the number of transactions grows, which actually stabilizes the program.

Yes, this is correct. If there's not enough funds, well, that's it. Let's wait for some new funds.
Actually it can be seen that this shouldn't be the case for quite a while

The chart of the balance at the fund's address is interesting.

It looks like you're about 24 hours from ruin all the time if no new funds are deposited.

Look at the steepness of the drops, and how soon they would hit the zero line if nobody deposited:

https://i.imgur.com/5c21nJo.png

[thExit]

One criticism I would make is that he's not clear about the end game. What happens when it comes to be payout time and he only has 75% of the amount he needs to make a payout?

Does he:

1) shut down, and keep the remaining funds for himself?
2) shut down, and make a final 75% payout?
3) skip this payout, wait for new deposits, then continue business as usual whenever there's enough to make a full hourly payout?
4) something else?

It would be good to have that clearly specified.

If my understanding of ponzis is correct, I would think that if new deposits slowed down, payouts would simply take longer and longer to fulfill.

It really depends on the operator.

"Bent" operators may decide to close the scheme as soon as the rate of new deposits slows to below the rate of outgoing payments. If their aim is to run off with the coins then it makes sense to stop when the available "haul" is as big as possible.

Even a legit operator may decide to close the scheme as soon as there are not enough coins available to make a regular payout. So long as that is announced up front I think that's OK. We just need to know what the rules are.

In this case I think he has said that he will run the scheme indefinitely, just skipping hourly payouts if he doesn't have enough to make a full payout.

@Dooglus, your comments, including the previous post, are very true, it's a good description/analysis of how this scheme operates and what could be the possible consequences, without adopting a positive or a negative bias towards the scheme.

I've taken some time to do some calculation, to see, at least hypothetically, what the numbers tell. I assumed that one User would put in 1 BTC and receive 1,5 BTC in 6 days. Obviously the “real” scheme operates in a different manner, with various Users putting different amounts of money, but it evens out over time. Also, the “real” scheme uses hourly payments and I’ve only considered a full 6-day cycle per member.

One more thing that is worth noticing is that the simulation assumes that every User would withdraw his Bitcoins, would not send them again into the scheme. I guess a lot of present Users of the “real” scheme are willing to reinvest what they have received, thus creating a case as we have with banks, where the amount owed by the banks to their customers is higher than the bank’s real holdings.

After level 3, to sustain the operation, for every User there is a need of two more Users to "donate" their deposits (a part of them). I calculated it only for 10 levels as I've run out of paper (using 4xA4) doing an Excel sheet would take me more time. It was kind of fun, I hope the operation doesn't get stuck at the same point as I did Those are my best wishes towards people who put in the money.

If you can see any flaws in the calculations or in my reasoning as to the simulation, I’d be happy to hear about it. I’ll take some time later to review my assumptions to examine if there are no mistakes, or if it can be done better to suit the "real" operation. Maybe anyone knows a “Ponzi for Dummies” book, I bet there is a lesson to be learned here.

http://s12.postimg.org/ymagrwogt/10_Level_Pyramid_v22.jpg



Here's a higher resolution image:

http://s30.postimg.org/s3ryiwuy9/10_Level_Pyramid_v1.jpg


The address chart balance is a great source of information, I would still consider this operation an interesting experiment.

Sure, this is really interesting indeed, all ponzi mechanics is open for everyone to see.
When considering the sustainability one should also take into account cash flows, not only the balance chart. If you look at this plot (number of transactions per day) https://blockchain.info/charts/n-transactions?timespan=30days&showDataPoints=false&daysAverageString=1&show_header=true&scale=0&address=1PoNzi7PGzRyvc9KWYBcaauS3oeJqa5vFg you can see that the number of transactions grows, which actually stabilizes the program.

Yes, this is correct. If there's not enough funds, well, that's it. Let's wait for some new funds.
Actually it can be seen that this shouldn't be the case for quite a while

The chart of the balance at the fund's address is interesting.

It looks like you're about 24 hours from ruin all the time if no new funds are deposited.

Look at the steepness of the drops, and how soon they would hit the zero line if nobody deposited:

https://i.imgur.com/5c21nJo.png

[bitponzi.io]

Great effort, but this is NOT a pyramid scheme, this is Ponzi scheme, it's not the same, not the same at all. Pyramids and levels belong to multilevel and affiliate program world, that is people are getting paid for bringing new members, part of their deposits. We do not have any affiliate program.

[allsopfree]

Are the payments automated or you have to wait for them ?

[dooglus]

One more thing that is worth noticing is that the simulation assumes that every User would withdraw his Bitcoins, would not send them again into the scheme. I guess a lot of present Users of the “real” scheme are willing to reinvest what they have received, thus creating a case as we have with banks, where the amount owed by the banks to their customers is higher than the bank’s real holdings.

One thing to note is that as soon as the first person deposits, the scheme already owes more than it has.

If the first depositor sends 1 BTC, he is "owed"* 1.5 BTC, and the scheme is already insolvent to the tune of 0.5 BTC.

Every time anyone deposits, the scheme only gets further into debt, because although their assets increase by X, their liabilities increase by 1.5 times X. Basically half of every new deposit counts as extra unfunded debt.

(*) except he isn't "owed" anything really. He's playing a game, and knows that he might get back less than he put in. That's part of the game. The problem is when the players don't know what game they're playing, like these poor people.

[bitponzi.io]

It's all automated, sent every hour.

Are the payments automated or you have to wait for them ?

[Loocid]

One more thing that is worth noticing is that the simulation assumes that every User would withdraw his Bitcoins, would not send them again into the scheme. I guess a lot of present Users of the “real” scheme are willing to reinvest what they have received, thus creating a case as we have with banks, where the amount owed by the banks to their customers is higher than the bank’s real holdings.

One thing to note is that as soon as the first person deposits, the scheme already owes more than it has.

If the first depositor sends 1 BTC, he is "owed"* 1.5 BTC, and the scheme is already insolvent to the tune of 0.5 BTC.

Every time anyone deposits, the scheme only gets further into debt, because although their assets increase by X, their liabilities increase by 1.5 times X. Basically half of every new deposit counts as extra unfunded debt.

(*) except he isn't "owed" anything really. He's playing a game, and knows that he might get back less than he put in. That's part of the game. The problem is when the players don't know what game they're playing, like these poor people.

I think that is the whole thrill of the idea. With the owner being transparent with their dealings (outside of their end game) everyone should hopefully understand there is literally no way everyone can be paid. The thrill is if you will be in the group of final suckers that will get screwed. While not invested myself, I can definitely see the appeal of such a venture.

[silvestar]

Here's a higher resolution image:

http://s30.postimg.org/s3ryiwuy9/10_Level_Pyramid_v1.jpg

It seems you have put the wrong link, that "higher resolution image" doesn't look right. 

[bitponzi.io]

There's no end game actually, or it is very simple. If there's money to pay, payment are processed, if not- the system is waiting for new funds. So it goes on.

One more thing that is worth noticing is that the simulation assumes that every User would withdraw his Bitcoins, would not send them again into the scheme. I guess a lot of present Users of the “real” scheme are willing to reinvest what they have received, thus creating a case as we have with banks, where the amount owed by the banks to their customers is higher than the bank’s real holdings.

One thing to note is that as soon as the first person deposits, the scheme already owes more than it has.

If the first depositor sends 1 BTC, he is "owed"* 1.5 BTC, and the scheme is already insolvent to the tune of 0.5 BTC.

Every time anyone deposits, the scheme only gets further into debt, because although their assets increase by X, their liabilities increase by 1.5 times X. Basically half of every new deposit counts as extra unfunded debt.

(*) except he isn't "owed" anything really. He's playing a game, and knows that he might get back less than he put in. That's part of the game. The problem is when the players don't know what game they're playing, like these poor people.

I think that is the whole thrill of the idea. With the owner being transparent with their dealings (outside of their end game) everyone should hopefully understand there is literally no way everyone can be paid. The thrill is if you will be in the group of final suckers that will get screwed. While not invested myself, I can definitely see the appeal of such a venture.

[thExit]

Great effort, but this is NOT a pyramid scheme, this is Ponzi scheme, it's not the same, not the same at all. Pyramids and levels belong to multilevel and affiliate program world, that is people are getting paid for bringing new members, part of their deposits. We do not have any affiliate program.

I get your point, especially after reading the following bits:

Quoting http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ponzi_scheme

“A pyramid scheme is a form of fraud similar in some ways to a Ponzi scheme, relying as it does on a mistaken belief in a nonexistent financial reality, including the hope of an extremely high rate of return. However, several characteristics distinguish these schemes from Ponzi schemes:[1]
•   In a Ponzi scheme, the schemer acts as a "hub" for the victims, interacting with all of them directly. In a pyramid scheme, those who recruit additional participants benefit directly. (In fact, failure to recruit typically means no investment return.)
•   A Ponzi scheme claims to rely on some esoteric investment approach and often attracts well-to-do investors; whereas pyramid schemes explicitly claim that new money will be the source of payout for the initial investments.
•   A pyramid scheme typically collapses much faster because it requires exponential increases in participants to sustain it. By contrast, Ponzi schemes can survive simply by persuading most existing participants to reinvest their money, with a relatively small number of new participants.”


Quoting http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pyramid_scheme

“A pyramid scheme is an unsustainable business model that involves promising participants payment or services, primarily for enrolling other people into the scheme, rather than supplying any real investment or sale of products or services to the public.[1][2]”

XXXXXX

One more thing that is worth noticing is that the simulation assumes that every User would withdraw his Bitcoins, would not send them again into the scheme. I guess a lot of present Users of the “real” scheme are willing to reinvest what they have received, thus creating a case as we have with banks, where the amount owed by the banks to their customers is higher than the bank’s real holdings.

One thing to note is that as soon as the first person deposits, the scheme already owes more than it has.

If the first depositor sends 1 BTC, he is "owed"* 1.5 BTC, and the scheme is already insolvent to the tune of 0.5 BTC.

Every time anyone deposits, the scheme only gets further into debt, because although their assets increase by X, their liabilities increase by 1.5 times X. Basically half of every new deposit counts as extra unfunded debt.

(*) except he isn't "owed" anything really. He's playing a game, and knows that he might get back less than he put in. That's part of the game. The problem is when the players don't know what game they're playing, like these poor people.

That is a good point to make, especially talking about assets increase versus liabilities increase. I didn’t think about it this way.

XXXXXX

It seems you have put the wrong link, that "higher resolution image" doesn't look right. 

You're right, sorry about that, the resolution was the same but the quality was better (I suppose)

[Didldak]

its funny how these two websites are similar, design and code wise =)

http://cloudhashers.net/ http://bitponzi.io/

[bitponzi.io]

Actually we drew inspiration from ponzi.io, now defunct. But we checked other ponzis which don't recognize that they are ponzi's too 

its funny how these two websites are similar, design and code wise =)

http://cloudhashers.net/ http://bitponzi.io/

[spendprofit.biz]

Hey folks.
Trying ★★★ https://spendprofit.biz/ 2.5% Hourly profit - SSL Trusted ★★★

[bitponzi.io]

Picking up steam (balance chart):  https://blockchain.info/charts/balance?timespan=30days&showDataPoints=false&daysAverageString=1&show_header=true&scale=0&address=1PoNzi7PGzRyvc9KWYBcaauS3oeJqa5vFg
Users often ask us how to maximize the chances of getting paid without problems
Such charts can give some indications. You can see that at the moment we receive around 6BTC per day.
It means that you definitely shouldn't deposit an amount comparable to that. 1.5-2 BTC maximum would be optimal. If you want to deposit more do it in several payments, in consecutive days.

[bitponzi.io]

Important: we won't change your payout address on request. We have no way to check that you are the person that made the transaction. The only situation we could do something is when you're not getting paid at all, due to paying from coinbase for example. Even in this case we will need as much information from you as possible.

[blacksmithtm]

...Since it's trustless the only thing you can compete on is fee, and so it's a race to the bottom. The fee would have to end up at zero.

See also: dice sites, exchanges, and anything else currently taking a fee for a service that can be decentralised and made trust-less.

Hi doog, much respect to you for making just-dice and all the work you do on this forum regarding scammers etc.

I just wanted to chime in and say fee is not the only thing provably fair ponzis can compete on. It can be the mechanisms themselves. For example how often payout? How much. Will there be levels for each investor, can you pay more for a bigger return etc.. There are many things to compete on, the idea is to make it fun and rewarding, and this is just the beginning.

[bitponzi.io]

This is correct, there can be very many variations. We chose the most basic one, at the same time giving a nod to the original 150% scheme of Mr. Ponzi.

...Since it's trustless the only thing you can compete on is fee, and so it's a race to the bottom. The fee would have to end up at zero.

See also: dice sites, exchanges, and anything else currently taking a fee for a service that can be decentralised and made trust-less.

Hi doog, much respect to you for making just-dice and all the work you do on this forum regarding scammers etc.

I just wanted to chime in and say fee is not the only thing provably fair ponzis can compete on. It can be the mechanisms themselves. For example how often payout? How much. Will there be levels for each investor, can you pay more for a bigger return etc.. There are many things to compete on, the idea is to make it fun and rewarding, and this is just the beginning.

[thExit]

...Since it's trustless the only thing you can compete on is fee, and so it's a race to the bottom. The fee would have to end up at zero.

See also: dice sites, exchanges, and anything else currently taking a fee for a service that can be decentralised and made trust-less.

Hi doog, much respect to you for making just-dice and all the work you do on this forum regarding scammers etc.

I just wanted to chime in and say fee is not the only thing provably fair ponzis can compete on. It can be the mechanisms themselves. For example how often payout? How much. Will there be levels for each investor, can you pay more for a bigger return etc.. There are many things to compete on, the idea is to make it fun and rewarding, and this is just the beginning.

Giving this a thought, you are right, the fee is not the only factor. Time may be perceived as one factor, but is it so influential? What difference does it make if payments are made every hour or every 10 minutes? If they are made too often, the scheme would get stuck due to lack of funds, and this would discourage new investors. Regarding time, there might be a prompter-like attitude with gradable profit factor- if the scheme is in need of new funds then instead of 150% you will receibe 300% but this would mean that the scheme would go further and deeper into debt, as Dooglus nicely called it an increase in liabilities.

I've spent some time today reading about Ethereum, as a solution (also) suggested by Dooglus, I went through their whitepaper and in terms of security, from the perspective of the people who risk their money, it really seems a good idea to run such a Ponzi operation with the use of their service. It becomes trustless, the only minus being the cost of Ether- of sustaining the operation with the native currency, but I guess it would be comparable to the managment fee/system maintenance. Thus, a good suggestion by Dooglus.

[bitponzi.io]

Once again we'd like to ask user MEM to remove negative trust he gave us. He does not respond to any requests, but still.  Also we'd like users who make money with us to give us positive trust. Forum trust affects the image of the program, and the image of the program affects the stability of your payouts, since we are a Ponzi after all.

[dooglus]

Once again we'd like to ask user MEM to remove negative trust he gave us. He does not respond to any requests, but still.  Also we'd like users who make money with us to give us positive trust. Forum trust affects the image of the program, and the image of the program affects the stability of your payouts, since we are a Ponzi after all.

I just left you positive feedback, for what it's worth.

I've not used your service, but it does appear that you're running it honestly.

[bitponzi.io]

Thank you very much indeed, we really appreciate it, especially from you.

Once again we'd like to ask user MEM to remove negative trust he gave us. He does not respond to any requests, but still.  Also we'd like users who make money with us to give us positive trust. Forum trust affects the image of the program, and the image of the program affects the stability of your payouts, since we are a Ponzi after all.

I just left you positive feedback, for what it's worth.

I've not used your service, but it does appear that you're running it honestly.

[sherbyspark]

This looks promising, would love to see what the end result is.

[Kords21]

As of this response, this program has been paying out pretty much every hour on the hour. I couldn't be any happier with it. I hope it continues and doesn't just disappear like some other programs tend to do. I plan to invest a bit more in the not too distant future.

[bitponzi.io]

Thank you for your feedback. We think that the key to success and stability here is transparency. We're working on the updated version of our website, with more statistics which will help users make  deposit decisions more intelligently. It is here now: bitponzi.io/new. If you would like to see some more stats there please let us know

[sherbyspark]

Just curious. There was a 1btc send to bit chest in the last pay hour, which would be the case only if they had invested 100 btc.
Is there any reason for this payment?
I might have missed something so just clarifying.

EDIT: I was wrong. I guess I was hallucinating. There doesnt seem to be a payout of 1BTC.

[dooglus]

Just curious. There was a 1btc send to bit chest in the last pay hour, which would be the case only if they had invested 100 btc.
Is there any reason for this payment?
I might have missed something so just clarifying.

I'm not seeing it in the list of transactions from 1PoNzi7PGzRyvc9KWYBcaauS3oeJqa5vFg.

[sherbyspark]

Thats weird, I was sure I saw it at the end of the list of a payout. Cant seem to find it now. No explanation for it. Maybe I was hallucinating.
And I also remember seeing, -1.2 something.

[bitponzi.io]

That could happen if we withdrew our profit which is 1% of the total deposits. But we haven't done it yet actually.

Thats weird, I was sure I saw it at the end of the list of a payout. Cant seem to find it now. No explanation for it. Maybe I was hallucinating.
And I also remember seeing, -1.2 something.

[dooglus]

That could happen if we withdrew our profit which is 1% of the total deposits. But we haven't done it yet actually.

That isn't clear at all from the game's description.

It would be better if you took your 1% from each deposit as soon as it happens. Then people can see how much is really left in the game just by watching the blockchain.

People are assuming the game doesn't stop paying until the balance in the 1ponzi address is zero, but that's not the case. It will stop paying when payouts start cutting into your paid 1% fees.

[bitponzi.io]

We thought about that, but it seems really cumbersome to take it from each deposit.
That probably would raise a lot of questions. But I get your point.

Let's make the following rule - we withdraw 1 BTC each time we get new 100 BTC in deposits.
That is as soon as we have 100 BTC in deposits we withdraw 1 BTC, as soon as we have 200 we withdraw another 1 BTC and so on. If we cannot withdraw it due to low balance we wait till we have sufficient balance. We're here for a long term program, we don't need to take 1btc out and damage the program.

That could happen if we withdrew our profit which is 1% of the total deposits. But we haven't done it yet actually.

That isn't clear at all from the game's description.

It would be better if you took your 1% from each deposit as soon as it happens. Then people can see how much is really left in the game just by watching the blockchain.

People are assuming the game doesn't stop paying until the balance in the 1ponzi address is zero, but that's not the case. It will stop paying when payouts start cutting into your paid 1% fees.

[bitponzi.io]

Just click on the rating and see for yourself who gave it to us and so on. Actually we'll put it the signature now.

Your trust rating makes me not want to invest/gamble

[bitponzi.io]

No, it shouldn't. There's 150 payments for each deposit, don't forget. Deposits older than 150 hours don't contribute to the total payout.

[dooglus]

We thought about that, but it seems really cumbersome to take it from each deposit.
That probably would raise a lot of questions. But I get your point.

Let's make the following rule - we withdraw 1 BTC each time we get new 100 BTC in deposits.
That is as soon as we have 100 BTC in deposits we withdraw 1 BTC, as soon as we have 200 we withdraw another 1 BTC and so on. If we cannot withdraw it due to low balance we wait till we have sufficient balance. We're here for a long term program, we don't need to take 1btc out and damage the program.

OK, so you get lots of tiny deposits, and for some of them taking 1% would mean taking less than a transaction fee which is very wasteful.

So how about this:

Each time you make an hourly payout, you pay yourself however much you're owed, based on all the deposits you've received since the last time you paid yourself.

That will usually not add enough to the transaction size to require any extra fee, and makes it clearer to everyone how much is really in the fund. As it is I don't know if you own 0.01 or 0.99 BTC of the fund in unclaimed fees.

[blacksmithtm]

What happens if you deposit less than the minimum amount?

[blacksmithtm]

Also if you have 25 BTC this is a good way to earn 12.5 btc... Pour 25 btc in. People will think there is plenty of money and pour in their own 1 btc amounts... But they are just paying you in reality. There is going to be enough suckers thinking there is plenty money in, you will have your 12.5 BTC before it collapses

Also how many payments can there be in a single transaction on the blockchain? I imagine the system might have trouble if it suddenly have to pay to 100 different adresses every hour?

[Bitcoinbikers]

Funds haven't moved since the 25th of June  https://blockchain.info/address/1PoNzi7PGzRyvc9KWYBcaauS3oeJqa5vFg

Edit: I was looking at the last page, my bad!

[zwickl]

We thought about that, but it seems really cumbersome to take it from each deposit.
That probably would raise a lot of questions. But I get your point.

Let's make the following rule - we withdraw 1 BTC each time we get new 100 BTC in deposits.
That is as soon as we have 100 BTC in deposits we withdraw 1 BTC, as soon as we have 200 we withdraw another 1 BTC and so on. If we cannot withdraw it due to low balance we wait till we have sufficient balance. We're here for a long term program, we don't need to take 1btc out and damage the program.

OK, so you get lots of tiny deposits, and for some of them taking 1% would mean taking less than a transaction fee which is very wasteful.

So how about this:

Each time you make an hourly payout, you pay yourself however much you're owed, based on all the deposits you've received since the last time you paid yourself.

That will usually not add enough to the transaction size to require any extra fee, and makes it clearer to everyone how much is really in the fund. As it is I don't know if you own 0.01 or 0.99 BTC of the fund in unclaimed fees.

I really hope there's enough "investors" checking the address' balance before sending their own money. But having a big fish in there would certainly attrack more tadpoles

[Loophole]

Once again we'd like to ask user MEM to remove negative trust he gave us. He does not respond to any requests, but still.

mem hasn't come back to bitcointalk since Jul 2 (the day he left you negative trust)

[Bitcoinbikers]

You've got a competitor now http://www.bitcointaboo.com/the-ponzi-game.php

[sidhujag]

We thought about that, but it seems really cumbersome to take it from each deposit.
That probably would raise a lot of questions. But I get your point.

Let's make the following rule - we withdraw 1 BTC each time we get new 100 BTC in deposits.
That is as soon as we have 100 BTC in deposits we withdraw 1 BTC, as soon as we have 200 we withdraw another 1 BTC and so on. If we cannot withdraw it due to low balance we wait till we have sufficient balance. We're here for a long term program, we don't need to take 1btc out and damage the program.

OK, so you get lots of tiny deposits, and for some of them taking 1% would mean taking less than a transaction fee which is very wasteful.

So how about this:

Each time you make an hourly payout, you pay yourself however much you're owed, based on all the deposits you've received since the last time you paid yourself.

That will usually not add enough to the transaction size to require any extra fee, and makes it clearer to everyone how much is really in the fund. As it is I don't know if you own 0.01 or 0.99 BTC of the fund in unclaimed fees.

Is it not possible to add in the 1% into the ethereum contract? What about if you used open transactions since the idea was even grandma can make contracts but the gui never came to fruition.

[bitponzi.io]

yes it's doable, but actually our fees are also very easy to see - this is just 1% of the total deposited amount, can be checked at blockchain.info

We thought about that, but it seems really cumbersome to take it from each deposit.
That probably would raise a lot of questions. But I get your point.

Let's make the following rule - we withdraw 1 BTC each time we get new 100 BTC in deposits.
That is as soon as we have 100 BTC in deposits we withdraw 1 BTC, as soon as we have 200 we withdraw another 1 BTC and so on. If we cannot withdraw it due to low balance we wait till we have sufficient balance. We're here for a long term program, we don't need to take 1btc out and damage the program.

OK, so you get lots of tiny deposits, and for some of them taking 1% would mean taking less than a transaction fee which is very wasteful.

So how about this:

Each time you make an hourly payout, you pay yourself however much you're owed, based on all the deposits you've received since the last time you paid yourself.

That will usually not add enough to the transaction size to require any extra fee, and makes it clearer to everyone how much is really in the fund. As it is I don't know if you own 0.01 or 0.99 BTC of the fund in unclaimed fees.

[bitponzi.io]

We refund it on request. Thought about automated refunds but it's an easy way to spam the system obviously.

What happens if you deposit less than the minimum amount?

[bitponzi.io]

You don't understand how it works actually. Please read the program description.
As for the payments - no problem up to several thousands hourly payments.

Also if you have 25 BTC this is a good way to earn 12.5 btc... Pour 25 btc in. People will think there is plenty of money and pour in their own 1 btc amounts... But they are just paying you in reality. There is going to be enough suckers thinking there is plenty money in, you will have your 12.5 BTC before it collapses

Also how many payments can there be in a single transaction on the blockchain? I imagine the system might have trouble if it suddenly have to pay to 100 different adresses every hour?

[dooglus]

yes it's doable, but actually our fees are also very easy to see - this is just 1% of the total deposited amount, can be checked at blockchain.info

Suppose you have collected 100 BTC in deposits, your fee is 1%, and your public address currently holds 1.1 BTC.

I can tell that so far you have collected 100 BTC.
So I can tell that you've "earned" 1 BTC in fees.
But I can't tell whether you've withdrawn your fees or not.

So maybe you already withdrew the 1 BTC, and the fund has 1.1 BTC to pay out future payments.
But maybe you didn't, so the fund only has 0.1 BTC to pay out future payments.
Or maybe you took out some but not all of the 1 BTC fee, so anywhere between 0.1 and 1.1 BTC is available for payouts.

This ambiguity makes it impossible for potential investors to make informed decisions.

[bitponzi.io]

Sure it's possible
When (and if) Etherium is online. There are gonna be other alts which allow this, this is certain.

We thought about that, but it seems really cumbersome to take it from each deposit.
That probably would raise a lot of questions. But I get your point.

Let's make the following rule - we withdraw 1 BTC each time we get new 100 BTC in deposits.
That is as soon as we have 100 BTC in deposits we withdraw 1 BTC, as soon as we have 200 we withdraw another 1 BTC and so on. If we cannot withdraw it due to low balance we wait till we have sufficient balance. We're here for a long term program, we don't need to take 1btc out and damage the program.

OK, so you get lots of tiny deposits, and for some of them taking 1% would mean taking less than a transaction fee which is very wasteful.

So how about this:

Each time you make an hourly payout, you pay yourself however much you're owed, based on all the deposits you've received since the last time you paid yourself.

That will usually not add enough to the transaction size to require any extra fee, and makes it clearer to everyone how much is really in the fund. As it is I don't know if you own 0.01 or 0.99 BTC of the fund in unclaimed fees.

Is it not possible to add in the 1% into the ethereum contract? What about if you used open transactions since the idea was even grandma can make contracts but the gui never came to fruition.

[bitponzi.io]

Yes I get your point, for now we'll withdraw it by 1 btc each 100 btc, but we'll make an automated script to withdraw the fee, I think it should be per 24 hours after all.

yes it's doable, but actually our fees are also very easy to see - this is just 1% of the total deposited amount, can be checked at blockchain.info

Suppose you have collected 100 BTC in deposits, your fee is 1%, and your public address currently holds 1.1 BTC.

I can tell that so far you have collected 100 BTC.
So I can tell that you've "earned" 1 BTC in fees.
But I can't tell whether you've withdrawn your fees or not.

So maybe you already withdrew the 1 BTC, and the fund has 1.1 BTC to pay out future payments.
But maybe you didn't, so the fund only has 0.1 BTC to pay out future payments.
Or maybe you took out some but not all of the 1 BTC fee, so anywhere between 0.1 and 1.1 BTC is available for payouts.

This ambiguity makes it impossible for potential investors to make informed decisions.

[bitponzi.io]

Updated our website, please check. We'll add more stats to it within a couple of days.

[sidhujag]

Sure it's possible
When (and if) Etherium is online. There are gonna be other alts which allow this, this is certain.

We thought about that, but it seems really cumbersome to take it from each deposit.
That probably would raise a lot of questions. But I get your point.

Let's make the following rule - we withdraw 1 BTC each time we get new 100 BTC in deposits.
That is as soon as we have 100 BTC in deposits we withdraw 1 BTC, as soon as we have 200 we withdraw another 1 BTC and so on. If we cannot withdraw it due to low balance we wait till we have sufficient balance. We're here for a long term program, we don't need to take 1btc out and damage the program.

OK, so you get lots of tiny deposits, and for some of them taking 1% would mean taking less than a transaction fee which is very wasteful.

So how about this:

Each time you make an hourly payout, you pay yourself however much you're owed, based on all the deposits you've received since the last time you paid yourself.

That will usually not add enough to the transaction size to require any extra fee, and makes it clearer to everyone how much is really in the fund. As it is I don't know if you own 0.01 or 0.99 BTC of the fund in unclaimed fees.

Is it not possible to add in the 1% into the ethereum contract? What about if you used open transactions since the idea was even grandma can make contracts but the gui never came to fruition.

OT already is out , can it not do the smart contracts?

[bitcoin4eva]

I am actually highly surprised that I have got paid every hour with the amount that I should have. I'm going to invest more once the cycle I'm in completes!

[bitponzi.io]

Excuse me what's OT?
As far as I know smart contracts like that are not supported by any live system at the moment.
It could work even with Bitcoin, if they didn't kill scripting

Sure it's possible
When (and if) Etherium is online. There are gonna be other alts which allow this, this is certain.

We thought about that, but it seems really cumbersome to take it from each deposit.
That probably would raise a lot of questions. But I get your point.

Let's make the following rule - we withdraw 1 BTC each time we get new 100 BTC in deposits.
That is as soon as we have 100 BTC in deposits we withdraw 1 BTC, as soon as we have 200 we withdraw another 1 BTC and so on. If we cannot withdraw it due to low balance we wait till we have sufficient balance. We're here for a long term program, we don't need to take 1btc out and damage the program.

OK, so you get lots of tiny deposits, and for some of them taking 1% would mean taking less than a transaction fee which is very wasteful.

So how about this:

Each time you make an hourly payout, you pay yourself however much you're owed, based on all the deposits you've received since the last time you paid yourself.

That will usually not add enough to the transaction size to require any extra fee, and makes it clearer to everyone how much is really in the fund. As it is I don't know if you own 0.01 or 0.99 BTC of the fund in unclaimed fees.

Is it not possible to add in the 1% into the ethereum contract? What about if you used open transactions since the idea was even grandma can make contracts but the gui never came to fruition.

OT already is out , can it not do the smart contracts?

[bitponzi.io]

If you have been burnt with scam ponzies it is understandable. Otherwise not so much, since the whole machinery of our operation is completely open for everyone to see. You can see actually when you should be getting paid and when probably you will have to wait.

I am actually highly surprised that I have got paid every hour with the amount that I should have. I'm going to invest more once the cycle I'm in completes!

[sidhujag]

Excuse me what's OT?
As far as I know smart contracts like that are not supported by any live system at the moment.
It could work even with Bitcoin, if they didn't kill scripting

Sure it's possible
When (and if) Etherium is online. There are gonna be other alts which allow this, this is certain.

We thought about that, but it seems really cumbersome to take it from each deposit.
That probably would raise a lot of questions. But I get your point.

Let's make the following rule - we withdraw 1 BTC each time we get new 100 BTC in deposits.
That is as soon as we have 100 BTC in deposits we withdraw 1 BTC, as soon as we have 200 we withdraw another 1 BTC and so on. If we cannot withdraw it due to low balance we wait till we have sufficient balance. We're here for a long term program, we don't need to take 1btc out and damage the program.

OK, so you get lots of tiny deposits, and for some of them taking 1% would mean taking less than a transaction fee which is very wasteful.

So how about this:

Each time you make an hourly payout, you pay yourself however much you're owed, based on all the deposits you've received since the last time you paid yourself.

That will usually not add enough to the transaction size to require any extra fee, and makes it clearer to everyone how much is really in the fund. As it is I don't know if you own 0.01 or 0.99 BTC of the fund in unclaimed fees.

Is it not possible to add in the 1% into the ethereum contract? What about if you used open transactions since the idea was even grandma can make contracts but the gui never came to fruition.

OT already is out , can it not do the smart contracts?

http://opentransactions.org/wiki/index.php?title=Smart_contracts

[sherbyspark]

Hey Guys, I was doing a simulation of the scheme and came with a massive discrepancy at the end.
In My simulation I assumed,every investor deposits 100 $.  and payout is 10$ every hour(with max payout 150%).


I also assume, that every new investor invests after a fixed time(1 hr). So after every hour as seen in the excel sheet payout grows.
At the end of 15 hrs. I assume no more investors take part and the payouts are done till 30th hour(which is 15 hrs after which the last investor deposited)
However, at the end Bank is still left with 300..Which is the discrepancy I am getting.
I summed up the payouts and it amounts to 2250(for 15 investors).
But numbers dont match, can someone find the error I made in this, and any predictions on how the program will end at the last cycle?


Here is the link to the excel sheet:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1-sj-fjSmklP0B_2djH1OkDep49R6kaaKFq0x81SfVHU/edit?pli=1#gid=0

[dooglus]

can someone find the error I made in this

Yes. The balance after the first hour is 100, after the 2nd is 190 (2 deposits, one payout) and after the 3rd is 270 (3 deposits, 10 payout the first week and 20 the second.

It goes on like this:

[sherbyspark]

Thanks dooglus. Kind of a silly miscalculation there. It also shows that the system will bust really fast after a few initial returns(unless profits are reduced).
I have updated the Excel Sheet to also reflect(scroll down) how the payouts will stop happening or happen at less intervals even if people continue investing after that.
It will stop/ paid out in less intervvals after a few more rounds of returns(unless the subsequent investments are much bigger than 100).


Also, looks like the current cycle has come to an end with only 0.3BTC left in the address, and has paid out around only a 50%-60% back who deposited on 9th July. Payouts will now happen only if the balance goes above 0.3 BTC, and will probably happen after bigger intervals(in the case more deposits occur).

[bitponzi.io]

You are more or less correct.
The math model is different though. The key here is the increase of the deposits by 50% each cycle. In this case no payments are missed. if it does not go like that - system slows down waiting for new funds.

Thanks dooglus. Kind of a silly miscalculation there. It also shows that the system will bust really fast after a few initial returns(unless profits are reduced).
I have updated the Excel Sheet to also reflect(scroll down) how the payouts will stop happening or happen at less intervals even if people continue investing after that.
It will stop/ paid out in less intervvals after a few more rounds of returns(unless the subsequent investments are much bigger than 100).


Also, looks like the current cycle has come to an end with only 0.3BTC left in the address, and has paid out around only a 50%-60% back who deposited on 9th July. Payouts will now happen only if the balance goes above 0.3 BTC, and will probably happen after bigger intervals(in the case more deposits occur).

[thExit]

You are more or less correct.
The math model is different though. The key here is the increase of the deposits by 50% each cycle. In this case no payments are missed. if it does not go like that - system slows down waiting for new funds.

Thanks dooglus. Kind of a silly miscalculation there. It also shows that the system will bust really fast after a few initial returns(unless profits are reduced).
I have updated the Excel Sheet to also reflect(scroll down) how the payouts will stop happening or happen at less intervals even if people continue investing after that.
It will stop/ paid out in less intervvals after a few more rounds of returns(unless the subsequent investments are much bigger than 100).


Also, looks like the current cycle has come to an end with only 0.3BTC left in the address, and has paid out around only a 50%-60% back who deposited on 9th July. Payouts will now happen only if the balance goes above 0.3 BTC, and will probably happen after bigger intervals(in the case more deposits occur).

The 50% increase is correct, in my earlier simulation it looked like the scheme needed two new Users to pay to an older User, but the two new Users, after deducing what needed to be paid, were left with more or less half of their initial deposit. In the real scheme they are not left with anything, as all the funds go to payments, but the math adds up. The number of the new participants needed every cycle may be impossible to reach, unless there is an ever-increasing interest in this operation.

http://s12.postimg.org/ymagrwogt/10_Level_Pyramid_v22.jpg

[blacksmithtm]

GG. This ponzi ran out of money way too fast, compared to the amount that was sent to it. Maybe its possible to tweak the payouts so they take longer and the incomming investments dont neccesarily have to get bigger and bigger very fast. But probably not possible.

[bitcoin4eva]

Oh well I thought it was too good to be true :-/ I got propably 70% of my money out of it though.

[bangboom]

Oh well I thought it was too good to be true :-/ I got propably 70% of my money out of it though.

Only 70% what happened to the rest ?

[dooglus]

Oh well I thought it was too good to be true :-/ I got propably 70% of my money out of it though.

Only 70% what happened to the rest ?

Lots of people made 50% profit. That profit came entirely from later investors.

If you get in early enough, you profit.
If you get in at the end, you lose.

Of course, the scheme could keep paying out for a while, in which case Eva could well end up making a profit after all (at the expense of the people who join even later).

[bitponzi.io]

This is rather unexpected I must say. There was an influx of funds several days ago but then it suddenly petered out. Unstable cashflows kill ponzies. We won't stop it, new funds will be used to pay old deposits, so the program goes on. Using this experience we'll tweak the payment scenario and launch a parallel program soon. The Ponzi experiments will continue.

[blacksmithtm]

Instead of hourly payments i suggest daily. Lots of people will be happy with 1% return every day. But many people wont be happy to lock their coins in for 150 days. Its a tricky balance. Maybe you should keep the funds for 14 days, and give 1% each day. on the 14th day pay out 114%?

[sherbyspark]

Instead of hourly payments i suggest daily. Lots of people will be happy with 1% return every day. But many people wont be happy to lock their coins in for 150 days. Its a tricky balance

But that will have the same issue towards the 2nd half of the payout period. No matter what the interval will be, the graph will follow the same falling curve.

[bitponzi.io]

Yes it's a tricky balance, probably if we could some absolutely secure escrow we could follow in the footsteps of the original ponzi which paid 150% in a month and a half. large payouts at the end of the term also break cashflows.
We have to ponder over all the possibilities a little.

Instead of hourly payments i suggest daily. Lots of people will be happy with 1% return every day. But many people wont be happy to lock their coins in for 150 days. Its a tricky balance. Maybe you should keep the funds for 14 days, and give 1% each day. on the 14th day pay out 114%?

[bitponzi.io]

sure you are right no ponzi lasts forever
on the other hand some ponzis last very long

Instead of hourly payments i suggest daily. Lots of people will be happy with 1% return every day. But many people wont be happy to lock their coins in for 150 days. Its a tricky balance

But that will have the same issue towards the 2nd half of the payout period. No matter what the interval will be, the graph will follow the same falling curve.

[a1choi]

sure you are right no ponzi lasts forever
on the other hand some ponzis last very long

Instead of hourly payments i suggest daily. Lots of people will be happy with 1% return every day. But many people wont be happy to lock their coins in for 150 days. Its a tricky balance

But that will have the same issue towards the 2nd half of the payout period. No matter what the interval will be, the graph will follow the same falling curve.

The only way to make a ponzi last longer "fairly" is to manipulate these:

ROI % - Decrease ROI to lengthen time, Increase ROI to shorten time
Total time of Annuity - Lengthen/Shorten total time of payback of principal + ROI
Time in between payments - lengthen/shorten
Amount of each individual payment - increase/decrease

not sure if i'm missing anything else.

[blacksmithtm]

You need to market the shit as well. People need to sign up

[Maidak]

So the round I joined in yesterday is over? Haven't gotten a 1% payout in quite some time. If so I have the worst luck with these ponzi games haha.

[bitponzi.io]

It will continue indefinitely, we don't have rounds actually.

So the round I joined in yesterday is over? Haven't gotten a 1% payout in quite some time. If so I have the worst luck with these ponzi games haha.

[a1choi]

It will continue indefinitely, we don't have rounds actually.

So the round I joined in yesterday is over? Haven't gotten a 1% payout in quite some time. If so I have the worst luck with these ponzi games haha.

It will continue indefinitely.  Yes this is true.  But practically, the ponzi could slow down so much and with so much time in between payments, that it could be considered effectively dead.  This will take some time tho.

[bitponzi.io]

Naturally another simple option would be to restart it after a certain time-out where it slows down indeed.
Let us know what you think, we sure can restart this. You are to choose.

[fedor3327]

Yeah, I sent yesterday some BTC:
https://blockchain.info/tx/83abc94472d9bee194b650e134bc4f8fa62b537b4b2243056179583a249e1137
to supporting your experiment
(Actually it's not me but one of my friends. I told him wait a little but he don't . OK. I helped him a bit ........ ) because you said "It will continue indefinitely."
If you will restart you can make refund to his address:
https://blockchain.info/en/address/1LagaAxdCqWVMJi7quCL1Raf1VN2EWDnEY
Regards.

[ozycash]

you say your site is a gambling site, so do you have a licence to run you gambling site?

[bitponzi.io]

Let's wait what the users think. If you sent your payment after the halt it will be refunded.

Yeah, I sent yesterday some BTC:
https://blockchain.info/tx/83abc94472d9bee194b650e134bc4f8fa62b537b4b2243056179583a249e1137
to supporting your experiment
(Actually it's not me but one of my friends. I told him wait a little but he don't . OK. I helped him a bit ........ ) because you said "It will continue indefinitely."
If you will restart you can make refund to his address:
https://blockchain.info/en/address/1LagaAxdCqWVMJi7quCL1Raf1VN2EWDnEY
Regards.

[fedor3327]

Definitely after halt: 2014-07-12 07:38:20

At least you stay here much longer then our fucking "doubler" and not run away at the moment like "doubler" did.

I think that you need to wait coz people sending some BTC ( That's my vote.)

Also my suggestion is to lower maximum something like 0.1-0.5 BTC coz if someone send big amount it will stop again.

Regards.

[dooglus]

Naturally another simple option would be to restart it after a certain time-out where it slows down indeed.
Let us know what you think, we sure can restart this. You are to choose.

I think you made it pretty clear that the scheme wouldn't shut down when it couldn't pay, but would wait for new deposits.

As a result, I don't think you can really shut it down any time soon without breaking your promises.

You have to give the bag-holders a chance to pass their bag on to new bag-holders.

[bitponzi.io]

Yes, no problem, and no one seems to want it. So it will run. we will start a new program using this experience, tweaking some things.

Naturally another simple option would be to restart it after a certain time-out where it slows down indeed.
Let us know what you think, we sure can restart this. You are to choose.

I think you made it pretty clear that the scheme wouldn't shut down when it couldn't pay, but would wait for new deposits.

As a result, I don't think you can really shut it down any time soon without breaking your promises.

You have to give the bag-holders a chance to pass their bag on to new bag-holders.

[bitponzi.io]

The system got unstuck.

The blue print for new ponzi is ready, we'll post it here for discussion soon.

[Burzhui]

Auto withdrawal from "Bit Ponzi":
Withdrawals per day: 1
Status: 88 confirmations
Date: 13.07.14 22:48
Credit: 0.0101 BTC
Net amount: +0.0101 BTC
Transaction ID: 5bd3aa6339ec5f63bd31c6a15f908f605038ef15252a543d7384441498642dcd

[bitponzi.io]

We need your feedback about the following scheme

- Every hour system calculates outstanding balance and checks available balance

- It pays the whole available balance to all users with outstanding balance, proportional to the system debt to a given user.

- System profit is taken only from complete 150% cycles, and it is 10% of all complete cycles payouts.

In this setting each new payment moves the system forward, since there's no fixed payout, the system tries to pay as much as it can. Also system profit structure is more clear.

Tell us what you think.

[dooglus]

- It pays the whole available balance to all users with outstanding balance, proportional to the system debt to a given user.

- System profit is taken only from complete 150% cycles, and it is 10% of all complete cycles payouts.

Tell us what you think.

I think there's a problem. If you pay each user a fraction of what they're owed, in proportion to what they're owed, nobody ever gets fully paid out until everybody is fully paid out - and that never happens.

See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zeno's_paradoxes#Achilles_and_the_tortoise for a related paradox.

This means you never complete anyone's 150% cycle, and never get paid yourself.

We can work various examples, but suppose every day you get 1 new person depositing 1 new BTC.

day 1:

A deposits 1 and is owed 1.5

day 2:

B deposits 1 and is owed 1.5. We'll assume B doesn't get paid from his own deposit, so only A is owed anything from B's deposit. A gets B's whole deposit. A is owed 0.5 and B is owed 1.5

day 3:

C deposits 1 and is owed 1.5.  C's 1 is split between A and B in ratio of their credit: 0.5:1.5 or 1:3. So A gets 0.25 and B gets 0.75. A is left being owed 0.25, B is owed 0.75, C is owed 1.5

day 4:

D deposits 1 and is owed 1.5. D's 1 gets split 0.25:0.75:1.5 or 1:3:6. A gets 0.1, B gets 0.3, C gets 0.6. A is owed 0.15, B is owed 0.45, C is owed 0.9, D is owed 1.5

and so on.  A's balance goes 1.5, 0.5, 0.25, 0.15, ... and gets lower every day but never reaches zero.

Get it?

[MV120]

I think it sounds to complicated.  You will provide more confidence when people know exactly when and how much their payments will be.  Keep it simple so more think they can "Play the system" and win.  The last run was simple and worked well while it ran.  Honestly I wouldn't change much, just provide more tips on how to make it last longer and advertise more on other sites.  Maybe post on a couple HYIP sites.

[bitponzi.io]

Reasonable advice.

I think it sounds to complicated.  You will provide more confidence when people know exactly when and how much their payments will be.  Keep it simple so more think they can "Play the system" and win.  The last run was simple and worked well while it ran.  Honestly I wouldn't change much, just provide more tips on how to make it last longer and advertise more on other sites.  Maybe post on a couple HYIP sites.

[bitponzi.io]

I get what you mean,  this is a simplified description, just to give the general idea. But yes you are right, there's  infinity here if taken literally
The most important here is not to overcomplicate the system. Trying to find a way to prevent it getting stuck.

- It pays the whole available balance to all users with outstanding balance, proportional to the system debt to a given user.

- System profit is taken only from complete 150% cycles, and it is 10% of all complete cycles payouts.

Tell us what you think.

I think there's a problem. If you pay each user a fraction of what they're owed, in proportion to what they're owed, nobody ever gets fully paid out until everybody is fully paid out - and that never happens.

See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zeno's_paradoxes#Achilles_and_the_tortoise for a related paradox.

This means you never complete anyone's 150% cycle, and never get paid yourself.

We can work various examples, but suppose every day you get 1 new person depositing 1 new BTC.

day 1:

A deposits 1 and is owed 1.5

day 2:

B deposits 1 and is owed 1.5. We'll assume B doesn't get paid from his own deposit, so only A is owed anything from B's deposit. A gets B's whole deposit. A is owed 0.5 and B is owed 1.5

day 3:

C deposits 1 and is owed 1.5.  C's 1 is split between A and B in ratio of their credit: 0.5:1.5 or 1:3. So A gets 0.25 and B gets 0.75. A is left being owed 0.25, B is owed 0.75, C is owed 1.5

day 4:

D deposits 1 and is owed 1.5. D's 1 gets split 0.25:0.75:1.5 or 1:3:6. A gets 0.1, B gets 0.3, C gets 0.6. A is owed 0.15, B is owed 0.45, C is owed 0.9, D is owed 1.5

and so on.  A's balance goes 1.5, 0.5, 0.25, 0.15, ... and gets lower every day but never reaches zero.

Get it?

[dooglus]

I get what you mean,  this is a simplified description, just to give the general idea. But yes you are right, there's  infinity here if taken literally
The most important here is not to overcomplicate the system. Trying to find a way to prevent it getting stuck.

I think there's a problem.

Dude, you changed my name?

I agree with the previous poster that simple is best.

It's always going to get stuck - there's no way to stop it.

[bitponzi.io]

Sorry might have messed up with the text when typing.
looks like no one likes what I proposed, we'll go a simpler  route for now, we'll have an announcement soon.

I get what you mean,  this is a simplified description, just to give the general idea. But yes you are right, there's  infinity here if taken literally
The most important here is not to overcomplicate the system. Trying to find a way to prevent it getting stuck.

I think there's a problem.

Dude, you changed my name?

I agree with the previous poster that simple is best.

It's always going to get stuck - there's no way to stop it.

[blacksmithtm]

We need your feedback about the following scheme

- Every hour system calculates outstanding balance and checks available balance

- It pays the whole available balance to all users with outstanding balance, proportional to the system debt to a given user.

- System profit is taken only from complete 150% cycles, and it is 10% of all complete cycles payouts.

In this setting each new payment moves the system forward, since there's no fixed payout, the system tries to pay as much as it can. Also system profit structure is more clear.

Tell us what you think.

Am i understanding this correctly? If i paid in 1 BTC and that is say 10% of the bankroll, every hour i get 10% of what is in the bankroll until i have made 1.5 BTC?

[dooglus]

Am i understanding this correctly? If i paid in 1 BTC and that is say 10% of the bankroll, every hour i get 10% of what is in the bankroll until i have made 1.5 BTC?

No, I don't think so.

Every time anyone deposits anything, the whole deposit is paid out to previous deposits in proportion to how much they are still owed.

There's no "every hour", because each payout completely drains the scheme's funds until the next deposit arrives.

At least that's how I understood it.

[btcinv]

Look at reality. Do you think 1% per hour is too big.

[bitponzi.io]

Yes exactly
actually we see no excitement for the scheme, so we'll take a simpler route.

Am i understanding this correctly? If i paid in 1 BTC and that is say 10% of the bankroll, every hour i get 10% of what is in the bankroll until i have made 1.5 BTC?

No, I don't think so.

Every time anyone deposits anything, the whole deposit is paid out to previous deposits in proportion to how much they are still owed.

There's no "every hour", because each payout completely drains the scheme's funds until the next deposit arrives.

At least that's how I understood it.

[blacksmithtm]

I cant stop thinking about this kind thing and ive made spreadsheets with different kind of setups. However i am a math noob and a code noob, not likely im going to set one up. But i think i have an interesting idea.

Basically i think i got the numbers set up so it takes about a month to be done. The payments are every 6 hours, and the interest is 19% total. That means you get 119% back of your original deposit. I think this is still attractive for an investor. 19% in 1 month. The good thing about it is the fund has time to lure in new investors, it doesent get out of hand too fast. There is time to gather more money.

What i made was something that paid out a % of the bankroll to everyone who invested. As soon as they invest the system registers they are owed 1.19 of their original deposit and will pay them out 0.015 of this amount in proportion to what is the bankroll. This means the bigger the bankroll is, the faster people can be done, and the smaller it is, the slower it will be. So when it is nearing depletion the payouts still come out, but they may be small, which gives time to find new/more investors. The payout will stop for each investor as soon as total payout reaches >1.19*original deposit.

[snuffish]

This is a really interesting concept, will definitely try it out sometime

[bitponzi.io]

I came up with many different concepts too, but they all seem to be either complicated or too unusual.
We'll launch a ponzi service with hourly payments and restarts when the system gets stuck within several days. Also our profit structure will be more transparent, we need profits the market the thing.

I cant stop thinking about this kind thing and ive made spreadsheets with different kind of setups. However i am a math noob and a code noob, not likely im going to set one up. But i think i have an interesting idea.

Basically i think i got the numbers set up so it takes about a month to be done. The payments are every 6 hours, and the interest is 19% total. That means you get 119% back of your original deposit. I think this is still attractive for an investor. 19% in 1 month. The good thing about it is the fund has time to lure in new investors, it doesent get out of hand too fast. There is time to gather more money.

What i made was something that paid out a % of the bankroll to everyone who invested. As soon as they invest the system registers they are owed 1.19 of their original deposit and will pay them out 0.015 of this amount in proportion to what is the bankroll. This means the bigger the bankroll is, the faster people can be done, and the smaller it is, the slower it will be. So when it is nearing depletion the payouts still come out, but they may be small, which gives time to find new/more investors. The payout will stop for each investor as soon as total payout reaches >1.19*original deposit.

[dooglus]

the system registers they are owed 1.19 of their original deposit and will pay them out 0.015 of this amount in proportion to what is the bankroll

I was with you up to this line. What does "0.015 of this amount in proportion to what is the bankroll" mean?

Suppose I deposit 1 BTC. The system registers I am owed 1.19 BTC.

Then someone deposits 0.5 BTC.

How does the 0.015 apply? Do I get 0.015 BTC? (0.015 * 1)? Or half that (0.015 * 0.5)? Or something else?

I guess what you mean is that every hour 1.5% of the bankroll gets paid out to creditors, in proportion to the amount they are still owed.

That seems like a reasonable scheme. It could keep paying out for a long time after deposits dry up, giving a chance for new deposits to arrive.

There was a "rain bot" on Just-Dice which would collect donations and randomly pay out 1% of its balance to random players. That meant that it took a long time to dry up. The payouts slowly got smaller, but someone would inevitably top it up before it ran dry.

[MV120]

How are we coming on the launch of the next ponzi?  I'm interested to see this back up and going.

[thExit]

I came up with many different concepts too, but they all seem to be either complicated or too unusual.
We'll launch a ponzi service with hourly payments and restarts when the system gets stuck within several days. Also our profit structure will be more transparent, we need profits the market the thing.

I cant stop thinking about this kind thing and ive made spreadsheets with different kind of setups. However i am a math noob and a code noob, not likely im going to set one up. But i think i have an interesting idea.

Basically i think i got the numbers set up so it takes about a month to be done. The payments are every 6 hours, and the interest is 19% total. That means you get 119% back of your original deposit. I think this is still attractive for an investor. 19% in 1 month. The good thing about it is the fund has time to lure in new investors, it doesent get out of hand too fast. There is time to gather more money.

What i made was something that paid out a % of the bankroll to everyone who invested. As soon as they invest the system registers they are owed 1.19 of their original deposit and will pay them out 0.015 of this amount in proportion to what is the bankroll. This means the bigger the bankroll is, the faster people can be done, and the smaller it is, the slower it will be. So when it is nearing depletion the payouts still come out, but they may be small, which gives time to find new/more investors. The payout will stop for each investor as soon as total payout reaches >1.19*original deposit.

Haven't been here for a while, but the concepts being too "complicated or too unusual" should't be discouraging when it comes to Bitcoin. This is the time to make matters unusual, to shape a new future, and we shouldn't be afraid doing things in a different way. Maybe it is even possible to run a successful ponzi:) This would be a breakthrough.

[josef2000]

We are a Ponzi gambling system offering automated hourly payments. We do not invest, gamble, or otherwise use your money other than to pay it to the previous depositors. 1% of the deposited funds goes for system maintenance.

 

Deposit address:

1PoNzi7PGzRyvc9KWYBcaauS3oeJqa5vFg

Minimum deposit: 0.005 BTC. Use Blockchain.info wallet or desktop Bitcoin clients. If you don't get payments contact support

Payments are processed hourly, you get 1% for 150 payouts.  That is your total profit is 50%, like in original scheme by Charles Ponzi.

This is pure gambling so don't risk coins you can't afford to lose. Analyze the cashflows and current system balance using blockchain.info to make intelligent deposit decisions. Promote the program to get it going forever. We pay hourly which reduces the chances of the system getting stuck.

Bitcoin transparency turns ponzi schemes into pure gambling. Have fun and make money!

Bitponzi.io

fkin shut down!!! Sent 4 BTC in all, only got 1.8 back?!

[Minnlo]

fkin shut down!!! Sent 4 BTC in all, only got 1.8 back?!

What did you expect from a ponzi? All ponzi are guaranteed to be a scam, sooner or later.

[sherbyspark]

We are a Ponzi gambling system offering automated hourly payments. We do not invest, gamble, or otherwise use your money other than to pay it to the previous depositors. 1% of the deposited funds goes for system maintenance.

 

Deposit address:

1PoNzi7PGzRyvc9KWYBcaauS3oeJqa5vFg

Minimum deposit: 0.005 BTC. Use Blockchain.info wallet or desktop Bitcoin clients. If you don't get payments contact support

Payments are processed hourly, you get 1% for 150 payouts.  That is your total profit is 50%, like in original scheme by Charles Ponzi.

This is pure gambling so don't risk coins you can't afford to lose. Analyze the cashflows and current system balance using blockchain.info to make intelligent deposit decisions. Promote the program to get it going forever. We pay hourly which reduces the chances of the system getting stuck.

Bitcoin transparency turns ponzi schemes into pure gambling. Have fun and make money!

Bitponzi.io

fkin shut down!!! Sent 4 BTC in all, only got 1.8 back?!

You should have tried to understand the concept before putting in money. It was clear that if you invested in a late stage, then you will not be getting your entire investment back, and specially you sent a lot of amount, it again backfires.