ANTMINER S3+ Discussion and Support Thread

[Gogreen]

8 days left with another difficulty change , oh my ?!

[phillipsjk]

I am curious: is the cover made out of plastic or metal? It should save on the cost of a case (which is one reason I have been a little reluctant to get an S1 (still haven't payed off my old blade either). Cases block EMI, which helps prevent interference with Over-the-air television.

I was thinking these things just need a 500W power supply: I suspect (but have not tested) that you can plug the 4Pin CPU connectors into the spare ports for an extra safety margin.

CPU connector(s) are different pinouts...Don't even try...

ZiG

OK, you made me try to look it up:

Caution: The eight-pin PCI Express Auxiliary Power Connector and the eight-pin EPS12V CPU Power Connector use similar Molex Mini-Fit Jr. connector housings. Although they are keyed differently, the keying can be overcome by sufficient force such that you can plug an EPS12V power connector into a graphics card, or a PCI Express power connector into a motherboard. Either of these scenarios results in +12 V being directly shorted to ground, potentially destroying the motherboard, graphics card, or power supply.

-Power Supply 101: A Reference Of Specifications

Forgot that CPU connectors are 8 pin now. Also was not aware that the 6 and 8 pin connectors had "sense" pins.
Further, I compared the PCI-E diagram to the 4 pin diagram on the wikipedia ATX page. The polarities are reversed if you line up the tabs.

[pvnamk19]

8 days left with another difficulty change , oh my ?!

The first time from Jan 23 2013, we will enjoy a RED difficulty change or get trapped by ASICs manufacturers!?
Up to now: network hashrate: 114,206,200 GH/s vs 120,391,236 GH/s (last change).

[ZiG]

I am curious: is the cover made out of plastic or metal? It should save on the cost of a case (which is one reason I have been a little reluctant to get an S1 (still haven't payed off my old blade either). Cases block EMI, which helps prevent interference with Over-the-air television.

I was thinking these things just need a 500W power supply: I suspect (but have not tested) that you can plug the 4Pin CPU connectors into the spare ports for an extra safety margin.

CPU connector(s) are different pinouts...Don't even try...

ZiG

OK, you made me try to look it up:

Caution: The eight-pin PCI Express Auxiliary Power Connector and the eight-pin EPS12V CPU Power Connector use similar Molex Mini-Fit Jr. connector housings. Although they are keyed differently, the keying can be overcome by sufficient force such that you can plug an EPS12V power connector into a graphics card, or a PCI Express power connector into a motherboard. Either of these scenarios results in +12 V being directly shorted to ground, potentially destroying the motherboard, graphics card, or power supply.

-Power Supply 101: A Reference Of Specifications

Forgot that CPU connectors are 8 pin now. Also was not aware that the 6 and 8 pin connectors had "sense" pins.
Further, I compared the PCI-E diagram to the 4 pin diagram on the wikipedia ATX page. The polarities are reversed if you line up the tabs.

Exactly...GOOD JOB, buddy...

I simply did not want to lecture you...You did it yourself...

Cheers,

ZiG

EDIT...:

A guy in Habanero thread already did try this "successfully"...

[vulgartrendkill]

Anyone know what procedure is for overclocking?  I note from other threads about s2 that the overclocking is done by editing the config file while ssh in the miner. Will it be the same?

[bones]

This was how you could power the s1, should work for s3, so long as wired right.
Guessing you would have to rewire though, not just PnP.

I am curious: is the cover made out of plastic or metal? It should save on the cost of a case (which is one reason I have been a little reluctant to get an S1 (still haven't payed off my old blade either). Cases block EMI, which helps prevent interference with Over-the-air television.

I was thinking these things just need a 500W power supply: I suspect (but have not tested) that you can plug the 4Pin CPU connectors into the spare ports for an extra safety margin.

CPU connector(s) are different pinouts...Don't even try...

ZiG

OK, you made me try to look it up:

Caution: The eight-pin PCI Express Auxiliary Power Connector and the eight-pin EPS12V CPU Power Connector use similar Molex Mini-Fit Jr. connector housings. Although they are keyed differently, the keying can be overcome by sufficient force such that you can plug an EPS12V power connector into a graphics card, or a PCI Express power connector into a motherboard. Either of these scenarios results in +12 V being directly shorted to ground, potentially destroying the motherboard, graphics card, or power supply.

-Power Supply 101: A Reference Of Specifications

Forgot that CPU connectors are 8 pin now. Also was not aware that the 6 and 8 pin connectors had "sense" pins.
Further, I compared the PCI-E diagram to the 4 pin diagram on the wikipedia ATX page. The polarities are reversed if you line up the tabs.

Exactly...GOOD JOB, buddy...

I simply did not want to lecture you...You did it yourself...

Cheers,

ZiG

EDIT...:

A guy in Habanero thread already did try this "successfully"...

[oskuro]

Just to know if this S3 ROI or not, made simple maths:

lets imagine i buy 50 S3.

50 S3 = 23900 GH/s without overclock
25 pairs x 1,48 BTC = 37 BTC = 23888.57 $

And for power costs, i calculate around 34 $ / S3 without overclock / month(costs 0.18 $kwh). So 34 x 50 = 1700 $ / month all together.

Right now, if you have 23.900 GH/s you earn / month --> 14083.18 $

So imagine:

14.083$(earnings) - 1.700$(power) = 12.383 $ / month.

We have difficulty increases, yeah, but right now, i see next difficulty will be 15998489889.0 / -4.9% [est.], is that correct??. Difficulty decrease?. Anyways, i think S3 ROI, but of course im just a noob here and its just my simple maths 

I dont have to buy PSU also, as i have 2 corsair CX750M from my S1´s

[asnghost]

Just to know if this S3 ROI or not, made simple maths:

lets imagine i buy 50 S3.

50 S3 = 23900 GH/s without overclock
25 pairs x 1,48 BTC = 37 BTC = 23888.57 $

And for power costs, i calculate around 34 $ / S3 without overclock / month(costs 0.18 $kwh). So 34 x 50 = 1700 $ / month all together.

Right now, if you have 23.900 GH/s you earn / month --> 14083.18 $

So imagine:

14.083$(earnings) - 1.700$(power) = 12.383 $ / month.

We have difficulty increases, yeah, but right now, i see next difficulty will be 15998489889.0 / -4.9% [est.], is that correct??. Difficulty decrease?. Anyways, i think S3 ROI, but of course im just a noob here and its just my simple maths 

I dont have to buy PSU also, as i have 2 corsair CX750M from my S1´s

https://bitcoinwisdom.com/bitcoin/difficulty
Estimated Next Difficulty:   18,740,225,207 (+11.43%)
Adjust time:   After 1464 Blocks, About 10.3 days

[JCNC]

If the difficulty doesn't rise, yes you will ROI, but that won't happen!

If you honestly think you'll make any money with this thing, it's simply delusional. Good luck with your investment as you quite clearly haven't done the proper calculations and sat down to think about everything properly.

In fact the only way I saw you could make money with this thing. Mine for 3 months and then sell it on eBay or somewhere else that will attract the silly, immature, inexperienced miners that think they are getting into a gold rush for a good price. Some might consider that a little sneaky or dirty as your selling to someone inexperienced, but if you want to make money this is your only way. On top of that you also have to be based in the US (Or anywhere else that won't get charged VAT, tax and other such delivery custom charges), have a cheap nd working PSU already in your possession and pay very minimal fee's for electricity (or get it for free, which most of you lie about getting anyway to make others jealous).

I posted my calculations in the other thread about the ROI for the S3. It simply doesn't exist and still looks that way in my opinion. I had a lot of money to invest in these, but at 0.7 BTC upwards, it's laughable. Only way to make profit was at a selling price lower than 0.6 BTC.

[RealMalatesta]

If the difficulty doesn't rise, yes you will ROI, but that won't happen!

If you honestly think you'll make any money with this thing, it's simply delusional. Good luck with your investment as you quite clearly haven't done the proper calculations and sat down to think about everything properly.

In fact the only way I saw you could make money with this thing. Mine for 3 months and then sell it on eBay or somewhere else that will attract the silly, immature, inexperienced miners that think they are getting into a gold rush for a good price. Some might consider that a little sneaky or dirty as your selling to someone inexperienced, but if you want to make money this is your only way. On top of that you also have to be based in the US (Or anywhere else that won't get charged VAT, tax and other such delivery custom charges), have a cheap nd working PSU already in your possession and pay very minimal fee's for electricity (or get it for free, which most of you lie about getting anyway to make others jealous).

I posted my calculations in the other thread about the ROI for the S3. It simply doesn't exist and still looks that way in my opinion. I had a lot of money to invest in these, but at 0.7 BTC upwards, it's laughable. Only way to make profit was at a selling price lower than 0.6 BTC.

Looking at all your calculations, I must agree: No ROI in sight.

But on the other hand, for me there is more than only the ROI why I invest in mining equipment.

First of all, I don't want to see the whole mining business in the hands of some few big corporations. Although I'm a small miner, I still can afford mining. And as long as many other people do this, there's a chance that the big corps won't take over all.

Secondly: You always calculate in a very simplistic way: Investment - costs - Earnings. This may be a very traditional and old fashioned way of some bankers who have as much investment spirit as a glas of water has. I can tell you: If I would calculate like this, I'd had lost money over the years. But I haven't. How comes? Because I believe in ideas of people. So with every little BTC I gain, I make a small investment. Some Satoshis here, some there, sometimes a couple of Bitcoins. And yes: This is risky, sometimes. And yes: Sometimes I do lose money. But after all, I was able to triple my mining investment over the last 12 months.

So again: I agree. If you are a simple-minded banker who calculates with ROI, you will lose money with mining. If you are beliveing in Bitcoin and if you are willing to support Bitcoin, you may win.

Okay, I already can hear your next sentence: Why don't you just buy your Bitcoins, so you would be able to make much more money. And my simple answer would be: Because I'm not a banker, but someone who believes that Bitcoin will play an important role in the future's financial and also social system. A banker doesn't care but only sees ROI. So go ahead, buy some Bitcoins which were mined by big companies. Support them. Make your ROI. Good luck....

[JCNC]

Looking at all your calculations, I must agree: No ROI in sight.

But on the other hand, for me there is more than only the ROI why I invest in mining equipment.

First of all, I don't want to see the whole mining business in the hands of some few big corporations. Although I'm a small miner, I still can afford mining. And as long as many other people do this, there's a chance that the big corps won't take over all.

Secondly: You always calculate in a very simplistic way: Investment - costs - Earnings. This may be a very traditional and old fashioned way of some bankers who have as much investment spirit as a glas of water has. I can tell you: If I would calculate like this, I'd had lost money over the years. But I haven't. How comes? Because I believe in ideas of people. So with every little BTC I gain, I make a small investment. Some Satoshis here, some there, sometimes a couple of Bitcoins. And yes: This is risky, sometimes. And yes: Sometimes I do lose money. But after all, I was able to triple my mining investment over the last 12 months.

So again: I agree. If you are a simple-minded banker who calculates with ROI, you will lose money with mining. If you are beliveing in Bitcoin and if you are willing to support Bitcoin, you may win.

Okay, I already can hear your next sentence: Why don't you just buy your Bitcoins, so you would be able to make much more money. And my simple answer would be: Because I'm not a banker, but someone who believes that Bitcoin will play an important role in the future's financial and also social system. A banker doesn't care but only sees ROI. So go ahead, buy some Bitcoins which were mined by big companies. Support them. Make your ROI. Good luck....

I enjoyed reading this reply, for once someone with similar realistic views I completely agree with everything you have said. What I should have also mentioned within my post is that I too enjoy mining for fun rather than ROI, obviously if ROI is there then it's an added bonus. But I enjoy mining purely for the interest in the community, the progression of the bitcoin and for the fun of it. With all of my calculations being said, I still plan on buying a couple of these and like I said previously, mining for 2-3 months and then selling them on. I'll probably make a very slim profit but it will have been a fun hobby to take up some of my evening time.

All of that aside, I just hate seeing posts like "OMG, just ordered 4 of these, can't wait to be making so much money!" The typical, I've just heard about this 'bitcoin mining' craze and I'm gonna triple my investment! bla bla bla.

As lots have mentioned though, BITMAIN have already mined the shit out of the best difficulty with the S3's and probably (I obviously don't have the figures to back this up) have made a lot of money over their original investment in hardware for the S3 before they even put them up for sale. Then add on top the amount they make from selling them, even at the current price, they will fly right off the shelf's because of these big businesses bulk purchasing or the silly unrealistic people like previously mentioned who haven't done their homework and just lost interest in research as soon as they saw the money they 'could' be making. All of that taken into consideration, why would they lower the price of the S3? The only possible reason for that could be if they were interested in securing the future of these silly over-eager miners to become return customers. Otherwise once they realize they have lost money they won't likely be returning haha. That, or the market takes a turn.

Another thing that is also interesting at the moment is the difficulty swooping down. Assuming the total hash rate has just dipped, I'd guess a couple big players have simply dropped off the market for now (could be too encourage sales into the market now, which would be a very clever marketing tactic). This is all complete speculation though as I haven't properly checked the hash distribution charts, nor have I been keeping track of their progression in the past couple days. Been too busy with my job, a real secure income! haha

Sorry for the long post, I do enjoy these conversations though. Although I'm relatively new to mining, I find the whole structure of it fascinating!

[pumaro]

Looking at all your calculations, I must agree: No ROI in sight.

But on the other hand, for me there is more than only the ROI why I invest in mining equipment.

First of all, I don't want to see the whole mining business in the hands of some few big corporations. Although I'm a small miner, I still can afford mining. And as long as many other people do this, there's a chance that the big corps won't take over all.

Secondly: You always calculate in a very simplistic way: Investment - costs - Earnings. This may be a very traditional and old fashioned way of some bankers who have as much investment spirit as a glas of water has. I can tell you: If I would calculate like this, I'd had lost money over the years. But I haven't. How comes? Because I believe in ideas of people. So with every little BTC I gain, I make a small investment. Some Satoshis here, some there, sometimes a couple of Bitcoins. And yes: This is risky, sometimes. And yes: Sometimes I do lose money. But after all, I was able to triple my mining investment over the last 12 months.

So again: I agree. If you are a simple-minded banker who calculates with ROI, you will lose money with mining. If you are beliveing in Bitcoin and if you are willing to support Bitcoin, you may win.

Okay, I already can hear your next sentence: Why don't you just buy your Bitcoins, so you would be able to make much more money. And my simple answer would be: Because I'm not a banker, but someone who believes that Bitcoin will play an important role in the future's financial and also social system. A banker doesn't care but only sees ROI. So go ahead, buy some Bitcoins which were mined by big companies. Support them. Make your ROI. Good luck....

I enjoyed reading this reply, for once someone with similar realistic views I completely agree with everything you have said. What I should have also mentioned within my post is that I too enjoy mining for fun rather than ROI, obviously if ROI is there then it's an added bonus. But I enjoy mining purely for the interest in the community, the progression of the bitcoin and for the fun of it. With all of my calculations being said, I still plan on buying a couple of these and like I said previously, mining for 2-3 months and then selling them on. I'll probably make a very slim profit but it will have been a fun hobby to take up some of my evening time.

All of that aside, I just hate seeing posts like "OMG, just ordered 4 of these, can't wait to be making so much money!" The typical, I've just heard about this 'bitcoin mining' craze and I'm gonna triple my investment! bla bla bla.

As lots have mentioned though, BITMAIN have already mined the shit out of the best difficulty with the S3's and probably (I obviously don't have the figures to back this up) have made a lot of money over their original investment in hardware for the S3 before they even put them up for sale. Then add on top the amount they make from selling them, even at the current price, they will fly right off the shelf's because of these big businesses bulk purchasing or the silly unrealistic people like previously mentioned who haven't done their homework and just lost interest in research as soon as they saw the money they 'could' be making. All of that taken into consideration, why would they lower the price of the S3? The only possible reason for that could be if they were interested in securing the future of these silly over-eager miners to become return customers. Otherwise once they realize they have lost money they won't likely be returning haha. That, or the market takes a turn.

Another thing that is also interesting at the moment is the difficulty swooping down. Assuming the total hash rate has just dipped, I'd guess a couple big players have simply dropped off the market for now (could be too encourage sales into the market now, which would be a very clever marketing tactic). This is all complete speculation though as I haven't properly checked the hash distribution charts, nor have I been keeping track of their progression in the past couple days. Been too busy with my job, a real secure income! haha

Sorry for the long post, I do enjoy these conversations though. Although I'm relatively new to mining, I find the whole structure of it fascinating!

I dont disagree with the folks saying they are going to be making so much money because after all we all expect the BTC price to increase.

The issue is people have to pay using BTC which makes this deal not very nice since the unit won't return the original BTC you paid for them. Yes you will make money in the long run though.

[StuffOfInterest]

Another thing that is also interesting at the moment is the difficulty swooping down. Assuming the total hash rate has just dipped, I'd guess a couple big players have simply dropped off the market for now (could be too encourage sales into the market now, which would be a very clever marketing tactic). This is all complete speculation though as I haven't properly checked the hash distribution charts, nor have I been keeping track of their progression in the past couple days. Been too busy with my job, a real secure income! haha

Maybe the down trend is Bitmain taking units offline from their S3 farm in order to package them up and ship.

[ZiG]

Another thing that is also interesting at the moment is the difficulty swooping down. Assuming the total hash rate has just dipped, I'd guess a couple big players have simply dropped off the market for now (could be too encourage sales into the market now, which would be a very clever marketing tactic). This is all complete speculation though as I haven't properly checked the hash distribution charts, nor have I been keeping track of their progression in the past couple days. Been too busy with my job, a real secure income! haha

Maybe the down trend is Bitmain taking units offline from their S3 farm in order to package them up and ship.

+1 ...of course ...

[JCNC]

Maybe the down trend is Bitmain taking units offline from their S3 farm in order to package them up and ship.

Yeah that's who I was considering being one of the 'big players' but still with the rate hardware production is going I wouldn't be so swayed against a levelling out difficulty.

I dont disagree with the folks saying they are going to be making so much money because after all we all expect the BTC price to increase.

The issue is people have to pay using BTC which makes this deal not very nice since the unit won't return the original BTC you paid for them. Yes you will make money in the long run though.

Yeah that's true. I forgot to factor in the BTC price rise in my posts. It's a very legitimate argument, so hard to predict when the bitcoin has actually hit it's maximum, which it very likely hasn't. It's always a gamble 

[Biodom]

Maybe the down trend is Bitmain taking units offline from their S3 farm in order to package them up and ship.

Yeah that's who I was considering being one of the 'big players' but still with the rate hardware production is going I wouldn't be so swayed against a levelling out difficulty.

I dont disagree with the folks saying they are going to be making so much money because after all we all expect the BTC price to increase.

The issue is people have to pay using BTC which makes this deal not very nice since the unit won't return the original BTC you paid for them. Yes you will make money in the long run though.

Yeah that's true. I forgot to factor in the BTC price rise in my posts. It's a very legitimate argument, so hard to predict when the bitcoin has actually hit it's maximum, which it very likely hasn't. It's always a gamble  

I don't understand why people make the distinction between prices in BTC and $$. If you have the coinbase account it is all the same.
Buy BTC instantly for $$ on Coinbase (up to $1000), pay with BTC that you just got, so essentially you paid with $$.

[jonnybravo0311]

Maybe the down trend is Bitmain taking units offline from their S3 farm in order to package them up and ship.

Yeah that's who I was considering being one of the 'big players' but still with the rate hardware production is going I wouldn't be so swayed against a levelling out difficulty.

I dont disagree with the folks saying they are going to be making so much money because after all we all expect the BTC price to increase.

The issue is people have to pay using BTC which makes this deal not very nice since the unit won't return the original BTC you paid for them. Yes you will make money in the long run though.

Yeah that's true. I forgot to factor in the BTC price rise in my posts. It's a very legitimate argument, so hard to predict when the bitcoin has actually hit it's maximum, which it very likely hasn't. It's always a gamble  

I don't understand why people make the distinction between prices in BTC and $$. If you have the coinbase account it is all the same.
Buy BTC instantly for $$ on Coinbase (up to $1000), pay with BTC that you just got, so essentially you paid with $$.

I think the argument goes like this:

1) Buy BTC for $$
2) Purchase miner with BTC
OR
2) Hold BTC you just bought

When you purchase the miner, you are hoping that it will return more than the BTC it cost to purchase it, otherwise you would have better been served by just buying and holding.  Regardless of what the price of BTC does, if your miner does not make back the BTC it cost you to purchase it (plus any other additional costs like electricity, power supplies and cooling) then you've lost on your gamble.

One thing you do get by purchasing a miner with your BTC is the ability to then later sell that same miner, whereas if you just bought and held BTC, you've got exactly what you started with.

[edonkey]

Another thing that is also interesting at the moment is the difficulty swooping down. Assuming the total hash rate has just dipped, I'd guess a couple big players have simply dropped off the market for now (could be too encourage sales into the market now, which would be a very clever marketing tactic). This is all complete speculation though as I haven't properly checked the hash distribution charts, nor have I been keeping track of their progression in the past couple days. Been too busy with my job, a real secure income! haha

Maybe the down trend is Bitmain taking units offline from their S3 farm in order to package them up and ship.

+1 ...of course ...

As several people noted, they plan to mine with their S3's for a bit, then sell their used units to noobs on Ebay. Assuming Bitmain (and the other mining manufacturers) implement a similar strategy, then we are their noobs ;-)

[Biodom]

Maybe the down trend is Bitmain taking units offline from their S3 farm in order to package them up and ship.

Yeah that's who I was considering being one of the 'big players' but still with the rate hardware production is going I wouldn't be so swayed against a levelling out difficulty.

I dont disagree with the folks saying they are going to be making so much money because after all we all expect the BTC price to increase.

The issue is people have to pay using BTC which makes this deal not very nice since the unit won't return the original BTC you paid for them. Yes you will make money in the long run though.

Yeah that's true. I forgot to factor in the BTC price rise in my posts. It's a very legitimate argument, so hard to predict when the bitcoin has actually hit it's maximum, which it very likely hasn't. It's always a gamble  

I don't understand why people make the distinction between prices in BTC and $$. If you have the coinbase account it is all the same.
Buy BTC instantly for $$ on Coinbase (up to $1000), pay with BTC that you just got, so essentially you paid with $$.

I think the argument goes like this:

1) Buy BTC for $$
2) Purchase miner with BTC
OR
2) Hold BTC you just bought

When you purchase the miner, you are hoping that it will return more than the BTC it cost to purchase it, otherwise you would have better been served by just buying and holding.  Regardless of what the price of BTC does, if your miner does not make back the BTC it cost you to purchase it (plus any other additional costs like electricity, power supplies and cooling) then you've lost on your gamble.

One thing you do get by purchasing a miner with your BTC is the ability to then later sell that same miner, whereas if you just bought and held BTC, you've got exactly what you started with.

Yep, some lucky dogs (jupiters owners) were able to mine for 2-3 mo, then sold Jups for 2-3 times their price in $$.
This feat would never repeat itself, though.
Just buying BTC is incredibly boring-what are you going to do-twiddle your thumbs as you observe your stash online and post on bitcoinalk regarding upcoming $1mil price?

[pumaro]

Maybe the down trend is Bitmain taking units offline from their S3 farm in order to package them up and ship.

Yeah that's who I was considering being one of the 'big players' but still with the rate hardware production is going I wouldn't be so swayed against a levelling out difficulty.

I dont disagree with the folks saying they are going to be making so much money because after all we all expect the BTC price to increase.

The issue is people have to pay using BTC which makes this deal not very nice since the unit won't return the original BTC you paid for them. Yes you will make money in the long run though.

Yeah that's true. I forgot to factor in the BTC price rise in my posts. It's a very legitimate argument, so hard to predict when the bitcoin has actually hit it's maximum, which it very likely hasn't. It's always a gamble  

I don't understand why people make the distinction between prices in BTC and $$. If you have the coinbase account it is all the same.
Buy BTC instantly for $$ on Coinbase (up to $1000), pay with BTC that you just got, so essentially you paid with $$.

I thought about doing the coinbase switcheroo instead of using my mined coins, its probably a good way to do this purchase and then trading your bought BTC for mined ones…hmmm