Ross Ulbricht faces a potential life sentence starting tomorrow.

[thejaytiesto]

After spending the past year in a Brooklyn federal prison, Ross Ulbricht will finally head to a New York City court on Tuesday where prosecutors will try to prove he is the mastermind behind the anonymous billion-dollar online drug market Silk ​Road.

http://motherboard.vice.com/read/heres-what-to-expect-from-the-silk-road-trial?utm_source=mbfb

Is there any doubt he is the mastermind at this stage, lets hope they go easy on him but i fear it cant get any better then shrem.

You don't doubt that he's the mastermind yet you think he should get off easy?  He's a criminal that probably deserves to spend a very long time in prison.

What he did removed violence from the streets..

America should be sued billions and he should be given a medal for pushing freedoms.  "Criminal" is a moronic term.  He shouldn't see a single day and many higher ups in america should never see the light of day ever again.  Making drugs illegal DECIMATES poor communites and poor countries and causes massive violence.

Im all for freedom but you know what can happen if you are selling illegal shit online, he knew what was coming. What do you want people to do? Make a political party and try to change the laws otherwise you know how things work and selling drugs is illegal, and yes I agree it would reduce street violence but I dont make the laws.

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[PaulPierce]

I don't think they have to do too much 'proving' as it seems it's pretty clear he was responsible and they pretty much caught him red handed, but what is interesting is what charges he can weasel out of if any and how long he gets. I'll be following this trial closely.

It is pretty clear on what he did n there r enough proof for it! I dont think he can weasel out much.

[mayax]

it's so funny that the people are arguing about that.

there are some crackheads here who really think the drugs are good and it's OK if Ross developed a network for that.

"There was no harm done. Nobody will come forward and claim that they were hurt."

let's defense any drug dealer who is using Bitcoin. Anyway Bitcoin is mainly used for illegal things but who cares? the Bitcoin community is "libertarian"  

They want no gov, no law, no FED Reserve, anonymity BUT they use centralized exchangers who asked them papers, they have a Foundation, they want a regulated "market", protection EVEN they say something else "2 min."  ago

when you ask them about price manipulation, they say "it's like wild west, we don't care, we like to be fucked by exchangers, we do not want rules"... OK !

BUT if an exchanger is running with their money, they call the police even they want "wild west and no gov, no rules".  LOL

[Rishblitz]

it's so funny that the people are arguing about that.

there are some crackheads here who really think the drugs are good and it's OK if Ross developed a network for that.

"There was no harm done. Nobody will come forward and claim that they were hurt."

let's defense any drug dealer who is using Bitcoin. Anyway Bitcoin is mainly used for illegal things but who cares? the Bitcoin community is "libertarian"  

They want no gov, no law, no FED Reserve, anonymity BUT they use centralized exchangers who asked them papers, they have a Foundation, they want a regulated "market", protection EVEN they say something else "2 min."  ago

when you ask them about price manipulation, they say "it's like wild west, we don't care, we like to be fucked by exchangers, we do not want rules"... OK !

BUT if an exchanger is running with their money, they call the police even they want "wild west and no gov, no rules".  LOL

The libertarianism can be a 2 sided sword.

[mayax]

alright but BE libertarian till the end. do not be libertarian when you like and "normal" people when you don't like.

assume your beliefs.

 Be Libertarian when someone is running with your funds from a "centralized" exchanger (why did you use it if you want de-centralized exchangers?), be libertarian by not using the banks at all, keep all your money in Bitcoin as you learn everybody else to do it and so on

Also, be libertarian and say NO to any regulation and do not scream that you want a regulated market because a libertarian wants "freedom", right?

Be hypocrite till the end.

[Rishblitz]

alright but BE libertarian till the end. do not be libertarian when you like and "normal" people when you don't like.

assume your beliefs.

 Be Libertarian when someone is running with your funds from a "centralized" exchanger (why did you use it if you want de-centralized exchangers?), be libertarian by not using the banks at all, keep all your money in Bitcoin as you learn everybody else to do it and so on

Also, be libertarian and say NO to any regulation and do not scream that you want a regulated market because a libertarian wants "freedom", right?

Be hypocrite till the end.

I am not a libertarian but I would like to know what you are because all ideologies have problems and all yours does is seem to make you unhappy and mad at others.

[SirChiko]

http://www.coindesk.com/mt-gox-ceo-mark-karpeles-implicated-silk-road-trial/

discuss.

I would never have expected that! You really cannot make this stuff up.

it is a bullshit. Ross Ulbricht owned Silk Road. FBI will bring the evidence next weeks. You will see.

Karpeles remains a thief and money launderer as most of the Bitcoin exchangers

Well, but if wallets were compromised and the gox had to operate with fake numbers after it could have something to do together, no?

[cinnamon_carter]

I find it amazing how quickly we forget in the United States people are innocent until proven guilty of any charge beyond a reasonable doubt.  Hundreds of years ago that system along with others was set up to prevent injustice by the wise men and women who suffered through those difficult times.  They left us some powerful laws to protect our liberty but few even know or care any longer......

Still that did not prevent the government from 'taking' assets and selling them off before any conviction or chance of appeal of the man facing these serious charges. What impunity the boot of the government steps into peoples lives.
Imagine he stands trial and is not guilty on every charge.  Will he get his time, health, nerves, assets and good name back with the same bravado in which they were stripped away from him ?  It would be impossible.

I never met him but to those calling for his lynching I ask have you ever met him ?

Do you have personal knowledge or evidence that justifies the crimes he is charged with and his guilt beyond a reasonable doubt ? Enough to jail him for life !!!
   
Who are the victims of these serious crimes I hear about ?

Anyone who is familiar with federal government prosecution tactics knows they have over 97% of the people plead guilty who are charged.

That means the 'authorities' in only about 3% of cases have to actally present evidence to a jury that proves anything beyond a reasonable doubt.

 
Why is that.. ... they strip people of assets, jail them, demoralize  them, put pressure on the families and do everything else in their power to strip them of the rights they have under the Constitution  of the United States ..........They file charges that are designed only to strike fear into the mind of anyone charged with a crime......

Pleading guilty gets a 5 year prison term, pleading innocent the person can face 100 years usually of trumped up charges.....

The criminal justice system in America is a large machine , a big bad business with an almost unlimited checkbook to expand operations.  It is run for profit for corporations and government agencies each with their own agendas.


I have no doubt there are few honourable men and women working for the prison/industrial/complex and partners the unlimited police departments in America trying to to what they believe is just and earn an honest living.

For the majority I guess they go along since it is a job for them and they care not for what is right or wrong.

There are probably some who actully delight in the ruin of other human lives.

Please , remember I am not taking  one side or another here in the trial of this man.

Unlike others I do not presume he did  something wrong since .....ohhhhhhh the police would  never arrest an innocent man........

ohhhhhh I saw it on tv,     ohhhhhhh i read all about it.
.
A few days ago another well known man was handed a 5 year prison term for providing a link  to something on the internet.

I would urge the almost all 'male' crowd who frequent the forum to consider your own hide if you cannot find a compassionate thought for someone you never met.

Until the trends that are running out of control right now in the name of LAW AND ORDER can be reversed to the fair and great justice system they mutated out of none of us are safe and could be taken away at any time.

Just try to remember that the next time you have the urge to follow the mob psychology and voice demands to 'lock them up and throw away the key' ......   

It is not by mistake schools in America today are run like  prisons.  The young  are being conditioned.
They may haul all our asses off someday if current trends continue.   

[thejaytiesto]

to me it looks like they got him pretty well covered... again I dont see him as a crook or criminal, he brought some interesting points to the table, but the shadow of a doubt is quickly fading.. unless his defense can pull a rabbit out of a hat, the confession of his friend with chat logs is going to be hard to dispute...

[BADecker]

I find it amazing how quickly we forget in the United States people are innocent until proven guilty of any charge beyond a reasonable doubt.  Hundreds of years ago that system along with others was set up to prevent injustice by the wise men and women who suffered through those difficult times.  They left us some powerful laws to protect our liberty but few even know or care any longer......

...

Further, basic law throughout the States requires that the plaintiff appear and take the stand to testify if the defendant so demands. The plaintiff in this case is the United States of America. It will never be able to take the stand and testify.

Further, basic law says that there must be harm or damage done. It is known as "corpus delicti." If the defendant requires it, the plaintiff must produce a person who was harmed with actual harm, or actual property damage that was done. Then they have to prove that the defendant did the harm or damage.

Further, they need a witness to the harming and/or damaging who will swear under oath that they observed that the defendant did it.

The whole court scene is designed to get the defendant to admit to guilt. Why? Because without that, if the defendant stands up and requires the above, government loses.

Further, if government loses, Ross can come back and demand a big settlement for everything they put him through, including return of his property, bitcoins, computer, etc.

The attorneys for the defendant are officers of the court. Their first allegiance is to the court, not to the defendant. The whole thing is a process to get the defendant to sign his life away rather than to stand up and require to face his accuser, the plaintiff, who must evidence some form of corpus delicti.

The court is a sham. It is a ripoff, designed to trick Ross into giving up.

[ScryptAsic]

I find it amazing how quickly we forget in the United States people are innocent until proven guilty of any charge beyond a reasonable doubt.  Hundreds of years ago that system along with others was set up to prevent injustice by the wise men and women who suffered through those difficult times.  They left us some powerful laws to protect our liberty but few even know or care any longer......

--snip--

I too am hoping for his acquittal, however looking at the evidence the government has so far presented against him, paired with my knowledge of Bitcoin, I somewhat doubt that he will be found not guilty.

If no additional evidence will be presented after today (this is not the case) then the burden of proof as beyond a reasonable doubt realistically has been met.

[mayax]

I find it amazing how quickly we forget in the United States people are innocent until proven guilty of any charge beyond a reasonable doubt.  Hundreds of years ago that system along with others was set up to prevent injustice by the wise men and women who suffered through those difficult times.  They left us some powerful laws to protect our liberty but few even know or care any longer......

--snip--

I too am hoping for his acquittal, however looking at the evidence the government has so far presented against him, paired with my knowledge of Bitcoin, I somewhat doubt that he will be found not guilty.

If no additional evidence will be presented after today (this is not the case) then the burden of proof as beyond a reasonable doubt realistically has been met.

I think the same. He developed the website and the whole network but life sentence or 20 years it's too much...IMO....even 10 years is too much.

[BADecker]

I find it amazing how quickly we forget in the United States people are innocent until proven guilty of any charge beyond a reasonable doubt.  Hundreds of years ago that system along with others was set up to prevent injustice by the wise men and women who suffered through those difficult times.  They left us some powerful laws to protect our liberty but few even know or care any longer......

--snip--

I too am hoping for his acquittal, however looking at the evidence the government has so far presented against him, paired with my knowledge of Bitcoin, I somewhat doubt that he will be found not guilty.

If no additional evidence will be presented after today (this is not the case) then the burden of proof as beyond a reasonable doubt realistically has been met.

We sit over here behind our computers. Ross is over there. Neither he nor his attorneys are trained in him just standing up and requiring the things I mentioned above ^^. Attorneys generally aren't trained that way. There is nobody he knows to trust besides his attorneys. There is nobody he will believe in who can get this info to him.

If he stands up as a man, not representing himself, but rather presenting himself (making himself as a man, present, rather than being represented by some made-up fictional Ross Ulbricht along with a bunch of attorneys), and requiring that his accuser take the stand and testify, he has it made. It, then becomes man to man. But... once he starts this, he has to maintain it throughout. And it has to be his accuser that he faces - the USA. Law does not let the accuser's attorney or representative take the accuser's place when a defendant stands as a man - man to man.

Laws are almost never presented in court. Only codes are. A defendant can't be tried as to understanding a code. Why not? Because he didn't write the code. He doesn't have understanding of what the authors meant when they wrote it. That's what the attorneys are for. So, if he stands alone, without his attorneys, as a man, present not represented by anyone, and they can't find his signature on the code like a contract, they can't make it apply to him, except if there is harm or damage - corpus delicti. And even then it is not the code that applies. It is the harm or damage.

They don't have a case against Ross the man. What they are trying to do is to get him to agree with them that he did wrong. Once he agrees that he did wrong, they have him. But, he didn't do wrong as a man, because there isn't anyone who was harmed or damaged... corpus delicti.

Study http://voidjudgments.com/ to see that I am right. It's all over the court cases and the law. What you as a man believe about your case is the thing that stands, except if there is corpus delicti. If they can get him to believe that he is guilty of something, he will admit to wrongdoing. Then it is all over for him. The whole court is a charade attempting to get him to admitting wrongdoing, thereby making himself guilty.

[hashman]

Crowdfund the jailbreak on lighthouse already

[inBitweTrust]

1st week review- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CbS24ul7mCE

2nd week overview of trial - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=20dmQlJFPZo

[picolo]

1st week review- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CbS24ul7mCE

2nd week overview of trial - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=20dmQlJFPZo

I will watch that thanks.

[ScryptAsic]

I find it amazing how quickly we forget in the United States people are innocent until proven guilty of any charge beyond a reasonable doubt.  Hundreds of years ago that system along with others was set up to prevent injustice by the wise men and women who suffered through those difficult times.  They left us some powerful laws to protect our liberty but few even know or care any longer......

--snip--

I too am hoping for his acquittal, however looking at the evidence the government has so far presented against him, paired with my knowledge of Bitcoin, I somewhat doubt that he will be found not guilty.

If no additional evidence will be presented after today (this is not the case) then the burden of proof as beyond a reasonable doubt realistically has been met.

I think the same. He developed the website and the whole network but life sentence or 20 years it's too much...IMO....even 10 years is too much.

Well it appears based on the evidence provided that he may have sold mushrooms in the very beginning of SR1. If this was the case (and can be proven) then he will likely get a lengthy jail sentence as the amount he apparently sold was probably trafficking levels.

If all that can be proven is that he was running Silk Road then the major concern is that he was really nothing more then a forum operator. Although he was marketing his forum to people trading illegal drugs he should not be held responsible for what was sold on it

[blumenwiese]

If all that can be proven is that he was running Silk Road then the major concern is that he was really nothing more then a forum operator. Although he was marketing his forum to people trading illegal drugs he should not be held responsible for what was sold on it

He made huge amounts of money from the drug selling business going on on his "forum" on his watch.
He was in it for the $$$ - get rich quick.

[SirChiko]

If all that can be proven is that he was running Silk Road then the major concern is that he was really nothing more then a forum operator. Although he was marketing his forum to people trading illegal drugs he should not be held responsible for what was sold on it

He made huge amounts of money from the drug selling business going on on his "forum" on his watch.
He was in it for the $$$ - get rich quick.

He just made the site, so fb owner should get sued for creating network where people set up drug deals easily also?

[wunkbone]

If all that can be proven is that he was running Silk Road then the major concern is that he was really nothing more then a forum operator. Although he was marketing his forum to people trading illegal drugs he should not be held responsible for what was sold on it

He made huge amounts of money from the drug selling business going on on his "forum" on his watch.
He was in it for the $$$ - get rich quick.

Almost anyone that creates a forum/website/business is ultimately going to be in it for the money.I don't think this facts proves/shows anything.

There are other sites that have illegal goods sold on them however their owners are not charged with similar crimes.