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Author Topic: Can I want my money back from SatoshiDICE?  (Read 6806 times)
TTBit
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July 26, 2012, 02:47:54 PM
 #21

Idea: A DB of addresses that pooled funds such as MtGox can contact so they don't send to them. Lottery and SD addresses come to mind.

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July 26, 2012, 02:49:08 PM
 #22

Idea: A DB of addresses that pooled funds such as MtGox can contact so they don't send to them. Lottery and SD addresses come to mind.
Actually, while I am opposed to "blacklists" and such, it would make sense for mtgox to give warning when paying to known satoshidice addresses to prevent issues like this.

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July 26, 2012, 02:49:28 PM
 #23

Idea: A DB of addresses that pooled funds such as MtGox can contact so they don't send to them. Lottery and SD addresses come to mind.

Will call it a the Red List.

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July 26, 2012, 02:50:38 PM
 #24

Since MtGox doubles as a wallet. Perhaps we should make it a double confirm

"You are about to send X btc to a SatoshiDice address. Are you sure?"

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TTBit
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July 26, 2012, 02:51:24 PM
 #25

Idea: A DB of addresses that pooled funds such as MtGox can contact so they don't send to them. Lottery and SD addresses come to mind.
Actually, while I am opposed to "blacklists" and such, it would make sense for mtgox to give warning when paying to known satoshidice addresses to prevent issues like this.

Also, mixers such as the one from blockchain.info could add to the DB after the address is deleted

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July 26, 2012, 02:52:41 PM
 #26

...Or just call it a stupid tax

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July 26, 2012, 02:57:35 PM
 #27

I LOLd Smiley)

Idea: A DB of addresses that pooled funds such as MtGox can contact so they don't send to them. Lottery and SD addresses come to mind.
Actually, while I am opposed to "blacklists" and such, it would make sense for mtgox to give warning when paying to known satoshidice addresses to prevent issues like this.
If anything, MtGox and others should prevent sending to 1dice/… from addresses that can't be used as return addresses as this is 99.9% unintentional but on the other hand: I would go with the stupid tax comment and not burden business with any effort like that.

Anyway, thanx for the laugh Smiley

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July 26, 2012, 02:59:42 PM
 #28

"Can I want my money back from SatoshiDICE?"
Yes you can.

"Can I have my money back from SatoshiDICE?"
I would say no.

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July 26, 2012, 03:07:42 PM
 #29

I LOLd Smiley)

Idea: A DB of addresses that pooled funds such as MtGox can contact so they don't send to them. Lottery and SD addresses come to mind.
Actually, while I am opposed to "blacklists" and such, it would make sense for mtgox to give warning when paying to known satoshidice addresses to prevent issues like this.
If anything, MtGox and others should prevent sending to 1dice/… from addresses that can't be used as return addresses as this is 99.9% unintentional but on the other hand: I would go with the stupid tax comment and not burden business with any effort like that.

Anyway, thanx for the laugh Smiley

Let's say for instance that this bloke DID win. Where would the winnings go?

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July 26, 2012, 04:50:26 PM
 #30


I'm new bitcoiner here.

Today, I made a serious mistake.

When I withdraw from Mtgox at 2012/07/26 02:40:48, I inputed the address of a SatoshiDICE (1dice97ECuByXAvqXpaYzSaQuPVvrtmz6)  and did not notice the error.

So, I lost 50BTC.

I would like to ask, Can I get back to me the BTC?

Is any SatoshiDICE staff here? Can anybody help me?




Rockxie - Unfortunately money sent to SatoshiDice from certain ewallets cannot be recovered. There is a warning on the front page of SatoshiDice explaining this:

Quote
WARNING: Only use wallets that allow you to receive Bitcoin from the same address you sent from. If you're not sure, test with .001 Bitcoins. If you get nothing back, then your wallet is not compatible.

So I am sorry to say that the funds cannot be returned. Any winnings from these bets go back to Gox, but they go into an account which Gox doesn't/can't access for some reason. It's possible the funds now belong to another Gox account holder. It's not really fair to bother Gox with this either, since SatoshiDice gives a very clear warning not to use it.  And if you lost the bet anyway, then there's no funds to return of course.

Please always be careful with bitcoins. The irreversible nature means you need to be diligent. You should not have sent a 50btc bet to a site that you didn't understand the mechanics of. I feel your pain, but please use this as a lesson for the future  Undecided
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July 26, 2012, 04:57:56 PM
 #31

You should not have sent a 50btc bet to a site that you didn't understand the mechanics of.
It sounds like it was a cut-'n-paste error, but yes - always double and triple check the address and the amount.

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July 26, 2012, 05:02:39 PM
 #32

You should not have sent a 50btc bet to a site that you didn't understand the mechanics of.
It sounds like it was a cut-'n-paste error, but yes - always double and triple check the address and the amount.

If only SatoshiDICE had some sort of vanity prefix for their addresses...   Cheesy
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July 26, 2012, 05:04:22 PM
 #33

evoorhees, I have a great idea here.

I want to send to the dice 50 BTC using proper client that can get incoming transfers to the transfer out source address just fine. It'll be 50/50 bet.

Then if I lose the bet I'll post on this forum and will tell ya opps I made a mistake, please refund. Pretty please! Sounds as a decent idea to me. What do you think?



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July 26, 2012, 05:20:09 PM
 #34


Rockxie - Unfortunately money sent to SatoshiDice from certain ewallets cannot be recovered. There is a warning on the front page of SatoshiDice explaining this:

Quote
WARNING: Only use wallets that allow you to receive Bitcoin from the same address you sent from. If you're not sure, test with .001 Bitcoins. If you get nothing back, then your wallet is not compatible.

So I am sorry to say that the funds cannot be returned. Any winnings from these bets go back to Gox, but they go into an account which Gox doesn't/can't access for some reason. It's possible the funds now belong to another Gox account holder. It's not really fair to bother Gox with this either, since SatoshiDice gives a very clear warning not to use it.  And if you lost the bet anyway, then there's no funds to return of course.

Please always be careful with bitcoins. The irreversible nature means you need to be diligent. You should not have sent a 50btc bet to a site that you didn't understand the mechanics of. I feel your pain, but please use this as a lesson for the future  Undecided



Can you tell if the bet the OP placed won? Can you tell whether the address it was sent from is one of these send-only Gox addresses? If the bet didn't win and it really did come from a Gox address, you're out no BTC and you know he wasn't trying to scam you, right?

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evoorhees
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July 26, 2012, 05:27:02 PM
 #35

I'll give the OP the benefit of the doubt. I don't think he was trying to scam SatoshiDice, but in any case that's a good reason why "refunds" can't be given (even if it was possible to do so, which in this case, it's not).
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July 26, 2012, 05:31:20 PM
 #36

Sorry but this look like angle shooting. I'm sorry for your loss.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Advantage_gambling#Angle_shooting
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July 26, 2012, 05:56:11 PM
 #37

You should not have sent a 50btc bet to a site that you didn't understand the mechanics of.
It sounds like it was a cut-'n-paste error, but yes - always double and triple check the address and the amount.

If only SatoshiDICE had some sort of vanity prefix for their addresses...   Cheesy

+1 Cheesy

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July 26, 2012, 06:00:17 PM
 #38


Can you tell if the bet the OP placed won? Can you tell whether the address it was sent from is one of these send-only Gox addresses? If the bet didn't win and it really did come from a Gox address, you're out no BTC and you know he wasn't trying to scam you, right?

If only a forum member had identified her bet already and determined the answers to these questions are: "lost, from a Mt.Gox account."

I'm afraid that it doesn't follow that it isn't a scam. If she had won, she would go to Mt.Gox instead and reclaim the profits by showing she placed the withdrawl. A scammee could bet that there's more than 1.8% chance SD would refund, which makes it a nice trick you could only get away with once. And if only once, why not for 50?

I believe OP made an honest mistake, but because it's impossible to know, the best policy is to hold a hard line.
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July 26, 2012, 06:30:50 PM
 #39

rockxie, you need to quickly send 100 btc to that address and when it hits, you'll win back everything you lost.  If it doesn't win, send 200.  It's a sure thing!
 Cheesy

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July 26, 2012, 07:02:43 PM
 #40

Idea: A DB of addresses that pooled funds such as MtGox can contact so they don't send to them. Lottery and SD addresses come to mind.

I submitted a support ticket to Mt. Gox requesting this capability:


Quote
There is the repeating situation where people are withdrawing from a Mt. Gox to an address which is incompatible with a hosted (shared) wallet like how Mt. Gox customer accounts use.

SatoshiDICE is one of these.  The betting site returns winnings (and commissions in losses as well) for all wagers to the sender's bitcoin address.  There have been numerous reports of a party not knowing Mt. Gox accounts aren't compatible in this manner and using it anyway.

While Mt. Gox isn't unique in maintaining a hosted (shared) wallet for its customer accounts, it is the largest.    It might be good customer service to at a minimum maintain a blacklist of static bitcoin addresses where any BTC withdrawal requests from Mt.Gox are checked against this list.  If there is a match either the request is rejected or at a minimum the user is warned before proceeding.

There are multiple services like this ... SatoshiDICE, BTCDice, BitLotto, and a handful of others much smaller.

There might even be a way to automate this where any service that is incompatible with EWallets can submit a request to be blocked.  The request would be a standardized format and be submitted as a message using the message signing feature available in the Bitcoin.org client.  There would probably be two messages for this, one to add a block, anther to clear a block.  That's far down the road though. 

At present it is just a handful of addresses which would be best if they were excluded.

Would Mt. Gox take the proactive step and add some method to either block or warn the user when these withdrawal requests are made?

SatoshiDICE could add one restriction.  If the coin happened to be coming from a green address (such as those from Mt. Gox, Instawallet or wherever else they are offered) to return it without treating it as a wager.  That's would only solve a tiny fraction of these as most are not Green Address withdrawals, but it likely will happen a few times.

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