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Author Topic: [ANN] The world's first handheld Bitcoin device, the Ellet!  (Read 42504 times)
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June 11, 2012, 01:06:49 PM
 #141

I don't understand how this device will connect to the network without SIM.
I also don't understand how this could work globally.

Anyway, wish you good luck with this project!
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June 11, 2012, 01:29:20 PM
 #142

Is this device real?

Elletsys.com won't load. Kickstarter finds nothing when searching or Ellet. Anybody know the creators?
Should of read the first post better. Its not on kickstarter yet it will be soon. If you mouse over elletsys.com you can see that <elletsys.com> is the text they put over for the link(like saying click <here>), it actually leads to a reddit page. Its not even a redirect.
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June 11, 2012, 02:04:14 PM
 #143

Is this device real?

Elletsys.com won't load. Kickstarter finds nothing when searching or Ellet. Anybody know the creators?
Should of read the first post better. Its not on kickstarter yet it will be soon. If you mouse over elletsys.com you can see that <elletsys.com> is the text they put over for the link(like saying click <here>), it actually leads to a reddit page. Its not even a redirect.

That's correct. KickStarter is a final stage and more or less for presentation and sales channels only. Going on KickStarter too early in the game is a huge risk to losing investors.

ElletSys.com is still being developed. In the meantime, you can follow the reddit and discuss relevant topics there.

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June 11, 2012, 02:07:58 PM
 #144

Is this device real?

Elletsys.com won't load. Kickstarter finds nothing when searching or Ellet. Anybody know the creators?
Should of read the first post better. Its not on kickstarter yet it will be soon. If you mouse over elletsys.com you can see that <elletsys.com> is the text they put over for the link(like saying click <here>), it actually leads to a reddit page. Its not even a redirect.

That's correct. KickStarter is a final stage and more or less for presentation and sales channels only. Going on KickStarter too early in the game is a huge risk to losing investors.

ElletSys.com is still being developed. In the meantime, you can follow the reddit and discuss relevant topics there.

So, once again here you are presenting vapourware.
You should've learnt your lesson with the magazine.
You should also learn not to accuse other of presenting vapourware when you do exactly the same the thing.

You're a great guy Matthew, but you should learn to deal with competition a little better. The way you deal with it doesn't put you in a good light.

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June 11, 2012, 02:17:21 PM
 #145

So, once again here you are presenting vapourware.
You lost me here. Are you referring to the website itself which I didn't link to or the actual product which has already been built?

You should've learnt your lesson with the magazine.
Funny you mention that. Making the first issue of the Bitcoin magazine was a very humbling experience. Despite the constant trolling from the community, I did exactly what I set out to do and everything came together nicely. In fact, when it was finally received by the first readers it received more upvotes on Reddit than any post I've ever seen on /r/Bitcoin  Cheesy. I think although there were many skills learned during the development days of the magazine, the community is the one who needed to learn a lesson from that one.

You should also learn not to accuse other of presenting vapourware when you do exactly the same the thing.

Quote
Vaporware is a term in the computer industry that describes a product, typically computer hardware or software, that is announced to the general public but is never actually released nor officially canceled.

You lost me again. Ellet is hardly vaporware. Please state your points and evidence if you expect a response.

You're a great guy Matthew, but you should learn to deal with competition a little better. The way you deal with it doesn't put you in a good light.

I appreciate the words of advice and I'll mull them over, however I think yourself included, many people here jump to conclusions as to the reasoning behind things far too easily. Bitcoinica hacked? "IT WAS ZHOUTONG!" Magazine late? "IT WAS A SCAM!"

I will gladly take the advice of the community but offer the advice of having some patience as well. I'm working on resolving the issues with ElletSys.com as we speak.

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June 11, 2012, 02:19:51 PM
 #146

Only you say that the device exists and was already built...
Why should I or anyone else believe in you?

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June 11, 2012, 02:22:50 PM
 #147

Only you say that the device exists and was already built...
Why should I or anyone else believe in you?

Don't believe me then.

When the videos and photos come out this week too, don't believe them.

When it's announced that 50,000 units are manufactured, don't believe it then either.

When your friends are holding it in their hands and using it on a daily basis, don't believe it then either.

I don't know what you want me to say. I cannot be your babysitter in life.

I exist here in ElletSys to be useful, create interesting services, products and technologies, and to support it with all that I know.

If you're judging me on my presentation, you're probably being thrown off by the fact that in the past I am well known for having fun while doing my job. I'm not going to change that just so a handful of detractors will have less FUD to spread.

If you're judging me on my attacks of other supposed hardware that makes claims that not even Apple would make, then you are wasting your time with me because there are much more prominent figures with much deeper pockets who will say the same thing upon learning of their claims.

Have some patience, argue your points with evidence, do whatever you like. It doesn't change anything.

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June 11, 2012, 02:31:32 PM
 #148


If you're judging me on my attacks of other supposed hardware that makes claims that not even Apple would make, then you are wasting your time with me because there are much more prominent figures with much deeper pockets who will say the same thing upon learning of their claims.

What would happen to your plans for the Ellet should the claims regarding the Bitcoincard turn out to be true?

"The powers of financial capitalism had another far-reaching aim, nothing less than to create a world system of financial control in private hands able to dominate the political system of each country and the economy of the world as a whole. This system was to be controlled in a feudalist fashion by the central banks of the world acting in concert, by secret agreements arrived at in frequent meetings and conferences. The apex of the systems was to be the Bank for International Settlements in Basel, Switzerland, a private bank owned and controlled by the world's central banks which were themselves private corporations. Each central bank...sought to dominate its government by its ability to control Treasury loans, to manipulate foreign exchanges, to influence the level of economic activity in the country, and to influence cooperative politicians by subsequent economic rewards in the business world."

- Carroll Quigley, CFR member, mentor to Bill Clinton, from 'Tragedy And Hope'
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June 11, 2012, 02:38:17 PM
 #149


If you're judging me on my attacks of other supposed hardware that makes claims that not even Apple would make, then you are wasting your time with me because there are much more prominent figures with much deeper pockets who will say the same thing upon learning of their claims.

What would happen to your plans for the Ellet should the claims regarding the Bitcoincard turn out to be true?

Personally speaking, I'd be so excited for them for actually creating new technology that billions in technology investments across the world could not put together. It would be revolutionary.

Officially, It wouldn't affect the Ellet at all as the Ellet is intended to be a functional payment device capable of handling -all- relevant payment methods, utilize the infinite amount of existing infrastructure out there, and provide a marketable form factor and feature set that will bring non-bitcoiners into Bitcoin. Bitcoincard seems to be a nerds toy (no offense) with little to no chance of any kind of adoption in a real world environment. Also, given it's supposed form factor, it is more in competition with Casascius coins than the Ellet.

Yifu is also making a secure tablet for Bitcoin transactions. We have discussed this before several times, that neither of us are in competition with each other either as we offer completely different tools for completely different purposes.

The comments on some threads from some detractors that I'm "scared" of bitcoincard is just not true. I was hopeful, but then did my homework. The claims that I'm "bothered" by it are very true. As I was mentioning on IRC, it always bothers me when vaporware takes center stage over similar new technologies with actual working models. It's just a lesson to future scammers that deceptive marketing and flashy gadgets are apparently the only thing that gets bitcoiners' attention.

I as much as anyone else cannot wait much longer for the official Ellet announcement with all the proof everyone is looking for. It's on the top of my priorities now that the magazine is moderately self-sustaining.


https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=61017.msg711305#msg711305
I'm glad you printed a magazine, but I think the businesses that paid you for advertising were expecting a little more circulation than a few dozen copies. I have heard nothing more of your plans to get Bitcoin Magazine distributed. I want to believe you, but you juggle so many things without following through that it is hard to see where you are going with your businesses.

This post as well as yours will surely be deleted shortly as they are completely off-topic but I do feel it deserves a response of some sort. The magazine advertisers were in contact with us the entire time. You do not give us much credit for resolving issues and like most in the community assume way too much.

The plans to make a magazine in the first place were mine, but once you have a Board of Directors with experience in distribution, infrastructure, security, etc, you lose your ability to discuss every intimate detail with the open public. I promised that I'd keep the community involved in the direction and content of the magazine, but no one said I had to make it easy for competitors to compete.  Wink

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June 11, 2012, 02:40:40 PM
 #150


If you're judging me on my attacks of other supposed hardware that makes claims that not even Apple would make, then you are wasting your time with me because there are much more prominent figures with much deeper pockets who will say the same thing upon learning of their claims.

What would happen to your plans for the Ellet should the claims regarding the Bitcoincard turn out to be true?

Hence the rushed up announcement on his part... The Bitcoincard workshop was coming and he needed to build some hype for his own vapourware as a way to try and fade out the hype for the Bitcoincard vapourware.
I wasn't going to say anything, but after seeing him attacking BitcoinCard, while doing exactly the same thing with this Ellet, didn't felt quite right to me.

PS: I think any kind of Bitcoin wallet with an included tracking system sucks, so, that includes the Bitcoincard and the Ellet.
You won't see me buying any, that's for sure. My cell phone is enough, thank you.

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June 11, 2012, 02:49:45 PM
 #151

...
What would happen to your plans for the Ellet should the claims regarding the Bitcoincard turn out to be true?

Hence the rushed up announcement on his part... The Bitcoincard workshop was coming and he needed to build some hype for his own vapourware as a way to try and fade out the hype for the Bitcoincard vapourware.
I wasn't going to say anything, but after seeing him attacking BitcoinCard, while doing exactly the same thing with this Ellet, didn't felt quite right to me.

But the big difference is that this bitcoincard can be seen on images and videos, while this mnw vaporware seems to exists only mnws imagination. And that seems to make it necessary for mnw to constantly spreading FUD in the bitcoincard thread.
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June 11, 2012, 02:51:49 PM
 #152

I can see that this is just a baiting trolls at this point and will post again here only when there is an update worth sharing with the community. Blatant slander, baseless accusations and further FUD based on individual's opinions of what they think I'm doing will be completely ignored and removed if off-topic.

Thanks!

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June 11, 2012, 02:58:27 PM
 #153

Officially, It wouldn't affect the Ellet at all as the Ellet is intended to be a functional payment device capable of handling -all- relevant payment methods, utilize the infinite amount of existing infrastructure out there, and provide a marketable form factor and feature set that will bring non-bitcoiners into Bitcoin. Bitcoincard seems to be a nerds toy (no offense) with little to no chance of any kind of adoption in a real world environment. Also, given it's supposed form factor, it is more in competition with Casascius coins than the Ellet.

I can agree that your devices don't seem to be in quite the same market, but you do appear to be threatened by their claims.  Would the Ellet be capable of updating it's core software, if the Bitcoincard became the dominate system for bitcoin transactions offline?  Said another way, would the Ellet be able to talk the Bitcoincard protocol.  That's the real question.

Quote

The comments on some threads from some detractors that I'm "scared" of bitcoincard is just not true. I was hopeful, but then did my homework. The claims that I'm "bothered" by it are very true. As I was mentioning on IRC, it always bothers me when vaporware takes center stage over similar new technologies with actual working models. It's just a lesson to future scammers that deceptive marketing and flashy gadgets are apparently the only thing that gets bitcoiners' attention.

But that is the problem, I've actual photos of Bitcoincards.  Granted, still photos can be faked; but I have nothing at all from you concerning the Ellet.  From my perspectives, it's the Ellet that is vaporware.  At a minimum, the Bitcoincard guys have working test models.  I saw a youtube video of two such cards (sitting less than a foot from each other, mind you) perform a transaction on video.  A transaction that can be verified via the bitcoin blockchain.  If the bitcoincard is vaporware, the fog is getting pretty thick.


"The powers of financial capitalism had another far-reaching aim, nothing less than to create a world system of financial control in private hands able to dominate the political system of each country and the economy of the world as a whole. This system was to be controlled in a feudalist fashion by the central banks of the world acting in concert, by secret agreements arrived at in frequent meetings and conferences. The apex of the systems was to be the Bank for International Settlements in Basel, Switzerland, a private bank owned and controlled by the world's central banks which were themselves private corporations. Each central bank...sought to dominate its government by its ability to control Treasury loans, to manipulate foreign exchanges, to influence the level of economic activity in the country, and to influence cooperative politicians by subsequent economic rewards in the business world."

- Carroll Quigley, CFR member, mentor to Bill Clinton, from 'Tragedy And Hope'
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June 11, 2012, 02:58:50 PM
 #154

I can see that this is just a baiting trolls at this point and will post again here only when there is an update worth sharing with the community. Blatant slander, baseless accusations and further FUD based on individual's opinions of what they think I'm doing will be completely ignored and removed if off-topic.

Thanks!

Just do as I say, Don't do as I do.

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June 11, 2012, 03:15:34 PM
 #155

Officially, It wouldn't affect the Ellet at all as the Ellet is intended to be a functional payment device capable of handling -all- relevant payment methods, utilize the infinite amount of existing infrastructure out there, and provide a marketable form factor and feature set that will bring non-bitcoiners into Bitcoin. Bitcoincard seems to be a nerds toy (no offense) with little to no chance of any kind of adoption in a real world environment. Also, given it's supposed form factor, it is more in competition with Casascius coins than the Ellet.

I can agree that your devices don't seem to be in quite the same market, but you do appear to be threatened by their claims.
Not threatened, annoyed by vaporware. Call it overjoy that made me want to announce without a photo, but anyone trying to convince the baker that he isn't baking a cake just because they aren't eating it yet is only going to receive puzzled looks from the baker. If however that baker claims he is baking a cake larger than the oven itself, then you can make some claims and ask some questions (which is what I've been doing to the bitcoincard).

would the Ellet be able to talk the Bitcoincard protocol.  That's the real question.
I don't see how anything standard would be able to talk to that non-standard device. I guess we could go out of our way to add specific hardware to our device that would allow it to talk to bitcoincard, but I don't see any company would do that that didn't have a contract directly with the other company. Put in other words, do iPhones have built in receivers for ham radio?

But that is the problem, I've actual photos of Bitcoincards.  Granted, still photos can be faked; but I have nothing at all from you concerning the Ellet.
Fair enough. Come back when there are photos. Until then, (advice to others) do not embarrass yourselves again with calling things fake just because of who is developing them. When this comes out and I move on to my next project, is the point going to get across then that I'm serious about what I do and all you need do is wait?

From my perspectives, it's the Ellet that is vaporware.  At a minimum, the Bitcoincard guys have working test models.
You believe this?

I saw a youtube video of two such cards (sitting less than a foot from each other, mind you) perform a transaction on video. A transaction that can be verified via the bitcoin blockchain.

I'm having trouble finding any videos other than the one on Vimeo which shows only one device, highly cropped/edited, all timing between transactions obfuscated, no actual provable process, with a laptop that more than likely sent the coins from the client to itself from another computer to simulate the process. I can be skeptical too, but apparently my reasons for being skeptical are the most logical. No photos does not make something vaporware. Fake videos and inviting investors to a 'secret meeting' screams vaporware imho.

I'll be posting later in the week with more information to parties interested in the Ellet. We've made another change to the form factor that I'm sure will assist in its marketability to non-bitcoiners.

Thanks for following!

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June 11, 2012, 03:31:16 PM
 #156

But that is the problem, I've actual photos of Bitcoincards.  Granted, still photos can be faked; but I have nothing at all from you concerning the Ellet.
Fair enough. Come back when there are photos. Until then, (advice to others) do not embarrass yourselves again with calling things fake just because of who is developing them. When this comes out and I move on to my next project, is the point going to get across then that I'm serious about what I do and all you need do is wait?
http://blog.bitinstant.com/blog/2012/6/8/bitcoincard-in-vienna-day-1-coffee-missing-atms-and-some-tes.html
But of course, this is a conspiracy of Gavin, Charly, Erik, Armir and all other bitcoin celebrities against you.
And I am pretty sure that Bitcoin magazine in those pictures is also faked, or at least an unlicensed reprint Wink

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June 11, 2012, 03:41:51 PM
 #157

sub.  why is there no way to subscribe to threads without posting?  fix this forum please.

SealsWithClubs poker room has  over 400 players online. Buy in from .01 to 60btc.      BTCSportsMatch lets you bet sports with vig free lines!  Best kept secret in bitcoin....          LocalBitcoins.com is very user-friendly now for bank transfers.  You don't have to live close to trade when in the same currency area.           
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June 11, 2012, 04:00:01 PM
 #158

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=61017.msg711305#msg711305
I'm glad you printed a magazine, but I think the businesses that paid you for advertising were expecting a little more circulation than a few dozen copies. I have heard nothing more of your plans to get Bitcoin Magazine distributed. I want to believe you, but you juggle so many things without following through that it is hard to see where you are going with your businesses.

This post as well as yours will surely be deleted shortly as they are completely off-topic but I do feel it deserves a response of some sort. The magazine advertisers were in contact with us the entire time. You do not give us much credit for resolving issues and like most in the community assume way too much.

The plans to make a magazine in the first place were mine, but once you have a Board of Directors with experience in distribution, infrastructure, security, etc, you lose your ability to discuss every intimate detail with the open public. I promised that I'd keep the community involved in the direction and content of the magazine, but no one said I had to make it easy for competitors to compete.  Wink
[/quote]

I know we're off topic, but your initial magazine announcement did claim distribution through Barnes & Noble.  When will I be able to pick up a copy at my local store?  I almost bought some advertising space because of this claim and I'd be pissed if I had.  Maybe "the community" is not the only one who needed to learn.  In the past you have overpromised and underdelivered.  I hope you have learned from these errors.

https://www.bitcoin.org/bitcoin.pdf
While no idea is perfect, some ideas are useful.
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June 11, 2012, 04:04:08 PM
 #159

I know we're off topic, but your initial magazine announcement did claim distribution through Barnes & Noble.  When will I be able to pick up a copy at my local store?  I almost bought some advertising space because of this claim and I'd be pissed if I had.  Maybe "the community" is not the only one who needed to learn.  In the past you have overpromised and underdelivered.  I hope you have learned from these errors.

Thank you for your constructive criticism. We're still working through the long process of being distributed in Barnes & Noble. As was mentioned, the review period is up to 3 months after the first issue is printed. They are already reviewing it and I am in regular talks with the distribution manager for Barnes & Noble's accounts.  The reason nothing is announced is that there is nothing to announce yet. Thank you for the kind words though. We're all looking forward to the already internationally available magazine to be distributed in bookstores as well, even at an almost guaranteed loss to gain exposure to Bitcoin and continue doing our duty. Appreciate the support as always!

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June 11, 2012, 04:06:04 PM
 #160

I know we're off topic, but your initial magazine announcement did claim distribution through Barnes & Noble.  When will I be able to pick up a copy at my local store?  I almost bought some advertising space because of this claim and I'd be pissed if I had.  Maybe "the community" is not the only one who needed to learn.  In the past you have overpromised and underdelivered.  I hope you have learned from these errors.

Thank you for your constructive criticism. We're still working through the long process of being distributed in Barnes & Noble. As was mentioned, the review period is up to 3 months after the first issue is printed. They are already reviewing it and I am in regular talks with the distribution manager for Barnes & Noble's accounts.  The reason nothing is announced is that there is nothing to announce yet. Thank you for the kind words though. We're all looking forward to the already internationally available magazine to be distributed in bookstores as well, even at an almost guaranteed loss to gain exposure to Bitcoin and continue doing our duty. Appreciate the support as always!

Good to hear... now get back to work on the Ellet!

https://www.bitcoin.org/bitcoin.pdf
While no idea is perfect, some ideas are useful.
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