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Author Topic: [500 GH/s]HHTT -Selected Diff/Stratum/PPLNS/Paid Stales/High Availability/Tor  (Read 52480 times)
Richy_T
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April 03, 2013, 03:27:25 PM
 #381

Hey, I'm just musing. It's not that I don't like it. I just don't see why anyone would run a pool that way.

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April 03, 2013, 03:36:39 PM
 #382

Well, Deepbit is taking a 10% fee for PPS. Guess he broke more than even. HHTT's fees are incredible low for a PPS pool. (At least when using high difficulty setting.)

Review of the Spondoolies-Tech SP10 „Dawson“ Bitcoin miner (1.4 TH/s)

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April 03, 2013, 07:26:17 PM
 #383

Well, Deepbit is taking a 10% fee for PPS. Guess he broke more than even. HHTT's fees are incredible low for a PPS pool. (At least when using high difficulty setting.)
yeah. even with 4% + half of fee it is still low & I can guarantee that 2TH will still stay here even the fee rise to 4%. hopefully he can add merge mining & I dont mind even he keeps all the alt coins.
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April 04, 2013, 02:53:19 PM
 #384

Hi - I am seeing problems with Payouts..

These are my lasts payouts - however my "funds" are above 0.25 and most certainly above 0.00782663. Can you explain why such random payouts happen and when will I get my full funds, the schedule on the page obviously is wrong or something with payouts is broke atm. thanks

2013-04-04 09:01:28   7feefb9a1ac20a09a332035308b26dbc4e79ddd6c1782f856603486ec2ad10ea   0.00782663
2013-04-03 09:01:46   7901d456a8388c623fc46bbc826f5bf0f0e53b4b0dba74049ca322ea342845d1   0.00195646
2013-04-01 13:01:46   fd4f6b8db03fdb725ccf537ef9852f82426571da24aaa7acde22805a9e8304c2   0.07380505
2013-03-31 13:00:59   46290bf4c189032cfbcc8d78983718625c3b706c294ed485d181a4317fa34b48   0.00787946
2013-03-29 04:01:15   f8a973fb17706472cfc77e8cf07da421f61ab285fc043539176af187ca44743e   0.08283379

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April 04, 2013, 03:18:04 PM
 #385

Hi - I am seeing problems with Payouts..

These are my lasts payouts - however my "funds" are above 0.25 and most certainly above 0.00782663. Can you explain why such random payouts happen and when will I get my full funds, the schedule on the page obviously is wrong or something with payouts is broke atm. thanks

2013-04-04 09:01:28   7feefb9a1ac20a09a332035308b26dbc4e79ddd6c1782f856603486ec2ad10ea   0.00782663
2013-04-03 09:01:46   7901d456a8388c623fc46bbc826f5bf0f0e53b4b0dba74049ca322ea342845d1   0.00195646
2013-04-01 13:01:46   fd4f6b8db03fdb725ccf537ef9852f82426571da24aaa7acde22805a9e8304c2   0.07380505
2013-03-31 13:00:59   46290bf4c189032cfbcc8d78983718625c3b706c294ed485d181a4317fa34b48   0.00787946
2013-03-29 04:01:15   f8a973fb17706472cfc77e8cf07da421f61ab285fc043539176af187ca44743e   0.08283379
because the pool is short of money.
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April 04, 2013, 03:58:44 PM
 #386

Hi - I am seeing problems with Payouts..

These are my lasts payouts - however my "funds" are above 0.25 and most certainly above 0.00782663. Can you explain why such random payouts happen and when will I get my full funds, the schedule on the page obviously is wrong or something with payouts is broke atm. thanks

2013-04-04 09:01:28   7feefb9a1ac20a09a332035308b26dbc4e79ddd6c1782f856603486ec2ad10ea   0.00782663
2013-04-03 09:01:46   7901d456a8388c623fc46bbc826f5bf0f0e53b4b0dba74049ca322ea342845d1   0.00195646
2013-04-01 13:01:46   fd4f6b8db03fdb725ccf537ef9852f82426571da24aaa7acde22805a9e8304c2   0.07380505
2013-03-31 13:00:59   46290bf4c189032cfbcc8d78983718625c3b706c294ed485d181a4317fa34b48   0.00787946
2013-03-29 04:01:15   f8a973fb17706472cfc77e8cf07da421f61ab285fc043539176af187ca44743e   0.08283379
because the pool is short of money.

and because lower hashrates are penalized, since it won't attempt to pay them every hour

right now, all the people at 60000-70000mhash are between 1.0 to 1.26 owed.  i'm at 0.9 with 7600mhash avg over the last day.  

1EFhXfX9uXsbXBF3LC69GiVfS3SHCsyMR1    is at 0.84 owed, with avg daily hash rate of 1700.  i think that's about 4 days behind, vs a couple hours for anyone that can make it to 1.0 fairly quickly

ed: since i'm already bumping at 1, and it's repaying me whenever i get back to 1, there's not much reason to switch (at least right now)..  but that 1 bitcoin could quite possibly be gone forever.  i sure wouldnt mine on there with anything under 60000mhash if you dont already have a 1btc balance

Dacentec, best deals for US dedicated servers. They regularly restock $20-$25 Opterons with 8-16GB RAM & 2x1-2TB HDD's (ofc, usually lots of other good stuff to choose from).  I did a Serverbear benchmark of one of my $20/mo Opteron (June last year), it's here.  Have had about a half dozen different servers with Dacentec, & none have failed to sustain at least 40MB/s (burst higher). My favorite is a 12-month rent-to-own ZT Systems 2XL5520 16GB 2x2TB SATA for $40/month (got lucky with the 'off-brand', haven't seen a RTO 2xL5520 for under $50/mo since -- at least for monthly contracts).  wholesaleinternet.com has some ancient 2-core intel CPUs @ $10/mo sometimes (I got an Intel Core 2 6300 @ 1.86GHz, with a 250GB HDD with 46000 hours on it, LOL. $20 @ Dacentec is much better, if you can grab one). joesdatacenter.com (same location as Wholesale Internet) also occasionally has specials (or if you don't want to wait, it has an AMD Opteron 170 @ $16/mo).
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April 04, 2013, 04:17:31 PM
 #387

Hi - I am seeing problems with Payouts..

These are my lasts payouts - however my "funds" are above 0.25 and most certainly above 0.00782663. Can you explain why such random payouts happen and when will I get my full funds, the schedule on the page obviously is wrong or something with payouts is broke atm. thanks

2013-04-04 09:01:28   7feefb9a1ac20a09a332035308b26dbc4e79ddd6c1782f856603486ec2ad10ea   0.00782663
2013-04-03 09:01:46   7901d456a8388c623fc46bbc826f5bf0f0e53b4b0dba74049ca322ea342845d1   0.00195646
2013-04-01 13:01:46   fd4f6b8db03fdb725ccf537ef9852f82426571da24aaa7acde22805a9e8304c2   0.07380505
2013-03-31 13:00:59   46290bf4c189032cfbcc8d78983718625c3b706c294ed485d181a4317fa34b48   0.00787946
2013-03-29 04:01:15   f8a973fb17706472cfc77e8cf07da421f61ab285fc043539176af187ca44743e   0.08283379
because the pool is short of money.

and because lower hashrates are penalized, since it won't attempt to pay them every hour

right now, all the people at 60000-70000mhash are between 1.0 to 1.26 owed.  i'm at 0.9 with 7600mhash avg over the last day.  

1EFhXfX9uXsbXBF3LC69GiVfS3SHCsyMR1    is at 0.84 owed, with avg daily hash rate of 1700.  i think that's about 4 days behind, vs a couple hours for anyone that can make it to 1.0 fairly quickly

ed: since i'm already bumping at 1, and it's repaying me whenever i get back to 1, there's not much reason to switch (at least right now)..  but that 1 bitcoin could quite possibly be gone forever.  i sure wouldnt mine on there with anything under 60000mhash if you dont already have a 1btc balance

ok, another hourly payment triggered.  now all the 66000mhash people are at 0.65 owed (emptying the available wallet), while the person at 1700mhash is still at 0.84

Dacentec, best deals for US dedicated servers. They regularly restock $20-$25 Opterons with 8-16GB RAM & 2x1-2TB HDD's (ofc, usually lots of other good stuff to choose from).  I did a Serverbear benchmark of one of my $20/mo Opteron (June last year), it's here.  Have had about a half dozen different servers with Dacentec, & none have failed to sustain at least 40MB/s (burst higher). My favorite is a 12-month rent-to-own ZT Systems 2XL5520 16GB 2x2TB SATA for $40/month (got lucky with the 'off-brand', haven't seen a RTO 2xL5520 for under $50/mo since -- at least for monthly contracts).  wholesaleinternet.com has some ancient 2-core intel CPUs @ $10/mo sometimes (I got an Intel Core 2 6300 @ 1.86GHz, with a 250GB HDD with 46000 hours on it, LOL. $20 @ Dacentec is much better, if you can grab one). joesdatacenter.com (same location as Wholesale Internet) also occasionally has specials (or if you don't want to wait, it has an AMD Opteron 170 @ $16/mo).
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April 04, 2013, 06:43:09 PM
 #388


and because lower hashrates are penalized, since it won't attempt to pay them every hour

right now, all the people at 60000-70000mhash are between 1.0 to 1.26 owed.  i'm at 0.9 with 7600mhash avg over the last day.  

1EFhXfX9uXsbXBF3LC69GiVfS3SHCsyMR1    is at 0.84 owed, with avg daily hash rate of 1700.  i think that's about 4 days behind, vs a couple hours for anyone that can make it to 1.0 fairly quickly

ed: since i'm already bumping at 1, and it's repaying me whenever i get back to 1, there's not much reason to switch (at least right now)..  but that 1 bitcoin could quite possibly be gone forever.  i sure wouldnt mine on there with anything under 60000mhash if you dont already have a 1btc balance

Good point.

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April 04, 2013, 06:56:36 PM
 #389

It seems like amount paid should be proportional to the amount of time between payouts. I understand paying out less often for smaller miners but if the purse is empty, they're disproportionately penalized.

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April 04, 2013, 06:59:23 PM
 #390

Sorry to say, but this is sh*t. I mined for 3 weeks into the pool and now you're telling me, profits are gone forever and I'm stuck on electricity bills? Please fireduck, fix this. I would say I donate to your pool, but I already paid 10-15% fees for my low diff shares. Needless to say, that's an exorbitant high fee for low diff shares!

1.  Highest fee is just over 10%
2.  To incur a higher fee you must choose a diff lower than the standard of 32 (3.4% fee)

FD has always done right by the miners and look forward to hearing from him -- it is an issue for all but significantly moreso for the miners with lower hashrates.

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April 04, 2013, 07:23:09 PM
 #391

I know FD is reliable and I trust he will fix this. But from my point of view I was lured into building trust in this pool after the first 0.01 BTC was sent after one day as stated in the pools own terms of service.

Now that I have invested weeks of hashing power into the pool, the pools own payout rules don't apply anymore?  

JWU42 said:

> 1.  Highest fee is just over 10%
> 2.  To incur a higher fee you must choose a diff lower than the standard of 32 (3.4% fee)

1. Fees have been significantly higher until 5 days ago. They've been 16% for diff 1 if I remember correctly.

2. In this very thread it wasn't advised to mine with 32 diff with a 400 MH miner. One share each month isn't going to do you any good or the pool. So small miners are forced to pay with high fees and are forced to forfeit some of their earning as well.. ?



You don't have to choose 32 - 32 is DEFAULT.  You have to CHOOSE to use lower (or higher) than 32 diff.  Taking the small guy getting screwed out of the discussion, that was my point.  It was the user's choice to select something other than the default 32 and they were doing so knowing it has higher fees.

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April 05, 2013, 06:12:17 AM
 #392

So the pool is basically broke with long delays between when people mine and when they get paid (the pool pays out when it can).

This sucks for me because I have a bunch of risk and am not really making any money for my efforts and significant hosting costs.  It sucks for miners because they are not getting paid consistently.

So I am thinking of switching to PPSLN, which has no risk for me but adds some variance to miners.  Anyone with thoughts on that?

I would have the payments for a block be build into the coinbase for the block so everyone gets paid as soon as that block matures and the accounting gets much simpler.

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April 05, 2013, 06:25:39 AM
 #393

So the pool is basically broke with long delays between when people mine and when they get paid (the pool pays out when it can).

This sucks for me because I have a bunch of risk and am not really making any money for my efforts and significant hosting costs.  It sucks for miners because they are not getting paid consistently.

So I am thinking of switching to PPSLN, which has no risk for me but adds some variance to miners.  Anyone with thoughts on that?

I would have the payments for a block be build into the coinbase for the block so everyone gets paid as soon as that block matures and the accounting gets much simpler.


raise PPS fee to 5% first, add merge mining NMC & you keep it all.
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April 05, 2013, 07:09:15 AM
 #394

Quote
raise PPS fee to 5% first, add merge mining NMC & you keep it all.

Fee is 10% for diff 2 and was 16% for diff 1 shares. No matter what system will be chosen, something has to change - that's what I'm advertising. Since w/o reliable payouts a pool is no good.

Obvisouly PPSLN will drive certain crowds away from the pool, people who dislike variance and favor steady payouts. However if it will make frozen funds liquid again, people will also come back to the pool.

As it stands now, for small miners (and your pool has quite a few of them), it doesn't make sense to pay a 10.4917% fee for diff 2 shares and then having to face payout problems. The attraction of the minimalistic approach of the pool is not significant good enough anymore in face of these problems. When ASIC rule earth you can always switch back to PPS again or some other "mean" 10000-difficulty system. Why don't you implement both systems, is it very complex to achieve that?

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April 05, 2013, 07:47:43 AM
 #395

Quote
raise PPS fee to 5% first, add merge mining NMC & you keep it all.

Fee is 10% for diff 2 and was 16% for diff 1 shares. No matter what system will be chosen, something has to change - that's what I'm advertising. Since w/o reliable payouts a pool is no good.

Obvisouly PPSLN will drive certain crowds away from the pool, people who dislike variance and favor steady payouts. However if it will make frozen funds liquid again, people will also come back to the pool.

As it stands now, for small miners (and your pool has quite a few of them), it doesn't make sense to pay a 10.4917% fee for diff 2 shares and then having to face payout problems. The attraction of the minimalistic approach of the pool is not significant good enough anymore in face of these problems. When ASIC rule earth you can always switch back to PPS again or some other "mean" 10000-difficulty system. Why don't you implement both systems, is it very complex to achieve that?
what about ...
0.0425 + (0.1325/pow(32 + share_difficulty,0.6))

 Roll Eyes
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April 05, 2013, 10:19:43 AM
 #396

Sorry to be that guy but it is PPLNS...  Roll Eyes

PPLNS - Pay Per Last N Shares. Similar to proportional, but instead of looking at the number of shares in the round, instead looks at the last N shares, regardless of round boundaries.

A great write-up by Meni -- https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=39832

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April 05, 2013, 12:18:46 PM
 #397

I don't really have a problem with the delayed payments myself... my problem is that there is no specific code in case of payment delays... so if you're under 1.00 BTC and don't have the hashrate to make more than 1BTC a day, you'll get a single daily payment which will consist of some small percentage of the available wallet.  The available wallet gets emptied every hour or two by the people at 60000mhash+.

If the pool doesn't go completely 'bankrupt' (right now it has about 75BTC left, after taking wallet + immature - payments owned), it'll take me at best, several days to get the 0.71719025 owed to me... last payment was 0.23906341 (lucky as hell, really), next payment won't be for 24hrs.  If I'm unlucky and a block doesn't mature in the hour before that next payment, I'll end up with something like 0.0x, since the wallet will be emptied by all the ASIC users from the hour earlier.

Good example is this:

http://hhtt.1209k.com/user-details.php?user=19yRn7nT4wV67xtpC7wuySBKg1p1kAxMj2

who had been mining at the pool nonstop for 6 months but stopped recently...   well, 3 days ago... and has gotten 0.2 out of the 1 owed in those 3 days. 


Dacentec, best deals for US dedicated servers. They regularly restock $20-$25 Opterons with 8-16GB RAM & 2x1-2TB HDD's (ofc, usually lots of other good stuff to choose from).  I did a Serverbear benchmark of one of my $20/mo Opteron (June last year), it's here.  Have had about a half dozen different servers with Dacentec, & none have failed to sustain at least 40MB/s (burst higher). My favorite is a 12-month rent-to-own ZT Systems 2XL5520 16GB 2x2TB SATA for $40/month (got lucky with the 'off-brand', haven't seen a RTO 2xL5520 for under $50/mo since -- at least for monthly contracts).  wholesaleinternet.com has some ancient 2-core intel CPUs @ $10/mo sometimes (I got an Intel Core 2 6300 @ 1.86GHz, with a 250GB HDD with 46000 hours on it, LOL. $20 @ Dacentec is much better, if you can grab one). joesdatacenter.com (same location as Wholesale Internet) also occasionally has specials (or if you don't want to wait, it has an AMD Opteron 170 @ $16/mo).
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April 05, 2013, 02:26:39 PM
 #398

I don't really have a problem with the delayed payments myself... my problem is that there is no specific code in case of payment delays... so if you're under 1.00 BTC and don't have the hashrate to make more than 1BTC a day, you'll get a single daily payment which will consist of some small percentage of the available wallet.  The available wallet gets emptied every hour or two by the people at 60000mhash+.


Yeah,

payments should start from low hash rate suckers and pay up towards high hash-rate suckers Smiley and pool should pay every hour if it has available coins.

spiccioli
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April 05, 2013, 02:50:12 PM
 #399

Two things might help;

1) Make the default rate variable per miner. 32 is great ( I use it ) even though my hash rate is only 1700Mh/s - Yes that is average of over 1 minute a share. You already have some of the code in place, you use it to display the ideal difficulty for each miners current hash rate; If you want to complete one share every 15, 30, 60 and 120 seconds. Make it the min allowed for that specific miner, people can set higher if they wish. So it just as simple as, they can request a lower one, but they'll actually receive the min allowed. No need to restrict what shares you allow to be submitted, if their min happens to change between request and submission.
I notice a lot of your biggest miners ask for a difficulty well below the 15 seconds one. This could reduce a lot of the strain on your servers.

2) Reduce the price range between lowest and highest % fee, say sliding scale between 3% and 5%. Then assign them based upon the above numbers. So if your request a difficult near you min difficulty 5% (15 seconds), if you do it nearer to the one for 120 seconds, it's 3%.
Trust me you can't be making that much off the few who actually do mine at a rate above 5%, but you are scaring them off, it is kinda proven in how many miners are 1Gh/s and above and how many are below that. The above change will mean their is less of a reason to charge differently because you are making sure each miner is not stressing your server. The main reason for this is to encourage more miners in general, not just large ones. Variance is high and we need a good way to lower that, one is with more miners.

The miners here like this pool as one of the original high difficulty pools, with low fees, with reliable payouts. It can be turned around.
I hope my ideas help and not too unrealistic.

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April 05, 2013, 02:52:24 PM
 #400

I don't really have a problem with the delayed payments myself... my problem is that there is no specific code in case of payment delays... so if you're under 1.00 BTC and don't have the hashrate to make more than 1BTC a day, you'll get a single daily payment which will consist of some small percentage of the available wallet.  The available wallet gets emptied every hour or two by the people at 60000mhash+.


Yeah,

payments should start from low hash rate suckers and pay up towards high hash-rate suckers Smiley and pool should pay every hour if it has available coins.

spiccioli

I'd even be happy if the payments were just buffered up. Calculate my payment from the insufficient purse every hour then pay me the sum on the 24 or 72 or whatever.

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