[ANN] CoinLab Protected Pool

[imsaguy]

Is Coinlab for GPU mining only?  Or Does coinlab accept ASIC as well?

Right now, we accept shares from any device.  We will be transitioning to GPU-only in a couple months.

Why transitioning to GPU ONLY if you could have ASIC that's much faster?  Maybe that's something on the business side or hardware side I don't understand. 

I don't have an ASIC machine at the moment.  We are just talking on a theoretical level right now.

I just want to find out what is the incentive for Coinlabs to have GPU only miners when they can get a much better hashing power in the future.

Go google BOINC.  Basically, universities and other companies can use the GPUs to do intensive work that would take much longer on ordinary processors.  They don't need the GPUs all the time, so its cheaper to lease the setup.

[organofcorti]

Is Coinlab for GPU mining only?  Or Does coinlab accept ASIC as well?

Right now, we accept shares from any device.  We will be transitioning to GPU-only in a couple months.

Why transitioning to GPU ONLY if you could have ASIC that's much faster?  Maybe that's something on the business side or hardware side I don't understand. 

I don't have an ASIC machine at the moment.  We are just talking on a theoretical level right now.

I just want to find out what is the incentive for Coinlabs to have GPU only miners when they can get a much better hashing power in the future.

Go google BOINC.  Basically, universities and other companies can use the GPUs to do intensive work that would take much longer on ordinary processors.  They don't need the GPUs all the time, so its cheaper to lease the setup.

Short version: CoinLab will transition to including non-btc computations - ASICs will be no good for the non-btc work.

[stick_theman]

Go google BOINC.  Basically, universities and other companies can use the GPUs to do intensive work that would take much longer on ordinary processors.  They don't need the GPUs all the time, so its cheaper to lease the setup.

I see.  It makes sense now.  Sounds like the software written for BOINC can not be executed in ASIC and only in x32, 64.

Well, without further ado, hat tip to Coinlabs.

[imsaguy]

Go google BOINC.  Basically, universities and other companies can use the GPUs to do intensive work that would take much longer on ordinary processors.  They don't need the GPUs all the time, so its cheaper to lease the setup.

I see.  It makes sense now.  Sounds like the software written for BOINC can not be executed in ASIC and only in x32, 64.

Well, without further ado, hat tip to Coinlabs.

Yeah, its processor and GPU work.  ASIC is too specialized. 

[ShadesOfMarble]

3/111350 rejected shares... incredible!

Another question: How are payouts made if Loyalty Points (LP) are being used? "Payments for computation will be in Bitcoin" means I will get bitcoins worth 2.5$ per GH/s per day? E.g. 1 GH/s would only yield 0.1 BTC/day, one btc is worth 2.5$ so my payout is 1 BTC? So payouts are ALWAYS in btc, no mather if I generate or use LPs?

[BlackPrapor]

Great project! I'm so relieved that you're making it, because I was thinking about the same platform and just didn't know about yours (I guess I need to get outside my watch list threads =))). I just hope that you're planning to sell your computational powers in btc only, so it pumps in more capital for us . This kind of payment strategy will kill any alternative crypto currency and would ensure btc future stable growth. There are so many companies and algorythms to apply using this platform!

[yochdog]

If you mine with us for 6 months before the price drops below $2.50, you’ll be able to continue to earn the minimum price of $2.50 for the next 6 months


This seems like a complete deal breaker, and a little like a weasel clause.  By your own estimates, the price will break below $2.50 much sooner than 6 months from now.  By my reading, that would mean the protection is not available.

Is this a correct interpretation? 

[stick_theman]

If you mine with us for 6 months before the price drops below $2.50, you’ll be able to continue to earn the minimum price of $2.50 for the next 6 months


This seems like a complete deal breaker, and a little like a weasel clause.  By your own estimates, the price will break below $2.50 much sooner than 6 months from now.  By my reading, that would mean the protection is not available.

Is this a correct interpretation? 

Yes, sounds like a short term protection.

Coinlabs has the monopoly currently in the arena.  The GPU miners have no options after ASIC, dealbreaker or not.

[imsaguy]

If you mine with us for 6 months before the price drops below $2.50, you’ll be able to continue to earn the minimum price of $2.50 for the next 6 months


This seems like a complete deal breaker, and a little like a weasel clause.  By your own estimates, the price will break below $2.50 much sooner than 6 months from now.  By my reading, that would mean the protection is not available.

Is this a correct interpretation? 

I think it was just an example.  If you mine with them for 2 months before it drops below $2.50, then you get 2 months at $2.50 after the drop.

[jjshabadoo]

How is this going to work for people who buy shares after the IPO ?

Do we still get a first dibs shot at hardware ?

[auctioneeeeer]

If you mine with us for 6 months before the price drops below $2.50, you’ll be able to continue to earn the minimum price of $2.50 for the next 6 months


This seems like a complete deal breaker, and a little like a weasel clause.  By your own estimates, the price will break below $2.50 much sooner than 6 months from now.  By my reading, that would mean the protection is not available.

Is this a correct interpretation? 

I believe that line is for example's sake, but should be edited to be more clear, as you read lower you get a loyalty point for each share submitted (I can see these on my mining page of how many I have currently banked).  If/when difficulty pushes each 1Gh/s of mining power below the $2.50 threshold, you start using your banked loyalty points at the guaranteed rate of $2.50 until exhausted.  You have up to 2 years once the breach happens to use all loyalty points. 

Is that correct Coinlab?

[CoinLab]

3/111350 rejected shares... incredible!

Another question: How are payouts made if Loyalty Points (LP) are being used? "Payments for computation will be in Bitcoin" means I will get bitcoins worth 2.5$ per GH/s per day? E.g. 1 GH/s would only yield 0.1 BTC/day, one btc is worth 2.5$ so my payout is 1 BTC? So payouts are ALWAYS in btc, no mather if I generate or use LPs?

Yes, we chose the figure $2.5 because it lets most AMD cards remain profitable (and electricity costs are denominated in USD).

In your example, if Bitcoins are worth $2.5, we'll pay out 1 Bitcoin per 1GH/s per 24 hours.  If the 1GH/s yielded 0.1BTC per day by mining Bitcoins, we will be paying out 10x Bitcoin mining prices (and GPU mining for Bitcoins will no longer be profitable).

We always pay out in BTC.  We're happy to pay out in USD if someone would prefer it, but we haven't heard anyone ask for that yet.

[CoinLab]

Great project! I'm so relieved that you're making it, because I was thinking about the same platform and just didn't know about yours (I guess I need to get outside my watch list threads =))). I just hope that you're planning to sell your computational powers in btc only, so it pumps in more capital for us . This kind of payment strategy will kill any alternative crypto currency and would ensure btc future stable growth. There are so many companies and algorythms to apply using this platform!

Thanks for sharing our excitement!

Our number one priority is to sell as much compute as possible.  Requiring compute consumers purchase Bitcoins (when most of them don't have them) will deter some of them, and we don't want that.   We want to sell as much compute as possible, so compute consumers are bidding up the price they are paying us for mining.  The higher value we can sell your compute at, the more Bitcoin we'll be able to pass on to our miners.

[CoinLab]

If you mine with us for 6 months before the price drops below $2.50, you’ll be able to continue to earn the minimum price of $2.50 for the next 6 months


This seems like a complete deal breaker, and a little like a weasel clause.  By your own estimates, the price will break below $2.50 much sooner than 6 months from now.  By my reading, that would mean the protection is not available.

Is this a correct interpretation?  

@imsaguy, Yes, that line is an example.

There is a 2 year expiration date on our Loyalty Points starting from after the price drop.   So if you have any Loyalty Points, they wont expire before you have a good amount of time to use them all up.

We threw around a lot of different ideas about how we could do this program and we landed on 1 share before/ 1 share after because we think it is the most fair. It allows flexibility in hash rate, incentivizes miners to join earlier, and is easy to understand. We're taking on risk of paying out of pocket if we can't sell compute fast enough, and we can't just give out liabilities without getting anything in return. With this system, we can easily, objectively, measure how much you've supported us in growing quickly, and then we're promising to support you the same amount when you need it.

[CoinLab]

If you mine with us for 6 months before the price drops below $2.50, you’ll be able to continue to earn the minimum price of $2.50 for the next 6 months


This seems like a complete deal breaker, and a little like a weasel clause.  By your own estimates, the price will break below $2.50 much sooner than 6 months from now.  By my reading, that would mean the protection is not available.

Is this a correct interpretation?  

I believe that line is for example's sake, but should be edited to be more clear, as you read lower you get a loyalty point for each share submitted (I can see these on my mining page of how many I have currently banked).  If/when difficulty pushes each 1Gh/s of mining power below the $2.50 threshold, you start using your banked loyalty points at the guaranteed rate of $2.50 until exhausted.  You have up to 2 years once the breach happens to use all loyalty points.  

Is that correct Coinlab?

Sorry for the confusion, all.

Here's the new edits I put into the OP:

Example
If you mine with us for 6 months before the price drops below $2.50, you’ll have enough shares to earn the minimum price of $2.50 for the next 6 months (assuming equivalent hash rates during both periods).  Or, you could sell half of your rig, and those loyalty points will last 1/2 the hashing power twice as long: 12 months. Or, double your hashing power and use all of your Loyalty Points up in 3 months.

Is that clear?

[philips]

I am getting lots of

Pool 0 communication failure.

Edit: After an hour still communication failures.

[BlackPrapor]

Great project! I'm so relieved that you're making it, because I was thinking about the same platform and just didn't know about yours (I guess I need to get outside my watch list threads =))). I just hope that you're planning to sell your computational powers in btc only, so it pumps in more capital for us . This kind of payment strategy will kill any alternative crypto currency and would ensure btc future stable growth. There are so many companies and algorythms to apply using this platform!

Thanks for sharing our excitement!

Our number one priority is to sell as much compute as possible.  Requiring compute consumers purchase Bitcoins (when most of them don't have them) will deter some of them, and we don't want that.   We want to sell as much compute as possible, so compute consumers are bidding up the price they are paying us for mining.  The higher value we can sell your compute at, the more Bitcoin we'll be able to pass on to our miners.

I see. But if you pay out in btc at least a portion of the capital is transferred to bitcoin. You could also encourage buyers to purchase in btc, by offering a certain discount or differential in prices versus fiat currencies. I hope that when you calculated that $2.5 price floor, you did take into account opportunity costs associated with mining alternative crypto currencies.
As of your pricing strategy, do I understand it correctly that I can mine at your protected pool with over 10Ghs and get 97%PPS + Loyalty points = N of shares submitted until the price drop below $2.5?

[JWU42]

Same here with connection errors and stales.  Last night alone cost me about .8 BTC in lost mining revenue (versus the rock solid pool I was using). 

[BlackPrapor]

Too bad you're getting comm errors, hope it will be resolved soon and I can join the pool  . High or dynamic difficulty shares are appreciated, rollntime and no LP for nmc blocks too.

[jjshabadoo]

I seem to be doing okay with the pool.