Hufflepuff Making 2k BTC On PrimeDice Nov 2014. March 2015 Update: He Cheated

[Altcoin4life]

Very interesting situation. Few things stood out to me. The integrity of Stunna and Primedice was one. I have a feeling that many other site owners would have closed up shop, ran away with customer funds, made up some excuse about being hacked, or denied huffle's large withdrawals altogether. You also have to show some respect to huffle, even though a crook, he used repeated ingenuity to game the system. Something I can respect even if I don't agree with the end result.

True but it's not the only site with integrity, just - dice, luckybit, moneypot,  betterbets...tho it was not cool huffle took it so far I mean 800 btc would a proved a point.

[Wendigo]

So the end of the article is kinda open-ended and Stunna is offering a reward for bounty hunters lol  Someone call Quickseller to investigate the blockchain.

[David19]

So the end of the article is kinda open-ended and Stunna is offering a reward for bounty hunters lol  Someone call Quickseller to investigate the blockchain.

I have already tried to investigate where the funds ended up and its almost impossible the coins have been mixed thro thousands and thousands of addresses. Person who did this is no joke thats for sure.

[fox19891989]

It was very interesting to read that story but we already knew almost all off it .

Its very possible that he can use that exploit on other sites to , cheater using that exploit is very hard to catch . Not possible without investigating database very closely . And even than its hard to prove that cheater is using that exploit.

But yeah, good to see that pd paid out 2000+ btc without any problem.

Max payout on pd will also be back to 40btc very soon so i guess they already earned back that 2000btc.

EV is 10000+ btc for pd , so pd should be in solid profit even without that 2000 btc that huffle got .

So you mean PD has earned over 10k btc from the gamblers? Good profit, I thought PD has earned over 50k btc from gamblers, but I think my estimation is too high, btw, 10k btc is good for a casino/gambling site, other casinos can't get so much money like PD. Congrats.

[arallmuus]

Person who did this is no joke thats for sure.

Definitely no joke at all and it seems that they have made PrimeDice their primary target ever since launch. Also the fact that they/he have/has been mixing the withdrawal ever since his first time using the account Nappa / Kane https://blockchain.info/address/18dMBap634aESPTeD3FGcAgJ2S9n4qtBTZ

From the email address, IP used and other things that have been done. This guy know stuff on how to cover up his tracks and I doubt that he wont be stupid enough to keep a stash of coins in an address or put them through exchanger as chances are he might split them up into few address in smaller amounts

So you mean PD has earned over 10k btc from the gamblers? Good profit, I thought PD has earned over 50k btc from gamblers

MICRO get this number from the wagered amount x 1 % house edge because there is no data about PrimeDice's profit since it is privately funded. Currently PrimeDice has 1M BTC wagered so roughly that is around 10k BTC in profit . 50k BTC is 5 % of the wagered amount which is quite impossible I'd say even for PrimeDice

for references http://dicesites.com/primedice

[Buziss]

MICRO get this number from the wagered amount x 1 % house edge because there is no data about PrimeDice's profit since it is privately funded. Currently PrimeDice has 1M BTC wagered so roughly that is around 10k BTC in profit . 50k BTC is 5 % of the wagered amount which is quite impossible I'd say even for PrimeDice

for references http://dicesites.com/primedice

Is that 1M btc wagered stats for PD 3 only or is it for the whole time since PD started operation in 2013?

[MICRO]

Person who did this is no joke thats for sure.

Definitely no joke at all and it seems that they have made PrimeDice their primary target ever since launch. Also the fact that they/he have/has been mixing the withdrawal ever since his first time using the account Nappa / Kane https://blockchain.info/address/18dMBap634aESPTeD3FGcAgJ2S9n4qtBTZ

From the email address, IP used and other things that have been done. This guy know stuff on how to cover up his tracks and I doubt that he wont be stupid enough to keep a stash of coins in an address or put them through exchanger as chances are he might split them up into few address in smaller amounts

So you mean PD has earned over 10k btc from the gamblers? Good profit, I thought PD has earned over 50k btc from gamblers

MICRO get this number from the wagered amount x 1 % house edge because there is no data about PrimeDice's profit since it is privately funded. Currently PrimeDice has 1M BTC wagered so roughly that is around 10k BTC in profit . 50k BTC is 5 % of the wagered amount which is quite impossible I'd say even for PrimeDice

for references http://dicesites.com/primedice

Yes . I said EV is 10000 btc . Idk how much pd is in profit . Never asked . .

Very interesting situation. Few things stood out to me. The integrity of Stunna and Primedice was one. I have a feeling that many other site owners would have closed up shop, ran away with customer funds, made up some excuse about being hacked, or denied huffle's large withdrawals altogether. You also have to show some respect to huffle, even though a crook, he used repeated ingenuity to game the system. Something I can respect even if I don't agree with the end result.

I cant respect him ever. I would respect him if he found that exploit and emailed it to primedice. He would got huge bounty for that and lots of respect.

[glorg44]

MICRO get this number from the wagered amount x 1 % house edge because there is no data about PrimeDice's profit since it is privately funded. Currently PrimeDice has 1M BTC wagered so roughly that is around 10k BTC in profit . 50k BTC is 5 % of the wagered amount which is quite impossible I'd say even for PrimeDice

for references http://dicesites.com/primedice

Is that 1M btc wagered stats for PD 3 only or is it for the whole time since PD started operation in 2013?

I am pretty sure its the overall accumulated amount.

[Quickseller]

EV is 10000+ btc for pd , so pd should be in solid profit even without that 2000 btc that huffle got .

I believe that stunna actually said that husslepuff caused PD to have overall losses, but that after a shot period afterwords they were back in the black.

They probably lost more then 2,000 BTC from the entire incident if the exploit was being used since PD3 opened.

[waterpile]

So the end of the article is kinda open-ended and Stunna is offering a reward for bounty hunters lol  Someone call Quickseller to investigate the blockchain.

i doubt that they will find the identity of hufflepuff.. he probably washed the BTC by using a mixing service that way its no longer can be detected if not then it will probably take more time to find it.

[Quickseller]

So the end of the article is kinda open-ended and Stunna is offering a reward for bounty hunters lol  Someone call Quickseller to investigate the blockchain.

Lol. I believe this level of blockchain analysis is probably a bit advanced for me. He probably used mixers and coinjoin transactions which are going to require advanced software to even potentially try to track which is something that I don't have access to.

[cazkooo]

He probably used mixers and coinjoin transactions which are going to require advanced software

Does this mean that even a coin is mixed then it still can be track? Back in the day, I know that many people use bitcoin gambling website such as primedice and justdice to launder because there are so many incoming deposit and withdrawals there and your coins will never be trackable. He could be using bitmixer and I never heard someone track a coin after it is mix by bitmixer

[Quickseller]

He probably used mixers and coinjoin transactions which are going to require advanced software

Does this mean that even a coin is mixed then it still can be track? Back in the day, I know that many people use bitcoin gambling website such as primedice and justdice to launder because there are so many incoming deposit and withdrawals there and your coins will never be trackable. He could be using bitmixer and I never heard someone track a coin after it is mix by bitmixer

If someone used a gambling site to mix the coins then someone would simply need to ask the operator of the gambling site to find out where the money went. In many cases the owner would likely be willing to give up that information because that is not what their site was designed to do.

For a mixer like bitmixer or bitcoinfog, their service is specifically designed to allow people to have privacy and if they are true to their word, will not reveal where a certain customer's money was sent to.

It is possible to track funds through a mixer. All you would have to do is know which txid that funds were sent to the mixer, the fee the mixer charges then look at all the transactions that were sent by the mixer over the next 12 hours (for bitmixer) that add up to the total amount mixed (minus the fee). For smaller amounts there will be a large number of possible outputs that belong to a certain customer, however when you have 2,000+ BTC total output, the total number of transactions is much smaller. The difficult part is trying to figure out which transactions belong to which mixers as if they do a good job their various addresses will not be spend linked together.

[cazkooo]

He probably used mixers and coinjoin transactions which are going to require advanced software

Does this mean that even a coin is mixed then it still can be track? Back in the day, I know that many people use bitcoin gambling website such as primedice and justdice to launder because there are so many incoming deposit and withdrawals there and your coins will never be trackable. He could be using bitmixer and I never heard someone track a coin after it is mix by bitmixer

If someone used a gambling site to mix the coins then someone would simply need to ask the operator of the gambling site to find out where the money went. In many cases the owner would likely be willing to give up that information because that is not what their site was designed to do.

For a mixer like bitmixer or bitcoinfog, their service is specifically designed to allow people to have privacy and if they are true to their word, will not reveal where a certain customer's money was sent to.

It is possible to track funds through a mixer. All you would have to do is know which txid that funds were sent to the mixer, the fee the mixer charges then look at all the transactions that were sent by the mixer over the next 12 hours (for bitmixer) that add up to the total amount mixed (minus the fee). For smaller amounts there will be a large number of possible outputs that belong to a certain customer, however when you have 2,000+ BTC total output, the total number of transactions is much smaller. The difficult part is trying to figure out which transactions belong to which mixers as if they do a good job their various addresses will not be spend linked together.

That is a lot of work to do and I checked the transaction and I see that it is going through a lot of addresses. I have never used bitmixer before but I read it that they can mix your btc in one piece and from the transaction from the thief the btc is send to a lot of address by splitting them into a lot of smaller pieces. Does this mean the thief use multiple address of a mixing company?

[Quickseller]

He probably used mixers and coinjoin transactions which are going to require advanced software

Does this mean that even a coin is mixed then it still can be track? Back in the day, I know that many people use bitcoin gambling website such as primedice and justdice to launder because there are so many incoming deposit and withdrawals there and your coins will never be trackable. He could be using bitmixer and I never heard someone track a coin after it is mix by bitmixer

If someone used a gambling site to mix the coins then someone would simply need to ask the operator of the gambling site to find out where the money went. In many cases the owner would likely be willing to give up that information because that is not what their site was designed to do.

For a mixer like bitmixer or bitcoinfog, their service is specifically designed to allow people to have privacy and if they are true to their word, will not reveal where a certain customer's money was sent to.

It is possible to track funds through a mixer. All you would have to do is know which txid that funds were sent to the mixer, the fee the mixer charges then look at all the transactions that were sent by the mixer over the next 12 hours (for bitmixer) that add up to the total amount mixed (minus the fee). For smaller amounts there will be a large number of possible outputs that belong to a certain customer, however when you have 2,000+ BTC total output, the total number of transactions is much smaller. The difficult part is trying to figure out which transactions belong to which mixers as if they do a good job their various addresses will not be spend linked together.

That is a lot of work to do and I checked the transaction and I see that it is going through a lot of addresses. I have never used bitmixer before but I read it that they can mix your btc in one piece and from the transaction from the thief the btc is send to a lot of address by splitting them into a lot of smaller pieces. Does this mean the thief use multiple address of a mixing company?

In order to increase privacy, you should have the mixer withdraw to multiple addresses in order to make it more difficult to track your money, however like I said before, if someone knows all the addresses that belong to the mixer then if you know that someone mixed exactly 2,235.5326 (for example), that bitmixer charges exactly 0.5% of the amount mixed plus .0005 BTC per output address then you would need to look at all the outputs of bitmixer over the next 12 hours that add up to 2,224.354937 BTC (99.5% of 2,235.5326 while adding .0005 to each output in order to figure out where that person's money ended up.

[dooglus]

you would need to look at all the outputs of bitmixer over the next 12 hours that add up to 2,224.354937 BTC (99.5% of 2,235.5326 while adding .0005 to each output in order to figure out where that person's money ended up.

I've never looked into how mixers work, but it seems pretty obvious that you would only allow withdrawals of particular sizes. If you want to withdraw 2,224.35x BTC then maybe you have to make 2 withdrawals of 1000 BTC, 2 of 100 BTC, 1 of 10 BTC, 4 of 1 BTC, etc. Then your plan of "look at all outputs that add up to ..." fails immediately, since all the outputs are of generic sizes.

[Quickseller]

you would need to look at all the outputs of bitmixer over the next 12 hours that add up to 2,224.354937 BTC (99.5% of 2,235.5326 while adding .0005 to each output in order to figure out where that person's money ended up.

I've never looked into how mixers work, but it seems pretty obvious that you would only allow withdrawals of particular sizes. If you want to withdraw 2,224.35x BTC then maybe you have to make 2 withdrawals of 1000 BTC, 2 of 100 BTC, 1 of 10 BTC, 4 of 1 BTC, etc. Then your plan of "look at all outputs that add up to ..." fails immediately, since all the outputs are of generic sizes.

Bitmixer does not use "accounts" you go to their website, tell them which addresses that you want them to send to, tell them what percentage each address should receive (12.346% to address "A", 36.257% to address "B", and 51.397% to address "C" - for example), you give them a time delay for each address (zero for address "A", 4 hours for address "B" and 2 hours for address "C"), then they give you an unused address they have the private keys to for you to send to. If you were to send 100 BTC to that address, then they would send 99.5 BTC to those addresses with the corresponding percentage minus .0005 BTC for each address. They claim to mix tens of thousands of BTC per week so if you only mixed 100 BTC then there would probably be a lot of possibilities as to which outputs belong to you. However mixing thousands of BTC would probably give them less privacy.

Bitmixer has since changed how they work so you can customize the fee they charge so an onlooker doesn't know exactly what the total sum of outputs will be exactly.

Figuring out which addresses belong to Bitmixer in itself would probably be a difficult task because they do not reuse addresses.

I believe that bitcoinfog uses an account system, I am not sure exactly how they work, however I know that they make heavier use of old addresses (they reuse addresses) and I don't think they send outputs in even amounts like that because they have such a wide range of how much money they mix for their customers (some only want .5 BTC mixed while others want 50 BTC mixed).

[sherbyspark]

The second quote makes it sound as if the "reveal old seed" behaviour could be made to happen without the "replace old seed by new seed" action having been done first. Maybe sending too many requests at once could trigger that. But it doesn't fit in with the first quote.

I had thought that was the trigger, and could affect the other sites as well. As for the final address it wouldn't help as it is likely he wouldn't have sold the coins and in the past it has been unlikely that any hacked coins have been recovered.

[Monopoly]

Still No proof for cheating him from stunna ?

[FruitsBasket]

Still No proof for cheating him from stunna ?

Stunna already posted about the story, I'm too lazy to get it for you.. try researching it.