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Author Topic: ASICMINER: Entering the Future of ASIC Mining by Inventing It  (Read 3896812 times)
delaria
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May 26, 2013, 07:49:12 PM
 #5961

Aggressively: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=148350.msg2159577#msg2159577
1000 shares x 0.03 btc/shares/week * 4 weeks/month = 120 btc/month

Conservatively: http://www.asicminer.co/figures.html
1000 shares x 0.007 btc/shares/week * 4 weeks/month = 28 btc/month

Thanks! the difference between the two scenarios is tied to share price or Bitcoin price ?

Don't you even bother to READ the post you are answering?

You don't deserve this, honestly.


Chill out dude. I'm new here and asking around. Your intimidating comment is absolutely awful and useless
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aahzmundus
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May 26, 2013, 07:55:27 PM
 #5962

Aggressively: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=148350.msg2159577#msg2159577
1000 shares x 0.03 btc/shares/week * 4 weeks/month = 120 btc/month

Conservatively: http://www.asicminer.co/figures.html
1000 shares x 0.007 btc/shares/week * 4 weeks/month = 28 btc/month

Thanks! the difference between the two scenarios is tied to share price or Bitcoin price ?

Don't you even bother to READ the post you are answering?

You don't deserve this, honestly.


Chill out dude. I'm new here and asking around. Your intimidating comment is absolutely awful and useless

Above it was, I agree clearly stated.  I will re state what was said.  He uses estimates of return in BTC of .03 and .007 per share... the difference is NOT share price (that was not a factor in the question about 1,000 shares)  nor was it bitcoin price (the value of bitcoin has no baring on how many you get from this investment) but the weekly dividend.  Historically the dividends recently have fell in that range, I would say .01 is a good conservative estimate of future dividends.

IF YOU can not figure this sort of thing out on your own, you SHOULD NOT be investing In my humble opinion.  There are many good resources posted on this thread if you bother to read it...

romerun
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May 26, 2013, 08:10:59 PM
 #5963

If AM can maintain at least 10% of coin generation in the next 15 years, don't you find it a bit puzzle that a company is worth 10% of the total currency itself (of course, minus coins generated before AM era).
delaria
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May 26, 2013, 08:12:23 PM
 #5964

Aggressively: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=148350.msg2159577#msg2159577
1000 shares x 0.03 btc/shares/week * 4 weeks/month = 120 btc/month

Conservatively: http://www.asicminer.co/figures.html
1000 shares x 0.007 btc/shares/week * 4 weeks/month = 28 btc/month

Thanks! the difference between the two scenarios is tied to share price or Bitcoin price ?

Don't you even bother to READ the post you are answering?

You don't deserve this, honestly.


Chill out dude. I'm new here and asking around. Your intimidating comment is absolutely awful and useless

Above it was, I agree clearly stated.  I will re state what was said.  He uses estimates of return in BTC of .03 and .007 per share... the difference is NOT share price (that was not a factor in the question about 1,000 shares)  nor was it bitcoin price (the value of bitcoin has no baring on how many you get from this investment) but the weekly dividend.  Historically the dividends recently have fell in that range, I would say .01 is a good conservative estimate of future dividends.

IF YOU can not figure this sort of thing out on your own, you SHOULD NOT be investing In my humble opinion.  There are many good resources posted on this thread if you bother to read it...

Thanks for the informations and good manners. Sound advice.
thx1164
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May 26, 2013, 08:18:59 PM
 #5965

Here it says over 50% is not that bad and the attack is not worthwhile.

https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Weaknesses#Attacker_has_a_lot_of_computing_power

How is THIS:

"An attacker that controls more than 50% of the network's computing power can, for the time that he is in control, exclude and modify the ordering of transactions. This allows him to:

Reverse transactions that he sends while he's in control. This has the potential to double-spend transactions that previously had already been seen in the block chain.

Prevent some or all transactions from gaining any confirmations

Prevent some or all other miners from mining any valid blocks"

And THIS :

"if this attack is successfully executed, it will be difficult or impossible to "untangle" the mess created -- any changes the attacker makes might become permanent."

not that bad??? Are you from Bizarro World?

*edit: No offence implied.
tkone
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May 26, 2013, 08:27:02 PM
Last edit: May 26, 2013, 09:27:49 PM by tkone
 #5966

https://www.khanacademy.org/science/core-finance/money-and-banking/bitcoin/v/bitcoin-security-of-transaction-block-chains

this seems that anyone with enough power to actually make such an attack, would be better of just mining and making money from btc or and together from transactions,

check out that video.


EDIT:
I CANT WAIT FOR THIS WEEKS DIVIDENDS TO INCLUDE SO MANY SALES THAT ASICMINER SHARE WILL GO UP UP UP!!!! CANT WAIT!!! MOAR DIVIDENDZZZZZZ!!!!!!

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May 26, 2013, 10:34:13 PM
 #5967

https://www.khanacademy.org/science/core-finance/money-and-banking/bitcoin/v/bitcoin-security-of-transaction-block-chains

this seems that anyone with enough power to actually make such an attack, would be better of just mining and making money from btc or and together from transactions,

check out that video.


EDIT:
I CANT WAIT FOR THIS WEEKS DIVIDENDS TO INCLUDE SO MANY SALES THAT ASICMINER SHARE WILL GO UP UP UP!!!! CANT WAIT!!! MOAR DIVIDENDZZZZZZ!!!!!!


Dividends sound good to me.  Last week stock price got close to 2.85 before the dividends posted. I wonder what they will do this week.

 Tat.AM got over .03  last week.

I see BTC as the super highway and alt coins as taxis and trucks needed to move transactions.
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May 26, 2013, 10:53:30 PM
 #5968

If friedcat has a surplus of ASIC hardware that can not be deployed for bitcoin mining, then why not mine another sha256 altcoin (can can not be merge mined) like PPC?

The PPC proceeds can easily be converted into BTC on exchanges like BTC-e.

Look at the volumes on BTC-e. Then try to calculate the revenues, also take a look at the market cap of PPC on Dustoin (about 28.289 BTC right now). Then crunch these numbers, and see how unsustainable doing this would be. After 24 hours, expect PPC exchange rate to plummet on a 1:10 scale at best...

So, interesting idea, but not a sustainable one.

This is a great idea!  Getting a major source of steady hashpower like AM would provide a lot of security and validation (PR) to PPC. 

We must not treat the altcoins like delicate flowers.  Like their mother, they benefit from added exposure and network capacity.

Of course there would be some increased volatility as the market adjusts to the new situation, but that's hardly a reason to ignore this opportunity for expansion.

We've seen the price of every coin rise in proportion to difficulty, because the more secure they are the more actual and potential value their networks represent.



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kano
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May 26, 2013, 11:13:15 PM
 #5969

I think you're missing something. The network hash rate doesn't "vary". It doesn't go up and down like that chart says. It's fairly constant (probably), growing slowly.

The chart you're seeing is an estimation of the network hash rate based on blocks found. This is what makes it vary, the fact that we're deducing hash rate from "number of hashes found below difficulty per unit of time".

You can't have a script running that makes sure ASICMiner doesn't have more than 50% of the total network hash rate at any point in time, because you don't know what total network hash rate is at some point in time. It can only be deduced, in retrospect, at a certainty that increases with the length of the period over which we average.

The spikes are really coming from luck because of found blocks? Interesting if true... till now i was under the impression that it spikes because of lowering or rising hashspeed... but it makes sense to calculate the speed from found blocks because thats the nearest you can get to hashrate. But i really thought the luck doesnt have such a variance over time. I mean the chart seems to show that it calculates only 3 times a day. I thought the average over such timeframe should prevent good enough to have spikes of 30%... but i didnt think it through really, youre right...
As sipa's graphs show, you really need to go up to a 3-day average, to get a somewhat stable graph: http://bitcoin.sipa.be/

That being said, there is essentially no way to know whether people are continually turning their rigs on and off in a coordinated fashion, or getting lucky, just by looking at when blocks are found.

I'm not good with statistics, but I'm sure you can determine the probability of, for example, 7 blocks being found in an hour instead of 6, or 160 blocks being found in a day instead of 144, and I don't think it's small.

Remember that only around 144 blocks are found per day. It doesn't take more than 15 extra blocks to be found in a day for the 1-day average to increase by 10%.
No, the 3 day average is also extremely unreliable and extremely unstable. Look at the graph and you can clearly see that.
That is also why they have the 7 and 14 day estimates on that graph, but ...
Bitcoin's 14 day re-targeting is not set to 14 days to make in drag out for too long, it's set to 14 days due to the need for it to be.
It's not rare to see a pool fail to find a block until 5 times (or find within 1/5 of) the difficulty ...

Pool: https://kano.is Here on Bitcointalk: Forum BTC: 1KanoPb8cKYqNrswjaA8cRDk4FAS9eDMLU
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Help keep Bitcoin secure by mining on pools with full block verification on all blocks - and NO empty blocks!
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May 26, 2013, 11:27:06 PM
 #5970

https://www.khanacademy.org/science/core-finance/money-and-banking/bitcoin/v/bitcoin-security-of-transaction-block-chains

this seems that anyone with enough power to actually make such an attack, would be better of just mining and making money from btc or and together from transactions,

And you've missed the point. Anyone performing that attack is probably doing it for malicious purposes - ie to take down Bitcoin. Those purposes may vary but it certainly isn't going to be to make a few quid. It'd be to make a stonking amount before anyone noticed - very difficult AND they'd have to launder it back into fiat or an asset super-quickly as the value would tank once spotted, or most likely to disrupt the network.

It's not all about money and sane behaviour.
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May 27, 2013, 12:03:48 AM
 #5971

https://www.khanacademy.org/science/core-finance/money-and-banking/bitcoin/v/bitcoin-security-of-transaction-block-chains

this seems that anyone with enough power to actually make such an attack, would be better of just mining and making money from btc or and together from transactions,

And you've missed the point. Anyone performing that attack is probably doing it for malicious purposes - ie to take down Bitcoin. Those purposes may vary but it certainly isn't going to be to make a few quid. It'd be to make a stonking amount before anyone noticed - very difficult AND they'd have to launder it back into fiat or an asset super-quickly as the value would tank once spotted, or most likely to disrupt the network.

It's not all about money and sane behaviour.


I don't get why this is discussed over and over again. Does everybody who just stumbled upon bitcoin have to publish his most recent learnings here? No offence, but please find the appropriate threads. Thank you
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May 27, 2013, 12:15:47 AM
 #5972

https://www.khanacademy.org/science/core-finance/money-and-banking/bitcoin/v/bitcoin-security-of-transaction-block-chains

this seems that anyone with enough power to actually make such an attack, would be better of just mining and making money from btc or and together from transactions,

And you've missed the point. Anyone performing that attack is probably doing it for malicious purposes - ie to take down Bitcoin. Those purposes may vary but it certainly isn't going to be to make a few quid. It'd be to make a stonking amount before anyone noticed - very difficult AND they'd have to launder it back into fiat or an asset super-quickly as the value would tank once spotted, or most likely to disrupt the network.

It's not all about money and sane behaviour.


I don't get why this is discussed over and over again. Does everybody who just stumbled upon bitcoin have to publish his most recent learnings here? No offence, but please find the appropriate threads. Thank you

I just realized... that...
If this thread contains more than 51% posts about the 51-attack-on-bitcoin it will go Ka-Booom and destroy planet Earth.

Fortunately we are still below 25% I believe Smiley


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May 27, 2013, 12:18:44 AM
 #5973

If everyone (including me for this one) posting anything off-topic here would be charged a 0.1 BTC fee payable to AM, our dividends would probably go higher every week ;-)
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May 27, 2013, 12:25:21 AM
 #5974

ok so heres something on topic that i been thinking about,

few days ago there was news about china blocking sms about bitcoins, or something like that,
could that be a step by china to try to block bitcoins? what if they make more steps or something more major?

isnt asicminer in china? how will this affect the company? or even more affect us the share holders?

just something i been thinking about and watching the news for.

ELAZAR

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May 27, 2013, 12:33:39 AM
 #5975

ok so heres something on topic that i been thinking about,

few days ago there was news about china blocking sms about bitcoins, or something like that,
could that be a step by china to try to block bitcoins? what if they make more steps or something more major?

isnt asicminer in china? how will this affect the company? or even more affect us the share holders?

just something i been thinking about and watching the news for.

ELAZAR

I dont know. I guess it was just some random misunderstanding at china telecom.

But here is something interesting: USB Eruptor crossing 1000 USD on ebay!!!

Ebay

What up!!??!!!
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May 27, 2013, 12:37:30 AM
 #5976

ok so heres something on topic that i been thinking about,

few days ago there was news about china blocking sms about bitcoins, or something like that,
could that be a step by china to try to block bitcoins? what if they make more steps or something more major?

isnt asicminer in china? how will this affect the company? or even more affect us the share holders?

just something i been thinking about and watching the news for.

ELAZAR

Yes I would also like more information about this.

I think there are possible backup plans for AM, even if China were to forbid the use of Bitcoin. First, mining bitcoins or using them as a payment method are two different things. Second, if AM were to be affected by a BTC ban in China, manufacuring mining hardware and exporting it would probably not be covered by the ban.

A seizure of all the hardware at the datacenter is the only real threat that I could see here (but -- before someone tells me I'm FUDding here -- I don't think it will happen)
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May 27, 2013, 12:40:10 AM
 #5977

But here is something interesting: USB Eruptor crossing 1000 USD on ebay!!!

Ebay

What up!!??!!!

I'm puzzled by the auction price breaking $1000, there are many open group buys here where you can get it at friedcat's price (1.99 BTC + GB fees). Oh well, supply and demand, I guess. But it's surprising, anyway.
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May 27, 2013, 12:40:16 AM
 #5978

This is a rehash of week old FUD. Not even worth talking about.
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May 27, 2013, 12:41:33 AM
 #5979

But here is something interesting: USB Eruptor crossing 1000 USD on ebay!!!

Ebay

What up!!??!!!

I'm puzzled by the auction price breaking $1000, there are many open group buys here where you can get it at friedcat's price (1.99 BTC + GB fees). Oh well, supply and demand, I guess. But it's surprising, anyway.

I have a feeling some stupid ebay bidders think they are getting 10 USB Erupters for that price...no one who knows anything about them would pay that much when you can get them for ~1/4 that price.
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May 27, 2013, 12:44:20 AM
 #5980

But here is something interesting: USB Eruptor crossing 1000 USD on ebay!!!

Ebay

What up!!??!!!

I'm puzzled by the auction price breaking $1000, there are many open group buys here where you can get it at friedcat's price (1.99 BTC + GB fees). Oh well, supply and demand, I guess. But it's surprising, anyway.

I have a feeling some stupid ebay bidders think they are getting 10 USB Erupters for that price...no one who knows anything about them would pay that much when you can get them for ~1/4 that price.


And all of the other open auctions (>25) have bids north of 400 USD!! Seems like 1.99 BTC wasn't such a high price after all...
One reason could be that interested buyers might have problems to get BTC
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