ASICMINER: Entering the Future of ASIC Mining by Inventing It

[SebastianJu]

Hm... i read people still bought BFL-Miners "last week"... i wonder how many could be "saved" when Asicminer would be so known for their Miner-Offers like BFL is...

Even though i see that friedcat would have work with it, for example explaining what website they want, speak about design and functionality im interested to see the effect.

What effect would have advertising at bitcointalk.org? What effect other internet marketing techniques?

I think it could lead to much more sells and maybe even to less poor guys thinking BFL is the one and only legit Miner-Company.

At the end only friedcat can decide such things. And it looks like its not top priority. I tend to believe friedcat thinks there are other things he can do to maximize dividends. At least he shows it all the time. But a rethink cant be bad.

[bobboooiie]

There was a block a few days ago with 11 BTC in transaction fees, but it was a fluke. Expensive typo 

I quess he did not have to wait for a long for confimations

[freedomno1]

The delay of confirmation of this week's dividends is caused by the payments of real
dividends are chained after the satoshi transactions, which are now refused by most
of the clients. We will either stop the satoshi payments, or unchain the payment in our
modified scripts.

Thanks for the update friedcat

Think I understand what this means but can someone re-confirm it
Mass sending out to multiple paying addresses is refused by most clients on the blockchain
And is that related to the transaction fee changes in the last update of the client

[canth]

There was a block a few days ago with 11 BTC in transaction fees, but it was a fluke. Expensive typo 

I quess he did not have to wait for a long for confimations

Heh. Like lightning! I saw that block and thought it odd - it makes sense that the only way that it would happen would be a typo. A gift to the world, eh?

[twmz]

Think I understand what this means but can someone re-confirm it
Mass sending out to multiple paying addresses is refused by most clients on the blockchain
And is that related to the transaction fee changes in the last update of the client

No, it's not related to having multiple payment addresses or to transaction fees.  The satoshis transaction has a lot of dust payments in it, many that are just a single satoshi (0.00000001).  The current version of bitcoin-qt/bitcoind considers such a transaction to be spam and refuses to relay it or include it in blocks.  It will only get included in blocks by miners that have customized algorithms for including transactions (and that have an algorithm that includes spam-like transactions).

Edit: and the reason this affects the dividends payment is that the transaction for the satoshis sends its left-over "change" to an address/output that is then used as the input/source-of-funds for the dividends payment.  The dividends transaction, then, will not get confirmed until after the satoshis transaction gets confirmed.

[freedomno1]

Think I understand what this means but can someone re-confirm it
Mass sending out to multiple paying addresses is refused by most clients on the blockchain
And is that related to the transaction fee changes in the last update of the client

No, it's not related to having multiple payment addresses or to transaction fees.  The satoshis transaction has a lot of dust payments in it, many that are just a single satoshi (0.00000001).  The current version of bitcoin-qt/bitcoind considers such a transaction to be spam and refuses to relay it or include it in blocks.  It will only get included in blocks by miners that have customized algorithms for including transactions (and that have an algorithm that includes spam-like transactions).

Edit: and the reason this affects the dividends payment is that the transaction for the satoshis sends its left-over "change" to an address/output that is then used as the input/source-of-funds for the dividends payment.  The dividends transaction, then, will not get confirmed until after the satoshis transaction gets confirmed.

That makes more sense thanks for clearing that up
But if its part of a bigger unit why does that cause a delay
Sending 10.00000001 bitcoin's would not be dust

[twmz]

Think I understand what this means but can someone re-confirm it
Mass sending out to multiple paying addresses is refused by most clients on the blockchain
And is that related to the transaction fee changes in the last update of the client

No, it's not related to having multiple payment addresses or to transaction fees.  The satoshis transaction has a lot of dust payments in it, many that are just a single satoshi (0.00000001).  The current version of bitcoin-qt/bitcoind considers such a transaction to be spam and refuses to relay it or include it in blocks.  It will only get included in blocks by miners that have customized algorithms for including transactions (and that have an algorithm that includes spam-like transactions).

Edit: and the reason this affects the dividends payment is that the transaction for the satoshis sends its left-over "change" to an address/output that is then used as the input/source-of-funds for the dividends payment.  The dividends transaction, then, will not get confirmed until after the satoshis transaction gets confirmed.

That makes more sense thanks for clearing that up
But if its part of a bigger unit why does that cause a delay
Sending 10.00000001 bitcoin's would not be dust

If a transaction contains any output that is "spam-like" then the latest version of bitcoin-qt will treat the entire transaction as non-standard (and refuse to relay it or include it in blocks).  It does not depend on the sum-total of the transaction, it depends on each individual payment in the transaction.

[freedomno1]

Think I understand what this means but can someone re-confirm it
Mass sending out to multiple paying addresses is refused by most clients on the blockchain
And is that related to the transaction fee changes in the last update of the client

No, it's not related to having multiple payment addresses or to transaction fees.  The satoshis transaction has a lot of dust payments in it, many that are just a single satoshi (0.00000001).  The current version of bitcoin-qt/bitcoind considers such a transaction to be spam and refuses to relay it or include it in blocks.  It will only get included in blocks by miners that have customized algorithms for including transactions (and that have an algorithm that includes spam-like transactions).

Edit: and the reason this affects the dividends payment is that the transaction for the satoshis sends its left-over "change" to an address/output that is then used as the input/source-of-funds for the dividends payment.  The dividends transaction, then, will not get confirmed until after the satoshis transaction gets confirmed.

That makes more sense thanks for clearing that up
But if its part of a bigger unit why does that cause a delay
Sending 10.00000001 bitcoin's would not be dust

If a transaction contains any output that is "spam-like" then the latest version of bitcoin-qt will treat the entire transaction as non-standard (and refuse to relay it or include it in blocks).  It does not depend on the sum-total of the transaction, it depends on each individual payment in the transaction.

Seems a little strange to be cutting out the satoshi from the total, it means miners who handle non-standard transactions will sometimes find more blocks than those who run the normal client just because of a one satoshi output in the whole transaction chain.

Wonder if that's more of a PR issue I do remember people putting some porn links in the blockchain, and changes to prevent that
I will not battle for the satoshi just wanted to know where it went
Thanks for answering twmz
And if it somehow effects the total number of bitcoin's fractional reserve capability the whole
Bitcoin has 2.1 quadrillion raw units

To surmise
If you don't include the satoshi as a standard relay it causes delays on the sending of units because the transaction for the satoshis sends its left-over "change" to an address/output that is then used as the input for the dividend payment.  

The dividends transaction, then, will not get confirmed until after the satoshis transaction gets confirmed.

Got it now just edited it to get it better
Sent you my first tip to someone for that explanation thanks again

[Jere.Jones]

I would like to see the satoshi transactions continue.  The reason why is that it would be hard, if not impossible, to determine how many shares an address owns without it.  

There have been mentions of adding up all the dividends, dividing by 400,000 to determine the per-share dividend, and then dividing the amount received by that dividend.  There are two problems with this:

• I can not determine the number of shares that an address owns without knowing all of the transactions that were used in this weeks dividend.  As it is now, I only need look at a single transaction to determine the number of shares owned by that address.
• Determining the per-share dividend becomes problematic for a non-direct-shareholder.  While it would be easy for a direct shareholder to determine the per-share dividend (because he/she would know how much he/she received and how many shares that dividend was applied to), someone else could not.  Even if you could manage to find all the dividend transactions and sum up the outputs, you still couldn't determine the per-share dividend because you don't know which of the outputs is the change (it could be obvious, it could not) and you don't know how many shares that sum is for as evidenced by the recent shareholder spreadsheet.

There have been discussions about these satoshi transactions being considered dust by the network.  Blocks with these transactions will still get relayed.  The "economic dust" change only affects unconfirmed transactions with dust.  While it is true they won't get relayed by stock bitcoind clients, it doesn't matter because ASICMINER can include them itself.  

In the end, these satoshi transactions provide value by making the system easily auditable and understandable.  I would hate to see them removed.

[vesper39]

One simple workaround would be to globally announce a designated address that will permanently hold 1 share of AM.

This gives the amount of dividends per share each week, as well as allow anyone to simply divide to figure out the number of shares another address holds.

Im indifferent in whether satoshis are sent or not. I'm sure AM team will figure out something reasonable.

[cointoss]

Where can I buy blades or shares directly from ASICMINER?

[freedomno1]

Where can I buy blades or shares directly from ASICMINER?

Usually on the forums at different times
Or Search ASIC auctions
If your a mega investor break this darn wall (Patiently waited for the market to forget then brings it back  )
Or if the market goes to 2.7 and forgets this wall that would be the time to ask for a loan lols
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=213729.40

To TheFuneral Not to certain myself but here is an example
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=193683.0

[TheFuneral]

is there a FAQ or HOW-TO for when it comes to buying auction ASIC shares from people on this board? I've been reading around but can't find much detail about the entire process. Do you guys have any links you could point me to on the process and rules?

[candoo]

is there a FAQ or HOW-TO for when it comes to buying auction ASIC shares from people on this board? I've been reading around but can't find much detail about the entire process. Do you guys have any links you could point me to on the process and rules?

Best way to buy shares is here https://bitfunder.com/asset/G.ASICMINER-PT

[cointoss]

How much GH is one ASICMINER share?

[inh]

How much GH is one ASICMINER share?

(1/400000)*current hash rate in GH

[twmz]

Seems a little strange to be cutting out the satoshi from the total, it means miners who handle non-standard transactions will sometimes find more blocks than those who run the normal client just because of a one satoshi output in the whole transaction chain.

Wonder if that's more of a PR issue I do remember people putting some porn links in the blockchain, and changes to prevent that
I will not battle for the satoshi just wanted to know where it went
Thanks for answering twmz
And if it somehow effects the total number of bitcoin's fractional reserve capability the whole
Bitcoin has 2.1 quadrillion raw units

To be clear, this has no affect on how many blocks a miner finds.  

Also, having a non-even amount is not a problem.  So, it's fine if you want to send 10.00000001 to someone.  You just can't send 10.0000000 to person A and 0.00000001 to person B (which is what the satoshis transaction does).

Sorry if my previous comment confused you.

Also, Gavin explained in the discussion about this change to bitcoin-qt that it was a  temporary fix (to the transaction spam problem).  Eventually, this rule will be removed and replaced with a better algorithm that adapts the definition of what makes something a "spam" transaction by looking at the pattern of what has recently been included in blocks.  So as the economy changes and it becomes more reasonable to send someone 0.000001, the bitcoin client will automatically adapt and start allowing it.

[helixone]

How much GH is one ASICMINER share?

Using latest estimated total TH of 25.86TH from http://asicminercharts.com/ and dividing by shares outstanding of 400,000 indicates an estimated 64.65MH per share.

-helixone

[GuiltySpark343]

If you do a "cost analysis" in terms of purchase price vs revenue generated, then:

ASSUMPTIONS
- do not factor in electricity costs
- BTC exchange at today's rate of $120 USD/BTC
- network difficulty on average increases 10% every 2 weeks, thereby reducing revenue by about 10% every 2 weeks

GPU
- AMD 7970 at stock speeds provides 650 MH/s
- Cost $400 USD or 3.33 BTC
- Generates 0.0209 BTC/day at today's difficulty
- After one year of continuous mining total BTC generated = 2.74 BTC
- LOSS OF 0.60 BTC

USB Block Erupter
- 333 MH/s
- Cost 1.99 BTC
- Generates 0.0107 BTC/day at today's difficulty
- After one year of continuous mining total BTC generated = 1.40 BTC
- LOSS OF 0.59 BTC

BFL Jalapeno
- 5000 MH/s
- Cost $274 USD = 2.28 BTC
- Generates 0.1611 BTC/day at today's difficulty
- After one year of continuous mining total BTC generated = 21.1 BTC if you start mining today!
- If you receive your unit and start mining 6 months from now
   - Generates 0.0454 BTC/day
   - After one year from that point, total BTC generated = 5.945 BTC

AM-PT SHARE
- Currently about 2.5 BTC/share at BTC-TC
- Recently generated 0.038 BTC/week in dividends (this was the highest dividend ever)
- After one year of dividends at this rate = 1.98 BTC
- LOSS OF 0.52 BTC

In other words, if you purchase any of the above items in the hopes of "earning back" your cost, you won't (with exception of BFL units). Of course this does not include the fact that you can sell your 7970 GPU in the future (but a year from now how much would it be worth? maybe $100?). Others would say you cannot sell the USB Block Erupter after a year because it is a uni-tasker without any other purpose. The BFL units are reasonably priced. Problem is they are not shipping in bulk, so a delay in shipment leads to large loss in profit. Finally, you can sell your AM-PT share too, and it is very difficult to predict what the sell price would be at that time.

[TheFuneral]

is there a FAQ or HOW-TO for when it comes to buying auction ASIC shares from people on this board? I've been reading around but can't find much detail about the entire process. Do you guys have any links you could point me to on the process and rules?

Best way to buy shares is here https://bitfunder.com/asset/G.ASICMINER-PT

Thanks, but I'm interested in direct shares. Which is why I've been looking in the auction forum here.