[ANN] Spark | X11 | BTer/Bittrex/C-CEX | PoW/PoS | Exchanges | Roadmap |

[SnjafSnjaf]

another inside job by bittrex. how convenient all these random newbie account coins get added by bittrex before they even have a roadmap.

bittrex-richie you were payed to list this coin.

this keeps happening, your just scamming your own users. at least pretend to not pick scam coins. getting obvious.

you're kidding, aren't you? at least you'd better pretend to...

...given the case you wouldn't just joke around that would mean you assume a high frequent marketplace like bittrex that strip off 10fold the value, spark made in trading volume over the whole lifespan, just in fees on trading action with various mainstream and venture coins over say an hour or so..., a platform used by multipools and trading robots, having disabled dusttrades since ever, taking new and ventourous coins but not as if they have to and closing the market on announced time when conditions havent met (if you have good arguments, they maybe keep a coin for some time longer but it will be a long cold day in hell before they take it up again once dropped)... you honestly believe, they spend time to think about making peanuts by ripping off some newb traders by conspiring with scam coin devs...

...I suggest you first throw your TV out of the window... just for the sake of your future... and then give yourself some time and think again...

either they are being payed 5btc per coin add, or they just dont give a fuck and add brand new newb account coins with no proof of developer because fuck you thats why



if your in the crypto world, you have a bitcointalk account. all this scamming could be stopped by bittrex simply not adding newb account coins. 90% of them are scams.

now, how much a PoD actually is worth, by means of providing some security to the investment that needs to be issued from the community, should be beyond any need of beeing discussed any further...
...and don't forget, Bittrex is what? right, it's a trading platform. so the main interrest is what? trading... right. to achiev a good trading volume and frequency each pool needs to make decisions which coins to accept and which not. and as bittrex isn't necessarily the smallest of all known market places, it indeed takes as well some responsibility for the selection of coins or it would naturally risk driving his traders away. so for sure If there's some negotiations, there will be sort of an evaluation of the market potential and thus the expected trading volume that coin might generate. there is for sure as well some sponsoring involved and I think you can safely assume, that bittrex would easily shit upon 5btc without even noticing it, if they would see any risk for their marketplace (like ignoring it being an obvious scam which in case of spark doesn't apply). they do a lot to keep traders from leaving or getting distracted by stale or empty markets. THAT is the important capital, not like lousy 5btc. simple as that. bittrex is not the coin police and responsible for background checking and investigating on the developers above the usual and obvious... and I'm sure you wouldn't do so either, because beyond that, the responsible traders EVERYTIME need to evaluate their own risk... the marketplace isn't your mama and won't stop you pumping all your coins into crap or hand you a paper to wipe your tears after losing your cash... a casino won't do so as well... when it comes to spending and how much, it's ALL up to the trader, each and every trade. and guess why... trading only works in one simple way: some pay, some get. period.
so, if there's no independent quality assurance registration or certification alliance or the like, that looks under the rugs and gives some deep quality investigation cert that's widely accepted and respected, forget about that. you're a trader, you're responsible. no crying in football and daytrading.
I'm sure I'm save to assume that if someone would make a tremendously good purse after leaving at the bottom of a dump with all the scamcoins sold to some other whosoevers that willingly gulliped the bait, he wouldn't go and file a complain about that... right?
...eg. some whosoever still is buying SRZ... remember... pure zombification of a coin. maybe it's suarez himself (got me ~.5btc over time for some instamine minutes every now and then when div bottomlined after coin was long time gone and buried. da ubiaman wok pun im )


btw. ~95-99% of all new altcoins are - if looking at them objectively - intended only for moving captial from one trader to another, while leaving some slices at the trading tool they use, all commonly known als marketplace... some of them turn out to have some long term potential and how that develops over time depends on a blend of a lot of factors - yet, a responsive transparent and actively careing developer could be the one foundation and for sure will be a crucial showstopper, if remaining absent or silent in a situarion like we have here.
 

btw. there's some yet to be deeper established system making save peer to peer trades while not needing a dedcated external marketplace (like eg. spark or saffroncoin still do a.o. even if they have achieved a more or less close integration into the wallet).
I'm talking of bithalo/blackhalo which provides a comcept of trustless smart contracts for direct exchange which would render escrow agents or trading platforms unnecessary (to an extent). http://blackhalo.info/

+1, i take it that you wrote some smart things since you wrote novel there... To lazy to read but i guess i am agreeing with smart points whatever they are in that novel of yours.  

[edschroedinger]

another inside job by bittrex. how convenient all these random newbie account coins get added by bittrex before they even have a roadmap.

bittrex-richie you were payed to list this coin.

this keeps happening, your just scamming your own users. at least pretend to not pick scam coins. getting obvious.

you're kidding, aren't you? at least you'd better pretend to...

...given the case you wouldn't just joke around that would mean you assume a high frequent marketplace like bittrex that strip off 10fold the value, spark made in trading volume over the whole lifespan, just in fees on trading action with various mainstream and venture coins over say an hour or so..., a platform used by multipools and trading robots, having disabled dusttrades since ever, taking new and ventourous coins but not as if they have to and closing the market on announced time when conditions havent met (if you have good arguments, they maybe keep a coin for some time longer but it will be a long cold day in hell before they take it up again once dropped)... you honestly believe, they spend time to think about making peanuts by ripping off some newb traders by conspiring with scam coin devs...

...I suggest you first throw your TV out of the window... just for the sake of your future... and then give yourself some time and think again...

either they are being payed 5btc per coin add, or they just dont give a fuck and add brand new newb account coins with no proof of developer because fuck you thats why



if your in the crypto world, you have a bitcointalk account. all this scamming could be stopped by bittrex simply not adding newb account coins. 90% of them are scams.

now, how much a PoD actually is worth, by means of providing some security to the investment that needs to be issued from the community, should be beyond any need of beeing discussed any further...
...and don't forget, Bittrex is what? right, it's a trading platform. so the main interrest is what? trading... right. to achiev a good trading volume and frequency each pool needs to make decisions which coins to accept and which not. and as bittrex isn't necessarily the smallest of all known market places, it indeed takes as well some responsibility for the selection of coins or it would naturally risk driving his traders away. so for sure If there's some negotiations, there will be sort of an evaluation of the market potential and thus the expected trading volume that coin might generate. there is for sure as well some sponsoring involved and I think you can safely assume, that bittrex would easily shit upon 5btc without even noticing it, if they would see any risk for their marketplace (like ignoring it being an obvious scam which in case of spark doesn't apply). they do a lot to keep traders from leaving or getting distracted by stale or empty markets. THAT is the important capital, not like lousy 5btc. simple as that. bittrex is not the coin police and responsible for background checking and investigating on the developers above the usual and obvious... and I'm sure you wouldn't do so either, because beyond that, the responsible traders EVERYTIME need to evaluate their own risk... the marketplace isn't your mama and won't stop you pumping all your coins into crap or hand you a paper to wipe your tears after losing your cash... a casino won't do so as well... when it comes to spending and how much, it's ALL up to the trader, each and every trade. and guess why... trading only works in one simple way: some pay, some get. period.
so, if there's no independent quality assurance registration or certification alliance or the like, that looks under the rugs and gives some deep quality investigation cert that's widely accepted and respected, forget about that. you're a trader, you're responsible. no crying in football and daytrading.
I'm sure I'm save to assume that if someone would make a tremendously good purse after leaving at the bottom of a dump with all the scamcoins sold to some other whosoevers that willingly gulliped the bait, he wouldn't go and file a complain about that... right?
...eg. some whosoever still is buying SRZ... remember... pure zombification of a coin. maybe it's suarez himself (got me ~.5btc over time for some instamine minutes every now and then when div bottomlined after coin was long time gone and buried. da ubiaman wok pun im )


btw. ~95-99% of all new altcoins are - if looking at them objectively - intended only for moving captial from one trader to another, while leaving some slices at the trading tool they use, all commonly known als marketplace... some of them turn out to have some long term potential and how that develops over time depends on a blend of a lot of factors - yet, a responsive transparent and actively careing developer could be the one foundation and for sure will be a crucial showstopper, if remaining absent or silent in a situarion like we have here.
 

btw. there's some yet to be deeper established system making save peer to peer trades while not needing a dedcated external marketplace (like eg. spark or saffroncoin still do a.o. even if they have achieved a more or less close integration into the wallet).
I'm talking of bithalo/blackhalo which provides a comcept of trustless smart contracts for direct exchange which would render escrow agents or trading platforms unnecessary (to an extent). http://blackhalo.info/

+1, i take it that you wrote some smart things since you wrote novel there... To lazy to read but i guess i am agreeing with smart points whatever they are in that novel of yours.  

sometimes I'm loosing it...   ...but I think the first part could be

tl;dr'ed: ...clarifying some things about bittrex, trading platforms and trading. and responsibility is ALL up to the trader. No crying in daytrading ... uh, and about nearly all new altcoins being nothing but a bare money shifter at large...



btw. i filed a request at bittrex... maybe this brings some answers.

[ianta]

I think dev, got heart attack again... 

[Framauro]

yes, thanks for the useful comment...

...bored?


--



btw. is anyone actually able to sucessfully start the windows client (and keep it running for longer than a couple seconds?)

 ...if it's already open, you might want to keep it like this as it might not come up a second time...

Disconnect from the internet, start your wallet and then (re)connect  to the internet.

it worked for me, it's syncing again.

"getmininginfo"

{
"blocks" : 13407,
"currentblocksize" : 1000,
"currentblocktx" : 0,
"difficulty" : {
"proof-of-work" : 33.98574285,
"proof-of-stake" : 0.00024414,
"search-interval" : 1
},
"blockvalue" : 10000000000,
"netmhashps" : 3649.19135163,
"netstakeweight" : 0.00000000,
"errors" : "",
"pooledtx" : 0,
"stakeweight" : {
"minimum" : 2683,
"maximum" : 0,
"combined" : 2683
},
"stakeinterest" : 17500000,
"testnet" : false
}

[edschroedinger]

now, as discouraging as the following might sound at first, it also might avoid a not yet exaggerated FUDnado and provides some decision support...

I received a quick response from bitrex (thanx ryan for sharing the info!), but read yourself:

Hello Team

I'd just like to ask for a quick status on the SPARK blockchain fork that recently happened @ ~ blk10042. in fact, there is no statement concerning this issue or anything else from the responsible developer in the respective bct thread ( https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=826767.440 ) for like 2 days straight and a lot of wild speculation starts poping up.

as there's no reliable info available yet, I'd just like to ask, if:
- the dev actually contacted someone at bittrex and maybe
- actively working on the issue (that moves towards looking excessively long)
or:
- if you are as well simply on hold while still waiting for a response?

looking forward to hearing from you.
with kind regards,

E.Schroedinger

Hi,

The btc talk thread is what we are currently looking at as well since the developer has not reached out to us. Doesn't look like there has been much progress.

Thanks,

Ryan

...

[edschroedinger]

Disconnect from the internet, start your wallet and then (re)connect  to the internet.

it worked for me, it's syncing again.

whow, thanx for that one    

that absolutely worked.

wallet is syncing (don't now if that still matters, though )... receiving a bootload of transactions now...
and I would have about NEVER tried that on my own.
well, actually getting offline ...hm, thats is indeed an option I usually fade away pretty well

--

when that wallet refused to start properly after running for a few days straight without the slightest issue, no lagging sync, status and stuff all working actually nice and slick... when now this wallet went unusable I absolutely assumed either some intentional or unintentional 'timebomb' or something that should work but not look like one.
now this odd 'cannot start with network on, that's too much'-issue is however one very keen bug, especially considering what this program actually represents: a network-node

now, still... bitcointalk, being the infamous coindev bermuda triangle... I'm still at most curious how this story develops...

...if that thing has being planned and started as a 'scam', this would be the most unprofitable scam in history... like performing an oceans 11 crew like super art heist but only snatching that glossy catalog from the counter....

[tylerderden]

wow sucks to be bter, they ninja add a coin, which they dont really do often and its this turd. I think its the same douchbag from adamntiumwhateverthefuck. he seems to think he is some vigilante crypto cop thats going to teach us all a lesson. Or its just a bad dev. big promises in the beginning should have been a pretty good indicator that its garbage. and that is why i dumped this shit asap. go check out fibre those dudes are the real deal. shit like this really doesnt even deserve any more of our thoughts or concerns, in other words fuck em. treat these scamdevs like hoes. POD doesnt mean shit either, plenty of scamcoins have POD. All these trashcoins just hit it and dump it, you can always get back in later when things prove to be legit. yeah you may pay a little more, but its better than holding a bag of worthless coins.

[tylerderden]

if you want to see a real hoot of a scamcoin go look at profitcoins roadmap lol!!! people quit being so fucking gullible for shits sake.

[Framauro]

Disconnect from the internet, start your wallet and then (re)connect  to the internet.

it worked for me, it's syncing again.

whow, thanx for that one   

that absolutely worked.

wallet is syncing (don't now if that still matters, though )... receiving a bootload of transactions now...
and I would have about NEVER tried that on my own.
well, actually getting offline ...hm, thats is indeed an option I usually fade away pretty well

your're welcome

and now a exchange where we can dump it, if that ever gonna happen soon..

[edschroedinger]

Disconnect from the internet, start your wallet and then (re)connect  to the internet.

it worked for me, it's syncing again.

whow, thanx for that one    

that absolutely worked.

wallet is syncing (don't now if that still matters, though )... receiving a bootload of transactions now...
and I would have about NEVER tried that on my own.
well, actually getting offline ...hm, thats is indeed an option I usually fade away pretty well

your're welcome

and now a exchange where we can dump it, if that ever gonna happen soon..

hehe, if that would happen (I guess it won't anyway) before there were a butload of clarifying
statements from our lost spark and certainly a propper solution how to deal with the fork, to
buid up some new trust in the future of that coin, than no one could stop people from
getting frantic and throwing those coins away like they were redhot coal gravel...

that would flatline the coin before any transactions from wallet to xchg became confirmed just once

digital paperchase in a minefield, blindfolded of course...  

if dealt with the situation in a propper and sensitive way, it could more or less continue at around the 4k price
when it left the sacred halls of barter...

[RentaMouse]

At what point do we decide to declare the original Dev MIA, fork off a new wallet and just make it a community coin? So far noone has posted any evidence of a cunning scam so as long as the bulk of coin owners (since I guess we'll stick with the now PoS phase blockchain fork) update to the forked wallet then its a takeover.

[edschroedinger]

At what point do we decide to declare the original Dev MIA, fork off a new wallet and just make it a community coin? So far noone has posted any evidence of a cunning scam so as long as the bulk of coin owners (since I guess we'll stick with the now PoS phase blockchain fork) update to the forked wallet then its a takeover.

..good question, indeed.
well, if it turns out that this dev really stays lost after POW is done (ca. 600 blk to go... ~7-8h), I'd say that would be a crucial moment when decisions are due to be made, especially in relation to the fork, so someone needs to be there who could handle at least the upcoming phase of setting things straight with that mess.
so, at this point, the future (If any) of this coin depends on what happens with the exchanges. this is when one responsible person (usually the original dev) HAS to show up or it is overdue to be officially declared as: 'abandoned'. period.

... next question would be (as blocks should continue to be generated by pos), what's the status of the blockchain(s). my impression atm is, there's at least one wallet, that became hooked to the other branch while unfortunately having supposedly one of the most active transaction histories over that period of time, which is the bittrex wallet.
the status of those from b'ter and c-cex obviously needs to be clarified as well, as it's not yet clear if they went offline with their wallets just in case, or if they also hooked to the wrong*) blockchain.

and of course, there needs to be a final decision taken, which of the blockchain forks would be the least trouble to 'merge' the other to (howsoever) and will be the RIGHT chain. it's yet open to be determined but I got the impression, that suchpool, ipominer and last not least suprnova followed the original chain, while a part of the network to whatever reasons got lost and grabbed another chain (maybe ddos? network trouble + unluckily spread hashpower?).
my wallet, and most probably the one of the 8+ connections it gets, follow the 'dominant' chain as well.
I got connected not even once to the 'other' side of the fork plus no pool I know used that one, so I have no clue on how much of the powe ended at that side (maybe some larger solo's?) and for how long it has been followed along by whom...

might turn out to be not that much of trouble, but as well could, if pretty large amounts of coins have been generated on the 'wrong' fork from that time on (in theory ~4.000.000 spark on each side)...

I guess, some of the losses could be compensatet, some could be minimized (maybe market internal transactions are a bit easier to handle as only withdrawals and deposits use the actual blockchain to my knowing)... and it will turn out how these will be possibly funded.


now... lets hope in the first place, the original dev shows up, as he should be way better into the internals as someone taking over (any volunteers??)...
up to the moment, I don't have even a remote clue what on earth would make someone abandon his work at this point (ok, it's not a mans work of it's lifetime but certainly took some time and effort, even if built upon shade coin wallet) while neither any obvious profit could have been drawn from scamming, nor would it be extraordinary impossible to solve that forking problem... maybe he's fucked up about that fork or simply lost interest? maybe (in fact shit happens all the time) he actually has no clue due to other real world trouble keeping him busy? I don't know... time might tell.

... but one thing should be clear: if NOTHING happens within 24-48h after 14400, you can as well delete your wallet as SPARK will never hit some relevant marketplace again, ever.



*) what's 'wrong' or not, will be point of discussion at some later time. just for the sake of what fork of blockchain we're talking, I define the supposedly doninant branch (the one followed by ipo, suchpool and suprnova) as they have been running in perfect sync since then.


--


if, by some lucky strike of chance, all turns out to be resolved... a wallet, that doesn't jump the gun when network is active while starting it would be on my personal wishlist

[Rigsuss]

can someone tell me why can people trade spark on bter.com
when there is a fork ?

[edschroedinger]

can someone tell me why can people trade spark on bter.com
when there is a fork ?

it's inside the market, the wallets are only 'gateways'... those trading are the ones that managed to depo/withd. before the fork happenened. bter closed withdrawal and deposit. trading happens in their database
same went on on c-cex,
bittrex was the only one to disable the market as well.


...time for some cheapo sparkies... but who knows if you'll ever be able to withdraw them
now, givent the facts atm. i'm surprised it's still at 26micro... buyers don't have a clue obviously

[Rigsuss]

Thx for your Help

[edschroedinger]

Thx for your Help

ya welcome



---



...to get back to trust; that certain mentioned PoD, cryptoasian kindly provides - and to a given time helped improving trust, where trustless action isn't an option - was certainly a step into the right direction, yet you only need to take a look at the shadecoin thread (SPARK's... well... sort of predecessor) to make yourself an impression, that the idea also contains a major pitfall... it suggests way more trust than given at any moment.

there need to be easy, transparent ways for developers to prove, that they are real, located somewhere without the need to strip of their privacy or the like.
there of course must be a balance between personal privacy (if you wanna stay hidden and fully anonymous, you're not a contact person. period) and availability. if a developer shows commitment to his project, he as well commits part of it's time for service and maintainance of the project, he's taken the responsibility for.
at least one person should be there to get info who is, once committed to the project, in some form known and unhideable (to some extent of course). no way (nor any thought about) to enforce that even remotely, but there should be some stronger bond that encourages information transfer or gives a strong signal to the community for decision taking if they commit as well or wouldn't dare touch it with a 10ft pole. PoD showed, that it's more a tool for scammers than providing some protection against them. those with real commitment won't need that anyway, as they're in with a completely different set of motives than simply gaining profit by tricking the community...

this could be part of a next step in creating some trust where you don't get along without:
digital ID via blockchain technolgy ... PoE ...proof of existence:

now, watch how they create an ID ...fantastic idea
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1iAg6BITPdc

repo on the hub, and whtp. on google docs:
https://github.com/MrChrisJ/World-Citizenship
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1hq52GT0sQ8mJBZ3_qr-LIpZTBFqIDA2WV8vb_1m8i4U



in general, as blurbed some posts earlier, RESPONSIBILITY is all with the community member, each on it's own... but as we're all humans (I assume), we're all following the same patterns.
mankind is doing a hard but amazingly good job (taken the difficulty of that challenge) in adapting those psychic patterns to something they're never intended to work with while developing over the millenia of human history... the internet.
of course we fail quite often, as you're by nature stuffed with flaws when trying to adapt, while the necessary information that let us judge are so prone to clever manipulation that - in a profit oriented global society - those flaws WILL be used against each other, and that's far beyond any point of speculation.

so, this is where some more attention needs to be focused upon; we need more ways to get objective and trustless information that's practically impossible to forge, yet easy to check, to support what will never be completely adaptable to digital communication: our human senses.

[shwin]

this is the perfect dev who run after any problem. Dont mine any newb coin dev

90% of the time, he just made a nice graphic and nice wallet but dont have any skill to fix any problem (like this fork)

Why people get excited for nice graphic. Crypto != graphic and wallet

[edschroedinger]

this is the perfect dev who run after any problem. Dont mine any newb coin dev

90% of the time, he just made a nice graphic and nice wallet but dont have any skill to fix any problem (like this fork)

Why people get excited for nice graphic. Crypto != graphic and wallet

...humans are especially prone to manipulation and trickery without beeing able to use all their natural senses (no way to do so over the internet)... hehe, just edited some lines to my prev. post on that topic ...

[edschroedinger]

OK, i made an approach to get an overview on how the situation develops, it's current state, things to do, etc.

I assume, dev isn't in the process of preparing for his big jack-in-a-box performance so there will be soon some decisions to be made, that will determine where this thing is going... or if it's simply going into the annals.

due to the fact of the stalled markets, there's indeed a certain pressure to find a solution...
no need to say, that a solution won't wait for long to follow if no action is taken, but that solution also renders all purses rather worthless.

so, if anyone has some ideas - if still interrested in keeping this alive at all - go forth and speak out.
actually ANY opinion (statements would be great, 'you fools suck' is recognised. no need to post it again and again )

[CryptoStoner]

It's close to 300 blocks to end the POW, it is suprising that the network has been close to 1.5-3 gh/s the whole time while the dev was gone and the fork appeared, but yea a community takeover should happen if there's no news 48 hours after POW end

EDIT: POW has ended, transition to POS was smooth, now we see if Dev shows up or a community takeover happens in the next couple of days