Thinking about purchasing 20 TH/s worth of hardware.

[Rewire]

Would it be a better idea to mine solo or go for a pool?  Mine BTC or some altcoin?  If pool, which pool should I go with?

Price per KW/h where I live is .088 KW/h.

I'm also debating only getting 10 TH/s worth, and then purchasing solar panels for power, but need opinions of those more experienced before making a decision, any advice would be appreciated.

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[Zich]

With 20 TH miner, i would still use pool for mining. And will choose PPS pool since the payout will constant 

Did you mean 0.088 USD per KWH?

[Rewire]

Yes, .088 USD per KW/h.  I've been looking at mining calculators and such for my figures and even 10 TH/s will generate 11k in profit annually, and 20 KH/s would be about 24k, but I'm looking to add on as the profit comes in to expand eventually up to generate at least $70k/yr in profit. 

I have plans for a dedicated metal shed complete with AC units, vents and a breaker box eventually, but with just my house, I estimate that I can run at least 60 Th/s safely in one of the rooms with a few window AC units.

I was seeing that with 60 TH/s it would only take me a month to generate a full block solo, so I thought that might be more profitable.  I was however looking for ballpark figures from someone with around the same power that I was going for (10 or 20 TH/s)

The real challenge is convincing my wife.

[redsn0w]

Yes, .088 USD per KW/h.  I've been looking at mining calculators and such for my figures and even 10 TH/s will generate 11k in profit annually, and 20 KH/s would be about 24k, but I'm looking to add on as the profit comes in to expand eventually up to generate at least $70k/yr in profit. 

I have plans for a dedicated metal shed complete with AC units, vents and a breaker box eventually, but with just my house, I estimate that I can run at least 60 Th/s safely in one of the rooms with a few window AC units.

I was seeing that with 60 TH/s it would only take me a month to generate a full block solo, so I thought that might be more profitable.  I was however looking for ballpark figures from someone with around the same power that I was going for (10 or 20 TH/s)

The real challenge is convincing my wife.

Then... good luck , I think it will be a difficult task .   Can I ask you where do you live ? 0.088 USD per KWh is a good price .

[bitkilo]

That would be one nice rig, what sort of equipment were you thinking of?
Have you figured in tax with your profit calculations?
Did you think about the block reward only being half of what it is now in just over a year to 18months?
If you do go ahead maybe tell the local cops so they don't kick in ya door at 5am thinking you have a crop growing.

[Rewire]

Northern Idaho.

And I have not figured in taxes, what it is categorized as?  I was thinking I could claim it as a business and write off the electricity under operating costs.

The 2 Th/s rigs I were looking at are the Ant Miner S4s.

I was thinking of buying a small rig, an Ant Miner or such and showing her profits from it, seeing if that could convince her.  Our current situation is our bills are low enough that we can pay it with half of one of her paychecks, but if I start mining without telling her, the $600 electric bills will be noticed.....  I don't work and just sit on a trust fund from parents with around $700k in it, but it's not making me money monthly (not alot at least), and I don't trust the stock market at the moment.

I could spend it on things, but then I would have no money, so I would rather spend money on something that will make me money, before I start spending money on things that cost me money.

[bitkilo]

So your in the US and you think your going to get away with mining bitcoin and not think about tax, the IRS will screw you!
Sorry to tell you this but you should get familar wih the btc tax laws before starting and trying to write off the electricty. And if when you finish with reading that if mining is still profitable then try.

700k trust fund, right, me too 

[Rewire]

Believe what you want, I'm trying to get information, not show off, was just explaining my situation.  $700k isn't really a lot of money anyways, if my wife wasn't still working, I would run out in around 18 years continuing with our current lifestyle.

On another note, is there a calculator that can estimate shares per second based on hash power?  I can't seem to find one to calculate PPS.


EDIT:  The only thing I can find concrete related to BTC is treat it as a stock option that's gifted, so it's taxed depending on when it's sold after the gift.   This would be taxed at 28% or 25% for my income bracket, still profitable, though I would probably need a bit more than 60 TH/s for my goal of $70k passive.

[Zich]

Believe what you want, I'm trying to get information, not show off, was just explaining my situation.  $700k isn't really a lot of money anyways, if my wife wasn't still working, I would run out in around 18 years continuing with our current lifestyle.

On another note, is there a calculator that can estimate shares per second based on hash power?  I can't seem to find one to calculate PPS.

I believe all mining calculator is PPS calculator  
Like this one coinwarz

[bitkilo]

Believe what you want, I'm trying to get information, not show off, was just explaining my situation.  $700k isn't really a lot of money anyways, if my wife wasn't still working, I would run out in around 18 years continuing with our current lifestyle.

On another note, is there a calculator that can estimate shares per second based on hash power?  I can't seem to find one to calculate PPS.

Not giving you shit just wish i had cash.
If your after a mining calculator try this one.
https://bitcoinwisdom.com/bitcoin/calculator

[Rewire]

Is the difficulty increment really 20%?  That seems way off.   And i'm looking more for something like shares generated per second per GH/s, because I'm sure PPS varies per pool.

[bitkilo]

Is the difficulty increment really 20%?  That seems way off.   And i'm looking more for something like shares generated per second per GH/s, because I'm sure PPS varies per pool.

Nobody know exactly what the difficulty will do, if lots of people lile you set up 20TH mining rigs it could explode.
There is some pretty good estimates on the net.
Did you know the block reward will half in early to mid 2016?

[redsn0w]

Is the difficulty increment really 20%?  That seems way off.   And i'm looking more for something like shares generated per second per GH/s, because I'm sure PPS varies per pool.

Nobody know exactly what the difficulty will do, if lots of people lile you set up 20TH mining rigs it could explode.
There is some pretty good estimates on the net.
Did you know the block reward will half in early to mid 2016?

approximately the : 2016-07-31 17:08:34 UTC (84 weeks, 5 days, 11 hours, 40 minutes)    (source : http://bitcoinclock.com/ ).

[MichaelBliss]

The truth is, mining is not a sure thing.  Profits are actually getting pretty thin, if they even exist..

Like everything, there is risk and reward, you may or may not make back the money you invested into mining, depending on a few things, mostly difficulty adjustments and btc price.

Think twice, there could be better businesses for you to invest in.  (I would forget about alt-coins, they are mostly all shit).

[bitkilo]

Is the difficulty increment really 20%?  That seems way off.   And i'm looking more for something like shares generated per second per GH/s, because I'm sure PPS varies per pool.

Nobody know exactly what the difficulty will do, if lots of people lile you set up 20TH mining rigs it could explode.
There is some pretty good estimates on the net.
Did you know the block reward will half in early to mid 2016?

approximately the : 2016-07-31 17:08:34 UTC (84 weeks, 5 days, 11 hours, 40 minutes)    (source : http://bitcoinclock.com/ ).

Is that time set in stone? It does say block reward drop ETA
Not doubting you just thought it would change often.

[Rewire]

By that time I'm sure just using proceeds + advances in mining hardware could get me into PH/s by myself if I became serious enough and saw the money, at that point I'd probably get a dedicated location that's not my house though...

It seems profitable enough with only 50 TH/s - taxes, even that is about $50k in income for 1 year (assuming average price does not change)  If I use that solely for buying more hashing power I can get up to 150 TH/s, which would have $115k of profit, even halved would still be around $57k by 2016.  Supposing this 4 year cycle is correct, that would be 57k a year for profit for 4 years, at which I'm sure I could sell the equipment off (assuming no failures) for around half of what I purchased it for.

If I continued to add equipment with proceeds, the money would just keep going up assuming BTC does not lose value from saturation.  But if the World Bank picked it up as a use-anywhere currency, I expect the USD value to skyrocket really.

Honestly though I'm thinking about just buying some Chick-fil-a franchises, but that requires constant work, and I don't want that for a while, even though my wife would be happier about that decision because she LOVES their sandwiches...

EDIT:  Anyone have a AntMiner S3+?  I have around 3 400W power supplies laying around the house and might use 1 to find out if this is worth my while.

[MichaelBliss]

Keep in mind that just buying btc and holding has historically been the most profitable route.   And on top of that, it is a lot less work than running a mining farm!

Good luck whatever you do anyway. 

[mwizard]

Yes, .088 USD per KW/h.  I've been looking at mining calculators and such for my figures and even 10 TH/s will generate 11k in profit annually, and 20 KH/s would be about 24k, but I'm looking to add on as the profit comes in to expand eventually up to generate at least $70k/yr in profit.  

I have plans for a dedicated metal shed complete with AC units, vents and a breaker box eventually, but with just my house, I estimate that I can run at least 60 Th/s safely in one of the rooms with a few window AC units.

I was seeing that with 60 TH/s it would only take me a month to generate a full block solo, so I thought that might be more profitable.  I was however looking for ballpark figures from someone with around the same power that I was going for (10 or 20 TH/s)

The real challenge is convincing my wife.

I strongly suggest you start with just a single SP20 or S4, or similar, to at least try mining before dreaming of riches. Some comments:

1) Your claim of 11k profit annually from 10 TH/s appears to ignore the large initial setup costs.

It will cost you a large part of your first years 'profit' to pay for the mining hardware and any electrical or air conditioning work needed to set up the bitcoin mining. This is most of your first years 'profit'.

2) Your claim of 11k profit annually from 10 TH/s after paying the startup costs appears to be optimistic.  Presumably you used Bitcoin at around $360, electricity at say $0.088 kWh, no difficulty change and say 7,000 Watts  (0.7 Watt/gigahash) for power.

Bitcoin is currently around $330 lowering your expected 'profit' by 10%.  Your electrical costs are also likely to be higher than expected, especially if air conditioners are used.  Then there is the cost of your time to learn mining and set up your miners, and maybe even a divorce.

Also, has been mentioned in earlier posts, in mid 2016 the bitcoin payout to miners falls from 25 bitcoins per block to 12.5 bitcoins per block.  So the total return from all mining will half.

3) 60 Terrahash needs a lot of electrical power, generates a lot of heat and can generate a lot of noise.  It would draw the same electricity as about 60 normal houses or a moderately sized commercial or industrial operation.  You may need to install a three phase supply rated for a couple of hundred amps.  Even for 10 Terrahash you may need upgraded supply wiring and switchboard.

4) It would take a brave person to go solo mining with just 20 to 60 Terrahash.  Mining is a statistical event.  With just 20-60 Terrahash you could easily go months without a block being found.  A number of smaller mining pools have already discovered this the hard way, for example ozcoin.

[Rewire]

The circuitry in my house can easily handle a 100 KW/h draw from a single outlet with no issues with the current equipment, all of my wiring in the house is VERY thick.  I paid for my house to be custom built on land I purchased in 2012 with the best equipment I could afford within reasonable usage amounts, so I don't have to replace anything for a long time, and it will help retain value in-case we move.   Plus, 60 TH/s is only around 36 KW/h with AntMiner S4s (Supposedly), and is definitely not energy worth of 60 housholds, so that really won't be a problem at all.

I do, however, believe I will simply purchase a single AntMiner S4 at first to prospect, because if it doesn't give me what I want, I can always re-sell it.

Anyone half one that can rep it to give me an idea of what to expect?

[seriouscoin]

cant wait, post it