Bought an account , and received a negative reputation a month later

[Quickseller]

While the account does appear to be sold, it does not change the fact that the OP engaged in extremely unethical behavior by opening a scam accusation against the seller ~2 hours before buying it via an alt.

Unethical how ? I just bought an account from him, at the right market price. I didn't ask him to give it to me for cheap because of the loan either. Plus, its not worth a negative rep because I am not scamming anyone in any way.

He had pressure to get rid of any accounts that he owned because he would have feared them receiving negative trust. You used a different account to buy the account then you used to open the scam accusation, you know there was a reason for that in that you didn't want him to know that you were buying the account even though you openly buy accounts. If you used lolled to try to buy it then you would be running the risk of him pointing this out and your credibility ruined.

Additionally the fact that Ume is almost always around at roughly the same time you are around to back up your statements/claims makes me further suspicious that you are somehow associated with him despite the evidence to the contrary above.

[erikalui]

No, it isn't, because one person can have multiple IP addresses across the globe if they want to.

How many hours of everyone's time has been wasted by account selling and throwing theories around about scammer alts, whether negs should be removed, etc? If this was my forum, every sold account would be banned, with some sort of algorithm to detect it (password change forces logout and immediate relogin from same IP, perhaps).

Yeah, proxy can be used. If the OP tried to fake this account sale, I don't see a huge amount risked here as I don't think he even made a good amount in BTC by faking this sale or scamming anyone here. If this case is true, such a person needs treatment. I've never come across such a rare case in my life.

Account sales should be banned here else such cases would keep coming up and the admin would need to provide evidences for such scams. Here I can't even say if I am talking to 5 different people on my thread or if it's one person. I actually have spoken to 3 different members on this forum for a deal and now I realized the 3 members were actually only 1 person who owns more 4-5 accounts.

[TheButterZone]

No, it isn't, because one person can have multiple IP addresses across the globe if they want to.

Ofcourse they can, but you wanted the log for the password change, which I was able to get for you through theymos.

Ok, then the only PM I'm interested in at this point is from a mod/staff member who can show a preponderance of the evidence (logs, hostnames, etc) one way or the other. Don't PM me again Twipple, unless a mod/staff has told you they PMed me that first.

With only a log of these ridiculous password changes being inconclusive, the preponderance has not been reached.

I started a scam accusation against Ume, for couple of things. Which should make it obvious that he and I are not the same person. The thread was started before any negative trust came on either Ume or Twipple.

I could have sworn my initial negative on Twipple (which might have showed under untrusted feedback) was on Jan 31 2015, the day I got the begging PM, and I deleted/replaced it later to shorten my Dropbox URL. Is there a ratings log that shows removals?

Assuming that none of the IP addresses can be linked to a known tor exit node or a VPN then it is most likely the account was sold.

Where can I input the IP addresses to detect those links?

[Twipple]

While the account does appear to be sold, it does not change the fact that the OP engaged in extremely unethical behavior by opening a scam accusation against the seller ~2 hours before buying it via an alt.

Unethical how ? I just bought an account from him, at the right market price. I didn't ask him to give it to me for cheap because of the loan either. Plus, its not worth a negative rep because I am not scamming anyone in any way.

He had pressure to get rid of any accounts that he owned because he would have feared them receiving negative trust. You used a different account to buy the account then you used to open the scam accusation, you know there was a reason for that in that you didn't want him to know that you were buying the account even though you openly buy accounts. If you used lolled to try to buy it then you would be running the risk of him pointing this out and your credibility ruined.

Ok, Firstly, I do not wish to let this discussion affect the negative trust on my account by TBZ in anyway, as its not related to this in anyway,  so if you want to discuss it through, then PM me. I will just do it one last time for you. Obviously, I wouldn't have used my original account. I actually bought the account to prove that there was something fishy, and since I was also getting it for the market price(Note , it was 0.05 for a Member acccount ) , I didn't mind. And him pointing out would not ruin my credibility, as its not scamming to buy accounts.

Additionally the fact that Ume is almost always around at roughly the same time you are around to back up your statements/claims makes me further suspicious that you are somehow associated with him despite the evidence to the contrary above.

I thought we were over with this phase. I started the initial scam accusation against him, and it was also during the loan with him that an address was posted. Being around at the same time is not my fault. Just because you Quickseller spend your life on the forum, and are online at the same time with another guy, doesn't mean you are him.

[Twipple]

No, it isn't, because one person can have multiple IP addresses across the globe if they want to.

Ofcourse they can, but you wanted the log for the password change, which I was able to get for you through theymos.

Ok, then the only PM I'm interested in at this point is from a mod/staff member who can show a preponderance of the evidence (logs, hostnames, etc) one way or the other. Don't PM me again Twipple, unless a mod/staff has told you they PMed me that first.

With only a log of these ridiculous password changes being inconclusive, the preponderance has not been reached.

What you wanted was the log for PM change. The PM change log doesn't show the IP anyways, which I provided to you as a courtesy and theymos didn't.  How is it inconclusive in anyway ?

[Quickseller]

You should be able to check for tor exit nodes on the tor projects website (I assume) for VPNs that is much more difficult. I believe that you can even get VPN gateways of residential IP addresses with some services (http://lowendtalk.com/discussion/27897/vpn-service-that-provides-ip-s-that-look-like-a-residential-isp) so any list of VPN IP addresses would be incomplete.

[Umekhan]

No reason for making this scam thread about me ..
1) I forget the password of my Ume account lol.
2) Twipple , when he saw that the twipple account scammed me over 0.025 he said me that i,ll buy your account, the starting price was from 0.04 i guess. I posted like 5-20 because i know that the account has some potential while looking at its date of registeration . after that when i went to 110+ activity which was near to FM . he bought this account at 0.05.
3) Getting negative feedback after 1-2 months . is not my fault, he know that its a scammer account who just scammed me for 0.025 why did he buy ,
4) I just pm`ed theymos with my signed message to recover my account , if i get into it i have all the pm`s saved in my account.
 
If you have further questions to ask me then i m here,

[Twipple]

No reason for making this scam thread about me ..
1) I forget the password of my Ume account lol.
2) Twipple , when he saw that the twipple account scammed me over 0.025 he said me that i,ll buy your account, the starting price was from 0.04 i guess. I posted like 5-20 because i know that the account has some potential while looking at its date of registeration . after that when i went to 110+ activity which was near to FM . he bought this account at 0.05.
3) Getting negative feedback after 1-2 months . is not my fault, he know that its a scammer account who just scammed me for 0.025 why did he buy ,
4) I just pm`ed theymos with my signed message to recover my account , if i get into it i have all the pm`s saved in my account.
 
If you have further questions to ask me then i m here,

Can you admit you sent that message(begging) to TheButterZone ?
Just incase you don't I would be happy to have an escrow , login to my account, and the account I bought the account from and from the time of the messages prove that it was you.

[Umekhan]

No reason for making this scam thread about me ..
1) I forget the password of my Ume account lol.
2) Twipple , when he saw that the twipple account scammed me over 0.025 he said me that i,ll buy your account, the starting price was from 0.04 i guess. I posted like 5-20 because i know that the account has some potential while looking at its date of registeration . after that when i went to 110+ activity which was near to FM . he bought this account at 0.05.
3) Getting negative feedback after 1-2 months . is not my fault, he know that its a scammer account who just scammed me for 0.025 why did he buy ,
4) I just pm`ed theymos with my signed message to recover my account , if i get into it i have all the pm`s saved in my account.
 
If you have further questions to ask me then i m here,

Can you admit you sent that message to TheButterZone ?
Just incase you don't I would be happy to have an escrow , login to my account, and Tdowns account and from the time of the messages prove that it was you.

No i do not admit that i sent message to TheButterZone , maybe before asking for loan the Scammer(twipple) sent the pm for begging but i dont ..

[Twipple]

No reason for making this scam thread about me ..
1) I forget the password of my Ume account lol.
2) Twipple , when he saw that the twipple account scammed me over 0.025 he said me that i,ll buy your account, the starting price was from 0.04 i guess. I posted like 5-20 because i know that the account has some potential while looking at its date of registeration . after that when i went to 110+ activity which was near to FM . he bought this account at 0.05.
3) Getting negative feedback after 1-2 months . is not my fault, he know that its a scammer account who just scammed me for 0.025 why did he buy ,
4) I just pm`ed theymos with my signed message to recover my account , if i get into it i have all the pm`s saved in my account.
 
If you have further questions to ask me then i m here,

Can you admit you sent that message to TheButterZone ?
Just incase you don't I would be happy to have an escrow , login to my account, and Tdowns account and from the time of the messages prove that it was you.

No i do not admit that i sent message to TheButterZone , maybe before asking for loan the Scammer(twipple) sent the pm for begging but i dont ..

Well the time the message was sent  is 31st January. Anyways, I won't have a problem proving it as you clearly had the account holding on 31st.
TheButterZone , how would you like to proceed on this ?

[Umekhan]

No reason for making this scam thread about me ..
1) I forget the password of my Ume account lol.
2) Twipple , when he saw that the twipple account scammed me over 0.025 he said me that i,ll buy your account, the starting price was from 0.04 i guess. I posted like 5-20 because i know that the account has some potential while looking at its date of registeration . after that when i went to 110+ activity which was near to FM . he bought this account at 0.05.
3) Getting negative feedback after 1-2 months . is not my fault, he know that its a scammer account who just scammed me for 0.025 why did he buy ,
4) I just pm`ed theymos with my signed message to recover my account , if i get into it i have all the pm`s saved in my account.
 
If you have further questions to ask me then i m here,

Can you admit you sent that message to TheButterZone ?
Just incase you don't I would be happy to have an escrow , login to my account, and Tdowns account and from the time of the messages prove that it was you.

No i do not admit that i sent message to TheButterZone , maybe before asking for loan the Scammer(twipple) sent the pm for begging but i dont ..

Well the time the message was sent  is 31st January. Anyways, I won't have a problem proving it as you clearly had the account holding on 31st.
TheButterZone , how would you like to proceed on this ?

Well there is no such reason that i ask for some shit money .
in the mean time, I was running an exchange For Pakistani`s you can check my trust.
Giving loans.
so this means i have enough bitcoins ,

[Twipple]

No reason for making this scam thread about me ..
1) I forget the password of my Ume account lol.
2) Twipple , when he saw that the twipple account scammed me over 0.025 he said me that i,ll buy your account, the starting price was from 0.04 i guess. I posted like 5-20 because i know that the account has some potential while looking at its date of registeration . after that when i went to 110+ activity which was near to FM . he bought this account at 0.05.
3) Getting negative feedback after 1-2 months . is not my fault, he know that its a scammer account who just scammed me for 0.025 why did he buy ,
4) I just pm`ed theymos with my signed message to recover my account , if i get into it i have all the pm`s saved in my account.
 
If you have further questions to ask me then i m here,

Can you admit you sent that message to TheButterZone ?
Just incase you don't I would be happy to have an escrow , login to my account, and Tdowns account and from the time of the messages prove that it was you.

No i do not admit that i sent message to TheButterZone , maybe before asking for loan the Scammer(twipple) sent the pm for begging but i dont ..

Well the time the message was sent  is 31st January. Anyways, I won't have a problem proving it as you clearly had the account holding on 31st.
TheButterZone , how would you like to proceed on this ?

Well there is no such reason that i ask for some shit money .
in the mean time, I was running an exchange For Pakistani`s you can check my trust.
Giving loans.
so this means i have enough bitcoins ,

I would be happy to open a new scam accusation with what you say and what you did with the account, once you get back your account. I don't care about the reason why you begged with the account.

@TBZ, PM me and I will be happy to provide you another definite proof that Twipple and Ume are not the same person.

[Umekhan]

No reason for making this scam thread about me ..
1) I forget the password of my Ume account lol.
2) Twipple , when he saw that the twipple account scammed me over 0.025 he said me that i,ll buy your account, the starting price was from 0.04 i guess. I posted like 5-20 because i know that the account has some potential while looking at its date of registeration . after that when i went to 110+ activity which was near to FM . he bought this account at 0.05.
3) Getting negative feedback after 1-2 months . is not my fault, he know that its a scammer account who just scammed me for 0.025 why did he buy ,
4) I just pm`ed theymos with my signed message to recover my account , if i get into it i have all the pm`s saved in my account.
 
If you have further questions to ask me then i m here,

Can you admit you sent that message to TheButterZone ?
Just incase you don't I would be happy to have an escrow , login to my account, and Tdowns account and from the time of the messages prove that it was you.

No i do not admit that i sent message to TheButterZone , maybe before asking for loan the Scammer(twipple) sent the pm for begging but i dont ..

Well the time the message was sent  is 31st January. Anyways, I won't have a problem proving it as you clearly had the account holding on 31st.
TheButterZone , how would you like to proceed on this ?

Well there is no such reason that i ask for some shit money .
in the mean time, I was running an exchange For Pakistani`s you can check my trust.
Giving loans.
so this means i have enough bitcoins ,

I would be happy to open a new scam accusation with what you say and what you did with the account, once you get back your account. I don't care about the reason why you begged with the account.

@TBZ, PM me and I will be happy to provide you another definite proof that Twipple and Ume are not the same person.

And i guess you are going to make a scam accusation against Ume , because of (LYCAN) i have proof of that too .. that its get hacked , gl dude.. i think you have nothing do rather then making scam accusation against me . GOOD LUCK

[Twipple]

@TheButterZone , please let me know what other proof you want, and how you want to proceed with this. I already provided you with the Password change log, that you requested, and the PM Log. The next thing I can do is, have an escrow log in to the account and verify everything, which I also offered before.
I am heading out, and will await your reply.

[TheButterZone]

You should be able to check for tor exit nodes on the tor projects website (I assume) for VPNs that is much more difficult. I believe that you can even get VPN gateways of residential IP addresses with some services (http://lowendtalk.com/discussion/27897/vpn-service-that-provides-ip-s-that-look-like-a-residential-isp) so any list of VPN IP addresses would be incomplete.

Ruh roh.

https://collector.torproject.org/archive/exit-lists/exit-list-2015-01.tar.xz
2015-01-25-05-02-07 & 2015-01-31-00-02-02 have IP #4.

25- ECBBE1D6832FFAFC8FA1344E13BF4D252D477F61 91.196.48.203
31- ECBBE1D6832FFAFC8FA1344E13BF4D252D477F61 91.196.48.203

[Quickseller]

You should be able to check for tor exit nodes on the tor projects website (I assume) for VPNs that is much more difficult. I believe that you can even get VPN gateways of residential IP addresses with some services (http://lowendtalk.com/discussion/27897/vpn-service-that-provides-ip-s-that-look-like-a-residential-isp) so any list of VPN IP addresses would be incomplete.

Ruh roh.

https://collector.torproject.org/archive/exit-lists/exit-list-2015-01.tar.xz
2015-01-25-05-02-07 & 2015-01-31-00-02-02 have IP #4.

That would explain why Ume is always around when the OP is trying to give additional points to his argument. It looks like he went to pretty extreme lengths to fake the sale to himself.

[Twipple]

You should be able to check for tor exit nodes on the tor projects website (I assume) for VPNs that is much more difficult. I believe that you can even get VPN gateways of residential IP addresses with some services (http://lowendtalk.com/discussion/27897/vpn-service-that-provides-ip-s-that-look-like-a-residential-isp) so any list of VPN IP addresses would be incomplete.

Ruh roh.

https://collector.torproject.org/archive/exit-lists/exit-list-2015-01.tar.xz
2015-01-25-05-02-07 & 2015-01-31-00-02-02 have IP #4.

That would explain why Ume is always around when the OP is trying to give additional points to his argument. It looks like he went to pretty extreme lengths to fake the sale to himself.

Thanks for being a fan quickseller, I am sorry you have no life or wife, or any living social life around you, and are forced to earn the money by just posting here.

[Twipple]

You should be able to check for tor exit nodes on the tor projects website (I assume) for VPNs that is much more difficult. I believe that you can even get VPN gateways of residential IP addresses with some services (http://lowendtalk.com/discussion/27897/vpn-service-that-provides-ip-s-that-look-like-a-residential-isp) so any list of VPN IP addresses would be incomplete.

Ruh roh.

https://collector.torproject.org/archive/exit-lists/exit-list-2015-01.tar.xz
2015-01-25-05-02-07 & 2015-01-31-00-02-02 have IP #4.

25- ECBBE1D6832FFAFC8FA1344E13BF4D252D477F61 91.196.48.203
31- ECBBE1D6832FFAFC8FA1344E13BF4D252D477F61 91.196.48.203

What about it ? Does using TOR mean that he and I are the same person ? How does that logic come into play now ? I use TOR because I did not wish to disclose my identity to my other account to any one on the forum.
If thats conclusive for you that it proves Ume and I are the same person . Go ahead give the same negative rep to Ume, as according to you we are the same person.
Doesn't it make sense that he and I are not the same person, because I am the one who started the scam accusation against him ?
What good will it do to me, to fake the sale ? Did I fake it to beg from you and get some penny bitcoin in exchange for letting my account get a negative rep ?
Please tell me how it makes any sense ?

The best I can offer is come to an online chat and let me explain it to you live, without having Quickseller here just post bullshit to manipulate what I am trying to say. I will also start a new thread tomorrow Off Meta, which I will keep self Moderated for the discussion.

[TheButterZone]

Just changed my forum timezone to UTC so I can correlate with the seclog entries.

hey can you give me some btc as a firned ?

^ 2015-01-31 08:18:56 UTC

Code:

+---------------------+---------------+----------+
| UTC Time            | ip            | type     |
+---------------------+---------------+----------+
| 2015-01-31 10:53:13 | 91.196.48.203 | Password |
+---------------------+---------------+----------+

^ Less than 3 hours later (and after I believe I originally negrated for the begging - I am always awake at the time it was received), the password is changed via TOR exit node ECBBE1D6832FFAFC8FA1344E13BF4D252D477F61 91.196.48.203.

Not going to go on a witch hunt negrating a whole bunch of accounts* that weren't the same exact one that PMed me to beg.

* https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=366936 https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=503772 https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=386380 https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=464674 and all the ones listed in https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=834733.msg9875630#msg9875630

[Twipple]

^ Less than 3 hours later (and after I believe I originally negrated for the begging - I am always awake at the time it was received), the password is changed via TOR exit node
....

Not sure what you meant by that, but if you look at the PM screenshot I provided , It will be clear that the account was sold to me after that PM.
PS: This whole thing is for that PM. How about I send you some money ? Anyone in the right mind wouldn't actually be sending that PM , when he knows it can get a negative trust because of it. And I can't help if Ume was stupid enough to do that.